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  1. #61
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    Feb 2010
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    I've been thinking a lot about our ideal roster and positions for our core players.

    Ideally, I'd prefer not to make any major splashes and just add complimentary pieces. With our young guys progression and health this team will be much better next year.

    So here's how I view each players "natural position". Brad coaches position versatility and our players are great at playing out of position, so this is not to say they can't play affectively at a different position, most can. But this is an IDEAL roster based on their natural positions to help determine how to fill this roster out in the offseason.

    PG
    Kyrie Irving
    Terry Rozier
    Marcus Smart
    Shane Larken

    These 4 are obvious. Ideally 1 is the odd man out between Smart and Rozier and 1 will be here long term. I'd prefer it be Rozier. He's younger. Better offensively and still can play defense at a high level, but not quite to Smarts level. Smart is more of a leader and a bull dog. Rozier's game is a little redundant to Kyrie's game though. I could go either way. If I'm Danny I'm floating both names out there and taking the best return this offseason.

    SG
    Hayward
    Brown

    Both can play SG or SF, and in Brad's system the 2 wings are essentially the same position anyways. But both are more of a SG (especially with Browns improved 3 point shot) than a SF in my eyes. Defensively Hayward might match up better against SF's though.

    SF
    Tatum
    Morris
    Ojeleye

    I list these 3 as natural SF's. They can transition to SG or PF if needed. I like what Ojeleye brings defensively. If he can get his shot more consistent he just may be a nice 3 and D player in this league. He's a perfect compliment to Tatum. Morris is streaky but can score in bunches. He can play solid D when he wants to. He's a bit of a hot head who thinks he's better than he is.

    PF
    Horford
    Theis

    Both are modern NBA stretch 4's. Horford can play C when called upon but I think he's much more effective at his natural PF position. Theis showed some promise this year and can even play a small 5, but it's not ideal for big minutes. Both athletically can't play anywhere else other than C.

    C
    Baynes
    Monroe

    Monroe is an old school PF but in the modern NBA he's relegated to C due to lack of athleticism and defense. He can rebound and score from the block. He has a decent shot but not much range outside of 15-18'. I love what Baynes brings but he's absolutely a role player and shouldn't be starting on a contending team. His defense and new found 3pt range add a lot to a team.

    Moving forward I like these groups and how they compliment one another.

    PG Irving/Smart/Larkin
    SG Hayward/Brown
    SF Tatum/Ojeleye
    PF Horford/Theis
    C _____/Baynes

    The starting 5 has loads of offense with Kyrie/Hayward/Tatum. Brown should be able to lead the second unit with a scoring punch, but other than that the second unit is loaded with defense.

    My ideal offseason would include trading Morris and Rozier to fill that void at C. Let Monroe walk.

    Could Smart and Morris be used to get a talent like Turner? Maybe a flyer on Noel who's stock is way down?

    There aren't many bigs out there and even fewer within reach or available. And generally those available come with question marks (Noel) or their contracts just aren't matchable (Whiteside)

    City of Champions

  2. #62
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    Dec 2007
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    25,877
    Whats the status of Rozier? I was hoping Bucks would trade for him. Would ya consider Brogdon and Maker for Rozier? Or draft night you pick at #17 and Maker for Rozier? Or #17 and Brogdon for Rozier?

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by MILLERHIGHLIFE View Post
    Whats the status of Rozier? I was hoping Bucks would trade for him. Would ya consider Brogdon and Maker for Rozier? Or draft night you pick at #17 and Maker for Rozier? Or #17 and Brogdon for Rozier?
    His value is high, but he needs to put together a solid back-up season next year... I think his value still has room to go... IMO, he's a better pure scorer than Brogdon and Maker...
    "I've never been scared of contact. Now I get to bring it, that's what I love to do, so I'm going to bring it."

    Reggie Lewis



    GET OFF YOUR HEELS BILL !!!

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by MILLERHIGHLIFE View Post
    Whats the status of Rozier? I was hoping Bucks would trade for him. Would ya consider Brogdon and Maker for Rozier? Or draft night you pick at #17 and Maker for Rozier? Or #17 and Brogdon for Rozier?
    I would trade him for #17 and Maker.

    Maker still has a long ways to go but his upside is immense. Stevens could make him into a top 3 defensive C in a hurry. Will take a bit longer to develop his offensive game.

    Sign me up for

    PG Irving/Smart/Larkin
    SG Hayward/Brown
    SF Tatum/Morris/Ojeleye
    PF Horford/Theis
    C Baynes/Maker

    City of Champions

  5. #65
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    Apr 2012
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    Tacoma, WA
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    5,186
    i love MIL as a trade partner and agree getting maker in this system could be scary. horford could be a great guy to learn from and to possibly pass the torch too. also, if rozier must be traded have him go team up with bledsoe will be classic lol.

  6. #66
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    Nov 2006
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    2,044
    Nah, I'm not interested in trading Rozier right now. No way this team runs smoothly with Smart backing up Irving at PG. If Irving goes down again, you need another scoring PG that can create space. Rozier would be my back-up next year, unless I get blown away by an offer (top 1-7 protected 1st rd pick).

    And if Rozier plays well throughout the season next year, and Irving gets hurt again . . . well then you have an interesting dilemma. Do you trade Irving? Let him opt out and not resign him? and if one of these options take place, then Rozier is a great replacement for the time being.

  7. #67
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    Feb 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by CeltBruinSoxFan View Post
    Nah, I'm not interested in trading Rozier right now. No way this team runs smoothly with Smart backing up Irving at PG. If Irving goes down again, you need another scoring PG that can create space. Rozier would be my back-up next year, unless I get blown away by an offer (top 1-7 protected 1st rd pick).

    And if Rozier plays well throughout the season next year, and Irving gets hurt again . . . well then you have an interesting dilemma. Do you trade Irving? Let him opt out and not resign him? and if one of these options take place, then Rozier is a great replacement for the time being.
    The team ran smoothly without Rozier playing major minutes last year and without Kyrie. Brads system is what allows players to be successful because in a very Belichickian way, he allows players to play to their strengths better than any other coach in the NBA right now. He's made IT, a career 6th man into a top 5 MVP candidate. Soon as he left, he crashed back down to earth. He turned Crowder, a guy who struggled for minutes, into a household name and a rock solid 3 and D guy. He also had a down season 1 year removed from this system.

    I like Rozier, but I think many here are a little over the top in their expectations of what Rozier actually is. He's never going to be a franchise guy. He's likely a career 6th man on a playoff roster. If he's starting...You're team has major holes or injuries.

    We'd be just fine without him. Some team will likely throw more money than he's worth at him in the very near future anyways.

    You can't build a roster around "if my best player gets hurt".

    City of Champions

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oakmont_4 View Post

    Could Smart and Morris be used to get a talent like Turner? Maybe a flyer on Noel who's stock is way down?

    There aren't many bigs out there and even fewer within reach or available. And generally those available come with question marks (Noel) or their contracts just aren't matchable (Whiteside)
    I can see DA kicking the tires with Okafor since he'll be a FA...

    I like Turner, but I don't see Indy giving up on him... 22, he's still young...
    "I've never been scared of contact. Now I get to bring it, that's what I love to do, so I'm going to bring it."

    Reggie Lewis



    GET OFF YOUR HEELS BILL !!!

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forever35 View Post
    I can see DA kicking the tires with Okafor since he'll be a FA...

    I like Turner, but I don't see Indy giving up on him... 22, he's still young...
    I doubt he'll look Okafors way, even if he did he doesn't play D so Stevens would never put him on the court.

    City of Champions

  10. #70
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    Jan 2009
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    https://twitter.com/ESPNForsberg/sta...907264/photo/1

    Crazy...

    A C's win against the Cavs on Tues along with a win with the ping pong balls on Tues would be a great story...
    "I've never been scared of contact. Now I get to bring it, that's what I love to do, so I'm going to bring it."

    Reggie Lewis



    GET OFF YOUR HEELS BILL !!!

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forever35 View Post
    https://twitter.com/ESPNForsberg/sta...907264/photo/1

    Crazy...

    A C's win against the Cavs on Tues along with a win with the ping pong balls on Tues would be a great story...
    I'd take one or the other. Not sure which is more probable at this point haha. Both however would be extremely lucky.

    City of Champions

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forever35 View Post
    https://twitter.com/ESPNForsberg/sta...907264/photo/1

    Crazy...

    A C's win against the Cavs on Tues along with a win with the ping pong balls on Tues would be a great story...


    Maybe they'll get a little "Magic" help.

  13. #73
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    Feb 2010
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    4,740
    Mock Offseason 1.0

    I’m going to start out and assume we make the NBA finals and lose a close series to GS in 6 games.

    We'll have pick #27 in the draft.

    Draft Day

    Pick #27: Jontay Porter. A bit of a project player here but with legitimate upside. He stands at 6’11 240lbs. Legitimate center body frame. He can shoot the 3. He’s a great passer. Will need to shape and mold his body a bit, but sitting behind Horford and Theis he’ll have the ability to do that and getting some spot duty during the season.

    Trade: Guerschon Yabusele to BRK for #40 and #45

    ***I like Yabusele and think he can eventually be a nice role player in this league. But in Boston he’s buried behind a ton of wings and his $2.7M salary is starting to hamstring our cap. He’s traded for 2 second round picks to help fill out the roster with some cheaper contracts.***

    Pick #40: Grayson Allen. 6’5 205lb. Duke product with a high pedigree. He has that compete level Danny and Brad love. High IQ guy who can shoot the 3. Excellent FT shooter. High motor. Decent playmaker. Doesn’t have ideal agility or speed. Overall average athlete. He’ll struggle defensively in the NBA but not for a lack of effort. If he pans out he could be the next JJ Redick. Or a non factor/NBA washout.

    Pick #45: De’Anthony Melton. 6’2. 195lb. Combo guard. 6’8 wingspan (insane). He’s a terrific defender but his offensive game needs to be polished. He reminds me a lot of Terry Rozier when he first came into the league. He has all the tools to be a nice player in this league but needs development.

    Trade: Abdel Nader for heavily protected future 2nd round pick. (Salary dump)

    QO’s –
    Qualifying offers will be extended to Marcus Smart, Aron Baynes, Shane Larkin

    Roster

    PG
    Kyrie Irving
    Marcus Smart
    Terry Rozier
    Shane Larkin

    Wings
    Gordon Hayward
    Jaylen Brown
    Jayson Tatum
    Marcus Morris
    Semi Ojeleye
    De’Anthony Melton
    Grayson Allen

    Centers
    Al Horford
    Aron Baynes
    Daniel Theis
    Jontay Porter

    To this point our cap is sitting at about $127M.
    ***This number is for the complete above roster, accounting for holds and draft pick salaries.***

    The cap is projected to be $101M with a luxury tax threshold of $123M.
    ***So as we currently sit here, we would need to trim about $4M in salary to get under the threshold. Something I really think we should try and do considering future ramifications of paying luxury taxes.***

    Re-Signings

    Marcus Smart - $44.4M/3 (back loaded so first years cap # is $12M)
    Smart showed during the playoff run his value to this team. He’s a source of energy for this team and makes all the big plays. He’s continued his slow shooting improvement but that’s not why he’s here. He also had a great year becoming more of playmaker. He make not score much, but his defense and ability to make those around him better are immensely valuable to this club.

    Aron Baynes - $6.2M/1
    Baynes had a great first year in Boston. He’s a great role player. He compliments Al well and allows him to play his natural PF position. He’s not an elite rim protector but he’s serviceable enough. His surprising development of a 3 point shot helps space the floor as well.

    Shane Larkin - $1.5M/1
    Larkin was a great 4th PG option for this team last season. He’s small and quick. Has a decent 3 point shot and plays fairly solid defense though can be taken advantage of by bigger/faster players. Stevens trusts him when he’s forced into action.

    Looking at the roster – we have to trim $4M, there a few players I view as easy to unload without feeling an impact on the court. But when looking through and considering contract number, length and positioning on the team I find 1 player that I would consider expendable.

    Marcus Morris is the odd man out. He played great throughout the playoffs and was a key contributor to this team. He was a flash scorer who provided a nice spark of the bench. His versatility and defense were huge during the playoff run. However, he’ll be making $5M that if shed, gets us under the luxury tax, and will be a Free Agent the following season. He could likely be re-signed for a fair deal, but would he really want to stay on as the 5th wing on this team? With Hayward returning, he’s going to wipe out all of Morris’s minutes and reduce him to a small bench role he likely would not be happy with.

    Trade: Marcus Morris and 2 future second round picks to IND for C Ike Anigbogu.

    IND will have cap space and could use a player like Morris. They’re unlikely to be a major player in Free Agency but will look to build around a surprising 2017-18 campaign. Morris versatility, ability to score off the bench and defense will fit seamlessly into IND scheme. In return we get a developmental C in Ike Anigbogu who has some decent upside but is very raw. He will get a chance to develop and learn from some solid vets in Horford and Baynes. Celtics shed nearly $4M after this transaction to get under the luxury tax threshold.

    Final Roster - $122M

    PG Irving/Rozier/Smart/Larkin

    Wing Hayward/Brown/Tatum/Ojeleye/Allen/Melton

    Big Horford/Baynes/Theis /Porter/Anigbogu

    Rotation (MPG)

    PG Irving (32)/Rozier (16)
    SG Hayward (32)/Rozier(9)/Smart(7)
    SF Brown (32)/Smart(16)
    PF Tatum (32)/Horford(10)/Ojeleye(6)
    C Horford (20)/Baynes(15)/Theis(13)

    Don’t worry so much about the positions listed.

    The Point
    We’ll feature a (hopefully) fully recovered Kyrie Irving who will give the starting lineup stability and a huge scoring threat and playmaker. Rozier will be his main backup/insurance should he need to have his minutes carefully monitored. It would be smart play to regulate/restrict his minutes in the regular season. Especially with the depth this roster features. Rozier and Smart can handle the duties at any point in time and Larkin is a reliable 4th option.

    The wing position
    Absolutely stacked. Smart will have to play a lot of 2-3 to get on the court but that doesn’t bother me because of his defensive versatility. Hayward reinserts into the starting lineup – effectively absorbing the minutes Morris played. He’s at best equal defensively to Morris but if he falls short it’s only slightly. However he’s a much more potent and consistent scoring threat to Morris. This is a big upgrade. Expect continued progression from Tatum and Brown who will play 30+ minutes a night. Ojeleye played well his rookie season and has carved out a small role for himself. Hopefully he can improve his shot and become more consistent but defensively he can hold his own. Horford will also see time at the “4”. This group can do it all. Big, long, athletic, versatile, can score from anywhere, can D on just about anyone.

    The Bigs
    Horford will start. Baynes can spell him and Theis will also have a role off the bench. Solid rotational group here. They complement each other well. We lack a true “rim protector” but Baynes and Horford can get the job done.

    The end of the Bench
    Features Larson, a solid vet presence and trusted emergency option. Grayson Allen who has spark plug type potential off the bench. He could be a deadly 3 point shooter if he can play enough defense to get on the court. De-Anthony Melton is more of a defensive threat, combo guard in the mold of a young Terry Rozier. His offense will need a lot of work but if he can play solid defense (his calling card) he could create a role for himself in the future. Jontay Porter is a semi polished developmental big. He has some great aspects of his game that could eventually lead him to being an Al Horford type player. Learning under Al for a few seasons will be greatly beneficial to him and his development. Ike Anigbogu is a different type of big. He would classify as the rim protector, energy big (think Bismack Biyombo). His offensive game is a wreck and needs a ton of work but defensively he can give you a lot. He’s a big body off the bench that could come in handy for certain matchups or to chew up fouls until he can develop an offensive skillset.

    Looking ahead.

    In the 2019 offseason as constructed the team has $11M in cap space on a projected $108M cap.

    Irving and Rozier will both be Free Agents along with Theis, Baynes and Larken.
    Depending on how Irving comes back and health will determine if he’s retained. It’s possible to retain both Rozier and Irving should the both play well. We’d have to go over the luxury tax but its likely money well spent.

    Horford and Hayward will also be entering their last years of their contracts (assuming Horford opts in).

    We’ll potentially have 4 first round picks (1 projected top 10) in the 2019 offseason
    Last edited by Oakmont_4; 05-16-2018 at 05:53 PM.

    City of Champions

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oakmont_4 View Post
    Mock Offseason 1.0

    I’m going to start out and assume we make the NBA finals and lose a close series to GS in 6 games.

    This leaves us with pick #29.
    The draft order is already set in stone, unless there are trades... The C's have the 27th pick... Picks 15 to 30 are based on regular season schedules...

    NFL has the Super Bowl champs and runner-ups as the last 2 picks in the draft...
    "I've never been scared of contact. Now I get to bring it, that's what I love to do, so I'm going to bring it."

    Reggie Lewis



    GET OFF YOUR HEELS BILL !!!

  15. #75
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    Feb 2010
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    4,740
    Quote Originally Posted by Forever35 View Post
    The draft order is already set in stone, unless there are trades... The C's have the 27th pick... Picks 15 to 30 are based on regular season schedules...

    NFL has the Super Bowl champs and runner-ups as the last 2 picks in the draft...
    Touche. You're right. Even better!

    City of Champions

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