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  1. #1126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bubba313 View Post
    Frank has not been impressing me lately. But you missed the point of his post - Frank is a PG and yet since Mudiay has gotten here he has barely had the chance to dominate the ball, which is crucial to his development.

    Regardless of of your view of his readiness to assume primary PG duties, some people (me included) believe the only way heíll get better is by having those chances not playing wing.
    Me neither, but I honestly don't expect him to at the 2. I just don't think that's his natural position at all. He's not really a scorer.

    Maybe he hit the rookie wall, but that combined with moving him to the 2... I mean he had a decent number of games early in the season with 8-11 assists when he ran point, sometimes in as little as 20-24 minutes. The guy has good court vision and he makes the right pass almost every time.

    He's got a long way to go on offense. But I genuinely think he could get there with the right guidance. Knicks just can't seem to develop anyone, it's been this way for 20+ years now (KP being the exception).

  2. #1127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bubba313 View Post
    Frank has not been impressing me lately. But you missed the point of his post - Frank is a PG and yet since Mudiay has gotten here he has barely had the chance to dominate the ball, which is crucial to his development.

    Regardless of of your view of his readiness to assume primary PG duties, some people (me included) believe the only way heíll get better is by having those chances not playing wing.
    what if playing him at PG he regresses even more? Maybe the experts know how to ease him in? Maybe this is the entire FO decision.

    We saw him get pulled when he was stumbling I would have pulled him as well, you don't just put a 19 year old in to fail, I'm sure in practice he has shown the same, and he gets his chances.

    funny how people forget about practice, you know we are talking practice lol

  3. #1128
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    A lot of yall are tripping on here. Frank is like the 2nd coming of Eddie Jones. The dude is going to become a great 2 way defensive combo guard/wing. He should be an easy 15ppg year 3 after hitting the weights.

  4. #1129
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    what if playing him at PG he regresses even more? Maybe the experts know how to ease him in? Maybe this is the entire FO decision.

    We saw him get pulled when he was stumbling I would have pulled him as well, you don't just put a 19 year old in to fail, I'm sure in practice he has shown the same, and he gets his chances.

    funny how people forget about practice, you know we are talking practice lol
    I say let him. Iíd rather give him the opportunity to become a star PG than force him into being an average 3 and D wing at the age of 19, even if thereís a chance he busts/regresses.

    And what experts? Jeff? Give me a break. We had Pop praising Frankís floor general skills I donít need anyone elseís opinion.

  5. #1130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Seats View Post
    You know this and all those scouts did not...amazing....

    I'm going to give up on him now -- no sense in expecting a 19 year old to improve!
    Every young player gets better, its no doubt about that, the question is how much better can he get. Jordan Hill got better but it wasn't good enough to keep him in the league. Chris Duhon got better and he was a bum. Nobody's saying he won't get better but by his game I can't see him getting better to the point of being a difference maker.

  6. #1131
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    Quote Originally Posted by kartyea View Post
    Every young player gets better, its no doubt about that, the question is how much better can he get. Jordan Hill got better but it wasn't good enough to keep him in the league. Chris Duhon got better and he was a bum. Nobody's saying he won't get better but by his game I can't see him getting better to the point of being a difference maker.
    Everyoneís entitled to their opinion but Jordan Hill & Duhon were both 22 when they were drafted. Huge difference.

  7. #1132
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    Quote Originally Posted by still a fan View Post
    what if playing him at PG he regresses even more? Maybe the experts know how to ease him in? Maybe this is the entire FO decision.

    We saw him get pulled when he was stumbling I would have pulled him as well, you don't just put a 19 year old in to fail, I'm sure in practice he has shown the same, and he gets his chances.

    funny how people forget about practice, you know we are talking practice lol
    Do you know of any player who started out playing as a wing or sg and ended up being PG later on? I don't think so this whole lets believe in FO they know what they're doing crap is nonsense stilla just adding perry to the mix doesn't increase dolan and mills IQ level.

  8. #1133
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    Might be a bit of a small sample size but Frank is already the best P&R defender in the league, in a league dominated by P&R

    https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/973219715463176192

    Knick fans scream for defense then we get a guy that looks like he has all defense potential and we trash him...lol.

    Who cares if he ends up a SG or even a SF? He has the length to play either of those positions, his wingspan is the same as Melo who can play PF. How many SG's or SF's can get 10 assists in a game the way Frank has already done at 19? PG's aren't play makers anymore they are scorer, it never hurts to have another play maker out there like GS does with Dray.

  9. #1134
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    Frank is one of the few guys on this team with a + net rating, and it's because of defense. If he can already have a positive impact as a 19 year old rookie despite have no offense, imagine once he gets some offense going? He's going to be a guy that makes his team better when he's on the court, period. and that's what you should want.

    DSJR might make some flashy plays but he shoots 38% and DAL is infinitely better when he's on the bench. He has a - 15.1 rating which is almost Mudiay like. Heck you know what, his rookie season numbers look damn similar to Mudiay actually. Another rookie that was just thrown out there for 30+mpg as a rookie like so many Knick fans want Jeff to do because "development".

  10. #1135
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    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    Might be a bit of a small sample size but Frank is already the best P&R defender in the league, in a league dominated by P&R

    https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/973219715463176192

    Knick fans scream for defense then we get a guy that looks like he has all defense potential and we trash him...lol.

    Who cares if he ends up a SG or even a SF? He has the length to play either of those positions, his wingspan is the same as Melo who can play PF. How many SG's or SF's can get 10 assists in a game the way Frank has already done at 19? PG's aren't play makers anymore they are scorer, it never hurts to have another play maker out there like GS does with Dray.
    This is even more reason for him to be a PG, considering most PnR are 1-5 or 1-4. If he's defending a wing, he'll be taken out of a lot of PnR plays.

    What have Frank's assists looked like since he moved off the ball? You're crazy if you think he'll be able to do that from a wing position without the ball in his hands.

    PGs can do both...it's not just scoring. They aren't all getting 10+ assists per game, but they are still typically the best playmakers on their teams. Oh and Frank is not a playmaker...at least not yet.

    Frank is also a player where his physical attributes are largely a reason for who he is as a player. Based on that, moving him from PG where he has an advantage to SG or SF, where he would only be average and maybe undersized, doesn't seem smart.

    Do you not see the differences between positions and how they are viewed or are they all the same to you?
    Last edited by smood999; 03-13-2018 at 12:35 PM.

  11. #1136
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    This is even more reason for him to be a PG, considering most PnR are 1-5 or 1-4. If he's defending a wing, he'll be taken out of a lot of PnR plays.

    What have Frank's assists looked like since he moved off the ball? You're crazy if you think he'll be able to do that from a wing position without the ball in his hands.

    PGs can do both...it's not just scoring. They aren't all getting 10+ assists per game, but they are still typically the best playmakers on their teams. Oh and Frank is not a playmaker...at least not yet.

    Frank is also a player where his physical attributes are largely a reason for who he is as a player. Based on that, moving him from PG where he has an advantage to SG or SF, where he would only be average and maybe undersized, doesn't seem smart.

    Do you not see the differences between positions and how they are viewed or are they all the same to you?
    Iím on the same page as you here. I genuinely think Frank is a PG, heís just not an explosive one and that is a weakness that heíll have to work around by being crafty, which I believe he can do as he gets better with recognizing what defenses are giving him. Itís kust going to take a bit of time and a competent coaching staff. Rambis is the new Herb Williams.

  12. #1137
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    Quote Originally Posted by teddygreen17 View Post
    I'm hoping maybe to moved Frank to SG as its a weaker position in the league and allows Frank to think less. But I am going to say this AGAIN. I would start him the rest of the season as a PG and give him 30MPG. I don't care if he gets embarrassed.
    1. He wanted to come out early
    2. His problem is not talent, it's DOG.

    He needs to figure it out. Because I bet 9/10 in this forum believe that is he does, he is the best fit next to KP, has temperament to be leader, be defensive PG which we all crave, and is someone we drafted and WANT to root for. I bet if they brought in Jackson, he's squash all this multi-position noise on Frank. It's hard to develop just PG and you want him to learn BOTH (next to a guy, Mudiay, you traded to get here to see if he could take his spot - who sucks.). Knicks need to stop being cautious and HIT on players. KP needs HELP. If Frank hits, that's one less position you have to worry about (A BIG POSITION). If you going to bring in someone to challenge Frank, stop bringing in guys like Mudiay (same level) and Burke (older) who cannot really push, grow him.

    poll: After a full offseason - will Frank be better than Mudiay and Burke?

    Frank is in a man's league. He's got to grow up NOW. We need PG answered. Do you know messing with him is also a confidence killer as well as not playing well at PG. Let the man learn!
    Definitely better than Mudiay. Outside of a couple hot quarters, Mudiay has looked like straight trash. Horrible decision maker, ugly shot, terrible defense. Unless he vastly improves over the next 2-3 years heís a 15 minute backup at best.

  13. #1138
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    Quote Originally Posted by smood999 View Post
    This is even more reason for him to be a PG, considering most PnR are 1-5 or 1-4. If he's defending a wing, he'll be taken out of a lot of PnR plays.

    What have Frank's assists looked like since he moved off the ball? You're crazy if you think he'll be able to do that from a wing position without the ball in his hands.

    PGs can do both...it's not just scoring. They aren't all getting 10+ assists per game, but they are still typically the best playmakers on their teams. Oh and Frank is not a playmaker...at least not yet.

    Frank is also a player where his physical attributes are largely a reason for who he is as a player. Based on that, moving him from PG where he has an advantage to SG or SF, where he would only be average and maybe undersized, doesn't seem smart.

    Do you not see the differences between positions and how they are viewed or are they all the same to you?
    I'm hoping maybe we moved Frank to SG as its a weaker position in the league and allows Frank to think less - temporarily. But I am going to say this AGAIN. I would start him the rest of the season as a PG and give him 30MPG. I don't care if he gets embarrassed.
    1. He wanted to come out early
    2. His problem is not talent, it's DOG.

    He needs to figure it out. Because I bet 9/10 in this forum believe that if he does, he is the best fit next to KP, has temperament to be leader, be defensive PG which we all crave, and is someone we drafted and WANT to root for. I bet if they brought in Jackson, he's squash all this multi-position noise on Frank. It's hard to develop just PG and you want him to learn BOTH (next to a guy, Mudiay, you traded to get here to see if he could take his spot - who sucks.). Knicks need to stop being cautious and HIT on players. KP needs HELP. If Frank hits, that's one less position you have to worry about (A BIG POSITION). If you going to bring in someone to challenge Frank, stop bringing in guys like Mudiay (same level) and Burke (older) who cannot really push, grow him.

    poll: After a full offseason - will Frank be better than Mudiay and Burke?

    Frank is in a man's league. He's got to grow up NOW. We need PG answered. Do you know messing with him is also a confidence killer as well as not playing well at PG. Let the man learn!
    Last edited by teddygreen17; 03-13-2018 at 12:55 PM.

  14. #1139
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    Quote Originally Posted by teddygreen17 View Post
    I'm hoping maybe we moved Frank to SG as its a weaker position in the league and allows Frank to think less - temporarily. But I am going to say this AGAIN. I would start him the rest of the season as a PG and give him 30MPG. I don't care if he gets embarrassed.
    1. He wanted to come out early
    2. His problem is not talent, it's DOG.

    He needs to figure it out. Because I bet 9/10 in this forum believe that if he does, he is the best fit next to KP, has temperament to be leader, be defensive PG which we all crave, and is someone we drafted and WANT to root for. I bet if they brought in Jackson, he's squash all this multi-position noise on Frank. It's hard to develop just PG and you want him to learn BOTH (next to a guy, Mudiay, you traded to get here to see if he could take his spot - who sucks.). Knicks need to stop being cautious and HIT on players. KP needs HELP. If Frank hits, that's one less position you have to worry about (A BIG POSITION). If you going to bring in someone to challenge Frank, stop bringing in guys like Mudiay (same level) and Burke (older) who cannot really push, grow him.

    poll: After a full offseason - will Frank be better than Mudiay and Burke?

    Frank is in a man's league. He's got to grow up NOW. We need PG answered. Do you know messing with him is also a confidence killer as well as not playing well at PG. Let the man learn!
    Nothing wrong with doing it temporarily or for the rest of this season, but it shouldn't be the long term focus is all.

  15. #1140
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeartOfStarks View Post
    Iím on the same page as you here. I genuinely think Frank is a PG, heís just not an explosive one and that is a weakness that heíll have to work around by being crafty, which I believe he can do as he gets better with recognizing what defenses are giving him. Itís kust going to take a bit of time and a competent coaching staff. Rambis is the new Herb Williams.
    Yes, I am very critical of Frank, but those that support him and are fine with him playing a wing position are not realizing that making a move like that will probably limit most of his strengths. They are sentencing him to becoming strictly a 3-and-D player.

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