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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyben36 View Post
    It simply comes down to value. If we had gotten more i was fine (and most were except Howard fanboys). But a 5th or 6ths next year is basically the equluivalant of a 6th or 7th this year. Its nothing. I just would have held onto him. Maybe Run I im in a rotational role showcasing him in formations that fit his style and not forcing hin into ones that don't. Maybe not carry Burton if your really worried about roster space (only played 4.5% of snaps anyway)

    I just dont think u get good trade value in the off-season. Teams in need of a RB .think they can just draft a guy( who often ends up closer to Ronald Jones then Alvin Lamar's or sign a guy and everything works out. I think he is worth more to a team at deadline. A team looking to make a push. Like i have brought up. Jay Ajayi is worth a 4th b4 the deadline why. 1 half extra year on his deal. Jordan Howard was worth a 3rd last season at deadline. Now he is worth scraps.

    I seriously don't mind moving on from howard. But if worst came to worst u let him walk and hope some team pays him hoping he can run like he did. U hope for a comp pick. And if u dont get one (god forbid) u trade down a few spots from your 2nd to pick one up if u need it that bad.

    I just think its really clear the Eagles won this deal. They could easily end up with a free year of Jordan Howard. Maybe even getring a better comp pick then they give up.

    The only rational reason not to keep howard though i will admit is that u probably should not hold hin hostage on your bench. But like i stated I think you can create a role and allow him to showcase himself for trade and FA.
    But Howard adds almost no value to this offense, even as a depth piece. Just because he ran for 1,000 with Fox doesnít mean he is that guy (or anywhere near it) for Nagy. Howard has a whole year to establish a role in the offense and didnít. How will that get better in 2019? People have to stop pretending that Howard does or will have value in the Nagy offense. He doesnít; in fact his value will probably keep dropping, not improving.

    And again, holding on to him for a comp pick delays that pick for a year (2020 v 2021) and probably doesnít improve the pick.

    Keeping Howard to hopefully trade him for more mid season or to get a comp pick is not a good argument IMO. That pick would be in 2020 (via trade) or 2021 (via comp) anyways and would very likely be the same or worse then what Pace got out of Philly.

    It was time to move on and the entire NFL knew it. Pace got what he could and now can move on to his next plan of attack at RB.


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  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach100 View Post
    But Howard adds almost no value to this offense, even as a depth piece. Just because he ran for 1,000 with Fox doesnít mean he is that guy (or anywhere near it) for Nagy. Howard has a whole year to establish a role in the offense and didnít. How will that get better in 2019? People have to stop pretending that Howard does or will have value in the Nagy offense. He doesnít; in fact his value will probably keep dropping, not improving.

    And again, holding on to him for a comp pick delays that pick for a year (2020 v 2021) and probably doesnít improve the pick.

    Keeping Howard to hopefully trade him for more mid season or to get a comp pick is not a good argument IMO. That pick would be in 2020 (via trade) or 2021 (via comp) anyways and would very likely be the same or worse then what Pace got out of Philly.

    It was time to move on and the entire NFL knew it. Pace got what he could and now can move on to his next plan of attack at RB.


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    I just don't agree. I think we saw glimpses of Howard success especially late last year. I think u couod have done the same early in the season while you groom whoever u draft. Again what happens when a competing team has a back go down wirh injury. Its much diferent then now when guys have time to recoop andget healthy. And if not they have options out there in FA still.


    ‎"If your going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big"

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  3. #33
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    There are still guys like Ajayi and Yeldon unsigned. This idea that Howard would suddenly have more value right before the season or during the season seems like wishful thinking.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by DamnGoat View Post
    There are still guys like Ajayi and Yeldon unsigned. This idea that Howard would suddenly have more value right before the season or during the season seems like wishful thinking.
    I dont think B4 the season. But mid season if Gurley looks like he wont be able to contribute then maybe they deal if they struggle if he cant play.


    ‎"If your going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big"

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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyben36 View Post
    I dont think B4 the season. But mid season if Gurley looks like he wont be able to contribute then maybe they deal if they struggle if he cant play.
    Or they just sign a guy off the street again, like they did with CJ Anderson.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by DamnGoat View Post
    Or they just sign a guy off the street again, like they did with CJ Anderson.
    Exactly. The fact that CJ just stepped off the couch and played amazing for LA shows how replaceable RBs are.


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  7. #37
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    The more articles that I read, the more comfortable I get with this trade.

    Howard needed 20-30 plays to wear down defenses. He was the "check down" target out of the backfield. He was never the primary target. The defenses knew that. He actually hindered Nagy's offense.

    Nagy likes to rotate RBs to keep them fresh and each RB needs to able to catch the ball well because they may be the first read.

    After this trade, it's obvious now that Pace will draft a RB ASAP. Many people felt that was the case, and I've come around to this thinking.

    Howard is perfect for a "ground and pound" type offense, which makes it odd that the Eagles traded for him. He fits their offense as well as he did Nagy's.

    I really like Howard as a player, but I understand the move better now.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by DamnGoat View Post
    Or they just sign a guy off the street again, like they did with CJ Anderson.
    So remind me why Ty Montgomery and Jay ajayi were worth trading for????


    ‎"If your going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big"

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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyben36 View Post
    So remind me why Ty Montgomery and Jay ajayi were worth trading for????
    Ajayi (dealt for a 4th) had 1.5 seasons left on his rookie contract (Howard has 1) and Montgomery was dealt for a 7th round pick. You can probably throw Carlos Hyde (dealt for a 5th) in there too even after signing a FA deal with Cleveland.

    These things tell me that additional control matters (both Hyde and Ajayi had more than a year left on their deals), receiving backs have more value, and the league views Howard/Montgomery as JAG's.

    I get it, you don't like the trade. I don't buy this notion that his value would increase with injuries to contenders or whatever other scenario. Howard's still the same player that nobody valued enough to trade a 5th for and there are always RB's available off the street.
    Last edited by DamnGoat; 03-31-2019 at 12:08 AM.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by DamnGoat View Post
    Ajayi (dealt for a 4th) had 1.5 seasons left on his rookie contract (Howard has 1) and Montgomery was dealt for a 7th round pick. You can probably throw Carlos Hyde (dealt for a 5th) in there too even after signing a FA deal with Cleveland.

    These things tell me that additional control matters (both Hyde and Ajayi had more than a year left on their deals), receiving backs have more value, and the league views Howard/Montgomery as JAG's.

    I get it, you don't like the trade. I don't buy this notion that his value would increase with injuries to contenders or whatever other scenario. Howard's still the same player that nobody valued enough to trade a 5th for and there are always RB's available off the street.
    I dont think it had anything to do with control apthough yes having an extra year is probably a booste in value. Teams feel no reason to trade with guys like CJ anderson or TJ Yeldon out there. These guys will be picked up as suspensions injuries and other things happen.

    Thats why RBs never get traded in the offseason. Mid season trade deadline when guys have been picked over. And the options are limited. Its why the jags traded for Hyde. Because when fornette got suspended (and constantly hurt) the options to replace him were not apealing.

    And to be fair Hyde got a higher value and was only kept for half a season. Because they though he could hold the fort for them as they made a push. But the jags overall just crumbled.
    Last edited by Kyben36; 03-31-2019 at 02:20 AM.


    ‎"If your going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big"

    -Rem Koolhaas

  11. #41
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    Just being curious here. I'm not saying that this would even be realistic.

    Would anyone have issues with the 2020 6th round pick from the Eagles would net a trade for Robbie Gould this year?

    I know that I'd be a very happy fan.

  12. #42
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    So Kyben - you would rather have Nagy adjust his offense to a less desirable, more predictable style to build trade value for Howard in hopes that he nets a better return than just move forward with players who fit Nagyís scheme??

    People quickly forget three major reasons Nagy probably had Howard doing more in an adjusted scheme late last season.

    1) Mitch was coming off an injury and they didnít want to risk him and his health late. They had no chance at winning in the playoffs without Mitch. Howard helped milk the clock more, either by gaining first downs or by putting the defense back on the field. Either way, Mitch wasnít getting hurt. To this point, Mitch averaged less pass attempts/game after his injury (28.25) than before (32.1). Also, Howard averaged more carries/game in those last four games (18) than he did in the first 12 games (13.67)

    2) Running Howard saved Cohen. Tarik saw less carries and receptions in the last 4 weeks than he did in the first 12 games.

    (Coincidentally, CHI also averaged less points/game and had their two lowest scoring games of the year in those final 4 games. You figure it out...)

    3) CHI was in control of the division. After beating the Rams - a game that saw Mitch and Tarik the most involved of any of the last four games - CHI had all but sealed up a playoff birth. They could allow for a less aggressive, more predictable offense game plan that featured Howard instead of Mitch and Tarik.

    Howard was never going to be utilized by Nagy. He didnít fit the scheme and his value was never going to go up. While another teamís injury misfortune may have peaked their interest in Howard, his value was going to remain low (or be moving lower) given that he had no role in the offense. The team is better off having all of their desired players from Day 1, not holding out hope that an undesired player magically draws more interest and trade value while producing very little on the field.


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