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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by castan_b View Post
    1) they need to rebuild around price. Flat out. That isn’t a flaw, that is a fact. They have to rebuild with their roster. Nothing is coming.

    2 and 3 combo) how is it a Pronger situation because last I checked Weber has all of his eyes and no concussions. Montreal wanted Morin that year, he speaks French (which does matter), and they are a small team that needs to get bigger. Morin is a cost controlled option and former first round pick, despite me thinking he is garbage, Montreal might not. Rubtsov was highly touted and Montreal liked radulov, I think he fits Montreal’s prototype well and is also a former first round pick. That is 4 first round picks and Gudas for Weber and his contract and #3; and #3 isn’t Scechnikov ... the top 2 are the top 2 like last draft, after that, it is up for highest bidder. I post about G and Jake because I think next year is close for them and we could sneak a cup. Look at the finals this year!

    4) long term it actually is fine for the cap because we will replace Amac with Weber soon enough and maybe even push Amac to the AHL with the new vet leadership so valuable to this team/coach (observed). And we go for it hart’s rookie year with an elite defense.


    Not sure I see your points. We can agree to disagree.
    1) We see that, everyone else sees that, but Montreal does not. We can agree all day that the Canadiens should rebuild, but the fact is they don't believe they need to. They are portraying to their fan base that they had a bad year and will be competitive next season and are going to make moves to do so. That's the reality of the situation in Montreal, so they're not going to trade Weber, their most effective defenseman and their most solid player (who again, they traded their franchise player for) just to clear his contract. That's not Montreal, that's not their identity and that's not who they are. They won't move him AND the third overall pick unless they're receiving a boatload back full of impact talent and NHL players who can help them win right now. Gudas, Morin, Rubtsov, and two first round picks in a class where most guys are 2 years away will not help them win right now. Again, you and I agree that they need to rebuild, but at the end of the day they don't believe that, or refuse to admit it, so they're not giving up Weber and Zadina/Svechnikov who both have the ability to help them right now.

    2-3) It's Pronger-like because of the age at the end of his contract. Do you remember how much it sucked being hampered with Pronger's contract and he couldn't take the ice? I just don't want nearly $8 million locked up in a guy who will be 33 at the start of this season for the next 7 years coming off an ACL injury. I realize there are options considering it's not a 35+ contract, but it's just not worth investing that many assets into a player who is going to cause cap trouble down the road. This would be a huge gamble to take on a guy that is going to be 33 and 40 when his contract expires and that is a large chunk of cap space to commit to a guy on a d-corps where the pipeline is chock full of upcoming talent. Trading for him would deplete valuable assets and could also prevent guys like Myers and Sanheim from being signed long term after their bridge deals. For what? To take a run at the cup for a couple of years? I'd rather use those assets to acquire the scoring winger we desperately need and build from within and have a shot at the cup for the next 5-10 years, much like how Pittsburgh, Chicago, LA, etc. have all built their cup run teams.

    4) It will create issues down the road with cap space. Provorov is going to get a massive pay day on his next contract. Sanheim and Myers will get bridge deals, but after those 2-3 years are up they will be due pay days as well and if they realize the potential we all believe they have... not to mention Ghost's contract is also going to run out while Weber would still be here and if he continues this improvement and is a legitimate 1B defenseman, you're looking at another massive contract to keep him here.

    The point is, this is the kind of move that hampers a franchise with dead money if it goes south. The benefit does not outweigh the risk when you can build with cost-controlled pieces from within.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlyGuys89 View Post
    Hughes is the best all-around defenseman after Dahlin. He should go #4. If Dobson goes ahead of him it's because the team is reaching on potential. Dobson is very, very good, but Hughes has been phenomenal this season.
    Agree. Dobson is a better defender, but Hughes is a better all around player due to his elite skating and elite offensive skill.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by CasperX22 View Post
    Watch Bouchard go at 4 to Ottawa now.
    Lol

  4. #34
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    Reports that Red Wings are “open” to moving out of the #6 spot. However, they likely wouldn’t want to move outside of the top 10, so for us to get up there from 14 would require quite a bit to make it happen. Highly unlikely, as any draft day trade swaps in the first round are, but it’s another option at Hextall’s disposal.

  5. #35
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    So very preliminary draft research, in no particular order, I’d be looking at these players for 14 and 19:

    Joel Farabee
    Jonatan Berggren
    Ty Smith
    Vitali Kravtsov
    Isac Lundestrom
    K’Andre Miller
    Rasmus Kupari
    Bode Wilde
    Grigori Denisenko
    Barrett Hayton
    Martin Kaut
    Akil Thomas
    Rasmus Sandin
    Calen Addison
    Dominik Bokk


    Some guys on the outside looking in:

    Joe Veleno
    Serron Noel
    Ryan McLeod


    Early favorites of that group are Farabee and Berggren. These guys are just electric offensive players that know how to create goals. Flyers need some more dynamic offensive guys.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlyGuys89 View Post
    Reports that Red Wings are “open” to moving out of the #6 spot. However, they likely wouldn’t want to move outside of the top 10, so for us to get up there from 14 would require quite a bit to make it happen. Highly unlikely, as any draft day trade swaps in the first round are, but it’s another option at Hextall’s disposal.
    Offer both 1sts and see what happens.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by CasperX22 View Post
    Offer both 1sts and see what happens.
    100%

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by CasperX22 View Post
    Value is way off in your trade scenario. It costs ALOT to move all the way up to 3 from outside the top 10. You're looking at 14+19+Hagg or equivalent just to move up to #3 and that's before factoring in the cost to acquire Weber. And that's before factoring in Montreal isn't trading that pick unless it leads to a young stud center aka Patrick or the fact that Montreal will not rebuild right after signing Price to an extension. These are facts. They aren't rebuilding. They are looking for pieces to help them win right now.
    I think #14 + #19 + a mid-tier prospect is fair market value for the #3 pick -- however, MTL will likely want more than fair value for the pick.

    As for Weber, I don't know how much they'd want for him. On one hand, he's an exceptionally good defenseman; on the other, he's on the wrong side of 30 and has a contract that could quickly turn into an albatross.

  9. #39
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    I’d be shocked to see any trades at all involving picks this year. This is a draft where there are a lot of players in the first 40 picks or so that are very likeable. They may not be game changing players in terms of projection, but there is a ton of talent and a lot to like in this year’s draft. I would be even more shocked if a team in the top-10 moved outside the top-10. This is one of those weird draft years where outside of the top 3-4 guys, players may start to slide and teams will want to stay within reach. I have a weird feeling about the top-10 of this draft, especially picks 2-5. We all know Svechnikov should go second, followed by Zadina, but teams are weird and do weird things during the draft. This is the time of year when management thinks they’re the smartest guys in the room and know better than everyone else and it usually ends up in some kind of head scratching move.

    Carolina picks second. Do they feel they’re that far away? They need a 1C desperately. Do they take a leap and select Tkachuk because he can play center? (Guys, I am not saying they will, or should, by any means. All I’m saying is that weird things happen at the draft) Montreal is not in rebuild mode. Do they take a shot at drafting for need vs BPA? Do they end up taking Wahlstrom to add some size and goal scoring ability to Drouin’s wing? Do they seriously continue to force Drouin to be a center? Do they take a shot at drafting a center higher than he should be drafted? Again, all of this is very unlikely, but possible. The draft is where most overthinking and outsmarting happens.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlyGuys89 View Post
    I’d be shocked to see any trades at all involving picks this year. This is a draft where there are a lot of players in the first 40 picks or so that are very likeable. They may not be game changing players in terms of projection, but there is a ton of talent and a lot to like in this year’s draft. I would be even more shocked if a team in the top-10 moved outside the top-10. This is one of those weird draft years where outside of the top 3-4 guys, players may start to slide and teams will want to stay within reach. I have a weird feeling about the top-10 of this draft, especially picks 2-5. We all know Svechnikov should go second, followed by Zadina, but teams are weird and do weird things during the draft. This is the time of year when management thinks they’re the smartest guys in the room and know better than everyone else and it usually ends up in some kind of head scratching move.

    Carolina picks second. Do they feel they’re that far away? They need a 1C desperately. Do they take a leap and select Tkachuk because he can play center? (Guys, I am not saying they will, or should, by any means. All I’m saying is that weird things happen at the draft) Montreal is not in rebuild mode. Do they take a shot at drafting for need vs BPA? Do they end up taking Wahlstrom to add some size and goal scoring ability to Drouin’s wing? Do they seriously continue to force Drouin to be a center? Do they take a shot at drafting a center higher than he should be drafted? Again, all of this is very unlikely, but possible. The draft is where most overthinking and outsmarting happens.
    I disagree about trades, for the exact reason you said: teams get weird. GMs fall in love with a specific player for whatever reason and move up to get him (or move down when he is taken).

    Someone is going to do something. There are just too many teams with too much ammo for it not to happen.

    Hell, do you think MTL & NYI talk trade if Tavares is gone? #10 & #11 plus rights to JT for #3 and MTL mid-rounder?

    Drouin & JT would be an absolutely incredible combination....

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ace23 View Post
    I think #14 + #19 + a mid-tier prospect is fair market value for the #3 pick -- however, MTL will likely want more than fair value for the pick.

    As for Weber, I don't know how much they'd want for him. On one hand, he's an exceptionally good defenseman; on the other, he's on the wrong side of 30 and has a contract that could quickly turn into an albatross.
    Agreed.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ace23 View Post
    I disagree about trades, for the exact reason you said: teams get weird. GMs fall in love with a specific player for whatever reason and move up to get him (or move down when he is taken).

    Someone is going to do something. There are just too many teams with too much ammo for it not to happen.

    Hell, do you think MTL & NYI talk trade if Tavares is gone? #10 & #11 plus rights to JT for #3 and MTL mid-rounder?

    Drouin & JT would be an absolutely incredible combination....

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
    I don’t think you trade those two picks just for the rights to talk with Tavares before he heads to free agency. The only way a team trades for Tavares is if it’s a sign and trade, which is incredibly unlikely. In that scenario Tavares gets to negotiate a deal, get the 8th year, and choose his destination. In that case I don’t see him wanting to go to Montreal when there are other teams he could go to that are closer to actually being a legitimate contender. San Jose and Toronto come to mind, but at the end of the day I believe Tavares is going to hit the open market and see what’s out there.

  13. #43
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    JT sure would move us forward. Mostly a pipe dream, but I think we could all get behind JT, Couturier, Patrick, and Laughton down the middle.

  14. #44
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    I really do not think that Hexy is going to move the 14 and 19. I think he makes those picks. I think he's going to want quality prospects in the pipeline. He's going to want to keep a lot of young talent to manage his cap space. The better your young player pipeline, the less you have to overpay. his cupboard is full and he's going to want to keep it that way.
    <Meaning and Content>

    ...And did you see that Giroux goal?

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by crzyhawk View Post
    I really do not think that Hexy is going to move the 14 and 19. I think he makes those picks. I think he's going to want quality prospects in the pipeline. He's going to want to keep a lot of young talent to manage his cap space. The better your young player pipeline, the less you have to overpay. his cupboard is full and he's going to want to keep it that way.
    I agree with this, but I want him to move up for higher end talent

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