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  1. #1
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    Liberals don't win - change my mind

    Bill Maher basically summed up how I've been feeling since Trump got elected last night. I'll post the link, but for anyone who doesn't watch it, I'll summarize what he said:

    Conservatives own the presidency, congress, most state legislations, the Supreme Court... while liberals cling to hollow, symbolic victories like getting people fired, social media 'swarming', getting companies to boycott individuals etc. The Tea Party went from nothing to controlling Congress in 10 years, while liberals got TripAdvisor.com to boycott Laura Ingraham's show (his words).

    He also said something that was interesting. "Conservatives govern with no shame; liberals shame without governing."

    Thoughts?

    Link:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GgQI2pT3eg


    The Lost Boys of PSD

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by statquo View Post
    Bill Maher basically summed up how I've been feeling since Trump got elected last night. I'll post the link, but for anyone who doesn't watch it, I'll summarize what he said:

    Conservatives own the presidency, congress, most state legislations, the Supreme Court... while liberals cling to hollow, symbolic victories like getting people fired, social media 'swarming', getting companies to boycott individuals etc. The Tea Party went from nothing to controlling Congress in 10 years, while liberals got TripAdvisor.com to boycott Laura Ingraham's show (his words).

    He also said something that was interesting. "Conservatives govern with no shame; liberals shame without governing."

    Thoughts?

    Link:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GgQI2pT3eg
    Don't agree with Bill's over the top approach very often, but he's right. The Democrats have absolutely zero plan outside of SJWism, and they can't even stay consistent with that.

    On a side note, why do you always want people to change your mind?
    GJO- You will never be forgotten. "MORE THAN MINFINITY"!

  3. #3
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    First, I think conservative and liberal do not necessarily work here, insofar as olitical parties have a life of their own outside of their so-called platforms. I prefer Republican and Democrat — neither of whose destruction, by the way, would I lament.

    REDPUBLICANS: I think the word “own” is appropriate here. They are first and foremost, greedy (which is why they favor the wealthy). Let’s face it, Republicans have no more of a coherent agenda for governing than do the Democrats; they want power — straight and simple. They will do anything to attain (and maintain) power: lie, gerrymander, obstruct. Standard stuff in politics.

    DEADMOCRATS: They are like the liberal Christians. They kind of believe what they say, but when push comes to shove, not really; they do not go for the “muscular” approach at all. Their sign says “All are welcome.” They soft-sell the inclusivity narrative, relying largely on the glorified past (read FDR, JFK) for inspriration while at the same time soaking the rich, old ladies and the Ivy League financiers to fund their institutions. Standard stuff in politics.
    Last edited by Crovash; 06-11-2018 at 07:06 AM.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    First, I think conservative and liberal do not necessarily work here, insofar as olitical parties have a life of their own outside of their so-called platforms. I prefer Republican and Democrat — neither of whose destruction, by the way, would I lament.

    REDPUBLICANS: I think the word “own” is appropriate here. They are first and foremost, greedy (which is why they favor the wealthy). Let’s face it, Republicans have no more of a coherent agenda for governing than do the Democrats; they want power — straight and simple. They will do anything to attain (and maintain) power: lie, gerrymander, obstruct. Standard stuff in politics.

    DEADMOCRATS: They are like the liberal Christians. They kind of believe what they say, but when push comes to shove, not really; they do not go for the “muscular” approach at all. Their sign says “All are welcome.” They soft-sell the inclusivity narrative, relying largely on the glorified past (read FDR, JFK) for inspriration while at the same time soaking the rich, old ladies and the Ivy League financiers to fund their institutions. Standard stuff in politics.
    Most of what you're saying is probably true although I don't agree with the tone.

    Republicans are first and foremost greedy…you say this as if its a bad thing. What you consider "greed" others may consider "advancement." If you made $100K last year is it greedy to want to make $150K this year or is it the desire to move ahead. No matter how wealthy the wealth are, they want to move ahead. Standing still, no matter how high the level you are standing on, means falling behind. Look at economic reports…a business that is 2-3% behind last year goes into panic mode when they are only really a slight amount behind. "Greed, for lack of a better word, is good."

    Your point about Democrats is well taken. They say all this baloney but they don't really mean it. They want the minority vote but they don't really want the minorities. Just vote for me and go away. They pander. Promise everything, get their vote and do little to advance the standing of the minorities.

    Republican/Conservatives are far more realistic, and actually far more honest.They try to provide equal opportunity for everyone and expect everyone to seek out those opportunities. If you fail you are on your own. They believe in the rising tide theory, the trickle down theory.

    Democrats/Liberals are unrealistic and less than honest. The promise equality of outcome full well knowing that this is impossible…no matter what, there will always be failures. They also promote ideas that they full well know are wrong. They are not stupid…They know that open borders are wrong. it is a crime to be here illegally. They know that unbridled welfare is wrong…it keeps people poor in the long run. They don't really care about gay marriage one way or the other. All of their "fairness" and "humanitarian" programs are designed to grab votes.

    In a nutshell…Republicans try to provide equal opportunity and it's up to the individual to make the most of it. he is on his own if he fails.

    Democrats try to provide equality of outcomes, which is an impossibility, and are willing to just pay (with my money) for individual failures.

  5. #5
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    I'm glad someone brought up Bill Maher.

    http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/06/0...resident-trump

    'Bring on the Recession': Bill Maher 'Hoping' for Economic Crash to Oust Trump
    Liberal comedian Bill Maher on Friday said that he hopes the economy crashes in order to "get rid" of President Donald Trump.

    Maher made the remarks on his HBO talk show, "Real Time with Bill Maher."

    "I feel like the bottom has to fall out at some point," he said.

    "By the way, I'm hoping for it because one way you get rid of Trump is a crashing economy. So please, bring on the recession."

    "Sorry if that hurts people but it's either root for a recession or you lose your democracy," Maher added.

    According to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, 223,000 jobs were added last month.

    It also noted that unemployment was at 3.8 percent, the lowest so far this year.

    Pete Hegseth said Saturday on "Fox & Friends that Maher says things that many liberals are thinking but won't say.

    "Who wants to root for people losing their jobs and a bad economy? No one does," he said. "But in the back of their mind they're saying, ‘how do we beat this guy in 2018, especially in 2020? Well, the economy's got to tank.’"
    this is the level of stupidity that has impacted millions of idiots in America, to hope that America fails just to hurt Trump. how can anyone be this ****ing stupid.


    at least an opinion piece from cnn.com agrees.

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/09/opini...lah/index.html

    Bill Maher is wrong to root for a recession
    Bill Maher may have made his cruelest and most ill-informed comment yet -- and that says a lot, given his track record -- on his HBO show Friday night.

    Maher, during a discussion of the economy under Donald Trump, acknowledged that it was "going pretty well." Then Maher, the sometime liberal, shared his hope that the economy would tank to hurt Trump politically: "I feel like the bottom has to fall out at some point. And by the way, I'm hoping for it. I think one (way) you get rid of Trump is a crashing economy."

    He then jaw-droppingly added, "So please, bring on the recession. Sorry if that hurts people, but it's either root for a recession or you lose your democracy."

    This is wrong on so many levels. It's despicable for Maher, who is wealthy enough to have donated $1 million in 2012 to a super PAC, to root for an economic downturn in exchange for political gain.

    If our nation were to hit a recession again, millions of Americans who are not well-off like Maher would horribly suffer, as unemployment would climb and families would struggle to put food on the table.

    I would hope that everyone here would be able to agree that wanting America to have a recession or wanting America to fail is stupid.

    the anti-Trump movement seems to be getting dumber

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sluggo1 View Post
    Most of what you're saying is probably true although I don't agree with the tone.

    Republicans are first and foremost greedy…you say this as if its a bad thing. What you consider "greed" others may consider "advancement." If you made $100K last year is it greedy to want to make $150K this year or is it the desire to move ahead. No matter how wealthy the wealth are, they want to move ahead. Standing still, no matter how high the level you are standing on, means falling behind. Look at economic reports…a business that is 2-3% behind last year goes into panic mode when they are only really a slight amount behind. "Greed, for lack of a better word, is good."

    Your point about Democrats is well taken. They say all this baloney but they don't really mean it. They want the minority vote but they don't really want the minorities. Just vote for me and go away. They pander. Promise everything, get their vote and do little to advance the standing of the minorities.

    Republican/Conservatives are far more realistic, and actually far more honest.They try to provide equal opportunity for everyone and expect everyone to seek out those opportunities. If you fail you are on your own. They believe in the rising tide theory, the trickle down theory.

    Democrats/Liberals are unrealistic and less than honest. The promise equality of outcome full well knowing that this is impossible…no matter what, there will always be failures. They also promote ideas that they full well know are wrong. They are not stupid…They know that open borders are wrong. it is a crime to be here illegally. They know that unbridled welfare is wrong…it keeps people poor in the long run. They don't really care about gay marriage one way or the other. All of their "fairness" and "humanitarian" programs are designed to grab votes.

    In a nutshell…Republicans try to provide equal opportunity and it's up to the individual to make the most of it. he is on his own if he fails.

    Democrats try to provide equality of outcomes, which is an impossibility, and are willing to just pay (with my money) for individual failures.
    Yes, my tone is intentionally cynical — for both sides.

    Greed is greed. It is neither good nor bad, I suppose, but by the same token, it isn’t advancement either — that’s is mere doublespeak.

    Indeed, Republicans are more realistic from the perspecive of one who possesses a Hobbsian worlview; however, Democrats are more realistic is one takes the perspective of, say, Rousseau.

    Don’t kid yourself though — both sides are dishonest, in different ways, maybe, but equally. The Republican narrative about opportunity is as disingenuous as the Democratic promise of equality.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    Yes, my tone is intentionally cynical — for both sides.

    Greed is greed. It is neither good nor bad, I suppose, but by the same token, it isn’t advancement either — that’s is mere doublespeak.

    Indeed, Republicans are more realistic from the perspecive of one who possesses a Hobbsian worlview; however, Democrats are more realistic is one takes the perspective of, say, Rousseau.

    Don’t kid yourself though — both sides are dishonest, in different ways, maybe, but equally. The Republican narrative about opportunity is as disingenuous as the Democratic promise of equality.
    Bolded…completely disagree. I don't think the Republicans pander for votes the way the Democrats do. If the Republicans are pandering to the wealthy, they could have chosen a large group. There just aren't enough wealthy to pander to as a group. The Dems have a seemingly inexhaustible supply to pander to.

    Sorry, I'm not up on Rousseau. Hobbes' thought, to me anyway, tended to go along the lines of human nature. Good or bad, feel what you will but humans are a greedy group. Desirable of more makes them competitive. Competitive leads to innovation and advancement. Always moving forward. Just doing for and giving to holds back advancement in my mind.

    Jump on the train that is moving and not stuck in the station.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sluggo1 View Post
    Bolded…completely disagree. I don't think the Republicans pander for votes the way the Democrats do. If the Republicans are pandering to the wealthy, they could have chosen a large group. There just aren't enough wealthy to pander to as a group. The Dems have a seemingly inexhaustible supply to pander to.

    Sorry, I'm not up on Rousseau. Hobbes' thought, to me anyway, tended to go along the lines of human nature. Good or bad, feel what you will but humans are a greedy group. Desirable of more makes them competitive. Competitive leads to innovation and advancement. Always moving forward. Just doing for and giving to holds back advancement in my mind.

    Jump on the train that is moving and not stuck in the station.
    You are on track with Hobbes. Rousseau tended more towards the cooperative inclination of humans — emphasizing the strength of the communal life.

    The Republicans obviously pander for votes, exploiting their brand of fearmongering and and playing on people’s insecurities, while delivering mostly to the wealthy. The Democrats exploit a different aspect of fear and insecurity, while also delivering mostly to the wealthy.

  9. #9
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    Greed is one of the seven deadly sins.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crovash View Post
    You are on track with Hobbes. Rousseau tended more towards the cooperative inclination of humans — emphasizing the strength of the communal life.

    The Republicans obviously pander for votes, exploiting their brand of fearmongering and and playing on people’s insecurities, while delivering mostly to the wealthy. The Democrats exploit a different aspect of fear and insecurity, while also delivering mostly to the wealthy.
    Bolded…Not sure if I would call that "pandering" or "fear mongering." More like a propensity to allow the natural order of things a way to take its course. But your point is well taken.

    The Democrats definitely pander. They do thinks they know is wrong in the attempt to buy.sway votes.

  11. #11
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    Both sides of the same coin. There is a reason why both parties often have the same donors. Wall street donors are present in every administration regardless of party affiliation.

    there will never be a liberal or socialist president or congress, because the big bucks won't have it. Kind of floating around who run the show, the guys who paid for the party.
    Last edited by WES445; 06-11-2018 at 10:03 PM.

  12. #12
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    http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/sho...4#post32389894

    Bill Maher.

    "By the way, I'm hoping for it because one way you get rid of Trump is a crashing economy. So please, bring on the recession."

    Quote Originally Posted by SpecialFNK View Post
    I would hope that everyone here would be able to agree that wanting America to have a recession or wanting America to fail is stupid.


    the anti-Trump movement seems to be getting dumber

  13. #13
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    Where were you when the republican congress said the same thing about Obama back in 2008, right after the banking crash that year? Wanting to see him fail?
    Last edited by WES445; 06-12-2018 at 09:07 AM.

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  15. #15
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    Bill Maher sucks but I agree with the premise. Democrats lose time after time despite more popular policy. You can point to the ways the deck has been stacked against them (be it gerrymandering, voter suppression, Wyoming getting 2 Senators just like California...etc.) but a lot of that is because, well, they're losers. Republicans are far more ruthless in the way they fight to win and it's not even close.

    Next time Dems have the power they better start playing dirty too. Start being winners, because even if it makes you feel dirty, it's worth it. Stop bringing knifes to this gun fight, mimic your Republican tormentors and get this country where it needs to be.

    Pack the courts with Doogie Howser-like progressive judges.

    Give statehood to DC and PR (both shouldn't be controversial but, again, because Republicans are ruthless competitors it isn't happening).

    Hell, enlarge the Supreme Court, which can be done by an act of Congress, to get around the 5-4 minority that was stolen.

    Pass a new voting rights act which mandates automatic registration, relief from punitive felony voting laws and eliminates the overtly racist voter ID laws. And make election day a holiday already.

    Hell, break up California into multiple states. It's the 6th largest economy in the world. Maybe Republicans counter by breaking up Texas...but let them. It wouldn't be as beneficial.

    Amnesty for millions of undocumented immigrants.

    There's a range there that I'm sure many would and would not be comfortable with, but at the very least, Dems need to start doing SOMETHING.

    And any conservative that wants to cry about such brazen ideas, don't. Republicans are the only major political party in the democratic world that actively seek to make it harder for people to vote. They've been gerrymandering like hell. They're packing the courts themselves. They let PR rot because they are worried about the electoral ramifications of they got statehood. They are "winners" because they stoop.


    The shamelessness is worth it. Republicans get away with it, Democrats can too.
    this my sig

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