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  1. #631
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    I am not saying AA was being honest in his interview yesterday, but he eluded that ATL spent a large chunk of their money on JD/BMac. If that is true, I already don’t like the offseason approach he has taken. That means the only viable way to fill holes with good players is via trade. The FA market (and the cost associated with shopping in it) would only land players of a Markakis level at best. (And before people start with the “Marky is good” talk, let’s be honest. He had half of a year in the last 4-5 seasons that were good. You are probably paying for the average Marky that he has been for quite a long time now, not that dude who went on a half season tear last year)

    If ATL enters the 2019 season with Marky back in RF and no real upgrades to the pen or rotation, I will consider this offseason very poor. If that is the case, AA should have never paid JD 23M to upgrade a position that was already filled with a solid starter.

    I always reserve judgement until the offseason is over. I am just thinking out loud right now. But if AA was being honest yesterday, I and many other fans will be disappointed come the beginning of the season.


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  2. #632
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach100 View Post
    I am not saying AA was being honest in his interview yesterday, but he eluded that ATL spent a large chunk of their money on JD/BMac. If that is true, I already don’t like the offseason approach he has taken. That means the only viable way to fill holes with good players is via trade. The FA market (and the cost associated with shopping in it) would only land players of a Markakis level at best. (And before people start with the “Marky is good” talk, let’s be honest. He had half of a year in the last 4-5 seasons that were good. You are probably paying for the average Marky that he has been for quite a long time now, not that dude who went on a half season tear last year)

    If ATL enters the 2019 season with Marky back in RF and no real upgrades to the pen or rotation, I will consider this offseason very poor. If that is the case, AA should have never paid JD 23M to upgrade a position that was already filled with a solid starter.

    I always reserve judgement until the offseason is over. I am just thinking out loud right now. But if AA was being honest yesterday, I and many other fans will be disappointed come the beginning of the season.


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    Most reports I've read only seem to think Donaldson/McCann took up about half of what we have to spend. So when AA said he has to be a little more "selective" I took that to mean we won't be spending 20+ million again on a 1 player. I still think AA has something up his sleeve. I'll be surprised if he doesn't use our prospect capital to make a splash at the winter meetings.
    2018 Vikings Draft :
    Round 1: Mike Hughes CB UCF
    Round 2: Brian O'Neill OT Pittsburgh
    Round 4: Jalyn Holmes DE Ohio State
    Round 5: Tyler Conklin TE Central Michigan
    Round 5: Daniel Carlson K Auburn
    Round 6: Colby Gossett G Appalachian State
    Round 6: Ade Aruna DE Tulane
    Round 7: Devante Downs LB California


  3. #633
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    Carrasco signed an extension. I wonder if CLE gets more aggressive in moving Kluber or Bauer.


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  4. #634
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach100 View Post
    Carrasco signed an extension. I wonder if CLE gets more aggressive in moving Kluber or Bauer.


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    Who would you offer for Bauer?

  5. #635
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    Quote Originally Posted by SB75 View Post
    Who would you offer for Bauer?
    Bauer is tough to determine. He broke out last year but can we expect this type of production going forward? He also has some baggage. He claims he won't sign a long term deal. He wants to go year by year instead. He also can be a bone head. He cut his hand playing around with a drone and had to miss time. He just recently admitted to cutting his hand again. It'll be tough to give up somebody like Soroka for him. Maybe 1 or 2 of our "B" type prospects.
    2018 Vikings Draft :
    Round 1: Mike Hughes CB UCF
    Round 2: Brian O'Neill OT Pittsburgh
    Round 4: Jalyn Holmes DE Ohio State
    Round 5: Tyler Conklin TE Central Michigan
    Round 5: Daniel Carlson K Auburn
    Round 6: Colby Gossett G Appalachian State
    Round 6: Ade Aruna DE Tulane
    Round 7: Devante Downs LB California


  6. #636
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    1 or 2 “B” prospects will get the phone hung up on AA. That is the return I think MadBum would get for SF, not Bauer for CLE.

    Bauer has 2 yrs of team control left. He is coming off a really good year. He is somewhat cost controlled through ARB.

    Cleveland wants salary relief, so they want young players in return. They have very few good pitching prospects, so I would guess they will want a 1-2 in return.

    Bauer is a tough case. You will have to pay for the year he just had, not his previous years which are substantially less impressive. I would guess CLE would want a top 50 SP - Touki, Sororka, Wright, or Anderson - plus a fringe top 100 guy, like Wentz or Allard.

    I can understand why fans and even AA wouldn’t want to pay that price. If Bauer is the pitcher of old, ATL would get fleeced. If ATL gets the Bauer of last year, it is probably worth it.

    I am actually leaning towards holding out, getting MadBum (1 year deal, will cost the least amount of prospects, and is a good #2) and using the 23M from JD and the 12M from MadBum in trying to get Sale next year. That is if he and BOS don’t strike a deal.

    Trade for Peralta & MadBum and see how 2019 goes.


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  7. #637
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach100 View Post
    1 or 2 “B” prospects will get the phone hung up on AA. That is the return I think MadBum would get for SF, not Bauer for CLE.

    Bauer has 2 yrs of team control left. He is coming off a really good year. He is somewhat cost controlled through ARB.

    Cleveland wants salary relief, so they want young players in return. They have very few good pitching prospects, so I would guess they will want a 1-2 in return.

    Bauer is a tough case. You will have to pay for the year he just had, not his previous years which are substantially less impressive. I would guess CLE would want a top 50 SP - Touki, Sororka, Wright, or Anderson - plus a fringe top 100 guy, like Wentz or Allard.

    I can understand why fans and even AA wouldn’t want to pay that price. If Bauer is the pitcher of old, ATL would get fleeced. If ATL gets the Bauer of last year, it is probably worth it.

    I am actually leaning towards holding out, getting MadBum (1 year deal, will cost the least amount of prospects, and is a good #2) and using the 23M from JD and the 12M from MadBum in trying to get Sale next year. That is if he and BOS don’t strike a deal.

    Trade for Peralta & MadBum and see how 2019 goes.


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    By "B" prospects, I mean anybody not named Soroka/Wright/Touki/Anderson. Pitchers like Bryse Wilson and Joey Wentz should get the conversation started. I like Bauer but don't feel comfortable giving up any of those 4. I do feel Bauer turned a corner, though. His previous seasons were filled with ups and downs and it appears last year he ironed out his control issues. However, my concern is if those flair up again. Plus the baggage.

    I'm with you on MadBum for the reasons you stated. Plus, I'm thinking being further away from his injuries should be beneficial to him. He'll be almost 2 years removed from his shoulder injury and a year from his broken hand when the season starts. Having to rehab 2 major injuries in the middle of the season 2 straight years surely played a part in his drop in velocity. I'd be willing to gamble that we'll see a better pitcher in 2019.
    2018 Vikings Draft :
    Round 1: Mike Hughes CB UCF
    Round 2: Brian O'Neill OT Pittsburgh
    Round 4: Jalyn Holmes DE Ohio State
    Round 5: Tyler Conklin TE Central Michigan
    Round 5: Daniel Carlson K Auburn
    Round 6: Colby Gossett G Appalachian State
    Round 6: Ade Aruna DE Tulane
    Round 7: Devante Downs LB California


  8. #638
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach100 View Post
    Carrasco signed an extension. I wonder if CLE gets more aggressive in moving Kluber or Bauer.


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    Reportedly they only want to move Bauer right now.

  9. #639
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingsfan0845 View Post
    By "B" prospects, I mean anybody not named Soroka/Wright/Touki/Anderson. Pitchers like Bryse Wilson and Joey Wentz should get the conversation started. I like Bauer but don't feel comfortable giving up any of those 4. I do feel Bauer turned a corner, though. His previous seasons were filled with ups and downs and it appears last year he ironed out his control issues. However, my concern is if those flair up again. Plus the baggage.

    I'm with you on MadBum for the reasons you stated. Plus, I'm thinking being further away from his injuries should be beneficial to him. He'll be almost 2 years removed from his shoulder injury and a year from his broken hand when the season starts. Having to rehab 2 major injuries in the middle of the season 2 straight years surely played a part in his drop in velocity. I'd be willing to gamble that we'll see a better pitcher in 2019.
    I just don’t think a Wentz/Wilson/Gohara type guy will headline a deal for a SP who has 2 years of cheap team control and is coming off a 5.7 WAR season.

    I know he only has one year like that, it CLE will do their very best to value him as that type of guy moving forward. I also beat one pitching needy team is willing to part with more.

    As always, I could certainly be wrong. I just don’t see a SP coming off such a good season moving for a low-end too 100 guy. I think that is a MadBum-esque return.


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  10. #640
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    DOB put up an article on The Athletic. Here are some of the big points:

    - Braves weren't willing to give up 3 elite pitching prospects for Diaz
    - he mentioned David Peralta as the best trade target and Cutch/Cargo as OFs the Braves might be interested in
    - Brantley at 3 for 45 might draw a pass from the Braves
    - AA doesn't like making deals at the winter meetings; prefers to finalize something before or after
    - remaining cash is probably about 15-20 million
    - Liberty leaves it up to the Braves to set the payroll as they seem fit
    - Terry McGuirk and a few others decide payroll, has full confidence in AA's vision.
    - Braves unlikely to give Indians young, major league position players (Ender being traded is not happening) plus 2 or 3 pitching prospects for Kluber. That is the indication the price tag for Kluber will be
    - Bauer doesn't seem high on the wish list
    - Braves like Wheeler but are uncertain if Mets will trade him, let alone in the divison
    - AA wants a reliable closer
    - Kimbrel still unlikely. Adam Ottavino also unlikely
    - AA thinks Minter is talented enough to make a jump next year
    - Britton might be an option
    - unlikely to be involved on Grienke
    - nothing is imminent, on the FA or trade market

    Quote from AA on Donaldson hitting 2nd:

    “The last time he hit second every day was his MVP year (2015), and that worked out,” said Anthopoulos, who was the Blue Jays’ GM who traded to bring Donaldson to Toronto after the 2014 season. “Some people in (research and development) will tell you, the 2-hole is an important spot. And the other side of it is, getting your best hitters more at-bats. So knowing that Freddie is behind him, and Acuña could still hit (leadoff); Snit’s talked about potentially hitting (Acuña) fourth. The way Ender swung the bat at the end of the year — his last two months were fantastic — he could find himself back up there (at leadoff). Maybe (Ozzie) Albies. But Snit will make that call.

    “I do think there’s some merit to just getting guys more at-bats. If we end up with starting off the game with Acuña, Donaldson and Freddie Freeman, the guy on the other side is not feeling good. If you look at momentum, the team that’s scoring first and all that, it’s pretty good. But Snit will make that decision. He’s got all winter and spring training to make that call.”

    When it was mentioned to Anthopoulos that Atlanta’s top of the order could resemble the formidable group the Boston Red Sox have at the top, he said, “Yeah, the guy that won the (AL) MVP hit first (Mookie Betts). Ronald did an unbelievable job in that spot. The fact that he can run and do all those things …

    “But just in my opinion, getting your best hitters the most at-bats, makes the most sense. Whether you want to hit them one, two or three (in whichever order). But again, Snit will make that call.”
    2018 Vikings Draft :
    Round 1: Mike Hughes CB UCF
    Round 2: Brian O'Neill OT Pittsburgh
    Round 4: Jalyn Holmes DE Ohio State
    Round 5: Tyler Conklin TE Central Michigan
    Round 5: Daniel Carlson K Auburn
    Round 6: Colby Gossett G Appalachian State
    Round 6: Ade Aruna DE Tulane
    Round 7: Devante Downs LB California


  11. #641
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    Why the hell would you bat Acuna behind the slow guys?

  12. #642
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    1. 100% agree with Coach on Markakis. You are paying for a half season abberation and he isn't getting any younger.

    2. SB I am right there with you on the rather having Madbum for cheaper than Bauer. Peralta and MadBum added to this squad is a plus.

    3. I massively agree the offseason is a flop if we only add Cutch or Markakis or Coors Field Gonzo and spend a ton of money on a position we weren't as desperate at as OF and SP and bullpen. Donaldson was more of a luxury than necessity. I actually think we could have got Donaldson cheaper, but you can't fault the aggressiveness and trying him for a yr.


    4. Soroka, Touki and Anderson are hell no's for Bauer, Wright probably as well is a strong no. I don't know if I like Wright or Anderson more, but I know I loved Touki and Soroka.

    5. Gohara and Allard and another prospect 10-20 for Bauer.

    6. As of right now, I don't like Donaldson at the 2 hole. Add a bat like Peralta and I could be down with that. I would probably prefer Acuna, Ender, Freeman, Donaldson, FA OF, Albies, Catcher , Swanson/Camargo.

    7. I still would love a deal that involves Starling Marte into our OF. He is a great combo of speed, enough power and defense. Pitt has been quiet. Max Kepler and Eddie Rosario are guys we could be talking about....but not worth much with Kepler, paying for the potential.

    8. Would a deal of Robbie Ray and Souza be of interest? Souza seems a lot like Duval...

  13. #643
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    Assume the roster stays as is, who hits clean up? Albies? If he figures out how to hit for an entire year like his first half I would be ok with that. If not, Duvall? McCann? Camargo?

    Acuna
    Donaldson
    Freeman
    Albies
    Camargo/Duvall
    McCann/Flowers
    Inciarte
    Swanson


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    2018 Vikings Draft :
    Round 1: Mike Hughes CB UCF
    Round 2: Brian O'Neill OT Pittsburgh
    Round 4: Jalyn Holmes DE Ohio State
    Round 5: Tyler Conklin TE Central Michigan
    Round 5: Daniel Carlson K Auburn
    Round 6: Colby Gossett G Appalachian State
    Round 6: Ade Aruna DE Tulane
    Round 7: Devante Downs LB California


  14. #644
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    I read an article from Gabe Burns that the Braves were turned down when trying to acquire Haniger and Peralta, so AA might need to think out of the box, VTgriff mention someone that will be great because will allow us to move Acuña into the middle of the order, but the Pirates traded for Archer last deadline so i don't know if they want to trade from the major league club, I think they will try to compete, even though they shouldn't.

    McCutchen and Markakis are uninspiring and Brantley might be out of our price range, so if Peralta and Haniger are off the table, the options are dwindling.

  15. #645
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    I like what AA said and agree with him about those guys hitting 1-2-3. They are easy our best hitters and should be getting more ABs in a game than the rest and doing that type of lineup helps.

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