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  1. #2836
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    Those people are not informed in the very least. This is an example of whatís wrong with our society.
    You seem to be the one not informed here..

  2. #2837
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    It is petty, but I think it's important that a politician trying to communicate an issue to their constituents needs to be totaly clear. Her error actually seems to have made some New Yorkers believe the city wrote a $3B check to Amazon.
    That's fair. unfortunately i think they speak as sale people more then educators. I have certainly seen more manipulative uses of language. I do think she knows the difference and don't see her word choice as a big deal or really telling
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
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  3. #2838
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    It depends who actually runs against him. I see politics as sport so I enjoy how much trump irritates the left but if there was a worthy candidate that more represents my views and if those views outweigh trumps accomplishments so far. I voted for Gary Johnson in 2016. If thereís a legit 2020 libertarian candidate, I might vote for them. Of the current dems running, none would get my vote.
    Isnít this precisely my point? Who?

    If you are going to bash Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (real easy to do while sitting in the proverbial armchair) it seems that you should have enough interest to know what libertarians you might support. Otherwise, you have litlle, if any, credibility.

  4. #2839
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    Quote Originally Posted by flips333 View Post
    wait are you a farmer or an ecologist...? I love to know what people do.
    Moved it to other dedicated thread
    Last edited by benny01; 04-01-2019 at 12:58 PM.

  5. #2840
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    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    Yes, she did not want to give in to the tax breaks. If 50 companies come to NY and generate that much revenue they would be paying much higher taxes. If Amazon doesn't open a hq there there are still plenty of jobs there. I'm not seeing what she did as necessarily bad. Trump defunding the federal end of the California high speed rail is definitely much more economically devastating than this Amazon hq deal.
    50 companies are not offering to come to NY and create those types of jobs and revenue. And while overall the unemployment rate is good, it can always be better.

    Trumps job is different from AOCs. Iím not sure of the particulars of the rail deal but Iím assuming those werenít specific jobs but potential jobs. Either way, trumps job is not primarily about California or any one state

  6. #2841
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    I'm generally against municipalities giving money to corporations, but from everything I've read the city was going to get far more in return than the $3B break they were giving. Over $1B a year in taxes, tens of thousands of jobs, Amazon sponsored tech education programs for New Yorkers, and more. The big problem New Yorkers I know had with it was that it would "change the city" and I get that. But to argue that it was a money loser for the city is really really wrong.
    Well the money aspect is something you are taking at face value. Let's just say that the amount of benefits a city gets in exchange for giving companies massive tax breaks for moving there is generally far less than what is listed in the proposal.

    The chances the city was going to get all the benefits described in the press packet is near zero.

  7. #2842
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    Isnít this precisely my point? Who?

    If you are going to bash Ms. Ocasio-Cortez (real easy to do while sitting in the proverbial armchair) it seems that you should have enough interest to know what libertarians you might support. Otherwise, you have litlle, if any, credibility.
    AOC currently has a position in Congress. There are no libertarians currently holding a similar position. There are people like Rand Paul but I thought he was thoroughly beaten in the 2016 debates by almost everyone. I judge people individually for the most part, not by their party affiliation.

    Also, this is an AOC thread so obviously if I have an opinion on her, even if itís unfavorable, Iím going to share it. Can you support her positions or just attack my political followings?

  8. #2843
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    AOC currently has a position in Congress. There are no libertarians currently holding a similar position. There are people like Rand Paul but I thought he was thoroughly beaten in the 2016 debates by almost everyone. I judge people individually for the most part, not by their party affiliation.

    Also, this is an AOC thread so obviously if I have an opinion on her, even if itís unfavorable, Iím going to share it. Can you support her positions or just attack my political followings?
    You can certainly have an opinion on Ms. Ocasio-Cortez, and from what you have written, your opinion is based on her positions ó many of which, by the way, I have supported on this thread (and some of which I have questioned as well).

    My request to you, however, was not an attack on your followings. My request was to ascertain whether you had someone in mind if you were not going to support Trump.

    Check me if Iím wrong, but you have indicated that you have no one in mind, but that you might support a libertarian (should one come along, I guess).

    Just seems kind of hollow to me, but, then again, it makes complete sense if you see politics as like sports (and I think you may well be in the majority with that opinion). And sports, as we know, is entertainment.
    Last edited by Crovash; 04-01-2019 at 01:41 PM.

  9. #2844
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Well the money aspect is something you are taking at face value. Let's just say that the amount of benefits a city gets in exchange for giving companies massive tax breaks for moving there is generally far less than what is listed in the proposal.

    The chances the city was going to get all the benefits described in the press packet is near zero.
    Sure, but the $3B is around 1/10 of the likely optimistic projection, and the chances of it being a money loser for the city were essentially zero. I think the biggest issue was the cultural change that was certain to happen and that the majority of locals definitely did not want.

  10. #2845
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    50 companies are not offering to come to NY and create those types of jobs and revenue. And while overall the unemployment rate is good, it can always be better.

    Trumps job is different from AOCs. Iím not sure of the particulars of the rail deal but Iím assuming those werenít specific jobs but potential jobs. Either way, trumps job is not primarily about California or any one state
    50 companies would love to go there and offer jobs and revenue, wether they can get in and fit in is a diff story.

    It doesn't matter if trumps job is about any one state, or if it were about potential jobs, there is a chance for legitimate rapid development for a 1 million+ populated area and he's adding obstacles. That's what matters. Those type of mathematic don't translate to Brooklyn. If AOC nixed this deal as a representative of Detroit then I would probably side with you more.

  11. #2846
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    By all estimates, Amazon would have created thousands of jobs for the area with the averages salary of $150k and generated 27 billion dollars in tax revenue over 10 years. Amazon only wanted to pay 24 billion in taxes. The city lost out. To your earlier point about how NYC doesnít need the money, in her district that it does and thatís her main responsibility, her district.

    FYI, instead of NYC, Amazon went to crystal city, VA which is directly next to the most affluent county in the entire country, Loudoun county. So the rich get richer thanks to AOC and friends.
    Amazon was always coming to Crystal City. In fact based on the overall subsidies that were to be handed out amongst the two areas, one would gather that Crystal City was like 1a, with NYC, being 2b.


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  12. #2847
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    You can certainly have an opinion on Ms. Ocasio-Cortez, and from what you have written, your opinion is based on her positions ó many of which, by the way, I have supported on this thread (and some of which I have questioned as well).

    My request to you, however, was not an attack on your followings. My request was to ascertain whether you had someone in mind if you were not going to support Trump.

    Check me if Iím wrong, but you have indicated that you have no one in mind, but that you might support a libertarian (should one come along, I guess).

    Just seems kind of hollow to me, but, then again, it makes complete sense if you see politics as like sports (and I think you may well be in the majority with that opinion). And sports, as we know, is entertainment.
    Yes, Iím very entertained by the current political arena and furthermore how itís covered by the media. With the analogy that itís like a sport. I donít need to have a favorite team to dislike a school or franchise. For instance, Iíve always disliked Duke basketball. However, I donít really support a basketball team.

    Trumps accomplishments are decent so far. If he runs on his actual accomplishments and not some hyperbole than I may consider him for reelection.

  13. #2848
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeyc77 View Post
    Yes, Iím very entertained by the current political arena and furthermore how itís covered by the media. With the analogy that itís like a sport. I donít need to have a favorite team to dislike a school or franchise. For instance, Iíve always disliked Duke basketball. However, I donít really support a basketball team.

    Trumps accomplishments are decent so far. If he runs on his actual accomplishments and not some hyperbole than I may consider him for reelection.
    What's his accomplishments?

  14. #2849
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeW-Star View Post
    Amazon was always coming to Crystal City. In fact based on the overall subsidies that were to be handed out amongst the two areas, one would gather that Crystal City was like 1a, with NYC, being 2b.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
    My dick is named 'Ewing'.

  15. #2850
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    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    50 companies would love to go there and offer jobs and revenue, wether they can get in and fit in is a diff story.

    It doesn't matter if trumps job is about any one state, or if it were about potential jobs, there is a chance for legitimate rapid development for a 1 million+ populated area and he's adding obstacles. That's what matters. Those type of mathematic don't translate to Brooklyn. If AOC nixed this deal as a representative of Detroit then I would probably side with you more.
    Trumps job matters in comparison to AOC whose main purpose is to serve her constituents. And in this case, I fail to see the negatives.

    Which 50 companies are you talking about? Again this is a headquarters, not a packaging plant or whatever. Which companies are going to produce those types of jobs and tax revenue?

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