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  1. #4621
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    Iíve never voted for a Republican. But I have voted for independents. The GOP platform has entirely unreconcilable planks to me that even the most moderate Republican wonít cut it for me.
    Not even once?

  2. #4622
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Not even once?
    Well Iíve only been voting since 2008. And no, I have not. They havenít offered anything that I think warrants my vote. Like I said, Iíve voted for independents but they were folks I felt were properly distanced from the GOP positions I find repugnant.

  3. #4623
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Iím aware of what you wrote, Iím asking if you think there is a candidate who has significant support from both sides.

    For someone who decried partisanship, you act very partisan.
    I'm advocating for more momentum particularly because candidates are very afraid of going the independent route precisely because of the dominant two-party system. It's career suicide which is why Andrew Yang largely never touched it considering he would be scapegoated as stealing votes from Democrats that would hurt their chances in the general election. The sentiment right now is that if you're an independent, it's likely career suicide and even if it isn't, how do they raise enough money without a strong political backing from Democrats or Republicans.

    Think about it from this perspective: If you're truly trying to win a presidency, how do you beat two behemoths? It's a matter of if you can't beat them, join them. And that's created by America's obsession with voting for a two-party system.

    There isn't a candidate with significant support from both sides. That doesn't change the fact that I hope there will be more traction towards it in the future. Which is why I am confused as to why you implied that I've stated that there was a strong independent candidate to begin with. It's not what I am saying at all.

  4. #4624
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Who have you voted for President/Governor/Mayor/Senator/etc. and how many were Rís and how many were Dís?
    I voted for Obama (hated Romney). I voted for Trump (hated Clinton). I will vote for Andrew Yang in the upcoming NYC Mayoral election. Dude, I'm voting for the candidate who has the best ideas that I believe is in my best interest (first-and-foremost) and the best interest of the country. I've made that very clear. Whether they are a D or R is irrelevant to me. I liked Obama's presidency. Disagreed with some, agreed with most. I felt 2016 was an embarrassment that Clinton and Trump were the two final candidates but I settled for Trump particularly because I was sick of government career officials and I liked Trump's illegal immigration stance. I preferred Kasich out of the Republican nominees. You wouldn't know the rest of the names but I think I've made my stance very clear on how I vote.

  5. #4625
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    Quote Originally Posted by OceanSpray View Post
    I'm advocating for more momentum particularly because candidates are very afraid of going the independent route precisely because of the dominant two-party system. It's career suicide which is why Andrew Yang largely never touched it considering he would be scapegoated as stealing votes from Democrats that would hurt their chances in the general election. The sentiment right now is that if you're an independent, it's likely career suicide and even if it isn't, how do they raise enough money without a strong political backing from Democrats or Republicans.

    Think about it from this perspective: If you're truly trying to win a presidency, how do you beat two behemoths? It's a matter of if you can't beat them, join them. And that's created by America's obsession with voting for a two-party system.

    There isn't a candidate with significant support from both sides. That doesn't change the fact that I hope there will be more traction towards it in the future. Which is why I am confused as to why you implied that I've stated that there was a strong independent candidate to begin with. It's not what I am saying at all.
    A big reason why nobody can "beat" them so to speak is because the parties have teamed up to make it so that no independents can challenge them via burdensome laws.

  6. #4626
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    Quote Originally Posted by OceanSpray View Post
    I voted for Obama (hated Romney). I voted for Trump (hated Clinton). I will vote for Andrew Yang in the upcoming NYC Mayoral election. Dude, I'm voting for the candidate who has the best ideas that I believe is in my best interest (first-and-foremost) and the best interest of the country. I've made that very clear. Whether they are a D or R is irrelevant to me. I liked Obama's presidency. Disagreed with some, agreed with most. I felt 2016 was an embarrassment that Clinton and Trump were the two final candidates but I settled for Trump particularly because I was sick of government career officials and I liked Trump's illegal immigration stance. I preferred Kasich out of the Republican nominees. You wouldn't know the rest of the names but I think I've made my stance very clear on how I vote.
    We have similar voting patterns then (minus Trump). I also liked Kasich a lot, well minus the outdated marijuana stance, but that's not the most pressing issue to me.

    Why did you like Trump over Biden? If you could go back knowing everything that happened after the election, would you still prefer Trump over Biden?

  7. #4627
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    A big reason why nobody can "beat" them so to speak is because the parties have teamed up to make it so that no independents can challenge them via burdensome laws.
    Which is my point. Two party system trying to keep two party dominance. If people continued showing more interest and support towards independent candidates, more would run as an independent.

  8. #4628
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    Quote Originally Posted by OceanSpray View Post
    Which is my point. Two party system trying to keep two party dominance. If people continued showing more interest and support towards independent candidates, more would run as an independent.
    Neither side wants to be the first to make that leap and hand the election to the "other" side.

  9. #4629
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    We have similar voting patterns then (minus Trump). I also liked Kasich a lot, well minus the outdated marijuana stance, but that's not the most pressing issue to me.

    Why did you like Trump over Biden? If you could go back knowing everything that happened after the election, would you still prefer Trump over Biden?
    1) Not a fan of Biden's immigration policies.

    2) Biden's a career politician. 45+ years of government but continues pressing about the same issues people have faced for decades.

    3) Trump's presidency was very good to me monetarily. My family (not wealthy but professionals) all saw an improvement in income.

    4) I disagree with higher taxes when they are being spent irrationally and that goes for any income class. Corporate income tax is a huge subject here but it's a lengthy one.

    5) Biden is too lax on China's trade policies. He prefers an idle approach when everyone knows China isn't playing by the same rules.

    6) No military conflict under Trump's presidency despite those saying he was going to start World War III. Starting discussions with North Korea was a huge path forward and Trump deserves credit. Trump wanting to pull out of other countries affairs was and is important.

    7) Increased spending plans that are being proposed by Biden.

    8) Student debt forgiveness = me no likey regardless of the amount owed.

    9) I don't agree with many of the Democratic propositions today which is why I tend to defend Republicans more. Republicans have largely moved a bit more left while Democrats have gone so far left that it's becoming unrecognizable. If Biden wins = more Democrat legislation that I am not a fan of.


    Why I do like Biden over Trump:

    1) Energy. Trump's hesitance with cleaner alternatives is annoying. This falls under climate as well.

    2) Trump's rhetoric is annoying to hear for four straight years.

    3) Trump's horrible initial COVID response by first claiming it was just like the flu and then continuously downplaying it.

    4) Biden's healthcare plan is far better than anything Trump has come up with which really isn't much other than the individual mandate being removed.


    What I don't care about:

    1) Abortion

    2) Religion

    3) Personal insults or accusations that have very little evidence

  10. #4630
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    Neither side wants to be the first to make that leap and hand the election to the "other" side.
    Which is why people need to start voting on what they believe in rather than just voting based on party lines regardless of which party benefits most from the independent votes. What I've noticed is that being an independent is more difficult because generally people who vote on party lines don't do much research to consider an alternative angle of something which is why they would just rather just agree on whatever a platform says. There's such a huge discrepancy when it comes to speaking with a Democrat vs Republican and it shouldn't be that partisan.

  11. #4631
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    We have similar voting patterns then (minus Trump). I also liked Kasich a lot, well minus the outdated marijuana stance, but that's not the most pressing issue to me.

    Why did you like Trump over Biden? If you could go back knowing everything that happened after the election, would you still prefer Trump over Biden?
    He voted Obama, Trump, Trump. You voted Obama, Clinton, Biden. How are those similar voting patterns?

  12. #4632
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncsinmo View Post
    He voted Obama, Trump, Trump. You voted Obama, Clinton, Biden. How are those similar voting patterns?
    That's where he said (minus Trump) which means he would vote for other candidates if it weren't for Trump. Also likely meaning he doesn't vote based on party lines but I would assume he will vote for a candidate that tends to be a Democrat since he does seem more left than moderate.

  13. #4633
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncsinmo View Post
    He voted Obama, Trump, Trump. You voted Obama, Clinton, Biden. How are those similar voting patterns?
    I didn't vote for Clinton...

  14. #4634
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    A big reason why nobody can "beat" them so to speak is because the parties have teamed up to make it so that no independents can challenge them via burdensome laws.
    I think they also team up (not conspiracy, just the way they react and what they do and don't go after) to defeat people on their own teams the leadership of the parties don't like.

  15. #4635
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    Quote Originally Posted by valade16 View Post
    I didn't vote for Clinton...
    How do you really know who you voted for?
    Let's get embedded tweets working again!

    https://forums.prosportsdaily.com/sh...5#post33780085

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