Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez

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Originally Posted by Sluggo1

But free college tuition is serious?

The post was made in sarcasm (and you knew that) to point out that preaching free anything will get you a good following.

The base point is that nothing is free (and you know that too). Is the road in front of my house free. Sure. I don't pay a toll to drive on it so it's free…except for my real estate taxes.

So campaigning on free tuition, or free health care or free 4 bedroom homes is actually campaigning for a massive tax hike to pay for the free "stuff."

And while we're trying to look at it logically (call me madcap)…why is it that the ones who are most supportive of free anything seem to have nothing. People who actually have any thing…money, property, assets etc.…are far less supportive of free stuff since they're the ones that will pay for it.

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bingo. You can't come in with that mantra and not get immediate divide. We talk about how Trump needs to rope it in, as a politician, you can't just say things like "free" anything. That doesn't exist. Develop the idea into something people can swallow, not just laugh off.

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Originally Posted by Sluggo1

And while we're trying to look at it logically (call me madcap)…why is it that the ones who are most supportive of free anything seem to have nothing. People who actually have any thing…money, property, assets etc.…are far less supportive of free stuff since they're the ones that will pay for it.

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Except.. that's not remotely true. You have a Trump streak in you -- just lie and lie and lie and hope nobody will notice.

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Originally Posted by Walter_White

Absolutely it is.

Nobody EVER asks how we are going to pay for our endless military budget, our endless war budget, or our endless tax cuts for the wealthy. But when someone suggests that we -- God forbid -- make a 4 year college program free, which has broad support, that's when we hear about how we can't pay for it. It's pathetic and transparent and America clearly isn't falling for it.

This is not even mentioning the fact that the money saved from a program like is put back into the economy, while money thrown at the military is more like throwing the money in an incinerator.

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Never heard a politician cry out, "Free national defense".

Yes, the military budget is crazy inflated, and that money needs to be directed to education/urban infrastructure. But when you go around yelling, "free college", which actually isn't even possible (nothing is free), you get labeled extreme quickly.

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Originally Posted by Hawkeye15

Never heard a politician cry out, "Free national defense".

Yes, the military budget is crazy inflated, and that money needs to be directed to education/urban infrastructure. But when you go around yelling, "free college", which actually isn't even possible (nothing is free), you get labeled extreme quickly.

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Okay if you want to play silly word games like "nothing is technically 'free'" (duh), then that just makes it clear to everyone that you have no actual argument. Everyone - EVERYONE - here knows that when people talk about the idea of "free college" they are talking about the idea of having the government cover the costs of tuition. There's already been many suggestions on how to pay for this. Raise taxes on the wealthy, cut the inflated defense budget, cut corporate tax breaks.

You act like we're the first country to propose such a thing -- which is nonsense. Germany, for example, already does this. And do it effectively.

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Originally Posted by Walter_White

Except.. that's not remotely true. You have a Trump streak in you -- just lie and lie and lie and hope nobody will notice.

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What's not true?????

Is it the people that have nothing are in support of free stuff…that is true for the most part. Not 100%. I'm sure some well to dos are supportive of this. But for the most part, its the have nothings.

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Originally Posted by Walter_White

Okay if you want to play silly word games like "nothing is technically 'free'" (duh), then that just makes it clear to everyone that you have no actual argument. Everyone - EVERYONE - here knows that when people talk about the idea of "free college" they are talking about the idea of having the government cover the costs of tuition. There's already been many suggestions on how to pay for this. Raise taxes on the wealthy, cut the inflated defense budget, cut corporate tax breaks.

You act like we're the first country to propose such a thing -- which is nonsense. Germany, for example, already does this. And do it effectively.

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again, my point is, if you walk around saying "free" anything, you immediately get labeled. You just can't do that and be taken seriously by half the population.

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Originally Posted by Sluggo1

What's not true?????

Is it the people that have nothing are in support of free stuff…that is true for the most part. Not 100%. I'm sure some well to dos are supportive of this. But for the most part, its the have nothings.

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:laugh: And you have some sort of evidence of this?

Laughable man!

https://media.giphy.com/media/61Uxg0...KXfc/giphy.gif

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Originally Posted by Hawkeye15

again, my point is, if you walk around saying "free" anything, you immediately get labeled. You just can't do that and be taken seriously by half the population.

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Oh, so now you're bashing the word choice, and not the idea itself.

I've already shown you that this has 60% support from the public.

You're wrong, just take the L and move on like a man, Jesus dude.

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Originally Posted by ciaban

It's not just foreign affairs, she attributed unemployment being at a record low "because everyone is working 2 jobs, and 60-80 hours a week just to get by"
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/vi..._two_jobs.html

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Been through this a half dozen pages ago.

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Originally Posted by Hawkeye15

eh, he kinda just says **** without even checking if it's true or not. We all know people like that, they just make claims with no basis. A politician is groomed to never be like this, so for some people, it's refreshing to have such an honest person in politics. The problem is, his facts are incorrect, and he is clearly a racist who is really only interested in leaving a footprint behind as a "big business" President. He is pissing off people at an alarming rate, and while the damage he can do isn't as bad as I thought it would be (because nobody takes him seriously), Trump isn't exactly a step in the right direction.

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As I said a few pages ago, that might make sense when you speak off the cuff in an unregulated environment, responding at the moment to a pointed question perhaps. Does not, however, come anywhere near justifying his tweets. He lies, and he knows it.

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Originally Posted by Hawkeye15

again, my point is, if you walk around saying "free" anything, you immediately get labeled. You just can't do that and be taken seriously by half the population.

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Yep, it sounds like ******** to a lot of people. Whenever someone on the left talks about free in state tuition and single payer they need to outline how it will be paid for and how it will reduce costs for the individuals. I do think those problems are more related to the media’s short attention span and the way we hold debates. We never get to the details of any proposals, all about the catchphrase.

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Originally Posted by Crovash

As I said a few pages ago, that might make sense when you speak off the cuff in an unregulated environment, responding at the moment to a pointed question perhaps. Does not, however, come anywhere near justifying his tweets. He lies, and he knows it.

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It’s his strategy. Look over here, look over here

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Originally Posted by Hawkeye15

Never heard a politician cry out, "Free national defense".

Yes, the military budget is crazy inflated, and that money needs to be directed to education/urban infrastructure. But when you go around yelling, "free college", which actually isn't even possible (nothing is free), you get labeled extreme quickly.

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Obviously nothing is “free.” We’re all paying for it in some form.

Just curious: “free” K-12 is how different from “free” 4 years of college? I have no dog in this fight per se, but I’m curious whether anyone has done the maths here.

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Originally Posted by Crovash

Obviously nothing is “free.” We’re all paying for it in some form.

Just curious: “free” K-12 is how different from “free” 4 years of college? I have no dog in this fight per se, but I’m curious whether anyone has done the maths here.

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Who believes k-12 is free? People pay for it through taxes, mostly in local property taxes(here anyway). School referendums are on the ballot all the time. Nevermind registration fees that people pay every year. Obviously I’m for “free” in state tuition, but free doesn’t play where I live. Access, and how that access is made more available wins every time.

I talk to a lot of farmers regularly about health care. Free ends the conversation with single payer. We spend more for less access, you will spend less than your current policy in the additional taxes, etc..moves the needle. They see free as ******** magic. It’s not free, tell them how it will save them money and give them better access

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Originally Posted by Walter_White

:laugh: And you have some sort of evidence of this?

Laughable man!

https://media.giphy.com/media/61Uxg0...KXfc/giphy.gif

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Wow\. I must be wrong. You have funny faces and silly videos. That seals the deal.