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  1. #3106
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    Quote Originally Posted by BUCK WILD!! View Post
    I do like Holiday and Redick as some nice trade gets, however I would try to make it happen without BroLo included. I still feel we should only trade BroLo in a package if we get a Beal, Booker, Lillard or Davis. This trade of Holiday and Redick would fix one problem but introduce another.
    I mean, I'm not going that far. We aren't getting Beal, Booker, Lillard or Davis. Davis is staying in LA. No reason for the Suns to deal Booker, and if they did, the Bucks have nowhere near the assets for him. Same for lillard. He is Portland, they'd trade McCollum before Lillard for sure. Beal is maybe available, but if he is, we don't have near enough to get him. We have virtually no picks or young talent.

    Brolo is far from untouchable. If it takes him to get holiday, I'd do it for sure. Im just saying I dont know that NO would value him super highly, so letting them keep JJ and us keep Brolo might work. If not, Brolo is movable to get a higher level guy. Holiday could be that guy.

  2. #3107
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    I mean, I'm not going that far. We aren't getting Beal, Booker, Lillard or Davis. Davis is staying in LA. No reason for the Suns to deal Booker, and if they did, the Bucks have nowhere near the assets for him. Same for lillard. He is Portland, they'd trade McCollum before Lillard for sure. Beal is maybe available, but if he is, we don't have near enough to get him. We have virtually no picks or young talent.

    Brolo is far from untouchable. If it takes him to get holiday, I'd do it for sure. Im just saying I dont know that NO would value him super highly, so letting them keep JJ and us keep Brolo might work. If not, Brolo is movable to get a higher level guy. Holiday could be that guy.
    DRose..what is the obsession with him? Good dude but I am not giving up much to get him. Jrue Holiday is an upgrade but trading Bled and BroLo for him isn't great. The Bucks do need to diversify this team. There are too many specialists. This team needs guys who can get their own not just dependent on GA to get them shots. Especially in playoffs when Giannis' outside shot still isn't near reliable. This team needs a Lou Williams type. Dame would be an ideal guy but obviously doubt he is available. But this team is too Giannis-dependent. Need some difference makers. Drafting young talent has been an issue and would been nice not to crap bed in draft nearly every year. I think Kira Lewis could be a stud. I would try and get him move up in draft. Danillo Galinari might be cheap option for ring chase for MLE

  3. #3108
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    In the Miami series, brook was 2nd on the team in minutes per game (ahead of giannis, but only because of the injury). He was our 3rd leading scorer per game. He had the best net rating of anyone on our team and had the 3rd highest average game score. By all accounts, brook was our 3rd best player behind giannis and Midds. I get he's not a perfect playoff fit against all teams, but he's far from unplayable.

    To me, I'd rather have him than Redick if the cost is similar. I really like Jrue, so if brook has to be part of the deal to get him, then so be it, but I'm not neccesarily actively shopping brook to the highest bidder.

    To me, keeping brook and bringing back Wes for a cheapish deal is better than getting Redick and trying to find a center for a similar deal to Wes.
    I'd prefer to keep Brook as well, but highly doubt that the Pelicans really want Bledsoe. I'm also not sure that I'd be willing to give up Bledsoe, DD and pick 24 and more, for just Jrue Holiday.

    If we could get Jrue for Bledsoe, Ersan and DD, that's fine, we still have pick 24 for other upgrades.

    If we can get Holiday for Bledsoe, Rolo, DJ and pick, that's fine cause we still have DD.

    I suspect the Pelicans will want Brook instead of Bledsoe or else both the pick and DD.

    If we give up both the pick and DD, that's all our trade chips and we are done except for FA unless we're really shopping Middleton.
    Last edited by HacksawButch; 10-14-2020 at 02:38 PM.

  4. #3109
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    So i posted earlier about the Clippers interest in Bledsoe, with a proposed Lou Williams, Shamet and Mcgruder deal. Many of you have been wanting Lou Williams for a couple years now. After looking at Lou's stat's, especially his post season stat's, I have no interest in him any more. Regular season 18.7 PPG on .416/.363/.863. Post season 12.7 PPG .425/.235/.811. Bledsoe shot .388/.250/.808 in this past post season, but at least he plays defense.

    With that being said, if we trade Brolo, Ersan, DJ and pick 24 for Holiday, We could trade Bledsoe even up for Patrick Beverly, who plays the same defense as Bledsoe but shoots the 3 ball much better. Clippers are looking for someone who can pass the ball and create assists, which Bledsoe can do along with defense.

  5. #3110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tg11 View Post
    Milwaukee Bucks receive: Derrick Rose
    Detroit Pistons receive: Eric Bledsoe, #24 pick, Ersan Ilyasova and DD


    New Bucks starting 5

    PG- D Rose
    SG- Middleton
    SF- Connaughton
    PF- Giannis
    C- Brook Lopez

    Pair up D Rose in Milwaukee with Middleton and Giannis
    I like Rose but this is too much going out for him

  6. #3111
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    No chance. Thats an awful deal. Bledsoe has struggled in the playoffs, but he was first team all defense last year and third team this year. He alone for rose probabky isn't a good deal, yet you're also giving up DD and the pick. Rose is older and just as bad of outside shooter as Bledsoe. He's provides a little more self creation on offense, but less on defense. No chance.
    I agree! It's too much given up for Rose

  7. #3112
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    I mean, I'm not going that far. We aren't getting Beal, Booker, Lillard or Davis. Davis is staying in LA. No reason for the Suns to deal Booker, and if they did, the Bucks have nowhere near the assets for him. Same for lillard. He is Portland, they'd trade McCollum before Lillard for sure. Beal is maybe available, but if he is, we don't have near enough to get him. We have virtually no picks or young talent.

    Brolo is far from untouchable. If it takes him to get holiday, I'd do it for sure. Im just saying I dont know that NO would value him super highly, so letting them keep JJ and us keep Brolo might work. If not, Brolo is movable to get a higher level guy. Holiday could be that guy.
    Yea I know we want be getting the guys I named although there maybe hope for Beal.

    I just named these guys because these are the caliber players are worth adding BroLo in a package for. I wouldn't do it in a Holiday trade because Holiday is not on those guys level. I like him but he gets the Middleton syndrome at times. Basically not playing at a high level on a consistent basis. However would be an upgrade over Bledsoe

  8. #3113
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    Quote Originally Posted by gopackgo87 View Post
    DRose..what is the obsession with him? Good dude but I am not giving up much to get him. Jrue Holiday is an upgrade but trading Bled and BroLo for him isn't great. The Bucks do need to diversify this team. There are too many specialists. This team needs guys who can get their own not just dependent on GA to get them shots. Especially in playoffs when Giannis' outside shot still isn't near reliable. This team needs a Lou Williams type. Dame would be an ideal guy but obviously doubt he is available. But this team is too Giannis-dependent. Need some difference makers. Drafting young talent has been an issue and would been nice not to crap bed in draft nearly every year. I think Kira Lewis could be a stud. I would try and get him move up in draft. Danillo Galinari might be cheap option for ring chase for MLE
    I agree about not adding BroLo! However Rose is the type of players we need on the team and he is fairly cheap 7mil. Although he want be savior alone. And Lou Williams for years I thought would be great for this team. He is a bucket getter and decent contract too!

    I like Lewis too! Along with Bane he has size and range. If we can't get top level talent we would need multiple cheap bucket getters to cause a serious threat in the playoffs. If Teams want to gang up on Giannis they would get killed from other threats. This is how Miami used Butler and kept advancing in the playoffs

  9. #3114
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    Quote Originally Posted by HacksawButch View Post
    I'd prefer to keep Brook as well, but highly doubt that the Pelicans really want Bledsoe. I'm also not sure that I'd be willing to give up Bledsoe, DD and pick 24 and more, for just Jrue Holiday.

    If we could get Jrue for Bledsoe, Ersan and DD, that's fine, we still have pick 24 for other upgrades.

    If we can get Holiday for Bledsoe, Rolo, DJ and pick, that's fine cause we still have DD.

    I suspect the Pelicans will want Brook instead of Bledsoe or else both the pick and DD.

    If we give up both the pick and DD, that's all our trade chips and we are done except for FA unless we're really shopping Middleton.
    It would be nice to get Holiday without given up our 1st and/or BroLo

  10. #3115
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    Im not entirely sold on keeping brook, but I would at least try this trade with us keeping brook and not getting Redick back. I'm just not a huge Redick fan. He's a great regular season guy, but he gets exposed in the playoffs a ton. Good teams will just run pick and rolls until he gets switched onto a bad matchup.
    I don't doubt that JJ is a negative on the defensive end, but he might be the best option available to eliminate the wall against Giannis on the other end. Did you see the Bucks/Pelicans game in the bubble? Probably not since it was a day game, but luckily you have me here to break it down for you.

    No Bledsoe or Connaughton, out with Covid, no Zion either. Bucks were flat in 1st half and down by double figures. We start playing Bucks basketball with Giannis being Giannis in the 3rd qtr and cut the lead to 2. Enter JJ Redick. He flys around the court coming off of screens, catch's the ball on the wing, jumps side ways off 1 foot leaning to the right and fires up an off balance 3 ball. If any Buck shoots that shot it doesn't come within 2 feet of the rim, but it goes through the basket like a Middleton FT and we're down 5. Bucks turn it over and JJ hits another off balance 3 while flying to the right and we're down 8. Giannis gets a slam, back to 6. Everybody watching JJ run around screens and someone loses Ingram for a lay up, then they get a back door slam after another Bucks basket, still down 8. We miss a corner 3 and JJ goes around a screen at top of the key. Hill fights through it to contest and he misses, but Hill runs into him, so we're down 11 after the FT's. 3 minutes later with 2 more JJ 3's and we're down 15. Game over in the 3rd qtr. JJ averaged 14.9 PPG on .450/.452/.902 shooting, hitting 156 3's in 54 games, so 3 makes per game. As a 45% 3 point shooter, when he enters the game, he's the number 1 option. His 3 point shooting only translates to a true shooting percentage of .678, which doesn't include when he gets fouled shooting a 3 which has a 1.353 true shooting percentage.

    He hasn't gotten to play in Bud's let it fly offense, which might become Let JJ let it fly offense. If he ups his attempts from less than 7 to say 12, he could make 5 per game. Everyone might forget Giannis is on the court.
    Last edited by HacksawButch; 10-15-2020 at 08:39 AM.

  11. #3116
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    There's no chance you get holiday without giving up the first and/or lopez. The pelicans don't need to trade him. He's still a good fit on that roster and by all accounts, he's not unhappy and requesting a trade. So you have to make them want it. You start with Bledsoe cuz you need salary to match and Bledsoe can do similar things. If they time it properly, you can add ersan before his contract guarantees, which adds cap space. But those two things aren't enough to get him. You need legit assets. For all intents and purposes, especially for a young team like NO, DD and the pick are the only assets. And unfortunately for us, pick 24 isn't overly valuable, so you probably need to add both.

    To me, holiday is worth that for sure. He provides the same level of defense as Bled. Bled has had some defensive accolades, but my most accounts around the league, Jrue is just as good. And jrue is better offensively, especially compared to the version of Bledsoe that shows up in the playoffs. Jrue shoots it better and more consistently and he can get his own look fairly well. He's the guy we can realistically get that we need to go after.

    I've liked Lou Williams types alot, but we've gone too far with him though. Those types of guys should be your 4th or 5th best player at most. Lou in particular is a great example. He's a microwave that can get super hot at any second. But he's also a defensive liability and isn't super consistent on offense. So maybe there's more deals to be made, but if our offseason is basically swapping Bledsoe for Lou and some bench guys plus whoever we draft at 24, I'm going to be disappointed.
    Last edited by crewfan13; 10-15-2020 at 09:02 AM.

  12. #3117
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    Quote Originally Posted by HacksawButch View Post
    I don't doubt that JJ is a negative on the defensive end, but he might be the best option available to eliminate the wall against Giannis on the other end. Did you see the Bucks/Pelicans game in the bubble? Probably not since it was a day game, but luckily you have me here to break it down for you.

    No Bledsoe or Connaughton, out with Covid, no Zion either. Bucks were flat in 1st half and down by double figures. We start playing Bucks basketball with Giannis being Giannis in the 3rd qtr and cut the lead to 2. Enter JJ Redick. He flys around the court coming off of screens, catch's the ball on the wing, jumps side ways off 1 foot leaning to the right and fires up an off balance 3 ball. If any Buck shoots that shot it doesn't come within 2 feet of the rim, but it goes through the basket like a Middleton FT and we're down 5. Bucks turn it over and JJ hits another off balance 3 while flying to the right and we're down 8. Giannis gets a slam, back to 6. Everybody watching JJ run around screens and someone loses Ingram for a lay up, then they get a back door slam after another Bucks basket, still down 8. We miss a corner 3 and JJ goes around a screen at top of the key. Hill fights through it to contest and he misses, but Hill runs into him, so we're down 11 after the FT's. 3 minutes later with 2 more JJ 3's and we're down 15. Game over in the 3rd qtr. JJ averaged 14.9 PPG on .450/.452/.902 shooting, hitting 156 3's in 54 games, so 3 makes per game. As a 45% 3 point shooter, when he enters the game, he's the number 1 option. His 3 point shooting only translates to a true shooting percentage of .678, which doesn't include when he gets fouled shooting a 3 which has a 1.353 true shooting percentage.

    He hasn't gotten to play in Bud's let it fly offense, which might become Let JJ let it fly offense. If he ups his attempts from less than 7 to say 12, he could make 5 per game. Everyone might forget Giannis is on the court.
    This is what u call entertainment!!

  13. #3118
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    So it sounds like we are all in for Bogdan Bogdanovic, who is a restricted free agent. Obviously the MLE isn't enough, so you have to do a sign and trade. My question is what kind of contract you need per year for him to be interested? Is Bledsoe money enough or is it $20 Mill per year or even more? I understand they probably aren't interested in Bledsoe, so we need a 3rd team that likes Bled and need to add sweeteners like DD or the pick.

    So what do you think Bogdan commands? 15 Mil, 17.5, 20, 23...

    I like the fit, but we'll need to fill out the roster and replace Bledsoe.

  14. #3119
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    There's no chance you get holiday without giving up the first and/or lopez. The pelicans don't need to trade him. He's still a good fit on that roster and by all accounts, he's not unhappy and requesting a trade. So you have to make them want it. You start with Bledsoe cuz you need salary to match and Bledsoe can do similar things. If they time it properly, you can add ersan before his contract guarantees, which adds cap space. But those two things aren't enough to get him. You need legit assets. For all intents and purposes, especially for a young team like NO, DD and the pick are the only assets. And unfortunately for us, pick 24 isn't overly valuable, so you probably need to add both.

    To me, holiday is worth that for sure. He provides the same level of defense as Bled. Bled has had some defensive accolades, but my most accounts around the league, Jrue is just as good. And jrue is better offensively, especially compared to the version of Bledsoe that shows up in the playoffs. Jrue shoots it better and more consistently and he can get his own look fairly well. He's the guy we can realistically get that we need to go after.

    I've liked Lou Williams types alot, but we've gone too far with him though. Those types of guys should be your 4th or 5th best player at most. Lou in particular is a great example. He's a microwave that can get super hot at any second. But he's also a defensive liability and isn't super consistent on offense. So maybe there's more deals to be made, but if our offseason is basically swapping Bledsoe for Lou and some bench guys plus whoever we draft at 24, I'm going to be disappointed.
    I agree that a trade to get Holiday would need our 1st or/and BroLo. However it would be nice if we can pull it off without including neither.
    I just think by given up BroLo in a deal to get Holiday would cripple our size advantage against certain teams. See I think we as Bucks fans are so fixated on the Miami series and disregard the big squads. And we all know the Lakers out sized the Heat. I can just see it if we include BroLo in a trade for Holiday then get into the playoffs and then we would face the 76ers, Raptors and get eliminated from the playoffs again due to lack of size this time around. So this why would have to get it right in other to be ready for any battle.

  15. #3120
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    I like bogdanovic but like you said, it's not goign to be easy to get done. Sac probably still wants him and we dont really have a great fit to deal them. I've thought buddy heild makes more sense because they seem more motivated to deal him, but perhaps we can snag bogdanovic. He'd be a nice get, but I'm not sure why Sac would want to move on from him, unless they don't think he's worthy of the deal he might get.

    But if we get him, I can definitely see us move hill into the starting lineup. For the playoffs, he was playing alot of crunch time minutes lately anyway, so it would make sense for him to take that role. Maybe we can use a chunk of the MLE to grab a guy like DJ Augustin as well.

    If we were to get him I think logically it makes some sense that the deal would be similar to a holiday proposed deal with bled, mayn Ers, DD and a pick.

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