This is why they kneel

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09-13-2020, 05:58 PM
valade16

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeyc77

No because the cut in taxes would not impact the cash flow quick enough to offset that type of change in a small business.

What if the $15 minimum wage didn’t go into effect until after the tax cuts effect the businesses? Like say give the businesses the tax cut a year early.
09-13-2020, 06:01 PM
joeyc77

Quote:

Originally Posted by spliff(TONE)

No, we don't agree on that. Your comparison was patently ridiculous regardless. At least you've finally admitted that your issue isn't actually that people wanting a higher federal minimum wage are being "too vague".

So you think small businesses could handle not only doubling the wage for minimum wage employees but also give conditional raises to other employees as well? I personally know or have worked with/for many small business owners who would disagree with you and that’s not because of their greed. It’s because their company wouldn’t survive.

I stated early on that protestors asked for $15 an hr minimum wage. Politicians who support these protestors typically use the term livable wage but won’t really define what that term includes.
09-13-2020, 06:01 PM
spliff(TONE)

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeyc77

They can hide their feelings in not calling every black persons the n-word but working in that type of political or corporate environment, an individual needs to respect their coworkers and especially individuals at a higher level then them. I don’t not see how a racist person could do this consistently. As you even said, eventually their feelings would come to be known. So they are either extremely good at hiding their feelings or eventually they get outed and typically lose their success, which is my point.

Your point is absurd.
09-13-2020, 06:02 PM
valade16

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeyc77

They can hide their feelings in not calling every black persons the n-word but working in that type of political or corporate environment, an individual needs to respect their coworkers and especially individuals at a higher level then them. I don’t not see how a racist person could do this consistently. As you even said, eventually their feelings would come to be known. So they are either extremely good at hiding their feelings or eventually they get outed and typically lose their success, which is my point.

Well yeah, Donald Sterling was forced to sell his team... but only after he gained tremendous success despite being racist. If Stephen Miller gets fired tomorrow because he’s a racist, it doesn’t change he was able to rise to that level of success despite being racist in the first place.

You did not happen to comment on how so many people get caught on social media doing racist tirades if it’s impossible to work with or even for minorities. Do you think everyone who is caught in a racist tirade only worked for white people?

Mel Gibson’s anti-Semitic tirade came after working for Jewish producers and studio heads for 20 years. Michael Richards racist tirade came after performing next to many black actors (such as Jackie Child’s). How do you explain how they were able to work next to minorities despite espousing racist views?
09-13-2020, 06:03 PM
joeyc77

Quote:

Originally Posted by valade16

What if the $15 minimum wage didn’t go into effect until after the tax cuts effect the businesses? Like say give the businesses the tax cut a year early.

For many small businesses, cash flow is week to week. I also don’t believe enough of a tax break exists to offset this type of raise in wages.
09-13-2020, 06:05 PM
spliff(TONE)

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeyc77

So you think small businesses could handle not only doubling the wage for minimum wage employees but also give conditional raises to other employees as well? I personally know or have worked with/for many small business owners who would disagree with you and that’s not because of their greed. It’s because their company wouldn’t survive.

I stated early on that protestors asked for $15 an hr minimum wage. Politicians who support these protestors typically use the term livable wage but won’t really define what that term includes.

I know for a fact small business could survive just fine in the area I live, hence why I disagree with your statement that "small businesses would cease to exist". Obviously, many in other states would be negatively impacted but again: I mentioned $15/hr as a starting point and/or ceiling.
09-13-2020, 06:05 PM
valade16

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeyc77

For many small businesses, cash flow is week to week. I also don’t believe enough of a tax break exists to offset this type of raise in wages.

Do you think we should even have a minimum wage at all?
09-13-2020, 06:11 PM
joeyc77

Quote:

Originally Posted by valade16

Well yeah, Donald Sterling was forced to sell his team... but only after he gained tremendous success despite being racist. If Stephen Miller gets fired tomorrow because he’s a racist, it doesn’t change he was able to rise to that level of success despite being racist in the first place.

You did not happen to comment on how so many people get caught on social media doing racist tirades if it’s impossible to work with or even for minorities. Do you think everyone who is caught in a racist tirade only worked for white people?

Mel Gibson’s anti-Semitic tirade came after working for Jewish producers and studio heads for 20 years. Michael Richards racist tirade came after performing next to many black actors (such as Jackie Child’s). How do you explain how they were able to work next to minorities despite espousing racist views?

If people are willing to hide their views and work with minorities, I would argue they aren’t really racists despite one or two indiscretions. Being a real racist is like being really religious. You believe in something despite evidence to the contrary.

Would a really religious person have an abortion even if they couldn’t afford a baby? I would say it’s about their needs and in some cases, their needs outweigh their religiousness. The same is true of racists. Sometimes their need or desire for success outweighs their need to be racist.
09-13-2020, 06:13 PM
joeyc77

Quote:

Originally Posted by spliff(TONE)

I know for a fact small business could survive just fine in the area I live, hence why I disagree with your statement that "small businesses would cease to exist". Obviously, many in other states would be negatively impacted but again: I mentioned $15/hr as a starting point and/or ceiling.

You must live among the wealthy then....
09-13-2020, 06:16 PM
joeyc77

Quote:

Originally Posted by valade16

Do you think we should even have a minimum wage at all?

Personally, no. I think it only lowers wages. Although with our current requirement on college level education, I see the need for it.
09-13-2020, 06:16 PM
spliff(TONE)

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeyc77

If people are willing to hide their views and work with minorities, I would argue they aren’t really racists despite one or two indiscretions. Being a real racist is like being really religious. You believe in something despite evidence to the contrary.

Would a really religious person have an abortion even if they couldn’t afford a baby? I would say it’s about their needs and in some cases, their needs outweigh their religiousness. The same is true of racists. Sometimes their need or desire for success outweighs their need to be racist.

You are really stretching to defend that ridiculous statement you made. :laugh2:
09-13-2020, 06:25 PM
ewing

This is why they kneel

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeyc77

Personally, no. I think it only lowers wages. Although with our current requirement on college level education, I see the need for it.

this guy complains that others are not practical

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
09-13-2020, 06:25 PM
spliff(TONE)

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeyc77

You must live among the wealthy then....

I live among the really wealthy, the really poor, and all people in between those two extremes. Either way about it, your point has been negated. Small businesses wouldn't entirely cease to exist if a $15/hr federal minimum wage was introduced (and again, that figure is merely a starting point).
09-13-2020, 06:26 PM
joeyc77

Quote:

Originally Posted by spliff(TONE)

You are really stretching to defend that ridiculous statement you made. :laugh2:

How is it stretching? Racism is like a religion. It’s pure belief in something despite evidence to the contrary. I can see at some point in history when people could get away with this belief. But not in this century for sure.

Do you think a racist would allow a non white doctor to operate on them to save their lives? Their kids lives? I do not believe a real racist would entertain this idea because they would consider a non white doctor to be of lesser capabilities and intelligence than a white doctor. Similarly, there’s religious knuckleheads who would pray so god can save their child’s life rather than a doctor.
09-13-2020, 06:33 PM
joeyc77

Quote:

Originally Posted by spliff(TONE)

I live among the really wealthy, the really poor, and all people in between those two extremes. Either way about it, your point has been negated. Small businesses wouldn't entirely cease to exist if a $15/hr federal minimum wage was introduced (and again, that figure is merely a starting point).

As I said, I know small business owners and very worked with/for small businesses all over the country and most could not sustain a $15 an hr minimum wage. They would also need to give non minimum wage workers A huge increase in wages.

I haven’t even brought up this point, but do you think large corporations would hire as many minimum wage employees at $15 an hr or would they enforce technological advances to replace them? My money is on the latter. FFS we all currently work for Walmart anytime we walk in that store now.

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