After 5 Years Is Ross Atkins the 2nd Best GM in Blue Jays History?

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Originally Posted by ChongInc.

Happ and Estrada were signed by lacava.

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I'm aware of that. If AA stuck around that wouldn't of happened as he was adamant on signing Price. That was my point.

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Originally Posted by Spiderdan22

It must be tough being you. You've back yourself so far into a corner that you can't see that Atkins is not the genius you think him to be. So far more of my predictions of how the season was going to go has come true than yours. Let's see...you jumped all over me because I called Ryu (although a good initial signing will be a liability by the time the Jays are competitive) and Pearson fragile flowers...oh look, Merryweather is hurt again and just got transferred to the 60 day...Biggio is showing that sophomore jinx...Jannsen and Tellez are fodder and I hope they shows up some night...the pitchers are thanking Bo for every extra extra pitch they have to throw...Vlad's doing much better!!!! Another bad contract given by Atkins in Tanner Roark (man he has a history of wasting money) is released...Hernandez OPS continues to fall and his war is only 0.1...yes right now Grichuk has better numbers...and we are yet again an inconsistent fledgling 500 team for the wait for it SIXTH YEAR OF THE REBUILD!!!

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lol

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Originally Posted by mike_noodles

I would say the major difference is that this team is far better setup for long term success than the other. They still need to do it of course, but in every area they seem better suited for sustainability.

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Bingo.

Some people are just so blinded by hate for Atkins or still have a boner for AA that they refuse to acknowledge this blatant fact. A team full of young players equipped with a loaded farm is a hell of a lot different than a team full of players on the wrong side of 30 with no farm. Not to mention the difference in team salary.

Are people really hating on Atkins after a 16-14 start to the season amidst a barrage of injuries? What a reach...

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Originally Posted by ChongInc.

6 years in and our best player was still brought in by his predecessor. His prospects aren’t living up to the hype yet (still lots of time), and his FA signings (and only decent draft pick in the year after bringing in his own staff) cannot stay healthy.

Still lots of work to do.

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What a bad post. You’re so much better than that.

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Originally Posted by hanton

Atkins trying so hard to build through the draft. Can't be done - well unless you are the Dodgers. They are a good model and we should strive to be like them, we are not close to having the same development structure as they do.

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Wow another bad post. You guys have gone into a slump.

Atkins haters should just pipe down. Your posts don’t age well I submit three years worth of posts as evidence. Lol.

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Originally Posted by Spiderdan22

Definitely not! Too many specs flame out. He is hoping that all of them work out. That leaves us with too many gaps to fill now. And players like Janssen are showing us who they really are now. How long until the next catcher is ready?

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3 for 3 lol. Another terrible take by an Atkins hater.

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Originally Posted by ChongInc.

6 years in and our best player was still brought in by his predecessor. His prospects aren’t living up to the hype yet (still lots of time), and his FA signings (and only decent draft pick in the year after bringing in his own staff) cannot stay healthy.

Still lots of work to do.

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Roster is full of prospects/young players that could be legit players. Some are due for a decline IMO (ie Teo or LGJ) but 2 of the 3 sons were brought in by the current regime and theyve been living up to the hype.

I dont get the reference for 6 years of rebuild. The roster hasnt been in rebuild mode for more than 3 years at the most. They made the playoffs in 2016. They also tried in 2017 but failed but not sure how that can be a rebuild year.

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Originally Posted by mike_noodles

Wow another bad post. You guys have gone into a slump.

Atkins haters should just pipe down. Your posts don’t age well I submit three years worth of posts as evidence. Lol.

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Never thought he'd be so polarizing.

In one case, you have a few who somehow are pricing in what happens in 2025 as something you should give him credit for in 2020 and give creidt for trivial things. And a few who said they wont give him credit even if they find success in later seasons.

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Originally Posted by Spiderdan22

Funny that think I'm an AA guy. I loved most of his trades by felt he never went all in. He got most of a team and never finished the job until he gave the farm away in 2015. He could of/should of had most of those gaps in the roster filled before the season. You don't retool a team like that in the middle of a season and expect it to be sustainable. But, he also didn't think twice make moves because a player was popular either. If the trade bettered the team he made the move. But really, I'm a Gillick guy,

And Boston was down for a year, but come on...how long before a team with the financial resources Boston has and a desire to win stays down for long. Sorry, but Boston is not going anywhere. They may regress a bit this year but will be a force in the East again sooner than later. The Yankees are underperforming right now and will move up. So will Tampa despite trading Snell. Jays are third, maybe fourth in the East if the inconsistent play continues. 500 teams usually fall well out of the playoff picture.

And the amount of injuries are a huge concern. One or two hurt maybe...but half the roster. Perhaps Shatkins could be doing a better job on those physical evaluations? Although I was thrilled Ryu signed in Toronto, why was he relatively cheap considering he was second in the cy young voting the year before? Perhaps he was a ticking time bomb for injuries? He will be a liability moving forward. This trip to the IL is just one of many.

And really? Run differential? Wow. That's grasping at straws. You could beat a team 20-0 one night and lose you next five in closer games and still have a great run differential. But in the end, you are just 1-6.

When can you finally admit that Shatkins has squandered this rebuild from day one and we are now suffering from his inability to manage a team when the rebuild started. He's relying on the draft and most specs flame out. He plan is based on the hope that every spec he draft works out and becomes a potential allstar. To do that he needed to get way more at the beginning of the rebuild than he did. Oh...btw...AA would have.

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Run differential is a valid stat over the course of a season to see how a team is doing and where they should be based on it. For as bad as our pitching has been, we have allowed the third least amount of Runs in the AL. That's with the left side of the D trying to lead the league in errors and with Ryu, Pearson, Merryweather, Phelps, Yates, Chatwood, Millone and Springer missing time and Roark in the rotation for a bit.

Speaking of injuries, we are leading the league in key player injuries in days missed this year and still above .500.

You may not like how Atkins operates, and that's fine. I didn't like how AA operated here, as it was with little regard to assets and not sustainable. How many trades did AA actually do well? For every Donaldson, there was a Dickey and Reyes. For every Wells, there was a Tulo. AA was an ave to mediocre GM at best that lucked out in our garbage assets developing into stars (JB and EE) from the prior regime, while also DFA'ing one of said stars.

With that in mind, he made a lot of moves and had a lot of luck with 2015. Atkins did enough in 2016 to keep them in the same spot. Since then we have had top 10 pipeline players to replenish the roster, while adding a top FA each year since the rebuild (Ryu, Springer and Semien). How many top FA's did AA sign other than an East Yorker who wanted to come home?

In terms of injuries, that comes with FA's as they typically are older. Older players tend to get hurt more and heal slower. It's not like he traded away the last pieces of the farm and took on $80M, 30+ injury prone SS that helped force us into a rebuild (that and father time).

Say what you will, we have higher level specs in our roster and the farm in these past years than at any point with AA. Elite homegrown players (on cheap contracts, the more the better) are what build the corner stones of competitive teams and dynasties (That and LAD money). When they get expensive is when you get a balancing act unless you have unlimited cap.

As for Boston, their spending days might be behind them as they are bleeding money, both in Boston and in Liverpool. I'm thinking they are currently over preforming due to schedule and lack of key injuries.

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Originally Posted by mike_noodles

Wow another bad post. You guys have gone into a slump.

Atkins haters should just pipe down. Your posts don’t age well I submit three years worth of posts as evidence. Lol.

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So I can like the team, cheer for them but I can't critique them? Come on Mike.

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Originally Posted by R. Johnson#3

I'm aware of that. If AA stuck around that wouldn't of happened as he was adamant on signing Price. That was my point.

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No he wasn’t.

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Originally Posted by mike_noodles

What a bad post. You’re so much better than that.

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What part do you disagree with?

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Originally Posted by Chaotic98

Run differential is a valid stat over the course of a season to see how a team is doing and where they should be based on it. For as bad as our pitching has been, we have allowed the third least amount of Runs in the AL. That's with the left side of the D trying to lead the league in errors and with Ryu, Pearson, Merryweather, Phelps, Yates, Chatwood, Millone and Springer missing time and Roark in the rotation for a bit.

Speaking of injuries, we are leading the league in key player injuries in days missed this year and still above .500.

You may not like how Atkins operates, and that's fine. I didn't like how AA operated here, as it was with little regard to assets and not sustainable. How many trades did AA actually do well? For every Donaldson, there was a Dickey and Reyes. For every Wells, there was a Tulo. AA was an ave to mediocre GM at best that lucked out in our garbage assets developing into stars (JB and EE) from the prior regime, while also DFA'ing one of said stars.

With that in mind, he made a lot of moves and had a lot of luck with 2015. Atkins did enough in 2016 to keep them in the same spot. Since then we have had top 10 pipeline players to replenish the roster, while adding a top FA each year since the rebuild (Ryu, Springer and Semien). How many top FA's did AA sign other than an East Yorker who wanted to come home?

In terms of injuries, that comes with FA's as they typically are older. Older players tend to get hurt more and heal slower. It's not like he traded away the last pieces of the farm and took on $80M, 30+ injury prone SS that helped force us into a rebuild (that and father time).

Say what you will, we have higher level specs in our roster and the farm in these past years than at any point with AA. Elite homegrown players (on cheap contracts, the more the better) are what build the corner stones of competitive teams and dynasties (That and LAD money). When they get expensive is when you get a balancing act unless you have unlimited cap.

As for Boston, their spending days might be behind them as they are bleeding money, both in Boston and in Liverpool. I'm thinking they are currently over preforming due to schedule and lack of key injuries.

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Atkins had us in the same spot in 2016 as 2015? Sry... what?
This, after siting run differential as a good measurement of a team hahaha. Dead.

Then talking up signing older FA, followed by pointing out that they have trouble staying healthy.

People keep forgetting that AA brought in the best prospect we have ever had - who is currently our franchise cornerstone. This team would be in shambles without Vlad.