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  1. #1696
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    Pueblo Sin Fronteras is a Chicago based group who I've seen in interviews say they are for no borders anywhere.
    Ok. And there are a couple people out there who think lots of other crazy conspiracies. The Illuminati killed JFK...Bigfoot is real...there is no gold in Fort Knox...the moon landing was fake...

    Do we make actual government policy based on wingnuts who have an even loser grasp on reality than they do on the policies.
    Think long and hard about why you respond to nonsense. Please!


  2. #1697
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    Ok. And there are a couple people out there who think lots of other crazy conspiracies. The Illuminati killed JFK...Bigfoot is real...there is no gold in Fort Knox...the moon landing was fake...

    Do we make actual government policy based on wingnuts who have an even loser grasp on reality than they do on the policies.
    So, you didn't think anyone thought it, I prove it, and now you deride it as akin to conspiracy theorists.

    It's a lot more than "a couple people". The very liberal people I've talked to in the bay area seem to almost universally support the idea of no border with Mexico. To me that is absolutely a factor in the immigration reform debate.
    Last edited by Scoots; 01-09-2019 at 07:51 PM.

  3. #1698
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    Pueblos sin fronteras literally translates to "villages without boarders"


    This post is purely a factoid, not an attempt to join the debate

  4. #1699
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    So, you didn't think anyone thought it, I prove it, and now you deride it as akin to conspiracy theorists.

    It's a lot more than "a couple people". The very liberal people I've talked to in the bay area seem to almost universally support the idea of no border with Mexico. To me that is absolutely a factor in the immigration reform debate.
    Where are these people? I don't see ANYONE raising their voice into the debate making this claim. If people silently keep these ideas to themselves, that's fine. To the tangible point about people in the bay area supporting no border, then why don't their politicians think that way? I would expect the politician to voice what the community supports.
    Think long and hard about why you respond to nonsense. Please!


  5. #1700
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    Where are these people? I don't see ANYONE raising their voice into the debate making this claim. If people silently keep these ideas to themselves, that's fine. To the tangible point about people in the bay area supporting no border, then why don't their politicians think that way? I would expect the politician to voice what the community supports.
    I told you they are based in Chicago. They are SOMEONE, so now there is more than ANYONE. I heard it from other people in the bay area last year when there was all that conflict with Trump about sancuary cities. Where I first saw this group was in a piece covering the migration of the caravan to the border from across central america, most of the supplies that caravan got were supplied and organized by them from US donors.

    I have always thought you an intelligent person so I don't believe you actually think politicians say what they or their constituents actually think. Politicians say what is expedient to gain power or protect power, that is about it. It doesn't make sense for politicians to say that they want no border since it's too hot for too many, but that doesn't mean it's not there.

    Pages and pages ago in this debate we were talking about the need for border control ... if it wasn't in question would any of this debate be happening at all?

  6. #1701
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scoots View Post
    I told you they are based in Chicago. They are SOMEONE, so now there is more than ANYONE. I heard it from other people in the bay area last year when there was all that conflict with Trump about sancuary cities. Where I first saw this group was in a piece covering the migration of the caravan to the border from across central america, most of the supplies that caravan got were supplied and organized by them from US donors.

    I have always thought you an intelligent person so I don't believe you actually think politicians say what they or their constituents actually think. Politicians say what is expedient to gain power or protect power, that is about it. It doesn't make sense for politicians to say that they want no border since it's too hot for too many, but that doesn't mean it's not there.

    Pages and pages ago in this debate we were talking about the need for border control ... if it wasn't in question would any of this debate be happening at all?
    How many people are part of that group? Because if we're talking about a group of 10 people, then I am not ready to say they are influential or relevant at all.

    I mean yes there are people out there who will believe all sorts of stupid ****. There are people who believe that Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump are both representing the interests of the lizard people.

    In an area like San Francisco, if the support for open/no borders were as wide spread as described; then I absolutely believe it would be supported by local politicians.
    Think long and hard about why you respond to nonsense. Please!


  7. #1702
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    It is not irrelevant. You were factually incorrect. You said the news anchor said something that wasn't true, you were wrong. He said something that was true and you tried to counter with something that was not what he said.

    In order to avoid this in the future, don't be wrong.
    how many people "on a federal government list of known or suspected terrorists" were there valade16?







    https://insider.foxnews.com/2019/01/...der-walls-work

    'The President Is Right': Former Border Patrol Chief Under Obama Says Walls ‘Absolutely Work’
    The chief of U.S. Border Patrol during Barack Obama's presidency said Monday that President Trump is right in his view that border walls are effective.

    Mark Morgan said on "Tucker Carlson Tonight" that walls "absolutely work" and that there is no real argument against building and implementing one.

    He added that although he was removed from his position by President Trump's administration, Trump's stance on border security makes sense.

    "The president is right. ... That's based on historical data and facts that can be proven," Morgan said.

    He said that opponents of a border wall are looking to make a political point.

    "I cannot think of a legitimate argument why anyone would not support the wall as part of a multi-layered border security issue," noting his experience with the FBI in Texas.

    People are too concerned about the president's style and the delivery of his case for a border wall as opposed to the substantive issues at hand, Morgan said.

    He added that Trump is correct in calling the issues at the border a national security problem, and that border security professionals think the same.

    "Why aren't we listening to the experts and the people who do it every day? I don't understand that."







    the anti-Trump movement seems to be getting dumber

  8. #1703
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpecialFNK View Post
    how many people "on a federal government list of known or suspected terrorists" were there valade16?







    https://insider.foxnews.com/2019/01/...der-walls-work










    Since you are desperate for a response. Chuck is dumb too I guess. I use these 2-3 times a week when it’s warm. I’m strolling through your fence in less than 5 minutes.

    https://www.homedepot.com/p/DEWALT-1...0273/202723433

  9. #1704
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpecialFNK View Post
    this is the type of ignorance you get from Liberal media. first they continue to use the word undocumented when in fact they are illegal. anyone that has illegally crossed the border is illegal and just from that are criminals.


    []
    What a truly stupid comment. Do you refer to anyone who has broken the speed limit in their life as a criminal? What a stupid take..
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  10. #1705
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    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    What a truly stupid comment. Do you refer to anyone who has broken the speed limit in their life as a criminal? What a stupid take..
    He’s all stupid takes. Trump is a felon.

  11. #1706
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    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    What a truly stupid comment. Do you refer to anyone who has broken the speed limit in their life as a criminal? What a stupid take..
    . To be fair, I don't think you can parallel driving 65 in a 55 with crossing a country's border illegally. Sneaking a retro 1984 Van Halen concert tee shirt in your coat pocket while shopping at Target so you don't have to pay for it probably not gonna get you on the "criminal" list.............climbing up on the roof, prying open a roof hatch while wearing a ski mask so you can't be identified on camera to steal that same shirt, well that gets you a little more on that list

  12. #1707
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hatch View Post
    . To be fair, I don't think you can parallel driving 65 in a 55 with crossing a country's border illegally. Sneaking a retro 1984 Van Halen concert tee shirt in your coat pocket while shopping at Target so you don't have to pay for it probably not gonna get you on the "criminal" list.............climbing up on the roof, prying open a roof hatch while wearing a ski mask so you can't be identified on camera to steal that same shirt, well that gets you a little more on that list
    Yeah, I can’t tell the cop I was fleeing for my life and make the speeding completely legal, but I can if I cross the border.

  13. #1708
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    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    What a truly stupid comment. Do you refer to anyone who has broken the speed limit in their life as a criminal? What a stupid take..
    I should re-word what I said. illegally crossing the border is illegal, against the law. the left would rather call this undocumented because they know it's actually illegal but don't want to use that word.

    there is a case where this is criminal.

    https://www.americanimmigrationcounc...n-prosecutions

    Physical presence in the United States without proper authorization is a civil, rather than criminal, offense. This means that the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) can place a person in removal (deportation) proceedings and can require payment of a fine, but the federal government cannot charge the person with a criminal offense. Likewise, a migrant who enters the United States on a valid visa but who stays longer than permitted may be put in removal proceedings, but cannot face federal criminal charges. Those who enter or reenter the United States without permission, however, can face criminal charges.

    Title 8 of the U.S. Code identifies federal criminal offenses pertaining to immigration and nationality, including the following two entry-related offenses:

    “Illegal Entry”/8 U.S.C. 1325 makes it a crime to unlawfully enter the United States. It applies to migrants who do not enter with proper inspection at a port of entry, such as those who enter between ports of entry, avoid examination or inspection, or who make false statements while entering or attempting to enter. A first offense is a misdemeanor punishable by a fine, up to six months in prison, or both.

    “Illegal Re-Entry”/8 U.S.C. 1326 makes it a crime to unlawfully reenter, attempt to unlawfully reenter, or to be found in the United States after having been deported, ordered removed, or denied admission. This crime is punishable as a felony with a maximum sentence of two years. Higher penalties apply if the migrant has a criminal record: up to 10 years for a migrant with misdemeanors and simple felonies, and up to 20 years for more serious crimes.





    this is CNN and other Liberal media that do not want to cover news that doesn't fit their narrative.

    https://www.kusi.com/cnn-requests-ku...ut-wall-works/

    CNN requests KUSI for local view on the border, declines our reporter after finding out wall works
    Thursday morning, CNN called the KUSI Newsroom asking if one of our reporters could give them a local view of the debate surrounding the border wall and government shutdown.

    KUSI offered our own Dan Plante, who has reported dozens of times on the border, including one story from 2016 that was retweeted by former Speaker of the House, Newt Gingrich, and posted on DrudgeReport.com. The Border Fence Tour is below.

    We believe CNN declined a report from KUSI because we informed them that most Border Patrol Agents we have spoken to told us the barrier does in fact work.


    We have continuously been told by Border Patrol Agents that the barrier along the Southern border helps prevent illegal entries, drugs, and weapons from entering the United States, and the numbers prove it.

    Democrats, CNN, Liberal media, and maybe on the left continually want to ignore this type of information.
    this is Trump Derangement Syndrome on steroids, hatred of President Trump so intense that it impairs people's judgment to the point where people want to flat out ignore whatever doesn't fit with their narrative. don't want walls, walls don't work, walls are immoral.. ********.






    https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/newt...-tuesday-night

    When the president asserted that, “In the last two years, ICE officers made 266,000 arrests of aliens with criminal records – including those charged or convicted of 100,000 assaults, 30,000 sex crimes and 4,000 violent killings,” he was being the commander-in-chief defending Americans from danger. The liberal media will do all it can to debunk and undermine this claim. However, every time an illegal immigrant kills or attacks an American, the public will move a step closer to President Trump.

    The president’s claim that we need a physical barrier for our national security was also reinforced by professionals with years of experience on the border. When President Obama’s chief of U.S. Border Patrol, Mark Morgan, goes on “Tucker Carlson Tonight” to defend Trump, it is clear where the argument is heading. Consider what Morgan said:

    MORGAN: The President is right, the President of [the] Border Patrol council is right, [and] the other day when they had the national press conference and they got up and they said the wall works, they’re [sic] right. And it’s not based on a personal political ideology. That’s based on historical data and facts that can be proven.

    CARLSON: So why do you think people oppose it?

    MORGAN: That, I think, is a political point that they are trying to make. I personally, in my experience and I was also with The FBI for 20 years, I was special agent in charge of the El Paso Division right on the border. Tucker, I cannot think of a legitimate argument why anyone would not support the wall as part of the multilayered border security.


    When President Obama’s head of the Border Patrol says the argument Pelosi and Schumer are making is not legitimate and only serves a political point, the Democrats are walking on very thin ground. They could rapidly find themselves in quicksand as the party which is unwilling to protect Americans.

    There is more law enforcement support for President Trump’s proposed control of the southern border. Yuma County Sheriff Leon Wilmot said that the fence and other security measures under the Secure Fence Act of 2006 dramatically impacted crime. “We were able to reduce [ancillary crimes] by 91 percent,” Wilmot told the Epoch Times. “The deaths in the desert, the rapes, the robberies, the homicides, the burglaries, the thefts.”

    President Trump gained ground when he alluded to Senator Schumer’s vote in favor of the Secure Fence Act (which was also supported by Senators Clinton and Obama and has substantially reduced crime in Yuma, Arizona). Schumer can claim it was a different time and different circumstances, but it undermines his own hostility to a fence and makes it look like opposition to Trump rather than a principled position.

    The president also helped his cause when he drew a strong distinction between legal migration and lawbreaking: “America proudly welcomes millions of lawful immigrants who enrich our society and contribute to our nation. But all Americans are hurt by uncontrolled, illegal migration.”

    This was the president’s first Oval Office address to the nation. Compared to the debut of the Nancy and Chuck Show, the president can feel good that he has advanced the cause of securing the border while his opponents have further driven home how negative and lacking in solutions they are.

    a wall/fence works. right now for Democrats this is all politics, and for those on the left that oppose Trump it's all hate.







    the anti-Trump movement seems to be getting dumber

  14. #1709
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    index of things that people more often want to ignore.
    valade16, dbroncos78087, GGGGG-Men, Kenny Powders, Hawkeye15, nastynice, anyone, feel free to comment on these stories that deserve attention.





    https://insider.foxnews.com/2019/01/...der-walls-work
    'The President Is Right': Former Border Patrol Chief Under Obama Says Walls ‘Absolutely Work’




    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...0E814T20140528
    Waves of immigrant minors present crisis for Obama, Congress
    https://www.upi.com/Record-number-of...4921540314448/
    A record number of family members were apprehended at the U.S. border with Mexico in September, Customs and Border Patrol data released Tuesday indicates.

    CPB said 16,658 family members were apprehended, a record high for a single month. The figure is comparable to numbers seen in 2014 during a surge in unaccompanied minors. That year there were 16,330 family apprehensions in June and in December 2016 there were 16,139.

    The report showed there were 396,579 apprehensions for fiscal year 2018, up 30.5 percent from fiscal year 2017.

    Fiscal year 2018 apprehensions included 107,212 family members, 50,036 unaccompanied minors and 239,331 single adults. The number of family members or minors to cross in fiscal year 2018 represented about 40 percent of all apprehensions or inadmissible border crossers.




    http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/08/1...migration-2009
    Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.) has been an outspoken critic of President Trump's immigration policies.

    But in a speech in 2009, Schumer espoused views against illegal immigration that sound strikingly similar to what President Trump has said since 2015.

    Speaking at an immigration policy conference at Georgetown Law, Schumer said, "Illegal immigration is wrong, and a primary goal of comprehensive immigration reform must be to dramatically curtail future illegal immigration."

    Schumer also called for significant increases in infrastructure, technology and border personnel to achieve "operational control of our borders," in addition to an expansion of the E-Verify program to disincentivize illegal immigrants coming to the U.S. for jobs.

    “When we use phrases like ‘undocumented workers,’ we convey a message to the American people that their government is not serious about combating illegal immigration, which the American people overwhelmingly oppose,” Schumer said. “If you don’t think it’s illegal, you’re not going to say it. I think it is illegal and wrong and we have to change it."

    “People who enter the United States without our permission are illegal aliens, and illegal aliens should not be treated the same as people who entered the U.S. legally," Schumer said later in the speech.




    https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2019/01...-donald-trump/
    in 2006 Schumer, now one of the leaders of the anti-wall forces in Washington, voted to build 700 miles of fence on the U.S.-Mexico border.

    Three years later, he said progress in ending illegal immigration was defined by, “construction of a 630-mile border fence that creates a significant barrier to illegal immigration on our southern land border.”
    “Illegal immigration is wrong, plain and simple. Until the American people are convinced that we will stop future flows of illegal immigration we will make no progress on dealing with the millions of illegals who are here now,”
    Kramer: “What’s the difference between a wall and a fence?”

    Schumer: “A lot. It’s not just fencing. A fence works. You ask the experts. A big, concrete wall is expensive and it doesn’t work. You don’t just need fencing. You need drones, you need helicopters and you need roads. The agents can’t get people crossing the border because they can’t get there.”





    https://archives.nbclearn.com/portal...w?cuecard=3418
    One last pre-election event on the red-hot issue of illegal immigration for President Bush. He signed a bill today authorizing the construction of a fence along the border with Mexico. This fence would be 700 miles long, though the border is much longer, and cost anywhere between 2 and $6 billion. And as NBC's George Lewis tells us tonight, though the fence has a lot of fans, others say it won't fix anything.

    GEORGE LEWIS, reporting:

    This section of the border at San Ysidro, south of San Diego, was once the number one hot spot for illegal crossings, but not since they beefed up the fence here in the 1990's. It cut the flow of illegal immigration here way back, and that's what the government hopes to do elsewhere by fencing about one third of the border with Mexico. Now, starting here in California and extending eastward along the border, the law authorizes new fencing where illegal immigrant traffic is the heaviest, but leaves many areas still open. The bill signed by the president authorizes but does not fund the fence.





    https://cis.org/Report/Have-Terroris...sed-Our-Border
    Have Terrorists Crossed Our Border?
    An initial count of suspected terrorists encountered en route and at the U.S. Southwest Border Since 2001
    15 suspected terrorists have been apprehended at the U.S.-Mexico border, or en route, since 2001.





    https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/09/polit...ber/index.html
    Overall, the number is also continuing to climb, but is not close to a record. The total number of individuals apprehended illegally crossing the southwest border in October were 50,975, up from 41,486 in September and 25,488 last October. Historically, in the early to mid-2000s, there were months when well over 100,000 migrants were apprehended illegally crossing the southern border.





    https://abc7chicago.com/trump-makes-...-wall/5011448/
    Brandon Judd, president of the National Border Patrol Council, which represents many -- but not all -- border agents, called for "physical barriers" at the border.





    http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1812/28/es.03.html
    DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Christine and Joe, Secretary Nielsen is headed to the border and her stated purpose to examine the medical screenings that are taking place in the border control situations. Obviously, with two children who had within the past month, she is facing the crisis and one of the things she has ordered her agency to do is offer enhanced medical screenings. She wants to witness that process first hand. She will be in El Paso on Friday and in Yuma, Arizona, on Saturday.

    In the meantime, we are getting a better understanding of why this father and son made this entry into the United States. The mother spoke to "Reuters". One of the things she told them is they were under the impression if you travel with a child, you have a better chance of gaining entry into the country. She says she was essentially encouraged by neighbors to do this.

    One of the quotes she gave "Reuters" was lots of them have gone with children and managed to cross, even if they are held for a month or two.

    [05:10:06] And it is statements that critics say that is the problem with U.S. immigration policy that it incentivizes bringing children across the border, that if you're a family from a country that does not border the United States, you are not automatically deported. Oftentimes family members go free while immigration proceedings are pending.





    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...utdown-1074815

    mid a government shutdown centered on President Donald Trump’s demands for border wall funding, the president again slammed Democrats on Monday for refusing to give him the funding levels he wants.

    “Virtually every Democrat we are dealing with today strongly supported a Border Wall or Fence,” Trump tweeted. “It was only when I made it an important part of my campaign, because people and drugs were pouring into our Country unchecked, that they turned against it. Desperately needed!”

    The comments echo a talking point that congressional Republicans have circulated in recent days — noting that a failed 2013 immigration plan, which garnered Senate Democratic support, would have devoted $46 billion to border security.

    That is much more than the $5 billion Trump has demanded in border wall funding, a point that largely prompted the current shutdown.

    But the $46 billion tells only part of the story. Just $8 billion would have gone toward border fencing — which Democrats are at pains to note is different than a wall. A “30-foot concrete wall, 30-foot steel spikes, that's not the smart way, and that's what all the experts on the border tell us,“ said Sen. Jeff Merkley (D-Ore.) on Sunday’s “This Week“ on ABC in discussing the distinction.





    https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...ncrete-wall-at
    President Trump said Sunday that his administration is pushing for a steel barrier rather than a concrete wall along the southern border, calling it a "good solution" amid a partial government shutdown centered on discussions over funding for the structure.
    https://thehill.com/policy/finance/4...-off-the-table
    Acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney said President Trump has moved away from his desire for a concrete wall along the U.S.-Mexico border toward a plan for metal fencing instead, which he said indicates how the president is working to compromise with Democrats.
    https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...its-not-a-wall
    “The president still says ‘wall’ — oftentimes frankly he’ll say ‘barrier’ or ‘fencing,’ now he’s tended toward steel slats," Kelly added. "But we left a solid concrete wall early on in the administration, when we asked people what they needed and where they needed it."

    Kelly, who will leave the administration in the coming days after a contentious tenure, said Customs and Border Protection Agents told him during his brief stint as Homeland Security secretary that they need physical barriers in some areas, but largely indicated a desire for new technology and additional personnel.







    these are the real victims.

    https://www.justice.gov/usao-edva/pr...exual-purposes
    Illegal Alien Pleads Guilty to Transporting Minor for Sexual Purposes
    A Honduran man who illegally entered the United States pleaded guilty yesterday to transportation of a person for criminal sexual purposes.

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/27/us/su...led/index.html
    Suspect who shot and killed California officer was in the country illegally

    https://www.foxnews.com/us/undocumen...-year-old-girl
    A Guatemalan citizen living in the United States illegally was sentenced Monday to 50 years in prison for raping a 6-year-old girl in Tennessee.
    He had been detained in 2013 when he tried entering the U.S. illegally. He failed to appear at an immigration hearing.






    bottom line..


    the anti-Trump movement seems to be getting dumber

  15. #1710
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    Virus? Is this what losing looks like? The answers you are looking for are on this very thread, just scroll through the numbers at the top or bottom of the page. I know I wasn’t invited to answer, but I’m growing concerned. You may want to see an IT guy.

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