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Scoots
10-06-2018, 05:03 PM
The lottery rules have flattened a little and now 4 teams are selected instead of 3, and so many teams tanked last year and fewer bad teams have traded lottery protected first round picks this year so there should be far fewer teams tanking this year than last.

Conditional tanks:
Cavs, 1-10 protected pick to the Hawks. They guaranteed to Love that they were not going to tank, but I suspect if everything goes wrong Love will understand, so there is a small chance they go into a tank late

Mavs, 1-5 protected pick to the Hawks. Things would have to go VERY bad for the Mavs to try to tank again.

Nugs: 1-12 protected pick to the Nets. Only in a disaster.

Griz: 1-12 protected pick to the Celts. The 2nd most likely team to tank on conditions.

Kings: 1st overall protected pick to the Celtics. They are so bad they could try hard for that pick but they are the Kings so ...

Raps: 1-20 protected pick to the Spurs. If things go moderately wrong they could drop a few games to keep the pick, but I doubt it.

Coming soon, teams with a straight tanking plan.

Silent
10-06-2018, 05:54 PM
I hope my bulls are on this train

Scoots
10-06-2018, 06:14 PM
Teams that may tank without the pick protection incentive:

1st tier:
Hawks: not a good team, a young team, not much reason not to tank.
Nets: in need of talent.

2nd tier:
Bulls: Young with some talent, but not ready to win, could use some more top talent, but may be unwilling to go full tank.
Suns: Talent and some veteran depth, but not ready to challenge for a playoff spot yet.

3rd tier:
Magic: When are they not considering tanking?
Hornets: Sounding more and more like they want to reboot.

ewing
10-06-2018, 06:54 PM
I was hoping the Knicks would follow the Sixers plan and keep KP out for the year plus sit Knox til his sophomore season


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sacgiants1213
10-06-2018, 07:39 PM
The lottery rules have flattened a little and now 4 teams are selected instead of 3, and so many teams tanked last year and fewer bad teams have traded lottery protected first round picks this year so there should be far fewer teams tanking this year than last.

Conditional tanks:
Cavs, 1-10 protected pick to the Hawks. They guaranteed to Love that they were not going to tank, but I suspect if everything goes wrong Love will understand, so there is a small chance they go into a tank late

Mavs, 1-5 protected pick to the Hawks. Things would have to go VERY bad for the Mavs to try to tank again.

Nugs: 1-12 protected pick to the Nets. Only in a disaster.

Griz: 1-12 protected pick to the Celts. The 2nd most likely team to tank on conditions.

Kings: 1st overall protected pick to the Celtics. They are so bad they could try hard for that pick but they are the Kings so ...

Raps: 1-20 protected pick to the Spurs. If things go moderately wrong they could drop a few games to keep the pick, but I doubt it.

Coming soon, teams with a straight tanking plan.

Kings do not have a pick next season even if it's #1.

IndyRealist
10-06-2018, 08:37 PM
Hypothetically, if they banned pick protections, does anyone think that would reduce the amount of tanking?

Scoots
10-06-2018, 09:42 PM
Kings do not have a pick next season even if it's #1.

Did I miss read that? I thought they got it if it was #1. Or does it go to Philly then?

Jeez the Kings are terrible. Sorry Kings fans.

YAALREADYKNO
10-07-2018, 03:33 AM
Tank watch? I just watched Khabib run through Conor like a tank

sacgiants1213
10-07-2018, 03:40 AM
Did I miss read that? I thought they got it if it was #1. Or does it go to Philly then?

Jeez the Kings are terrible. Sorry Kings fans.

Your sympathy is much appreciated.

Storch
10-07-2018, 05:30 AM
Did I miss read that? I thought they got it if it was #1. Or does it go to Philly then?

Jeez the Kings are terrible. Sorry Kings fans.

They should just resign mike bibby

warfelg
10-07-2018, 07:35 AM
Kings: 1st overall protected pick to the Celtics. They are so bad they could try hard for that pick but they are the Kings so ...

Yea the correction here is that the Kings pick is owned by the Sixers. It is owed to the Celtics, unless it's #1. If it's #1 then the Sixers pick goes to the Celtics.

Scoots
10-07-2018, 11:21 AM
Yea the correction here is that the Kings pick is owned by the Sixers. It is owed to the Celtics, unless it's #1. If it's #1 then the Sixers pick goes to the Celtics.

LOL, okay.

IKnowHoops
10-09-2018, 01:20 PM
Iíd like to see MN tank hard for Zion

lakerfan85
10-09-2018, 01:30 PM
Lakers should tank..

AllBall
10-09-2018, 01:39 PM
The new rules are dumb. Sure, now teams don't have to tank to be the absolute worse team for the best odds, but now they can be 3rd worse (which is easier to get to). Teams will now be "soft tanking" to be the #3rd worse team because there is no incentive to tank further than that as there is no odds improvement being 2nd to last or last place.

IKnowHoops
10-09-2018, 01:43 PM
The new rules are dumb. Sure, now teams don't have to tank to be the absolute worse team for the best odds, but now they can be 3rd worse (which is easier to get to). Teams will now be "soft tanking" to be the #3rd worse team because there is no incentive to tank further than that as there is no odds improvement being 2nd to last or last place.

Nice...Iíd love for the worst teams to have a playoff...maybe even like a single elimination sweet 16 for the #1 pick. Would be sweet.

GREATNESS ONE
10-09-2018, 04:37 PM
They should just resign mike bibby

Send them to Seattle

MILLERHIGHLIFE
10-10-2018, 09:18 AM
Send them to Seattle

Seattle maybe can land the Grizzlies or Hawks.

Heediot
10-10-2018, 09:51 AM
Basketball would be a tonne more interesting with promotion and relegation.

Scoots
10-10-2018, 07:24 PM
Basketball would be a tonne more interesting with promotion and relegation.

Never, never, never, NEVER going to happen. People regularly talk about contracting the league as it is, relegation would require there be even more talent to go around.

AllBall
10-10-2018, 11:07 PM
Basketball would be a tonne more interesting with promotion and relegation.

How does that work?

Heediot
10-11-2018, 10:36 AM
Never, never, never, NEVER going to happen. People regularly talk about contracting the league as it is, relegation would require there be even more talent to go around.

I feel you. Parity probably dies with that structure. In Europe it's basically the same powerhouses at the top all the time in Ball and Soccer. I think it gets rid of tanking though, and cities like Pittsburgh, OKC, St. Louis, and other small market fans/teams get excitement from not being relegated and or being promoted.

Maybe 20 nba teams in first division. 20 in the 2nd and 3rd divisions. 60 cities duking it out. It's be like a championship for a team from Buffalo or Tampa to make it to the 1st division.

Scoots
10-11-2018, 11:11 AM
I feel you. Parity probably dies with that structure. In Europe it's basically the same powerhouses at the top all the time in Ball and Soccer. I think it gets rid of tanking though, and cities like Pittsburgh, OKC, St. Louis, and other small market fans/teams get excitement from not being relegated and or being promoted.

Maybe 20 nba teams in first division. 20 in the 2nd and 3rd divisions. 60 cities duking it out. It's be like a championship for a team from Buffalo or Tampa to make it to the 1st division.

Yeah, but I suspect that we have too many other entertainment options for there to be enough money to make it work.

IndyRealist
10-11-2018, 11:33 AM
I feel you. Parity probably dies with that structure. In Europe it's basically the same powerhouses at the top all the time in Ball and Soccer. I think it gets rid of tanking though, and cities like Pittsburgh, OKC, St. Louis, and other small market fans/teams get excitement from not being relegated and or being promoted.

Maybe 20 nba teams in first division. 20 in the 2nd and 3rd divisions. 60 cities duking it out. It's be like a championship for a team from Buffalo or Tampa to make it to the 1st division.

Without revenue sharing, 20 or so teams would be losing money already. There are not 60 cities that could support an NBA team.

Heediot
10-11-2018, 05:53 PM
Without revenue sharing, 20 or so teams would be losing money already. There are not 60 cities that could support an NBA team.


Yeah, but I suspect that we have too many other entertainment options for there to be enough money to make it work.

Yeah. I'm not saying it's realistic. Theoretically it would eliminate tanking. There can still be a model where teams can make money like the EPL at least for the top division of the nba in this scenario. I think fans in europe of lower division teams are more loyal vs. the ones that would be needed for a 2nd and 3rd division team in the nba. The economics of it all changes a lot and i think it's possible for it to work. The current structure is a gold mine though so I'm not even remotely expecting change.

This would eliminate tanking, but it will cause problems with drafting. I guess getting prospects would be a free for all. I don't think there would be a cap in this structure either, so the Knicks and Lakers would be contenders every year.

Tg11
10-11-2018, 07:21 PM
Teams that may tank without the pick protection incentive:

1st tier:
Hawks: not a good team, a young team, not much reason not to tank.
Nets: in need of talent.

2nd tier:
Bulls: Young with some talent, but not ready to win, could use some more top talent, but may be unwilling to go full tank.
Suns: Talent and some veteran depth, but not ready to challenge for a playoff spot yet.


3rd tier:
Magic: When are they not considering tanking?
Hornets: Sounding more and more like they want to reboot.



I would go with the following teams to tank: Hawks, Nets, Bulls, Suns, Magic and Hornets but as for who finishes with the worst record this season I have a feeling it will be the Hawks

TheMightyHumph
10-11-2018, 11:01 PM
Hypothetically, if they banned pick protections, does anyone think that would reduce the amount of tanking?

I think I'm missing something.

How would that reduce the amount of tanking?

Scoots
10-12-2018, 08:46 AM
I think I'm missing something.

How would that reduce the amount of tanking?

Because team A trades a 1st round pick with team B but protect it for top 10. The year before that pick transfers they have an incentive to tank to end up with a top 10 pick and keep their pick. If teams were not allowed to trade picks with protection then all those teams would have no way to retain their pick and thus no reason to tank.

Scoots
10-12-2018, 08:47 AM
I think it's fairly clear the Hawks are doing the old school tank of just building a super young team and flat out being just that bad. I'd be really surprised if they don't end up with the worst record.

IKnowHoops
10-12-2018, 11:51 AM
I want the T wolves to tank for Zion

MILLERHIGHLIFE
10-12-2018, 01:38 PM
Teams that may tank without the pick protection incentive:

1st tier:
Hawks: not a good team, a young team, not much reason not to tank.
Nets: in need of talent.

2nd tier:
Bulls: Young with some talent, but not ready to win, could use some more top talent, but may be unwilling to go full tank.
Suns: Talent and some veteran depth, but not ready to challenge for a playoff spot yet.

3rd tier:
Magic: When are they not considering tanking?
Hornets: Sounding more and more like they want to reboot.

If and when Kemba gets traded or walks next summer be the day meddling MJ reboots. Horrible team though. Suns should of continued tanking but they added Ariza and Anderson. Not good enough yet. But maybe wont be worse 3 for top lottery either. Even though they just fired their GM. Nets wont be bad enough to get a good pick. They might as well keep on trucking. Use that cap next summer to lure in more win now pieces. Mavs will be tanking.

TheMightyHumph
10-12-2018, 01:47 PM
Because team A trades a 1st round pick with team B but protect it for top 10. The year before that pick transfers they have an incentive to tank to end up with a top 10 pick and keep their pick. If teams were not allowed to trade picks with protection then all those teams would have no way to retain their pick and thus no reason to tank.

A) Has that happened?

B) Bad teams would stop trading their first round picks

C) Less trades would occur

Tg11
10-12-2018, 02:30 PM
If I were MJ and the front office in Charlotte I would definitely tank and then reboot.

I mean you have talent there in RJ Barrett, Zion Williamson, Romeo Langford, Cam Reddish, etc. that you can tank for with probably Zion being the best player out of the current crop for the 2019 Draft class that is gonna be coming in

If Shaq's son Shareef O'Neal wasn't injured this whole college season taking the season off due to a heart ailment but if Shareef were healthy he would have been in the 2019 Draft class as well

You also have Manute Bol's son Bol Bol coming in to the 2019 Draft class as well

However, back to the topic at hand here the teams that should definitely tank are Hornets, Suns, Kings, Nets, Mavs and I would say the Knicks but they aren't gonna tank

Atlanta will obviously tank this whole entire season because they want the 1st pick I am sure

Scoots
10-12-2018, 07:39 PM
A) Has that happened?

B) Bad teams would stop trading their first round picks

C) Less trades would occur

A) Yes. The Warriors had traded a first to the Mavs with 1-7 protection. They tanked HARD to get to that 7th pick in the draft they picked up Draymond Green. No tank, no 3 titles. This is actually the most common form of tanking.

B) Probably not.

C) Maybe.

TheMightyHumph
10-12-2018, 08:52 PM
A) Yes. The Warriors had traded a first to the Mavs with 1-7 protection. They tanked HARD to get to that 7th pick in the draft they picked up Draymond Green. No tank, no 3 titles. This is actually the most common form of tanking.

B) Probably not.

C) Maybe.

Draymond was a 2nd rd pick.

IndyRealist
10-12-2018, 08:55 PM
Draymond was a 2nd rd pick.

He's saying it was the year they drafted Green. They tanked and got Harrison Barnes.

TheMightyHumph
10-12-2018, 10:10 PM
He's saying it was the year they drafted Green. They tanked and got Harrison Barnes.

That is not what he was saying.

Harrison Barnes was certainly a grand reward for tanking.

But Dallas made out. Warriors broke Harrison in fpr the Mavs.

IndyRealist
10-12-2018, 10:42 PM
That is not what he was saying.

Harrison Barnes was certainly a grand reward for tanking.

But Dallas made out. Warriors broke Harrison in fpr the Mavs.

It doesn't matter who they got. They tanked to retain their pick because of pick protections, which was the point.

Scoots
10-13-2018, 12:28 PM
He's saying it was the year they drafted Green. They tanked and got Harrison Barnes.

The tank got them Green too. Had they not tanked their 2nd round pick would have been behind Detroit who were going to take Green.

But the point was that the Warriors tanked to keep their first round pick.

TheMightyHumph
10-13-2018, 01:19 PM
It doesn't matter who they got. They tanked to retain their pick because of pick protections, which was the point.

Yeah. Warriors really beat the system.

Scoots
10-13-2018, 07:00 PM
Yeah. Warriors really beat the system.

If by that you mean they got REALLY lucky? Then yes, several times. Without the luck they don't have Curry, Green, or KD.

TheMightyHumph
10-14-2018, 02:39 AM
The new rules are dumb. Sure, now teams don't have to tank to be the absolute worse team for the best odds, but now they can be 3rd worse (which is easier to get to). Teams will now be "soft tanking" to be the #3rd worse team because there is no incentive to tank further than that as there is no odds improvement being 2nd to last or last place.

I agree. Just to think that these guys are getting a GODDAM GOOD salary (Not counting the outside benefits), TO FIGURE THIS OUT, and at least 34-65 percent of the time we're right, and we don't get a penny.

MORE T-SHIRT SHOOTERS

But we are just fans. This **** is about money. Later.

GREATNESS ONE
10-14-2018, 03:02 AM
Seattle maybe can land the Grizzlies or Hawks.

Or Bucks?

Tg11
10-14-2018, 10:10 AM
Knowing that some teams are definitely gonna tank their season because they want that #1 pick or they want to be anywhere from #1 to #5 protected in the 2019 NBA Draft Lottery it should be interesting to see who sucks on purpose because you have teams trying to make the playoffs you are gonna have teams who want to tank because they want to rebuild and have/want that incentive

Scoots
10-14-2018, 10:49 AM
Knowing that some teams are definitely gonna tank their season because they want that #1 pick or they want to be anywhere from #1 to #5 protected in the 2019 NBA Draft Lottery it should be interesting to see who sucks on purpose because you have teams trying to make the playoffs you are gonna have teams who want to tank because they want to rebuild and have/want that incentive

At least it looks like this year there will be fewer teams tanking.

Tg11
10-14-2018, 11:03 AM
At least it looks like this year there will be fewer teams tanking.

I guess you're right but then again looking at the college NCAA scene right now you have probably the most promising crop of players for 2019 who will come into the league for the NBA for the 2019-20 season and the players are definitely exciting especially the Duke trio of Zion, Barrett and Reddish who have the ability to be #1 in the 2019 NBA Draft

Mr.B
10-15-2018, 08:56 PM
If I were MJ and the front office in Charlotte I would definitely tank and then reboot.

I mean you have talent there in RJ Barrett, Zion Williamson, Romeo Langford, Cam Reddish, etc. that you can tank for with probably Zion being the best player out of the current crop for the 2019 Draft class that is gonna be coming in

If Shaq's son Shareef O'Neal wasn't injured this whole college season taking the season off due to a heart ailment but if Shareef were healthy he would have been in the 2019 Draft class as well

You also have Manute Bol's son Bol Bol coming in to the 2019 Draft class as well

However, back to the topic at hand here the teams that should definitely tank are Hornets, Suns, Kings, Nets, Mavs and I would say the Knicks but they aren't gonna tank

Atlanta will obviously tank this whole entire season because they want the 1st pick I am sure

There is not reason or incentive for the Mavs to tank this season. They actually want to be good and they do not have a 1st round pick next year. Well itís top 5 protected but they have already said they want that trade to be completed next off season. They donít want it moving on to the next draft. They need to be good enough to attract a FA to come play with Luka and DSJ. Tanking does not accomplish that.