2020-21 game thread

Oh and don’t worry about TG11, he’s been given fair warning and I’m monitoring his activity on here. If he wants to waste time posting here only for his posts to be deleted then let him have at it..

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Originally Posted by killersweet

Are you delusional? You act like we are expecting this team to be a championship contender. This is after 3 games? Do you think 3-1 Cavs are going to make the playoffs? Raptors will figure it out and they aren't going to be anything more than a regular playoff team this year. I believe you have some massive expectations for this team for some reason.

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Don’t respond to him. Let Aman and I deal with him

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Originally Posted by R. Johnson#3

You're giving him what he wants by responding like this.

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Exactly. Don’t feed the troll

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Originally Posted by pebloemer

Definitely happy to discuss this. I agree that a core of FVV/OG/Siakam isn't enough. Those are 3 really good pieces of a supporting cast. As a team, overall team play led to a lot of success last year. That doesn't work with weak links, which a now have many. We aren't seeing Norm from last year (is he really just a jump shooter that curls of screens now?). Ibaka and Gasol were huge sources of strength. Other teams (ie. Atlanta, Indiana, Brooklyn, Philly) will all be better than they were last year. I would have us on the playoff fringe. My pre-season prediction was 6th, but I had higher expectations for Baynes in that scenario (he hasn't looked good IMO). I think we are probably 7-10 range in the East this year.

So what to do with Lowry and how to add to FVV/Siakam/OG?

3 options:

1. Trade. I don't believe this team can acquire Harden without giving pieces from that core up. Probably 2 of those pieces + picks IMO. Which is terribly risky and I don't think we'd be able to win around Harden. I think trading needs to look to the future. As such, anyone should be on the block in the right deal. I think Lowry for futures is the most sensible.

2. Draft. 2021 draft is said to be loaded. Lottery odds are more balanced. Trading Lowry for futures (picks or young players on rookie scales) could help our draft position and give us additional picks. This organization has excelled at drafting and developing. FVV/OG/Siakam are good, young and contract controlled players to help youth along.

3. FA. Once we wave goodbye to Kyle, we still have about 30 million in cap space. Is Oladipo a target? Jrue Holiday? DeRozan? Go after an RFA like Collins, Markannen, Lonzo?

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Excellent post.

I think the best route to take would be trading Lowry for the future. If we find the right suitor we could get a future piece and still re-sign him in the off-season if he takes a team friendly deal. A team I recently thought of is the Hawks. Granted they have Trae at PG but they desperately need help on defence. Maybe they decide to run Lowry at the point with Trae playing off ball at the 2? Considering they're a playoff team we could also throw Norm in to give them a boost. It's a win/win as it makes them better and us worse. We'd have to wait until Len is able to be dealt but here's what I've thought of.

Lowry
Norm
Len

for

Capela
Snell
Rondo
2022 1st rd pick

Raps get their much needed rebounding presence while the Hawks get their push for the playoffs. It's mighty crowded in ATL and I can only imagine they want to keep Collins around. If Capela is the odd man out then we should be all over him.

Rondo/Flynn
Fred/Snell
OG/Bembry
Siakam/Boucher
Capela/Baynes

Ride that tank into 2021, sign Lowry in the off-season and draft the best 2 guard available with what is hopefully a top 10 pick.

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Originally Posted by smith&wesson

I do think we could win if we had the right team around him. For example if we kept Lowry/OG/Siakam and incert Harden to that starting line up I think we look pretty dam good in the east. I’m a rockets fan too, as I currently live in Houston and have been following the situation very closely. Our new GM has made it clear he wants picks and a young player emerging as a star. Beyond that they want expiring contracts to get out of Hardens bloated deal. And because of Harden making his trade demands public and his antics, Houston has lost a lot of leverage. This is where Masai can take advantage. We have a ton of expiring deals/ picks and can offer up FVV. Now the harden thing was just an example as I agree with you it comes with a lot of risk. However I’d gladly take that risk vs staying with what we have which is a team that will struggle to make the playoffs.

If we trade Lowry this core is dead in the water so I don’t see that as a solution unless we’re also going to make further trades and go in to a complete rebuild. This team as constructed is nothing with out Lowry. Which is my concern considering Lowry is nearing the end of his career.

Last point, we should never ever bank on free agency. When Giannis was an option it was different because there’s a connection there with Masai. But in general terms we have never been a desirable free agent destination.

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Curious what the proposed deal for Harden is without adding OG, Siakam or Lowry. Have a hard time believing other teams won't beat it. I'd be excited if it happened, but honestly, I'm ready for a retool/rebuild.

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Originally Posted by smith&wesson

Don’t respond to him. Let Aman and I deal with him

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Won't respond any more. Just irritating to see those posts.

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Originally Posted by pebloemer

Definitely happy to discuss this. I agree that a core of FVV/OG/Siakam isn't enough. Those are 3 really good pieces of a supporting cast. As a team, overall team play led to a lot of success last year. That doesn't work with weak links, which a now have many. We aren't seeing Norm from last year (is he really just a jump shooter that curls of screens now?). Ibaka and Gasol were huge sources of strength. Other teams (ie. Atlanta, Indiana, Brooklyn, Philly) will all be better than they were last year. I would have us on the playoff fringe. My pre-season prediction was 6th, but I had higher expectations for Baynes in that scenario (he hasn't looked good IMO). I think we are probably 7-10 range in the East this year.

So what to do with Lowry and how to add to FVV/Siakam/OG?

3 options:

1. Trade. I don't believe this team can acquire Harden without giving pieces from that core up. Probably 2 of those pieces + picks IMO. Which is terribly risky and I don't think we'd be able to win around Harden. I think trading needs to look to the future. As such, anyone should be on the block in the right deal. I think Lowry for futures is the most sensible.

2. Draft. 2021 draft is said to be loaded. Lottery odds are more balanced. Trading Lowry for futures (picks or young players on rookie scales) could help our draft position and give us additional picks. This organization has excelled at drafting and developing. FVV/OG/Siakam are good, young and contract controlled players to help youth along.

3. FA. Once we wave goodbye to Kyle, we still have about 30 million in cap space. Is Oladipo a target? Jrue Holiday? DeRozan? Go after an RFA like Collins, Markannen, Lonzo?

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Good Points. Definitely agree with trading Lowry for future picks or a player with an upside. We hope Powell builds his value up so they can trade him as well.

The bigger question is what is MU upto? He has made sure the core is intact and rest of the guys are expiring in 2021. Would he return or is he planning to leave the team with a clean slate for the next President?

Stanley Johnson is the first guard off the bench again.

Malachi should have had more minutes especially in the 3rd quarter. But no they bring him in, in the 4th only after the Raptors had a large lead but come on with only like a couple of minutes left. If Malachi is ever goin to get better as a player, he needs more playing time.

Same could be said for Paul Watson, Jr

But Siakam not playing last night was a shocker I have to admit. But Nurse has him sit out cuz of what happened in Philly and I get that but then again I can also see it from Pascal's side because he was frustrated. I mean he isn't happy with this team right now. But if he ain't happy, the answer is very simple. He needs to start playin more aggressively when he is in-game but he has to take some responsibility. That is what superstars do especially when they hold themselves to the highest standard. He needs to start making more shots and getting aggressive especially when gettin to the basket. Or not just workin more on mid range but shooting from outside too more often.

Besides that, Len was hitting shots which I found surprising especially from outside.

Baynes should not be starting especially if he can't buy buckets...at this point let Len start or Boucher and have Baynes come off the bench.

VanVleet and Lowry were your bright spots but that is to be expected.

I know they won last night but they still looked unimpressive to me. The Knicks D was brutal and we still didn't put up a lot of points and the Raps didn't play great D, the Knicks just kept missing open 3s. Playing like that is not going to be a recipe for success against good teams. Hopefully they look at it as a win and build off it, but they just don't look like a team with a lot of confidence right now.

My thoughts on their first win...


It was nice to see Len play well. His corner 3's were MASSIVE in the 3rd quarter. The Raptors didnt finish off a lot of good possessions because they missed wide open shots most of the night letting NY hang around. I like the way he challenges people at the rim more than Baynes too. I find Baynes looks hesitant still on where he is supposed to be. If Len can step up he could steal Baynes' job..

Thank the lord for a Davis siting!!! He missed a few 3's, but he showed off his quickness and ability to finish at rim....with either hand as that lefty one in the second half was foolish. Hopefully it was enough to earn him minutes next game. I really want to see him, Powell and Siakam together on our second unit and try to run people to death in the middle of each half. All 3 can grab a rebound and beat most of the NBA down the floor.

OG still really struggling on offense.

A bench that brings athletes like Powell, Davis, Johnson and Boucher should be able to play solid Raptor defense.

Baynes is slow to react to basically everything on defence. He sets good screens on offence but brings no threat to finish as a roll man. No need to respect his jumper either. Len isn't much better but he can gobble up rebounds. That's what we desperately need right now.

Powell may have springs in his shoes but he's not a good defender. It's a big part of the reason why he's never been a starter. The Sixers showed just how easy it is to take Boucher out of games too. He racked up 2 fouls in under 3 minutes when he had to guard Dwight.

We have an incredibly undersized bench full of players that play subpar defence. It doesn't help that one of the best defenders off the bench (Bembry) has a habit of passing the ball to the other team.

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Originally Posted by R. Johnson#3

Baynes is slow to react to basically everything on defence. He sets good screens on offence but brings no threat to finish as a roll man. No need to respect his jumper either. Len isn't much better but he can gobble up rebounds. That's what we desperately need right now.

Powell may have springs in his shoes but he's not a good defender. It's a big part of the reason why he's never been a starter. The Sixers showed just how easy it is to take Boucher out of games too. He racked up 2 fouls in under 3 minutes when he had to guard Dwight.

We have an incredibly undersized bench full of players that play subpar defence. It doesn't help that one of the best defenders off the bench (Bembry) has a habit of passing the ball to the other team.

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I think Boucher is a good rim protector, he's just more of a 4 than a 5 unless teams are playing without a traditional C. If they go with Davis, Powell, Johnson/Watanabe, Boucher and Len that group really isn't undersized anywhere.

This team is trying to find a new identity. They lost two great defensive C's, and one of their primary scorers in Ibaka. I cringe every time Baynes shoots a 3. Its a shot put for crying out loud. Whatever coaches encouraged him to shoot should be fired. He needs to set picks, rebound and protect the paint as well as he can....and that's it imo.


I would start Len on Sat against Adams and bring Baynes off the bench if he gets in foul trouble. I think Len deserves it with his play the last 2 games.

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Originally Posted by bartron_44

This team is trying to find a new identity. They lost two great defensive C's, and one of their primary scorers in Ibaka. I cringe every time Baynes shoots a 3. Its a shot put for crying out loud. Whatever coaches encouraged him to shoot should be fired. He needs to set picks, rebound and protect the paint as well as he can....and that's it imo.


I would start Len on Sat against Adams and bring Baynes off the bench if he gets in foul trouble. I think Len deserves it with his play the last 2 games.

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Yeah he’s garbage. Can’t do any of those things really...