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  1. #1501
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    Kirk/Theilan/Smith/Peterson/Pierce/Barr/Kendricks are all around 30+ as of next season I believe and that is a pretty large amount of talent at some important positions. On top of that we will be stuck with eating a bunch of pushed back salary/Kirk is at 45 mil next season so its more like we are talking about 2 seasons from now.
    Pierce and Peterson haven't played 1 snap for the Vikings yet.... Kendricks might be one of the best LB in football and is paid modestly. I mean I get what you are saying but jeez. This whole burn it down build it up idea every talks about is Madden BS. The teams that do that stay there for a long time Browns, Jets, Raiders, Jags, Dolphins, Lions to name a few are teams that always submit to this idea. Some have recovered but that 2-3 rebuild took 10 years.
    We have more top players at their position than many other teams in the NFL and no one on this team is overpaid. I don't want to hear about Cousins contract either because it really doesn't effect the teams ability to do anything. Vikings fans are ridiculous with blaming Kirks contract for the fact that guys who grew up in California and Texas have 0 interest in living and playing in Minnesota regardless of the contract.

    This team is fine compared to the rest of the league when it comes to the talent they have and young up and coming players. They are going to grow IF they let them.

  2. #1502
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingsfan0845 View Post
    Yup I agree. Itís basically rinse, wash, repeat. I do like our current set up with Zim and Rick but we just canít seem to get over the hump. Starting over from scratch is a real possibility. I hate thinking that could take 2-3 years before we see another potentially good team again but if we have another so-so season we may have no choice but to tear it down. My guess is Zim, Rick, and Kirk are all tied at the hip. So Iím guessing Zim and Rick will have this year and next year to get this team right. If not, itís back to rebuilding.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I initially was more on board with them/decisions but essentially since moving to Kirk Cousins I have become more and more frustrated with how they handle things/make decisions. I pointed out when we got him it was likely wasting years, it's possible we have 4 years with him (if we don't do much this year) and the two you reference where we have to wait to get out of the mess with that NO/SF playoffs being the only decent season in the 6 year span.

    I hope that they end it after 1 more and don't let Rick/Zimmer try and gut our future even more next offseason. I think this is their chance we either have a killer year or move on and accept what this team is around/with Kirk. IF we give them next year too that just extends the waiting period until further.

  3. #1503
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Jorge 69 View Post
    Pierce and Peterson haven't played 1 snap for the Vikings yet.... Kendricks might be one of the best LB in football and is paid modestly. I mean I get what you are saying but jeez. This whole burn it down build it up idea every talks about is Madden BS. The teams that do that stay there for a long time Browns, Jets, Raiders, Jags, Dolphins, Lions to name a few are teams that always submit to this idea. Some have recovered but that 2-3 rebuild took 10 years.
    We have more top players at their position than many other teams in the NFL and no one on this team is overpaid. I don't want to hear about Cousins contract either because it really doesn't effect the teams ability to do anything. Vikings fans are ridiculous with blaming Kirks contract for the fact that guys who grew up in California and Texas have 0 interest in living and playing in Minnesota regardless of the contract.

    This team is fine compared to the rest of the league when it comes to the talent they have and young up and coming players. They are going to grow IF they let them.
    I am not saying every single one of them needs to go, you seemed to imply Kirk is the only older player on the roster to potentially move on from. I listed guys that would be older and where we would have decisions to make. Tearing it down means making some of those tough decisions (Smith/Theilan/Kirk/Barr seem likely to be gone imo) and then evaluate. Pierce may not be old but we already have Tomlinson as a NT too so it might just make sense. I love Kendricks and would want to keep him most out of the guys mentioned. You asked what is there to tear down this team is young as hell and I listed a bunch of players not young at all by that time lol.

    If we had no issues with cap there would be 0 reason not to have signed oline by now. We may not have anything way way over the top but overall our cap situation has been dealt with by pushing a decent amount down the road yet we still can't make the room for our most important/major need.

    The team has made the playoffs 1 time the last 3 seasons and we are talking about not having the best season next year on top. I think we have some up and coming talent, not saying this isn't true at all. By tear down I was mostly referencing moving on from Kirk/Speilman/Zimmer but we also have some older guys it isn't a team solely of young guns as vikingsfan also noted.
    Last edited by mngopher35; 04-11-2021 at 03:54 PM.

  4. #1504
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    We can't get over the hump because we constantly seeminly deliberately leave ourselves weak in one position group, usually recently it's been OL. We were 'all in' the year we signed Kirk, but still expected a mediocre OL group to play above average. So we keep putting together 2 solid/strong position groups on both sides of the ball but never the third. We had one of the best overall D's in the league a couple years but an inconsistent O at the same time....then we finally had more consistency on O last year but a D that couldn't put it together for various reasons.
    gotta love 'referential' treatment

  5. #1505
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    I know that the 49ers trying to trade for Kirk is BS. However, I am interested to see if Speileman attends OSU and NDSU 2nd pro day. Doesn't seem there would be ANY reason at all other than a slim possibility of the unthinkable.

  6. #1506
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Jorge 69 View Post
    I know that the 49ers trying to trade for Kirk is BS. However, I am interested to see if Speileman attends OSU and NDSU 2nd pro day. Doesn't seem there would be ANY reason at all other than a slim possibility of the unthinkable.
    NDSU has a very solid OL prospect...not sure about OSU
    gotta love 'referential' treatment

  7. #1507
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiteWolf View Post
    NDSU has a very solid OL prospect...not sure about OSU
    Well these two are pretty much just for the QBs as I understand it.
    Just saw Ian Rappaport tweeted that the only two teams attending OSU 2nd pro day is San Fran and New England.

  8. #1508
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    Welp, looks like we are done with signings until after the draft... still a lot of fun names out there no the FA market.

  9. #1509
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    Clowney signing with the Browns, 1 year up to 10 million.

    Edge rusher in FA is getting thin. Could still look at Melvin Ingram or Ryan Kerrigan. Maybe Olivier Vernon if he's healthy. Other than that there isn't much left.
    2021 Vikings Draft:
    1: Christian Darrisaw OT Virginia Tech
    3: Kellen Mond QB Texas A&M
    3: Chazz Surratt LB North Carolina
    3: Wyatt Davis G Ohio State
    3: Patrick Jones III DE Pittsburgh
    4: Kene Nwangwu RB Iowa State
    4: Camryn Bynum S California
    4: Janarius Robinson DE Florida State
    5: Ihmir Smith-Marsette WR Iowa
    5: Zach Davidson TE Central Missouri St.
    6: Jaylen Twyman DT Pittsburgh

  10. #1510
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingsfan0845 View Post
    Clowney signing with the Browns, 1 year up to 10 million.

    Edge rusher in FA is getting thin. Could still look at Melvin Ingram or Ryan Kerrigan. Maybe Olivier Vernon if he's healthy. Other than that there isn't much left.
    For some reason, i really do think Vikings FO believes Weatherly/Woonum is the combo. They will certainly draft someone, but i dont think they are going DE in round 1 or round 2 (if they get a pick in that round).

    I think they look for DE value in middle rounds, and focus on OL, CB, S or WR in rounds 1-3.

    Between no extension for Harrison Smith, reworking Hunter contract, we just have way too much cap space with projected cap next year set to spike massively to not be signing OL help.

  11. #1511
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    Quote Originally Posted by APmvp28 View Post
    For some reason, i really do think Vikings FO believes Weatherly/Woonum is the combo. They will certainly draft someone, but i dont think they are going DE in round 1 or round 2 (if they get a pick in that round).

    I think they look for DE value in middle rounds, and focus on OL, CB, S or WR in rounds 1-3.

    Between no extension for Harrison Smith, reworking Hunter contract, we just have way too much cap space with projected cap next year set to spike massively to not be signing OL help.
    Agreed, considering the history and success of this team developing DEs I just don't see us taking one at #14 or even round 1 if we trade down. I like Patrick Jones II from Pitt end Rd 3/4 if he is there. Or if Rousseau truly falls the way people are saying I would take him ALL Day with pick #78.

  12. #1512
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Jorge 69 View Post
    Agreed, considering the history and success of this team developing DEs I just don't see us taking one at #14 or even round 1 if we trade down. I like Patrick Jones II from Pitt end Rd 3/4 if he is there. Or if Rousseau truly falls the way people are saying I would take him ALL Day with pick #78.
    If Rick/Zim weren't on the hot seat, I would agree with this. But their jobs are on the line. So far the message of the off season has been that Zim is either going to sink or swim this year doing things his way and that's with a strong defense. That has me feeling DE is a real possibility in the first round.
    2021 Vikings Draft:
    1: Christian Darrisaw OT Virginia Tech
    3: Kellen Mond QB Texas A&M
    3: Chazz Surratt LB North Carolina
    3: Wyatt Davis G Ohio State
    3: Patrick Jones III DE Pittsburgh
    4: Kene Nwangwu RB Iowa State
    4: Camryn Bynum S California
    4: Janarius Robinson DE Florida State
    5: Ihmir Smith-Marsette WR Iowa
    5: Zach Davidson TE Central Missouri St.
    6: Jaylen Twyman DT Pittsburgh

  13. #1513
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingsfan0845 View Post
    If Rick/Zim weren't on the hot seat, I would agree with this. But their jobs are on the line. So far the message of the off season has been that Zim is either going to sink or swim this year doing things his way and that's with a strong defense. That has me feeling DE is a real possibility in the first round.
    True, but of all the talent in this draft at other positions would you say one of the Rookie DE's splitting time with Weatherly and Wonnum really going to have the impact of any of the Oline we could take, a Micah Parsons if he drops, Devonta Smith or Waddle. I get the argument for DE but I think over the course of the 2021 season that is the position that will have the least impact on the success of the team this season. Especially when you consider that the Dline will have 100% new starters compared to 2020 season. So any success at the Rookie DE could just be a product of that.

    If they go DE there won't be a surprised bone in my body I just don't think it's the best investment of that pick unless they are quietly trading Hunter. Which I do not believe is in any shape or form the case.
    Last edited by El Jorge 69; 04-15-2021 at 11:54 AM.

  14. #1514
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Jorge 69 View Post
    True, but of all the talent in this draft at other positions would you say one of the Rookie DE's splitting time with Weatherly and Wonnum really going to have the impact of any of the Oline we could take, a Micah Parsons if he drops, Devonta Smith or Waddle. I get the argument for DE but I think over the course of the 2021 season that is the position that will have the least impact on the success of the team this season. Especially when you consider that the Dline will have 100% new starters compared to 2020 season. So any success at the Rookie DE could just be a product of that.

    If they go DE there won't be a surprised bone in my body I just don't think it's the best investment of that pick unless they are quietly trading Hunter. Which I do not believe is in any shape or form the case.
    I don't think a first round pick DE will split time with Weatherly and maybe not Wonnum either. His last time here Weatherly was only a rotational end but never split time with Griffen or Hunter. Not sure what Wonnum's role will be long term. Maybe if we go DE at 14 Wonnum takes on the old Brian Robison role where he rotates in and sometimes rushes from the interior. Regardless, I would expect Hunter and a rookie to take up 70+% of the snaps.

    I don't look at who we pick in the first round as "who will make more of an impact" because I think we can get a player on both sides of the ball in the first 2 rounds who can start right away. I look at this OL class and I see a bunch of guys we could get from the middle of the second round to both of our picks in the 3rd round that can start right away. I only see 1-2 pass rushers in that area we could get and play right away. Boogie Bashman may not last past around pick 50 but Peyton Turner should be within reach.

    Zimmers defenses since he arrived have always depended on two edge guys (Hunter/Griffen) creating a lot of pressure so he can drop more in coverage. I have little faith Wonnum can step up next year and be that guy.

    So we could go DE in the first, trade up into the 2nd for OL, and then even take another OL with our extra 3rd.
    2021 Vikings Draft:
    1: Christian Darrisaw OT Virginia Tech
    3: Kellen Mond QB Texas A&M
    3: Chazz Surratt LB North Carolina
    3: Wyatt Davis G Ohio State
    3: Patrick Jones III DE Pittsburgh
    4: Kene Nwangwu RB Iowa State
    4: Camryn Bynum S California
    4: Janarius Robinson DE Florida State
    5: Ihmir Smith-Marsette WR Iowa
    5: Zach Davidson TE Central Missouri St.
    6: Jaylen Twyman DT Pittsburgh

  15. #1515
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    The Raiders waived Maurice Hurst and Arden Key. I wouldn't mind taking a flier on Hurst.
    2021 Vikings Draft:
    1: Christian Darrisaw OT Virginia Tech
    3: Kellen Mond QB Texas A&M
    3: Chazz Surratt LB North Carolina
    3: Wyatt Davis G Ohio State
    3: Patrick Jones III DE Pittsburgh
    4: Kene Nwangwu RB Iowa State
    4: Camryn Bynum S California
    4: Janarius Robinson DE Florida State
    5: Ihmir Smith-Marsette WR Iowa
    5: Zach Davidson TE Central Missouri St.
    6: Jaylen Twyman DT Pittsburgh

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