Yankee off season thread, news, notes, rumors and ideas

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10-17-2020, 12:38 PM
YANKSGUY

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stevemil505

With Stanton as the full time DH, where do you play him to get those at bats? He's a butcher at third and, at least so far, hasn't looked much better in left.

Well, as long as urshela is here, he's getting little time at 3rd. Left field would be their only real option. Like you say, he hasn't looked much better there, but not terrible. Then what do you do with Frazier?
10-17-2020, 01:00 PM
Posada20

Quote:

Originally Posted by YANKSGUY

Well, as long as urshela is here, he's getting little time at 3rd. Left field would be their only real option. Like you say, he hasn't looked much better there, but not terrible. Then what do you do with Frazier?

There is just no valid reason to play andujar in the outfield over Frazier . This past season Frazier has earned his spot on the roster. It’s time to trade andujar , trade him to a team that needs a dh
10-17-2020, 01:19 PM
drt1010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Posada20

All of that is exactly why I am not convinced that sevy would have made a difference in the alds this season . And why I don’t think he could ever be counted on when it comes to winning a ws . So while I am not sure I agree with calling him trash I can certainly understand why you would feel that way.

Please Jorge. A green rook in Garcia and an ineffective Happ. OK Sevy wouldn't have made a difference!

I know who I would have preferred as an alternative.
10-17-2020, 01:52 PM
Kinkotheclown

if the Astros win the WS, I have to wonder if the fix is in. What a way to “clear” their names
Rays have never fallen apart like this.
10-17-2020, 02:10 PM
drt1010

Quote:

Originally Posted by sauronthepower

Funny you should mention all of those examples........it’s almost as if those very points may have may have been utilized somewhere before.

Let us not forget that Severino pitched to a stellar 5.83 ERA his first full season in the bigs.

Let us also not forget that Severino mentally imploded (I believe that he never actually possessed the mental acumen/fortitude/disposition required for the task) not once, not twice, but a stellar three consecutive playoff years in a row.

Let us not forget Severino forgetting the start time to arguably the biggest game of his career in a postseason must-have.

Trash is something that is both fetid and odious and needs to be discarded without question or hesitation.

I believe it is a perfectly apt and appropriate comparison.

I can't help but think your disdain for Cashman has a subliminal influence on your perspective of "Brian's Boy" Sevy. Imo a more objective analysis would not lead one to the same conclusion. I have admitted my own disappointment in his postseason performance, but that alone is not just cause to dismiss him ad hoc as trash.

Many MLB greats have struggled in the postseason, particularly early in their careers. Should that be the sole barometer on greatness? Has that defined their careers? Consider:

Glavine - His excellent World Series career — a 2.16 ERA, 4-3 record over eight starts — masks some significant struggles in others. In 1992, he allowed 13 hits and 10 runs over seven innings in two NLCS starts. In four other series, Glavine had an ERA of over 5.00. Overall, his 87 career walks are the most in postseason history.

Gooden - Gooden went winless in his postseason career, going 0-4. He posted an 8.22 ERA over three ALDS. At his peak form in 1986, Gooden went 0-2 with a 8.00 ERA against the Red Sox in World Series play, allowing 17 hits and walking four.

Kershaw - Kershaw has played an irreplaceable role in the Dodgers’ run of success over the decade but has often been at the center of their postseason letdowns as well. He owns a sub-.500 (9-10) postseason record despite owning the third-best winning percentage in regular-season history. He has allowed five or more runs eight times in his playoff career, the most in history, and is also one of two players ever to allow seven runs in consecutive postseason starts (2013-2014).

Peavy - The 2007 NL Cy Young Award winner stands as one of the most horrid postseason hurlers of all time. Over nine playoff starts, Peavy was owned to the tone of a 7.98 ERA and 1-5 record. He worked to a 1.82 WHIP, letting up 53 hits over 38 innings and walking 17 in the process. Over three World Series starts, Peavy had a 9.58 ERA, including a 12.79 showing amid two losses in the 2014 Series with the Giants.

Price - Baseball’s first $30 million per year pitcher, Price has performed well south of that in postseason value. Although he won a pair of games in relief, it took Price 10 years to win his first postseason start, which came in the 2018 ALCS. Up to that point, Price had routinely been shellacked in October, owning a 5.44 ERA between 2010 and 2017, offset by a 1-8 record and 11 home runs over 12 games.

Wakefield - The winningest pitcher in Red Sox history had a different type of luck with his signature knuckleball in October. Over 18 postseason appearances, Wakefield was hit hard to the tune of 54 earned runs over 72 innings (a 6.75 ERA). This included allowing 13 home runs and owning series ERAs of 11.81, 33.75, 13.50, 12.27 and 16.88. Of course in one of his better postseason showings in 2003, he let up the infamous Aaron Boone walk-off to end the ALCS.
10-17-2020, 02:54 PM
Posada20

Quote:

Originally Posted by drt1010

I can't help but think your disdain for Cashman has a subliminal influence on your perspective of "Brian's Boy" Sevy. Imo a more objective analysis would not lead one to the same conclusion. I have admitted my own disappointment in his postseason performance, but that alone is not just cause to dismiss him ad hoc as trash.

Many MLB greats have struggled in the postseason, particularly early in their careers. Should that be the sole barometer on greatness? Has that defined their careers? Consider:

Glavine - His excellent World Series career — a 2.16 ERA, 4-3 record over eight starts — masks some significant struggles in others. In 1992, he allowed 13 hits and 10 runs over seven innings in two NLCS starts. In four other series, Glavine had an ERA of over 5.00. Overall, his 87 career walks are the most in postseason history.

Gooden - Gooden went winless in his postseason career, going 0-4. He posted an 8.22 ERA over three ALDS. At his peak form in 1986, Gooden went 0-2 with a 8.00 ERA against the Red Sox in World Series play, allowing 17 hits and walking four.

Kershaw - Kershaw has played an irreplaceable role in the Dodgers’ run of success over the decade but has often been at the center of their postseason letdowns as well. He owns a sub-.500 (9-10) postseason record despite owning the third-best winning percentage in regular-season history. He has allowed five or more runs eight times in his playoff career, the most in history, and is also one of two players ever to allow seven runs in consecutive postseason starts (2013-2014).

Peavy - The 2007 NL Cy Young Award winner stands as one of the most horrid postseason hurlers of all time. Over nine playoff starts, Peavy was owned to the tone of a 7.98 ERA and 1-5 record. He worked to a 1.82 WHIP, letting up 53 hits over 38 innings and walking 17 in the process. Over three World Series starts, Peavy had a 9.58 ERA, including a 12.79 showing amid two losses in the 2014 Series with the Giants.

Price - Baseball’s first $30 million per year pitcher, Price has performed well south of that in postseason value. Although he won a pair of games in relief, it took Price 10 years to win his first postseason start, which came in the 2018 ALCS. Up to that point, Price had routinely been shellacked in October, owning a 5.44 ERA between 2010 and 2017, offset by a 1-8 record and 11 home runs over 12 games.

Wakefield - The winningest pitcher in Red Sox history had a different type of luck with his signature knuckleball in October. Over 18 postseason appearances, Wakefield was hit hard to the tune of 54 earned runs over 72 innings (a 6.75 ERA). This included allowing 13 home runs and owning series ERAs of 11.81, 33.75, 13.50, 12.27 and 16.88. Of course in one of his better postseason showings in 2003, he let up the infamous Aaron Boone walk-off to end the ALCS.

Outside of glavine those other pitchers you listed aren’t really great pitchers , I mean glavine is the only hall of famer on that list . They are good pitchers but not great . And besides glavine none of the others ever contributed to anything in the playoffs . Wakefield got his rings because of Pedro , schilling , manny and Ortiz . Gooden wasted his career on drugs , peavy was on mostly bad teams , price got his ring because of the players around him . And kershaw is an overrated hack who fails his team every year in the playoffs . So I don’t understand the point you are trying to prove here other than you are a cashman fan .
10-17-2020, 04:26 PM
808yankee

Quote:

Originally Posted by Webslinger

You want to trade 2 starters, potential all stars, not making very much, for someone, whos going to command maybe 30 million a year, after 2021?

On this team, we have a ton of players, who are literally walking wounds. Stanton, Judge, Hicks, even Gio and Voit. Maybe even Torres. What will we do if all of them go down at the same time? Andujar will be needed on this team.

Yes I would trade Voit and Frazier in the same deal if need be IF it nets Lindor or at least a #2 starter. People keep saying they are cheap but they are now arbitration eligible so they aren't exactly cheap anymore, affordable yes. Take a look at Johnny NY's link about arbitration it's somewhere back a few pages.

It all depends on Cashman's plan on how to build a championship team. But you can replace Voit with DJ, replace Frazier with Brantley and net Lindor. Yes that'll cost a lot of money/salary and that doesn't even take into account money for pitching.

Like Sauron says, the window for this team is now. Steinbrenner if he's serious about winning a championship needs to put up or shut up (apologizing to Yankee fans) and field the best Yankee team he can. All in 2021! I know, wishful thinking :p
10-17-2020, 04:31 PM
drt1010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Posada20

Outside of glavine those other pitchers you listed aren’t really great pitchers , I mean glavine is the only hall of famer on that list . They are good pitchers but not great . And besides glavine none of the others ever contributed to anything in the playoffs . Wakefield got his rings because of Pedro , schilling , manny and Ortiz . Gooden wasted his career on drugs , peavy was on mostly bad teams , price got his ring because of the players around him . And kershaw is an overrated hack who fails his team every year in the playoffs . So I don’t understand the point you are trying to prove here other than you are a cashman fan .

Give it a rest Jorge. I wasn't addressing you. Cashman has nothing at all to do with this. It focused and revolved around Sevy. Not great pitchers? Are they trash as suggested Sevy is? They all failed in postseason. :facepalm:
10-17-2020, 05:05 PM
Posada20

Quote:

Originally Posted by drt1010

Give it a rest Jorge. I wasn't addressing you. Cashman has nothing at all to do with this. It focused and revolved around Sevy. Not great pitchers? Are they trash as suggested Sevy is? They all failed in postseason. :facepalm:

Give what a break ? I made it clear that I didn’t agree with calling sevy trash in my response to sauron earlier . I just understood why he felt that way about sevy . And you have to admit as of right now sevy atleast isn’t far from being trash because of his durability issues . None of those pitchers you listed missed most or all of three consecutive seasons .
10-17-2020, 05:13 PM
drt1010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Posada20

Give what a break ? I made it clear that I didn’t agree with calling sevy trash in my response to sauron earlier . I just understood why he felt that way about sevy . And you have to admit as of right now sevy atleast isn’t far from being trash because of his durability issues . None of those pitchers you listed missed most or all of three consecutive seasons .

Goalposts twelve feet left, 10 yards in.

I said give it a rest, please do.
10-17-2020, 05:19 PM
sauronthepower

Quote:

Originally Posted by drt1010

I can't help but think your disdain for Cashman has a subliminal influence on your perspective of "Brian's Boy" Sevy. Imo a more objective analysis would not lead one to the same conclusion. I have admitted my own disappointment in his postseason performance, but that alone is not just cause to dismiss him ad hoc as trash.

Many MLB greats have struggled in the postseason, particularly early in their careers. Should that be the sole barometer on greatness? Has that defined their careers? Consider:

Glavine - His excellent World Series career — a 2.16 ERA, 4-3 record over eight starts — masks some significant struggles in others. In 1992, he allowed 13 hits and 10 runs over seven innings in two NLCS starts. In four other series, Glavine had an ERA of over 5.00. Overall, his 87 career walks are the most in postseason history.

Gooden - Gooden went winless in his postseason career, going 0-4. He posted an 8.22 ERA over three ALDS. At his peak form in 1986, Gooden went 0-2 with a 8.00 ERA against the Red Sox in World Series play, allowing 17 hits and walking four.

Kershaw - Kershaw has played an irreplaceable role in the Dodgers’ run of success over the decade but has often been at the center of their postseason letdowns as well. He owns a sub-.500 (9-10) postseason record despite owning the third-best winning percentage in regular-season history. He has allowed five or more runs eight times in his playoff career, the most in history, and is also one of two players ever to allow seven runs in consecutive postseason starts (2013-2014).

Peavy - The 2007 NL Cy Young Award winner stands as one of the most horrid postseason hurlers of all time. Over nine playoff starts, Peavy was owned to the tone of a 7.98 ERA and 1-5 record. He worked to a 1.82 WHIP, letting up 53 hits over 38 innings and walking 17 in the process. Over three World Series starts, Peavy had a 9.58 ERA, including a 12.79 showing amid two losses in the 2014 Series with the Giants.

Price - Baseball’s first $30 million per year pitcher, Price has performed well south of that in postseason value. Although he won a pair of games in relief, it took Price 10 years to win his first postseason start, which came in the 2018 ALCS. Up to that point, Price had routinely been shellacked in October, owning a 5.44 ERA between 2010 and 2017, offset by a 1-8 record and 11 home runs over 12 games.

Wakefield - The winningest pitcher in Red Sox history had a different type of luck with his signature knuckleball in October. Over 18 postseason appearances, Wakefield was hit hard to the tune of 54 earned runs over 72 innings (a 6.75 ERA). This included allowing 13 home runs and owning series ERAs of 11.81, 33.75, 13.50, 12.27 and 16.88. Of course in one of his better postseason showings in 2003, he let up the infamous Aaron Boone walk-off to end the ALCS.

Doc, while your initial point about measuring postseason performance against overall career quality is a fair one, are you really going to try and include Luis Severino in a conversation amongst those pitchers??

Doc..................................come back to the reservation.
10-17-2020, 05:21 PM
Posada20

Quote:

Originally Posted by drt1010

Please Jorge. A green rook in Garcia and an ineffective Happ. OK Sevy wouldn't have made a difference!

I know who I would have preferred as an alternative.

Stop using the rookie excuse for Garcia not being used in the playoffs . Buck showalter had no problem using a rookie pettitte to start a game in the 95 alds . Joe torte had no problem using joba and Hughes from the bullpen as rookies in the playoffs in 07 . Cashman stood pat at the deadline this year instead of trading Garcia . So if he chose to stick with Garcia at the deadline then there was no reason for Garcia to not start game 3 or 4 in the alds .
10-17-2020, 05:24 PM
Posada20

Quote:

Originally Posted by drt1010

Goalposts twelve feet left, 10 yards in.

I said give it a rest, please do.

Give what a rest ? And you are the one moving goal posts by actually comparing sevy an unproven injury prone kid to a great like glavine and good pitchers like the others . That just makes no sense since sevy hasn’t accomplished anything compared to what those other pitchers did
10-17-2020, 05:30 PM
drt1010

Quote:

Originally Posted by sauronthepower

Doc, while your initial point about measuring postseason performance against overall career quality is a fair one, are you really going to try and include Luis Severino in a conversation amongst those pitchers??

Doc..................................come back to the reservation.

No! I am merely suggesting even very good / great pitchers struggled in the postseason. Why hold Sevy to a standard you wouldn't hold all?

I never left.
10-17-2020, 05:31 PM
drt1010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Posada20

Give what a rest ? And you are the one moving goal posts by actually comparing sevy an unproven injury prone kid to a great like glavine and good pitchers like the others . That just makes no sense since sevy hasn’t accomplished anything compared to what those other pitchers did

No such comparison exists. You are fabricating. See my post above for explanation.

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