PDA

View Full Version : If Kawhi Leonard joins the Lakers, will he be hated like Durant?



Pages : [1] 2

redsox12
06-27-2019, 07:07 PM
KD got hated on for making a super team even better and leaving a up and coming contender like OKC. Toronto already got a title but if Kawhi leaves them to make a super team in LA, will Kawhi get the KD treatment?

Switch
06-27-2019, 07:11 PM
KD got hated on for making a super team even better and leaving a up and coming contender like OKC. Toronto already got a title but if Kawhi leaves them to make a super team in LA, will Kawhi get the KD treatment?No because Kawhi already proved that he can win on his own

Sent from my SM-G955U1 using Tapatalk

IKnowHoops
06-27-2019, 07:12 PM
KD got hated on for making a super team even better and leaving a up and coming contender like OKC. Toronto already got a title but if Kawhi leaves them to make a super team in LA, will Kawhi get the KD treatment?

Kawhi proved twice that he can lead a team to a championship that wouldnít have a prayer without him. Bron has done the same thing.

Durant has not shown he can do that.

If Kawhi joins the Lakers it will be to thwart the chances of any other arising super teams that are sure to come. As an individual, neither Bron or KL have anything to prove.

Now itís about being apart of the greatest team ever. That is the goal.

bucketss
06-27-2019, 07:13 PM
lebron will take another hit for being the biggest front runner

Cal827
06-27-2019, 07:18 PM
Nah, if he goes, all of the pressure/hatred will be on Lebron. He got exactly what he wanted, if he can't deliver a title with two other of the top 5-10 players in the league, while another one might never be the same after his injury, it'll be looked upon as a black eye on his career.


Difference too is that the fanbase that he would be leaving will be forever celebrating what he accomplished with the team. He came here, with the roster around him and won a title (the franchises first ever) in a place that was consistently dogged in the media for being chokers. Doesn't matter what team he's on, his first game back in Toronto will be an absolute standing ovation whether that's with the Raptors or someone else.


Also Kawhi was able to do something that Lebron arguably hasn't been able to: win on his own (as someone touched on here), with Kyle Lowry as the second best player on the team


:dance:

IKnowHoops
06-27-2019, 07:31 PM
Nah, if he goes, all of the pressure/hatred will be on Lebron. He got exactly what he wanted, if he can't deliver a title with two other of the top 5-10 players in the league, while another one might never be the same after his injury, it'll be looked upon as a black eye on his career.


Difference too is that the fanbase that he would be leaving will be forever celebrating what he accomplished with the team. He came here, with the roster around him and won a title (the franchises first ever) in a place that was consistently dogged in the media for being chokers. Doesn't matter what team he's on, his first game back in Toronto will be an absolute standing ovation whether that's with the Raptors or someone else.


Also Kawhi was able to do something that Lebron arguably hasn't been able to: win on his own (as someone touched on here), with Kyle Lowry as the second best player on the team


:dance:


Lol

Bron has had to be beyond other worldly to win his rings.

Toronto was 17-4 without Kawhi

Regardless of what team Bron has been on, heís never been on a team that could/has had that type of winning pct without him, so heís d say you are absolutely wrong about the assertion that Kawhi has was on his own and Bron hasnít. Toronto was a great TEAM and they provhttps://clutchpoints.com/warriors-rumors-kevin-durant-pissed-off-golden-state-over-handling-injury/e it without KL

NBA all the way
06-27-2019, 07:34 PM
No, he's not joing a 73-9 team that just knocked his team outta the playoffs and went to back to back finals, winning one.

He's joining a under .500 ball club that hasn't made the playoffs in awhile.

Plus he won 2 chips as the best player on 2 separate teams already. KD had never won prior to joining and if he ends up leaving, with the age and injury may never win again.

More-Than-Most
06-27-2019, 08:09 PM
No, he's not joing a 73-9 team that just knocked his team outta the playoffs and went to back to back finals, winning one.

He's joining a under .500 ball club that hasn't made the playoffs in awhile.

Plus he won 2 chips as the best player on 2 separate teams already. KD had never won prior to joining and if he ends up leaving, with the age and injury may never win again.

:pity:

why is it so hard to use logic? He is joining a team with wait for it... the 2nd greatest player ever and another top 7 player in the sport.... if we **** on durant for joining a team with 3 top 20 players we should without a doubt **** on KL for joining a team with 2 top 7 players... come on people stop this dumb stuff like the wins the team has or how they were last year etc.

I am not ******** on durant and will not **** on KL... but do not spew about wins the year before etc like it matters.

Max.This
06-27-2019, 08:09 PM
its really hard to hate Kawhi for any reason

More-Than-Most
06-27-2019, 08:10 PM
its really hard to hate Kawhi for any reason

also this. Durant just gives off a little ***** vibe and i defend the dude. KL is a ****ing boss lol

kobebabe
06-27-2019, 08:49 PM
No he wouldnít. Heís already won a championship for Toronto, proving he can carry a team to a championship. Durant is way far from that.

KD also comes off arrogant with quotes like ďyou all know who I amĒ which makes him quite unlikable. What is there to hate about Kawhi? Nothing really

NBA all the way
06-27-2019, 09:05 PM
:pity:

why is it so hard to use logic? He is joining a team with wait for it... the 2nd greatest player ever and another top 7 player in the sport.... if we **** on durant for joining a team with 3 top 20 players we should without a doubt **** on KL for joining a team with 2 top 7 players... come on people stop this dumb stuff like the wins the team has or how they were last year etc.

I am not ******** on durant and will not **** on KL... but do not spew about wins the year before etc like it matters.

All those things are very important when talking about how people perceive you. Be it fans, media or your peers.

It's weak to go join a team because you can't beat them.

Kawhi leaving wouldn't be because he can't win on his own or that he is joining a team because he can't get past them.

You think if the Warriors hadn't made the playoffs in 7 seasons or only won 37 games the season before he joined that the narrative would be the same? It's a rhetorical question but I doubt KD even joins them if that's the case.

Heck, if you even take that stuff away and just say if KD had ever won a ring anywhere else prior to joining the Warriors would the narrative be the same? Again, rhetorical.

You can't just take variables away and try to look at things in a vacuum, well, I mean I guess you can but that's not how public opinion or perception actually works.

More-Than-Most
06-27-2019, 09:13 PM
All those things are very important when talking about how people perceive you. Be it fans, media or your peers.

It's weak to go join a team because you can't beat them.

Kawhi leaving wouldn't be because he can't win on his own or that he is joining a team because he can't get past them.

You think if the Warriors hadn't made the playoffs in 7 seasons or only won 37 games the season before he joined that the narrative would be the same? It's a rhetorical question but I doubt KD even joins them if that's the case.

Heck, if you even take that stuff away and just say if KD had ever won a ring anywhere else prior to joining the Warriors would the narrative be the same? Again, rhetorical.

You can't just take variables away and try to look at things in a vacuum, well, I mean I guess you can but that's not how public opinion or perception actually works.

so you think there is a big difference in joining a team with curry/dray/klay and lebron/AD? without KL this team when they add the depth will be on par or better than that warriors team yet we should ignore logic all because a team the year before didnt make the playoffs but ignore the facts of why they didnt make the playoffs? If Lebron/Lonzo arent hurt the lakers are like a 4 seed out west but lets ignore logic here.

IKnowHoops
06-27-2019, 09:25 PM
All those things are very important when talking about how people perceive you. Be it fans, media or your peers.

It's weak to go join a team because you can't beat them.

Kawhi leaving wouldn't be because he can't win on his own or that he is joining a team because he can't get past them.

You think if the Warriors hadn't made the playoffs in 7 seasons or only won 37 games the season before he joined that the narrative would be the same? It's a rhetorical question but I doubt KD even joins them if that's the case.

Heck, if you even take that stuff away and just say if KD had ever won a ring anywhere else prior to joining the Warriors would the narrative be the same? Again, rhetorical.

You can't just take variables away and try to look at things in a vacuum, well, I mean I guess you can but that's not how public opinion or perception actually works.

Agreed. Had Durant beaten GS while on OKC, and then gone to GS, he could do it based on wanting to play the game the right way and look like a boss.

Itís totally different going to the team that just beat you

NBA all the way
06-27-2019, 09:34 PM
so you think there is a big difference in joining a team with curry/dray/klay and lebron/AD? without KL this team when they add the depth will be on par or better than that warriors team yet we should ignore logic all because a team the year before didnt make the playoffs but ignore the facts of why they didnt make the playoffs? If Lebron/Lonzo arent hurt the lakers are like a 4 seed out west but lets ignore logic here.

In a vacuum, sure man they're similar.

But circumstances matter, they just do. A team that has been together for 4 years, to the finals the past 2, won a title 2 years prior, blew a 3-1 lead to almost be back to back champs after winning 67 then 73 games the past 2 seasons and being compared to the '96 Bulls by the media without KD even being on that team yet.

Versus a dude who has played a career 13 playoff games and another guy who is 35 years old this year. None of the hypothetical 3 have ever played together and will be on a gutted roster.

Not mention Klay, Dray, Steph and KD were all in their primes.

Sorry, I can't just push all variables aside and operate in a vacuum. If you do and think that is "logic" then I think we have different definitions of logic. Which is okay, I just know, mostly, public opinion is based upon the whole thing, the full view and circumstances of the given situation.

nastynice
06-27-2019, 09:42 PM
If he joins the Lakers and starts winning he will start being hated.

Bostonjorge
06-27-2019, 09:45 PM
Impossible to not like Leonard. Unless your team loses to him.

rocket
06-27-2019, 09:52 PM
Kawhi can do whatever the **** he wants at this point.

aman_13
06-27-2019, 10:12 PM
LeBron would **** over the Raptors again! Smh..

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

hugepatsfan
06-27-2019, 10:25 PM
No because Kawhi already proved that he can win on his own

Sent from my SM-G955U1 using Tapatalk

/thread

hugepatsfan
06-27-2019, 10:25 PM
If he joins the Lakers and starts winning he will start being hated.

Yes but heíll always be respected.

KobeOwnSU
06-27-2019, 10:26 PM
Kawhi donít care. Kawhi will just roll a blunt and say ďApple time.Ē


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Saddletramp
06-27-2019, 10:40 PM
No, he's not joing a 73-9 team that just knocked his team outta the playoffs and went to back to back finals, winning one.

He's joining a under .500 ball club that hasn't made the playoffs in awhile.

Plus he won 2 chips as the best player on 2 separate teams already. KD had never won prior to joining and if he ends up leaving, with the age and injury may never win again.

Bingo. Plus, forming is different from joining. They are a legit contender if Kawhi joins but probably not if he doesnít. The Warriors were a legit contender before KD joined.

tp13baby
06-27-2019, 10:46 PM
I would hate to see it but I respect KL as a player. Dude is all business, just plays, and has done it as the best player without true elites on his team.

KD never did that. KD also is a mouthy prick.

CptObvious71
06-27-2019, 10:52 PM
I personally think it's wrong to begrudge an athlete for choosing any team really. It's not very often that they get to pick where they are going to work. They often play for years in cities they don't want to play in for far less money than they deserve. When the opportunity comes for them to truly pick and choose where and in what situation they want to play, they would be nuts not to pick the best fit for them. For some the main factor might be money, some might want to be close to home, some might want the best chance to win. We shouldn't boo them simply for doing what most of us would do too.

ohreally
06-27-2019, 11:25 PM
:pity:

why is it so hard to use logic? He is joining a team with wait for it... the 2nd greatest player ever and another top 7 player in the sport.... if we **** on durant for joining a team with 3 top 20 players we should without a doubt **** on KL for joining a team with 2 top 7 players... come on people stop this dumb stuff like the wins the team has or how they were last year etc.

I am not ******** on durant and will not **** on KL... but do not spew about wins the year before etc like it matters.

Totally agree with this.

ohreally
06-27-2019, 11:30 PM
Bingo. Plus, forming is different from joining. They are a legit contender if Kawhi joins but probably not if he doesnít. The Warriors were a legit contender before KD joined.

Well, after the trade, most fans and most press were saying the Lakers were a contender if not favorites for coming out of the West.

I didnít see it that way, but it was/is a common perception.

Chronz
06-28-2019, 12:02 AM
Nobody could ever top KD's decision to dick ride daddy Curry and the record setting Dubs but this would be the closest approximation, yes, he would be derided and rightfully so. Just not on the level of joining instead of forming. The team still has holes, especially if Bron finally ages like hes suppose to so that could change things too.

Saddletramp
06-28-2019, 12:45 AM
Well, after the trade, most fans and most press were saying the Lakers were a contender if not favorites for coming out of the West.

I didnít see it that way, but it was/is a common perception.

Depends on who else they get, but this is not ďDurant to the WarriorsĒ easy road, thisíll be Lebron and Bosh forming a team with Wade learning process. But Kawhi gets hurt a lot, AD has only been in a few series and Lebron is starting to decline. Not remotely the same as KD to the Warriors.

More-Than-Most
06-28-2019, 12:50 AM
Nobody could ever top KD's decision to dick ride daddy Curry and the record setting Dubs but this would be the closest approximation, yes, he would be derided and rightfully so. Just not on the level of joining instead of forming. The team still has holes, especially if Bron finally ages like hes suppose to so that could change things too.

well look at this... i can respect this and agree with it... I cant see how others that had issues with durant or even lebron can give KL a pass... It doesnt matter to me in all honesty... go where you want to go... some guys are gifted insane teams most of their career and if we judge on rings then go get them rings... I will say this... I love lebron.... Curry and the texts i have always said was a huge ***** move as well... if lebron takes a back seat to either one of these guys the titles will mean nothing to me for his legacy

SiteWolf
06-28-2019, 01:25 PM
if you're going to bash someone, wouldn't AD be more deserving? that is, if you operate under the impression the Lakers promised him that they'd get Kawhi or another stud before he agreed to the trade.....I mean after all, Kawhi is coming FROM the champions if he does...

Dade County
06-28-2019, 02:31 PM
KD got hated on for making a super team even better and leaving a up and coming contender like OKC. Toronto already got a title but if Kawhi leaves them to make a super team in LA, will Kawhi get the KD treatment?

There is a difference...

KD went to a team that beat HIM. As a competitor he didn't try to over come, instead he joined. But I never hated KD for his decision.

Kawhi on the other hand, was with the Spurs a very good franchise that had backing by the League. Then Kawhi just got a ring this past season, so the media can't label him with anything negative. He is their new golden boy, so in short, no hate will come to Kawhi.

futureman
06-28-2019, 05:53 PM
It would show he lacks confidence in his abilities even after winning 2 rings. Why does every player need to come out west?

RaiderLakersA's
06-28-2019, 06:26 PM
If he joins the Lakers and starts winning he will start being hated.

I doubt it. No one every really hates the soft-spoken, quiet assassins. If Leonard was one of those bombastic, outspoken types the hate would have begun immediately. Aside from some San Antonio fans who may still feel some kind of way about his time there ended, I think most people will like Kawhi no matter how many titles he wins as a Laker.

SiteWolf
06-28-2019, 06:38 PM
It would show he lacks confidence in his abilities even after winning 2 rings. Why does every player need to come out west?

well, in his case, it's where he's from...however much that matters to him

Chapin78
06-28-2019, 06:38 PM
I wouldnít think the hype would be towards him. He proved he can win alone. Heís joining a team that even with Lebron they couldnít even be competitive in the east.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

lakers squad
06-28-2019, 07:23 PM
If Kawhi signs with the Lakers, your looking at a team with LeBron possibly being their 3rd best player! That is completely insane!

nastynice
06-28-2019, 07:35 PM
Yes but heíll always be respected.

Not by his haters. Just how kd isn't by his haters. Haters will always find some sort of target.

If he keeps winning, just watch how many targets he will develop.

nastynice
06-28-2019, 07:38 PM
I doubt it. No one every really hates the soft-spoken, quiet assassins. If Leonard was one of those bombastic, outspoken types the hate would have begun immediately. Aside from some San Antonio fans who may still feel some kind of way about his time there ended, I think most people will like Kawhi no matter how many titles he wins as a Laker.

A lot of people will like him, but a lot will hate him. It always happens. Always. Look at how lovable Shaq is now

Saddletramp
06-28-2019, 07:44 PM
I doubt it. No one every really hates the soft-spoken, quiet assassins. If Leonard was one of those bombastic, outspoken types the hate would have begun immediately. Aside from some San Antonio fans who may still feel some kind of way about his time there ended, I think most people will like Kawhi no matter how many titles he wins as a Laker.

If Kawhi did exactly what KD did and KD did exactly what Kawhi is rumored to possibly do, then Iíd give Kawhi **** and KD a pass. Regardless of winning elsewhere or who beat who when, it comes down to joining a champion and 73 win team over joining guys whoíve never played together.

Iíd never fault three guys from forming up somewhere fresh but Iíd always call out a player of KDís stature joining what he joined.


Letís put it this way, if Kawhi joined the Warriors in Ď16, heís a *****. If KD joined Jimmy Butler and Al Horford that year in, letís say, Atlanta, with no other quality help, then Iíd be totally ok with that.

NBA all the way
06-28-2019, 07:59 PM
If Kawhi did exactly what KD did and KD did exactly what Kawhi is rumored to possibly do, then Iíd give Kawhi **** and KD a pass. Regardless of winning elsewhere or who beat who when, it comes down to joining a champion and 73 win team over joining guys whoíve never played together.

Iíd never fault three guys from forming up somewhere fresh but Iíd always call out a player of KDís stature joining what he joined.


Letís put it this way, if Kawhi joined the Warriors in Ď16, heís a *****. If KD joined Jimmy Butler and Al Horford that year in, letís say, Atlanta, with no other quality help, then Iíd be totally ok with that.

Exactly! Not sure why people can't grasp that or refuse to grasp it. Pretty easy concept to follow.

nastynice
06-28-2019, 08:13 PM
Exactly! Not sure why people can't grasp that or refuse to grasp it. Pretty easy concept to follow.

It's not that anyone cant grasp this, its that this isn't the end all be all you seem to make it out to be. People didn't hate kd because he joined a team that beat him, they hated him because he poised himself to start winning a lot. A lot a lot. So the hate came a lot a lot.

It's simple math :)

Bostonjorge
06-28-2019, 08:19 PM
Canít wait to pick up some signature New Balance balling shoes.

Saddletramp
06-28-2019, 08:24 PM
It's not that anyone cant grasp this, its that this isn't the end all be all you seem to make it out to be. People didn't hate kd because he joined a team that beat him, they hated him because he poised himself to start winning a lot. A lot a lot. So the hate came a lot a lot.

It's simple math :)

What? Learn how to read. Heís agreeing with me and part of my post was:




If Kawhi did exactly what KD did and KD did exactly what Kawhi is rumored to possibly do, then Iíd give Kawhi **** and KD a pass. Regardless of winning elsewhere or who beat who when, it comes down to joining a champion and 73 win team over joining guys whoíve never played together.

Iíd never fault three guys from forming up somewhere fresh but Iíd always call out a player of KDís stature joining what he joined.


Letís put it this way, if Kawhi joined the Warriors in Ď16, heís a *****. If KD joined Jimmy Butler and Al Horford that year in, letís say, Atlanta, with no other quality help, then Iíd be totally ok with that.

Damn son, what the ****.

nastynice
06-28-2019, 09:00 PM
What? Learn how to read. Heís agreeing with me and part of my post was:





Damn son, what the ****.

The **** is that I'm telling you WHY people hate kd. No one hates him because he joined a team that beat him,lol, they hate him because he was poised to start winning. When people started hating him because of his potential success,they may have SAID the reason they hate him is because he joined a team that beat him, but that's just how they try and convince themselves their hate is justified, haha,.its not the actual reason.

Pay attention to my posts, it will help you understand why you post the way you do :)

TylerSL
06-28-2019, 09:14 PM
KD got hated on for making a super team even better and leaving a up and coming contender like OKC. Toronto already got a title but if Kawhi leaves them to make a super team in LA, will Kawhi get the KD treatment?

To answer your question no he will not be. Kevin Durant wasn't hated because "he made a superteam even better and left an up and coming contender", KD was hated because he joined a team that was already great without him. The Warriors had already won a championship, they were coming off a record 73-9 regular season, and Curry was the 2 time reigning league MVP before he ever donned that jersey. Also the fact that Durant's old team held a 3-1 series lead in the WCF against the Warriors before collapsing right before he bolted to join them makes it even worse.

If Kawhi does join the Lakers, Raptors fans will be upset and hurt. The strong majority of them would boo Kawhi for leaving, but that organization traded for him with one year left on his contract knowing that he had no intention of re signing with them. It was an extremely bold move from Ujiri that ultimately brought them their first championship, so even if he leaves it will have been worth it. It would still hurt that fan base to lose him, worse because it's beyond evident that there is nothing more they could have done. If he leaves it will be because he never wanted to be there. That reality would be rough for all of Raptor nation.

Outside of Raptor nation however, I believe the Lakers organization, and Lebron specifically, would garner more hate than Kawhi himself. It was Lebron who publicly requested the Lakers trade for AD, it was Lebron's best friend and agent (who also happens to be AD's agent) who meddled with AD's relationship with the Pelicans. It was Lebron who told Kawhi "we'll be in touch" after a game in March. Lebron is already hated by some fans because of his past forming of super teams. This would top of all of those, and would garner the most hate.

Saddletramp
06-28-2019, 09:20 PM
The **** is that I'm telling you WHY people hate kd. No one hates him because he joined a team that beat him,lol, they hate him because he was poised to start winning. When people started hating him because of his potential success,they may have SAID the reason they hate him is because he joined a team that beat him, but that's just how they try and convince themselves their hate is justified, haha,.its not the actual reason.

Pay attention to my posts, it will help you understand why you post the way you do :)

That was my whole point of correcting you. How has this gone over your head twice now?



Jesus ****ing Christ.

Chronz
06-28-2019, 09:27 PM
To answer your question no he will not be. Kevin Durant wasn't hated because "he made a superteam even better and left an up and coming contender", KD was hated because he joined a team that was already great without him. The Warriors had already won a championship, they were coming off a record 73-9 regular season, and Curry was the 2 time reigning league MVP before he ever donned that jersey. Also the fact that Durant's old team held a 3-1 series lead in the WCF against the Warriors before collapsing right before he bolted to join them makes it even worse.

If Kawhi does join the Lakers, Raptors fans will be upset and hurt. The strong majority of them would boo Kawhi for leaving, but that organization traded for him with one year left on his contract knowing that he had no intention of re signing with them. It was an extremely bold move from Ujiri that ultimately brought them their first championship, so even if he leaves it will have been worth it. It would still hurt that fan base to lose him, worse because it's beyond evident that there is nothing more they could have done. If he leaves it will be because he never wanted to be there. That reality would be rough for all of Raptor nation.

Outside of Raptor nation however, I believe the Lakers organization, and Lebron specifically, would garner more hate than Kawhi himself. It was Lebron who publicly requested the Lakers trade for AD, it was Lebron's best friend and agent (who also happens to be AD's agent) who meddled with AD's relationship with the Pelicans. It was Lebron who told Kawhi "we'll be in touch" after a game in March. Lebron is already hated by some fans because of his past forming of super teams. This would top of all of those, and would garner the most hate.

Well said.

IKnowHoops
06-28-2019, 09:33 PM
Not by his haters. Just how kd isn't by his haters. Haters will always find some sort of target.

If he keeps winning, just watch how many targets he will develop.

His skills will always be respected. His rings and mindset are suspect.

nastynice
06-28-2019, 09:41 PM
That was my whole point of correcting you. How has this gone over your head twice now?



Jesus ****ing Christ.

Yes but you somehow tried to use that as a differentiater between people joining to form something vs joining something. It's the same bull ****, lol, no one cares if you join something already formed vs forming at once. You convince yourself it means something, but it really doesn't

nastynice
06-28-2019, 09:42 PM
His skills will always be respected. His rings and mindset are suspect.

To some people, sure.

To some people playing injured and having your Achilles snap in front of everyone makes his mindset not suspect.

Diff strokes, diff folks

Saddletramp
06-28-2019, 10:27 PM
Yes but you somehow tried to use that as a differentiater between people joining to form something vs joining something.

No I didnít, I said that it didnít matter ďRegardless of winning elsewhere or who beat who whenĒ. A guy joining the team that just eliminated him happens and is kinda weak but it didnít bring on ďthe hateĒ.


It's the same bull ****, lol, no one cares if you join something already formed vs forming at once. You convince yourself it means something, but it really doesn't

It absolutely matters.

GREATNESS ONE
06-28-2019, 10:28 PM
Canít wait to pick up some signature New Balance balling shoes.

same!!!! I'm buying a few pairs, and a couple Kawhi #2 Jerseys if it happens :nod:

Saddletramp
06-28-2019, 10:31 PM
To some people, sure.

To some people playing injured and having your Achilles snap in front of everyone makes his mindset not suspect.

Diff strokes, diff folks

He wanted to come in a prove that they needed him. It backfired and itíll cost him most or all of next season.

nastynice
06-28-2019, 10:52 PM
No I didnít, I said that it didnít matter ďRegardless of winning elsewhere or who beat who whenĒ. A guy joining the team that just eliminated him happens and is kinda weak but it didnít bring on ďthe hateĒ.



It absolutely matters.

I guess to you it does, to me it doesn't.

If Giannis, lebron, kd, Kawhi, curry, harden and kyrie all joined the same team in one summer, to me that would stack the odds on their favor more than a top player joining a top team.

nastynice
06-28-2019, 10:53 PM
He wanted to come in a prove that they needed him. It backfired and itíll cost him most or all of next season.

He wanted to try and get a 3 peat. It backfired and it'll cost him most or all of next season.

NBA all the way
06-28-2019, 11:43 PM
It's not that anyone cant grasp this, its that this isn't the end all be all you seem to make it out to be. People didn't hate kd because he joined a team that beat him, they hated him because he poised himself to start winning a lot. A lot a lot. So the hate came a lot a lot.

It's simple math :)

Everyone made fun of him, by pasting a new team on his players tribune picture for "my next chapter" everytime he lost to a new team. Or made the joke of KD seen 3 guys beating up an old man so he jumped in, then said he didn't stand a chance against the 4 of us. Even Peyton Manning roasting him at the ESPY's for wanting to join the USA gymnastics team because they were so dominant. I believe there was even a joke reference to him joining a LLWS team or something.

So, no. Him joining the team that just beat him wasn't where the hate came from, it just made him the butt of a ton of jokes, especially when coupled with how historically dominant the team he was joining already was without him.

You just didn't see Malone, Stockton or Ewing rushing to join the Bulls.

As far as building vs going to something built, KG, PP and Ray won year 1 but still had to build it. LBJ, Wade and Bosh had to build it. LBJ, Kyrie and Love had to build it. KD came to a team who had been in playoff contention for 4 years and finals contention for 2, he didn't have to build anything.

If Durant leaves it's probably because he's a sensitive dude and tired of getting ripped on by everyone. Or if there is any truth to the medical stuff being a point of contention between him and the Warriors.

But he got his rings like he wanted and if he leaves he probably never wins again, and I'm sure he's well aware of this.

Side note, just because the fan base he joined can't say out loud what he did was weak, doesn't change that the general population (who makes up public opinion/perception) feels it was.

aman_13
06-29-2019, 01:58 AM
He won't be hated but will it be a weak move? The answer is yes. It will rank right up there with Durant.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

GREATNESS ONE
06-29-2019, 02:44 AM
He won't be hated but will it be a weak move? The answer is yes. It will rank right up there with Durant.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Really think about it, and come back tomorrow with your answer...

Bostonjorge
06-29-2019, 02:51 AM
He won't be hated but will it be a weak move? The answer is yes. It will rank right up there with Durant.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Even tho rumors of him wanting to play in LA came before James and Davis got to LA?

Itís only weak if he thinks he can only win by teaming up. Iím sure we can all agree thatís not the case here.

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 03:34 AM
Everyone made fun of him, by pasting a new team on his players tribune picture for "my next chapter" everytime he lost to a new team. Or made the joke of KD seen 3 guys beating up an old man so he jumped in, then said he didn't stand a chance against the 4 of us. Even Peyton Manning roasting him at the ESPY's for wanting to join the USA gymnastics team because they were so dominant. I believe there was even a joke reference to him joining a LLWS team or something.

So, no. Him joining the team that just beat him wasn't where the hate came from, it just made him the butt of a ton of jokes, especially when coupled with how historically dominant the team he was joining already was without him.

You just didn't see Malone, Stockton or Ewing rushing to join the Bulls.

As far as building vs going to something built, KG, PP and Ray won year 1 but still had to build it. LBJ, Wade and Bosh had to build it. LBJ, Kyrie and Love had to build it. KD came to a team who had been in playoff contention for 4 years and finals contention for 2, he didn't have to build anything.

If Durant leaves it's probably because he's a sensitive dude and tired of getting ripped on by everyone. Or if there is any truth to the medical stuff being a point of contention between him and the Warriors.

But he got his rings like he wanted and if he leaves he probably never wins again, and I'm sure he's well aware of this.

Side note, just because the fan base he joined can't say out loud what he did was weak, doesn't change that the general population (who makes up public opinion/perception) feels it was.

This guy gets it. Comprehend this, nasty, and you might actually get it, too.

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 03:36 AM
He won't be hated but will it be a weak move? The answer is yes. It will rank right up there with Durant.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Nope. How is this so hard to see?

nastynice
06-29-2019, 04:52 AM
Everyone made fun of him, by pasting a new team on his players tribune picture for "my next chapter" everytime he lost to a new team. Or made the joke of KD seen 3 guys beating up an old man so he jumped in, then said he didn't stand a chance against the 4 of us. Even Peyton Manning roasting him at the ESPY's for wanting to join the USA gymnastics team because they were so dominant. I believe there was even a joke reference to him joining a LLWS team or something.

So, no. Him joining the team that just beat him wasn't where the hate came from, it just made him the butt of a ton of jokes, especially when coupled with how historically dominant the team he was joining already was without him.

You just didn't see Malone, Stockton or Ewing rushing to join the Bulls.

As far as building vs going to something built, KG, PP and Ray won year 1 but still had to build it. LBJ, Wade and Bosh had to build it. LBJ, Kyrie and Love had to build it. KD came to a team who had been in playoff contention for 4 years and finals contention for 2, he didn't have to build anything.

If Durant leaves it's probably because he's a sensitive dude and tired of getting ripped on by everyone. Or if there is any truth to the medical stuff being a point of contention between him and the Warriors.

But he got his rings like he wanted and if he leaves he probably never wins again, and I'm sure he's well aware of this.

Side note, just because the fan base he joined can't say out loud what he did was weak, doesn't change that the general population (who makes up public opinion/perception) feels it was.

Durant is what made the team historically dominant. The team without him went 7 games twice in 4 series. That's not a historically dominant team.

Malone Stockton and Ewing didn't live in an era of free agency as is today. These aren't comparable. This is the super team era, lebron's joined the heat but we one upped them, and now they're trying to get lebron ad and Kawhi. That is arguably 3 of the top 7 players. Yet somehow this is defended while Durant was weak? lol, c'mon

This is just a new era, lebron helped change the way teams are built and how free agents hit the market. This is a super team era. Lakers didn't look to build around lebron, they got ad. It's a super team potential.

Up to this point in time the warriors have been the best. It makes people mad. It is what it is.

More-Than-Most
06-29-2019, 05:33 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FZOw1rlqhU


go ahead... watch that and hear what jay said... same thing i said and tell me how its not as bad or worse then durant? Also i say **** it sign where you sign. It sucks but whatever... But dont sit here and **** on durant for all those years and be alright with KL going to the lakers... stop with the 73 win team ********... durant went to a team with 3 top 20 players..... KL would be going to a team with 2 top 5-7 players and probably a sick *** bench because of the ring chasers.... JUST STOP. Use your damn head... If you were alright with the durant move then you should be alright with this... if you hated the durant move your *** better be calling KL the **** out as well or you are a hyporcite.... the arguable BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD would be joining the arguable BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD and another top 7 player........................ exactly.

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 06:11 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FZOw1rlqhU


go ahead... watch that and hear what jay said... same thing i said and tell me how its not as bad or worse then durant? Also i say **** it sign where you sign. It sucks but whatever... But dont sit here and **** on durant for all those years and be alright with KL going to the lakers... stop with the 73 win team ********... durant went to a team with 3 top 20 players..... KL would be going to a team with 2 top 5-7 players and probably a sick *** bench because of the ring chasers.... JUST STOP. Use your damn head... If you were alright with the durant move then you should be alright with this... if you hated the durant move your *** better be calling KL the **** out as well or you are a hyporcite.... the arguable BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD would be joining the arguable BEST PLAYER IN THE WORLD and another top 7 player........................ exactly.

That sounds a lot like what the Heat were looking forward to in 2010 and they started off rocky and didnít win their first year and went 2-2 those four years in the Finals when the East was so weak it was a laughingstock aside from Lebron. We donít know how those guys will gel and if they get a quality bench and stay healthy. We knew, barring injury, what GS with Durant was capable of.

Again, forming>>>>>>>>joining. This isnít a hard concept to grasp, people.

warfelg
06-29-2019, 06:15 AM
Yes he should get hate and more.

Durant didnít join 2 other top 7 players.
LeBron didnít join 2 other top 7 players.

Kawhi will be joining 2 other top 7 players. To add to it, we make this big deal about rings, what Durant and LeBron were players without rings. You would be talking about a 2x champion and a 2x FMVP joining to create more rings which should be criticized very hard.

More-Than-Most
06-29-2019, 06:16 AM
That sounds a lot like what the Heat were looking forward to in 2010 and they started off rocky and didnít win their first year and went 2-2 those four years in the Finals when the East was so weak it was a laughingstock aside from Lebron. We donít know how those guys will gel and if they get a quality bench and stay healthy. We knew, barring injury, what GS with Durant was capable of.

Again, forming>>>>>>>>joining. This isnít a hard concept to grasp, people.

To put it into context youd have lebron joining wade/Bosh right?

This is KL who isnt on prime brons level Joining lebron/Davis who even now both are much better than wade/bosh while KL might be almost but not quite as good as lebron.

Lebron/AD->curry/klay/dray
Lebron/AD/KL---------------------->Lebron/wade/bosh

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 06:28 AM
To put it into context youd have lebron joining wade/Bosh right?

This is KL who isnt on prime brons level Joining lebron/Davis who even now both are much better than wade/bosh while KL might be almost but not quite as good as lebron.

Lebron/AD->curry/klay/dray
Lebron/AD/KL---------------------->Lebron/wade/bosh

Again, we donít know how these guys will gel. We donít who will ring chase. We donít know if the coaching will clash or even matter.

We knew these things with the Durant move. We knew that the Warriors had recently won a title with that core and set the wins record and came a Curry choke away from winning a second straight title. We knew Kerr was there implementing everything for a DPOY/triple double machine/point forward, greatest shooting 3&D guy ever, greatest shooter ever and two time MVP, and super-Sixth-Man-to-be Iguodala. KL+AD+LBJ is better than the Heat threesome but itís not on that Ď16 Warriors team with KD joining. Those were two excruciatingly awful years.



That KL/AD/LBJ combo is more like a beefed up Heat team. Durant joining was like Lebron joining the Celtics or Malone joining the Bulls. It wouldnít be worth watching in those situations, either.

Edit: And ****, Durant is way better than Malone and that Warriors team was way better than that Celtics team. It would be like prime Shaq joining the Bulls.



Meh, as amazing as repeating myself over and over to guys that have no clue what actually brings ďhateĒ upon a player, Iím going to bed. And I hope I never click into this dumb thread again. Lord williní and if the creek donít rise......

zookman65
06-29-2019, 08:06 AM
This thread is the ultimate in false equivalencies. Kawhi joining Lakers not anything like Durant, whom had never won anything, joining the Warriors. Kawhi went from what San Antonio thought was ultimate banishment in Toronto to being the undisputed king of basketball. So the answer is no, unless you fall easily for false equivalencies and fallacious logic.

Rad_Racing
06-29-2019, 09:04 AM
If Kawhi signs with the Lakers I see it more of wanting to play back home in Southern California. He has probably had his mind made up for over a year.

I donít see a major correlation between the free agencies of Durant and Kawhi. Many people have already outlined that. I didnít really have much of an opinion on Durant going to the Warriors.

NBA all the way
06-29-2019, 09:54 AM
Durant is what made the team historically dominant. The team without him went 7 games twice in 4 series. That's not a historically dominant team.

Malone Stockton and Ewing didn't live in an era of free agency as is today. These aren't comparable. This is the super team era, lebron's joined the heat but we one upped them, and now they're trying to get lebron ad and Kawhi. That is arguably 3 of the top 7 players. Yet somehow this is defended while Durant was weak? lol, c'mon

This is just a new era, lebron helped change the way teams are built and how free agents hit the market. This is a super team era. Lakers didn't look to build around lebron, they got ad. It's a super team potential.

Up to this point in time the warriors have been the best. It makes people mad. It is what it is.

I just meant from a single season perspective, because no one is ever gonna match or beat that 73 mark. But KD helped them become a dynasty for sure.

I'm not saying it's defended, the op just asked if Kawhi joins the Lakers will he be hated like Durant was. I think no for the reasons I listed, it's just different circumstances. It's not one in the same. Plus to me, Kawhi is already established he can win on his own... Twice. If KD does decide to leave and ends up winning elsewhere, it may deter some of his naysayers, although I think his age and injury will make that more difficult.

I understand the difference in eras, I was just doing it for comparison sake. Everyone who thinks they're similar seem to be caught up on the talent coming together versus the circumstances in which they were able to. The built vs bought argument. If you wanna say the Lakers will have more or on par talent as the 2017 Warriors, on paper maybe, sure. But we have no idea what they can do. We were well aware of what the Warriors could do prior to KD joining.

On paper the 2013/14 Nets shoulda been way better than they were. On paper the 2012/13 Lakers shoulda been better than they were. On paper the 2012/13 Knicks shoulda been better than they were. On paper the 2012/13 and the 2013/14 Clippers shoulda been better than they were. The 2007/08 Rockets shoulda been better than they were. The list is endless of coulda, shoulda, woulda teams strictly on talent alone.

I know people will say age, injuries and chemistry issues played a part in most or all of those situations, but that is exactly the point. When something isn't established, you have no idea how it's going to workout. Lakers have a brand new coaching staff just jam packed with former head coaches. As it stands right now only returning 2 players from last year's roster, that is massive turnover. None of the hypothetical big 3 have ever played together.

As far as you saying the Warriors one upped whoever and have just been the best. Well, Curry's ankles, Klay and Dray being young, Iggy being older and the NBPA not wanting to smooth in the money from the new tv deal, allowing the cap spike is the only reason KD was able to join. There was no equivalent to it prior and there most likely never will be again. That was such a unique set of circumstances for the salary cap to jump $24 million in one summer, never been anything close to that in the salary cap era. It was over a 34% increase in cap space.

Anyway, it's not like LBJ, AD and Melo in their primes have been stomping over the league (Kawhi included) together the past 2 seasons and have a ring or 2 and that is what Kawhi is potentially joining. It'll be a gutted roster, new coaching staff, ground up build. Not at all similar to the dynasty in the making KD joined.

KobeOwnSU
06-29-2019, 11:11 AM
Wait. Didnít Kawhi want to go to the Lakers before either LeBron or AD were there? You know, when the Lakers sucked and were in the lottery every year? Is it his fault he had to wait a year because the Spurs refused to trade him to the Lakers? Yíall done known that Kawhi was going to the Lakers for the past year, why act surprised? The only question was whether the Lakers could get that max money for him and they did. Also, KD joined a team with three all stars, three straight finals appearances and coming off 73 wins. The Lakers havenít done **** in a decade. The only comparison is that they already have a couple great players but is that Kawhis fault? He couldnít control where he went last year and now he can, why should he get bashed for going where he wanted to be all along?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

mike_noodles
06-29-2019, 11:24 AM
Now why would Kawhi not want to meet with Rob Pelinka? What could it possibly be that he only wants to meet with Buss and Magic?

tucksoe
06-29-2019, 11:31 AM
so you think there is a big difference in joining a team with curry/dray/klay and lebron/AD? without KL this team when they add the depth will be on par or better than that warriors team yet we should ignore logic all because a team the year before didnt make the playoffs but ignore the facts of why they didnt make the playoffs? If Lebron/Lonzo arent hurt the lakers are like a 4 seed out west but lets ignore logic here.
And with a healthy Klay and KD Warriors would have been champs again

aman_13
06-29-2019, 11:39 AM
Nope. How is this so hard to see?I should ask you that. He would be joining two top 5 players lol.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

aman_13
06-29-2019, 11:42 AM
Kawhi can honestly end the era of super teams. I don't think KD stays with Oakland long term if Kawhi plays for the Clippers or stays with the Raptors.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

tucksoe
06-29-2019, 11:49 AM
so you think there is a big difference in joining a team with curry/dray/klay and lebron/AD? without KL this team when they add the depth will be on par or better than that warriors team yet we should ignore logic all because a team the year before didnt make the playoffs but ignore the facts of why they didnt make the playoffs? If Lebron/Lonzo arent hurt the lakers are like a 4 seed out west but lets ignore logic here.
And with a healthy Klay and KD Warriors would have been champs again

RaiderLakersA's
06-29-2019, 12:13 PM
A lot of people will like him, but a lot will hate him. It always happens. Always. Look at how lovable Shaq is now

I couldn't stand Shaq in his prime. That didn't change when he became a Laker. We would have won more titles if he had kept his *** in shape and had Kobe's focus. Don't much care for him now. Most Dominant Big Man, but has only about half the rings of Kareem. LOL

LeonFSU
06-29-2019, 12:36 PM
Now why would Kawhi not want to meet with Rob Pelinka? What could it possibly be that he only wants to meet with Buss and Magic?

Probably because he knows there is no chance he goes there. Maybe he wants to ask Magic why he should want to go to the Lakers if their GM canít be trusted.

I canít see how anyone seriously thinks Kawhi would want to team up with LeBron. They play the same position, one of them would have to change his game, and they are arguably rivals. Kawhi is not choosing to play with LeBron or Durant. Just not happening.

IKnowHoops
06-29-2019, 01:29 PM
Yes but you somehow tried to use that as a differentiater between people joining to form something vs joining something. It's the same bull ****, lol, no one cares if you join something already formed vs forming at once. You convince yourself it means something, but it really doesn't

There is a difference.

Forming leaves a lot more unknown.

Taking a 73 win team, and replacing Harrison Barnes with KD leaves zero doubt about whatís going to happen.

We already know that the team is already the best in the league without KD. Itís hard to give props for still winning at that point.

IKnowHoops
06-29-2019, 01:32 PM
To some people, sure.

To some people playing injured and having your Achilles snap in front of everyone makes his mindset not suspect.

Diff strokes, diff folks

Achilles rupture doesnít erase twitter burner accounts or narking out Shaq for cheating.

IKnowHoops
06-29-2019, 01:37 PM
I guess to you it does, to me it doesn't.

If Giannis, lebron, kd, Kawhi, curry, harden and kyrie all joined the same team in one summer, to me that would stack the odds on their favor more than a top player joining a top team.

Yes that does. There are levels to this, and that would, tip the scale...but up to this point, the highest level of stacking the deck is Durant joining a 73 win team. And the fact they eliminated him 2 months prior puts the cherry on top.

IKnowHoops
06-29-2019, 01:46 PM
Yes he should get hate and more.

Durant didnít join 2 other top 7 players.
LeBron didnít join 2 other top 7 players.

Kawhi will be joining 2 other top 7 players. To add to it, we make this big deal about rings, what Durant and LeBron were players without rings. You would be talking about a 2x champion and a 2x FMVP joining to create more rings which should be criticized very hard.

Durantís team did and could win without him.
None of Brons teams that won, could of won without him.

Stop being silly
Bosh wasnít top 7 lol
Itís not about just two other guys, itís about the whole team and how good they are. That Miami team had the weakest role players ever. Your not even trying to be logical. Your just blurting out a few fandoms to try and win an argument.


I never hated on KD. I still think it was the right move and I donít think he should leave now. It was unfortunate he and Klay got hurt, but heís still in the most amazing situation ever if winning is the goal.

You will be mad because it just makes it harder now for your team to win. I get it.

statquo
06-29-2019, 01:53 PM
Durant should sign in Toronto to play with Kawhi. The experts of load management will make sure his Achilles is good to go.

nastynice
06-29-2019, 05:28 PM
Yes that does. There are levels to this, and that would, tip the scale...but up to this point, the highest level of stacking the deck is Durant joining a 73 win team. And the fact they eliminated him 2 months prior puts the cherry on top.

Sure, and before that the highest level of deck stacking was in Miami, and now the new highest might be in LA.

It is what it is, the league is different now. If people wanna not take the easy way out like lillard, that's fine, but super teams are here.

nastynice
06-29-2019, 05:29 PM
. That Miami team had the weakest role players ever.

I wonder what their depth looked like compared to these warriors depth

Iron24th
06-29-2019, 05:31 PM
Kawhi has already proved everything, that's why he can do anything he wants to do now.

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 05:31 PM
I should ask you that. He would be joining two top 5 players lol.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

And again, thatís not why Durant was hated on. He wasnít hated on for joining 2 guys he had never played with. He didnít get hated for joining Curry and Klay on a new team that was basically starting from scratch. He got hated for joining a championship team that won the most games in regular season history and made the competitive balance a non factor.

This new Lakers team (if Kawhi even joins) wonít be flat out the best team head and shoulders above the rest, Theyíll be another contender with flaws and questions just like a half dozen other teams.

aman_13
06-29-2019, 05:51 PM
And again, thatís not why Durant was hated on. He wasnít hated on for joining 2 guys he had never played with. He didnít get hated for joining Curry and Klay on a new team that was basically starting from scratch. He got hated for joining a championship team that won the most games in regular season history and made the competitive balance a non factor.

This new Lakers team (if Kawhi even joins) wonít be flat out the best team head and shoulders above the rest, Theyíll be another contender with flaws and questions just like a half dozen other teams.

That's your interpretation i guess. To me they are hands down the favorite next year. No team is beating them 4 times next year if Kawhi joins that squad. I will never hate on Kawhi, but why take on a secondary role when you can lead the team you were on to the finals. Again, i will respect Kawhi no matter what and you won't see me complaining but its a weak move to go to the Lakers.

Like let's not overthink this, Kawhi, AD and LeBron on the same team is insane. I'm sure they will figure out how to fill the team out and it is nice to have Kuzma as well.

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 06:01 PM
That's your interpretation i guess. To me they are hands down the favorite next year. No team is beating them 4 times next year if Kawhi joins that squad. I will never hate on Kawhi, but why take on a secondary role when you can lead the team you were on to the finals. Again, i will respect Kawhi no matter what and you won't see me complaining but its a weak move to go to the Lakers.

Like let's not overthink this, Kawhi, AD and LeBron on the same team is insane. I'm sure they will figure out how to fill the team out and it is nice to have Kuzma as well.

But you said his move would rank right up here with Durant. No, they are two different situations. A lot can happen over the course of a season and we all saw what happened last time three studs joined up, it wasnít dominance on the Warriors level. Lots of variable waiting to be seen.

aman_13
06-29-2019, 06:04 PM
But you said his move would rank right up here with Durant. No, they are two different situations. A lot can happen over the course of a season and we all saw what happened last time three studs joined up, it wasnít dominance on the Warriors level. Lots of variable waiting to be seen.

Yeah in terms of weak moves, it's right up there. I'm not saying it's ahead of KD or on par but when we rank free agent decisions based on all-time greats trying to make it incredibly easy on themselves to win a chip, Kawhi joining AD and LeBron would be up there.

aman_13
06-29-2019, 06:10 PM
He can do whatever he likes though. I will be sad if he leaves Toronto, but i'll still root for him if he does play for the Lakers. In fact, i hope he wins another chip in the process if it's not against us. Good chance it won't be if he decides to leave.

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 06:30 PM
Yeah in terms of weak moves, it's right up there. I'm not saying it's ahead of KD or on par but when we rank free agent decisions based on all-time greats trying to make it incredibly easy on themselves to win a chip, Kawhi joining AD and LeBron would be up there.

Disagree, especially since heís wanted to go there for years.


He can do whatever he likes though. I will be sad if he leaves Toronto, but i'll still root for him if he does play for the Lakers. In fact, i hope he wins another chip in the process if it's not against us. Good chance it won't be if he decides to leave.

I kinda doubt he leaves but good on you for not being salty if he does.

aman_13
06-29-2019, 06:47 PM
Disagree, especially since heís wanted to go there for years.



I kinda doubt he leaves but good on you for not being salty if he does.

He was never a Lakers fan though and the word is that he wanted to join the Clippers.

CELTICS4LYFE
06-29-2019, 06:58 PM
Lakers won a ring and 72 games last year????

Think this would be the complete opposite of KD leaving OKC

aman_13
06-29-2019, 07:01 PM
Lakers won a ring and 72 games last year????

Think this would be the complete opposite of KD leaving OKC

:nod:

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 07:08 PM
:nod:

But you just said......wait; huh?

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 07:09 PM
He was never a Lakers fan though and the word is that he wanted to join the Clippers.

LAís LA.

aman_13
06-29-2019, 07:19 PM
But you just said......wait; huh?Read what I wrote bro.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 07:32 PM
Read what I wrote bro.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

You correlated the two and said that the level of hate was the same but now youíre agreeing that itíd be the complete opposite.


So, huh?

Jamiecballer
06-29-2019, 07:36 PM
Kawhi is too much of a competitor to do this crap. I will believe it when I see it. He has stated many times he wants to be one of the all-time all-timers. This would put a nail in that coffin.

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 07:40 PM
Kawhi is too much of a competitor to do this crap. I will believe it when I see it. He has stated many times he wants to be one of the all-time all-timers. This would put a nail in that coffin.

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

I do t know about that. Bringing titles back to the Lakers would be pretty big. But if he continues to do it in Toronto, I think itíll go a lot farther. He kinda got lucky with going to a Spurs team with Pop and crew already being winners and then facing a hurt Warriors team. Regardless, heís still amazing but Iím not sure he wins if heís not traded by Indiana on draft night. Who knows, though.

aman_13
06-29-2019, 07:51 PM
You correlated the two and said that the level of hate was the same but now youíre agreeing that itíd be the complete opposite.


So, huh?I said it was a weak move. Didn't mean to put in in terms of level of hate. I should have added context in my original post but I get the confusion because of what the OP asked.

All I'm saying is if we made a list about all time moves where superstars in their primes joined a team to make it incredibly easy on themselves, Kawhi joing AD and LeBron would rank somewhere up there. The context would be different but the basis of the list still stands.

In terms of getting hate, I know people will because talk shows are already discussing it but it would be no where near Durant level. And yes it doesn't deserve to be.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

aman_13
06-29-2019, 07:52 PM
He won't be hated but will it be a weak move? The answer is yes. It will rank right up there with Durant.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using TapatalkLooking back, this is what I wrote lol. Nothing about hate.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 08:03 PM
The reason people hated Durant was because of how weak his move was. To say that Kawhiís move to LA would be just as weak but without the same level of hate is........odd. And wrong. And Iím not going to go over again why it is because even if I did, you still wouldnít understand it.

aman_13
06-29-2019, 08:05 PM
The reason people hated Durant was because of how weak his move was. To say that Kawhiís move to LA would be just as weak but without the same level of hate is........odd. And wrong. And Iím not going to go over again why it is because even if I did, you still wouldnít understand it.

lmao yeah, this is a waste of time, my point wasn't that hard to understand. It's okay.

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 08:21 PM
lmao yeah, this is a waste of time, my point wasn't that hard to understand. It's okay.

Oh, it was. Itís just wrong.

aman_13
06-29-2019, 08:41 PM
Oh, it was. Itís just wrong.You'd get it if you weren't so fixated on such a narrowed argument.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 08:48 PM
You'd get it if you weren't so fixated on such a narrowed argument.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Might be narrow, but at least itís accurate.

LakerShow
06-29-2019, 08:53 PM
Leonard is joining a team that is not that good last year, Durant did a punk move and joined a team that eliminated him. Lol

aman_13
06-29-2019, 09:01 PM
Might be narrow, but at least itís accurate.Your point isn't anything new. You just can't read or can't think outside your small box.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 09:18 PM
Your point isn't anything new. You just can't read or can't think outside your small box.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Thatís why he was getting hate and itís not remotely the same as what Kawhi would be doing by joining LA. Iím no Laker fan and Iíd love for him to stay in Toronto, but if he does go to the Lakers, I wonít hate on him or call him what I (and countless others) called Durant.


But go ahead, say something else off base and obtuse and get them final lickins in, bro.

aman_13
06-29-2019, 09:38 PM
Thatís why he was getting hate and itís not remotely the same as what Kawhi would be doing by joining LA. Iím no Laker fan and Iíd love for him to stay in Toronto, but if he does go to the Lakers, I wonít hate on him or call him what I (and countless others) called Durant.


But go ahead, say something else off base and obtuse and get them final lickins in, bro.

You have no idea what I'm saying. It's fine.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

Jamiecballer
06-29-2019, 09:42 PM
I do t know about that. Bringing titles back to the Lakers would be pretty big. But if he continues to do it in Toronto, I think itíll go a lot farther. He kinda got lucky with going to a Spurs team with Pop and crew already being winners and then facing a hurt Warriors team. Regardless, heís still amazing but Iím not sure he wins if heís not traded by Indiana on draft night. Who knows, though.Winning titles as the 3rd option on a team with Lebron James and one of the most talented bigs ever will do almost nothing for his legacy.

I get that comparing him to Chris Bosh is nuts because of how much better Kawhi is but nobody will ever credit Bosh with "bringing titles" to Miami and I dont expect anyone to view this any different.

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

nastynice
06-29-2019, 09:44 PM
The reason people hated Durant was because of how weak his move was. To say that Kawhiís move to LA would be just as weak but without the same level of hate is........odd. And wrong. And Iím not going to go over again why it is because even if I did, you still wouldnít understand it.

Maybe he understood it and just disagrees. That's also a possibility

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 10:10 PM
Winning titles as the 3rd option on a team with Lebron James and one of the most talented bigs ever will do almost nothing for his legacy.

I get that comparing him to Chris Bosh is nuts because of how much better Kawhi is but nobody will ever credit Bosh with "bringing titles" to Miami and I dont expect anyone to view this any different.

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

Iíd say Kawhi is the Wade in the situation and AD is the Bosh. If LeBron keeps getting some injuries as he ages, Kawhi might be the Lebron. Granted, AD is miles ahead of Bosh.

Jamiecballer
06-29-2019, 10:47 PM
Iíd say Kawhi is the Wade in the situation and AD is the Bosh. If LeBron keeps getting some injuries as he ages, Kawhi might be the Lebron. Granted, AD is miles ahead of Bosh.Either way, think about how people generally discount Kobe's rings when he had Shaq. Or Currys rings when he has Durant and vice versa.

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

Saddletramp
06-29-2019, 10:51 PM
Either way, think about how people generally discount Kobe's rings when he had Shaq. Or Currys rings when he has Durant and vice versa.

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

I hear ya.

DODGERS&LAKERS
06-30-2019, 01:11 AM
Obviously as a laker fan I would like them to sign Kawhi because it ensures a two man tandem once lebron is done. But for the NBA, I prefer he stay in Toronto. Plus, I'd like to see a more complete roster. I dont think you NEED 3 superstars of that caliber. Especially if KD leaves GS. If he stays then the Lakers do need Kawhi.

I'd prefer this if affordable (Salaries for 1st year with 20% raises after)

Beverly $12/Caruso
Green$10/Curry 4.8 R.E
Lebron/Ariza vet min
Kuzma/Korver vet min
Davis/Jordan $10

LaVar Ball
06-30-2019, 02:02 AM
lebron will take another hit for being the biggest front runner

LeBron is towards the end of his career

LaVar Ball
06-30-2019, 02:03 AM
Iíd say Kawhi is the Wade in the situation and AD is the Bosh. If LeBron keeps getting some injuries as he ages, Kawhi might be the Lebron. Granted, AD is miles ahead of Bosh.

Wrong.


LeBron is the Wade already. First step he took was giving his 23 to AD. That was a resignation of sorts that he no longer wants to be the focal point, he understand he has 2-3 yrs left on his contract, AD and Ďsaid playerí are the future of the franchise. He is doing the honors and passing the torch.

KobeOwnSU
06-30-2019, 02:14 AM
Kawhi is definitely the LeBron. Saying LeBron, right now, is the Wade is a disservice to prime Wade honestly.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Bostonjorge
06-30-2019, 02:25 AM
How is the Finals MVP going to be a third wheel on a team that has zero players in the playoffs last year?

Leonard is the Jordan of basketball right now.

More-Than-Most
06-30-2019, 04:01 AM
Kawhi is definitely the LeBron. Saying LeBron, right now, is the Wade is a disservice to prime Wade honestly.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

this is stupid... I love KL but stop. I get some of your fanbase hates lebron but he was still amazing last year even with an injury... the show runs through lebron even at his age like it always has... Even with an injury lebron was better than AD and KL and fun note even with an injury played in almost as many games as KL who needed rest time... really think about how insane and sad that is that KL to do what he did needed 22 games of off days to be that good and lebron finished 5 games short..... lebron was better... is better and even with an injury almost played as much so just stop... get over the hate because of the love for kobe... You have arguably the best player in the world when healthy and the show runs through him.


anyway you slice it lebron while injured was better than KL in the regular season without the rest time KL needed... per/win/Real plus minus etc... KL had an amazing playoffs but lebron does that **** every year and would have done it again had he not gotten injured where is KL needed 22 games off with no injury and still didnt do what lebron did in his normal playoff runs. Just saying


my god get over the kobe love and stop with the hate... lebron is/was and always will be better move on... for the lakers right now Lebron had a better regular season than KL and his last post season app was better than KL this post season... Maybe lebron falls off but right now you are honestly being delusional because of hate

lakers squad
06-30-2019, 04:34 AM
Kawhi would be our best all around player imo...Lebron has lost a step already, he doesn't play much Defense because of it. KL definitely is better on that end, and his offensive game is getting better and is on par with a declining Lebron, wake up and smell the coffee, MTM!

More-Than-Most
06-30-2019, 04:55 AM
Kawhi would be our best all around player imo...Lebron has lost a step already, he doesn't play much Defense because of it. KL definitely is better on that end, and his offensive game is getting better and is on par with a declining Lebron, wake up and smell the coffee, MTM!

Imagine if you werent bias and used logic and understood lebron hasnt played wait for it defense in years in the wait for it REGULAR SEASON because and again wait for it because he gets to the finals every year and understands and wait for it CHAMPIONSHIPS MEAN EVERYTHING... Imagine if lebron was able to only play 60 games during the regular season in his career and his team ended up being a 2 seed and had like an 85 winning pct without him WHICH HAS NEVER HAPPENED... Imagine? Imagine? Logic/facts IMAGINE? we get it the few of you are so worried about kobe and say to hell with winning because you hate lebron that much but move the **** on. Stop spewing this crap that has no actual evidence AND MOVE ON. Lebron was better than KL last year in the regular season WHILE INJURED and almost played as many games as a healthy KL .

lakers squad
06-30-2019, 06:54 AM
Imagine if you werent bias and used logic and understood lebron hasnt played wait for it defense in years in the wait for it REGULAR SEASON because and again wait for it because he gets to the finals every year and understands and wait for it CHAMPIONSHIPS MEAN EVERYTHING... Imagine if lebron was able to only play 60 games during the regular season in his career and his team ended up being a 2 seed and had like an 85 winning pct without him WHICH HAS NEVER HAPPENED... Imagine? Imagine? Logic/facts IMAGINE? we get it the few of you are so worried about kobe and say to hell with winning because you hate lebron that much but move the **** on. Stop spewing this crap that has no actual evidence AND MOVE ON. Lebron was better than KL last year in the regular season WHILE INJURED and almost played as many games as a healthy KL .

I'm not bias because of Kobe, I'm all about the Lakers as a team over any individual player! According to your Logic Lebron waits to the playoffs to really play Defense apparently! Well we will see if he can still turn it on as for as Defense go's once the playoffs get here, and agree to drop this for now! But trust me, I hope you are correct! I do agree that the Raptor's managed Kawhi's season perfectly last year, and kept him healthy and fresh to finish strong!

warfelg
06-30-2019, 07:07 AM
Stop being silly
Bosh wasnít top 7 lol



LeBron didnít join 2 other top 7 players.

Hmmm funny. Looks like Iím implying one of Wade or Bosh not being a top 7 player...

More-Than-Most
06-30-2019, 07:28 AM
I'm not bias because of Kobe, I'm all about the Lakers as a team over any individual player! According to your Logic Lebron waits to the playoffs to really play Defense apparently! Well we will see if he can still turn it on as for as Defense go's once the playoffs get here, and agree to drop this for now! But trust me, I hope you are correct! I do agree that the Raptor's managed Kawhi's season perfectly last year, and kept him healthy and fresh to finish strong!

if you guys dont get KL and have lebron/AD just manage their minutes... 8 seed or 1 seed means nothing if i am being honest... that is overrated as ****... manage their minutes and keep them healthy and let them come alive when the playoffs start just like the raptors did for KL

Jamiecballer
06-30-2019, 07:57 AM
How is the Finals MVP going to be a third wheel on a team that has zero players in the playoffs last year?

Leonard is the Jordan of basketball right now.

for arguments sake, lets just say you are right. one thing we have seen time and again is that the circumstances that created these 3 lines

25.9 ppg, 12 rpg, 3.9 apg
27.4 ppg, 8.5 rpg, 8.3 apg
26.6 ppg, 7.3 rpg, 3.3 apg

won't exist on one team. so who takes a backseat? there has to be a Bosh or Kevin Love.

personally i think when you've got Lebron, who is going to be the guy with the ball in his hand making plays the most, still at a very high level, he will still be the centrepiece. because he's Lebron. he will play until he can no longer be "the man", imo, and no longer - despite whatever he might say to the contrary. just my opinion. and anthony davis has been salivating to come to LA and IMO is the guy who will be most hungry to get recognition because he probably feels like his time in NO did not get him the notoriety he deserves. and with a player of Anthony Davis's caliber in the paint i just have a feeling in the interest of a balanced offense he will be the most likely second option.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-30-2019, 10:29 AM
Nah. Durant joined a team he lost to and the optics looked really bad.

Kawhi won on his own already. He doesn't have anything to prove at this point.

KobeOwnSU
06-30-2019, 11:58 AM
this is stupid... I love KL but stop. I get some of your fanbase hates lebron but he was still amazing last year even with an injury... the show runs through lebron even at his age like it always has... Even with an injury lebron was better than AD and KL and fun note even with an injury played in almost as many games as KL who needed rest time... really think about how insane and sad that is that KL to do what he did needed 22 games of off days to be that good and lebron finished 5 games short..... lebron was better... is better and even with an injury almost played as much so just stop... get over the hate because of the love for kobe... You have arguably the best player in the world when healthy and the show runs through him.


anyway you slice it lebron while injured was better than KL in the regular season without the rest time KL needed... per/win/Real plus minus etc... KL had an amazing playoffs but lebron does that **** every year and would have done it again had he not gotten injured where is KL needed 22 games off with no injury and still didnt do what lebron did in his normal playoff runs. Just saying


my god get over the kobe love and stop with the hate... lebron is/was and always will be better move on... for the lakers right now Lebron had a better regular season than KL and his last post season app was better than KL this post season... Maybe lebron falls off but right now you are honestly being delusional because of hate

I donít hate LeBron, I watched him last year every game and Iím telling you he was out of shape and looked old for the first time. Now, that can change this year if he rededicated himself this offseason but right now Kawhi is the better player and in his prime.

As for the other remark, prime Wade was a way better player then the LeBron I saw last season with the Lakers. Do you not realize just how good prime Wade was? LeBron put up good numbers last year but they were empty and he didnít look nearly as good doing it. The eye test was definitely a fail last year for him.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Bostonjorge
06-30-2019, 12:01 PM
for arguments sake, lets just say you are right. one thing we have seen time and again is that the circumstances that created these 3 lines

25.9 ppg, 12 rpg, 3.9 apg
27.4 ppg, 8.5 rpg, 8.3 apg
26.6 ppg, 7.3 rpg, 3.3 apg

won't exist on one team. so who takes a backseat? there has to be a Bosh or Kevin Love.

personally i think when you've got Lebron, who is going to be the guy with the ball in his hand making plays the most, still at a very high level, he will still be the centrepiece. because he's Lebron. he will play until he can no longer be "the man", imo, and no longer - despite whatever he might say to the contrary. just my opinion. and anthony davis has been salivating to come to LA and IMO is the guy who will be most hungry to get recognition because he probably feels like his time in NO did not get him the notoriety he deserves. and with a player of Anthony Davis's caliber in the paint i just have a feeling in the interest of a balanced offense he will be the most likely second option.

Itís the perfect mesh of players. Leonard will be ďBoshĒ like he was ďBoshĒ on that 2014 Spurs Championship team. Leonard never led any series in scoring and Parker had the ball in hands followed by Ginobli. Leonard was 6th in scoring in the West Finals when they beat the Thunder. This version of Leonard was the finals MVP. Leonard can play off the ball and be MVP effective. Thatís whatís makes the claw special. Leonard will be the one to close the games out even tho heís 6th in scoring while playing the ďBoshĒ role. Leonard just flat out plays winning basketball.

James and Davis can still play their role. James having the ball in his hands as the greatest floor general ever. Davis as the best big man in the game today owning the paint. Itís a perfect mesh of winning basketball.

tredigs
06-30-2019, 12:06 PM
Kawhi proved twice that he can lead a team to a championship that wouldnít have a prayer without him. Bron has done the same thing.

Durant has not shown he can do that.

If Kawhi joins the Lakers it will be to thwart the chances of any other arising super teams that are sure to come. As an individual, neither Bron or KL have anything to prove.

Now itís about being apart of the greatest team ever. That is the goal.

Ohhh, so it's Cool to stack the deck with the All NBA 1st Team on one squad *if* those player have won on their own. Roger that. I guess AD is SOL then. He will never be respected.

NBA all the way
06-30-2019, 12:25 PM
Why is it that it's mostly only Warriors fans who think the 2 situations are the same? 🤔

tredigs
06-30-2019, 12:46 PM
Why is it that it's mostly only Warriors fans who think the 2 situations are the same? 🤔

I haven't read any of this thread outside of the first couple posts as it's predictable and I could care less either way (for either situation).

But I do find it funny the mental gymnastics people perform on the fly when trying to figure out what they deem appropriate or not for other people's life decisions.

As far as wanting to be competitive though? This move clearly is not it if you're Kawhi, AD or Lebron. This would be about stacking the deck with the most top heavy roster in NBA history, and if they don't win nearly every single playoff game (in a rout would be the expectation) should this trade go down, their legacies all take hits as far as their standing next to past greats. That's the stakes if you make this team. And I have no problem with it going down (they're all taking max contracts just like Durant did for GS, it's fair game).

tredigs
06-30-2019, 12:51 PM
And I would be shocked if the average fan (especially those of a top ~8 team) did not absolutely hate this idea. Just when you thought your squad had a fighting chance in the playoffs with the Warriors injuries + possible semi breaking up, an even more lopsided team is potentially being formed. A team where Lebron is the 3rd best player :laugh:

Rough.

Max.This
06-30-2019, 01:25 PM
And I would be shocked if the average fan (especially those of a top ~8 team) did not absolutely hate this idea. Just when you thought your squad had a fighting chance in the playoffs with the Warriors injuries + possible semi breaking up, an even more lopsided team is potentially being formed. A team where Lebron is the 3rd best player :laugh:

Rough.

Prime Lebron, Prime wade, and Prime bosh is comparable to Prime Kawhi, Prime AD, and Slightly over the hill Lebron. They lost their first year to Dirk and when they added Ray allen they were 1 rebound from losing. Stars are important, but i'd argue 1 star surrounded by complimentary pieces can compete with 3 stars + Veteran minimums. When you put 4 all stars on a squad like the warriors, then it becomes impossible barring injuries

smith&wesson
06-30-2019, 01:36 PM
KD got hated on for making a super team even better and leaving a up and coming contender like OKC. Toronto already got a title but if Kawhi leaves them to make a super team in LA, will Kawhi get the KD treatment?

No matter what any one ever does in free agency it wonít amount to the cowardice move Durant made.

tredigs
06-30-2019, 01:38 PM
Prime Lebron, Prime wade, and Prime bosh is comparable to Prime Kawhi, Prime AD, and Slightly over the hill Lebron. They lost their first year to Dirk and when they added Ray allen they were 1 rebound from losing. Stars are important, but i'd argue 1 star surrounded by complimentary pieces can compete with 3 stars + Veteran minimums. When you put 4 all stars on a squad like the warriors, then it becomes impossible barring injuries
A couple things: That loss to the Mavs was an absolute bludgeon to LeBron's legacy and a complete embarrassment of a series by him. There is no excuse for that loss.

Bosh was a very good/All Star Caliber power forward. Anthony Davis is a borderline top 5 player/2 way superstar. Kawhi is a top 5 player/2 way superstar. Lebron is still just 34 (MJ was still the MVP/Finals MVP at this age), coming off the most rest of his career and at worst a top 8 player. They also have Kuzma and will likely get 1-2 solid players to take a cut for a 1 year vet-min/free title. That's significantly more potent than the Heat.

That said, yeah I agree the healthy 2017 Warriors (where Iguodala and Livingston were still helpful) still beat them. But the Lakers will in fact be the most stacked team in history if Kawhi teams up, and they will have expectations of "runaway championship or bust".

tredigs
06-30-2019, 01:46 PM
Consider that if they team up next season there will be legitimate debates on the talking head shows of whether the Lakers have "The 3 best players in the NBA?" and it won't be a ridiculous premise. There is no other team in history where that comment could ever be reasonably made.

Lakers + Giants
06-30-2019, 01:55 PM
I'm liking your posts, Tre :)

Max.This
06-30-2019, 02:04 PM
A couple things: That loss to the Mavs was an absolute bludgeon to LeBron's legacy and a complete embarrassment of a series by him. There is no excuse for that loss.

Bosh was a very good/All Star Caliber power forward. Anthony Davis is a borderline top 5 player/2 way superstar. Kawhi is a top 5 player/2 way superstar. Lebron is still just 34 (MJ was still the MVP/Finals MVP at this age), coming off the most rest of his career and at worst a top 8 player. They also have Kuzma and will likely get 1-2 solid players to take a cut for a 1 year vet-min/free title. That's significantly more potent than the Heat.

That said, yeah I agree the healthy 2017 Warriors (where Iguodala and Livingston were still helpful) still beat them. But the Lakers will in fact be the most stacked team in history if Kawhi teams up, and they will have expectations of "runaway championship or bust".

I think the league is a bit different now then it was back when Lebrons first trio in Miami, no team in the league was remotely close to that team in talent. Theres a lot to be filled in with free agency, but Houston, Philly, milwaukee, Denver, Portland, Boston, and GS can all compete with the Lakers even if they add kawhi. I believe teams are more prepared to face a team with 3 stars, but that warriors 4 star gap was too much .

Max.This
06-30-2019, 02:09 PM
Consider that if they team up next season there will be legitimate debates on the talking head shows of whether the Lakers have "The 3 best players in the NBA?" and it won't be a ridiculous premise. There is no other team in history where that comment could ever be reasonably made.

KD not injured is arguably the best player over kawhi. You give him 2 of the top shooters in the history of basketball.. not just in their generation , but all generations. You put a lockdown defender iguodala next to them as well as one of the best passing powerforwards + defenders as well. You can say Lebron+AD+Kawhi is one of the best talented teams in basketball history, but The GSW the first 2 years with KD arguably has the best team in all of basketball history.

nastynice
06-30-2019, 02:22 PM
Why is it that it's mostly only Warriors fans who think the 2 situations are the same? 🤔

Lol, because they are!

This entire narrative started because kd did what lebron did and stacked the deck in his favor. Same ****.

People always point out these differences, one was built already one was formed,lmaoooo, c'mon no one gives a ****, it's the same ****. It's the super team era and warriors made a super team. Period. All this other ****, oh one team wasn't formed, or lebron signed his contract on a Tuesday evening while kd signed on a Thursday morning, lol, no one cares, its meaningless

It's just warriors haters letting out hate and its hella funny to watch

nastynice
06-30-2019, 02:24 PM
Prime Lebron, Prime wade, and Prime bosh is comparable to Prime Kawhi, Prime AD, and Slightly over the hill Lebron. They lost their first year to Dirk and when they added Ray allen they were 1 rebound from losing. Stars are important, but i'd argue 1 star surrounded by complimentary pieces can compete with 3 stars + Veteran minimums. When you put 4 all stars on a squad like the warriors, then it becomes impossible barring injuries

lol. I like how right up to what the warriors did, it's all kosher, but as soon as it's what the warriors did it's too much :laugh2: :laugh2:

tredigs
06-30-2019, 02:28 PM
KD not injured is arguably the best player over kawhi. You give him 2 of the top shooters in the history of basketball.. not just in their generation , but all generations. You put a lockdown defender iguodala next to them as well as one of the best passing powerforwards + defenders as well. You can say Lebron+AD+Kawhi is one of the best talented teams in basketball history, but The GSW the first 2 years with KD arguably has the best team in all of basketball history.

Well, this is a tangent debate but I'd say KD was clearly the bonus piece that put the Curry led Warriors out of reach by replacing Harrison Barnes 18% Finals 3pt shooting with an assassin, but his skill set is somewhat a case of diminishing returns for the Warriors (I think they're nearly equally out of reach in 2017/18 with Khris Middleton to be honest). That being said, they weren't completely out of reach either. Houston showed us that. It's never as bad as fans think and even if Lebron gets two players better than him on this team, they're still capable of losing to the right team (if Klay comes back with enough time to get healthy that matchup would actually be extremely interesting), but they would still correctly be huge favorites and it will be unlike anything we've ever seen from a top-end talent standpoint.

Best players right now (if healthy) I have (roughly)....

1: Curry
2: Giannis
3: Durant
4: Kawhi
5: AD
6: Harden
7: Jokic
8: Lebron
9: Embiid
10: Damian Lillard

11: Paul George
12: Jimmy Butler
13: Draymond Green
14: Rudy Gobert
15: Kyrie Irving
16: KAT
17: Klay Thompson
18: Victor Oladipo
19: Westbrook
20: Blake Griffin

tredigs
06-30-2019, 02:35 PM
^As far as no other Raptors up there despite the title, they just have a lot of extremely solid players + an insane defense and good coaching around Kawhi. Lowry and Siakim would fall in the low/mid 20's, Gasol in the 30's and Ibaka 40's.

blams
06-30-2019, 02:37 PM
lol. I like how right up to what the warriors did, it's all kosher, but as soon as it's what the warriors did it's too much :laugh2: :laugh2:The warriors did nothing wrong. ****, why not sign KD?

But from KD's side there never has and never will be a more cowardly and unimpressive move in sports history.

Joining the best team ever, after losing to them.

It's like Shaq joining the Bulls after losing to then in Orlando.


They aren't beatable when healthy, no matter what LeBron does.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

blams
06-30-2019, 02:38 PM
Well, this is a tangent debate but I'd say KD was clearly the bonus piece that put the Curry led Warriors out of reach by replacing Harrison Barnes 18% Finals 3pt shooting with an assassin, but his skill set is somewhat a case of diminishing returns for the Warriors (I think they're nearly equally out of reach in 2017/18 with Khris Middleton to be honest). That being said, they weren't completely out of reach either. Houston showed us that. It's never as bad as fans think and even if Lebron gets two players better than him on this team, they're still capable of losing to the right team (if Klay comes back with enough time to get healthy that matchup would actually be extremely interesting), but they would still correctly be huge favorites and it will be unlike anything we've ever seen from a top-end talent standpoint.

Best players right now (if healthy) I have (roughly)....

1: Curry
2: Giannis
3: Durant
4: Kawhi
5: AD
6: Harden
7: Jokic
8: Lebron
9: Embiid
10: Damian Lillard

11: Paul George
12: Jimmy Butler
13: Draymond Green
14: Rudy Gobert
15: Kyrie Irving
16: KAT
17: Klay Thompson
18: Victor Oladipo
19: Westbrook
20: Blake GriffinLeBron is still 1 when it matters.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

nastynice
06-30-2019, 02:42 PM
The warriors did nothing wrong. ****, why not sign KD?

But from KD's side there never has and never will be a more cowardly and unimpressive move in sports history.

Joining the best team ever, after losing to them.

It's like Shaq joining the Bulls after losing to then in Orlando.


They aren't beatable when healthy, no matter what LeBron does.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

There never was and never has been a kd golden state competition. Only a kd lebron competition. Kd didn't view the warriors the way outsiders think he should have. They only met once in the playoffs.

tredigs
06-30-2019, 02:43 PM
LeBron is still 1 when it matters.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Eh - I don't think so (but it's certainly not absurd and I'm sure many agree with this take). Not with his minutes at this age. Not after his proclamation of "entering playoff mode!" last year and nothing changing. He undoubtedly improves, though, and at that point they do legitimately have 3 of the top 5 players in the league for the playoffs if this scenario shakes out.

Saddletramp
06-30-2019, 02:47 PM
Gotta mention ďCurry led WarriorsĒ in case people forgot with all of this superstar talk who the real top player that had the league in check for the last half decade is. Thanks for the reminder. Also:



As far as wanting to be competitive though? This move clearly is not it if you're Kawhi, AD or Lebron. This would be about stacking the deck with the most top heavy roster in NBA history, and if they don't win nearly every single playoff game (in a rout would be the expectation) should this trade go down, their legacies all take hits as far as their standing next to past greats. That's the stakes if you make this team. And I have no problem with it going down (they're all taking max contracts just like Durant did for GS, it's fair game).

Wouldnít it be the team that just set the win record and had recently won a title and that had the two greatest shooters of all time (one just had back to back MVP seasons including the only unanimous count ever), a DPOY triple double machine, a defensive all star vet leader, one of the keagueís best backup PGs, all playing for a COTY adding another MVP and who had been a top 2 or 3 player in the league for a decade? Wouldnít they be the greatest top end talent of all time?

tredigs
06-30-2019, 03:00 PM
Gotta mention ďCurry led WarriorsĒ in case people forgot with all of this superstar talk who the real top player that had the league in check for the last half decade is. Thanks for the reminder. Also:




Wouldnít it be the team that just set the win record and had recently won a title and that had the two greatest shooters of all time (one just had back to back MVP seasons including the only unanimous count ever), a DPOY triple double machine, a defensive all star vet leader, one of the keagueís best backup PGs, all playing for a COTY adding another MVP and who had been a top 2 or 3 player in the league for a decade? Wouldnít they be the greatest top end talent of all time?

Well, it's clear he forgot?

And no, what you're describing is a more dominant all around team than what we're projecting for these Lakers. No team in history has had three legitimate tier-1 superstars at the same time. That is top-end talent. But thanks for chirping in with an irrelevant semantics comment. Talk to you soon.

Saddletramp
06-30-2019, 03:04 PM
Well, it's clear he forgot?

And no, what you're describing is a more dominant all around team than what we're projecting for these Lakers. No team in history has had three legitimate tier-1 superstars at the same time. That is top-end talent. But thanks for chirping in with an irrelevant semantics comment. Talk to you soon.

Iíd rather have what the Warriors have than what the Lakers could potentially have and so do you. Youíre just playing it up in case the Lakers do get past them and itíll be more sweet to take down the big bad giant the more you build him up if you do.

Irrelevant schematic? It was your whole ****ing point. Seriously, you just wrote 5 posts talking about it.

nastynice
06-30-2019, 03:04 PM
Gotta mention ďCurry led WarriorsĒ in case people forgot with all of this superstar talk who the real top player that had the league in check for the last half decade is. Thanks for the reminder. Also:




Wouldnít it be the team that just set the win record and had recently won a title and that had the two greatest shooters of all time (one just had back to back MVP seasons including the only unanimous count ever), a DPOY triple double machine, a defensive all star vet leader, one of the keagueís best backup PGs, all playing for a COTY adding another MVP and who had been a top 2 or 3 player in the league for a decade? Wouldnít they be the greatest top end talent of all time?

Nope, that was #teamstacked. Now we're top end.

NBA all the way
06-30-2019, 03:22 PM
Lol, because they are!

This entire narrative started because kd did what lebron did and stacked the deck in his favor. Same ****.

People always point out these differences, one was built already one was formed,lmaoooo, c'mon no one gives a ****, it's the same ****. It's the super team era and warriors made a super team. Period. All this other ****, oh one team wasn't formed, or lebron signed his contract on a Tuesday evening while kd signed on a Thursday morning, lol, no one cares, its meaningless

It's just warriors haters letting out hate and its hella funny to watch

I feel like circumstances matter but if not view things in a vacuum I suppose. 🤷🏼

tredigs
06-30-2019, 03:32 PM
Iíd rather have what the Warriors have than what the Lakers could potentially have and so do you. Youíre just playing it up in case the Lakers do get past them and itíll be more sweet to take down the big bad giant the more you build him up if you do.

Irrelevant schematic? It was your whole ****ing point. Seriously, you just wrote 5 posts talking about it.

You're exhausting kid. Go ***** and derail somewhere else.

nastynice
06-30-2019, 03:33 PM
I feel like circumstances matter but if not view things in a vacuum I suppose. 🤷🏼*♂️

Circumstances do matter, but I'll say this, they matter little enough in the big picture that if someone are actively supporting one side and bashing the other, they sound ridiculous.

Thats what's been happening in this forum for years and that's what I be polking at

Saddletramp
06-30-2019, 03:42 PM
I feel like circumstances matter but if not view things in a vacuum I suppose. 🤷🏼

Donít waste your time.


You're exhausting kid. Go ***** and derail somewhere else.

Iíd white flag it, too, if I got caught talking out of both sides of my mouth like you just did.

tredigs
06-30-2019, 03:46 PM
Ultimately the big loser if this were to go down would be AD. Just 6 months ago he talked about wanting to be revered as the best player in the NBA, and yet all he has to show for it as a #1 is a bunch of 35-45 win seasons along with 2 early exits. And if he only wins now alongside Lebron and the guy who just won Finals MVP + is considered better than him by most right now, that is just not good for his image. But hey, sometimes rings > image. They just need to make sure they get those rings if this goes down.

tredigs
06-30-2019, 03:48 PM
Donít waste your time.



Iíd white flag it, too, if I got caught talking out of both sides of my mouth like you just did.

Lmfao oh, because I was out there saying the Warriors were not the best team in the league? :laugh: "both sides of my mouth". And literally less than an hour ago in here did not write I would prefer the Warriors in 2017/18 over this hypothetical Lakers team? Just go **** off dude. You're so petty and provide absolutely ****-all to an NBA discussion.

IKnowHoops
06-30-2019, 05:41 PM
I wonder what their depth looked like compared to these warriors depth

Warriors were so much better.

Remember in 2016 finals. Cleveland was up on the starters. Then the bench came in. Barbosa/Livingston went nuts and got the lead in game one. The breasted all series.

The Heats starting pg, Mario Chalmers was so garbage. Barbosa or Livingston were so much better and they were off the bench. Then add in Iggy/and your tough guy PF you had. After Bron Bosh Wade, heat sucked badly.

IKnowHoops
06-30-2019, 05:45 PM
Ultimately the big loser if this were to go down would be AD. Just 6 months ago he talked about wanting to be revered as the best player in the NBA, and yet all he has to show for it as a #1 is a bunch of 35-45 win seasons along with 2 early exits. And if he only wins now alongside Lebron and the guy who just won Finals MVP + is considered better than him by most right now, that is just not good for his image. But hey, sometimes rings > image. They just need to make sure they get those rings if this goes down.

Tre, on paper, I agree, there is almost no difference.

But we are talking about public perception.

Durant looks worse than his teammates because they won without him, as his own teamate Dray even said, also called him a B.

Durant looks worse than KL for the same reasons.

Had he beaten GS that year, then gone to play for him, heíd come off looking like the savior, and the rest of GS would look like the Bís.

Jamiecballer
06-30-2019, 05:45 PM
Itís the perfect mesh of players. Leonard will be ďBoshĒ like he was ďBoshĒ on that 2014 Spurs Championship team. Leonard never led any series in scoring and Parker had the ball in hands followed by Ginobli. Leonard was 6th in scoring in the West Finals when they beat the Thunder. This version of Leonard was the finals MVP. Leonard can play off the ball and be MVP effective. Thatís whatís makes the claw special. Leonard will be the one to close the games out even tho heís 6th in scoring while playing the ďBoshĒ role. Leonard just flat out plays winning basketball.

James and Davis can still play their role. James having the ball in his hands as the greatest floor general ever. Davis as the best big man in the game today owning the paint. Itís a perfect mesh of winning basketball.Hey man, I'm not disagreeing at all. Not only would it be the most talented threesome I've ever seen it would have every chance of working beautifully. I just dont think there is any way Leonard would go back to being that guy. He wants to reach for MJ, IMO.

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

nastynice
06-30-2019, 06:30 PM
Warriors were so much better.

Remember in 2016 finals. Cleveland was up on the starters. Then the bench came in. Barbosa/Livingston went nuts and got the lead in game one. The breasted all series.

The Heats starting pg, Mario Chalmers was so garbage. Barbosa or Livingston were so much better and they were off the bench. Then add in Iggy/and your tough guy PF you had. After Bron Bosh Wade, heat sucked badly.

No I said depth vs THESE warriors. Off the top of my head Miami sounds way better ray Allen, Mike Miller, Chalmers, all these guys were better than what we had by the end of these finals.

Yea 2016 was team stacked, we were crazy deep. Even iggy and Livingston were way better just 3 years ago. That was a fully built squad. We gave that up for the top end elite talent. It was a good move, but the downside got exposed this year when players started going down

Saddletramp
06-30-2019, 07:16 PM
Lmfao oh, because I was out there saying the Warriors were not the best team in the league? :laugh: "both sides of my mouth". And literally less than an hour ago in here did not write I would prefer the Warriors in 2017/18 over this hypothetical Lakers team? Just go **** off dude. You're so petty and provide absolutely ****-all to an NBA discussion.

Then what the **** were you crying about?

Never mind, you do you.

tredigs
06-30-2019, 07:24 PM
Then what the **** were you crying about?

Never mind, you do you.

:laugh: You are so ****ing clueless. There was no crying. Just some thoughts and a discussion. Until your dumb-*** piped up and derailed.

IKnowHoops
06-30-2019, 07:43 PM
this is stupid... I love KL but stop. I get some of your fanbase hates lebron but he was still amazing last year even with an injury... the show runs through lebron even at his age like it always has... Even with an injury lebron was better than AD and KL and fun note even with an injury played in almost as many games as KL who needed rest time... really think about how insane and sad that is that KL to do what he did needed 22 games of off days to be that good and lebron finished 5 games short..... lebron was better... is better and even with an injury almost played as much so just stop... get over the hate because of the love for kobe... You have arguably the best player in the world when healthy and the show runs through him.


anyway you slice it lebron while injured was better than KL in the regular season without the rest time KL needed... per/win/Real plus minus etc... KL had an amazing playoffs but lebron does that **** every year and would have done it again had he not gotten injured where is KL needed 22 games off with no injury and still didnt do what lebron did in his normal playoff runs. Just saying


my god get over the kobe love and stop with the hate... lebron is/was and always will be better move on... for the lakers right now Lebron had a better regular season than KL and his last post season app was better than KL this post season... Maybe lebron falls off but right now you are honestly being delusional because of hate


Imagine if you werent bias and used logic and understood lebron hasnt played wait for it defense in years in the wait for it REGULAR SEASON because and again wait for it because he gets to the finals every year and understands and wait for it CHAMPIONSHIPS MEAN EVERYTHING... Imagine if lebron was able to only play 60 games during the regular season in his career and his team ended up being a 2 seed and had like an 85 winning pct without him WHICH HAS NEVER HAPPENED... Imagine? Imagine? Logic/facts IMAGINE? we get it the few of you are so worried about kobe and say to hell with winning because you hate lebron that much but move the **** on. Stop spewing this crap that has no actual evidence AND MOVE ON. Lebron was better than KL last year in the regular season WHILE INJURED and almost played as many games as a healthy KL .

You better quit before people think you are my dupe

tredigs
06-30-2019, 07:49 PM
Tre, on paper, I agree, there is almost no difference.

But we are talking about public perception.

Durant looks worse than his teammates because they won without him, as his own teamate Dray even said, also called him a B.

Durant looks worse than KL for the same reasons.

Had he beaten GS that year, then gone to play for him, heíd come off looking like the savior, and the rest of GS would look like the Bís.

Oh dude im not saying it's a bad look for AD in the sense that he will get hate (forget KD hate). I'm saying it would put him in a position where he would never have a chance to be respected as the best player in the league. With just Lebron and a cast of role players, that possibility is still open to him.

I'm speaking to how he called himself the best player in the world and wants to be respected as such. Ain't happening if Kawhi is there (nevermind he isn't anyway).

Bostonjorge
06-30-2019, 11:20 PM
All these teams didnít wait to see where Leonard was headed. Or maybe heís already decided whereís he's already playing.

tredigs
07-01-2019, 01:54 AM
All these teams didnít wait to see where Leonard was headed. Or maybe heís already decided whereís he's already playing.

It's almost like they have inside info?!?

IKnowHoops
07-01-2019, 02:03 AM
Oh dude im not saying it's a bad look for AD in the sense that he will get hate (forget KD hate). I'm saying it would put him in a position where he would never have a chance to be respected as the best player in the league. With just Lebron and a cast of role players, that possibility is still open to him.

I'm speaking to how he called himself the best player in the world and wants to be respected as such. Ain't happening if Kawhi is there (nevermind he isn't anyway).

Whoever is actually the best out of the three, will show he is the best. Going to be interesting. I donít any of them can be denied. I personally feel Bron is still the best of the three

tredigs
07-01-2019, 02:22 AM
Whoever is actually the best out of the three, will show he is the best. Going to be interesting. I donít any of them can be denied. I personally feel Bron is still the best of the three

Yeah I don't know, it will be interesting. Like 2011 Bron/Wade where we still were not sure who the best player in the world was with Lebron, then Wade just absolutely took control of the Finals while Lebron turtled and they got beat up. That was crazy.

At this point with Lebron already giving up his number and clearly not his prime self, I think it's fair to say he would be the 3rd best player on this team.

More-Than-Most
07-01-2019, 02:43 AM
You better quit before people think you are my dupe

honestly lebron is the reason why i want KL to go to the lakers... Lebron with more rings shuts people up... My list for rings is

sixers




lebron









knicks-because i feel bad





every other west team besides the wariors.



Then the east teams

tredigs
07-01-2019, 02:51 AM
honestly lebron is the reason why i want KL to go to the lakers... Lebron with more rings shuts people up... My list for rings is

sixers




lebron









knicks-because i feel bad





every other west team besides the wariors.



Then the east teams
Your most honest post :laugh:

But a quick hint, if the Lakers win a title next season with Peak AD + Kawhi, he likely gets zero credit. But we will see how this all plays out.

Fun summer.

More-Than-Most
07-01-2019, 02:58 AM
Your most honest post :laugh:

But a quick hint, if the Lakers win a title next season with Peak AD + Kawhi, he likely gets zero credit. But we will see how this all plays out.

Fun summer.

he would still be finals mvp... we both know this and you need to accept it now because it will hurt oh so much later : )

IKnowHoops
07-01-2019, 03:26 AM
Yeah I don't know, it will be interesting. Like 2011 Bron/Wade where we still were not sure who the best player in the world was with Lebron, then Wade just absolutely took control of the Finals while Lebron turtled and they got beat up. That was crazy.

At this point with Lebron already giving up his number and clearly not his prime self, I think it's fair to say he would be the 3rd best player on this team.

Or like every year Curry is in the finals. Iggy outshines him simply by playing great defense, then next year, he get guarded by Kevin Love and shut down when they need him most right after being daggered by Kyrie, then Durant just straight outshines him in 2 straight, then this year Klay was heading to the mvp while Curry floundered only for Klay to get hurt then Curry misses a wide open 3 to win when they need it most. Yeah I feel you bro. Crazy stuff out there huh.

Hehehe

Saddletramp
07-01-2019, 03:49 AM
Or like every year Curry is in the finals. Iggy outshines him simply by playing great defense, then next year, he get guarded by Kevin Love and shut down when they need him most right after being daggered by Kyrie, then Durant just straight outshines him in 2 straight, then this year Klay was heading to the mvp while Curry floundered only for Klay to get hurt then Curry misses a wide open 3 to win when they need it most. Yeah I feel you bro. Crazy stuff out there huh.

Hehehe

This, also,



But a quick hint, if the Lakers win a title next season with Peak AD + Kawhi, he likely gets zero credit. But we will see how this all plays out.

Shouldnít Curry not get all the credit you give him then? Especially seeing how he couldnít get it done this year without Durant? Your double standards are breathtaking. If Lebron had guys like Klay/Dray/Iggy and he got beat this year, youíd be railing on him that he choked. But your sweetheart canít get it done and all of the sudden itís that he had no help, but when he has great help, theyíre great because he makes them great.



I know what youíre response will be so shove it.

IKnowHoops
07-01-2019, 08:34 AM
Well, this is a tangent debate but I'd say KD was clearly the bonus piece that put the Curry led Warriors out of reach by replacing Harrison Barnes 18% Finals 3pt shooting with an assassin, but his skill set is somewhat a case of diminishing returns for the Warriors (I think they're nearly equally out of reach in 2017/18 with Khris Middleton to be honest). That being said, they weren't completely out of reach either. Houston showed us that. It's never as bad as fans think and even if Lebron gets two players better than him on this team, they're still capable of losing to the right team (if Klay comes back with enough time to get healthy that matchup would actually be extremely interesting), but they would still correctly be huge favorites and it will be unlike anything we've ever seen from a top-end talent standpoint.

Best players right now (if healthy) I have (roughly)....

1: Curry
2: Giannis
3: Durant
4: Kawhi
5: AD
6: Harden
7: Jokic
8: Lebron
9: Embiid
10: Damian Lillard

11: Paul George
12: Jimmy Butler
13: Draymond Green
14: Rudy Gobert
15: Kyrie Irving
16: KAT
17: Klay Thompson
18: Victor Oladipo
19: Westbrook
20: Blake Griffin

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 😂

Tre is back

More-Than-Most
07-01-2019, 08:56 AM
Tre please tell me how curry is 1 and most of all how AD is above both harden and embiid? Embiid plus/minus is better.. his stats are better... per favors AD because he shot better but AD didnt have to play with Ben simmons... come on bruh... you are better than this.


there was never a season where anyone would put curry 1 in any nba rankings... stop

tredigs
07-01-2019, 09:30 AM
Tre please tell me how curry is 1 and most of all how AD is above both harden and embiid? Embiid plus/minus is better.. his stats are better... per favors AD because he shot better but AD didnt have to play with Ben simmons... come on bruh... you are better than this.


there was never a season where anyone would put curry 1 in any nba rankings... stop

AD is healthy/26 years old and entering his peak. I would entertain Embiid over him at full strength but the dude is brittle. He embarrassed himself to a degree we've never seen from AD in that Raptors series. I simply trust Davis more next year and would rather have him on my team.

Curry is the best player in the game. He just dropped 33/6/6 on a 63% TS from game 5 of the 2nd round through the Finals as the focal point of every defensive scheme. He's a cheat code that nobody else is matching (leads all players in multi-year PIPM - best long term stat available - by a country mile). I've shared with you the video breakdown of Ben Taylor ranking him #1 after the Finals and rest assure he represents a much higher thinking demographic than your Max Kellermens.

Kawhi doesn't have the defensive impact (some people might be stuck in 2015, but Kawhi was probably the 3rd best defender on Toronto) or playmaking ability of Giannis, which is why I rank the MVP over him.

Vee-Rex
07-01-2019, 09:48 AM
Well, this is a tangent debate but I'd say KD was clearly the bonus piece that put the Curry led Warriors out of reach by replacing Harrison Barnes 18% Finals 3pt shooting with an assassin, but his skill set is somewhat a case of diminishing returns for the Warriors (I think they're nearly equally out of reach in 2017/18 with Khris Middleton to be honest). That being said, they weren't completely out of reach either. Houston showed us that. It's never as bad as fans think and even if Lebron gets two players better than him on this team, they're still capable of losing to the right team (if Klay comes back with enough time to get healthy that matchup would actually be extremely interesting), but they would still correctly be huge favorites and it will be unlike anything we've ever seen from a top-end talent standpoint.

Best players right now (if healthy) I have (roughly)....

1: Curry
2: Giannis
3: Durant
4: Kawhi
5: AD
6: Harden
7: Jokic
8: Lebron
9: Embiid
10: Damian Lillard

11: Paul George
12: Jimmy Butler
13: Draymond Green
14: Rudy Gobert
15: Kyrie Irving
16: KAT
17: Klay Thompson
18: Victor Oladipo
19: Westbrook
20: Blake Griffin

My top 10 is slightly different.

1. Kevin Durant (when fully healthy)
2. Kawhi Leonard
3. LeBron James
4. Giannis
5. Stephen Curry
6. James Harden
7. Anthony Davis
8. Jokic
9. George
10. Embiid
Lillard/Butler after that

tredigs
07-01-2019, 10:10 AM
My top 10 is slightly different.

1. Kevin Durant (when fully healthy)
2. Kawhi Leonard
3. LeBron James
4. Giannis
5. Stephen Curry
6. James Harden
7. Anthony Davis
8. Jokic
9. George
10. Embiid
Lillard/Butler after that

Size queen.

Jamiecballer
07-01-2019, 10:14 AM
This, also,




Shouldnít Curry not get all the credit you give him then? Especially seeing how he couldnít get it done this year without Durant? Your double standards are breathtaking. If Lebron had guys like Klay/Dray/Iggy and he got beat this year, youíd be railing on him that he choked. But your sweetheart canít get it done and all of the sudden itís that he had no help, but when he has great help, theyíre great because he makes them great.



I know what youíre response will be so shove it.Enter 3 time Olympic champion in mental gymnastics - Tresovic Digsonovich

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

Vee-Rex
07-01-2019, 10:43 AM
Size queen.

Ha, pretty much

IKnowHoops
07-01-2019, 07:09 PM
AD is healthy/26 years old and entering his peak. I would entertain Embiid over him at full strength but the dude is brittle. He embarrassed himself to a degree we've never seen from AD in that Raptors series. I simply trust Davis more next year and would rather have him on my team.

Curry is the best player in the game. He just dropped 33/6/6 on a 63% TS from game 5 of the 2nd round through the Finals as the focal point of every defensive scheme. He's a cheat code that nobody else is matching (leads all players in multi-year PIPM - best long term stat available - by a country mile). I've shared with you the video breakdown of Ben Taylor ranking him #1 after the Finals and rest assure he represents a much higher thinking demographic than your Max Kellermens.

Kawhi doesn't have the defensive impact (some people might be stuck in 2015, but Kawhi was probably the 3rd best defender on Toronto) or playmaking ability of Giannis, which is why I rank the MVP over him.

Can you put out a link to see the PIPM rankings?

Scoots
07-02-2019, 02:12 AM
There is always going to be someone hating on someone for some decision that is totally unrelated to their lives. So, of course the answer is yes, some people will hate on him, but there will be enough Lakers fans there to shout them down.

Jamiecballer
07-02-2019, 10:58 AM
AD is healthy/26 years old and entering his peak. I would entertain Embiid over him at full strength but the dude is brittle. He embarrassed himself to a degree we've never seen from AD in that Raptors series. I simply trust Davis more next year and would rather have him on my team.

Curry is the best player in the game. He just dropped 33/6/6 on a 63% TS from game 5 of the 2nd round through the Finals as the focal point of every defensive scheme. He's a cheat code that nobody else is matching (leads all players in multi-year PIPM - best long term stat available - by a country mile). I've shared with you the video breakdown of Ben Taylor ranking him #1 after the Finals and rest assure he represents a much higher thinking demographic than your Max Kellermens.

Kawhi doesn't have the defensive impact (some people might be stuck in 2015, but Kawhi was probably the 3rd best defender on Toronto) or playmaking ability of Giannis, which is why I rank the MVP over him.

if i didn't know you from posting i would say there is no way you really think Curry is the best player in the game. because if you think Curry is the best player in the game, i would think you would be expecting the Warriors to be contenders for a title next year.

great players need help, for sure. but at any point in the history of the game i would say the absolute best player is someone that almost always confers a feeling in fans that any team that has them on it is a title contender. and yet we don't even have to go that far back to find a statement from you that if Klay comes back for a month they will be the most feared 6-8 seed in the history of the game.

i'm paraphrasing because it's too much work to go back and find the exact wording but can anyone imagine expecting a team with Lebron, or MJ, or Durant, or Kawhi to be a 6-8 seed before the season started?

Heediot
07-02-2019, 11:16 AM
if i didn't know you from posting i would say there is no way you really think Curry is the best player in the game. because if you think Curry is the best player in the game, i would think you would be expecting the Warriors to be contenders for a title next year.

great players need help, for sure. but at any point in the history of the game i would say the absolute best player is someone that almost always confers a feeling in fans that any team that has them on it is a title contender. and yet we don't even have to go that far back to find a statement from you that if clay comes back for a month they will be the most feared 6-8 seed in the history of the game.

i'm paraphrasing because it's too much work to go back and find the exact wording but can anyone imagine expecting a team with Lebron, or MJ, or Durant, or Kawhi to be a 6-8 seed before the season started?

Curry and Harden can curn out more w's in the regular season vs. Kawhi and KD imo. Kawhi the only oneof the guys mentioned that can beast consistently with defensive attention and offensive load in the playoffs.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 11:43 AM
if i didn't know you from posting i would say there is no way you really think Curry is the best player in the game. because if you think Curry is the best player in the game, i would think you would be expecting the Warriors to be contenders for a title next year.

great players need help, for sure. but at any point in the history of the game i would say the absolute best player is someone that almost always confers a feeling in fans that any team that has them on it is a title contender. and yet we don't even have to go that far back to find a statement from you that if clay comes back for a month they will be the most feared 6-8 seed in the history of the game.

i'm paraphrasing because it's too much work to go back and find the exact wording but can anyone imagine expecting a team with Lebron, or MJ, or Durant, or Kawhi to be a 6-8 seed before the season started?

If you use a little common sense it's not too tough to recognise why I said they were lining up for a 6-8 seed, and I've already mentioned they're no lock for the playoffs (but now with the news of the Russell trade, they should make it if they stay healthy).


You're talking about a conference where you need to be around 15 games over .500 to sneak into the playoffs. AD has pulled it off a grand total of two times in 7 years, Lebron didn't pull it off last season in his first go at it, and prime Harden + Dwight couldn't break. 500 one season. Not to mention as recently as 1989 MJ + Pippen (the year before their 3 peat) were finishing just 12 games over .500 (that would not have made the WC Playoffs). I think the Warriors make it, but it won't be easy with virtually every playoff team improving + The Lakers leapfrogging with at least AD. Considering the Dubs 2nd option is out for at least the majority of the season (so 40 million chilling on the bench) + no small forward and no bench (they'll have two 2nd round picks and D leaguers). Livingston is retired, Iguodala gone, etc. They're not exactly primed for dominance. Russell helps their spacing, but the D and bench are going to be horrible. There are just a lot of other better set up teams this coming season (that won't be the case when they get Klay back and hopefully flip Russell for a small forward and depth at the deadline, but it is now). Doesn't change the fact that Curry still has a very strong case as the best/most impactful player in the league. In case you missed it, he's the one who lead GS to a tight Finals loss with a team of war victims 3 weeks ago.

And now, let's see your list -->

tredigs
07-02-2019, 12:28 PM
Can you put out a link to see the PIPM rankings?

https://www.bball-index.com/18-pipm/

That's this year. Can scroll to the right to find multi-year and list it that way.

MarkieMark48
07-02-2019, 01:59 PM
If you use a little common sense it's not too tough to recognise why I said they were lining up for a 6-8 seed, and I've already mentioned they're no lock for the playoffs (but now with the news of the Russell trade, they should make it if they stay healthy).


You're talking about a conference where you need to be around 15 games over .500 to sneak into the playoffs. AD has pulled it off a grand total of two times in 7 years, Lebron didn't pull it off last season in his first go at it, and prime Harden + Dwight couldn't break. 500 one season. Not to mention as recently as 1989 MJ + Pippen (the year before their 3 peat) were finishing just 12 games over .500 (that would not have made the WC Playoffs). I think the Warriors make it, but it won't be easy with virtually every playoff team improving + The Lakers leapfrogging with at least AD. Considering the Dubs 2nd option is out for at least the majority of the season (so 40 million chilling on the bench) + no small forward and no bench (they'll have two 2nd round picks and D leaguers). Livingston is retired, Iguodala gone, etc. They're not exactly primed for dominance. Russell helps their spacing, but the D and bench are going to be horrible. There are just a lot of other better set up teams this coming season (that won't be the case when they get Klay back and hopefully flip Russell for a small forward and depth at the deadline, but it is now). Doesn't change the fact that Curry still has a very strong case as the best/most impactful player in the league. In case you missed it, he's the one who lead GS to a tight Finals loss with a team of war victims 3 weeks ago.

And now, let's see your list -->

Just curious, if Steph has the warriors in the top 4, then gets hurt and misses significant time, and then the warriors end up missing the playoffs, will that be a valid reason as to why they missed the playoffs, or will it be an excuse?

Saddletramp
07-02-2019, 02:36 PM
Just curious, if Steph has the warriors in the top 4, then gets hurt and misses significant time, and then the warriors end up missing the playoffs, will that be a valid reason as to why they missed the playoffs, or will it be an excuse?

I see what youíre doing there.........

Bostonjorge
07-02-2019, 02:54 PM
C. Davis
PF. Kuzma
SF. Iggy
SG. Leonard
PG. James

Super death lineup

tredigs
07-02-2019, 04:05 PM
Just curious, if Steph has the warriors in the top 4, then gets hurt and misses significant time, and then the warriors end up missing the playoffs, will that be a valid reason as to why they missed the playoffs, or will it be an excuse?

Lebron was no shoe-in to make the playoffs either and I had them pegged between a 6-10 seed before last season (figured that would be the bunch after the top 5). When he went down I think they were what, 5 games over .500 and 3 games away from the 11 seed? That after it being by-far the easiest stretch of their season with by-far their toughest stretch coming in the final 3rd of the season for them. Take just the games HE played - extrapolate it to a full season - and guess what, they miss the playoffs. Going to have to bring a better hypothetical than that.

Hawkeye15
07-02-2019, 04:25 PM
Well, KL isn't running to the team that beat him with his tail between his legs. Correct me if I am wrong, but the Lakers did NOT win 72 games, a championship, and have the current 2 time MVP, as well as 2 other all NBA players, all in their absolute peak, waiting for him. Is that correct?

No, there is no situation under the sun that compares to what Durant did. None. KL going to the Lakers would be disappointing, but the Lakers positioned themselves for this the old fashioned way, by sucking balls for years, and adding pieces in LeBron (FA) and AD (trade).

Saddletramp
07-02-2019, 04:31 PM
Lebron was no shoe-in to make the playoffs either and I had them pegged between a 6-10 seed before last season (figured that would be the bunch after the top 5). When he went down I think they were what, 5 games over .500 and 3 games away from the 11 seed? That after it being by-far the easiest stretch of their season with by-far their toughest stretch coming in the final 3rd of the season for them. Take just the games HE played - extrapolate it to a full season - and guess what, they miss the playoffs. Going to have to bring a better hypothetical than that.

Nice deflection from the question.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 04:45 PM
Nice deflection from the question.

There's no deflection. I'm letting him know that the Lakers WITH Lebron did not win at a high enough rate to make the playoffs, as clearly that goes over many peoples heads.

Do I think the Warriors make it if Curry goes down? Obviously not and it does not matter if that is deemed "valid" or an "excuse", it's reality. I don't even understand the point of the question other than to try to prop up Bron.

blams
07-02-2019, 04:54 PM
Lebron was no shoe-in to make the playoffs either and I had them pegged between a 6-10 seed before last season (figured that would be the bunch after the top 5). When he went down I think they were what, 5 games over .500 and 3 games away from the 11 seed? That after it being by-far the easiest stretch of their season with by-far their toughest stretch coming in the final 3rd of the season for them. Take just the games HE played - extrapolate it to a full season - and guess what, they miss the playoffs. Going to have to bring a better hypothetical than that.

The Lakers were a 4 seed when he was actually healthy.

They would have competed for a title come playoff time if they got in and had the chance to play a Durant-less Golden State


LeBron is still the best player in the NBA when it matters. He conserves energy, so what. He won't win regular season MVP anymore and that's a good move on his part.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 05:04 PM
The Lakers were a 4 seed when he was actually healthy.

They would have competed for a title come playoff time if they got in and had the chance to play a Durant-less Golden State


LeBron is still the best player in the NBA when it matters. He conserves energy, so what. He won't win regular season MVP anymore and that's a good move on his part.

"They were a 4 seed when he got injured" is the running theme. That is an incredibly short-sighted view of the reality of the situation. They were 5 games over .500 and 3 games from the 11 seed. It was just one big pack that they were a part of, and they had a very, very easy early schedule. Did he seem injured to you when he returned? No. And they still did not have a high enough win% WITH him to make the playoffs. They went 8-13 in games he played after he returned. That isn't cutting it. This after he announced he was "entering playoff mode!" mind you.

As far as him still being #1, that's not what the evidence suggests over the past year+, and it would be fairly irrational to expect that to reverse course as he ages.

blams
07-02-2019, 05:08 PM
"They were a 4 seed when he got injured" is the running theme. That is an incredibly short-sighted view of the reality of the situation. They were 5 games over .500 and 3 games from the 11 seed. It was just one big pack that they were a part of, and they had a very, very easy early schedule. Did he seem injured to you when he returned? No. And they still did not have a high enough win% WITH him to make the playoffs. They went 8-13 in games he played after he returned. That isn't cutting it. This after he announced he was "entering playoff mode!" mind you.

As far as him still being #1, that's not what the evidence suggests over the past year+, and it would be fairly irrational to expect that to reverse course as he ages.He actually did seem injured to me, very injured imo

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

ewing
07-02-2019, 05:13 PM
Itíd make him a *****


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

tredigs
07-02-2019, 05:14 PM
He actually did seem injured to me, very injured imo

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Lol well, he wasn't. Certainly not "very", but that's a hilarious new take. His minutes/production actually slightly ramped up after he came back. It just wasn't enough to lead them to the 8 seed. They finished 28-27 with him in the lineup on the season by the way. For perspective the Clippers - as the 8 seed - finished 14 games over .500.

Saddletramp
07-02-2019, 05:19 PM
There's no deflection. I'm letting him know that the Lakers WITH Lebron did not win at a high enough rate to make the playoffs, as clearly that goes over many peoples heads.

Do I think the Warriors make it if Curry goes down? Obviously not and it does not matter if that is deemed "valid" or an "excuse", it's reality. I don't even understand the point of the question other than to try to prop up Bron.

But you just dismissed Lebron not doing it (ďLebron didn't pull it off last season in his first go at itĒ). You didnít bring up the turmoil with the Rockets/lack of depth. Iíd bet my bottom dollar that if Curry had them (a better team, mind you) on a four seed this year and then they dropped out after he got injured you wouldnít say ďCurry didnít pull it offĒ. Youíd say ďCurry took those scrubs to HCA before he got hurt; whatchagonnadohesstillthetopguyintheleague.Ē You wouldnít bring up strength of schedule or if that team wasnít a playoff team with an end of season fired coach.

Good Olí Capít Double Standards.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 05:32 PM
But you just dismissed Lebron not doing it (ďLebron didn't pull it off last season in his first go at itĒ). You didnít bring up the turmoil with the Rockets/lack of depth. Iíd bet my bottom dollar that if Curry had them (a better team, mind you) on a four seed this year and then they dropped out after he got injured you wouldnít say ďCurry didnít pull it offĒ. Youíd say ďCurry took those scrubs to HCA before he got hurt; whatchagonnadohesstillthetopguyintheleague.Ē You wouldnít bring up strength of schedule or if that team wasnít a playoff team with an end of season fired coach.

Good Olí Capít Double Standards.

LOL at telling me what I would say. Next level nonsense right there. And no, if the Warriors with Curry on the floor were not a playoff team, I would not be stupid enough to say they were a playoff team (regardless if that was the case for a stretch of games).

And that's not really an indictment on Bron. I knew there was a chance they didn't make the playoffs in the West with that roster (and said exactly that). Only the blind fanboys thought they were a contender.

I like the Warriors roster minus Klay slightly more (I think? As long as Draymond comes to play all season at least... which **** he might not thinking about it), but they clearly have massive deficiencies (Poor D, NO bench, no NBA caliber SF to name a few) and any objective fan understands that the playoffs in the West are extremely tough to make if you don't have a full roster. They have their work cut out for them.

Saddletramp
07-02-2019, 05:59 PM
LOL at telling me what I would say. Next level nonsense right there. And no, if the Warriors with Curry on the floor were not a playoff team, I would not be stupid enough to say they were a playoff team (regardless if that was the case for a stretch of games).

And that's not really an indictment on Bron. I knew there was a chance they didn't make the playoffs in the West with that roster (and said exactly that). Only the blind fanboys thought they were a contender.

I like the Warriors roster minus Klay slightly more (I think? As long as Draymond comes to play all season at least... which **** he might not thinking about it), but they clearly have massive deficiencies (Poor D, NO bench, no NBA caliber SF to name a few) and any objective fan understands that the playoffs in the West are extremely tough to make if you don't have a full roster. They have their work cut out for them.

Saying that youíd say what I said youíd say is not a reach, and no one would argue it except for you.

Iím not sure anyone thought that they were a contender for a title but for the playoffs? Yep.

daleja424
07-02-2019, 06:03 PM
Of course not! He won the title without anyone.... he can do whatever he wants to do.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 06:16 PM
Saying that youíd say what I said youíd say is not a reach, and no one would argue it except for you.

Iím not sure anyone thought that they were a contender for a title but for the playoffs? Yep.

Revisionist history again bud? Many thought they would be a top team in the West at the very least. Point is, he/they failed on both. WITH him on the court. Those are the facts. How you want to try to spin that is on you guys.

As far as your first comment, it's just you being a clueless troll. Nothing more.

Saddletramp
07-02-2019, 06:21 PM
Revisionist history again bud? Many thought they would be a top team in the West at the very least. Point is, he/they failed on both. WITH him on the court. Those are the facts. How you want to try to spin that is on you guys.

As far as your first comment, it's just you being a clueless troll. Nothing more.

First point, nope. WITH him on the court, they were a mid-seed (thatís an actual fact). After the injury, it was too steep a hill to climb.

Second point, lol.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 06:28 PM
First point, nope. WITH him on the court, they were a mid-seed (thatís an actual fact). After the injury, it was too steep a hill to climb.

Second point, lol.
They went 28-27 with him on the court. That is the beginning and end of the discussion.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 06:33 PM
Of course not! He won the title without anyone.... he can do whatever he wants to do.

"Without anyone" :laugh:

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 06:44 PM
"They were a 4 seed when he got injured" is the running theme. That is an incredibly short-sighted view of the reality of the situation. They were 5 games over .500 and 3 games from the 11 seed. It was just one big pack that they were a part of, and they had a very, very easy early schedule. Did he seem injured to you when he returned? No. And they still did not have a high enough win% WITH him to make the playoffs. They went 8-13 in games he played after he returned. That isn't cutting it. This after he announced he was "entering playoff mode!" mind you.

As far as him still being #1, that's not what the evidence suggests over the past year+, and it would be fairly irrational to expect that to reverse course as he ages.

They were 4th seed, and you know Bron doesnít really try all that hard compared to the playoffs. Heís proven that enough to know thatís just how it is. Every year he turns it up ridiculously in the playoffs and has been the unquestioned best player in the playoffs 8 years in a row. You better than anyone knows this.

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 06:47 PM
Lol well, he wasn't. Certainly not "very", but that's a hilarious new take. His minutes/production actually slightly ramped up after he came back. It just wasn't enough to lead them to the 8 seed. They finished 28-27 with him in the lineup on the season by the way. For perspective the Clippers - as the 8 seed - finished 14 games over .500.

Probably because all the youngsters thought they got traded, and then mentally were done after. Season got torpedoed.

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 06:49 PM
Revisionist history again bud? Many thought they would be a top team in the West at the very least. Point is, he/they failed on both. WITH him on the court. Those are the facts. How you want to try to spin that is on you guys.

As far as your first comment, it's just you being a clueless troll. Nothing more.

Ok, and Cury has been to 5 straight finals and never been an mvp. He failed at that. Spin it how ever you want Trey.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 06:51 PM
They were 4th seed, and you know Bron doesnít really try all that hard compared to the playoffs. Heís proven that enough to know thatís just how it is. Every year he turns it up ridiculously in the playoffs and has been the unquestioned best player in the playoffs 8 years in a row. You better than anyone knows this.

Oh, he was trying to make the playoffs lol. Let's not sit here and make excuses for him after he said he was entering playoff mode, and then still could not will them to victories. The West is a different animal; you're playing an extremely tough team 4 out of every 5 or 6 games. And from last year going forward, no, I don't expect to see him at the top of the game. That said, he's still great and should continue to be great for a few more years. Not sure we'll see him as the best player even on his own team in the playoffs again though (almost for sure not in the regular season). The mid 30's catch up to you quick... time will tell...

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 06:52 PM
They went 28-27 with him on the court. That is the beginning and end of the discussion.

Cury has been to 5 straight finals and has zero mvpís. That is the beginning and the end of The discussion

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 06:54 PM
Oh, he was trying to make the playoffs lol. Let's not sit here and make excuses for him after he said he was entering playoff mode, and then still could not will them to victories. The West is a different animal; you're playing an extremely tough team 4 out of every 5 or 6 games. And from last year going forward, no, I don't expect to see him at the top of the game. That said, he's still great and should continue to be great for a few more years. Not sure we'll see him as the best player even on his own team in the playoffs again though (almost for sure not in the regular season). The mid 30's catch up to you quick... time will tell...

No he didnít try. He didnít at all. He new he couldnít win with them and said Iím not wasting my time. As someone who watches his game closely, itís easy to see. You have been in denial about Bron and we already concluded and you admitted you always call it wrong when talking about Bron. Trust me he did not try.

Dade County
07-02-2019, 06:58 PM
Cury has been to 5 straight finals and has zero mvpís. That is the beginning and the end of The discussion

Final Mvp's are really not the end all be all. Just look back at the past 20yrs of the players that have won it.

Not all great numbers. Kobe last Final's Mvp should have went to Pau Gasol, and everyone knew it.

Curry is awesome he changed the entire game, just because he is a team player, you can't judge him by a Final's Mvp.

What Curry has done to the game is on the level of Magic Johnson, Dr J, & Jordan. The NBA will never be the same.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 06:59 PM
Ok, and Cury has been to 5 straight finals and never been an mvp. He failed at that. Spin it how ever you want Trey.

OK? He was still better than Lebron this year. And the best player on his team over the past 5 years. It's cool that KD took his newfound space/freedom to excel in ISO while the D focused on trying to stop Curry (didn't work), but with all respect to KD, those Finals MVP's don't really matter that much either. They were a 5 game series and a sweep. Give Curry and the boys Khris Middleton and it's the same result. You saw that first hand this season (again) that Curry was the engine. Every time he missed games the Warriors went to ****. If KD missed games they mowed through Houston, the Western Conference Finals and played a tight Finals (including multiple other huge injuries obviously).

We don't need to re-hash all of that though. Everybody saw what I've been saying for the last 3 years. KD was merely the icing on top (and that's why everybody naturally hated his move). I'm glad he's on to browner pastures. I just wish he was healthy and GS was healthy.

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 06:59 PM
Tre, even after Curry put up 17 in a quarter against Portland, you still brought up the injury excuse when they lost to Cleveland 2 series later.

After Brons injury...he failed, even though he had them in 4th place coasting. Gotcha. This season we will be able to see Curry in a Lebron/Harden situation. Well see if he can do what they have done as the ďleagues best playerĒ. No body hates and homers as hard as you do.

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 07:01 PM
OK? He was still better than Lebron this year. And the best player on his team over the past 5 years. It's cool that KD took his newfound space/freedom to excel in ISO while the D focused on trying to stop Curry (didn't work), but with all respect to KD, those Finals MVP's don't really matter that much either. They were a 5 game series and a sweep. Give Curry and the boys Khris Middleton and it's the same result. You saw that first hand this season (again) that Curry was the engine. Every time he missed games the Warriors went to ****. If KD missed games they mowed through Houston, the Western Conference Finals and played a tight Finals (including multiple other huge injuries obviously).

We don't need to re-hash all of that though. Everybody saw what I've been saying for the last 3 years. KD was merely the icing on top (and that's why everybody naturally hated his move). I'm glad he's on to browner pastures. I just wish he was healthy and GS was healthy.

So best overall but never in the finals. You kill Bron for dissapearing once 10 years ago. But Curry falls off every finals and...heís the best overall. Please.

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 07:06 PM
Final Mvp's are really not the end all be all. Just look back at the past 20yrs of the players that have won it.

Not all great numbers. Kobe last Final's Mvp should have went to Pau Gasol, and everyone knew it.

Curry is awesome he changed the entire game, just because he is a team player, you can't judge him by a Final's Mvp.

What Curry has done to the game is on the level of Magic Johnson, Dr J, & Jordan. The NBA will never be the same.

Heís on a great team with a great system. In the finals he flat out isnít as good as he is in the regular season.

News flash.

Teams focus everything on Lebron every year of his career, and he is always much better in the finals. Sorry Iím not giving passes. Curry has a crazy ability, but he can be stopped, and every year he is not the same guy in the finals. Bron steps it up every finals. They arenít comparable. Bron can not be stopped. Curry can.

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 07:10 PM
Bron through last season. This year Bron will prove he is still the best. If he doesnít I will concede, but I know Bron. He made a biz decision last year. He did it for a multitude of reasons. Wouldnít have AD and KL if he did otherwise. Plus when the whole team quits...why put more miles on his 34 year old body. Smart decision

tredigs
07-02-2019, 07:13 PM
So best overall but never in the finals. You kill Bron for dissapearing once 10 years ago. But Curry falls off every finals and...heís the best overall. Please.

No player is without their holes (he's been excellent most Finals including this one by the way), but Curry simply puts his team in a better chance to win than any other player over the past 5 years has. Lots of help? Of course. But he maximizes that help. You can argue 1-2 players over him I suppose, but each have their faults and Curry's case is extremely strong. Durant has almost no case over him honestly.

As for Bron not trying, that's a complete joke. He even admitted he was trying to ramp it up and get them in. But he couldn't will them to victories the way his younger self was used to in the East. He then eventually phoned it in a few times before quitting on the season. Had he maintained the record of what the 4 seed actually finished at in just the games he was playing (and not quit to end the year), they would have made it. But, that didn't happen did it? I was right on my prognostication for them. And you were wrong (you were also the majority opinion). Simple as that.

JAZZNC
07-02-2019, 07:20 PM
"Without anyone" :laugh:
Yeah, that's classic. The Raptors had plenty of "help" for Kawhi. Quite a bit actually. Let's not act like that Raptors team wasn't extremely talented and we'll constructed.

Saddletramp
07-02-2019, 07:22 PM
They went 28-27 with him on the court. That is the beginning and end of the discussion.

And Iím saying before the injury, they were a mid seed. By the end of the year those losses starting adding up when it was already over. As soon as he missed that amount of games he missed, it was over. I love how you only use schematics when it benefits you.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 07:25 PM
Heís on a great team with a great system. In the finals he flat out isnít as good as he is in the regular season.

News flash.

Teams focus everything on Lebron every year of his career, and he is always much better in the finals. Sorry Iím not giving passes. Curry has a crazy ability, but he can be stopped, and every year he is not the same guy in the finals. Bron steps it up every finals. They arenít comparable. Bron can not be stopped. Curry can.

A) Bron has been better in his Finals, correct. He's a top 3 player/athlete in history who is built for the long grind.

B) He also has simply been given passes at times for volume production. The one time I saw him get a Curry level attention defensively was against the Warriors in 2015 after Kyrie went down, and Bron finished with huge volume, but on 39% from the field and a 47% TS. Efficiency (or lack there of) you will never see once in a playoff series in Curry's career. It played right into the Warriors hands. If that is not being "stopped" offensively I don't know what is. And they still tried to give him Finals MVP :laugh:

C) Again, Curry has been fantastic most Finals. Better than most All Time Greats. 30/7/6 the past 3 on a 60+ percent TS. He's held to a standard by the haters out there that nobody else is.

You see a guy like Dame who is out there looking like the legit All NBA/top 10 player that he is in these playoffs. Just crushing PG/Westbrook and coming up huge against the 2 seeded Nuggets. He's a monster. Then he goes up against Curry (no KD) and you see what THE monster is. It's different tiers. Curry rightfully has his argument as the best in the game. It's not "homer" talk. It's a dude who proves that his impact is simply at another level from 99.9% of the game and does so every year.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 07:28 PM
Yeah, that's classic. The Raptors had plenty of "help" for Kawhi. Quite a bit actually. Let's not act like that Raptors team wasn't extremely talented and we'll constructed.

Oh of course. They were an insanely smart+strong 2-7 and they all showed up in the ECF+Finals. There's not many teams that can go 16-5 without their best player, and that included Golden State without Curry.

Saddletramp
07-02-2019, 07:38 PM
No player is without their holes (he's been excellent most Finals including this one by the way), but Curry simply puts his team in a better chance to win than any other player over the past 5 years has. Lots of help? Of course. But he maximizes that help. You can argue 1-2 players over him I suppose, but each have their faults and Curry's case is extremely strong. Durant has almost no case over him honestly.

As for Bron not trying, that's a complete joke. He even admitted he was trying to ramp it up and get them in. But he couldn't will them to victories the way his younger self was used to in the East. He then eventually phoned it in a few times before quitting on the season. Had he maintained the record of what the 4 seed actually finished at in just the games he was playing (and not quit to end the year), they would have made it. But, that didn't happen did it? I was right on my prognostication for them. And you were wrong (you were also the majority opinion). Simple as that.

So if Lebron woulda been healthy, they woulda made it. Gotcha.


And Iíd hope that swapping out Middleton for KD would still make them the favorites. Curry/Klay/Dray/Iguadala/Cousins/Middleton is a no brainer, especially with Kerrís system.


I love how people have been saying that Curry needs help to win and heís MVP level because of all the help he has and Kerrís system but you keep arguing that thatís not true.......until he loses half of his studs and then youíre basically agreeing with us when you are saying that youíll be surprised if they finish with higher than a 6th seed (and this was before Iguadala got shipped out).

Saddletramp
07-02-2019, 07:44 PM
A) Bron has been better in his Finals, correct. He's a top 3 player/athlete in history who is built for the long grind.

B) He also has simply been given passes at times for volume production. The one time I saw him get a Curry level attention defensively was against the Warriors in 2015 after Kyrie went down, and Bron finished with huge volume, but on 39% from the field and a 47% TS. Efficiency (or lack there of) you will never see once in a playoff series in Curry's career. It played right into the Warriors hands. If that is not being "stopped" offensively I don't know what is. And they still tried to give him Finals MVP :laugh:

C) Again, Curry has been fantastic most Finals. Better than most All Time Greats. 30/7/6 the past 3 on a 60+ percent TS. He's held to a standard by the haters out there that nobody else is.

You see a guy like Dame who is out there looking like the legit All NBA/top 10 player that he is in these playoffs. Just crushing PG/Westbrook and coming up huge against the 2 seeded Nuggets. He's a monster. Then he goes up against Curry (no KD) and you see what THE monster is. It's different tiers. Curry rightfully has his argument as the best in the game. It's not "homer" talk. It's a dude who proves that his impact is simply at another level from 99.9% of the game and does so every year.

And in that 2015 series, he still took a bunch of D-Leaguers to 2 wins against a completely healthy Warriors team. **** point.


Listen, again, Curryís great. But youíre propping him up like Jesus Christ himself is out here balling out of his mind and doling out double standards worse than these Fox News bozos this week in regards to Trump/Kim Jong-Un

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 10:34 PM
No player is without their holes (he's been excellent most Finals including this one by the way), but Curry simply puts his team in a better chance to win than any other player over the past 5 years has. Lots of help? Of course. But he maximizes that help. You can argue 1-2 players over him I suppose, but each have their faults and Curry's case is extremely strong. Durant has almost no case over him honestly.

As for Bron not trying, that's a complete joke. He even admitted he was trying to ramp it up and get them in. But he couldn't will them to victories the way his younger self was used to in the East. He then eventually phoned it in a few times before quitting on the season. Had he maintained the record of what the 4 seed actually finished at in just the games he was playing (and not quit to end the year), they would have made it. But, that didn't happen did it? I was right on my prognostication for them. And you were wrong (you were also the majority opinion). Simple as that.

Lol, he admitted heís the GOAT also. He admitted heís the best in the league. We will see what your boy does next season. Next year will be the true test. Curry is a great player, but his regular season is better than his finals. Bron is always way better than Curry in the playoffs and itís not even close. Bron coasts during the reg season. We will see how Curry performs playing in a more average situation.

IKnowHoops
07-02-2019, 10:41 PM
A) Bron has been better in his Finals, correct. He's a top 3 player/athlete in history who is built for the long grind.

B) He also has simply been given passes at times for volume production. The one time I saw him get a Curry level attention defensively was against the Warriors in 2015 after Kyrie went down, and Bron finished with huge volume, but on 39% from the field and a 47% TS. Efficiency (or lack there of) you will never see once in a playoff series in Curry's career. It played right into the Warriors hands. If that is not being "stopped" offensively I don't know what is. And they still tried to give him Finals MVP :laugh:

C) Again, Curry has been fantastic most Finals. Better than most All Time Greats. 30/7/6 the past 3 on a 60+ percent TS. He's held to a standard by the haters out there that nobody else is.

You see a guy like Dame who is out there looking like the legit All NBA/top 10 player that he is in these playoffs. Just crushing PG/Westbrook and coming up huge against the 2 seeded Nuggets. He's a monster. Then he goes up against Curry (no KD) and you see what THE monster is. It's different tiers. Curry rightfully has his argument as the best in the game. It's not "homer" talk. It's a dude who proves that his impact is simply at another level from 99.9% of the game and does so every year.

The ďone time he got Curry level attentionĒ...

Since Brons second year in the league, the entire defense has shifted to him. One on ne against anyone is a guaranteed bucket.

You think when he dropped 29 consecutive points on Detroit in the playoffs he wasnít getting Curry level attention? He was getting much more than Curry level attention and he kept scoring and dunking n everyone.

Curry level attention was when they put k love on him one on one during crunch time and didnít help and Curry got shut down. Stop

tredigs
07-02-2019, 10:46 PM
Well, KL isn't running to the team that beat him with his tail between his legs. Correct me if I am wrong, but the Lakers did NOT win 72 games, a championship, and have the current 2 time MVP, as well as 2 other all NBA players, all in their absolute peak, waiting for him. Is that correct?

No, there is no situation under the sun that compares to what Durant did. None. KL going to the Lakers would be disappointing, but the Lakers positioned themselves for this the old fashioned way, by sucking balls for years, and adding pieces in LeBron (FA) and AD (trade).

Bears mentioning that the Lakers weren't their current team last year. They have already added another top 5 player to Lebron. So we can't look at last years team with any relevance. If they filled out their roster with 2-3 strong role players along with Kuz instead of Kawhi, they're still the clear favorites to win it all (Vegas literally made them favorites the second they got AD). You understand that.

That said, like with all these moves where the players are taking the max, there's no issue from it on my end.


The reality though is that it keeps the streak going of knowing who the NBA Champion will be before the season begins (*barring injuries*), and like KD (and to a lesser extent Curry/Klay/Dray) fans won't give Kawhi (and to a lesser extent Lebron or AD) any real credit for it. We can argue the Warriors were better and in the first two years at least I would agree, but it will still be a situation of "yep, you were massive favorites before the season and did what you were supposed to do"). Where as if he joined literally any other team the league is back to being wide open.

Any non-Laker fan should obviously not want it to happen. But as a Warrior fan (and a guy who never hates super teams), who would I be to complain :laugh:.

Bostonjorge
07-02-2019, 11:01 PM
Final Mvp's are really not the end all be all. Just look back at the past 20yrs of the players that have won it.

Not all great numbers. Kobe last Final's Mvp should have went to Pau Gasol, and everyone knew it.

Curry is awesome he changed the entire game, just because he is a team player, you can't judge him by a Final's Mvp.

What Curry has done to the game is on the level of Magic Johnson, Dr J, & Jordan. The NBA will never be the same.
Kobe didnít deserve finals MVP? He led 7 out of 8 games in scoring. BOTH teams not just the lakers. It took Ray Allen to make history with most 3ís in a finals game to battle Kobe. Kobe led the lakers in scoring, assists and 2nd in rebounds. Gasol had a game with 12 points and another with 13 points. What did everyone see that I didnít?

Magic has 5 rings and only 3 final MVPís. Getting the ring is what truly matters.

tredigs
07-02-2019, 11:01 PM
Lol, he admitted heís the GOAT also. He admitted heís the best in the league. We will see what your boy does next season. Next year will be the true test. Curry is a great player, but his regular season is better than his finals. Bron is always way better than Curry in the playoffs and itís not even close. Bron coasts during the reg season. We will see how Curry performs playing in a more average situation.

His pre KD playoffs numbers are 26/5/7 on a 60% TS (not yet in his prime for some of it). Multiple MVP's. Multiple Finals. A title. And an overall 39-24 playoff record in the West. Effectively a 50 win team only against WC playoff teams. Pre KD. He has absolutely nothing to prove. But I'm sure he will again anyway.

Dade County
07-02-2019, 11:43 PM
Heís on a great team with a great system. In the finals he flat out isnít as good as he is in the regular season.

News flash.

Teams focus everything on Lebron every year of his career, and he is always much better in the finals. Sorry Iím not giving passes. Curry has a crazy ability, but he can be stopped, and every year he is not the same guy in the finals. Bron steps it up every finals. They arenít comparable. Bron can not be stopped. Curry can.

Well you mention Lbj to the wrong HEAT fan. Le-Con gave Dallas a championship & made us HEAT fans and Wade suffer our first Finals loss.

Now that i got that out of the way. Yes Curry is in a great system that maximizes his skill set.

All I'm saying is don't overvalue Finals MVP's. When trying to compare or judge Stars/Super Stars.

Kawhi got his first one against Miami, look at his Numbers tgat series & compare his numbers to other Super Stars tyat have won Finals Mvp.

I wouldn't judge any star player by a Finals, MVP.

More-Than-Most
07-03-2019, 05:01 AM
A) Bron has been better in his Finals, correct. He's a top 3 player/athlete in history who is built for the long grind.

B) He also has simply been given passes at times for volume production. The one time I saw him get a Curry level attention defensively was against the Warriors in 2015 after Kyrie went down, and Bron finished with huge volume, but on 39% from the field and a 47% TS. Efficiency (or lack there of) you will never see once in a playoff series in Curry's career. It played right into the Warriors hands. If that is not being "stopped" offensively I don't know what is. And they still tried to give him Finals MVP :laugh:

C) Again, Curry has been fantastic most Finals. Better than most All Time Greats. 30/7/6 the past 3 on a 60+ percent TS. He's held to a standard by the haters out there that nobody else is.

You see a guy like Dame who is out there looking like the legit All NBA/top 10 player that he is in these playoffs. Just crushing PG/Westbrook and coming up huge against the 2 seeded Nuggets. He's a monster. Then he goes up against Curry (no KD) and you see what THE monster is. It's different tiers. Curry rightfully has his argument as the best in the game. It's not "homer" talk. It's a dude who proves that his impact is simply at another level from 99.9% of the game and does so every year.

um what? :laugh:

come on my dude you need to stop... lebron is the only person the other team tries to stop... Durant was more focused on over curry... my god.


As for the 30/7/6... not that hard for a star to put out stats when he is playing defense against the worst player on the floor and the other team is trying to shut down durant... there is more to basketball than just shooting and that is where curry skill set ends.

More-Than-Most
07-03-2019, 05:06 AM
Well you mention Lbj to the wrong HEAT fan. Le-Con gave Dallas a championship & made us HEAT fans and Wade suffer our first Finals loss.

Now that i got that out of the way. Yes Curry is in a great system that maximizes his skill set.

All I'm saying is don't overvalue Finals MVP's. When trying to compare or judge Stars/Super Stars.

Kawhi got his first one against Miami, look at his Numbers tgat series & compare his numbers to other Super Stars tyat have won Finals Mvp.

I wouldn't judge any star player by a Finals, MVP.

well yea I feel like lebron was probably tired after carrying him through the bulls series no? As for the MVP debate and KL.... did you not realize the sport is a 2 way sport and KL in that series was their shut down lock down defender? WHY DOESNT DEFENSE MATTER TO YOU PEOPLE... Holy ****

tredigs
07-03-2019, 09:05 AM
um what? :laugh:

come on my dude you need to stop... lebron is the only person the other team tries to stop... Durant was more focused on over curry... my god.


As for the 30/7/6... not that hard for a star to put out stats when he is playing defense against the worst player on the floor and the other team is trying to shut down durant... there is more to basketball than just shooting and that is where curry skill set ends.

Absolutely clueless bud. Yikes.

valade16
07-03-2019, 09:15 AM
um what? :laugh:

come on my dude you need to stop... lebron is the only person the other team tries to stop... Durant was more focused on over curry... my god.

As for the 30/7/6... not that hard for a star to put out stats when he is playing defense against the worst player on the floor and the other team is trying to shut down durant... there is more to basketball than just shooting and that is where curry skill set ends.

So Curry averaged 30/5/6 on 60% TS this Finals because the Raptors were trying to shut down Durant?

MarkieMark48
07-03-2019, 09:20 AM
Lebron was no shoe-in to make the playoffs either and I had them pegged between a 6-10 seed before last season (figured that would be the bunch after the top 5). When he went down I think they were what, 5 games over .500 and 3 games away from the 11 seed? That after it being by-far the easiest stretch of their season with by-far their toughest stretch coming in the final 3rd of the season for them. Take just the games HE played - extrapolate it to a full season - and guess what, they miss the playoffs. Going to have to bring a better hypothetical than that.

I just wanted you to answer the question I asked you, not your take on what happed to Lebron last year. So again, if Curry had the Warriors as a 4 seed and then got hurt and missed significant time then they ended up missing the playoffs, would the injury be an excuse or a reason?

Bostonjorge
07-03-2019, 03:22 PM
Getting my fireworks ready for 4th of Kawhi

tredigs
07-03-2019, 04:50 PM
I just wanted you to answer the question I asked you, not your take on what happed to Lebron last year. So again, if Curry had the Warriors as a 4 seed and then got hurt and missed significant time then they ended up missing the playoffs, would the injury be an excuse or a reason?

Continue reading the thread after your post and all your dreams will be met my guy.

IKnowHoops
07-03-2019, 06:22 PM
His pre KD playoffs numbers are 26/5/7 on a 60% TS (not yet in his prime for some of it). Multiple MVP's. Multiple Finals. A title. And an overall 39-24 playoff record in the West. Effectively a 50 win team only against WC playoff teams. Pre KD. He has absolutely nothing to prove. But I'm sure he will again anyway.

If he wants to say he better than Lebron, he has much to prove. If you are saying heís a top 7 player he has nothing to prove.

BSF101
07-03-2019, 08:26 PM
Oh look another super team in the west where have I seen that before?

tredigs
07-03-2019, 10:32 PM
If he wants to say he better than Lebron, he has much to prove. If you are saying heís a top 7 player he has nothing to prove.

If you're talking about top 7 in the current league then lmfao at you brother. As much or far more to prove from the rest of the top 6. As far as LBJ goes, he is clearly the one with everything to prove if he wants to regain the crown. I don't see a path where it happens for him again entering age 35.

Bostonjorge
07-04-2019, 03:55 PM
Leonard game winner against Sixers. Clutch!

Game 3 vs Bucks being down 2-0 in series, in overtime. Thatís clutch!

Beating Curry, Greek, Embiid and KD in the same playoff year. Amazing!

Leonard is not taking a back seat on any team he plays for.

smith&wesson
07-04-2019, 05:06 PM
Leonard holds the balance of power in the nba in his one claw.

blams
07-04-2019, 07:43 PM
If you're talking about top 7 in the current league then lmfao at you brother. As much or far more to prove from the rest of the top 6. As far as LBJ goes, he is clearly the one with everything to prove if he wants to regain the crown. I don't see a path where it happens for him again entering age 35.LBJ has nothing to prove

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk