Like us on Facebook


Follow us on Twitter





Page 3 of 34 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 502
  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    28,889
    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    That's really what it all boils down to. Atheists believe science applies to all that is real. Theists believe that too, with one notable exception.
    Well of course, if science were to apply to that noticeable exception, well than that notable exception wouldn't be so notable, now would it.

    I get what ur saying. What ur saying just carries zero weight.
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    6,505
    I have yet to see a logical argument to justify believing in any of the world.

    If someone wants to believe in a God concept since there is alot we don't know then great. Nothing wrong with that. However when people pretend to know details about God and how God wants us to love our lives then I simply can't take you seriously anymore.

    Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    13,924
    Quote Originally Posted by macc View Post
    I have yet to see a logical argument to justify believing in any of the world.

    If someone wants to believe in a God concept since there is alot we don't know then great. Nothing wrong with that. However when people pretend to know details about God and how God wants us to love our lives then I simply can't take you seriously anymore.

    Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk
    This is the problem with the gods are outside of science problem.

    If a god can't be detected by science, fine. But if someone claims to know something about a god then THAT can be tested by science. None of those tests point to any god.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    28,889
    Quote Originally Posted by filihok View Post
    This is the problem with the gods are outside of science problem.

    If a god can't be detected by science, fine. But if someone claims to know something about a god then THAT can be tested by science. None of those tests point to any god.
    What does this mean?

    How would a test point to a god?
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    6,505
    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    What does this mean?

    How would a test point to a god?
    The same way we test anything. Through observation, testing, seeing a pattern... something.

    This is where you say "well God is outside our natural world"

    Which ultimately is just a scape goat answer because there is no basis at all to believe that. Except stories. Stories are not validation.

    Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    28,889
    Quote Originally Posted by macc View Post
    The same way we test anything. Through observation, testing, seeing a pattern... something.

    This is where you say "well God is outside our natural world"

    Which ultimately is just a scape goat answer because there is no basis at all to believe that. Except stories. Stories are not validation.

    Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk
    What's an example of how a test would point to God?
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    East of the Sun, West of the Moon
    Posts
    29,868
    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    What's an example of how a test would point to God?
    How about someone repeatibly raising people from the dead regardless of how they perished after saying a prayer for them?

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    28,889
    Quote Originally Posted by Dugmet View Post
    How about someone repeatibly raising people from the dead regardless of how they perished after saying a prayer for them?
    So basically if we observe something which we cannot explain through natural means?
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    28,889
    Apparently Jesus done did that, btw
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    13,924
    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    So basically if we observe something which we cannot explain through natural means?
    No. That's simply the god of the gaps.

    Again, if gods lay outside of our ability to EVER be able to test for them how can anyone claim to know of their existence or what they reward or punish?

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    6,505
    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    What's an example of how a test would point to God?
    Well that is a tough question. Even within the confines of religion God is not defined. So when something is not defined it's impossible to give you an accurate answer to your question.

    So we are left to figure these things out using the senses we have. Perhaps we are very limited with our few senses and perhaps there is alot going on around us we are oblivious to. But that's all speculation.

    So all we can do is use the tools we have and not believe things until there is a reason to believe them.

    If the tools we use are limited then I wouldn't know any better which still doesn't justify the belief in these religion based God's.



    Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk

  12. #42
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    28,889
    Quote Originally Posted by filihok View Post
    No. That's simply the god of the gaps.

    Again, if gods lay outside of our ability to EVER be able to test for them how can anyone claim to know of their existence or what they reward or punish?
    I understand that's simply God of the gaps, if you break down what he's saying is that not his argument? That was basically my point right there.

    Well I can claim to know of a gods existence because I know that there must be a supernatural element to our universe because according to the laws of nature, natural law cannot self create.

    I put the I's in bold because I understand that for whatever reason, this reality doesn't seem to apply to everyone. I can't explain to you why that is, I just know that from talking about this earlier, this is somehow or another not a reality in some people's lives. But either way, it's my answer, it's a major part of why I think what I think.

    Some of us feel that while God may kinda above and beyond human capability, we still feel a connection with him, we still feel in tune with him, we believe some people who brought us these books are very knowledgable and have an AMAZIGLY strong connection with our maker and so we follow in their footsteps, and follow their books and traditions etc. Just the same way if you love beer and a brewmaster shows you how to brew it you listen to what they say and see what works for you and what doesn't, this is basically many peoples approach with their religion, it helps us create that personal connection with God. It helps us understand.
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    28,889
    Quote Originally Posted by macc View Post
    Well that is a tough question. Even within the confines of religion God is not defined. So when something is not defined it's impossible to give you an accurate answer to your question.

    So we are left to figure these things out using the senses we have. Perhaps we are very limited with our few senses and perhaps there is alot going on around us we are oblivious to. But that's all speculation.

    So all we can do is use the tools we have and not believe things until there is a reason to believe them.

    If the tools we use are limited then I wouldn't know any better which still doesn't justify the belief in these religion based God's.



    Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk
    God IS defined (somewhat universally), unfortunately for the scientists mind this definition places it outside of science. So this is where our divide begins...

    It's funny reading your post cuz I agree with a lot that you're saying, it's just our conclusions are obviously very opposite.
    RAIDERS, SHARKS, WARRIORS

    "i don't believe in mysteries but still i pray for my sister, when speaking to the higher power that listens, to the lifeless vision of freedom everytime we're imprisoned, to the righteous victims of people of a higher position" - planet asia, old timer thoughts

    "God is Universal he is the Ruler Universal" - gangstarr (rip guru), robbin hood theory

    "don't gain the world and lose your soul, wisdom is better than silver and gold" - bob marley, zion train

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    13,924
    Quote Originally Posted by nastynice View Post
    I understand that's simply God of the gaps, if you break down what he's saying is that not his argument? That was basically my point right there.

    Well I can claim to know of a gods existence because I know that there must be a supernatural element to our universe because according to the laws of nature, natural law cannot self create.
    So, god of the gaps.

    Some of us feel that while God may kinda above and beyond human capability, we still feel a connection with him, we still feel in tune with him, we believe some people who brought us these books are very knowledgable and have an AMAZIGLY strong connection with our maker and so we follow in their footsteps, and follow their books and traditions etc. Just the same way if you love beer and a brewmaster shows you how to brew it you listen to what they say and see what works for you and what doesn't, this is basically many peoples approach with their religion, it helps us create that personal connection with God. It helps us understand.
    Some people believe they have amazingly strong connections with characters from TV series.
    I believe those people are delusional.

    There's no evidence that these people with connections to gods know more about the universe than anyone else. If they did, that would be evidence, but FAR from proof, of the existence of gods

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Washington
    Posts
    30,515

    What Science Can't Do

    It has always seemed strange to me that people have trouble grasping the creation of the universe and their answer is to say God created it as if you don't run into the same problem of creation with God.

    If it's easy for you to grasp God being immortal or infinite, why can't you grasp that principle for the universe itself?

Page 3 of 34 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •