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  1. #7531
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    [QUOTE=MRSpock;33963424]
    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    https://finance.yahoo.com/chart/VOO/...4iOm51bGx9XX0-

    There it's is. I can't find the more interactive graph....

    I see the s&p as a long term asset. Just like most people look at a house. And my asset will be worth more. Based and annual average in the long term. There's no getting around that.
    Except this doesn't take into account rent $ accrued over time, or rent $ spent over time either.

    As I already showed if you make enough in rent then invest in something like this you can end up with a larger investment over time than simply investing the down payment initially. You also would have said house that has been gaining value on top.

  2. #7532
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    Can I not get a 2 room apartment and rent out a room? Or a 3 room?

    You are just not getting this on a fundamental level.

    And you're not including expenses. The fact you need a larger cash fund with a house in case of untimely necessary repairs. Upgrades that need to be bought. Simple equipment for maintaining the house.

    If you rent an apartment none of these expenses are applicable to you.

  3. #7533
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    So you take that difference in cost from renting and house ownership and you invest it...you will still invest more than when owning a house especially early on.

    And your initial investment will be making more than if you purchased a house.
    Last edited by MRSpock; 05-26-2021 at 06:22 PM.

  4. #7534
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRSpock View Post
    Can I not get a 2 room apartment and rent out a room? Or a 3 room?

    You are just not getting this on a fundamental level.

    And you're not including expenses. The fact you need a larger cash fund with a house in case of untimely necessary repairs. Upgrades that need to be bought. Simple equipment for maintaining the house.

    If you rent an apartment none of these expenses are applicable to you.
    Normally the cost of rent is dependent on the number of rooms it has when you are renting somewhere. You could buy a condo and do this though sure but that would be buying property and often times you may have less rooms to rent out.

    You can make up those expenses in rent made, again this will always be dependent on the situations. I noted an example where all you need is $700 extra from renting to clearly outproduce. If you rent out two rooms at 900/month and use that is far more than the extra $700 you need to invest and can use it when the time comes for said expense. There are so many different ways this could play out you are just so focused on sticking with your initial point.

    If you rent you also often do not get to make the same income off your apartment etc. as noted we have been through this plenty. The issue is you clearly are set in your ways and are the one not understanding the fundamentals here. At one point you literally said a house isn't an investment and called it ****, you are just so far off base in this conversation lol. I am simply noting there are many ways to invest and make $ that can work great for people.

  5. #7535
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    I think you're dug into more emotional arguments while I'm more focused on the numbers.

    I'm the one set in my ways? What you're saying is the common Misconception. If anyone is set in their ways its you lol. This is the common thought process of most Middle class people in the USA. "Buy a house".

    Yes there is the way you invest and get a small return and the way you invest to get a much larger return.

    And I was getting to the point that you should only buy a house if you want a house. Not because it's some great investment.

  6. #7536
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRSpock View Post
    So you take that difference in cost from renting and house ownership and you invest it...you will still invest more than when owning a house especially early on.

    And your initial investment will be making more than if you purchased a house.
    https://www.rentcafe.com/average-ren...us/mn/st-paul/
    In st paul the average rent is $1317. Only 1% for less than $700. Only 23 percent are in the 700-1000 range.

    https://www.zillow.com/saint-paul-mn/home-values/
    The average housing cost is $263,563 in St Paul via comparison. If you account for insurance and taxes and just use the average for each option and do 20% down then the down payment would be basically 53k initially (plus closing costs so lets say 55.5k). Your monthly mortgage+insurance+taxes is likely to come out around $1130 per month though which is actually saving almost $200 per month from the average rent cost.

    As I noted depending on the areas etc. this type of stuff will change. If you have a lower down payment or go for a cheaper house it would change as would cheaper rent.

  7. #7537
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRSpock View Post
    I think you're dug into more emotional arguments while I'm more focused on the numbers.

    I'm the one set in my ways? What you're saying is the common Misconception. If anyone is set in their ways its you lol. This is the common thought process of most Middle class people in the USA. "Buy a house".

    Yes there is the way you invest and get a small return and the way you invest to get a much larger return.

    And I was getting to the point that you should only buy a house if you want a house. Not because it's some great investment.
    Lol you haven't been sharing any actual numbers that is what I have been doing. I have used many links to back up what I am saying while you haven't brought anything really other than the same talking points repeatedly.

    I am not saying everyone needs to buy a house, I am noting it easily can be a good investment for some though. You are the one trying to call it **** and not investment etc. without any real reasoning behind it.

  8. #7538
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    Lol you haven't been sharing any actual numbers that is what I have been doing. I have used many links to back up what I am saying while you haven't brought anything really other than the same talking points repeatedly.

    I am not saying everyone needs to buy a house, I am noting it easily can be a good investment for some though. You are the one trying to call it **** and not investment etc. without any real reasoning behind it.
    Meh if you want I can later.

  9. #7539
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRSpock View Post
    Meh if you want I can later.
    Feel free but up to this point there hasn't been and you seemingly are missing obvious points/not fully aware of the data out there like costs in areas.

  10. #7540
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    Lol you haven't been sharing any actual numbers that is what I have been doing. I have used many links to back up what I am saying while you haven't brought anything really other than the same talking points repeatedly.

    I am not saying everyone needs to buy a house, I am noting it easily can be a good investment for some though. You are the one trying to call it **** and not investment etc. without any real reasoning behind it.
    I'm closing on my current house at the end June. Once I sign those papers I will have made over $220k on a home I built six years ago. That will be almost a 30% return.
    GJO- You will never be forgotten. "MORE THAN MINFINITY"!

  11. #7541
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncsinmo View Post
    I'm closing on my current house at the end June. Once I sign those papers I will have made over $220k on a home I built six years ago. That will be almost a 30% return.
    Ya I mean the idea they are **** or not investments just doesn't make sense. There can be better options for sure especially looking back and finding the best stocks or whatever I would never deny that but they can be great investment for people either way. I also noted to him many people use their property to rent and receive additional income that way via their investment as well and markets dictate the cost of rent, it isn't a one size fits all.

    As I noted I think the best option generally is to include both stocks and real estate in your portfolio. It always depends on each persons situation/context. It certainly can be a good investment for many though depending on what they are lookin for.

  12. #7542
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngopher35 View Post
    Ya I mean the idea they are **** or not investments just doesn't make sense. There can be better options for sure especially looking back and finding the best stocks or whatever I would never deny that but they can be great investment for people either way. I also noted to him many people use their property to rent and receive additional income that way via their investment as well and markets dictate the cost of rent, it isn't a one size fits all.

    As I noted I think the best option generally is to include both stocks and real estate in your portfolio. It always depends on each persons situation/context. It certainly can be a good investment for many though depending on what they are lookin for.
    Absolutely. They say a one way investor is a one way fool. However, anyone that stomps their feet and claims that real estate is not a good investment is equally foolish.

  13. #7543
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncsinmo View Post
    Absolutely. They say a one way investor is a one way fool. However, anyone that stomps their feet and claims that real estate is not a good investment is equally foolish.
    Real estate can be.

    30% over these last 6 years is ****.

  14. #7544
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    Please stop misusing diversify lol.

  15. #7545
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRSpock View Post
    Real estate can be.

    30% over these last 6 years is ****.
    No. It's not. I'm making over $200k for living in a house that I owned dude. All together I've made almost $1m by living in all of the homes that I've owned. You're ****ing nuts man.
    GJO- You will never be forgotten. "MORE THAN MINFINITY"!

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