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  1. #1141
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    Yes, I am very critical of Frank, but those that support him and are fine with him playing a wing position are not realizing that making a move like that will probably limit most of his strengths. They are sentencing him to becoming strictly a 3-and-D player.
    I hear you - But could end up a Batum type.
    Don't worry about what people think, they don't do it very often




  2. #1142
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    Nothing wrong with doing it temporarily or for the rest of this season, but it shouldn't be the long term focus is all.
    I slightly disagree.
    Let's play GM. I'm fire Jeff and bring in a new coach. New coach comes in and says, I like Frank. Can I see his tape at PG? I plan on playing him there. How did he handle starting games, his adversity, playing against 1s for long stretches, PG Leadership? - There needs to be SOME film on it.

  3. #1143
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    Quote Originally Posted by teddygreen17 View Post
    I slightly disagree.
    Let's play GM. I'm fire Jeff and bring in a new coach. New coach comes in and says, I like Frank. Can I see his tape at PG? I plan on playing him there. How did he handle starting games, his adversity, playing against 1s for long stretches, PG Leadership? - There needs to be SOME film on it.
    Considering his age, I think they will want to see first hand especially to gauge things like improvement.

  4. #1144
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn2timer View Post
    I hear you - But could end up a Batum type.
    Not to mention Kawhii Leonard started out in a 3 and D role.

  5. #1145
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    This is even more reason for him to be a PG, considering most PnR are 1-5 or 1-4. If he's defending a wing, he'll be taken out of a lot of PnR plays.

    What have Frank's assists looked like since he moved off the ball? You're crazy if you think he'll be able to do that from a wing position without the ball in his hands.

    PGs can do both...it's not just scoring. They aren't all getting 10+ assists per game, but they are still typically the best playmakers on their teams. Oh and Frank is not a playmaker...at least not yet.

    Frank is also a player where his physical attributes are largely a reason for who he is as a player. Based on that, moving him from PG where he has an advantage to SG or SF, where he would only be average and maybe undersized, doesn't seem smart.

    Do you not see the differences between positions and how they are viewed or are they all the same to you?
    i dont see how those two correlate, Frank looks like the type that will guard the best perimeter player, theres no reason he cant guard opposing PG's even if he's not the running the point. He should be able to hide a guy like THJR or a guy like Trae Young for instance if we had them on defense.

    but again, we're talking IF he can't run PG... I think the fallback scenario for Frank is still pretty damn good.

  6. #1146
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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    i dont see how those two correlate, Frank looks like the type that will guard the best perimeter player, theres no reason he cant guard opposing PG's even if he's not the running the point. He should be able to hide a guy like THJR or a guy like Trae Young for instance if we had them on defense.

    but again, we're talking IF he can't run PG... I think the fallback scenario for Frank is still pretty damn good.
    It is because he'd basically be Tony Allen with better passing and a better jumper, which is still a damn good player to have on your team. Again he could end up a combo guard or even point forward if he grows another inch or two... time will tell. I still like Frank alot and have high hopes for him but some of this does come down to development in general and the Knicks as an organization haven't done much in the past 20 years to make me feel super comfortable about how they develop guys. KP is an anomaly cause he's like a legit star and even the Knicks ineptitude can't **** him up so much, but those players are rare.

  7. #1147
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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    i dont see how those two correlate, Frank looks like the type that will guard the best perimeter player, theres no reason he cant guard opposing PG's even if he's not the running the point. He should be able to hide a guy like THJR or a guy like Trae Young for instance if we had them on defense.

    but again, we're talking IF he can't run PG... I think the fallback scenario for Frank is still pretty damn good.
    If you pair him with Hardaway, that means he's playing PG.

    If you pair him with Trae Young, do you want Young guarding opposing wings? Also, the PG isn't the best player on every team, but the PG runs the majority of the PnRs for most teams. It's not as simple as Frank will always guard the PnR ball handler. It doesn't work that way. At PG, he will be in position to do that more times than not and think about how much PnR is run throughout the league.

  8. #1148
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    This Frank love affair some of you have is not disturbing at all, I've seen posters in love with Duhon in this forum, David Lee, Landry Fields, I can go on for days about the bums in here posters were forced to open their eyes about. For the record I've seen dozens of Franks come and go, hard workers on defense liability on offense.

    I love the fact he plays his heart out and is all effort, but you can get effort guys at the end of the 1st round. Then we get the most ridiculous comparisons like Derozan who might I add has been great on every level. An athlethic jump out the gym guy, there's no comparison.

    Another ridiculous one is Kawhi whom I might add has always been nice both ways and was no 3 point shooter early on. The problem with the comparisons is yall are comparing Frank to players who were dam good early in their basketball careers. Highschool, College, it took a little longer for their games to translate to the NBA.

    With Frank it's like he never showed the type of talent those guys have and you expect it to develop in the NBA, he's never had it. Good defender he is, difference maker he won't be. Can he help a team with his effort yes, is he the difference between winning and losing no. I find it crazy that everyone who puts on the uniform posters say they're gonna be special.

    Then I hear once his strength comes around and I hate to be the bearer of bad news that applies to talented players with skill, which Frank lacks. Derozan needed to get stronger, Curry needed to get stronger, KP needs to get stronger, guys like Frank get stronger and have the same game because they lack the skill and talent to use that strength effectively.

  9. #1149
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    If you pair him with Hardaway, that means he's playing PG.

    If you pair him with Trae Young, do you want Young guarding opposing wings? Also, the PG isn't the best player on every team, but the PG runs the majority of the PnRs for most teams. It's not as simple as Frank will always guard the PnR ball handler. It doesn't work that way. At PG, he will be in position to do that more times than not and think about how much PnR is run throughout the league.
    you're overthinking it... no player guards his position 100% of the time, but Frank could be one of those guys that gives your great flexibility on defense. We don't know who's going to be starting long term, THJR could end up a SF, SG or a 6th man...

  10. #1150
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    Quote Originally Posted by kartyea View Post
    This Frank love affair some of you have is not disturbing at all, I've seen posters in love with Duhon in this forum, David Lee, Landry Fields, I can go on for days about the bums in here posters were forced to open their eyes about. For the record I've seen dozens of Franks come and go, hard workers on defense liability on offense.

    I love the fact he plays his heart out and is all effort, but you can get effort guys at the end of the 1st round. Then we get the most ridiculous comparisons like Derozan who might I add has been great on every level. An athlethic jump out the gym guy, there's no comparison.

    Another ridiculous one is Kawhi whom I might add has always been nice both ways and was no 3 point shooter early on. The problem with the comparisons is yall are comparing Frank to players who were dam good early in their basketball careers. Highschool, College, it took a little longer for their games to translate to the NBA.

    With Frank it's like he never showed the type of talent those guys have and you expect it to develop in the NBA, he's never had it. Good defender he is, difference maker he won't be. Can he help a team with his effort yes, is he the difference between winning and losing no. I find it crazy that everyone who puts on the uniform posters say they're gonna be special.

    Then I hear once his strength comes around and I hate to be the bearer of bad news that applies to talented players with skill, which Frank lacks. Derozan needed to get stronger, Curry needed to get stronger, KP needs to get stronger, guys like Frank get stronger and have the same game because they lack the skill and talent to use that strength effectively.
    First 3 guys you name were all drafted at age 22. DeRozan was 20 when he was drafted, a year older than Frank, and averaged 8.5 PPG, 25% from 3, less than 1 assist per game.

    We get it you think Frank stinks so do a bunch of other Knicks fans but your inability to put it in any sort of relevant context doesn't help your argument.

  11. #1151
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    We all know Timmy is a SG, he is not big enough to handle SF.
    Again the question is, who fits with KP better, on BOTH ends, Trae or Frank - if Franks gets a consistent jumper (and he will learn to drive as time goes on), it's not even close to me.
    Frank's offense is a problem because Timmy is too streaky. If Timmy shot 7-12 every night (on avg) and Frank notches 8 assist with awesome p\r defense, this isn't a problem.

    We have this thing in the league now where PG has to do everything (incld rebounding). MOST players aren't Westbrook or Harden. You need a team to win. Frank is good in a TEAM environment. I 100% guarantee you, next year with improvement and if you got a consistent SG next to him in Timmy, Frank will be x3 better.

    I dont want Frank having to worry about playing multiple positions and ON D cause his teammates are trash. That's why getting Mikal is going to be important. KP - Mikal - Frank will make EVERYONE job a lot easier. - I guess what I'm saying is Frank is doing to much. Leave him at point, take bumps, defend p\r and see what you have.

  12. #1152
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    Simple question...

    Would Jerian Grant play over any of the PGs we have today... NO
    Frank is going to be a solid player for years to come. He might not ever be a super star or all star but he's a competent combo guard that will get better on offense. A blind man can even see that.
    "Isiah's about as safe as me in a room full of cookies, If I'm in a room full of cookies the cookies ain't got no chance." --- Sir Charles

  13. #1153
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    Quote Originally Posted by cheetos185 View Post
    Do you know of any player who started out playing as a wing or sg and ended up being PG later on? I don't think so this whole lets believe in FO they know what they're doing crap is nonsense stilla just adding perry to the mix doesn't increase dolan and mills IQ level.
    Based on this can you name one Point Guard who ever had a worse handle than Frank? including 19 year olds, I can't at this point.

    Maybe that is the reason he is now a wing? Just maybe he's getting eaten up in practice with his handle?

    It's getting old coming over mid court and giving it up, so glad we don't have to endure that, I mean even his first pass would be a pick 6, we have not seen that since he became a wing.

    Maybe Jeff and FO have something here?

  14. #1154
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    Based on this can you name one Point Guard who ever had a worse handle than Frank? including 19 year olds, I can't at this point.

    Maybe that is the reason he is now a wing? Just maybe he's getting eaten up in practice with his handle?

    It's getting old coming over mid court and giving it up, so glad we don't have to endure that, I mean even his first pass would be a pick 6, we have not seen that since he became a wing.

    Maybe Jeff and FO have something here?
    I mean there's this thing in basketball called a high screen... maybe Jeff never heard of it

  15. #1155
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    Based on this can you name one Point Guard who ever had a worse handle than Frank? including 19 year olds, I can't at this point.

    Maybe that is the reason he is now a wing? Just maybe he's getting eaten up in practice with his handle?

    It's getting old coming over mid court and giving it up, so glad we don't have to endure that, I mean even his first pass would be a pick 6, we have not seen that since he became a wing.

    Maybe Jeff and FO have something here?
    Your not making sense so his handle is weak you suddenly change his position? how is that development how can you be confident this idiot organization knows what the **** they're doing

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