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  1. #6766
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    457
    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    I don't think its their fault the physical wasn't thorough enough. I wouldn't be surprised to see someone let go though over it. It's a reason for him stinking at the dish though. Tough to hit with a broken hand. The problem isn't Drury's hand though...it's Drury. What on earth are they going to do with him? His best season was good, but not spectacular. I think he is going to be a bench/super utility kind of guy just like Diaz will be next year once Tulo comes back. They have depth built up at many positions. Pretty soon they need to start amalgamating talent and turning 3 or 4 good players into 1 or 2 great players.

    Think of the options Atkins has this winter. He's thinking things like....:

    - what could I get for Stroman, Alford and Drury
    - what could I get for Sanchez, Travis and Kevin Smith
    - what could I get for Pillar, Martin, Tulo and Donaldson (assuming he accepts a QO)
    - what could I get for Solarte, Diaz and Gurriel
    - what could I get for Morales and Smoak


    The amount of turnover that could be made is ridiculous.
    I'm hoping that happens, but I don't trust Shatkins yet...

  2. #6767
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    6,970
    Quote Originally Posted by Spiderdan22 View Post
    I'm hoping that happens, but I don't trust Shatkins yet...
    Barton is our breath of fresh optimistic air.

  3. #6768
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    17,523
    If Im the Jays I call up Jansen and have Martin mentor him. They got one more year of Martin next year, which i think he'll split time catching with the new guy.

    In fact I think Reese McGuire should also be up now learning from him as I think he is an absolute upgrade from Maile -- I dont get why the F we have Maile wasting a precious spot there -- this is the one thing getting on my nerves about Atkins right now... overall his moves have been pretty good but he needs to move on the catching, no catching coach will ever have the knowledga and experience of Martin to pass on...
    Last edited by Sanyo; 08-09-2018 at 08:33 PM.

  4. #6769
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    6,970
    I'd actually like to see Martin brought in as a coach after his contract is up.

  5. #6770
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    712
    Quote Originally Posted by ChongInc. View Post
    I'd actually like to see Martin brought in as a coach after his contract is up.
    I would just transition him into Manager when this contract is up. I have no desire to trade him before he expires, itís just money, during a rebuild where we donít need it somewhere else.

  6. #6771
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    6,208
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanyo View Post
    If Im the Jays I call up Jansen and have Martin mentor him. They got one more year of Martin next year, which i think he'll split time catching with the new guy.

    In fact I think Reese McGuire should also be up now learning from him as I think he is an absolute upgrade from Maile -- I dont get why the F we have Maile wasting a precious spot there -- this is the one thing getting on my nerves about Atkins right now... overall his moves have been pretty good but he needs to move on the catching, no catching coach will ever have the knowledga and experience of Martin to pass on...


    Jansen started the season out on fire, but he has been tailing off. He hit .200/.337/.453 in July and is hitting .250/.280/.417 so far in August. Not exactly the ideal time to call someone up when you don't have to. McGuire is hitting .236/.318/.339 in AAA. Do you really think he is going to post better numbers than Maile has? If so then please share with us whatever you are on..lol

    They need to showcase Maile (and Martin) so they can try to trade them in the off season. I think next year we see Jansen and Martin split time behind the plate pretty evenly like Martin has with Maile this year. Then the next year Jansen takes over and McGuire becomes his backup. Unless they have injuries or are able to find a taker for Martin this off season.


    There is a legit possibility that they have Martin and Tulo as bench warmers at some point next season making 40M dollars. Martin will be at best splitting time and Tulo needs to out play Diaz, Gurriel and possibly even Bo Bichette in ST after missing a full season at 33 years old. (Yes I am including Bichette since he will be in big league camp with a chance to impress just like Travis did in 2015). I could definitely see him losing his spot by mid season if he (or the team) struggles out of the gate and he isn't building up his trade value. I hope that doesn't happen and they actually play well though. I think things could get awkward with competitors like them riding the pines for the first time in their great careers. Especially while they are still being paid to be leaders of this team.


    Look how drastically different these 2 potential lineups could look like next year:


    Option 1. (They give JD a QO, keep Martin and Tulo and then send Vladdy back to the minors)


    Travis
    Donaldson
    Smoak
    Hernandez
    Morales
    Grichuk
    Tulo
    Martin
    Pillar


    vs


    Option 2. (They trade Martin, Tulo and Morales and JD either declines or never gets a QO)


    SS- Bichette/Gurriel
    2B- Travis
    3B- Guerrero
    1B- Smoak
    LF- Hernandez
    DH- Tellez
    RF- Grichuk
    C- Jansen
    CF- Pillar

  7. #6772
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    1,601
    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    Jansen started the season out on fire, but he has been tailing off. He hit .200/.337/.453 in July and is hitting .250/.280/.417 so far in August. Not exactly the ideal time to call someone up when you don't have to. McGuire is hitting .236/.318/.339 in AAA. Do you really think he is going to post better numbers than Maile has? If so then please share with us whatever you are on..lol

    They need to showcase Maile (and Martin) so they can try to trade them in the off season. I think next year we see Jansen and Martin split time behind the plate pretty evenly like Martin has with Maile this year. Then the next year Jansen takes over and McGuire becomes his backup. Unless they have injuries or are able to find a taker for Martin this off season.


    There is a legit possibility that they have Martin and Tulo as bench warmers at some point next season making 40M dollars. Martin will be at best splitting time and Tulo needs to out play Diaz, Gurriel and possibly even Bo Bichette in ST after missing a full season at 33 years old. (Yes I am including Bichette since he will be in big league camp with a chance to impress just like Travis did in 2015). I could definitely see him losing his spot by mid season if he (or the team) struggles out of the gate and he isn't building up his trade value. I hope that doesn't happen and they actually play well though. I think things could get awkward with competitors like them riding the pines for the first time in their great careers. Especially while they are still being paid to be leaders of this team.


    Look how drastically different these 2 potential lineups could look like next year:


    Option 1. (They give JD a QO, keep Martin and Tulo and then send Vladdy back to the minors)


    Travis
    Donaldson
    Smoak
    Hernandez
    Morales
    Grichuk
    Tulo
    Martin
    Pillar


    vs


    Option 2. (They trade Martin, Tulo and Morales and JD either declines or never gets a QO)


    SS- Bichette/Gurriel
    2B- Travis
    3B- Guerrero
    1B- Smoak
    LF- Hernandez
    DH- Tellez
    RF- Grichuk
    C- Jansen
    CF- Pillar
    I think Bichette is still a year away. He's had a quietly solid year at AA, but has just recently started to produce the way he can. I feel like he is the kind of prospect who can easily be spoiled by calling him up too early, and since next year's a write-off anyway, they should just let him play his way on to the team by producing in Buffalo.

    I do think Travis' days with the Jays are numbered. Bichette and Gurriel are most likely our SS/2B of the future. Then there's also Biggio to think about.

    One wonders if it might be wise to pre-emptively move Vlad Jr. to LF or 1B. I'd hate to see his career cut short by injury.

  8. #6773
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    6,208
    Quote Originally Posted by LechWalesa View Post
    I think Bichette is still a year away. He's had a quietly solid year at AA, but has just recently started to produce the way he can. I feel like he is the kind of prospect who can easily be spoiled by calling him up too early, and since next year's a write-off anyway, they should just let him play his way on to the team by producing in Buffalo.

    I do think Travis' days with the Jays are numbered. Bichette and Gurriel are most likely our SS/2B of the future. Then there's also Biggio to think about.

    One wonders if it might be wise to pre-emptively move Vlad Jr. to LF or 1B. I'd hate to see his career cut short by injury.
    I just put this in the minor league thread..but it applies here..

    ==

    While some may think Bichette is having a down year compared to what he has done the last 2 seasons, put this into your perspective. Here's Bichette's rank in the EL this year:

    Doubles: 1st
    Triples: T-2nd
    Total Bases: 1st
    Runs Scored: 1st
    Stolen Bases: T-1st
    RBI's: T-4th
    Batting Avg: 13th
    OPS: 15th


    That is pretty crazy for a 20 year old....

    =====



    I don't think he is as far away as you may think.... especially offensively. The defense probably needs work, but so did Travis' when he won the opening day job at 2B in 2015. He was 23 when he posted his .298/.358/.460 line in AA for the Tigers and 22 when he obliterated A and Adv A. In fact, his numbers in the minors are very similar to Bichette's, he was just 3 years older at each level because he came out of college and not high school.

  9. #6774
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    10,924
    Quote Originally Posted by LechWalesa View Post
    I think Bichette is still a year away. He's had a quietly solid year at AA, but has just recently started to produce the way he can. I feel like he is the kind of prospect who can easily be spoiled by calling him up too early, and since next year's a write-off anyway, they should just let him play his way on to the team by producing in Buffalo.

    I do think Travis' days with the Jays are numbered. Bichette and Gurriel are most likely our SS/2B of the future. Then there's also Biggio to think about.

    One wonders if it might be wise to pre-emptively move Vlad Jr. to LF or 1B. I'd hate to see his career cut short by injury.
    I think it is inevitable. There just keeping him at a more important defensive position to aid his defensive development at this point. I personally don't think there is much of a chance that he's an MLB 3rd basemen.

  10. #6775
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    6,970
    I'd personally prefer him in the OF anyway. The only way I see him becoming a + defender is if he works on that cannon arm from the OF.

  11. #6776
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    838
    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    I just put this in the minor league thread..but it applies here..

    ==

    While some may think Bichette is having a down year compared to what he has done the last 2 seasons, put this into your perspective. Here's Bichette's rank in the EL this year:

    Doubles: 1st
    Triples: T-2nd
    Total Bases: 1st
    Runs Scored: 1st
    Stolen Bases: T-1st
    RBI's: T-4th
    Batting Avg: 13th
    OPS: 15th


    That is pretty crazy for a 20 year old....

    =====



    I don't think he is as far away as you may think.... especially offensively. The defense probably needs work, but so did Travis' when he won the opening day job at 2B in 2015. He was 23 when he posted his .298/.358/.460 line in AA for the Tigers and 22 when he obliterated A and Adv A. In fact, his numbers in the minors are very similar to Bichette's, he was just 3 years older at each level because he came out of college and not high school.
    I would have traded Bichette for good controllable starting pitcher. I think he is overrated and we have depth galore at shortstop.

  12. #6777
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    17,523
    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    Jansen started the season out on fire, but he has been tailing off. He hit .200/.337/.453 in July and is hitting .250/.280/.417 so far in August. Not exactly the ideal time to call someone up when you don't have to. McGuire is hitting .236/.318/.339 in AAA. Do you really think he is going to post better numbers than Maile has? If so then please share with us whatever you are on..lol

    They need to showcase Maile (and Martin) so they can try to trade them in the off season. I think next year we see Jansen and Martin split time behind the plate pretty evenly like Martin has with Maile this year. Then the next year Jansen takes over and McGuire becomes his backup. Unless they have injuries or are able to find a taker for Martin this off season.


    There is a legit possibility that they have Martin and Tulo as bench warmers at some point next season making 40M dollars. Martin will be at best splitting time and Tulo needs to out play Diaz, Gurriel and possibly even Bo Bichette in ST after missing a full season at 33 years old. (Yes I am including Bichette since he will be in big league camp with a chance to impress just like Travis did in 2015). I could definitely see him losing his spot by mid season if he (or the team) struggles out of the gate and he isn't building up his trade value. I hope that doesn't happen and they actually play well though. I think things could get awkward with competitors like them riding the pines for the first time in their great careers. Especially while they are still being paid to be leaders of this team.


    Look how drastically different these 2 potential lineups could look like next year:


    Option 1. (They give JD a QO, keep Martin and Tulo and then send Vladdy back to the minors)


    Travis
    Donaldson
    Smoak
    Hernandez
    Morales
    Grichuk
    Tulo
    Martin
    Pillar


    vs


    Option 2. (They trade Martin, Tulo and Morales and JD either declines or never gets a QO)


    SS- Bichette/Gurriel
    2B- Travis
    3B- Guerrero
    1B- Smoak
    LF- Hernandez
    DH- Tellez
    RF- Grichuk
    C- Jansen
    CF- Pillar
    Well I guess they listened to me and they promoted Jansen lol

  13. #6778
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    6,970
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanyo View Post
    Well I guess they listened to me and they promoted Jansen lol
    Please let them know how badly they ****ed up by not starting the rebuild sooner and remind them to continue to ready anything they can. Also let them know that you need to have Allstars at every position to win in this division.

  14. #6779
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    6,970
    "serviceable major league players with years of control" are only useful in trades for star contributors in this division.

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