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  1. #721
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    Quote Originally Posted by mgjohnson7851 View Post
    Yeah and he also sat for almost an entire quarter because his team was blowing the Bengals out.

    And you could not be more wrong. The Bengals have the 8th best pass defense in the NFL... The Giants are 31st.
    Pretty obvious that the Bengals defense has quit.

  2. #722
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    Quote Originally Posted by mgjohnson7851 View Post
    Yeah and he also sat for almost an entire quarter because his team was blowing the Bengals out.

    And you could not be more wrong. The Bengals have the 8th best pass defense in the NFL... The Giants are 31st.
    Dre Kirkpatrick was out, Adam Jones was out, Iloka left early, Burfict was out.

    So go ahead and say it's the same 8th ranked pass defense... They gave up 33 to the Bears the week prior.

    He threw one of his TDs in the 4th...
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack of Blades View Post
    I don't consider Brand New indie. I consider them ****ing awesome and don't belong to a genre.

  3. #723
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    Quote Originally Posted by koldjerky View Post
    Dre Kirkpatrick was out, Adam Jones was out, Iloka left early, Burfict was out.

    So go ahead and say it's the same 8th ranked pass defense... They gave up 33 to the Bears the week prior.

    He threw one of his TDs in the 4th...
    It’s what happens when you evaluate strictly off numbers.

  4. #724
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    Quote Originally Posted by QB_Eagles View Post
    Pretty obvious that the Bengals defense has quit.
    Same with the Giants lol

  5. #725
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    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    Here's what you can do mgj, tell the class why Foles isn't capable. I'm curious to hear. All signs over the last 2 seasons that he's played (Philly and KC) as well as his previous time in Philly suggest that he is capable.

    If you would like to consider his time in STL to determine who he is, under known QB killer Jeff Fisher, go right ahead. Not one person, myself included, has said Foles is as good as Wentz (although comparing their career beginning 29 games or whatever) is quite scarily similar. What Foles CAN do is move the offense. He doesn't run like Wentz, but can still move enough. He limits turnovers (7tds and 0int in the last 2 seasons of spot duty), he is comfortable with the system and coaching, and he's led a team to the postseason before.

    Again, so I'm not misunderstood. Foles is quite capable enough to help us win games, unlike Wentz, he won't likely win any on his own accord though, but he won't be the sole reason we lose games either.
    Yes let's just ignore the rest of his career and shrug it off as playing for a "Known QB killer". Instead let's use a two game sample size. Good grief man. I'm sure it must be nice living in your fantasy world.

    Let's ignore what Osweiler did in Houston under known quarterback killer Bill O'Brien then. Is Osweiler a capable starter in your mind?

  6. #726
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    Quote Originally Posted by mgjohnson7851 View Post
    Yes let's just ignore the rest of his career and shrug it off as playing for a "Known QB killer". Instead let's use a two game sample size. Good grief man. I'm sure it must be nice living in your fantasy world.
    Aren't you the one ignoring the rest of Foles' career?
    Last edited by QB_Eagles; 12-21-2017 at 05:11 AM.

  7. #727
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    Quote Originally Posted by mgjohnson7851 View Post
    Same with the Giants lol
    Did they quit before or after week 6?

  8. #728
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    Quote Originally Posted by mgjohnson7851 View Post
    Same with the Giants lol
    Apparently the Eagles D as well these past few weeks.

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

  9. #729
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    Quote Originally Posted by goingfor28 View Post
    Apparently the Eagles D as well these past few weeks.
    That's too small a sample size to draw that conclusion.

  10. #730
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    Quote Originally Posted by mgjohnson7851 View Post
    Yes let's just ignore the rest of his career and shrug it off as playing for a "Known QB killer". Instead let's use a two game sample size. Good grief man. I'm sure it must be nice living in your fantasy world.

    Let's ignore what Osweiler did in Houston under known quarterback killer Bill O'Brien then. Is Osweiler a capable starter in your mind?
    You’re the one ignoring the rest of his career.

  11. #731
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    So when was Brock ever good? He wasn't even that good in Denver before Houston.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jack of Blades View Post
    I don't consider Brand New indie. I consider them ****ing awesome and don't belong to a genre.

  12. #732
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    Still waiting for updates.

    The ONLY hashtag that even matters now...
    #SBCHAMPS


    #15Points, #Steamrolled, #NotEvenCapable, #SeasonsOver, #WellDeserved, #YouWon’tBeatATL, #YouWon’tBeatMIN, #YouWon’tBeatNE, #Blowout, #Classless, #Trash, #7YearsAway, #Can’tRun, #Overrated, #BulletinBoard, #StoryTime, #Underdogs, #Snoozefest, #LeakedParade, #NotInTheSameUniverse
    #FreeGreenMonster

  13. #733
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    Quote Originally Posted by BDawk4Prez View Post
    Still waiting for updates.
    Nah, you just caught me in the middle of brainstorming. I was looking for a way to weed out pure system QB's -- ie QB's that are more of a synthetic creation of a playcaller in the booth, or an offensive-minded HC. The Jared Goff/Case Keenum situation reeks of this.

    I'm aware that a brilliant GM can affect player performance as well... as could myriad of factors. But I had to start somewhere. Goff and Keenum were bottom-of-the-league bad last year. But if you look at the basic box stats from this year, their top performers. The hell happened here? The Rams got rid of Fisher/Boras, brought in McVay/LaFluer and now Goff is Kurt Warner. The Vikings hire some guy named Pat Shurmur last year, and now it doesn't matter who plays QB's Bradford/Keenum/Bridgewater whoever, their going to have one of the best TD/INT ratio's in the league.

    I could go into a lot more, but I'm exhausted tonight, let me get straight to my point. As boring as Jared Goff is to watch, I watch some video from last year. Goff is a check down passer. His Air Yards% was below .50 last year, it's low .50's this year. What McVay and co. have manage to do is what almost all the system QB coordinators attempt to do for their QB, more screens, check downs -- essentially turning Gurley into Le'Veon; more rub, swing, pick routes, blah blah. I'm convinced it's the system more than the QB. Give Mannion a few games, he'll probably be in the pro bowl too. The competition committee has pretty much curtailed defensive backs ability to play man coverage. Coach Belichick, who doesn't get enough credit for his offensive genius, perfected these schemes and concepts awhile ago. Yes, Tom Brady is a system QB. Although he's had the privilege of playing in that system so long he could likely call all the plays himself.

    Anyway, I haven't done any correlations but I'd imagine one way to identify a system QB (ie a QB benefiting more from a coaching scheme than pure skill) is to look at Air yards%, typically the further downfield the QB is throwing, the more difficult. A system QB would be more prone to short passes that may disguise his vertical passing deficiencies. Here is my revised list that factors in Air Yards percentage.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...nt0Ltb/pubhtml

  14. #734
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lionel20 View Post
    Nah, you just caught me in the middle of brainstorming. I was looking for a way to weed out pure system QB's -- ie QB's that are more of a synthetic creation of a playcaller in the booth, or an offensive-minded HC. The Jared Goff/Case Keenum situation reeks of this.

    I'm aware that a brilliant GM can affect player performance as well... as could myriad of factors. But I had to start somewhere. Goff and Keenum were bottom-of-the-league bad last year. But if you look at the basic box stats from this year, their top performers. The hell happened here? The Rams got rid of Fisher/Boras, brought in McVay/LaFluer and now Goff is Kurt Warner. The Vikings hire some guy named Pat Shurmur last year, and now it doesn't matter who plays QB's Bradford/Keenum/Bridgewater whoever, their going to have one of the best TD/INT ratio's in the league.

    I could go into a lot more, but I'm exhausted tonight, let me get straight to my point. As boring as Jared Goff is to watch, I watch some video from last year. Goff is a check down passer. His Air Yards% was below .50 last year, it's low .50's this year. What McVay and co. have manage to do is what almost all the system QB coordinators attempt to do for their QB, more screens, check downs -- essentially turning Gurley into Le'Veon; more rub, swing, pick routes, blah blah. I'm convinced it's the system more than the QB. Give Mannion a few games, he'll probably be in the pro bowl too. The competition committee has pretty much curtailed defensive backs ability to play man coverage. Coach Belichick, who doesn't get enough credit for his offensive genius, perfected these schemes and concepts awhile ago. Yes, Tom Brady is a system QB. Although he's had the privilege of playing in that system so long he could likely call all the plays himself.

    Anyway, I haven't done any correlations but I'd imagine one way to identify a system QB (ie a QB benefiting more from a coaching scheme than pure skill) is to look at Air yards%, typically the further downfield the QB is throwing, the more difficult. A system QB would be more prone to short passes that may disguise his vertical passing deficiencies. Here is my revised list that factors in Air Yards percentage.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...nt0Ltb/pubhtml
    tldr -

    Dak sucks so I have to adjust my stat more so he's not below players like Goff and keenum.
    Quote Originally Posted by NormSizedMidget View Post
    It's different now than it was.

    When he won the second one, Giants fans are here we're outside of their minds.
    That quote always cracks me up.

  15. #735
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lionel20 View Post
    Nah, you just caught me in the middle of brainstorming. I was looking for a way to weed out pure system QB's -- ie QB's that are more of a synthetic creation of a playcaller in the booth, or an offensive-minded HC. The Jared Goff/Case Keenum situation reeks of this.

    I'm aware that a brilliant GM can affect player performance as well... as could myriad of factors. But I had to start somewhere. Goff and Keenum were bottom-of-the-league bad last year. But if you look at the basic box stats from this year, their top performers. The hell happened here? The Rams got rid of Fisher/Boras, brought in McVay/LaFluer and now Goff is Kurt Warner. The Vikings hire some guy named Pat Shurmur last year, and now it doesn't matter who plays QB's Bradford/Keenum/Bridgewater whoever, their going to have one of the best TD/INT ratio's in the league.

    I could go into a lot more, but I'm exhausted tonight, let me get straight to my point. As boring as Jared Goff is to watch, I watch some video from last year. Goff is a check down passer. His Air Yards% was below .50 last year, it's low .50's this year. What McVay and co. have manage to do is what almost all the system QB coordinators attempt to do for their QB, more screens, check downs -- essentially turning Gurley into Le'Veon; more rub, swing, pick routes, blah blah. I'm convinced it's the system more than the QB. Give Mannion a few games, he'll probably be in the pro bowl too. The competition committee has pretty much curtailed defensive backs ability to play man coverage. Coach Belichick, who doesn't get enough credit for his offensive genius, perfected these schemes and concepts awhile ago. Yes, Tom Brady is a system QB. Although he's had the privilege of playing in that system so long he could likely call all the plays himself.

    Anyway, I haven't done any correlations but I'd imagine one way to identify a system QB (ie a QB benefiting more from a coaching scheme than pure skill) is to look at Air yards%, typically the further downfield the QB is throwing, the more difficult. A system QB would be more prone to short passes that may disguise his vertical passing deficiencies. Here is my revised list that factors in Air Yards percentage.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...nt0Ltb/pubhtml
    last year - "it doesn't matter if a QB has one of the best olines, RBs, and witten and dez, his stats say he's good"

    this year - "well having a good coordinator and system can make your stats look far better than they really are"

    /facepalm
    Quote Originally Posted by NormSizedMidget View Post
    It's different now than it was.

    When he won the second one, Giants fans are here we're outside of their minds.
    That quote always cracks me up.

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