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  1. #721
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    Quote Originally Posted by flea View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone like you to agree. You probably think Obama was not corrupt even though he weaponized the federal bureaucracy against citizens and journalists, drastically expanded domestic surveillance, started at least 3 more wars of aggression, and bailed out Wall Street with our money while doing nothing to bail out homeowners or anyone else caught holding the bag for the banks.

    I have a feeling you would agree if I only indicted the Bushes and Reagan as corrupt, and maybe you would grudgingly admit the obvious (that Clinton was a total political whore) but you still can't really get past that party line business. Hell I bet if some creep like Kamala Harris wins the Presidency at some point and the student loan bubble pops as a result of financial chicanery (like derivative trading) and she bails out the banks all over again on the taxpayer dime but does nothing for actual citizens you'll still pull the same old 'she was inspiring and maybe could have done more but on the whole was honest and great.'

    You're the perfect voter, piss down your neck and you'll fight to the death to convince everyone it's global warming.
    LOL. Love how you went all the way around the block before you got there.

    We could remove all context and pretend that those administrations did everything they did by kingly decree and you’d still be wrong.

  2. #722
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    Quote Originally Posted by browski234 View Post
    Lol this pathetic defense again. For such a fan of debate you have zero clue how many times that defense has been debunked.

    He’s racist as ****. He demeans Muslims and blacks all the time. Then again, he had to do this once a radio exec told him to flip on what he was saying before and totally expose himself as a fraud for ratings, so maybe you’re right and he’s just good st pretending to be racist.
    Any proof of your nonsense?

  3. #723
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    Quote Originally Posted by WES445 View Post
    Oh, I get what you are saying and it is bs. She isn't preaching taking over Capitalism. The best way to get her message across is to talk to people that are open to her not a hostile crowd who thinks, wrongly, that she wants to abolish capitalism.

    It might hurt your feeling or ego, but she and democrat socialist don't need this guy or the fanboy base that supports him. This conservative base needs to get used to being ignored and marginalized.

    Great opportunity my arse. You just want to see your boy try to rip her up for his fan base pleasure. You are so transparent.
    "Capitalism will not always exist." - Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, seems like she wants and end to it. The Democratic Socialists of America want to replace Capitalism with Socialism. That's what they want.
    Of course I would love to see him tear her to shreds, I haven't said anything to suggest I wouldn't. I just think from her standpoint, she missed an opportunity to reach a larger base to spread her Socialist ideals.

  4. #724
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    So what race do you put people in? I don’t think Arabic is a race?
    Is Muslim a race? How about Hindu? Christian?

  5. #725
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    Quote Originally Posted by nessythegreat View Post
    "Capitalism will not always exist." - Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, seems like she wants and end to it. The Democratic Socialists of America want to replace Capitalism with Socialism. That's what they want.
    Of course I would love to see him tear her to shreds, I haven't said anything to suggest I wouldn't. I just think from her standpoint, she missed an opportunity to reach a larger base to spread her Socialist ideals.
    No, trust me, she isn't missing an opportunity. She will win her little section of America, go to Congress and be among another two hundred plus voices. She isn't a threat to Capitalism.Lately, capitalism has been the problem and how it seems like it isn't working for a large majority of americans. Conservatives should be more worry about that, since a happy workforce don't dwell on crazy things like socialism.

  6. #726
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    Quote Originally Posted by nessythegreat View Post
    "Capitalism will not always exist." - Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, seems like she wants and end to it. The Democratic Socialists of America want to replace Capitalism with Socialism. That's what they want.
    Of course that’s what they want (all 42,000 of them).

    The people you really need to worry about are those like me — if I had to use a label, I’d say “progressives” — who want to implement more socialist programs while retaining some modicum of regulated capitalism.
    Last edited by Crovash; 08-26-2018 at 11:19 AM.

  7. #727
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    Quote Originally Posted by flea View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone like you to agree. You probably think Obama was not corrupt even though he weaponized the federal bureaucracy against citizens and journalists, drastically expanded domestic surveillance, started at least 3 more wars of aggression, and bailed out Wall Street with our money while doing nothing to bail out homeowners or anyone else caught holding the bag for the banks.

    I have a feeling you would agree if I only indicted the Bushes and Reagan as corrupt, and maybe you would grudgingly admit the obvious (that Clinton was a total political whore) but you still can't really get past that party line business. Hell I bet if some creep like Kamala Harris wins the Presidency at some point and the student loan bubble pops as a result of financial chicanery (like derivative trading) and she bails out the banks all over again on the taxpayer dime but does nothing for actual citizens you'll still pull the same old 'she was inspiring and maybe could have done more but on the whole was honest and great.'

    You're the perfect voter, piss down your neck and you'll fight to the death to convince everyone it's global warming.
    You assume a lot of things about me that aren't true.

    I would never suggest Obama wasn't corrupt. I think it's a big reason why Candidate Obama and President Obama were two very different people. I'm no Obama fanboy, pal. A lot of the things you're pointing to as evidence of his corruption are just tried and true neoliberal policy. Policy wants that the moderate ruling part (see: Dems and Republicans that have long held power) love.

    But Donald Trump can't even release his tax returns. He's had multiple people in his inner circle go down. His charity is probably next. He has a long history of ******/corrupt business practices. He's like a mob boss. He's ****ing Donald Trump. There's corrupt and then there's Donald Trump. He's playing corruption chess when everyone else is playing checkers. We're talking about a guy who created a fake university to swindle voters. This is a deeply greedy man who is only operating to serve the interests of the mega-wealthy and special interests. And hell, himself too. The guy hardly has truly "devested". He was making a KILLING at Mar-A-Lago.


    Everyone can be ****** and corrupt and Trump can still be more-so than the rest at the same time.
    Last edited by ManRam; 08-26-2018 at 12:43 PM.
    HELLO

  8. #728
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    Quote Originally Posted by nessythegreat View Post
    The Democratic Socialists of America want to replace Capitalism with Socialism. That's what they want.
    No ****. It's in their name. Thanks for the lesson!
    HELLO

  9. #729
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    Quote Originally Posted by WES445 View Post
    No, trust me, she isn't missing an opportunity. She will win her little section of America, go to Congress and be among another two hundred plus voices. She isn't a threat to Capitalism.Lately, capitalism has been the problem and how it seems like it isn't working for a large majority of americans. Conservatives should be more worry about that, since a happy workforce don't dwell on crazy things like socialism.
    Way to be proven wrong and not even address the point. Its pretty pointless to talk to you.

  10. #730
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    Of course that’s what they want (all 42,000 of them).

    The people you really need to worry about are those like me — if I had to use a label, I’d say “progressives” — who want to implement more socialist programs while retaining some modicum of regulated capitalism.
    Ya, usually movements start pretty small.

  11. #731
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManRam View Post
    No ****. It's in their name. Thanks for the lesson!
    Then tell your buddies to stop lying about it.

  12. #732
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    Quote Originally Posted by nessythegreat View Post
    Then tell your buddies to stop lying about it.
    ManRam, should we stop lying about it, now?

  13. #733
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    Quote Originally Posted by nessythegreat View Post
    Then tell your buddies to stop lying about it.
    WTF are you on to now?

  14. #734
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    Quote Originally Posted by nessythegreat View Post
    Then tell your buddies to stop lying about it.
    Who's lying about what?

    The simple definition of Democratic Socialism: a political philosophy that advocates achieving socialist goals within a democratic system, in contrast to what it perceives as undemocratic socialist ideologies such as Marxist–Leninist, which is non-democratic in practice.

    Taken right from Wikipedia. It's straightforward stuff.

    EDIT: I am just now reading Wes' post.

    The key with Democratic Socialism is that the "revolution" comes via elections and democracy...not violent authoritative means. So, in this country, that's going to come via slow progress and gradual winnings at that ballot box. It will come by slowly eroding the aspects of Capitalism that are most damaging and slowly replacing them with socialist policy that helps redistribute wealth and return power to the workers. A Democratic Socialist Utopia isn't going to be achieved rapidly so you're going to have a lot of talk about how to fix things first as opposed to the revolutionary angle.

    But don't get it twisted...if you are a DSA member you should want socialism instead of capitalism. Again, right now it's a large umbrella with a lot of different voices and a lot newcomers trying to find their fit under said umbrella, but in the end, it's right in the name. Socialism > Capitalism.
    Last edited by ManRam; 08-26-2018 at 03:09 PM.
    HELLO

  15. #735
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManRam View Post
    You assume a lot of things about me that aren't true.

    I would never suggest Obama wasn't corrupt. I think it's a big reason why Candidate Obama and President Obama were two very different people. I'm no Obama fanboy, pal. A lot of the things you're pointing to as evidence of his corruption are just tried and true neoliberal policy. Policy wants that the moderate ruling part (see: Dems and Republicans that have long held power) love.

    But Donald Trump can't even release his tax returns. He's had multiple people in his inner circle go down. His charity is probably next. He has a long history of ******/corrupt business practices. He's like a mob boss. He's ****ing Donald Trump. There's corrupt and then there's Donald Trump. He's playing corruption chess when everyone else is playing checkers. We're talking about a guy who created a fake university to swindle voters. This is a deeply greedy man who is only operating to serve the interests of the mega-wealthy and special interests. And hell, himself too. The guy hardly has truly "devested". He was making a KILLING at Mar-A-Lago.


    Everyone can be ****** and corrupt and Trump can still be more-so than the rest at the same time.
    He's Donald Trump, he's a pretty well-known commodity. I think overstating your case like calling him a 'mob boss' only hurts credibility. I think when you say 'corrupt' you just mean you disagree with deregulation at the federal level and think everyone should assume (as you do) that one could only believe that if they were nefarious.

    Dude was already a billionaire so it's not like Hillary Clinton's cattle futures, the fiasco with China buying Bill Clinton (funny how there was no foreign meddling special prosecutor in 1996 even though we know it was much worse than what anyone has been able to say Trump did with Russia, which so far is basically nothing). He's also not parlayed his Presidency from debt to extreme wealth, and he doesn't have any bestseller books about his father he met once.

    He is what he is - real estate shameless self promoter with a ego the size of browski's outrage gland. I don't doubt he's done shady stuff in real estate but he's probably what we deserve because it's hard to criticize his failings as a man (and there are plenty) when we're trumpeting John McCain, Barack Obama, and Hillary/Bill.

    I'm actually glad for this wonderful contrast - propping up the Clintons while chiding Trump as a serial woman abuser is an eye opener for average idiots who believe what the actors paid to read the news on TV say. Bill was 'credibly accused' (leftist media term for persecution of their enemies) by a ton of women for things as bad as rape and we're supposed to care what some oaf like Trump said to a buddy on a TV one time a while ago. No wonder people trust the media even less than Congress at this point.

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