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  1. #1606
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bandit999 View Post
    Do you think Bregman is a better defender then Arrenado
    Just enjoying the conversation as a non participating bystander, thanks.

  2. #1607
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    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    Just enjoying the conversation as a non participating bystander, thanks.
    Haha, fair enough

  3. #1608
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bandit999 View Post
    Do you think Bregman is a better defender then Arrenado
    The numbers suggest he is. I get that Nolan used to be on SC every night with a web gem, but that stuff doesn't last forever. Skills diminish, especially defense.

  4. #1609
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    All Things NL East & Around Baseball

    Quote Originally Posted by JoeGamer81 View Post
    The numbers suggest he is. I get that Nolan used to be on SC every night with a web gem, but that stuff doesn't last forever. Skills diminish, especially defense.
    Actually they donít suggest that. Check again. Arenado is still very much the superior defender and as awesome as ever at the position. Bregman hasnít been close.

  5. #1610
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna View Post
    Actually they donít suggest that. Check again. Arenado is still very much the superior defender and as awesome as ever at the position. Bregman hasnít been close.
    Depends on what metric you are using. His defensive runs saved have dropped significantly since 2017 and that's the number used to measure a player's total defensive value. UZR is still very solid though. If you're using defensive rWAR, he was worth nearly 3.5 WAR in 2013 just with his glove. Now he's worth 1 WAR.

  6. #1611
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna View Post
    Actually they donít suggest that. Check again. Arenado is still very much the superior defender and as awesome as ever at the position. Bregman hasnít been close.
    Thx someone with some sense

  7. #1612
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    Depends on what metric you are using. His defensive runs saved have dropped significantly since 2017 and that's the number used to measure a player's total defensive value. UZR is still very solid though. If you're using defensive rWAR, he was worth nearly 3.5 WAR in 2013 just with his glove. Now he's worth 1 WAR.
    You have to get out from behind a keyboard and use your eyes.

  8. #1613
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeGamer81 View Post
    The numbers suggest he is. I get that Nolan used to be on SC every night with a web gem, but that stuff doesn't last forever. Skills diminish, especially defense.
    Again which of his 6 going on 7 gold glove seasons in a row show him diminishing.
    If a pole was taken by players and managers who do you think they are saying is better fefensively.
    I mean guys who play and know the game not analytics people who were picked last for teams every day of their lives

  9. #1614
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    Depends on what metric you are using. His defensive runs saved have dropped significantly since 2017 and that's the number used to measure a player's total defensive value. UZR is still very solid though. If you're using defensive rWAR, he was worth nearly 3.5 WAR in 2013 just with his glove. Now he's worth 1 WAR.
    I remember seeing one of those defensive metric stats showed Keith Hernandez wasnt a good defender, forgot which one heard Joe and Evan talking about it.
    Maybe you know, whichever it is should be disregarded forever

  10. #1615
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    All Things NL East & Around Baseball

    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    Depends on what metric you are using. His defensive runs saved have dropped significantly since 2017 and that's the number used to measure a player's total defensive value. UZR is still very solid though. If you're using defensive rWAR, he was worth nearly 3.5 WAR in 2013 just with his glove. Now he's worth 1 WAR.
    Arenado is as excellent as ever defensively. His UZR was the highest itís been since his rookie year. He makes tons of remote and unlikely plays on a regular basis. Even if his DRS dropped a bit, heís still very good there too. Point is, Bregman hasnít had that kind of excellence ever at 3B.

  11. #1616
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna View Post
    Arenado is as excellent as ever defensively. His UZR was the highest itís been since his rookie year. He makes tons of remote and unlikely plays on a regular basis. Even if his DRS dropped a bit, heís still very good there too. Point is, Bregman hasnít had that kind of excellence ever at 3B.
    Agree with you 100 percent, I joined this discussion earler because someone was saying Bregman was the 2nd best player in baseball.
    He's not even the best player on his team

  12. #1617
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bandit999 View Post
    Agree with you 100 percent, I joined this discussion earler because someone was saying Bregman was the 2nd best player in baseball.
    He's not even the best player on his team
    Well thatís where youíre wrong and where we donít agree.

    Just because heís not on Arenadoís level defensively, doesnít mean he wasnít 2nd most valuable player in baseball in 2019. Only Trout and Yelich were better offensively than Bregman.

    The only player close to Bregman on the Astros this season was George Springer, but he missed some games whereas Bregman did not.

  13. #1618
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna View Post
    Arenado is as excellent as ever defensively. His UZR was the highest itís been since his rookie year. He makes tons of remote and unlikely plays on a regular basis. Even if his DRS dropped a bit, heís still very good there too. Point is, Bregman hasnít had that kind of excellence ever at 3B.
    It's not a bit. He went from 30 defensive runs saved in 2013 to 8 this year. Yeah he's a very good defensive 3rd baseman but the other worldly defender he was at 3rd, no. That happens. Defense tends to wane in your late 20s to early 30s. Most players are declining by age 30, almost all players are doing so by age 33.

  14. #1619
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna View Post
    Well thatís where youíre wrong and where we donít agree.

    Just because heís not on Arenadoís level defensively, doesnít mean he wasnít 2nd most valuable player in baseball in 2019. Only Trout and Yelich were better offensively than Bregman.

    The only player close to Bregman on the Astros this season was George Springer, but he missed some games whereas Bregman did not.
    Yeah you guys are overating Bregman, but that's ok, different ooiniona on the board are good

  15. #1620
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna View Post
    Well thatís where youíre wrong and where we donít agree.

    Just because heís not on Arenadoís level defensively, doesnít mean he wasnít 2nd most valuable player in baseball in 2019. Only Trout and Yelich were better offensively than Bregman.

    The only player close to Bregman on the Astros this season was George Springer, but he missed some games whereas Bregman did not.
    Let me ask you game on the line who'd you rather have up Bregman or Rendon, Bregman or Soto, Bregman or Altuve, Bregman or Freeman.
    My point is if you even have to think about it you can't say he's the 2nd most valuable player in baseball

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