NBA Playoffs Series Thread (1) Sixers vs (5) Hawks Atlanta wins 4-3

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Originally Posted by ewing

It seems like there is a long list of dos and donts needed from this max players teammates to make him fit. I think he should be a 5 and I don’t know if he is good enough to force teams to play him at the 4 even though he should be a 5 like AD


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I mean I would give it a shot where he ends up next, I definitely think ad is.

I am not saying that it’s not a him issue type thing, just that my feeling watching him is he may struggle to grind or often get out worked throughout a game against some 5s. Especially over a long season. I agree with you on that type of play needing to be what he does. At 5 it becomes even more of an advantage IF the team isn’t hurt in other areas like on the boards.


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Originally Posted by ewing

this makes me roll my eyes. Why can’t he play 5? I definitely think he is best suited as a 5. It give him the speed mismatch on O, makes him the roller in spread PNR with play making wings to kick to, puts him in the middle of PnR defense, and allows him to be in a great position to grab and go in boards to ignite fast breaks. If Ben wants to be special he has to at least play some 5 and probably should be FT imo.


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He can but it won't be the best use of him. Maybe for small stretches in games, but full time not likely. He's more of a on man defender than a help defender and rim protector. So asking him to stay the middle when teams drive on him isn't going to work as well as you think.

The hope in Portland would be Zach Collins is healthy. He's a perfect 5 fit next to Simmons.

Congrats to Atlanta. They are the better team in the series. Winning 3 games on the road is impressive.

Its been 24 hours and I still don't know where to begin. ts very disappointing. I know how JAZZNC feels.

Trading Ben is a MUST. I trust Daryl Morey will make it happen. I feel for Joel.

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Originally Posted by warfelg

Betting odds for Simmons next team:
Portland +250
Washington +300
San Antonio +450
Utah +550
Oklahoma City +550
Golden State +600
Los Angeles Lakers +625


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I like the idea of Dejounte Murray or SGA in Philly. IF you have to part with either Thibs or Maxey for SGA you do it :)

What about Ben for JimmyB swap? I welcome JB back to Philly so fast :clap:

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Originally Posted by NBA all the way

I actually think that 3 teamer could work! But idk what Raps fans would say. I still think the lottery might gift the Raptors #1 overall lol

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Work for Philly. Don’t see why Raps do it. Don’t see why OKC takes on a max contract for a non-scorer and an iffy 1st when they’re swimming in picks; they’d be happy to send you Kemba for Ben though.

I think you have to look at the fact that a team with three of the top-rated defenders in the league, with one of them being a strong offensive center, one of the best three-point shooters, and a PF who convinced 6ers fans he was a legit max player, and they had two back-to-back total collapses on both ends of the floor. So what does a top defender with no offensive game get you in today’s game?

Portland could be tempted, but giving up McCollum and Covington puts more pressure on Dame to score. Yeah, Ben can play some center and help the ball move, but results are an unknown. If trading those two guys, they need a solid two-way player in return.

Ben is worth getting, but you really need a really strong offensive team around him. Nets, Golden State, Wolves, Hawks seem to have the right types of teams, and I don’t think the Hawks would want to go there at this point.

I think people are asking the wrong questions and thinking at this with the wrong approach. Everyone keeps talking about getting Simmons where he can fit better or judging which teammates can nah his deficiencies.

The question and approach we should instead take is: What team has the coaching structure to hold Simmons accountable and get through to him to motivate significant improvement?

Cause let's be honest here, Simmons isn't going to go somewhere else and suddenly become worth $34M overnight. I don't care what team or teammates you add him with. He HAS to improve. So start there. Who can motivate him to improve?

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Originally Posted by beasted86

I think people are asking the wrong questions and thinking at this with the wrong approach. Everyone keeps talking about getting Simmons where he can fit better or judging which teammates can nah his deficiencies.

The question and approach we should instead take is: What team has the coaching structure to hold Simmons accountable and get through to him to motivate significant improvement?

Cause let's be honest here, Simmons isn't going to go somewhere else and suddenly become worth $34M overnight. I don't care what team or teammates you add him with. He HAS to improve. So start there. Who can motivate him to improve?

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pop 100 pct... but the spurs have nothing the sixers need or want

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Originally Posted by beasted86

I think people are asking the wrong questions and thinking at this with the wrong approach. Everyone keeps talking about getting Simmons where he can fit better or judging which teammates can nah his deficiencies.

The question and approach we should instead take is: What team has the coaching structure to hold Simmons accountable and get through to him to motivate significant improvement?

Cause let's be honest here, Simmons isn't going to go somewhere else and suddenly become worth $34M overnight. I don't care what team or teammates you add him with. He HAS to improve. So start there. Who can motivate him to improve?

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I was gonna say the Spurs come to mind. Outside of that maybe the Warriors. The Heat probably could but James Butler hates him.

It starts with Ben though, if he doesn't want to improve it doesn't matter if he has Pop as a coach, CP3 as a teammate, and Steve Ballmer as a governor, he'll never improve.

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Originally Posted by More-Than-Most

pop 100 pct... but the spurs have nothing the sixers need or want

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Murray, Walker, White, Johnson no combination of these players interest you?? I chuckle because I know you think you’re gonna get a tier one super star for Simmons but I wouldn’t hold my breath.

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Originally Posted by smith&wesson

Murray, Walker, White, Johnson no combination of these players interest you?? I chuckle because I know you think you’re gonna get a tier one super star for Simmons but I wouldn’t hold my breath.

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What if I told you he once made a 14-foot jump shot in the Summer league?

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Originally Posted by ewing

What if I told you he once made a 14-foot jump shot in the Summer league?

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lol I would say he has regressed since then.

For a team to give up something significant for him I’d have to imagine they will not play him at PG . That experiment should be over . A PG needs to be ferocious. He’s just not that guy .

Player A (22 years old): 24.3ppg, .475 FG%, .371 3PT%, 4.4 APG, 3.1 RPG, 1 SPG, 2.8 TOPG
Player B (29 years old): 23.1ppg, .458 FG%, .402 3PT%, 4.7 APG, 3.9 RPG, 0.9 SPG, 1.4 TOPG

Which would you rather have?

I take player A due to age. But when you reveal the names, people seem to like Player B a lot better. If I were the Sixers, I'd prefer player A in a trade for Simmons.

You think this is going to be like a Walker type quick trade or drawn out well into the offseason?

Cuz player A put up empty stats on a bad team and is considered a bad teammate to play with. Player B put up those numbers on a playoff team as the #2. Literally the opponents would taunt the teammates of player A saying he's not gonna pass the ball. I have a bunch embiid would murder player a it they played together, especially if you're trying to say player A should be a large part of the return for Simmons.

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Originally Posted by warfelg

I'm thinking similar with Ben to OKC or maybe Houston and lesser picks going to Orlando with those three coming back. Maybe Sixers can flip Ross and Bamba; or Thybulle and picks for a wing.

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Feel sliwm this is the type of deal that has to happen. Outside of a CJ for Simmons type swap, it's really hard to find a playoff caliber team that's going to be willing to give up fair market value for Simmons. He's shown he's currently a big liability in the playoffs, so if a team is angling to fix him, it would make sense to be a team who's a few years off. Or at least a year off.

Even a team looking to blow it up probably isn't wanting to blow it up with Simmons. He's too good to actually tank but he's not good enough to carry you anywhere. So even if Washington were to decide to blow it up and trade Beal, I'm not sure Simmons is their ideal target. He might be, but it's alot of money to pay for a project as opposed to getting a bunch of picks and even younger guys.

So someone like Houston or OKC, who will have to trade picks eventually, would make sense to take a chance on rehabbing Simmons confidence and shot, while sending Philly picks, which are a much easier currency to deal in when trying to acquire new players.

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Originally Posted by Vee-Rex

Player A (22 years old): 24.3ppg, .475 FG%, .371 3PT%, 4.4 APG, 3.1 RPG, 1 SPG, 2.8 TOPG
Player B (29 years old): 23.1ppg, .458 FG%, .402 3PT%, 4.7 APG, 3.9 RPG, 0.9 SPG, 1.4 TOPG

Which would you rather have?

I take player A due to age. But when you reveal the names, people seem to like Player B a lot better. If I were the Sixers, I'd prefer player A in a trade for Simmons.

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Without looking it up I'm almost certain this is Sexton vs CJ.

CJ is a #2, while Sexton is a #1 as well as the points brought up by the last poster. I particularly think Sexton would be okay value for Simmons. But to make the salaries work you have to include Love.

I just see neither team being interested.

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Originally Posted by crewfan13

Cuz player A put up empty stats on a bad team and is considered a bad teammate to play with. Player B put up those numbers on a playoff team as the #2. Literally the opponents would taunt the teammates of player A saying he's not gonna pass the ball. I have a bunch embiid would murder player a it they played together, especially if you're trying to say player A should be a large part of the return for Simmons.

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He's a kid (with some talent) on a terrible team, with a terrible coach and a terrible front office. Still could turn out to become a quality piece on a contending team. The upside is there.

Player B could start declining within the next few years.

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Originally Posted by Vee-Rex

He's a kid (with some talent) on a terrible team, with a terrible coach and a terrible front office. Still could turn out to become a quality piece on a contending team. The upside is there.

Player B could start declining within the next few years.

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Do you think Simmons will show any glimmer of motivation to improve being traded to a bad team, given that just less than 3 months ago one player there said everyone wants to be traded away?

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Originally Posted by Vee-Rex

He's a kid (with some talent) on a terrible team, with a terrible coach and a terrible front office. Still could turn out to become a quality piece on a contending team. The upside is there.

Player B could start declining within the next few years.

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He is also a pick-and-roll playmaker. The Sixers should be looking to add a second primary not a second Tobias Harris. Sexton is a bigger gamble. In term of play style and potentially he could be much bigger reward. I would love to see it.

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Originally Posted by beasted86

Do you think Simmons will show any glimmer of motivation to improve being traded to a bad team, given that just less than 3 months ago one player there said everyone wants to be traded away?

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I'll let you know after the draft lottery tonight.

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Originally Posted by ewing

He is also a pick-and-roll playmaker. The Sixers should be looking to add a second primary not a second Tobias Harris. Sexton is a bigger gamble. In term of play style and potentially he could be much bigger reward. I would love to see it.

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Agreed. Well said.

I was thinking why would the 76ers want Sexton and Love? Seems like a Sexton, Nance, Prince, Dotson package makes more sense.

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Originally Posted by Vee-Rex

He's a kid (with some talent) on a terrible team, with a terrible coach and a terrible front office. Still could turn out to become a quality piece on a contending team. The upside is there.

Player B could start declining within the next few years.

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The fact that you're trying to trade a 22 year old playmaker when your team has been garbage since LeBron left and shows very little glimmer of immediate hope should tell you everything you need to know about him. Bucks fans always did the same crap with John Henson. Sexton is better than Henson, but it's always wanting to trade your guy but wildly over valuing him in your proposals.

You trade sexton to free up garland to play on ball more and because he's going to get more expensive. Simmons doesn't solve that problem. Simmons is more expensive and has to be on the ball to have any offensive value. He's a better fit in the sense he will pass more and is a better defender. But if the reason for trading sexton is to free up on ball duties for garland, you're not solving that.

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Originally Posted by crewfan13

The fact that you're trying to trade a 22 year old playmaker when your team has been garbage since LeBron left and shows very little glimmer of immediate hope should tell you everything you need to know about him. Bucks fans always did the same crap with John Henson. Sexton is better than Henson, but it's always wanting to trade your guy but wildly over valuing him in your proposals.

You trade sexton to free up garland to play on ball more and because he's going to get more expensive. Simmons doesn't solve that problem. Simmons is more expensive and has to be on the ball to have any offensive value. He's a better fit in the sense he will pass more and is a better defender. But if the reason for trading sexton is to free up on ball duties for garland, you're not solving that.

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Good point. Sexton has a hell of a lot of talent though. I’d really like for them to work it out.


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What about this trade for fun. 3 way trade.

Sixers get Kemba, Love, Cavs #3 pick

OKc gets Harris, Philly first round pick 2022

Cavs get Simmons

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Originally Posted by ewing

Good point. Sexton has a hell of a lot of talent though. I’d really like for them to work it out.


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Cavs getting pick #3 did Sexton no favors. Suggs or Green are incoming. Sexton gonna go so another team can pay him.

Probably gonna be Bledsoe and #10 for Sexton, Prince, and some kinda protected 1st and/or pick swap.

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Originally Posted by Bostonjorge

What about this trade for fun. 3 way trade.

Sixers get Kemba, Love, Cavs #3 pick

OKc gets Harris, Philly first round pick 2022

Cavs get Simmons

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I doubt 2 old, overpaid, injury prone guys is what Embiid, Doc, and Morey have in mind.

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Originally Posted by NBA all the way

Cavs getting pick #3 did Sexton no favors. Suggs or Green are incoming. Sexton gonna go so another team can pay him.

Probably gonna be Bledsoe and #10 for Sexton, Prince, and some kinda protected 1st and/or pick swap.

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If Sexton is traded whoever gets him will be really excited about him at least for a short time. I think he is talented as hell. There will definitely be a honeymoon period and then we will see how things shake out.


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Originally Posted by ewing

If Sexton is traded whoever gets him will be really excited about him at least for a short time. I think he is talented as hell. There will definitely be a honeymoon period and then we will see how things shake out.


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He's quite a chucker, allegedly a Gilbert guy too. Hopefully the Cavs don't hold onto him or pick him over Garland, for VeeRex sake.

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Originally Posted by koldjerky

You think this is going to be like a Walker type quick trade or drawn out well into the offseason?

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My hope is that Morey will make a move sooner rather then later.

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Originally Posted by Bostonjorge

What about this trade for fun. 3 way trade.

Sixers get Kemba, Love, Cavs #3 pick

OKc gets Harris, Philly first round pick 2022

Cavs get Simmons

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:down:

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Originally Posted by smith&wesson

Murray, Walker, White, Johnson no combination of these players interest you?? I chuckle because I know you think you’re gonna get a tier one super star for Simmons but I wouldn’t hold my breath.

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Agreed. Hopefully Morey will pull something off.

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Originally Posted by crewfan13

The fact that you're trying to trade a 22 year old playmaker when your team has been garbage since LeBron left and shows very little glimmer of immediate hope should tell you everything you need to know about him.

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It just shows he's not a leader right now and is incapable of being a #1 option. Doesn't mean he can't be a valuable 3rd option or even grow into a 2nd option for a team that already has a lot of talent. The biggest part of this statement of yours (that you don't realize) is that he's 22. He's a baby.

Everyone said the same thing about Kyrie before LeBron came around and BOOM, suddenly Kyrie is valued highly as a "2nd option" for a championship squad. Sexton has his issues right now as a 22 year old unable to lead a terrible team/franchise but I think you're kidding yourself by insinuating he doesn't have any value.

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Originally Posted by NBA all the way

I was thinking why would the 76ers want Sexton and Love? Seems like a Sexton, Nance, Prince, Dotson package makes more sense.

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Agree, but I just wanna dump Love on someone. :(

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Originally Posted by beasted86

Do you think Simmons will show any glimmer of motivation to improve being traded to a bad team, given that just less than 3 months ago one player there said everyone wants to be traded away?

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No.