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  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack the Ripper View Post
    Can we stop the bellyaching about Tyrod already? He sucked before he was benched in Cleveland and barring an injury he isnít getting that job back.

    Darnold and Rosen have looked just as bad as Allen at times this year. Neither have a game as impressive as Allenís in the win over Minnesota, though. Thatís being a 1st year QB. Mahomes, while a 1st year starter, is not a 1st year QB. So the learning curve is not the same for him. Nobody predicted the success heís had this year. Heís exceeded even the loftiest of expectations, but heís also loaded with playmakers in an Andy Reid offense. Itís impressive how well he has succeeded, but letís not overlook the fact that heís succeeding in the cushiest situation in football. His 3rd option in the passing game is freakiní Sammy Watkins.

    Letís also not pretend that you wouldnít have *****ed and cried if we had drafted Mahomes, sabres. Only in hindsight do you think we should have drafted him, but youíve been barking about how QB is the last position we should have drafted and about how Tyrod should still be here. So shut up about Mahomes already.
    Yup, that too. I actually went back to last year's draft threads. He wanted no parts of a QB and he actually praised that draft, including Peterman.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by sabres11 View Post
    Pay attention. As I have said a trillion times, MY PLAN, wouldn't have been to draft a QB with all the needs this team has. However, we knew the coaches plan was to move on from Tyrod and he had several better options available and said no. Even as backup, we could have had Osweiler, Lynch, McCarron, etc, yet Mcdermotts plan was Peterman all along. So in the end, as I have said a trillion times, Our coaches failed this team with Their Plan. Who knows if the other backups would have been any better, but we all knew, at least the intelligent Bills fans knew, that Peterman is horrible and Allen should never ever be starting.

    And If I was in charge, and I knew I had to get a QB last year or the next, at number 10, a smart person would go for the people they see, Maholmes or Watson, rather than hoping and praying that they will have an opportunity at someone the following year. That is a horrible way to run the team. Praying and wishing that something the following year happens.
    I think the point is that you keep going on the epic rants as if you would've done the same or wanted them to do it at the time. I mentioned the culture thing and Ripper brought up the QB thing.

    Every year in the draft thread when someone suggests drafting a QB in the first round, you're against it. You can't just go back now and say that should've been the move.

    Also, you're going about this as if this year is a let down. It's not. This is what a lot of us expected, including everyone on here.

  3. #18
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    Comparing Allen to other QBs at this point is irrelevant at this point. Other guys are in other systems and even though many were drafted in the same year, they will take a different amount of time to develop. Mahomes is not a rookie in terms of experience, and is on a top 3 team in football. DeShaun Watson actually did not perform well last season, as dynamic as he seemed and as much as he lit up fantasy football leagues. He has played very well this year, though, but he also has a great WR corps and a ****** offensive line.

    I don't know if Allen will be the answer. He's not in a great position. He has probably the worst cast of receivers in the league.

    But I do think that building around a rookie QB is the way to go. This is how you build a team because if you can get good QB play out of him for a few years, you can free up a lot of cash to spend elsewhere on the team. This is the formula for teams like Philly, St. Louis and Kansas City.

    Trading Tyrod was fine. They got a third round pick for him, which is great value. The Bills would still do that deal in hindsight. I don't think they should have traded McCarron, though. Peterman just should not be on the field. If they can get away with Derek Anderson, fine. I can live with getting a 3rd and a 5th in return for backup QBs. Can't live with Peterman in there, though. His handling of Nathan is the worst thing he's done in Buffalo, and it just doesn't make any sense to me.

    He's coming off by and far the best game of his career. He went 6-12 and threw two interceptions pretty much in a row. Somehow he starts against the Chargers last year in a meaningful game, and gets action in a playoff game. Then on Sunday, he is put in a position where he could push the Bills back to .500.
    Last edited by Driven; 10-16-2018 at 01:48 PM.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    I agree with the bold, especially when it turns into having all choir boys on the team. It's one of the reasons I felt contributed to their lack of success pre-Whaley. The thing I'm having a hard time with though is that you were for that last year. You raved about him prioritizing certain kinds of players such as Peterman.

    You are right to do a 180 on that stance, but you would've never known that you posted the opposite last year with how much ranting you're doing about it.
    I never once supported Peterman or the coaching decision to draft and play him ever. I want you all to go back to last years draft thread. I specifically told you all we would not be drafting a QB, because McDermott is in love with Peterman and thinks he is our "Tom Brady". I of course was wrong and surprised that we made trades for Allen, but my belief all along was McDermott didn't want to draft Maholmes or Watson with a high pick, because he totally believed Peterman was a superstar in the 5th round. All of the decisions McDermott has made ever since drafting him, proves my theory right.


    McDermott loved Peterman so much, McDermott got rid of all of his competition. He knew fans wouldn't want to see Allen ever in the game, so he got rid of Peterman's competition, then only carried 2 QB's on the roster. What kind of coach goes into the season, with Peterman and a rookie, who wasn't even that good in college, playing behind this line? A bad coach. In College, Allen had 3 games his senior year that he couldn't throw for over 100 yards. He had around 6 games at no more than 150 yards. All while playing in a conference, where unknown QB's, against the same opponents, were throwing for 300 yards. Everyone falls in love with a players attitude and heart, but we need to start falling in love with the talent. He barely showed any in college.

    And just watch what happens this next week in Indi. If Peterman plays poorly and we lose a game that our defense hands to us, the locker room will become the complete opposite of what McDermott tried to create. The team will turn on McDermott. They are in the process of turning on him now. If we lose in the same fashion against Indi, watch the post game interviews. Players will publically call the coach out.
    Last edited by sabres11; 10-17-2018 at 08:56 AM.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Driven View Post
    Comparing Allen to other QBs at this point is irrelevant at this point. Other guys are in other systems and even though many were drafted in the same year, they will take a different amount of time to develop. Mahomes is not a rookie in terms of experience, and is on a top 3 team in football. DeShaun Watson actually did not perform well last season, as dynamic as he seemed and as much as he lit up fantasy football leagues. He has played very well this year, though, but he also has a great WR corps and a ****** offensive line.

    I don't know if Allen will be the answer. He's not in a great position. He has probably the worst cast of receivers in the league.

    But I do think that building around a rookie QB is the way to go. This is how you build a team because if you can get good QB play out of him for a few years, you can free up a lot of cash to spend elsewhere on the team. This is the formula for teams like Philly, St. Louis and Kansas City.

    Trading Tyrod was fine. They got a third round pick for him, which is great value. The Bills would still do that deal in hindsight. I don't think they should have traded McCarron, though. Peterman just should not be on the field. If they can get away with Derek Anderson, fine. I can live with getting a 3rd and a 5th in return for backup QBs. Can't live with Peterman in there, though. His handling of Nathan is the worst thing he's done in Buffalo, and it just doesn't make any sense to me.

    He's coming off by and far the best game of his career. He went 6-12 and threw two interceptions pretty much in a row. Somehow he starts against the Chargers last year in a meaningful game, and gets action in a playoff game. Then on Sunday, he is put in a position where he could push the Bills back to .500.

    I have been back and forth on the whether or not we can compare the rookies, when they are playing with different talent and different coaches etc etc.

    For Allen, I wanted to blame the WR's and line, just as I did with Tyrod last year. However, lets face it, Allen has not even come close to the WR's when throwing deep. I think he has completed one catch thrown over 20 yards this season. At least with Tyrod, we watched several drops when the ball hit our WR's hands or chest. With Allen, we haven't seen that. What we see is the ball 20 yards overthrown, 10 yards out of bounds, or 5 yards underthrown. He is not throwing for 80 yards a game, because our WR's are dropping passes.

    If Maholmes or Watson were here, of course they wouldn't be throwing for 400 yards. but they would definitely be hitting our Receivers in stride. Allen has failed to do that. When throwing deep, Maholmes and Watson would definitely get the ball to the WR. Whether they catch or drop the ball we will never know, but again, lets face it, Allen has not even come close to given our WR's a chance. He is nowhere near coming close to his targets.

    Now lets take it a step forward. Lets say Allen played for KC. Even with all their weapons, is Allen now completing 20 yard passes? Is Allen throwing 20 yard 3rd down completions, by throwing the ball with his left hand the way Maholmes did? Does Allen put up 40 points a game? Of course the answer is no. So at the end of the day, we would most likely be better with another QB, when other teams would be worse off with Allen.
    Last edited by sabres11; 10-17-2018 at 09:28 AM.

  6. #21
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    Have you even watched Watson? Dude not good at all last year. You're comparing Allen to these guys after 4.5 games of his career.

    The Bills offense outside of the RB is brutal. You can't expect a rookie to come in and light it up.

  7. #22
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    I don't know if Allen would be doing what mahomes is, and no one will know until he has a year if seasoning. You think they are giving Allen the green light to throw bombs to the slowest WR corps in the league? If we saw anything from McDermott last season it's that he knows how to play it close to the vest and rely on his defense to win games. Why would you think Allen has more flexibility in the offense then tyrod did?

    Also tyrod's deep ball sucked.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Driven View Post
    Have you even watched Watson? Dude not good at all last year. You're comparing Allen to these guys after 4.5 games of his career.

    The Bills offense outside of the RB is brutal. You can't expect a rookie to come in and light it up.
    Sorry, but I don't think you watched last year. Watson last year as a rookie,

    first game against NE 178 1 TD 40 yards rushing was his worse game. Then the next few games before being injured he threw for 310 yards 2tds, 385 yards 2 TDs, 375 yards 2 TDs, 377 1 TD and then before being injured in 2nd qtr 177 yards 1 tD. He also rushed on average 40 yards a game with 1 TD.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    I don't know if Allen would be doing what mahomes is, and no one will know until he has a year if seasoning. You think they are giving Allen the green light to throw bombs to the slowest WR corps in the league? If we saw anything from McDermott last season it's that he knows how to play it close to the vest and rely on his defense to win games. Why would you think Allen has more flexibility in the offense then tyrod did?

    Also tyrod's deep ball sucked.
    I think common sense would tell anyone who watches football, that Allen would have made KC no better, BUT, Maholmes would have made Buffalo one hell of a lot better. If you think otherwise, then your just trying to convince yourself that the Bills didn't bomb the QB position once again.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by sabres11 View Post
    Sorry, but I don't think you watched last year. Watson last year as a rookie,

    first game against NE 178 1 TD 40 yards rushing was his worse game. Then the next few games before being injured he threw for 310 yards 2tds, 385 yards 2 TDs, 375 yards 2 TDs, 377 1 TD and then before being injured in 2nd qtr 177 yards 1 tD. He also rushed on average 40 yards a game with 1 TD.
    Thank you for posting basic stats. Those don't tell the whole story. Watson did not play well last year. He also wasn't good on the mid-range throws and was okay on the deep ball. He put up all of his numbers with short passes against the blitz. PFF graded him as the 29th best QB last season. For comparison's sake, Tyrod was 12th.

    Watching Watson you see a guy with dynamic talent, but a guy who plays very badly at times. He's not a great decision maker, and if he were on Buffalo he would not be putting up the video game numbers that he did last season.

    Watson has played very well this year, but even he played badly against the Bills last game. The same Bills who he was trailing to, even though he has far better weapons than the Buffalo QBs do.

  11. #26
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    Here is another one. Allen puts on a Bills Jersey, can barely throw for 100 yards and he is a god. Watson throws for nearly 400 yards every game and Allen is better. Love it.

    And if Watson played here, we would have a lot more highlight reels, than what we have here, with our QB, running, not throwing the ball. If Allen played in Houston though, they would not be getting 400 yards per game throwing.

    As for Watson playing against us last game, the coach for Houston wasn't expecting the pass rush to be fierce. They were going to bench him because he is injured, but thought Buffalo would be like a bye. The coach made somewhat of that comment and Kyle Williams told WGR he got the troops riled up after hearing the coaches comment.
    Last edited by sabres11; 10-17-2018 at 02:42 PM.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by sabres11 View Post
    Here is another one. Allen puts on a Bills Jersey, can barely throw for 100 yards and he is a god. Watson throws for nearly 400 yards every game and Allen is better. Love it.
    Is this seriously what you took out of that? If so, what is the point of even having a discussion with you?

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Driven View Post
    Is this seriously what you took out of that? If so, what is the point of even having a discussion with you?
    Exactly. Welcome to the forum.

    I'd love for sabers to pull a quote where any of us said he's a god or said he's currently better than mahomes or Watson. Sabers listens to the radio and confuses the things he hears on the radio with us informed posters. And then he says the rants that he hears from the radio hosts on here like he's smart. It's hilarious and predictable, but it makes posting here tough.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    Exactly. Welcome to the forum.

    I'd love for sabers to pull a quote where any of us said he's a god or said he's currently better than mahomes or Watson. Sabers listens to the radio and confuses the things he hears on the radio with us informed posters. And then he says the rants that he hears from the radio hosts on here like he's smart. It's hilarious and predictable, but it makes posting here tough.
    I actually do agree with his point this time around, but it was to be expected this season. It was never going to be about this season for Josh Allen. We all knew he was further behind the others.

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