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View Full Version : League Wide Tampering - Can anything really be done?



More-Than-Most
07-04-2019, 03:37 AM
This wont be popular because its pro lakers but the lakers/clippers/raptors are about to get **** on pretty hard for trying to sign the best free agent on the market because all other free agents are almost off the board.... The thing is most free agents literally signed as soon as free agency opened up which 100 percent was tampering... I am fine with tampering because you cant stop it but over the last 2 years the league has **** on the lakers for tampering but then allow this to happen.... So and i get it everyone hates the lakers like the yankees and i dont blame anyone but the NBA really has an issue here... If you are going to **** on an organization for tampering this type of **** in free agency cant happen... Free agency opened up earlier which also screwed the lakers/clippers/raptors but so many players signing right off the back is ****ed up esp when these 3 teams are trying to go for 1 top player and whoever misses out will be ****ed hardcore.... yet this isnt getting talked about for some reason.


This just sets up a really terrible thing down the line... example... KL is the defending champion... i still think he signs with the lakers but imagine he is holding out just to screw over the lakers so they cant add a butler/or a ton of depth with their money and then signs with the raptors or clippers and the lakers end up with lebron/AD/Kuzma and crap? I feel like that is ****ed. Smart as hell but ****ed


I also get people hate the lakers/celtics/warriors etc because they win... but man this really seems ****ed up and everyone always screams out when magic etc tamper but where are all the people screaming out now? It feels like as fans we only want to destroy lebron when he tampers or anyone with the lakers organization... How is that right after witnessing free agency constantly?

More-Than-Most
07-04-2019, 04:05 AM
The rumor is sixers had a deal with horford 2 weeks before free agency started lololol... come on. I am happy about it BUT COME ONE.

More-Than-Most
07-04-2019, 04:06 AM
https://clutchpoints.com/sixers-rumors-al-horford-leaving-celtics-for-philly-was-done-two-weeks-ago/


**** i am happy as hell for it but how is this right?

Chronz
07-04-2019, 04:26 AM
What would be hilarious is if Kawhi doesn't sign with a team until a few weeks before camp when there is literally no one left but G-Leaguers. Seeing Bron get screwed that way would be such a fitting end to his career. I picture the Lakers dropping out realizing they've been played and the last team left is the one who doesn't blink.

But yeah, nobody should really give a **** about these fake rules. Sometimes players talk to other players about playing together while they are actually competing against each other.

Scoots
07-04-2019, 04:37 AM
Teams and agents are allowed to talk a lot ... the tampering stuff is just for show.

Dade County
07-04-2019, 04:40 AM
This just sets up a really terrible thing down the line... example... KL is the defending champion... i still think he signs with the lakers but imagine he is holding out just to screw over the lakers so they cant add a butler/or a ton of depth with their money and then signs with the raptors or clippers and the lakers end up with lebron/AD/Kuzma and crap? I feel like that is ****ed. Smart as hell but ****ed


Don't worry, Pat will be just a phone call away.

Dragic will fit in very nicely. They should also think about Waiters as well. Both of these players are better then anything they can get out there in free agency at the moment.

Dragic deal expires after this season, and Waiters has 2yrs remaining on his deal at around 12mil I believe.

Chronz
07-04-2019, 04:48 AM
The rumor is sixers had a deal with horford 2 weeks before free agency started lololol... come on. I am happy about it BUT COME ONE.

Do you think the Sixers purposely targeted Miami as a trading partner in order to lessen the blow from losing a potential lottery pick in the trade with the Clippers?

More-Than-Most
07-04-2019, 04:56 AM
Do you think the Sixers purposely targeted Miami as a trading partner in order to lessen the blow from losing a potential lottery pick in the trade with the Clippers?

yes... and that is what is most alarming... the heat could have laughed at us and we would have been ****ed... they didnt and we got richardson out of it even though 2 weeks before we had horford as a plan over 1 of harris or butler... it seems like the sixers knew they would get 1 of those 2 and would just fill in horford over the other guy and its smart but illegal as ****... once they realized they had their 2 they just said here miami... here is jimmy so give us your 3 and D guy who is super young for free... Its not right man.

mike_noodles
07-04-2019, 08:17 AM
There was just a on article out that said the league doesnít care about tampering as long as the players season is finished.

tredigs
07-04-2019, 08:29 AM
There was just a on article out that said the league doesnít care about tampering as long as the players season is finished.

Exactly this, and nobody else should either. What is truly tampering and complete bs is what Lebron, Rich Paul and the Lakers did with AD where they got a superstar under contract for another 2 years to demand a trade and essentially tank a season for them.

That said, it all worked out amazingly for the Pels because they got lucky in the draft and the Lakers front office is run by complete idiots.

NBA all the way
07-04-2019, 08:58 AM
Not a huge Windy fan but the way he explained it on the jump made a lot of sense to me. Once a player is a free agent be it April, May or June the NBA doesn't care what they do.

It's the in-season public comments that the NBA feel they need to regulate and control.

Personally, idc about tampering. Most players talk and are friends because of AAU, USA basketball and/or college anyway.

As far as Kawhi waiting, it doesn't impact the Raptors much, they're over the cap either way.

It would suck for the Clippers but their core from last season that made the playoffs is still intact. They could use their money to just round out the rotation.

It hurts the Lakers the most, who have to do the AD trade Saturday, then will lose some money towards the max if the Kawhi decision goes past that day. Furthermore, they only have 3 guys on their roster.

Dade County
07-04-2019, 10:30 AM
It hurts the Lakers the most, who have to do the AD trade Saturday, then will lose some money towards the max if the Kawhi decision goes past that day. Furthermore, they only have 3 guys on their roster.

The Lakers & HEAT can workout that problem together.

Lakers will be fine. Everyone needs a backup plan. Dragic & either Waiters or Olynyk to the Lakers if Kawhi doesn't sign there.

NBA all the way
07-04-2019, 12:21 PM
The Lakers & HEAT can workout that problem together.

Lakers will be fine. Everyone needs a backup plan. Dragic & either Waiters or Olynyk to the Lakers if Kawhi doesn't sign there.

No one wants Waiters or Kelly man. No one wants any of the Heat's contracts. They're all overpays. Some of the expirings might have an appeal at the trade deadline but next summer's free agent class is historically weak with tons of restricted guys.

The Lakers aren't gonna trade for a Dragic or Teague type guard. They'll just bring Rondo back for less than half what those guys make.

LeBron does most the ball handling anyway.

They agreed to terms with Daniels, Dudley and THT. Plus the 3 players they have. From there, Korver and Smith will come. Melo might try to join up. If/when Iggy gets bought out. Could easily bring in Cousins, McGee or Chandler.

They only have to get to 14 guys by opening night. They're not gonna use most their money on Dragic or Teague and they 100% aren't taking Waiters and Dragic to eat all their cap space.

Heat will have to give up assets to move Waiters and Johnson, maybe Kelly too.

Dade County
07-04-2019, 01:58 PM
No one wants Waiters or Kelly man. No one wants any of the Heat's contracts. They're all overpays. Some of the expirings might have an appeal at the trade deadline but next summer's free agent class is historically weak with tons of restricted guys.

The Lakers aren't gonna trade for a Dragic or Teague type guard. They'll just bring Rondo back for less than half what those guys make.

LeBron does most the ball handling anyway.

They agreed to terms with Daniels, Dudley and THT. Plus the 3 players they have. From there, Korver and Smith will come. Melo might try to join up. If/when Iggy gets bought out. Could easily bring in Cousins, McGee or Chandler.

They only have to get to 14 guys by opening night. They're not gonna use most their money on Dragic or Teague and they 100% aren't taking Waiters and Dragic to eat all their cap space.

Heat will have to give up assets to move Waiters and Johnson, maybe Kelly too.

Lakers will need quality players on their roster. The West is deep. Those guys you mentioned are at those prices for a reason.

I guess we will find out after Kawhi makes his decision.

Dragic contract is good. He was just battling an injury.

smith&wesson
07-04-2019, 03:07 PM
This wont be popular because its pro lakers but the lakers/clippers/raptors are about to get **** on pretty hard for trying to sign the best free agent on the market because all other free agents are almost off the board.... The thing is most free agents literally signed as soon as free agency opened up which 100 percent was tampering... I am fine with tampering because you cant stop it but over the last 2 years the league has **** on the lakers for tampering but then allow this to happen.... So and i get it everyone hates the lakers like the yankees and i dont blame anyone but the NBA really has an issue here... If you are going to **** on an organization for tampering this type of **** in free agency cant happen... Free agency opened up earlier which also screwed the lakers/clippers/raptors but so many players signing right off the back is ****ed up esp when these 3 teams are trying to go for 1 top player and whoever misses out will be ****ed hardcore.... yet this isnt getting talked about for some reason.


This just sets up a really terrible thing down the line... example... KL is the defending champion... i still think he signs with the lakers but imagine he is holding out just to screw over the lakers so they cant add a butler/or a ton of depth with their money and then signs with the raptors or clippers and the lakers end up with lebron/AD/Kuzma and crap? I feel like that is ****ed. Smart as hell but ****ed


I also get people hate the lakers/celtics/warriors etc because they win... but man this really seems ****ed up and everyone always screams out when magic etc tamper but where are all the people screaming out now? It feels like as fans we only want to destroy lebron when he tampers or anyone with the lakers organization... How is that right after witnessing free agency constantly?

The raptors are over the cap regardless if Leonard stays or goes, so itís not like we could have signed anyone else either. We can retain him because we have his rights, but we canít go spend that money else where.

But I agree if he doesnít go to the LA teams that he really messed them up because they do/did have the space to target other players and now that market has shrunk on them significantly.

NBA all the way
07-04-2019, 03:11 PM
Lakers will need quality players on their roster. The West is deep. Those guys you mentioned are at those prices for a reason.

I guess we will find out after Kawhi makes his decision.

Dragic contract is good. He was just battling an injury.

Waiters isn't a quality player, nor on a good contract. I'd take any of the players I mentioned at minimum over 2 years of Waiters at $12 million per, that's borderline robbery.

Dragic is okay man, not $20 million when the Lakers have a butt load of roster spots to fill good though. He's just getting older and coming off an injury. Teague has almost a similar contract and circumstance. Their teams are willing to give them away for next to nothing for a reason.

tredigs
07-04-2019, 11:14 PM
Lmao @ MTM going silent on his own thread when I called out the reality of tampering.

MTM - own your **** ups. Especially when you make a thread about it.

Happy 4th buddy.

More-Than-Most
07-05-2019, 12:31 AM
Lmao @ MTM going silent on his own thread when I called out the reality of tampering.

lol i post in so many threads because my knowledge is so needed that sometimes i lose track... Also anything lebron related i just attribute to hate when it comes to you because.... wait for it................................................ .................................


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zd62MxKXp8


: )


Happy 4th my dude

tredigs
07-05-2019, 12:49 AM
lol i post in so many threads because my knowledge is so needed that sometimes i lose track... Also anything lebron related i just attribute to hate when it comes to you because.... wait for it................................................ .................................


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zd62MxKXp8


: )


Happy 4th my dude

Aww. The Marshmallow center Lebron had in between being owned by the Dubs before and after. A bitter-sweet memory.

Imagine the Sixers knowing that sorrow :laugh:

Second round losses are something though. "The Process" is only 7 years in. You got this.

Dade County
07-05-2019, 12:51 PM
Hi


Waiters isn't a quality player, nor on a good contract. I'd take any of the players I mentioned at minimum over 2 years of Waiters at $12 million per, that's borderline robbery.

Dragic is okay man, not $20 million when the Lakers have a butt load of roster spots to fill good though. He's just getting older and coming off an injury. Teague has almost a similar contract and circumstance. Their teams are willing to give them away for next to nothing for a reason.

Bobby Marks of ESPN & others have reported that Lakers can go after Dragic, if they can't land Kawhi.



As the world waits for the decision of Kawhi Leonard, the Lakers are sitting with their hands tied. With only enough to offer the max for Kawhi, they cannot sign any players that will hurt their cap until he makes his choice.

The problem is, if he doesnít sign with the Lakers, their options are going to be limited. They have virtually no depth, and with the majority of free agents already committed to teams, it will be hard for L.A. to find players worthy of paying $10+ million contracts to.

So, as a resolution, they might look at the trade market, where Miami has been eagerly awaiting someone to take Goran Dragic off their hands.

According to Bobby Marks of ESPN, should the Los Angeles Lakers fail to sign Kawhi Leonard in free agency, they may then turn their attention to Dragic, as the Lakers could absorb his salary in a trade.

& the Lakers are not the only team interested in Dragic., it's just that everyone is waiting on the Kawhi signing.

https://fadeawayworld.net/2019/07/02/nba-rumors-lakers-could-trade-for-goran-dragic/


@ramonashelburne
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The Heat is still working on options to complete the Jimmy Butler sign and trade with Philadelphia, according to a league source. Out of respect for Goran Dragic, the Heat are working with him and his representatives to find a trade partner by July 6.

Stay tune

NBA all the way
07-05-2019, 01:51 PM
Hi



Bobby Marks of ESPN & others have reported that Lakers can go after Dragic, if they can't land Kawhi.






Stay tune
I don't buy it man. It's not logically sound to try and fill 10 to 11 roster spots with $12 million in cap space plus a room exception just to help the Heat out.

Look for Rondo, Green, Cousins, Melo, Morris and KCP to divvy up that $32 million if they strike out on Kawhi.

With potential offer sheets to Oubre and Wright.

Then fill in vet mins with Korver, JR, McGee, Chandler and obviously the 2 commits from Dudley and Daniels already in place.

SiteWolf
07-05-2019, 05:06 PM
lol i post in so many threads because my knowledge is so needed

:facepalm:

latinofire21
07-06-2019, 03:35 PM
It kind of sickens me the way the NBA has turned out. This is the first time in any of the sports that I really wish the teams had more control over player movement. Reports surfaced that basically said Leonard first tried to recruit Durant to the Clippers and when he was unsuccessful he reached out to George who is actually under contract and convinced him to request a trade?

In the end I think the Thunder made out well but what that one conversation did was completely destroy a western conference title contender. They went from contention to rebuild overnight. They even tried to ship Westbrook with George to the Raptors to fully go into rebuild. This all done by a conversation by Leonard to George?

How is the team benefiting most from this not even getting sanctions? Magic Johnson cant talk to players openly that aren't under his own team but a Free Agent can? Seems to me like there should be some new rules in place that stop this super team b.s. Its killing the competitiveness of the sport.

Your thoughts?

numba1CHANGsta
07-06-2019, 03:39 PM
Yeah players have too much power now. There needs to be a balance, but will be hard to come to an agreement on. I expect a lockout next CBA.

Bostonjorge
07-06-2019, 03:51 PM
Yeah players have too much power now. There needs to be a balance, but will be hard to come to an agreement on. I expect a lockout next CBA.

If a lockout does come it will come from the players side. The owners TV deal gives them 24 $Billion reasons not to lockout. The players will ask for a bigger cut of the pie and the owners will fold and allow more tampering to not stop any kind of interruptions on the $ they get compared to the players.

IndyRealist
07-06-2019, 03:53 PM
Players talking to players is not tampering. Players acting as a representative of a team talking to players is tampering. Indications are that Kawhi did not recruit PG to LA, he recruiting PG to play with Kawhi, whether it was in LA or Toronto. LA made that happen, Toronto didn't. Now, it would be interesting if OKC refused to trade PG then filed tampering charges, to see how the league would handle it. But that's not what happened.

IIRC Silver refused to fine Lebron for commenting on AD. This is even less severe, since Kawhi wasn't under contract with anyone.

aman_13
07-06-2019, 04:00 PM
Players talking to players is not tampering. Players acting as a representative of a team talking to players is tampering. Indications are that Kawhi did not recruit PG to LA, he recruiting PG to play with Kawhi, whether it was in LA or Toronto. LA made that happen, Toronto didn't. Now, it would be interesting if OKC refused to trade PG then filed tampering charges, to see how the league would handle it. But that's not what happened.

IIRC Silver refused to fine Lebron for commenting on AD. This is even less severe, since Kawhi wasn't under contract with anyone.

Let's be real here. He was recruiting for him to be in LA. There was still no guarantee he was going to stay in Toronto and the Raptors never had a real chance to make the PG trade happen.

IndyRealist
07-06-2019, 04:06 PM
Let's be real here. He was recruiting for him to be in LA. There was still no guarantee he was going to stay in Toronto and the Raptors never had a real chance to make the PG trade happen.

They could have, they just had to move Lowry, Ibaka or Gasol, Siakam, and take on Westbrook. Likely some picks thrown in too, and it would have ballooned their payroll to $150M+. But it was doable. The fact that Westbrook is mentioned in a Toronto deal but not the Clippers deal suggests that a framework for an offer was there. Toronto just decided the price was too high.

aman_13
07-06-2019, 04:11 PM
They could have, they just had to move Lowry, Ibaka or Gasol, Siakam, and take on Westbrook. Likely some picks thrown in too, and it would have ballooned their payroll to $150M+. But it was doable. The fact that Westbrook is mentioned in a Toronto deal but not the Clippers deal suggests that a framework for an offer was there. Toronto just decided the price was too high.

I read that they had no chance. The Clippers were offering too many picks. OKC used the Raptors as leverage and Masai backed out.

Heediot
07-06-2019, 04:38 PM
The truly elite like top 5 in the nba deserve some benefit from sacrificing theirs. When Kemba gets as much as Kawhi, looking from Leonard/LeBron/KD's side they are going to need to be compensated in a way for that sacrifice. Let me live and ball in LA while playing with my buddy. In an open Market maybe leonard bidding goes north of 50 million and Kemba back down a bit.

On the flip side, where are the role model's that reward healthy and thriving relationships? Raps did everything right but still get spurned?

Things are more complicated as well. These guys have wives and duties to their families.

Not so sure about the tampering thing, but get rid of max contracts and there will be less tampering and super teams.

IndyRealist
07-06-2019, 04:40 PM
I read that they had no chance. The Clippers were offering too many picks. OKC used the Raptors as leverage and Masai backed out.

We're basically saying the same thing. Raptors were in on a deal, decided it wasn't worth the price.

aman_13
07-06-2019, 04:48 PM
We're basically saying the same thing. Raptors were in on a deal, decided it wasn't worth the price.Yes but the key is there is no guarantee from Kawhi and he told LA to wait on the AD trade. My point is he wanted to be in LA and was recruiting for LA. The Raptors were his third choice. The whole point is to retain Kawhi and they felt his heart wasn't in it.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

aman_13
07-06-2019, 04:53 PM
Kawhi told Masai that if you can get PG, I might consider staying. The starting point for PG was Siakam and FVV plus 4 unprotected first round picks. That's just the starting point, all without a guarantee from Kawhi. The Raptors were never an option.

The Westbrook part never had traction because it would have tied up the Raptors financially, lose their future and half their roster and Kawhi wasn't a given.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Jamiecballer
07-06-2019, 06:08 PM
They could have, they just had to move Lowry, Ibaka or Gasol, Siakam, and take on Westbrook. Likely some picks thrown in too, and it would have ballooned their payroll to $150M+. But it was doable. The fact that Westbrook is mentioned in a Toronto deal but not the Clippers deal suggests that a framework for an offer was there. Toronto just decided the price was too high.

this is correct. i'm not saying masai should have done it, but it was a choice. i would have definitely considered it. westbrook would not have been on my opening night roster though.

AllBall
07-06-2019, 06:51 PM
You can't ban player friendships. :laugh2: These guys have histories going back to their high school days many times.

IKnowHoops
07-06-2019, 08:55 PM
The truly elite like top 5 in the nba deserve some benefit from sacrificing theirs. When Kemba gets as much as Kawhi, looking from Leonard/LeBron/KD's side they are going to need to be compensated in a way for that sacrifice. Let me live and ball in LA while playing with my buddy. In an open Market maybe leonard bidding goes north of 50 million and Kemba back down a bit.

On the flip side, where are the role model's that reward healthy and thriving relationships? Raps did everything right but still get spurned?

Things are more complicated as well. These guys have wives and duties to their families.

Not so sure about the tampering thing, but get rid of max contracts and there will be less tampering and super teams.

Agreed 100%

Iíd say players having more power is the best thing that ever happened to the NBA. The nba offseason held zero interest until the Heatles. Now 10 teams a year can impact free agency in a big way, generating way more interest in the regular season as well.

A new power can pop up every year now. A guy like Drob doesnít have to sit in purgatory for years because heís to good to miss the playoffs and never get a draft pick.

ewing
07-06-2019, 09:22 PM
Agreed 100%

Iíd say players having more power is the best thing that ever happened to the NBA. The nba offseason held zero interest until the Heatles. Now 10 teams a year can impact free agency in a big way, generating way more interest in the regular season as well.

A new power can pop up every year now. A guy like Drob doesnít have to sit in purgatory for years because heís to good to miss the playoffs and never get a draft pick.

The regular season is boring as hell


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IKnowHoops
07-06-2019, 09:47 PM
The regular season is boring as hell


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For a Knicks fan...of course...I feel for you. But eventually, your team will come up huge because of player power.

ewing
07-06-2019, 09:53 PM
For a Knicks fan...of course...I feel for you. But eventually, your team will come up huge because of player power.

The league is filled with tankers and the good team rest there guys and coast to hca. The best regular season games guys go at like 80%. Itís become a joke


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hugepatsfan
07-07-2019, 02:20 PM
It kind of is what it is. I think two examples this offseason are somewhat troubling though...

PG was under contract with OKC long term so a FA basically pulling strings of where he got traded to is somewhat concerning for the league going forward.

PHI reportedly being in Horfords ear weeks in advance would be normal except for that he had an uncertain option. This wasnít a case like KD, Kawhi, Kyrie or Kemba where they were obviously opting out - Horford has a real decision to make. Itís tough to know what goes on behind the scenes but their tampering might have been what convinced him to turn down a guaranteed $30M.

Vee-Rex
07-07-2019, 03:50 PM
Agreed 100%

Iíd say players having more power is the best thing that ever happened to the NBA. The nba offseason held zero interest until the Heatles. Now 10 teams a year can impact free agency in a big way, generating way more interest in the regular season as well.

A new power can pop up every year now. A guy like Drob doesnít have to sit in purgatory for years because heís to good to miss the playoffs and never get a draft pick.

Agreed. And LeBron paved the way for this. The league should be thanking him for this - especially Warriors fans who might only have one championship if KD didn't feel comfortable enough to join them.

aman_13
07-07-2019, 04:02 PM
this is correct. i'm not saying masai should have done it, but it was a choice. i would have definitely considered it. westbrook would not have been on my opening night roster though.

It was not a choice, for one, the trade was incredibly unrealistic, and two, he was never discussed according to Rachel Nichols.

Oakmont_4
07-07-2019, 06:01 PM
Iím happy about how this NBA offseason turned out and a lot of that had to do with the tampering thatís allowed to take place.

This teams of two mode weíve seen shake out has been great! It allows more teams to be competitive and 2 big names on one team is much more manageable than 3-4 on a handful of teams.

The NBA should do more to push the league in this direction. Let guys team up in pairs. If every team had a ďtop 2Ē it makes for a very exciting league.

Not sure how specifically this can be done but I think youíd have to work it from the bottom up. Make it very easy for teams to get 2 guys but almost impossible to get 3.

What if we allowed each team 2 MAX slots and thatís it. Players wonít like it - but they may if the NBA reshuffles that money to the bottom of the roster. Make the back end of the roster contracts and empty roster spots guarantee more money. This prevents teams from backfilling with super cheap contracts because they have 3-4 MAXís on their roster

If the NBA could make contracts in levels

MAX contracts - teams allowed to have 2 max
(Still based on service time)
Tier 2 contract - $15-20mil teams allowed to have 5 max
Tier 3 contract - $8-15mil 10 max
Tier 4 contract - $1.5-8mil unlimited

Minimum salary and empty roster spot hold is 1% of the cap, so right now it would be $1.09mil

This doesnít prevent tampering. It openly allows it but in a controlled environment. So now LeBron and AD canít go out and recruit Kawhi unless Kawhi is willing to take a Tier 2 contract. But if Kawhi or any other star wants to recruit another star to their own city - itís perfectly allowed and great for the NBA

warfelg
07-07-2019, 06:22 PM
Iím happy about how this NBA offseason turned out and a lot of that had to do with the tampering thatís allowed to take place.

This teams of two mode weíve seen shake out has been great! It allows more teams to be competitive and 2 big names on one team is much more manageable than 3-4 on a handful of teams.

The NBA should do more to push the league in this direction. Let guys team up in pairs. If every team had a ďtop 2Ē it makes for a very exciting league.

Not sure how specifically this can be done but I think youíd have to work it from the bottom up. Make it very easy for teams to get 2 guys but almost impossible to get 3.

What if we allowed each team 2 MAX slots and thatís it. Players wonít like it - but they may if the NBA reshuffles that money to the bottom of the roster. Make the back end of the roster contracts and empty roster spots guarantee more money. This prevents teams from backfilling with super cheap contracts because they have 3-4 MAXís on their roster

If the NBA could make contracts in levels

MAX contracts - teams allowed to have 2 max
(Still based on service time)
Tier 2 contract - $15-20mil teams allowed to have 5 max
Tier 3 contract - $8-15mil 10 max
Tier 4 contract - $1.5-8mil unlimited

Minimum salary and empty roster spot hold is 1% of the cap, so right now it would be $1.09mil

This doesnít prevent tampering. It openly allows it but in a controlled environment. So now LeBron and AD canít go out and recruit Kawhi unless Kawhi is willing to take a Tier 2 contract. But if Kawhi or any other star wants to recruit another star to their own city - itís perfectly allowed and great for the NBA

That tier and max number of players will never fly with the NBPA.

Best option to keep the pairs thing:
35% - 40% - 45% max contract levels. Impossible to get 3 unless drafted.

Oakmont_4
07-07-2019, 06:24 PM
That tier and max number of players will never fly with the NBPA.

Best option to keep the pairs thing:
35% - 40% - 45% max contract levels. Impossible to get 3 unless drafted.

I think itís possible for the NBPA to agree on something similar to what I propose as long as they get better leadership. LeBron, CP3 and co sold out the rest of the players for their own benefit in the last negotiations - getting a ton of money for themselves and nothing for the lower tier guys.

If the NBPA learns their lesson from the last negotiation this is exactly what they should be going for. A more even distribution of funds for all levels of players not just the top tier.

warfelg
07-07-2019, 06:27 PM
I think itís possible for the NBPA to agree on something similar to what I propose as long as they get better leadership. LeBron, CP3 and co sold out the rest of the players for their own benefit in the last negotiations - getting a ton of money for themselves and nothing for the lower tier guys.

Oh 100%. I've been saying that from day 1. Everything in the last CBA benefitted players drafted from '02-'08 more than anyone else.


If the NBPA learns their lesson from the last negotiation this is exactly what they should be going for. A more even distribution of funds for all levels of players not just the top tier.

It's partially going to take owners changing too. Raise the max so you can't have the cap to sign multiple. Also higher max will make owners bulk at paying lesser players max (that's starting to happen).

Jamiecballer
07-07-2019, 07:16 PM
Tampering is one thing that I have learned to live with, not sure what you can do about it either.

What really rubs me the wrong way is the way Leonard played the NBA's version of a homewrecker in the OKC situation creating unrest where none was apparently there. That's just dirty.

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Jamiecballer
07-07-2019, 07:18 PM
It was not a choice, for one, the trade was incredibly unrealistic, and two, he was never discussed according to Rachel Nichols.Wrong to the first - and to the 2nd I dont believe it based on other things that have been reported.

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aman_13
07-07-2019, 08:04 PM
Wrong to the first - and to the 2nd I dont believe it based on other things that have been reported.

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I mean I can take out a mortgage and invest in stocks, the choice is there, doesnít mean itís an option if we are being smart. I know we both agree Masai is a competent executive, putting your team in cap hell and throwing away your future just to get a ďmaybeĒ from Kawhi is not an option. You can choose not to believe it, but usually, you learn more about what happened and what didnít as time passes.

We are now learning that he wanted to team up with KD in LA . That was his first call before reaching out to PG. He wanted to be a Clipper and if it didnít happen, he would have been a Laker.

kobe4thewinbang
07-07-2019, 08:19 PM
The draft should be moved until after free agency, and they need to remove the moratorium. I looked it up and historically it seems that the concept of a moratorium is arbitrary and serves no real purpose.

AllBall
07-07-2019, 09:45 PM
Iím happy about how this NBA offseason turned out and a lot of that had to do with the tampering thatís allowed to take place.

This teams of two mode weíve seen shake out has been great! It allows more teams to be competitive and 2 big names on one team is much more manageable than 3-4 on a handful of teams.

The NBA should do more to push the league in this direction. Let guys team up in pairs. If every team had a ďtop 2Ē it makes for a very exciting league.

Not sure how specifically this can be done but I think youíd have to work it from the bottom up. Make it very easy for teams to get 2 guys but almost impossible to get 3.

What if we allowed each team 2 MAX slots and thatís it. Players wonít like it - but they may if the NBA reshuffles that money to the bottom of the roster. Make the back end of the roster contracts and empty roster spots guarantee more money. This prevents teams from backfilling with super cheap contracts because they have 3-4 MAXís on their roster

If the NBA could make contracts in levels

MAX contracts - teams allowed to have 2 max
(Still based on service time)
Tier 2 contract - $15-20mil teams allowed to have 5 max
Tier 3 contract - $8-15mil 10 max
Tier 4 contract - $1.5-8mil unlimited

Minimum salary and empty roster spot hold is 1% of the cap, so right now it would be $1.09mil

This doesnít prevent tampering. It openly allows it but in a controlled environment. So now LeBron and AD canít go out and recruit Kawhi unless Kawhi is willing to take a Tier 2 contract. But if Kawhi or any other star wants to recruit another star to their own city - itís perfectly allowed and great for the NBA

Won't prevent top tier players from taking less money in order to win. They can make it up elsewhere, stay for 1-2 years and get a ring, then leave and get paid elsewhere.

TylerSL
07-07-2019, 11:07 PM
The league should just give the Lakers their money back.

crewfan13
07-08-2019, 12:15 AM
Won't prevent top tier players from taking less money in order to win. They can make it up elsewhere, stay for 1-2 years and get a ring, then leave and get paid elsewhere.

That's why the solution will always be get rid of max deals. You can never prevent good players from taking discounts. It's impossible. But what you can do is make the decisions back to money. Sure, there's a super max that factors in. But outside of that money is barely even a conversation peice.

But if the difference in contract offers starts being more like $10 mill per year instead of $2-4 mill, it's a different story. Outside of Toronto, everyone with the cap space could offer kawhi the same deal. So location, marketing opportunities and championship potential now are the entire conversation. Get back to where the other sports are at and make it so Phoenix could have offered kawhi a huge deal that maybe the Lakers couldn't match because they had lebron and AD.

AllBall
07-08-2019, 12:42 PM
1148259956598218752
https://twitter.com/TheSteinLine/status/1148259956598218752

Great article on the subject.

Scoots
07-08-2019, 01:41 PM
Hard cap, no exceptions, no minimum contracts, simplify max contracts so they are not based on where player was drafted/traded/years of service.

Draft a week after season, 3 rounds, 3rd round only eligible for two-way contracts, FA a week after that, 5 two-way contracts for 20 players under contract for each team. Players allowed to play a maximum of 70 games in the regular season.

Tampering doesn't need to change. It's just PR anyhow.

Debate.

AllBall
07-08-2019, 03:34 PM
The NBA is entertainment. It is the most entertaining, engaging and profitable as it has ever been. If it aint' broke don't fix it. I don't think eliminating the drama (in an entertainment sense) out of the off season is what you want to do in this medium.

Jamiecballer
07-08-2019, 04:36 PM
I mean I can take out a mortgage and invest in stocks, the choice is there, doesnít mean itís an option if we are being smart. I know we both agree Masai is a competent executive, putting your team in cap hell and throwing away your future just to get a ďmaybeĒ from Kawhi is not an option. You can choose not to believe it, but usually, you learn more about what happened and what didnít as time passes.

We are now learning that he wanted to team up with KD in LA . That was his first call before reaching out to PG. He wanted to be a Clipper and if it didnít happen, he would have been a Laker.

Here is my interpretation based on what I've heard as well what was out there all season. I will go with it to my grave that the Lakers were 100% a media driven narrative. I do not believe at all he was ever going there to be 1b or 1c on that team.

And I do not believe the Raptors would be involved in this frantic Friday night that woj described unless they knew damn well how important George was to making Kawhi's decision for him. Now of course the side that loses out is going to say that they were just leverage or that they had no way to know for sure that they would even keep Kawhi but I call ******** on that. The proof is your involvement in the 1st place.

I have yet to hear any suggestions from anyone that Kawhi makes the plunge anyway if the Clippers fall short of attaining George, which suggests that even though he may have had his heart set on Clippers there was something even more important to him and that is forming a powerful duo to try and run the league.

And before anyone says unrealistic again there is nothing "realistic" about what the Clippers gave up but they did it anyway and it's almost impossible to find anyone who thinks it was a poor decision.

Cap hell is part of an extended championship run, you do it anyways in my opinion.

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crewfan13
07-08-2019, 05:05 PM
Agree. I think everyone looks back at that nets Celtics trade and fantisizes about how good those future picks could be. But in reality, when you're taking guys like anthiny Davis, Paul George (who potentially brings you kawhi as well) and those types, it's so different than the nets guys.

If you get kawhi and Paul George, you're picking no higher than 20 for at least 4 years. If you get AD, even without much else, you're probably outside the top 10. If you can also add anyone else of note, (like already having lebron), you're also looking at picking in the 20s for a few years. Draft picks are awesome because they are lottery picks. But if you're giving up 4 picks in the late teens or later and maybe 1 or 2 good picks 5 years down the road to open up a legit 4 year window, you do it every time.

AllBall
07-09-2019, 10:06 PM
1148758591089676288
https://twitter.com/ByTimReynolds/status/1148758591089676288

1148760764099907584
https://twitter.com/ByTimReynolds/status/1148760764099907584

Scoots
07-10-2019, 04:20 AM
More empty PR speak from Silver

SteBO
07-11-2019, 10:24 AM
More empty PR speak from Silver
Time will tell on that one, but I lean towards your side on that. After seeing how the PG trade came about in connection with Kawhi, I know owners can't be pleased...not that I give a **** about their feelings. They're just displeased that players recognize their power.

At this point, it's too little too late.

AllBall
07-11-2019, 10:46 AM
It's not PR speak, it means they will remove tampering restrictions for players once their season has ended. IN SEASON tampering is what is frowned upon, but if a player didn't make the playoffs, he and the team should be able to get on with it already.

mike_noodles
07-12-2019, 10:52 AM
It's not PR speak, it means they will remove tampering restrictions for players once their season has ended. IN SEASON tampering is what is frowned upon, but if a player didn't make the playoffs, he and the team should be able to get on with it already.

I don't disagree, but the problem is, how is that fair to the 16 teams that make the playoffs that could be interested in the player?, or to the players still playing that could have been interested in going to that team?

Scoots
07-12-2019, 01:15 PM
It's not PR speak, it means they will remove tampering restrictions for players once their season has ended. IN SEASON tampering is what is frowned upon, but if a player didn't make the playoffs, he and the team should be able to get on with it already.

They have no action that will make a difference. Every time there is some TV talk and fan noise Silver says "We're looking at ..." and that's all that happens. It's pure PR.

AllBall
07-12-2019, 01:21 PM
They have no action that will make a difference. Every time there is some TV talk and fan noise Silver says "We're looking at ..." and that's all that happens. It's pure PR.

It was at the annual July meeting, not a random TV interview.

Scoots
07-12-2019, 02:24 PM
It was at the annual July meeting, not a random TV interview.

I didn't say it was a random TV interview.

JainJude
07-13-2019, 05:24 AM
Which team needs Chris Paul the most?
I'm still shocked about this trade and I honestly don't understand how a backcourt with Harden and Westbrook is supposed to work, BUT my main concern is the next step for Chris Paul. It wouldn't make any sense for OKC to keep him after what they've done to get rid of Westbrook's albatross contract. So where should CP3 play next season? Suns fans are probably punching the hair right now, because Chris Paul would have been better PG to pair with Devin Booker than Ricky Rubio. What about the Orlando Magic? They need a PG and that's why they were rumored to be interested in Russell Westbrook. The Mavericks? If they don't want to put much weight on Luka's shoulders, maybe pairing him with a veteran playmaker like CP3 would help his development next season. People are suggesting Miami as a possible destination but IMO Pat Riley will not give up future picks for a guy like CP3. Westbrook wouldn't have made the Heat a contender, but they would have been a box office attraction. Do you think Miami people will renounce to South Beach evenings just to see an old CP3 playing alongside Jimmy Butler? I don't think so.xvideos (https://xvideos.onl/) xnxx (https://xnxx.onl/) xxx (https://ixxx.onl/)

More-Than-Most
07-13-2019, 06:02 AM
This off season was legit eye opening... KL toyed with the lakers period... The sixers cost the celtics horford and were in his ear before the NBA season ended which is wrong... The **** with KL and PG13 is ****ing gross but hey they got what they wanted... KL screwed over the lakers big time and used the lakers and raptors as a tool to buy time until that trade happened and the sixers talked horford from the celtics and what was suppose to be a 30 million deal etc....


Trust me i am happy we got horford and i am happy he isnt a celtic but at the same time this league really needs to figure this **** out because players have way to much control and this off season showed just that.... teams and players werent just trying to sign a guy but they were trying to sign and screw over other teams and that is a pretty big ****ing problem... Now yes the lakers got what they deserved because pelinka is a dumbass esp after the pelicans ****... he got played but KL never gave 1 **** about signing with the lakers and bought time until free agents were signed and had the PG13 thing working in the background the entire time.... this is the most ****ed up thing we have seen in a while and the best part is the NBA shat on the lakers and the cp3 trade years ago when that wasnt anywhere near as bad as this... they should have shut down the pg13 trade nomatter the insane haul the thunder got because what went down was dirty.... was it the lakers fault for being so stupid? sure but who wouldnt wait for KL?

Bostonjorge
07-13-2019, 01:13 PM
Hard to be mad at the players for having some control. He is what this little control still gets them.

Clippers trade Blake after reassurance of loyalty. Raptors dump Demar after his loyalty. Paul and Iggy get traded. Morris Twins take pay cuts to play with each other with the suns and they trade one away. Miami didnít want to pay Wade when he wanted to come back in his prime. Webber finding out he got traded to the Kings by fans in the street. Jordan retired from the Bulls because the owner didnít want to pay his players and Coach.

Being Loyal to the teams can back fire badly. Look what Isiah Thomas sacrificed for the Celtics. KD was cleared to play by the Warriors. Leonard was being almost forced to play with the Spurs. Grant Hill was cleared way to early by the Magic. Players have shown extreme levels of loyalty and got burned for it.

tredigs
07-13-2019, 02:39 PM
To my knowledge the true disruptive tamper agents right now are/were Lebron/Klutch and Kawhi (who was actively recruiting KD and Butler mid season apparently). It's when you **** with other teams/players under contract that actions should be taken. Off season free agents who cares.

hugepatsfan
07-13-2019, 03:18 PM
Time will tell on that one, but I lean towards your side on that. After seeing how the PG trade came about in connection with Kawhi, I know owners can't be pleased...not that I give a **** about their feelings. They're just displeased that players recognize their power.

At this point, it's too little too late.

Players in general donít have power. Star players do. Gallinari was a FA and chose to sign with LA. But because of what PG/Kawhi wanted his *** got shipped to OKC. Lonzo was thrilled to be in LA but because of what AD/Lebron wanted he was ran out of town.

There are three groups in the NBA - 1) teams/owners, 2) star players and 3) other players. Groups 1 and 2 donít give a damn about group 3, the largest group. And thatís why all those players surveys come back as the league is generally unhappy.

TrueFan420
07-13-2019, 06:55 PM
Hard to be mad at the players for having some control. He is what this little control still gets them.

Clippers trade Blake after reassurance of loyalty. Raptors dump Demar after his loyalty. Paul and Iggy get traded. Morris Twins take pay cuts to play with each other with the suns and they trade one away. Miami didnít want to pay Wade when he wanted to come back in his prime. Webber finding out he got traded to the Kings by fans in the street. Jordan retired from the Bulls because the owner didnít want to pay his players and Coach.

Being Loyal to the teams can back fire badly. Look what Isiah Thomas sacrificed for the Celtics. KD was cleared to play by the Warriors. Leonard was being almost forced to play with the Spurs. Grant Hill was cleared way to early by the Magic. Players have shown extreme levels of loyalty and got burned for it.
Not trying to take away from your point but I do take offense to you including Webber in there with some of those other examples. He wasnít remotely close to loyal to the Warriors. He legit cried his way off the team and got exactly what he wanted.