PDA

View Full Version : Should the Spurs stand pat, or make a move?



kobe4thewinbang
12-06-2018, 06:55 PM
The Spurs have had some nice games, with DeRozan and Aldridge both having clutch moments. Meanwhile, Kawhi Leonard has been killing it for the Raptors since the trade and Danny Green is clutch again up north.

However, Pau Gasol has an indefinite stress fracture. Bryn Forbes has shown flashes tasked as the starting point guard (what?), but Patty Mills isn't stepping up or possibly not being asked to, his stat line not too different from years past (10-ish points, 3-ish assists, 39% 3PT) in just 25-ish minutes a night. We all know the elephant in the room that is Dejounte Murray's devastating torn right ACL one summer removed from moving on from Tony Parker.

Spurs are at risk of making the playoffs, a twenty year streak, with the fellas on NBA TV's "The Starters" split on the likelihood of Coach Pop & crew figuring it out to sneak in. Some brutal losses so far has the Spurs at 11-14, 7-4 at home, but ranked 24th (out of 30 teams) in points (113) allowed by opponents, naturally allowing more points than they've been able to score themselves (109). No bueno.

I know it's typical Spurs behavior to hold the line and not make in-season trades (e.g. Kawhi Leonard/DeMarr DeRozan trade this summer). Do you think they just ride it out and wait for a healthy return and hopefully strong comeback season by Dejounte Murray as "the guy." Or do you think some major moves are needed, after the Spurs have now parted ways with the guy that was meant to be "the guy" with LaMarcus Aldridge not a name in "top big men" discussions.

Certainly, there's loads of talent in the league. Maybe someone from the Wizards, commit to John Wall or Bradley Beal, take a stab at Anthony Davis, Andre Drummond, Hassan Whiteside (maybe Popovich can talk to him), nab KCP from the Lakers, McCollum from Portland, Walker from Charlotte, Randle from Pelicans, Bradley from Clippers...with many other names elsewhere and no real mention of "untouchables" by the media aside from the elite talents. However, they're tied up now by big money allotted to DeRozan (2yr/54m w/Player Op), Aldridge (2yr/50m), Mills (2yr/25m) and Gasol (16m, exp. 19-20). Other teams wouldn't mind Gasol's expiring contract. Several Spurs fan questioned the three-year deal he got last time. Rudy Gay has been solid, could be a nice trade piece at 13ppg/FG%: 50% for twos and threes, 7-ish rebounds. Take on some young guys that haven't quite worked out elsewhere, but have some fire to them and athleticism, defense, potential, etc.

Dejounte Murray will be looking for a raise if he has a nice season next year, too.

Are they screwed? Or can they make some mini-moves? Is Popovich's time nearing its end? I don't see them making any moves. I could definitely imagine Pop going "this year just wasn't meant to be for us" and not having Buford make any moves. But next summer, I could see some trades. I was expecting more from DeRozan (hindsight=bad trade).

FlashBolt
12-06-2018, 07:26 PM
The culture isn't there anymore. Guys who are unselfish and care about winning while having the proper fit together.

1) LaMarcus isn't that good anymore. He's up there in age. I like his contract (it really isn't that bad considering other players make upwards of $40 million) but I think Spurs fans expected more from him.

2) Murray being injured with a very serious injury was the worst thing to happen for them. Losing Kawhi was terrible but Murray was such a huge piece of them moving forward and taking that next step.

3) DeRozan isn't an elite player. He's simply a very good one who can't compete against better players on an opposing team. If he's your best player, you're not going to win and compete for titles.

4) Popovich doesn't seem inspired. Losing his wife, TP and Manu, and Kawhi stressing him out likely sees Pop wanting to retire soon, IMO. With him gone, I'm not sure Spurs have any prestige the way they were known for in the previous two decades. San Antonio just isn't a very popular destination for NBA players.

GREATNESS ONE
12-07-2018, 02:26 AM
They should’ve traded Leonard for Ingram...

Tg11
12-07-2018, 03:23 AM
I mean the Spurs could still go after Ingram and Lonzo but I see them going along the lines of going after Beal or Wall

MILLERHIGHLIFE
12-07-2018, 10:28 AM
Spurs don't really have any decent trade assets. Other then expiring Gay and Gasol contract next year is possibly partial guaranteed of $6.7M out of $16M. So they could be moved if a team wants capspace.

kdspurman
12-07-2018, 10:37 AM
The culture isn't there anymore. Guys who are unselfish and care about winning while having the proper fit together.

1) LaMarcus isn't that good anymore. He's up there in age. I like his contract (it really isn't that bad considering other players make upwards of $40 million) but I think Spurs fans expected more from him.

LMA is definitely not the guy he was last year. Frustrating cause he had a really nice year.



2) Murray being injured with a very serious injury was the worst thing to happen for them. Losing Kawhi was terrible but Murray was such a huge piece of them moving forward and taking that next step.

Yea this was brutal. He was expected to make a big leap this season, and is obviously a great defender, that the team sorely lacks now.


3) DeRozan isn't an elite player. He's simply a very good one who can't compete against better players on an opposing team. If he's your best player, you're not going to win and compete for titles.


Disagree on this, he's competed against the best players on opposing teams many times this season. He obviously has some holes in his game that still need to be patched, but he's still playing at an efficient level, while taking on the PG duties with Murray out.


4) Popovich doesn't seem inspired. Losing his wife, TP and Manu, and Kawhi stressing him out likely sees Pop wanting to retire soon, IMO. With him gone, I'm not sure Spurs have any prestige the way they were known for in the previous two decades. San Antonio just isn't a very popular destination for NBA players.

I've seen no evidence to say Pop doesn't seem inspired. It's obviously a different time, but he's been motivated for sure. He likes the challenge, and knows this season will be a work in progress

kdspurman
12-07-2018, 10:37 AM
They should’ve traded Leonard for Ingram...

Nah

kdspurman
12-07-2018, 10:38 AM
They've got work to do. I don't see any changes being made yet, but that could change in a month or 2. I'm just looking forward to Lonnie Walker playing, he could provide them with a burst of energy they're lacking. A super athletic wing that can push the pace is something we're lacking with Murray injured.

valade16
12-07-2018, 01:24 PM
I just don't see how the Spurs get back to contending short of a complete rebuild.

Heediot
12-07-2018, 05:16 PM
Tank like they did for Duncan.

kdspurman
12-07-2018, 05:44 PM
Tank like they did for Duncan.

There isn't another Duncan walking thru the door :-(

Raps18-19 Champ
12-07-2018, 07:40 PM
No point of making moves. Ride out the year and try to reestablish next year.

JAZZNC
12-07-2018, 09:32 PM
There isn't another Duncan walking thru the door :-(

That's the unfortunate truth. People talk all the time about the "Spurs system" and how incredible it is. Really none of system stuff matters if they don't get Duncan. He was what made it all work. Not saying Pops isn't a phenomenal coach or the front office isn't great but without Duncan Pops in all likelihood isn't a household name.

Jamiecballer
12-07-2018, 10:14 PM
The Spurs have had some nice games, with DeRozan and Aldridge both having clutch moments. Meanwhile, Kawhi Leonard has been killing it for the Raptors since the trade and Danny Green is clutch again up north.

However, Pau Gasol has an indefinite stress fracture. Bryn Forbes has shown flashes tasked as the starting point guard (what?), but Patty Mills isn't stepping up or possibly not being asked to, his stat line not too different from years past (10-ish points, 3-ish assists, 39% 3PT) in just 25-ish minutes a night. We all know the elephant in the room that is Dejounte Murray's devastating torn right ACL one summer removed from moving on from Tony Parker.

Spurs are at risk of making the playoffs, a twenty year streak, with the fellas on NBA TV's "The Starters" split on the likelihood of Coach Pop & crew figuring it out to sneak in. Some brutal losses so far has the Spurs at 11-14, 7-4 at home, but ranked 24th (out of 30 teams) in points (113) allowed by opponents, naturally allowing more points than they've been able to score themselves (109). No bueno.

I know it's typical Spurs behavior to hold the line and not make in-season trades (e.g. Kawhi Leonard/DeMarr DeRozan trade this summer). Do you think they just ride it out and wait for a healthy return and hopefully strong comeback season by Dejounte Murray as "the guy." Or do you think some major moves are needed, after the Spurs have now parted ways with the guy that was meant to be "the guy" with LaMarcus Aldridge not a name in "top big men" discussions.

Certainly, there's loads of talent in the league. Maybe someone from the Wizards, commit to John Wall or Bradley Beal, take a stab at Anthony Davis, Andre Drummond, Hassan Whiteside (maybe Popovich can talk to him), nab KCP from the Lakers, McCollum from Portland, Walker from Charlotte, Randle from Pelicans, Bradley from Clippers...with many other names elsewhere and no real mention of "untouchables" by the media aside from the elite talents. However, they're tied up now by big money allotted to DeRozan (2yr/54m w/Player Op), Aldridge (2yr/50m), Mills (2yr/25m) and Gasol (16m, exp. 19-20). Other teams wouldn't mind Gasol's expiring contract. Several Spurs fan questioned the three-year deal he got last time. Rudy Gay has been solid, could be a nice trade piece at 13ppg/FG%: 50% for twos and threes, 7-ish rebounds. Take on some young guys that haven't quite worked out elsewhere, but have some fire to them and athleticism, defense, potential, etc.

Dejounte Murray will be looking for a raise if he has a nice season next year, too.

Are they screwed? Or can they make some mini-moves? Is Popovich's time nearing its end? I don't see them making any moves. I could definitely imagine Pop going "this year just wasn't meant to be for us" and not having Buford make any moves. But next summer, I could see some trades. I was expecting more from DeRozan (hindsight=bad trade).They are toast. They made a terrible decision to prioritize short term appearances over long term planning when they dealt with Toronto, or nobody truly would offer anything of value. I dont know which. But either way they are trying to win an unwinnable game against MATH. I never understood this because San Antonio is run by guys that are smart and should be able to see this.

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

kdspurman
12-08-2018, 12:05 AM
They are toast. They made a terrible decision to prioritize short term appearances over long term planning when they dealt with Toronto, or nobody truly would offer anything of value. I dont know which. But either way they are trying to win an unwinnable game against MATH. I never understood this because San Antonio is run by guys that are smart and should be able to see this.

Sent from my SM-A520W using Tapatalk

They have planned for long term. Great young pieces in Murray/Walker/Metu/Poeltl/White and 2 first round picks. Lot of guys coming off the books. They wanted to be competitive this year, and they've planned for the future.

From everything out there, teams weren't jumping at the idea of trading for nephew with his health/family ?'s , especially for valuable assets. Folks weren't willing to risk it being a rental

kdspurman
12-08-2018, 12:07 AM
That's the unfortunate truth. People talk all the time about the "Spurs system" and how incredible it is. Really none of system stuff matters if they don't get Duncan. He was what made it all work. Not saying Pops isn't a phenomenal coach or the front office isn't great but without Duncan Pops in all likelihood isn't a household name.

Yup. Dude was the foundation, idk if we'll get an elite talent/person like him again anytime soon, if ever.

Tg11
12-08-2018, 02:24 AM
Spurs at this point should tank

kobe4thewinbang
12-11-2018, 02:11 AM
LMA is definitely not the guy he was last year. Frustrating cause he had a really nice year.



Yea this was brutal. He was expected to make a big leap this season, and is obviously a great defender, that the team sorely lacks now.



Disagree on this, he's competed against the best players on opposing teams many times this season. He obviously has some holes in his game that still need to be patched, but he's still playing at an efficient level, while taking on the PG duties with Murray out.



I've seen no evidence to say Pop doesn't seem inspired. It's obviously a different time, but he's been motivated for sure. He likes the challenge, and knows this season will be a work in progressI saw some rumors yesterday that Popovich might be done after this season.

kdspurman
12-11-2018, 09:35 AM
I saw some rumors yesterday that Popovich might be done after this season.

Yeah I've seen that floated around too, but we'll see. I always thought he'd at least finish out his contract. I imagine whatever he's thinking is pretty close to home, so idk how much I put into that rumor. It's possible, but I doubt there's any real credibility.

Knowing how Pop is, the last thing he'd want is a distraction and the focus not to be on his team.

Vinylman
12-11-2018, 09:38 AM
Honestly, the guy they should shop the **** out of is Gay. probably can get a first and a young guy for him with the way he is playing

warfelg
12-11-2018, 09:41 AM
Honestly, the guy they should shop the **** out of is Gay. probably can get a first and a young guy for him with the way he is playing

I doubt they get much back for him, but I think Gasoline is another one they should shop.

Vinylman
12-11-2018, 10:14 AM
I doubt they get much back for him, but I think Gasoline is another one they should shop.

He would easily get a late first and a young guy... he would be a great 3rd or 4th option... I could see a lot of teams picking him up who would be drafting 25 or later

warfelg
12-11-2018, 10:15 AM
He would easily get a late first and a young guy... he would be a great 3rd or 4th option... I could see a lot of teams picking him up who would be drafting 25 or later

I don’t think they are getting both back for him. He’s got another year and $16mil owes.

Vinylman
12-11-2018, 10:18 AM
I don’t think they are getting both back for him. He’s got another year and $16mil owes.

no... he is on a relatively cheap one year deal At around $10 million

warfelg
12-11-2018, 10:36 AM
no... he is on a relatively cheap one year deal At around $10 million

That was two years ago now.

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/san-antonio-spurs/pau-gasol-2518/

Vinylman
12-11-2018, 10:40 AM
That was two years ago now.

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/san-antonio-spurs/pau-gasol-2518/

who is talking about Gasoft? he aint getting you ****... I am talking about Gay

warfelg
12-11-2018, 10:45 AM
who is talking about Gasoft? he aint getting you ****... I am talking about Gay

I did in the first post I replied to you. But it changes Gasol to gasoline. Stupid auto correct.

Vinylman
12-11-2018, 10:49 AM
I did in the first post I replied to you. But it changes Gasol to gasoline. Stupid auto correct.

yeah... I am talking about Gay... there is zero point to talk about pasoft… he is done... pretty stupid extension they gave him tbh... he isn't worth more than the vets min at this point...

kdspurman
12-11-2018, 10:58 AM
yeah... I am talking about Gay... there is zero point to talk about pasoft… he is done... pretty stupid extension they gave him tbh... he isn't worth more than the vets min at this point...

I wasn't thrilled about it, but it made sense why they did at the time. Gay is playing great, but I don't see them dealing him (unless he wants out). But his relationship with DeRozan is important for him & the team.

Vinylman
12-11-2018, 11:23 AM
]I wasn't thrilled about it, but it made sense why they did at the time. [/B]Gay is playing great, but I don't see them dealing him (unless he wants out). But his relationship with DeRozan is important for him & the team.

they did it because they have been making off the book deals with players for years to take less. It isn't hard to see that the idea was for Gasoft to get essentially $23 million to play this year and retire.

As for Gay... are you really gonna pony up 2/$40 million next year? because that is what he will want...

Honestly, I think the Spurs are just delusional at this point to think they have any option other than to strip it down... it reminds me of a lot of the Lakers mentality from 2012-2017 albeit you have traditionally better management...

kdspurman
12-11-2018, 11:55 AM
they did it because they have been making off the book deals with players for years to take less. It isn't hard to see that the idea was for Gasoft to get essentially $23 million to play this year and retire.

As for Gay... are you really gonna pony up 2/$40 million next year? because that is what he will want...

Honestly, I think the Spurs are just delusional at this point to think they have any option other than to strip it down... it reminds me of a lot of the Lakers mentality from 2012-2017 albeit you have traditionally better management...

I mean the fact that he got that longer deal with that money was cause he opted out to give the team a chance to sign a big time player, it just didn't happen. We'll see what happens with Gay, he's playing great. But how his body holds up remains a ?, and that'll be a determining factor for $ i'm sure. He opted out and maybe could've gotten a little more than he did this past summer, so we'll see where his head is at.

They've got some really young talent already in place. (Murray being hurt obviously was a big time blow for this season.) But they've got some really good young pieces in place already, (Walker/White/Poeltl/Murray etc...) with 2 first round picks in next years draft. I don't think they're like the Lakers at all, in that they got thrown a huge curve ball by nephew, but they still have some very promising players and are known to be great in terms of player development.& those first round picks could be big for them

Vinylman
12-11-2018, 01:46 PM
I mean the fact that he got that longer deal with that money was cause he opted out to give the team a chance to sign a big time player, it just didn't happen. We'll see what happens with Gay, he's playing great. But how his body holds up remains a ?, and that'll be a determining factor for $ i'm sure. He opted out and maybe could've gotten a little more than he did this past summer, so we'll see where his head is at.

They've got some really young talent already in place. (Murray being hurt obviously was a big time blow for this season.) But they've got some really good young pieces in place already, (Walker/White/Poeltl/Murray etc...) with 2 first round picks in next years draft. I don't think they're like the Lakers at all, in that they got thrown a huge curve ball by nephew, but they still have some very promising players and are known to be great in terms of player development.& those first round picks could be big for them

player development is always easier with top HOF talent... that is pretty much gone and will be even further removed if Pau leaves this offseason.

You do have some decent young guys but you have had a lot in the recent past that didn't get there either.

Anyway, I see you guys at a crossroads like the Lakers once they lost D12 and were stuck with old Nash and Broken down Kobe...

gonna be interesting.

LeonFSU
12-11-2018, 01:46 PM
I don't think there will really be a move for them to make that makes a lot of sense. Lonnie Walker has talent and should be back soon. Maybe they can pick up a point guard or wing that gets bought out/waived. Making the playoffs got a lot tougher without Murray, but I still think they'll be in the mix at the end of the season.