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  1. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmac_121
    I was talking about this with someone just yesterday. I wouldn't be opposed to offering a contract at all, not a max or anything like that, but a good deal for both parties. When he's healthy I prefer him to Dwight because of his better offensive game. All of this would have to happen after an extensive physical though, which I'm not sure he'd pass.
    Yeah, that's basically how I view it. Bynum's defensive instincts can't compare to that healthy Dwight from a few years ago, but 'Drew clearly has the superior offensive skillset, aside from struggling to find the open man when he gets doubled in the post. I just don't know what kind of deal he's worth, and imagine a number of teams are thinking about it.

  2. #107
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    Thought about it: Maybe a 2-year deal for Bynum, 2nd year is a team option, at around $10M each year. Then trade our two 1sts for Oladipo. If you told me we could roll out a lineup of (relatively healthy) Bynum-Horford-Somebody-Oladipo-Teague, I'd probably take it. Might save enough to re-sign Korver, or some SF who can light it up from 3.

  3. #108
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    I would definitely be up for something like that barring a physical. I'd especially like the team option. We'd also have enough cap to sign another big piece this year or next year.

  4. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmac_121
    I would definitely be up for something like that barring a physical. I'd especially like the team option. We'd also have enough cap to sign another big piece this year or next year.
    Yeah, Ferry has to protect the team's investment somehow so a team option makes the most sense.

    Bynum or his agent might say that passing a physical should guarantee him more money up front, and that's a somewhat legit argument for him. If we say the Top 6 "true centers" on extensions are Dwight ($19.5M last season), Marc (13.9), Noah (11.3), Hibbert (13.7), Lopez (13.7), Chandler (13.6) in some order, the salaries of those six guys averages out to just over $14M so maybe that's closer to the final number per year: $10-14M, depending on the physical, then slap on the team option. Bynum made $16.9M last season to do nothing, so we know he'll have to take a paycut regardless.
    Last edited by Bravo95; 06-26-2013 at 12:11 PM.

  5. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by SluggeR View Post
    1.) Sound like a co-sign to me. If you cool with the Hawks picking a guy you've never seen play, that's your business..no big deal.

    2.) It was questioned to how he was gonna do once he gets to the league and you chose to reply with bringing up the names of some of the greatest pg's to ever play the game..C'MON MANE.

    You not being misquoted, but I still see that you are very sensitive. I'm gonna reply to whoever. If I reply to your post, you have the right to ignore me..but stop the crying. I've replied to all these other posters, but you the only one catching feelings. I do thank you for helping me decide on not using the word "debate" in my post anymore though. It was a poor word choice in one of my other post. Rarely do I feel the need to really really debate someone, I just post what's on my mind..
    1) You should learn the definition of words and stop making it up as you go along. I did not have not co-signed him. You are just wrong as usual and making things up.

    2) look at your statement, it was not a question, making things up again.

    3) Me sensitive? PLEASE. You are just lying again and trying to figure away out of it. You totally misrepresent what people type when you want to argue another point. This is not politics! No one's crying just tired of you LYING! What will you lie about next?

    And last.... I have ignored you before, but people like you are dumb to get the hint. You just went on lying about other things I have posted. The only way to deal with people like you is to expose you every time you lie. Go ahead and rant for another week about how "Al's bread and butter is his post game" and tell us you watch a lot of Hawks games again. LIER!
    Last edited by SB75; 06-26-2013 at 12:19 PM.

  6. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmac_121 View Post
    Aside from Miami, his contract is the most team friendly deal for a player of his caliber.
    Well....... Okay you have accepted the fact that he is not the best contract. If you care to look up salaries, he is far from the most team friendly as well. Don't get me wrong, AL has a nice deal for him and the team. But there are about 5 to 10 contracts out their that are more team friendly than his.

  7. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by SB75 View Post
    Well....... Okay you have accepted the fact that he is not the best contract. If you care to look up salaries, he is far from the most team friendly as well. Don't get me wrong, AL has a nice deal for him and the team. But there are about 5 to 10 contracts out their that are more team friendly than his.
    Ha! 10 players? Come on man...
    We sold our soul to the Devil for the '96 Olympics and now we're cursed

  8. #113
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    Based on how bmac_121 phrased his comment, I'd say Horford's contract is in the Top 5 among similar players on a second long term extension... and there is an argument for him being 1st depending on how much a person wants to consider age and potentially-career-threatening injuries (if we're talking long term deals).

    This is the list of all the bigs and forwards who averaged a double-double last season while playing in 60+ games:

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/...t=&order_by=ws

    Tyson, Lee, Horford, ZBo, Howard, Noah, Hickson, Vucevic, and Asik.

    Vucevic is still on his rookie contract, and Hickson only had a 1-year deal, so they are out. Z-Bo, Tyson, and Lee are on the wrong side of 30 years old, with declining skillsets, and each makes more than Al over the next few years (Z-Bo almost $18M next season).

    That leaves Dwight Howard, Joakim Noah and Omer Asik.

    Well first off: Horford is a better all around player than Asik, so Omer is out; we won't find one reputable NBA source or publication who would rank or take Asik over Horford, with contracts considered.

    Howard is a superstar, but his previous max deal expires next Monday, so we can't use the term "team friendly" anymore... and he also carries serious injury risks right now (back injuries are nothing to mess around with), same goes for Noah (chronic foot problems) and Lee (hip).

    So, like I said towards the beginning of this post, it comes down to how much each person cares about age and potentially-career-threatening injuries when making that comparison for frontcourt players on their second long term deal.
    Last edited by Bravo95; 06-26-2013 at 01:16 PM.

  9. #114
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    Bravo pretty much hit the nail on the head for my reasoning.

  10. #115
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    Hawks worked out Kelly Olynyk today. I wouldn't mind seeing his name being called tomorrow at 17 or 18.

  11. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo95 View Post
    Based on how bmac_121 phrased his comment, I'd say Horford's contract is in the Top 5 among similar players on a second long term extension... and there is an argument for him being 1st depending on how much a person wants to consider age and potentially-career-threatening injuries (if we're talking long term deals).

    This is the list of all the bigs and forwards who averaged a double-double last season while playing in 60+ games:

    http://www.basketball-reference.com/...t=&order_by=ws

    Tyson, Lee, Horford, ZBo, Howard, Noah, Hickson, Vucevic, and Asik.

    Vucevic is still on his rookie contract, and Hickson only had a 1-year deal, so they are out. Z-Bo, Tyson, and Lee are on the wrong side of 30 years old, with declining skillsets, and each makes more than Al over the next few years (Z-Bo almost $18M next season).

    That leaves Dwight Howard, Joakim Noah and Omer Asik.

    Well first off: Horford is a better all around player than Asik, so Omer is out; we won't find one reputable NBA source or publication who would rank or take Asik over Horford, with contracts considered.

    Howard is a superstar, but his previous max deal expires next Monday, so we can't use the term "team friendly" anymore... and he also carries serious injury risks right now (back injuries are nothing to mess around with), same goes for Noah (chronic foot problems) and Lee (hip).

    So, like I said towards the beginning of this post, it comes down to how much each person cares about age and potentially-career-threatening injuries when making that comparison for frontcourt players on their second long term deal.
    To be honest, O didn't see anything about length of contract, service time or anything else in his first post. Even adding all that in, he still doesn't have the best.

  12. #117
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    Sorry, my thought got cut off.....

    If that is what he ment with the extra variables, I can dig it. I can only comment on what he typed. As stated, it's still not the best, but it will require more research to say if it's top 5 or not.

  13. #118
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    SB, to get back to your question, would you be cool with Shabazz being our pick (if we trade up)? Also as I said, to me he moves like Harden so I would atleast try him at the 2, where would you put him?

  14. #119
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    My Post #113 was responding to bmac_121's post #104, and the phrase I was referencing was the "player of his caliber" part. "Caliber" is synonymous with words like "value" or "distinction"... so I looked up the players in Horford's class in terms of position and production, just using the basic stats for now. If I use advanced stats to make my argument, it will be a much easier to dismiss most of those names, probably a whitewash. But everything else is subjective, just comes down to what each person values as usual, from compensation to intangibles.
    Last edited by Bravo95; 06-26-2013 at 07:42 PM.

  15. #120
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    Also, I think there is some truth to the Harden-Muhammad comparisons, the big difference IMO being Shabazz isn't the ballhandler that James is/was. It's possible to add that part to his game, but he has to be in the right environment for fundamentals and selflessness. He is more of a catch-and-shoot guy right now and didn't pass the rock much at all at UCLA but they had injuries and I'm not a big fan of Ben Howland (guys usually hate playing for him) so I'm kinda taking what I saw from SM there with a grain of salt. Wherever Shabazz goes, the coach has to be a good communicator and the team needs the right culture of getting the most out of one's ability, or he could win up the next Jordan Crawford.
    Last edited by Bravo95; 06-26-2013 at 08:09 PM.

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