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  1. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    You missed this point as well. The Knicks donít have any one need. They need everything, especially elite talent. Why box yourself in? Take the best player and be done with it. Youíre trying to fit parts to pieces that wonít even be here or arenít even good enough to be considered.

    They canít afford to take inferior players. Elite players win. Show me how often in NBA history where a team can just put together a bunch of good pieces to win. It doesnít work like that. The team that drafts the best talent of that generation and puts the best pieces around that player wins titles. The NBA, unlike other sports, is greatly impacted by one player.

    Zion is viewed as a potential once in a generation player. Ja, Barrett, etc., could very well be stars, but thereís a difference. That could be the difference between Jordan and Barkley, Ewing, etc. It could be the difference between LeBron and Melo. It could be the difference between Durant and Paul George or Curry and John Wall. One group wins titles, the others fall short. This is basically the same difference that many of us have been trying to explain to you regarding Doncic and Knox.

    No guarantee Zion becomes that, but he seems to be the only one with that level of potential and they donít come around often. Weíre basically talking AD, Simmons, Doncic and now Zion in the last decade plus as prospects viewed in that light. Learn from history. Even if you have doubts, you cannot pass just based on that. Who wants to risk purposely passing on that guy?
    Thank you .....saved me a lot of Writing this morning

  2. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    You missed this point as well. The Knicks donít have any one need. They need everything, especially elite talent. Why box yourself in? Take the best player and be done with it. Youíre trying to fit parts to pieces that wonít even be here or arenít even good enough to be considered.

    They canít afford to take inferior players. Elite players win. Show me how often in NBA history where a team can just put together a bunch of good pieces to win. It doesnít work like that. The team that drafts the best talent of that generation and puts the best pieces around that player wins titles. The NBA, unlike other sports, is greatly impacted by one player.

    Zion is viewed as a potential once in a generation player. Ja, Barrett, etc., could very well be stars, but thereís a difference. That could be the difference between Jordan and Barkley, Ewing, etc. It could be the difference between LeBron and Melo. It could be the difference between Durant and Paul George or Curry and John Wall. One group wins titles, the others fall short. This is basically the same difference that many of us have been trying to explain to you regarding Doncic and Knox.

    No guarantee Zion becomes that, but he seems to be the only one with that level of potential and they donít come around often. Weíre basically talking AD, Simmons, Doncic and now Zion in the last decade plus as prospects viewed in that light. Learn from history. Even if you have doubts, you cannot pass just based on that. Who wants to risk purposely passing on that guy?
    I don't think they should be considering "fit" but the idea that you take the less versatile guy b/c of fit makes no sense either to me. Zion plays everywhere. He is not only the most talented player, he is the the most adaptable to different situations.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
    My dick is named 'Ewing'.

  3. #228
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    this is a joke that we are actually talking about who to take if we are lucky to get #1?

    almost like saying who should have the Knicks picked, Ewing or Mullins? Mullins had a great 16 year career but would he have had the same impact on that Knicks team Ewing had?

    Folks that is rhetorical..............

  4. #229
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    this is a joke that we are actually talking about who to take if we are lucky to get #1?

    almost like saying who should have the Knicks picked, Ewing or Mullins? Mullins had a great 16 year career but would he have had the same impact on that Knicks team Ewing had?

    Folks that is rhetorical..............
    I mean Boogie also said Mudiay is a starter, Kanter is a legit starter, and that we should sign Klay over Durant... so...

  5. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    I mean Boogie also said Mudiay is a starter, Kanter is a legit starter, and that we should sign Klay over Durant... so...
    got it.........I'm thinking he was big time Frank starting at PG also now it's mudiay's turn..now it's move Frank to SG and get rid of timmy or put timmy off the bench?

    I guess we should realize there is one person in the entire BB world not choosing Zion with the #1........

    Maybe two somewhere lol

  6. #231
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    Zion has the best PER in the history of college basketball. Heís a freak of nature.

    One person is arguing against him. Thereís no reason to entertain the idea of anyone other than Zion going #1

  7. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by ewing View Post
    I think Mudiay's one good quality (north/south driving) is actually pretty coveted in the league right now. He just isn't good at anything else and your not going to let him have the ball all the time if that's all he can do. Maybe if did it on a Freek level but he cant and honestly I have no faith in him learning to play at different speeds at this point
    He has natural talent doing that but he has no clue when he should or shouldn't be pushing it.

    Mudiay is unconscious in a bad way on the basketball court.

  8. #233
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    Mudiay is a starter. Is he not starting and putting up better stats than many other starting PGs in the NBA.

    Kanter is also a starter on a good team, a team that plays team defense. If you start Kanter on the Spurs right now next to LA their record is better and he is still a double double machine.

    Klay's age and availability is why I think he is a more realistic option. KD already said publicly that he wants to make the most money that he can make. Are Knicks fans that swallow that they don't understand that means I'm not leaving because GS can pay me the most? Knicks aren't getting KD folks... wake up!

    Klay may leave if he wants to make more money because they can't Max out KD, already Maxed Curry and then Max Klay too. Now it's a chance Klay takes a pay cut to keep the Splash brothers together. This is why I've always targeted realistic players like Harris, Rozier and Oubre who haven't reached their prime and can be added without capping out.

    Back to Zion... I don't see how a 6'6" 280lb wing who can't shoot is going to add value to a team. How is he so versatile in the NBA?

    If you play him on the wing team will back off and load up in the paint to stop his drives.

    If you put him in the post he will become a smaller version of LJ and we all know how taller players abused him in the paint and cost us a championship in 1999.

    I just think Zion is an enigma like Charles Barkley who also never won a championship. There are arguably more skilled big men now than in the Barkley era. Zion won't be as effective as many people think IMO.

  9. #234
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    i mean if Mudiay and Kanter are legit starters... I wonder why we've won 10 games...lol

    we should be all set then right? With KP coming back that gives us 3-4 legit starters, that should make us a 45+ win team right?...

  10. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knicks Boogie View Post
    Mudiay is a starter. Is he not starting and putting up better stats than many other starting PGs in the NBA.

    Kanter is also a starter on a good team, a team that plays team defense. If you start Kanter on the Spurs right now next to LA their record is better and he is still a double double machine.

    Klay's age and availability is why I think he is a more realistic option. KD already said publicly that he wants to make the most money that he can make. Are Knicks fans that swallow that they don't understand that means I'm not leaving because GS can pay me the most? Knicks aren't getting KD folks... wake up!

    Klay may leave if he wants to make more money because they can't Max out KD, already Maxed Curry and then Max Klay too. Now it's a chance Klay takes a pay cut to keep the Splash brothers together. This is why I've always targeted realistic players like Harris, Rozier and Oubre who haven't reached their prime and can be added without capping out.

    Back to Zion... I don't see how a 6'6" 280lb wing who can't shoot is going to add value to a team. How is he so versatile in the NBA?

    If you play him on the wing team will back off and load up in the paint to stop his drives.

    If you put him in the post he will become a smaller version of LJ and we all know how taller players abused him in the paint and cost us a championship in 1999.

    I just think Zion is an enigma like Charles Barkley who also never won a championship. There are arguably more skilled big men now than in the Barkley era. Zion won't be as effective as many people think IMO.
    He's too big and strong for wings, too quick for bigs. He can realistically defend 3+ positions on the court. How is that not being versatile? You're the only one boxing him in as a wing, when he's not even that.

    If it were as simple as just backing off, why don't teams do that with Simmons and Giannis? This point would be valid for most other players, but Simmons, Giannis and Zion have an important common trait that allow them to get away with this -- they are physically and/or athletically superior to the competition. It's no different. With Zion, you are literally talking about one of the best athletes the NBA has ever seen.

    Neither one of us know how he'll pan out, but if you actually watch a Duke game you can see a clear difference between him and everyone else on the court, including his teammates.

    Also, to use one of your arguments, smarter people than us classify him as a generational talent. They are rarely ever wrong when they go to that extreme and it usually takes something unforeseen, such as an injury, for that player to not at least be an All Star if they don't meet those expectations.
    Last edited by smood999; 01-11-2019 at 12:36 PM.

  11. #236
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    He's too big and strong for wings, too quick for bigs. He can realistically defend 3+ positions on the court. How is that not being versatile? You're the only one boxing him in as a wing, when he's not even that.

    If it were as simple as just backing off, why don't teams do that with Simmons and Giannis? This point would be valid for most other players, but Simmons, Giannis and Zion have an important common trait that allow them to get away with this -- they are physically and/or athletically superior to the competition. It's no different. With Zion, you are literally talking about one of the best athletes the NBA has ever seen.
    He is a better shooter then either of those guys right now and is the hardest worker on the floor every night. Not only can he compensate he is going to get better
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
    My dick is named 'Ewing'.

  12. #237
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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    i mean if Mudiay and Kanter are legit starters... I wonder why we've won 10 games...lol

    we should be all set then right? With KP coming back that gives us 3-4 legit starters, that should make us a 45+ win team right?...
    So no team has 3 legit starters unless they win 45 plus games???? Apparently half this league doesn't have legit starters. Would love to hear your definition of legit.

  13. #238
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    Edit. Guys post to fast.

  14. #239
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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    i mean if Mudiay and Kanter are legit starters... I wonder why we've won 10 games...lol

    we should be all set then right? With KP coming back that gives us 3-4 legit starters, that should make us a 45+ win team right?...
    We've only won 10 games because no one plays defense consistently...it's as simple as that. Many games this season the Knicks have been right there but defensive mistakes cost them the game. This team even with all these young players isn't that bad offensively. Another reason they don't win is because there is no chemistry. Fiz is juggling guys in and out of the rotation all the time (maybe for the tank) but for whatever reason. How many times have you seen a guy make a pass thinking his teammate will be there and throw the ball away? Chemistry issues that you don't see on more stable teams.

    The whole point of development is to find out who can do what together and get better at it.

    I don't want Kanter because he just refuses to play defense, Timmy wants to play D but loses his man or misses a rotation overtime. Those are all main factors in winning and losing on the NBA level. Everybody in the NBA is very talented but the Spurs and Portland and Denver are proving that better talent doesn't always beat great chemistry.

  15. #240
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    He's too big and strong for wings, too quick for bigs. He can realistically defend 3+ positions on the court. How is that not being versatile? You're the only one boxing him in as a wing, when he's not even that.

    If it were as simple as just backing off, why don't teams do that with Simmons and Giannis? This point would be valid for most other players, but Simmons, Giannis and Zion have an important common trait that allow them to get away with this -- they are physically and/or athletically superior to the competition. It's no different. With Zion, you are literally talking about one of the best athletes the NBA has ever seen.

    Neither one of us know how he'll pan out, but if you actually watch a Duke game you can see a clear difference between him and everyone else on the court, including his teammates.

    Also, to use one of your arguments, smarter people than us classify him as a generational talent. They are rarely ever wrong when they go to that extreme and it usually takes something unforeseen, such as an injury, for that player to not at least be an All Star if they don't meet those expectations.
    Look I'm not against drafting Zion and yes I watch almost every Duke games because Zion and Barrett are both high flyers and very entertaining. I also know that in the NBA Zion isn't stronger than everybody else, Zion can't shoot consistently enough to put him on the wing, Zion isn't skying over AD, Freak, Embiid or even a big strong guy like Kanter for some of those rebounds that he gets in college.

    I feel that Barrett is also a dominant player and if you are watching Duke games you would know that. RJ is a better passer and much better shooter than Zion. No one knows for sure but I think his skill set transfers to the NBA better than Zion.

    It's like comparing Charles Barkley to Tmac... both great players, but who would you rather have on this Knicks team? I'm more of a Tmac guy.

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