Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez

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Originally Posted by Hawkeye15

Shouldn't we be trying to make life more affordable though? I get working 80 hours a week does it for some, but many of us realize we only have 1 life, and spending it in an office, away from loved ones and adventure, is a waste. Sure there is a balance, but we can't continue this wage stagnation while the cost of EVERYTHING skyrockets. Something has to give.

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You’re smarter than this

Making college education free will devalue college in itself and not get this country anywhere. There’s going to be too many people in college (people who shouldn’t be) and will devalue the degrees people already have.

College is too expensive and costs need to be reduced but offering free college is beyond stupid and could really hurt this country.

Of course though people don’t care because they want everything free.

Free healthcare! Free College! Free housing! Of course all that crap sounds good until you figure the cost it would take to achieve all those things


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Originally Posted by Hawkeye15

b.s. Life is about balance. Nobody should be working 50-60 hours a week just to make ends meet. My Mom died at 65, and one of the last things she said to me was to live today, because nobody is promised tomorrow. She is 100000% right.

Dude, if you don't understand that our fathers and mothers were able to raise a family on a mechanics income and send them to college, have a retirement fund, and pay off their mortgage, you aren't following what is happening. We CAN'T strap our youth with debt up to their eyeballs. We CAN'T continue to have Americans living paycheck to paycheck. Something has to give. And it isn't the people need to work harder and worry about enjoying life when their body doesn't work right anymore..

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Because too many people are stupid and believe that a college degree is necessary to survive in this country which is stupid. You don’t need to go to college just because your mom or dad want you to or your teacher says it’s needed. I know many people who work 40 hours make 75-100 k per year and didn’t pay one dime to go to school.

But all you hear is “you have to go to school to succeed in life!l which is bull


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Originally Posted by FlashBolt

You don't need to go to college to succeed. You don't even need a high school diploma. There are classes for computer programming and some are free if you are willing to just use YouTube, etc., You can create anything these days and most don't require a college degree. These are decisions one has to make before enrolling in college. No one forces anyone to do anything. Students AGREE to the debt and then find out they shouldn't. Whose fault is that?

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I was replying to Hawkeye before seeing this but this post nails it 100%.




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Originally Posted by DeW-Star

1). No you are wrong. College does on a macro level make you more educated. It also makes you more successful and productive. It may not make you more intelligent, but there is even evidence out there that education builds intelligence by stimulating your brain at a time when you are still growing and expanding your potential brain capacity.

So just because you can be someone who didn’t go to college and be more educated on a micro level does not equate to the facts on a macro level. And of course there are different ways to educate yourself. That’s not new news.

2). It should never be a case of ‘if you can afford it’. That limits the growth and potential of our economy by unnecessarily stagnating growth by a factor of which has no intrinsic bearing on success.

And if that’s my opinion about debt not being crippling then I’d like to know how it’s wrong? Just go ahead and look at the student debt situation and how it affects our economy. The macro level affect on people is real.

3).How would making college more affordable penalize those who work 2-3 jobs on the side? They would benefit from that as well because then that income can be put to better use. And conflating not working 2-3 jobs while attending college as laziness is a lazy argument. Are we a lazy society now that we have protections against child labor? And again, people on a macro level can’t all work 2-3 jobs. That just doesn’t work. The jobs don’t just appear out of nowhere.

I agree that college and higher education should be for those who can benefit from it. That’s why there is testing for it. And I bet if there was large government subsidies there’d be controls to the price structure. The problem is that even the people who do benefit from college aren’t seeing enough of a benefit because of the sheer amount of debt. And if people bail on college those jobs go to outsiders and foreign countries to fill the needs. That’s not good for the economy at all.


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Some of the most successful people in this country didn’t go to college. Some of the most successful people in this country didn’t even graduate high school.

Saying that going to college makes you more educated is wrong. A lot of college kids now a days use school to get drunk and party anyways.

And if you make it free how would they do testing? If you think everyone should have access to college should they accept everyone who is willing to go? How would that exactly work and where would all these kids go to school at?


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Originally Posted by FlashBolt

College does not make you more educated, buddy. It's a means to become certified. The only way someone can be more educated is if they take steps to be. You can be more educated and knowledgeable without college by doing your own research, studies, speaking with professionals, etc., All college does is provide you a criteria of what you need to do to be certified. It's a common thing in the NBA forums. Some assume someone who is in the NBA is more knowledgeable about basketball than people on PSD and that's also incorrect. Being in the NBA doesn't mean you know more about basketball. Similarly here, learning how to think, process information, and expand on what you know makes you more educated than any textbook colleges tell you to buy. I'm not wrong here - you are. College is becoming more outdated as time goes by because the content it used to provide you wasn't available online. Nowadays, everything you learn in college can be found online. In fact, many YouTube videos or classes (yes, there are free recorded classes online from some of the best colleges out there) are more informative than college professors are. What colleges does is provide a foundation but if you yourself aren't willing to learn, there is nothing anyone can do to make you more educated. It seems you're a victim of the college system. Going to college thinking it makes you more educated at the expense of increasing your debt is the #1 mistake students make.

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You keep saying you can be more educated. However if you were educated you would know that outliers do not make something consistently true.

When you take out statistical noise, people are vastly more educated and successful by just about every measure the more schooling they have. And here’s a news flash, outside of college courses can also deliver education. They aren’t mutually exclusive.

I do agree that college is going to evolve with the new avenues that online technology deliver. It’s also why I said many jobs can be remote these days in another discussion.

And nobody is saying that you automatically become educated if you enroll in college. Of course you also need to apply yourself correctly as well.

You are 100% wrong. Because we are looking at the big picture. Micro level discussions on to what one person can do are worthless because they don’t scale up. Kind of like how you said people should work 2-3 jobs. Not everyone can do that because it would change the dynamic when you’d scale that up.


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Originally Posted by Brewersfan255

Some of the most successful people in this country didn’t go to college. Some of the most successful people in this country didn’t even graduate high school.

Saying that going to college makes you more educated is wrong. A lot of college kids now a days use school to get drunk and party anyways.

And if you make it free how would they do testing? If you think everyone should have access to college should they accept everyone who is willing to go? How would that exactly work and where would all these kids go to school at?


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Ad hoc micro level examples mean nothing. Outliers are a thing in large data sets you know.

Free doesn’t guarantee access to college. We have testing already. It’s not like it’s a new concept here.


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Originally Posted by Brewersfan255

You’re smarter than this

Making college education free will devalue college in itself and not get this country anywhere. There’s going to be too many people in college (people who shouldn’t be) and will devalue the degrees people already have.

College is too expensive and costs need to be reduced but offering free college is beyond stupid and could really hurt this country.

Of course though people don’t care because they want everything free.

Free healthcare! Free College! Free housing! Of course all that crap sounds good until you figure the cost it would take to achieve all those things


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Making college free does not devalue it. That’s absolute nonsense.

The cost is easily achievable, it’s implemented in many places already. And it’s better for society overall then saddling people with debt before they can adequately handle it. Which is why it’s better served as a tax based funding.


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Originally Posted by Brewersfan255

You’re smarter than this

Making college education free will devalue college in itself and not get this country anywhere. There’s going to be too many people in college (people who shouldn’t be) and will devalue the degrees people already have.

College is too expensive and costs need to be reduced but offering free college is beyond stupid and could really hurt this country.

Of course though people don’t care because they want everything free.

Free healthcare! Free College! Free housing! Of course all that crap sounds good until you figure the cost it would take to achieve all those things


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Where countries have free college it increases not decreases competition for college. Kids work HARDER in primary schools because Free college doesn't mean you get in.

You are smarter than this.

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Originally Posted by Brewersfan255

Some of the most successful people in this country didn’t go to college. Some of the most successful people in this country didn’t even graduate high school.

Saying that going to college makes you more educated is wrong. A lot of college kids now a days use school to get drunk and party anyways.

And if you make it free how would they do testing? If you think everyone should have access to college should they accept everyone who is willing to go? How would that exactly work and where would all these kids go to school at?


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Some of the most successful people are deformed. Some of the most successful people have cancer. Some of the most successful people...

How bout we consider this. I'm assuming you define most successful as richest... and besides debating the that statement (which is debatable) let's just go with it. GO to the Topof page 3 https://files.stlouisfed.org/files/h...-wealth_SE.pdf

Just because some doesn't mean more likely.

Maybe you aren't smarter than this.

And before you go... "different major" in a whiny voice

http://money.com/money/collection-po...ut-of-college/

That is right out of college. So even an English major averages more RIGHT OUT OF COLLEGE than the average High school grad at all times. Plus if you want a job writing, you aren't likely to do that without a degree.

I understand you NEED to justify YOUR choices... But ignoring reality is ignoring reality.

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Originally Posted by DeW-Star

Ad hoc micro level examples mean nothing. Outliers are a thing in large data sets you know.

Free doesn’t guarantee access to college. We have testing already. It’s not like it’s a new concept here.


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So not everyone deserves college?


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Originally Posted by DeW-Star

Making college free does not devalue it. That’s absolute nonsense.

The cost is easily achievable, it’s implemented in many places already. And it’s better for society overall then saddling people with debt before they can adequately handle it. Which is why it’s better served as a tax based funding.


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When you have many more people who go into your program and graduate it does devalue it


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Originally Posted by Brewersfan255

Because too many people are stupid and believe that a college degree is necessary to survive in this country which is stupid. You don’t need to go to college just because your mom or dad want you to or your teacher says it’s needed. I know many people who work 40 hours make 75-100 k per year and didn’t pay one dime to go to school.

But all you hear is “you have to go to school to succeed in life!l which is bull


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Someone is still bitter about getting rejected by their favorite college.

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Originally Posted by FlashBolt

No. There are living standards in every country that are different. If you want to truly live life, work in America and then retire some place that your purchasing power is higher. You could easily retire with $150,000 by moving to Vietnam, India, etc., If you live in America, you're already doing better financially than most of the world. Fundamentally, I just think you're wrong. No one needs to work 50-60 to make ends meet unless external issues exist.

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Ok, stick with me here, you clearly don't get it.

Our parents, were able to do the following on an average salary:

Buy a single family home
Raise 2-4 kids on a single income
Stash away retirement savings, and actually retire at a decent age
Have affordable healthcare
Send their kids to college if they chose to

All of this on an average income.

Today, that isn't possible. It's not. You claim we are doing better financially in America than most other places, but you are wrong. That used to be true. It isn't anymore. Wages have not stuck with the costs of homes rising, the cost of education rising, the cost of child care rising, the cost of healthcare rising, nor anything else for that matter. Over half of all Americans have no retirement savings, and debt on top of it. You claim its all about choices. Fine. The point is, those same choices were made only 30 years ago with the ability for people to afford all of those items that people can no longer afford on average salary.

Wage gap is getting worse. The disparity in wealth has never been greater. The middle class is shrinking by the day. If this is the America you want, have it. Because it's not the America we all grew up in. And if I hear a single baby boomer talk about how the younger generations are lazy, I am going to neck chop them.

who said free college btw? I am referring to making college affordable again. Btw, even with free college, it doesn't mean everyone gets in. In fact, competition has shown to be greater in countries with free college in regards to the applying student base. To add to that, anyone who is against more people going to college is an idiot. It would only benefit our society to have more educated people.

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Originally Posted by Brewersfan255

So not everyone deserves college?


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of course not. Why would you think that? Everyone deserves the opportunity to go to college, if they earn it. And that opportunity doesn't exist today without that person coming out with massive debt in many circumstances.