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  1. #1546
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Trump is indeed terrible in terms of being a President or a leader. Literally every book and near every former cabinet or member of his White House has come out and says he possesses all the negative traits you don't want to see in a leader. He doesn't know what he's talking about and doesn't read up on any issues he's tasked with dealing with, he's impetuous and makes split decisions without consulting anyone or thinking about the repercussions, he does not work hard and is hardly at work. In the Army we have a phrase called toxic leader and he exhibits nearly all of the things that make a toxic leader toxic.

    As a boss or a person who is tasked with leading, he is garbage.
    Trump has a poor cast, as Chris Christie put it: 'They are “amateurs, grifters, weaklings, convicted and unconvicted felons” who “were hustled into jobs they were never suited for, sometimes seemingly without so much as a background check via Google or Wikipedia.'

    The only likable picks were Mathis and Haley.
    Last edited by kevin13697; 01-23-2019 at 06:13 PM.

  2. #1547
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Trump is indeed terrible in terms of being a President or a leader. Literally every book and near every former cabinet or member of his White House has come out and says he possesses all the negative traits you don't want to see in a leader. He doesn't know what he's talking about and doesn't read up on any issues he's tasked with dealing with, he's impetuous and makes split decisions without consulting anyone or thinking about the repercussions, he does not work hard and is hardly at work. In the Army we have a phrase called toxic leader and he exhibits nearly all of the things that make a toxic leader toxic.

    As a boss or a person who is tasked with leading, he is garbage.
    As a person, he’s garbage. They are only equatable in that they both use Twitter.

  3. #1548
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevin13697 View Post
    Trump has a poor cast that was thrown together, as Chris Christie put it: They are “amateurs, grifters, weaklings, convicted and unconvicted felons” who “were hustled into jobs they were never suited for, sometimes seemingly without so much as a background check via Google or Wikipedia.
    The cast was thrown together by Trump, so that is another negative mark against his leadership qualities. All the dysfunction we are seeing in the White House is nothing new, most people who have worked with Trump have said he thrives on dysfunction and chaos, he plays his staff against each other, and his only vetting criteria is loyalty.

    The only single positive leadership trait anyone can ever muster up to defend Trump with is "he gets things done" which is not really all that true and more importantly, not a trait that is indicative of only good leaders. Plenty of bad leaders get stuff done. Nobody can actually name a positive leadership trait he possesses, and that's because he possesses none.

  4. #1549
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    The cast was thrown together by Trump, so that is another negative mark against his leadership qualities. All the dysfunction we are seeing in the White House is nothing new, most people who have worked with Trump have said he thrives on dysfunction and chaos, he plays his staff against each other, and his only vetting criteria is loyalty.

    The only single positive leadership trait anyone can ever muster up to defend Trump with is "he gets things done" which is not really all that true and more importantly, not a trait that is indicative of only good leaders. Plenty of bad leaders get stuff done. Nobody can actually name a positive leadership trait he possesses, and that's because he possesses none.
    Trump was pushed into this Presidency by his kids who brought a lot of those names in.

    I don't believe he's a genius by any means but he relates to people. He understand American culture better than Obama IMO.
    Last edited by kevin13697; 01-23-2019 at 06:19 PM.

  5. #1550
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevin13697 View Post
    Trump is not terrible & America isn't as divided on the issues as the mainstream media makes them out to be.
    America is definitely divided, but not in the way the media portray it.

    While there are clear cultural differences between the many on the right and left, the real divide is not primarily political: it is economic (which obviously then has a huge impact on the political).

    Despite what they claim to stand for, most mainstream Democrats are not much more interested in serving the true needs of the broad spectrum of the American public than are the mainstream Republicans.

    In a weird way, the Trump followers and the Sanders followers should be on the same page on this account, fighting the corporate annexation of Amercan democracy.

  6. #1551
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    America is definitely divided, but not in the way the media portray it.

    While there are clear cultural differences between the many on the right and left, the real divide is not primarily political: it is economic (which obviously then has a huge impact on the political).

    Despite what they claim to stand for, most mainstream Democrats are not much more interested in serving the true needs of the broad spectrum of the American public than are the mainstream Republicans.

    In a weird way, the Trump followers and the Sanders followers should be on the same page on this account, fighting the corporate annexation of Amercan democracy.
    Liberal intolerance has a become a big problem socially, Kevin Hart can't even host the Oscars, It's ridiculous. In the same way, so has conservative intolerance regarding economics, taxation is theft BS.

    Nationalism brings us together. For example, my dad had never even had a conversation with a black man before Vietnam.

    I've known a black Marine who became best friends with a white nationalist who was with him in the service, when they returned home, he went with him to remove his racist tattoos.
    Last edited by kevin13697; 01-23-2019 at 06:29 PM.

  7. #1552
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevin13697 View Post
    Trump was pushed into this Presidency by his kids who brought a lot of those names in.

    I don't believe he's a genius by any means but he relates to people. He understand American culture better than Obama IMO.
    The explanation regarding the circumstances of his running and winning the Presidency still doesn't excuse his terribleness as a leader.

    I don't know that he understand American culture better than Obama, he may, though he seems to only be understanding and catering to an extreme base while the rest of the country looks on at what a terrible leader he is.

    The problem with the idea that Trump could unite us is the opinions he has that differ from extreme conservatism are the issues he cares least about. His Presidency has been the most conservative one we've seen since Reagan, possibly more so. Because while he may have said one time he thought highest margin tax rates should be 44% he cared so little he caved at the first argument against it, contrast this to his determination on the wall.

    Trump understands how to manipulate the media and people. He has used this to great effect. But he is a terrible leader, and that is evidence by how many people say so and by how many self created blunders he stumbles through.

  8. #1553
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    America is definitely divided, but not in the way the media portray it.

    While there are clear cultural differences between the many on the right and left, the real divide is not primarily political: it is economic (which obviously then has a huge impact on the political).

    Despite what they claim to stand for, most mainstream Democrats are not much more interested in serving the true needs of the broad spectrum of the American public than are the mainstream Republicans.

    In a weird way, the Trump followers and the Sanders followers should be on the same page on this account, fighting the corporate annexation of American democracy.
    I keep hearing this, but what has Trump actually done to give any indication he's on the same side as Sanders when it comes to fighting corporate annexation of American Democracy?

    He passed a giant tax break for the wealthy and corporations, he has appointed a litany of corporate CEOs into his cabinet, he is currently not paying 800,000 US workers. He has instituted so many tariffs that have hurt American workers that he had to pass aid packages to keep Farmers from revolting against him (though I understand the pay now benefit later argument for his tariffs).

    When it comes to what he's actually done to make anyone think he's for the little guy economically, it's almost zilch. I agree, he talks a big game, but he has done almost nothing to back it up.

    Though it's partially our own fault for thinking a Billionaire who inherited his wealth would somehow be the savior of the middle class.
    Last edited by valade16; 01-23-2019 at 06:37 PM.

  9. #1554
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    The explanation regarding the circumstances of his running and winning the Presidency still doesn't excuse his terribleness as a leader.

    I don't know that he understand American culture better than Obama, he may, though he seems to only be understanding and catering to an extreme base while the rest of the country looks on at what a terrible leader he is.

    The problem with the idea that Trump could unite us is the opinions he has that differ from extreme conservatism are the issues he cares least about. His Presidency has been the most conservative one we've seen since Reagan, possibly more so. Because while he may have said one time he thought highest margin tax rates should be 44% he cared so little he caved at the first argument against it, contrast this to his determination on the wall.

    Trump understands how to manipulate the media and people. He has used this to great effect. But he is a terrible leader, and that is evidence by how many people say so and by how many self created blunders he stumbles through.
    We've never seen Trump rule without a Republican Congress.

    You could work with him or force an impeachment, but beware right wing populism will become more aggressive.

  10. #1555
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    America is definitely divided, but not in the way the media portray it.

    While there are clear cultural differences between the many on the right and left, the real divide is not primarily political: it is economic (which obviously then has a huge impact on the political).

    Despite what they claim to stand for, most mainstream Democrats are not much more interested in serving the true needs of the broad spectrum of the American public than are the mainstream Republicans.

    In a weird way, the Trump followers and the Sanders followers should be on the same page on this account, fighting the corporate annexation of Amercan democracy.
    Yep. Spot on

  11. #1556
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    I keep hearing this, but what has Trump actually done to give any indication he's on the same side as Sanders when it comes to fighting corporate annexation of American Democracy?

    He passed a giant tax break for the wealthy and corporations, he has appointed a litany of corporate CEOs into his cabinet, he is currently not paying 800,000 US workers. He has instituted so many tariffs that have hurt American workers that he had to pass aid packages to keep Farmers from revolting against him (though I understand the pay now benefit later argument for his tariffs).

    When it comes to what he's actually done to make anyone think he's for the little guy economically, it's almost zilch. I agree, he talks a big game, but he has done almost nothing to back it up.
    He hasn’t done a thing, but he ran as all things to all people. The only issue he ran on with any conviction was his wall, he vaguely both sided everything else.

  12. #1557
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevin13697 View Post
    We've never seen Trump rule without a Republican Congress.

    You could work with him or force an impeachment, but beware right wing populism will become more aggressive.
    We're getting a good taste of it now, the Government is shutdown. The idea that Trump is somehow willing to become a moderate and work with Democrats seems naive to me. A big part of his popularity to his base is his vilification of Liberals and Democrats.

    More to the point, on what issue do we see compromise on? Trump has thus far signaled there will be zero cooperation on the wall or the environment. Maybe we could compromise on infrastructure, but that's about it.

  13. #1558
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    So Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez spoke at the women's march DESPITE the fact that the DNC no longer openly supports the Womens march.
    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/4...t-womens-march

    When asked she deflected saying
    Ocasio-Cortez said Saturday during an interview with CNN, that it was "absolutely valid" to worry about anti-semitism from the Trump administration.

    "I think that concerns of anti-Semitism with the current administration in the White House are absolutely valid and we need to make sure that we are protecting the Jewish community and all those that feel vulnerable in this moment," she said.
    Which is a little weird she's worried about antisemitism from the current administration, since of all possible bigotry labels levied at the Trump admin, they've been pretty consistently pro-Jewish and pro-Israel.

  14. #1559
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciaban2.0 View Post
    So Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez spoke at the women's march DESPITE the fact that the DNC no longer openly supports the Womens march.
    https://thehill.com/homenews/house/4...t-womens-march

    When asked she deflected saying


    Which is a little weird she's worried about antisemitism from the current administration, since of all possible bigotry labels levied at the Trump admin, they've been pretty consistently pro-Jewish and pro-Israel.
    They’ve also been pretty consistently pro-white nationalist. You seem to believe that the women’s march is an anti-Semitic movement.

  15. #1560
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    Quote Originally Posted by benny01 View Post
    They’ve also been pretty consistently pro-white nationalist. You seem to believe that the women’s march is an anti-Semitic movement.
    I don't know about Pro-White Nationalist, what policies have they pushed that are pro-white nationalist? I mean they've been pretty non-interventionist, which I know a lot of White-Nationalists like, but so do a lot of progressives. They've been VERY pro-Israel, though that's not something White Nationalists care about. In fact, I can't remember a MORE pro-Israel administration. If you look at the actual policies they've put forth the things they've done:
    Constantly blocking the (corrupt) UN from sanctioning Israel, selling weapons to Israel, recognizing Jerusalem as the Capital instead of Telaviv. I don't see how a admin can be so consistently pro Israel and simultaneously antisemitic and hating the jews.

    I don't believe the MOVEMENT is antisemitic, but the leadership seems to be very antisemitic and they seem to deal in conspiracy theories about Jews, namely that they control all the wealth, and that they were key participants in the slave trade.

    It's hard to reconcile the purported positive goals of the march with the hateful beliefs of the leadership.
    Last edited by ciaban2.0; 01-23-2019 at 10:32 PM.

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