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View Full Version : When GMs like Sam Presti Stop Getting Overrated Recognition



LaVar Ball
07-08-2019, 11:33 AM
The one thing we've learned about presti is that he's so great! A genius! One of if not the best exec in the business!!!




WHAT IN THE HELL HAS HE DONE?!?!?!?!?!




Harden - gone for a measly $4M (not annually, but of the entire contract !)


KD - gone for nothing



Paul George - gone for picks and Shai, sure, but like you just throw out any chance of competing.



Now Westy is out on his way.





Everyone jizzes over the Thunder making the 2012 finals, but for 7 seasons it has been crap. Does Presti warrant being the GM, or is he simply of the trend of the "Great White Hope" of NBA GMs and not having African Americans to represent NBA Teams?


Presti gets a pass year in and year out. He's always active in transactions, but those transactions lead to NOTHING!!!!! Dude is overrated af!




Thoughts

mightybosstone
07-08-2019, 11:39 AM
I think Presti's biggest mistake was putting all his eggs in the Westbrook basket, who's clearly the inferior player of the three stars. But ultimately the guy has done a pretty damn good job. He drafted those three guys in the first place and hit on a few other solid players in the draft like Adams and Ibaka. And despite losing Harden and Durant, he pulled off a pretty savvy deal out of nowhere that netted him Paul George and then somehow found a way to keep him in OKCónot exactly the sexiest market to play in.

Also, I think the guy deserves a ton of credit for what he's doing right nowórecognizing the team has plateaued as a 5-8 seed with no real potential to improve and doing something about it. Too many front offices would have stayed pat with Westbrook and George, won 48 games the next three years and never gotten past the second round of the playoffs and been totally fine with that. He recognized the team had zero chance to win a title, knew there was a demand for George and got a king's ransom for him from the Clippers.

Have the Thunder won any titles? No. Have they kept all their star players? No. But I've said it a million times on this site, and I'll say it againóyou cannot judge a player, team or GM's success solely by "Did they win a title or not?" There are 20+ franchises who'd probably love to have Presti running their front officeódude's good at what he does.

Giannis94
07-08-2019, 12:15 PM
I actually like what Presti has done. KD/Westy/Harden & being able to navigate that when they're all young and immature is a tough task for anyone. Also, let's not forger that the cap has exploded since he had to make cap decisons and it wasn't possible to have max guys back then.

R. Johnson#3
07-08-2019, 12:23 PM
People say Sam Presti is a good GM?

Giannis94
07-08-2019, 12:29 PM
People say Sam Presti is a good GM?

Looks adt trams like the Kings, Knicks, Suns, bulls and tell me how he's not . Yes.

IndyRealist
07-08-2019, 12:43 PM
He's credited with Durant, Westbrook, and Harden. They were all high draft picks and basically no brainers. Trading Harden was obviously bad. Trading for PG was a coup, it was the rest of the roster that he failed to improve. Controlling RWB is not on Presti, that's on the coach.

All things considered I'd say he's average, middle of the pack. Meaning he's better than about half the guys out there with his job title.

smith&wesson
07-08-2019, 01:32 PM
I think he got a boat load of assets for PG and is going to get some more by dealing WB. The future looks bright.

The biggest mistake was letting Harden go. He should have prioritized Hardens signing over anyone else at the time. Losing Harden was the beginning of the end.

SteBO
07-08-2019, 01:40 PM
The biggest mistake was letting Harden go. He should have prioritized Hardens signing over anyone else at the time. Losing Harden was the beginning of the end.
This was back when the big man was more valued than perimeter players. I know, cuz Brooks kept playing Kendrick Perkins for no good reason. Ibaka was a pretty big deal at that point.

ewing
07-08-2019, 02:41 PM
The one thing we've learned about presti is that he's so great! A genius! One of if not the best exec in the business!!!




WHAT IN THE HELL HAS HE DONE?!?!?!?!?!




Harden - gone for a measly $4M (not annually, but of the entire contract !)


KD - gone for nothing



Paul George - gone for picks and Shai, sure, but like you just throw out any chance of competing.



Now Westy is out on his way.





Everyone jizzes over the Thunder making the 2012 finals, but for 7 seasons it has been crap. Does Presti warrant being the GM, or is he simply of the trend of the "Great White Hope" of NBA GMs and not having African Americans to represent NBA Teams?


Presti gets a pass year in and year out. He's always active in transactions, but those transactions lead to NOTHING!!!!! Dude is overrated af!




Thoughts

You should settle down


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Cal827
07-08-2019, 02:48 PM
For the hand he was dealt, I think he's done a pretty good job... The Harden deal sticks out as a big mistake, but as someone said, this was before the Big Man Value had deteriorated... Also, was it the Owners who capped out on Harden's deal? Cause if they weren't budging, then I don't think it was Presti's fault necessarily if the owners weren't able to pay him.

Ibaka was a good choice, Adams was a decent choice too (I know Giannis was available but still). The Paul George trade was risky, but initially was successful as not only were they able to get him to play, but resign as well (I know Oladipo played well in Indiana, BUT his game wasn't meshing with Westbrook at all).

Now the man seems to understand that the team probably be able to build team around Westbrook and win, so he's selling. He dangled Westbrook and George with Toronto, in order to get a massive haul for George (so they could get Kawhi). A team like Miami, Detroit, Houston or another team will probably offer a large haul for Westbrook as well.

The Thunder will have a ton of assets to begin the rebuild, which is much more than most teams who were contenders for a while are able to get (E.g. Remember the Lakers praying that their picks didn't fall out of the top 3 because of a risky trade they made with Phoenix, or the Nets debacle when they tried to contend taking advantage of Boston).

With how some other GMs run, I would be happy if Presti was the GM. (I mean we have Webster/Ujiri so I'm not gonna say that I'd prefer him :laugh2: ) The man has tried for years for a winner; if the Thunder were to let him go, he'd definitely not spend that much time without a job IMO as he's probably a top 5-10 GM.

R. Johnson#3
07-08-2019, 03:05 PM
Looks adt trams like the Kings, Knicks, Suns, bulls and tell me how he's not . Yes.

I donít get your point? Also Vlade got Buddy Hield and 2 picks for Boogie. That move alone puts him miles ahead of Presti. Not to mention his recent drafting.

mightybosstone
07-08-2019, 06:22 PM
I donít get your point? Also Vlade got Buddy Hield and 2 picks for Boogie. That move alone puts him miles ahead of Presti. Not to mention his recent drafting.

:eyebrow: Really? Because at the time, pretty much everyone wondered what the hell the Kings were doing. Feel free to look up trade grades at the time, but here's the first one I pulled up from a reputable source (Spoilers: they don't like it for the Kings): https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/kings-reportedly-deal-demarcus-cousins-to-pelicans-grade-the-trade/

Gormans Mic
07-08-2019, 06:47 PM
dudes even toxix on vague message boards, good luck to those kids having to deal with toxic salt dog Labumblvar

zn23
07-08-2019, 07:06 PM
I believe they had a winning season every year except two and a playoff appearance during his tenure which is pretty impressive. More than Daryl Morey has done in that same period.

Let's not make it sound like he's Ernie Grunfeld.

JAZZNC
07-08-2019, 07:19 PM
I believe they had a winning season every year except two and a playoff appearance during his tenure which is pretty impressive. More than Daryl Morey has done in that same period.

Let's not make it sound like he's Ernie Grunfeld.

Exactly. He's done a really good job IMO. They made a Finals appearance and we're one game away from another Finals. Was trading Harden a good look in hindsight?? No, but Harden wasn't what he is now. Since then he's done what he can to make things work.

IndyRealist
07-08-2019, 08:15 PM
:eyebrow: Really? Because at the time, pretty much everyone wondered what the hell the Kings were doing. Feel free to look up trade grades at the time, but here's the first one I pulled up from a reputable source (Spoilers: they don't like it for the Kings): https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/kings-reportedly-deal-demarcus-cousins-to-pelicans-grade-the-trade/

I mean, I loved the trade. Given the salary differences and what they thought of Hield, it was a steal. Cousins was not a very productive player in Sacramento, especially given his contract.

kobe4thewinbang
07-08-2019, 08:32 PM
Presti has made some big name moves, but post-Durant has failed to build a sensible roster around Westbrook.

The Lakers just signed twenty shooters in one day.

Meanwhile, OKC still has Roberson FFS (career 25% 3PT).

Can Adams shoot threes? Can Patterson? Can Carmelo? Can Schroder? This should not be so difficult.

People wonder why Russ takes so many threes: who else should be shooting them? Then he trades George for Gallinari, but now theyíre trying to give up on Westbrook.

Losing Durant for nothing is damning enough, but after Westbrook is traded, I expect he will be terminated, even if he gets some good players because again, he does not know how to build a cohesive team.

R. Johnson#3
07-08-2019, 09:57 PM
:eyebrow: Really? Because at the time, pretty much everyone wondered what the hell the Kings were doing. Feel free to look up trade grades at the time, but here's the first one I pulled up from a reputable source (Spoilers: they don't like it for the Kings): https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/kings-reportedly-deal-demarcus-cousins-to-pelicans-grade-the-trade/

Thatís great for them. I remember the hate he garnered but Iíve been anti Boogie for quite a while now. Heís great at fantasy basketball but canít play winning basketball. The 6 different coaches in 7 years is pretty telling.

hugepatsfan
07-08-2019, 11:30 PM
I donít blame him for losing Durant for nothing. You canít trade KD unless he demands it. And he seemed very distraught about leaving for even a layup chance at championships with GS.

He totally botched the Harden situation. Deserves every bit of criticism for that.

I think heís overall done an excellent job of acquiring talent but his problem is he doesnít consider fit really. Like trading Ibaka while he has value for Oladipo was smart talent wise but his game didnít fit. Melo was a name acquisition whose game didnít fit. The list goes on and on. He just doesnít seem to see the bigger picture beyond individual talent.

ewing
07-09-2019, 12:26 AM
:eyebrow: Really? Because at the time, pretty much everyone wondered what the hell the Kings were doing. Feel free to look up trade grades at the time, but here's the first one I pulled up from a reputable source (Spoilers: they don't like it for the Kings): https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/kings-reportedly-deal-demarcus-cousins-to-pelicans-grade-the-trade/

Some people still think Boogie is a good basketball player and guys entering league over 19 canít be good. Those people are idiots


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

bucketss
07-09-2019, 01:57 AM
he turned ibaka into oladipo/sabonis than turned that into paul george, than made clippers overpay for him by using raptors as leverage. pretty impressive

valade16
07-09-2019, 10:22 AM
... Is the OP implying there's some racial angle as to why Presti still has a job or is thought of as a good GM?

Heediot
07-09-2019, 10:28 AM
he's top 10. just can't get over the hump.

elite with trades but his drafting pushes him down some.

Giannis94
07-09-2019, 10:50 AM
he's top 10. just can't get over the hump.

elite with trades but his drafting pushes him down some.

Right. which is why he has every right to be able to right the ship with his treasure-trove of assets he's now got. Look at teams that consistently pick in the top 5-8 year after year and can't land one star. Presti took 3 without having the #1 pick or having the #2 pick more than once. That's still pretty ****ing hard to do when Westy & Harden were not the clear cut consensus best player available at the time (like KD was)

smith&wesson
07-09-2019, 12:56 PM
This was back when the big man was more valued than perimeter players. I know, cuz Brooks kept playing Kendrick Perkins for no good reason. Ibaka was a pretty big deal at that point.

Ibaka was fine. He was a dpoy so I get his value at the time. It was the Perkins signing I didnít agree with.

Saddletramp
07-09-2019, 07:13 PM
I believe they had a winning season every year except two and a playoff appearance during his tenure which is pretty impressive. More than Daryl Morey has done in that same period.

Let's not make it sound like he's Ernie Grunfeld.

What? Morey never had the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th picks in consecutive drafts. He never had better than the 14th pick. He inherited Yao who retired so he got nothing and McGrady was nothing by the time he was traded and he still got Harden out of it a few years later after trading away Kevin Martin who he got in the deal for McGrady.


The Rockets also never had a losing season under Morey and the three playoff misses were as the ninth seed in a tough Western Conference where his best player was Kevin freaking Martin. Also, a lot of the guys he drafted, signed, or traded for went on to be something special (maybe not in Houston but usually thatís not on the GM).

I know you hate the Rockets and Iím not dissing on Presti but that wasnít contextually fair.

LaVar Ball
07-11-2019, 09:36 PM
BUMP


Whatever happened to the notion that you never trade an all star or superstar within the same conference ?!


Paul George: OKC to Clippers

Russell Westbrook: OKC to Houston


(Btw F U Popvoch for believing in that make believe notion)



R.I.P. Seattle Sonics/OKC Thunder 2007-2019.

IndyRealist
07-11-2019, 09:39 PM
BUMP


Whatever happened to the notion that you never trade an all star or superstar within the same conference ?!


Paul George: OKC to Clippers

Russell Westbrook: OKC to Houston


(Btw F U Popvoch for believing in that make believe notion)



R.I.P. Seattle Sonics/OKC Thunder 2007-2019.

OKC isn't trying to compete with them for the next 4ish years. I doubt they care much if LA/HOU are good. Most of those picks are going to be traded to reload the roster is my guess. If LA and/or Houston crash and burn, that's just bonus.

goingfor28
07-11-2019, 10:36 PM
Albert Nahmad
@AlbertNahmad
OKC 1sts:
2020 Own (1-20)
2020 DEN (11-30)
2021 Own (HOU 5-30 swap right)
2021 MIA (HOU 5-30 swap right)
2022 Own (1-14)
2022 LAC
2023 Own (LAC swap right)
2023 MIA (15-30)
2024 Own
2024 LAC
2024 HOU (5-30)
2025 Own (LAC and HOU 21-30 swap right)
2026 Own
2026 LAC
2026 HOU (5-30)
8:53 PM ∑ Jul 11, 2019

NBA all the way
07-11-2019, 10:42 PM
All the Thunder have to do is move Adams now and they will pretty much have purged themselves of last season's playoffs starting 5, lol

TheMightyHumph
07-11-2019, 10:44 PM
The one thing we've learned about presti is that he's so great! A genius! One of if not the best exec in the business!!!




WHAT IN THE HELL HAS HE DONE?!?!?!?!?!




Harden - gone for a measly $4M (not annually, but of the entire contract !)


KD - gone for nothing



Paul George - gone for picks and Shai, sure, but like you just throw out any chance of competing.



Now Westy is out on his way.





Everyone jizzes over the Thunder making the 2012 finals, but for 7 seasons it has been crap. Does Presti warrant being the GM, or is he simply of the trend of the "Great White Hope" of NBA GMs and not having African Americans to represent NBA Teams?


Presti gets a pass year in and year out. He's always active in transactions, but those transactions lead to NOTHING!!!!! Dude is overrated af!




Thoughts

Presti's okay.

Harden had to go because he couldn't Durant, Harden and Westbrook all that money.

Harden and Westbrook both need the ball.

They did get Steve Adams back.

He ahould have traded Westvrook instead of Olapida & Sabonis at the time.

Durant hates Westbrook

Only one NBA Champion per year. That's the rule.

He seems to have made some good trades thus far this pffseason.

Scoots
07-12-2019, 01:01 PM
We'll never know how much of the issue with his "worse" moves are a direct result of orders from ownership.

valade16
07-12-2019, 01:45 PM
We'll never know how much of the issue with his "worse" moves are a direct result of orders from ownership.

Yeah I mean, I find it hard to believe Presti ever trades Harden if he had unlimited money. It's not Presti's fault that he traded Harden if ownership said "You will trade Harden".

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-12-2019, 02:21 PM
:eyebrow: Really? Because at the time, pretty much everyone wondered what the hell the Kings were doing. Feel free to look up trade grades at the time, but here's the first one I pulled up from a reputable source (Spoilers: they don't like it for the Kings): https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/kings-reportedly-deal-demarcus-cousins-to-pelicans-grade-the-trade/

Clearly, everyone was wrong about that trade. For all the reasons that guy mentioned that it was a bad trade, he was wrong about damn near all of them lol.

Wrigheyes4MVP
07-12-2019, 02:31 PM
I think Presti's biggest mistake was putting all his eggs in the Westbrook basket, who's clearly the inferior player of the three stars. But ultimately the guy has done a pretty damn good job. He drafted those three guys in the first place and hit on a few other solid players in the draft like Adams and Ibaka. And despite losing Harden and Durant, he pulled off a pretty savvy deal out of nowhere that netted him Paul George and then somehow found a way to keep him in OKCónot exactly the sexiest market to play in.

Also, I think the guy deserves a ton of credit for what he's doing right nowórecognizing the team has plateaued as a 5-8 seed with no real potential to improve and doing something about it. Too many front offices would have stayed pat with Westbrook and George, won 48 games the next three years and never gotten past the second round of the playoffs and been totally fine with that. He recognized the team had zero chance to win a title, knew there was a demand for George and got a king's ransom for him from the Clippers.

Have the Thunder won any titles? No. Have they kept all their star players? No. But I've said it a million times on this site, and I'll say it againóyou cannot judge a player, team or GM's success solely by "Did they win a title or not?" There are 20+ franchises who'd probably love to have Presti running their front officeódude's good at what he does.

I agree... he's a good GM, but his faith in Westbrook was his big mistake. Westbrook is an overrated stat stuff who is incredibly inefficient. I get the idea of going all in on him if he is your only talented young star, but the Thunder had options. They should have prioritized those other options over Westbrook. I don't entirely blame Presti because I think his goal was to build around both Westbrook AND Durant for years to come, but it didn't work out mainly because of the high volume and low efficiency of Westbrook. IMO, that drove Durant away and was the unintended consequence that plagued this franchise. If they had chosen Harden instead and traded Westbrook for some solid assets/players to compliment Harden, Durant, and Ibaka... they might have won a championship and maybe that keep that team together longer.

Who knows would would have happened, but all I know is that Westbrook was not the right guy to prioritize on that team. You can't win with someone that inefficient and Westbrook never improved in that area. For a guy who is considered a superstar, it's rare to have a situation like this where you face his team and you are practically begging for him to take more shots because you know it will improve your odds of beating them. He's at that level of inefficiency. I'm watching my team face the Thunder this year and I'm like "please don't pass to PG13, please don't pass to PG13... take the shot yourself".

Scoots
07-12-2019, 08:29 PM
Yeah I mean, I find it hard to believe Presti ever trades Harden if he had unlimited money. It's not Presti's fault that he traded Harden if ownership said "You will trade Harden".

Or "you will not go over the cap"

Scoots
07-12-2019, 08:35 PM
I agree... he's a good GM, but his faith in Westbrook was his big mistake.

He didn't really have a choice. Harden vs Westbrook was a pretty easy choice for Westbrook 8 years ago, and once that deal was made he was stuck trying to keep KD happy, then all he had to be relevant was Westbrook. The roster around them was up to Presti for the most part, but the stars being moved he had little option.

TrueFan420
07-12-2019, 09:18 PM
Ibaka was fine. He was a dpoy so I get his value at the time. It was the Perkins signing I didnít agree with.

To be fair you got to remember the context of the league at that time. The Lakers were the top dogs with Gasol, Bynum and Odom. They had a massive front line and gave teams fits with their size. The 3 point shot wasnít king yet. They moved Harden for a young guard in Lamb who turned out to be a very solid player in his own right, picks and the cap space to keep their bigs to defend the lakers and other teams that relied on size.

LaVar Ball
07-15-2019, 12:38 AM
The Great White Hope!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BF7Mnv-t6dU