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LaVar Ball
06-18-2018, 10:26 PM
KD is a better player than Kobe but he'll never had that career recognition that Kobe had. At Kobe's peak, he was never better than KD.

Lol gtfoh. Kobe would shut his opponents down while dropping 40 in his young prime. Kobe was an elite all time defender.

FlashBolt
06-18-2018, 11:24 PM
Lol gtfoh. Kobe would shut his opponents down while dropping 40 in his young prime. Kobe was an elite all time defender.

He never averaged 40 at his prime so your explanation is clearly way off. Kobe's peak was never better than Durant's, period. And if not for Daddy Shaq and a prestigious organization such as the Lakers, Kobe would be more troubled with winning rings playing for some bad organizations. It's the honest truth. If Kobe was drafted by a bad team under a poor organization, he would have a much different career. It's unfortunate most of the top players ended up playing on a poor team because they were high draft picks.

IKnowHoops
06-19-2018, 01:10 AM
Lol gtfoh. Kobe would shut his opponents down while dropping 40 in his young prime. Kobe was an elite all time defender.

Example of him dropping 40 while shutting his man down?

IKnowHoops
06-19-2018, 01:13 AM
He never averaged 40 at his prime so your explanation is clearly way off. Kobe's peak was never better than Durant's, period. And if not for Daddy Shaq and a prestigious organization such as the Lakers, Kobe would be more troubled with winning rings playing for some bad organizations. It's the honest truth. If Kobe was drafted by a bad team under a poor organization, he would have a much different career. It's unfortunate most of the top players ended up playing on a poor team because they were high draft picks.

Kobe on bad teams would be In between Vince Carter and Tmac for an all time ranking.

Bostonjorge
06-19-2018, 01:23 AM
Example of him dropping 40 while shutting his man down?

https://youtu.be/0VFVejlOhFE

Here you go. This one was easy.
Game 5 in the western conference finals. Against defending Champion Spurs.

Elimination game. Kobe shut down all nba team Manu Ginobli with 9 points and Shut down Bowen with 4 points.

Then Kobe dropped 40 on all NBA defense first team Bowen and All NBA first team Duncan. Spurs ranked #2 in defense that year.

What else would you like to know about Kobeís accomplishments?

TheDish87
06-19-2018, 08:55 AM
Lol gtfoh. Kobe would shut his opponents down while dropping 40 in his young prime. Kobe was an elite all time defender.

no he wasnt.

Jeffy25
06-19-2018, 09:50 AM
Lol gtfoh. Kobe would shut his opponents down while dropping 40 in his young prime. Kobe was an elite all time defender.

Haha, no he wasn't, and he's never averaged 40, or anywhere close.

IKnowHoops
06-19-2018, 09:58 AM
https://youtu.be/0VFVejlOhFE

Here you go. This one was easy.
Game 5 in the western conference finals. Against defending Champion Spurs.

Elimination game. Kobe shut down all nba team Manu Ginobli with 9 points and Shut down Bowen with 4 points.

Then Kobe dropped 40 on all NBA defense first team Bowen and All NBA first team Duncan. Spurs ranked #2 in defense that year.

What else would you like to know about Kobeís accomplishments?

What year? Bowen averaged 4 points. Was Ginobili a rookie?

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 10:40 AM
1006774110146453504

Somebody say something about dropping 40 while shutting down your opponent?

Jeffy25
06-19-2018, 10:45 AM
1006774110146453504

Somebody say something about dropping 40 while shutting down your opponent?

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id1_hint=Dwyane+Wade&player_id1_select=Dwyane+Wade&player_id1=wadedw01&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Kobe+Bryant&player_id2_select=Kobe+Bryant&player_id2=bryanko01&idx=players

Head to Head

Wade 11 wins
Kobe 9 wins

Wade - 24.3 PPG - 4.6 Boards - 6.5 Assists - 1.9 steals - 1.1 blocks - .455 FG%
Kobe - 26.1 PPG - 4.1 Boards - 4.7 Assists - 1.2 Steals - 0.4 blocks - .436 FG%

Jeffy25
06-19-2018, 10:51 AM
What year? Bowen averaged 4 points. Was Ginobili a rookie?

He shared 2008

Starting 5 was
Parker
Duncan
Bowen
Finley
Oberto

Manu was 6th man

One of Kobe's toughest opponents for his career is and was clearly the Spurs. But he did well in that series.

It's the only time he faced the Spurs without Shaq

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 11:02 AM
https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id1_hint=Dwyane+Wade&player_id1_select=Dwyane+Wade&player_id1=wadedw01&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Kobe+Bryant&player_id2_select=Kobe+Bryant&player_id2=bryanko01&idx=players

Head to Head

Wade 11 wins
Kobe 9 wins

Wade - 24.3 PPG - 4.6 Boards - 6.5 Assists - 1.9 steals - 1.1 blocks - .455 FG%
Kobe - 26.1 PPG - 4.1 Boards - 4.7 Assists - 1.2 Steals - 0.4 blocks - .436 FG%

Yep, prime Wade was better than Kobe.

BDawk4Prez
06-19-2018, 12:33 PM
Yep, prime Wade was better than Kobe.

LOL, no.

Jeffy25
06-19-2018, 12:49 PM
Yep, prime Wade was better than Kobe.

I dunno about that, but either way Kobe's prime was significantly longer than Wade's

Bostonjorge
06-19-2018, 12:51 PM
What year? Bowen averaged 4 points. Was Ginobili a rookie?

No that year Ginobli made the All NBA team. Spurs were the defending champs and 4x champs up to that point.

Kobe has had multiple games like this. His 40 point NBA Finals game against the magic. They had the defensive player of the year in Howard anchoring and Pietrus, who was getting praised for his defense on the east playoff teams up to that point.

What else would you like to know about Kobeís legendary career?

TheDish87
06-19-2018, 01:38 PM
I dunno about that, but either way Kobe's prime was significantly longer than Wade's

thats probably the only case for Kobe but its pretty significant.

Oakmont_4
06-19-2018, 01:40 PM
Yep, prime Wade was better than Kobe.

:facepalm:

No

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 01:44 PM
:facepalm:

No

Yes....Kobe has longevity though.

BKLYNpigeon
06-19-2018, 01:53 PM
Wade couldnt win without Shaq or Lebron.

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 01:56 PM
Wade couldnt win without Shaq or Lebron.

No one could win without help. Kobe couldnít win without Shaq Or Pau/Bynum/Odom LeBron couldnít win without Wade/Bosh or Kyrie/Love Curry couldnít win without Klay/Green/Iggy Durant couldnít win without Curry/Klay/green. Thatís a horrible argument.

Shaq played like a scrub in the 06 finals btw.

D Blue987
06-19-2018, 02:10 PM
Yes....Kobe has longevity though.

Everybody in the forum right now...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3O8J2locx5o

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 02:27 PM
Everybody in the forum right now...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3O8J2locx5o

This is a pretty common take you will see many places. Wades prime, peak or whatever you want to call it was higher than Kobeís. Feel free to try and show me otherwise but the facepalms and lols as if itís not even close are ****ing hilarious.

Jeffy25
06-19-2018, 02:51 PM
Yes....Kobe has longevity though.

Okay, even if we pretend like their primes are equal, which maybe they are or one favors the other just slightly, Wade's prime is max 10 years (really a 7 year peak) and Kobe's is a solid 14 years.

The comp doesn't exist for Wade to Kobe overall.

But Kobe won't be scoring 40 and locking up his opponent on a nightly basis ever either.

Bostonjorge
06-19-2018, 02:52 PM
No one could win without help. Kobe couldnít win without Shaq Or Pau/Bynum/Odom LeBron couldnít win without Wade/Bosh or Kyrie/Love Curry couldnít win without Klay/Green/Iggy Durant couldnít win without Curry/Klay/green. Thatís a horrible argument.

Shaq played like a scrub in the 06 finals btw.

Gasol/Bynum and Odom has the worst numbers then everyone else listed. Itís not even close. So I guess we can say they had the worst ďpeakĒ? Itís that how it works? The numbers say they were only average help.

The year CAvs got swept by Spurs, Drew Goodon was out scoring Gasol, Bynum and Odom in multiple playoff series. So when do we look and numbers and when do we look at the names? Goodon never out scored anyone else listed.

Iím guessing Kobe didnít need a peak to win like other guys who have a peak and get destroyed.

Also after 06 Wade got swept by the bulls who had? They had? Well they had someone and swept peak Wade. Peak Wade would get bounced in the first round every year to low level team who are already forgotten because of ďpeakĒ. Until James came and lifted Wade out of the first round.

Vee-Rex
06-19-2018, 02:56 PM
Advanced stats favor peak Wade over Kobe, both in the regular season and the playoffs.

Wade was more efficient, better defense, and passer, at least according to general stats. Kobe put up more points due to shot volume.

At their peaks I prefer Wade. Longevity is another topic altogether.

Honestly, I wonder what we've missed out on because of Wade's injuries. If only he had a healthy career...

Vee-Rex
06-19-2018, 02:57 PM
And that's coming from someone who has no dog in this fight. Stats favor Wade. :shrug:

Jeffy25
06-19-2018, 02:59 PM
Gasol/Bynum and Odom has the worst numbers then everyone else listed. Itís not even close. So I guess we can say they had the worst ďpeakĒ? Itís that how it works? The numbers say they were only average help.

The year CAvs got swept by Spurs, Drew Goodon was out scoring Gasol, Bynum and Odom in multiple playoff series. So when do we look and numbers and when do we look at the names? Goodon never out scored anyone else listed.

Iím guessing Kobe didnít need a peak to win like other guys who have a peak and get destroyed.

Maybe check the numbers of Gasol/Bynum and Odom during the two peat with the rest of these guys.

Those guys were great, and they made that team a squad.

Kobe has no chance of winning without the help he got from legit all-stars.

Pau Gasol was an all-star in both years.


Kobe never won without another all-star. I can't remember the last time someone won a Finals, and they were the only all-star on the team in that season. Maybe Dirk in 2011?

Then you gotta go back to Ben Wallace in 2004, and Chauncy was at least in the sophomore game and Billups in the 3 point contest

Wade nor Kobe ever won without another all-star helping them.

Bostonjorge
06-19-2018, 03:01 PM
So having a high ďpeakĒ and getting destroyed by JV teams in the first round makes you better?

Having a low peak but beating all time great ďpeakĒ teams makes you a lesser player?

Iím guessing thatís why I never hear Jordan talking about ďpeakĒ. Sounds made up.

Vee-Rex
06-19-2018, 03:09 PM
So having a high ďpeakĒ and getting destroyed by JV teams in the first round makes you better?

Having a low peak but beating all time great ďpeakĒ teams makes you a lesser player?

Iím guessing thatís why I never hear Jordan talking about ďpeakĒ. Sounds made up.

Wade led the Heat to the finals and dominated to win the championship in 23 games in 2006. Statistically, Kobe has never had as good of a playoff stretch.

TS%, WS/48, AST%, BPM - you name it, Wade's are better.

Again, if you want to say, "Kobe is better than Wade and is the #2 SG of all time" - fine, by all means say so. I won't argue against you. I'm only saying that peak Wade looked better, both statistically and IMHO (very humble here) by the eye test as well.

Scoots
06-19-2018, 03:12 PM
Advanced stats favor peak Wade over Kobe, both in the regular season and the playoffs.

Wade was more efficient, better defense, and passer, at least according to general stats. Kobe put up more points due to shot volume.

At their peaks I prefer Wade. Longevity is another topic altogether.

Honestly, I wonder what we've missed out on because of Wade's injuries. If only he had a healthy career...

If Wade didn't play like his head was on fire he would have had a longer peak, but he wouldn't have been the same player either.

DODGERS&LAKERS
06-19-2018, 03:16 PM
What the, I read the post above mine and I thought I was in the wrong thread

Vee-Rex
06-19-2018, 03:16 PM
By the same token, if I look at Jordan's stats (traditional and advanced) in the regular season and playoffs, they DWARF Wade's and Kobe's.

The only modern-era wing player who has similar stats to Jordan is LeBron.

The fallacy of it all is getting caught up in peak stats, etc... there's so many factors involved which is why these kind of discussions can be so complicated/pointless. I honestly think more people need to look and compare players in tiers if they're gonna be so vehement about their arguments.

Vee-Rex
06-19-2018, 03:18 PM
If Wade didn't play like his head was on fire he would have had a longer peak, but he wouldn't have been the same player either.

Yeah, that's true. He was crashing into the paint like a madman. It got him a ring though, so I'm sure he's happy about it.

Bostonjorge
06-19-2018, 03:32 PM
Wade led the Heat to the finals and dominated to win the championship in 23 games in 2006. Statistically, Kobe has never had as good of a playoff stretch.

TS%, WS/48, AST%, BPM - you name it, Wade's are better.

Again, if you want to say, "Kobe is better than Wade and is the #2 SG of all time" - fine, by all means say so. I won't argue against you. I'm only saying that peak Wade looked better, both statistically and IMHO (very humble here) by the eye test as well.

My point is that you didnít need a lot to beat that very same Wade. Bulls had nothing and completely destroyed Wade in 4. Hawks a way below average team beat that same Wade. Then the next series Hawks get destroyed in 4 games. So Wade was easily eliminated and you didnít even need good players to do it. Just good enough players to make the east playoffs.

Kobe on the other hand lost to the truly elite only. He lost to the Suns who had the MVP. Lost to the Spurs twice who won the title both years that happened. Lost to Dallas who also won that same year. Weakest teams he lost to are OKC and Jazz who both went on to the finals. Every team was elite.

FlashBolt
06-19-2018, 03:33 PM
Wade's true peak (08-09) was better than Kobe's true peak (which were pretty much most of his seasons) but Wade's was so short that it's not even worth mentioning, honestly. Even when Wade was at his best, he didn't lead the Heat team anywhere deep in the playoffs. That 08-09 season was fun but still, they weren't a great team. 05-06 was not prime Wade at all. And then it went downhill after 11-present. Due to injuries/late entry to the NBA, Wade's career can't possibly be compared to Kobe Bryant. At the end of the day, give me Kobe over Wade if I had to build around one player. That's all that matters to me.

FlashBolt
06-19-2018, 03:39 PM
My point is that you didnít need a lot to beat that very same Wade. Bulls had nothing and completely destroyed Wade in 4. Hawks a way below average team beat that same Wade. Then the next series Hawks get destroyed in 4 games. So Wade was easily eliminated and you didnít even need good players to do it. Just good enough players to make the east playoffs.

Kobe on the other hand lost to the truly elite only. He lost to the Suns who had the MVP. Lost to the Spurs twice who won the title both years that happened. Lost to Dallas who also won that same year. Weakest teams he lost to are OKC and Jazz who both went on to the finals. Every team was elite.

Kobe also had more help. There were only 2-3 seasons where Kobe didn't have help and we all know what happened there. For Christ's sake, the guy game into the league playing with prime Shaq, Shaq gets traded and there is a 2-3 year span where Kobe and the Lakers are losing and trades are being mentioned, and then the Lakers being a great organization managed to get Kobe help quick enough to where they didn't have to rebuild. Kobe has been VERY fortunate in his situation that he's gotten a lot of help early in his career and during his prime. As he got older, it was already too late so you can't fault management.

Vee-Rex
06-19-2018, 03:52 PM
My point is that you didnít need a lot to beat that very same Wade. Bulls had nothing and completely destroyed Wade in 4. Hawks a way below average team beat that same Wade. Then the next series Hawks get destroyed in 4 games. So Wade was easily eliminated and you didnít even need good players to do it. Just good enough players to make the east playoffs.

Kobe on the other hand lost to the truly elite only. He lost to the Suns who had the MVP. Lost to the Spurs twice who won the title both years that happened. Lost to Dallas who also won that same year. Weakest teams he lost to are OKC and Jazz who both went on to the finals. Every team was elite.

He got smoked by the Suns in 2007 in only 5 games, pretty much a gentlemen's sweep - Dirk was the MVP that year, not Nash. Nash was the MVP the previous year when the Suns beat the Lakers in 7. The Suns went on to lose to the Spurs who won the championship.

There's reason to believe the Mavericks could've made another finals run if they weren't upset by the Warriors that year. So the Lakers DIDN'T lose to an MVP (it was Dirk) and they DIDN'T lose to the finals team (it was the Spurs).

Just as easily as you can try to pick apart Wade's accomplishments and highlight his disappointments, someone can easily do the same for Kobe.

Again, you're not arguing with someone who is opposed to Kobe > Wade. But you can't act like an argument can't be made for Wade's peak over Kobe's. If peak is irrelevant to you - fine, we can move on.

Jeffy25
06-19-2018, 03:54 PM
Kobe also had more help. There were only 2-3 seasons where Kobe didn't have help and we all know what happened there. For Christ's sake, the guy game into the league playing with prime Shaq, Shaq gets traded and there is a 2-3 year span where Kobe and the Lakers are losing and trades are being mentioned, and then the Lakers being a great organization managed to get Kobe help quick enough to where they didn't have to rebuild. Kobe has been VERY fortunate in his situation that he's gotten a lot of help early in his career and during his prime. As he got older, it was already too late so you can't fault management.

It says a lot that Kobe didn't make the playoffs while in his prime. The Lakers went 121-125 while Kobe was 25-27 years old playing every day.

It doesn't speak a ton on Kobe, but more the massive affect that help has on this league.

Prime Wade also missed the playoffs, so it's not like I'm just picking on Kobe here.

Jeffy25
06-19-2018, 03:56 PM
Can we agree with peak Wade being maybe 5% better than peak Kobe? But that peak Kobe lasted 14 years, and peak Wade was 7 years, and then equal to Kobe level peak another 3ish years?

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 04:09 PM
Okay, even if we pretend like their primes are equal, which maybe they are or one favors the other just slightly, Wade's prime is max 10 years (really a 7 year peak) and Kobe's is a solid 14 years.

The comp doesn't exist for Wade to Kobe overall.

But Kobe won't be scoring 40 and locking up his opponent on a nightly basis ever either.

Iím just talking about at their absolute best Wade was better, not length of their primes.

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 04:16 PM
Gasol/Bynum and Odom has the worst numbers then everyone else listed. Itís not even close. So I guess we can say they had the worst ďpeakĒ? Itís that how it works? The numbers say they were only average help.

The year CAvs got swept by Spurs, Drew Goodon was out scoring Gasol, Bynum and Odom in multiple playoff series. So when do we look and numbers and when do we look at the names? Goodon never out scored anyone else listed.

Iím guessing Kobe didnít need a peak to win like other guys who have a peak and get destroyed.

Also after 06 Wade got swept by the bulls who had? They had? Well they had someone and swept peak Wade. Peak Wade would get bounced in the first round every year to low level team who are already forgotten because of ďpeakĒ. Until James came and lifted Wade out of the first round.

Pau was a legit all star who many argued shouldíve won finals MVP in one of their championship wins. Odom is one of the best 6 mans ever and Bynum was the 2nd best center in the league then.

Wade got swept in 06 because he was injured. Thatís the year he shattered his restoration cut and ****ed yo his knee. They didnít want him to come back but he did anyways to try and defend the ring. He had to get more surgery right after that series because he was still hurt and it even lingered into the next season where he tried to play through and they forced him to shut it down and get even more surgery. Prior to shattering his rotator cuff he was running away with MVP averaging 29-7-8-2-1 on 50% and having a much better season than Kobe ever had.

Chronz
06-19-2018, 04:16 PM
What the, I read the post above mine and I thought I was in the wrong thread

Reminds me of the old days when everything became a kobe debate

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 04:17 PM
It says a lot that Kobe didn't make the playoffs while in his prime. The Lakers went 121-125 while Kobe was 25-27 years old playing every day.

It doesn't speak a ton on Kobe, but more the massive affect that help has on this league.

Prime Wade also missed the playoffs, so it's not like I'm just picking on Kobe here.

What year did prime Wade miss the playoffs? 07-08 he was playing injuried and they forced him to shut it down and get surgery.

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 04:18 PM
Advanced stats favor peak Wade over Kobe, both in the regular season and the playoffs.

Wade was more efficient, better defense, and passer, at least according to general stats. Kobe put up more points due to shot volume.

At their peaks I prefer Wade. Longevity is another topic altogether.

Honestly, I wonder what we've missed out on because of Wade's injuries. If only he had a healthy career...

Can always count on you Vee-Rex. Had Wade never got injured he would be higher than Kobe all time or equal.

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 04:22 PM
My point is that you didnít need a lot to beat that very same Wade. Bulls had nothing and completely destroyed Wade in 4. Hawks a way below average team beat that same Wade. Then the next series Hawks get destroyed in 4 games. So Wade was easily eliminated and you didnít even need good players to do it. Just good enough players to make the east playoffs.

Kobe on the other hand lost to the truly elite only. He lost to the Suns who had the MVP. Lost to the Spurs twice who won the title both years that happened. Lost to Dallas who also won that same year. Weakest teams he lost to are OKC and Jazz who both went on to the finals. Every team was elite.

Hilarious that youíre acting like that Bulls series was Wade at his best. I would argue he was 60% healthy at best and he multiple surgeries following that series back that.

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 04:28 PM
1006782755672346625

1006774950324260864

1006774290795069442

Wades sophomore year numbers were better than Kobeís MVP season:

1006773510058934272

Jeffy25
06-19-2018, 06:01 PM
What year did prime Wade miss the playoffs? 07-08 he was playing injuried and they forced him to shut it down and get surgery.

They were 11-49 when they shut him down lol


That Heat team was missing the playoffs, with or without Wade.

FlashBolt
06-19-2018, 06:37 PM
One thing I always loved about Wade is that he played efficient basketball and didn't force bad plays. He was always efficient enough to get the shots he needed to help his team. One thing I always hated about Kobe was that he didn't do enough of that in his career and simply took the shots he wanted. But you can't make the case you would rather have Wade definitively over Kobe - even for one year. I count four years of Wade's prime compared to over 12 for Kobe. Kobe's a more consistent player while Wade didn't have the health or early start. I may take 08-09 Wade over any year of Kobe's but the "Wade would surpass Kobe if he was more healthy" is just silly talk. Kobe's health is part of his consistency.

DODGERS&LAKERS
06-19-2018, 07:20 PM
Reminds me of the old days when everything became a kobe debate

So true my old friend, I've been away from forums for years now because life happens, but I see some things never change

WaDe03
06-19-2018, 10:15 PM
They were 11-49 when they shut him down lol


That Heat team was missing the playoffs, with or without Wade.

Yes because he clearly wasnít himself and was playing very injured which would explain the surgeries he had right after.

Vinylman
06-20-2018, 06:51 AM
It says a lot that Kobe didn't make the playoffs while in his prime. The Lakers went 121-125 while Kobe was 25-27 years old playing every day.

It doesn't speak a ton on Kobe, but more the massive affect that help has on this league.

Prime Wade also missed the playoffs, so it's not like I'm just picking on Kobe here.

you got the mod to delete my post... suffice it to say kobe had a better record in his age 25-27 seasons than wade and the above post is simply a lie... not misinformation... it is flat out inaccurate.

I guess PSD can't deal in facts

Jeffy25
06-20-2018, 10:32 AM
Just out of personal interest last night, I totaled Wade's career team record in his starts vs Kobe's

Wade - 538-369 - .593 winning percentage
Playoffs - 106-71 - .599 winning percentage

Kobe - 730-468 - .609 winning percentage
Playoffs - 135-85 - .614 winning percentage



For me, Kobe is ahead of Wade all-time because of the sheer volume of peak. It's why LeBron can catch Jordan.

Kobe has at least a 14 year peak. And even if Wade was better for maybe a 7 year stretch, it's marginal and the sheer volume ranks Kobe ahead of Wade.

It's the same thing that brings LeBron into the Jordan stratosphere. While Jordan was better on a per minute basis during their primes, LeBron having a 15 year prime vs Jordan's broken up 10 seasons is just too much value produced for it to be ignored.

It's the same thing here, Wade's peak is basically half as long as Kobe's. And sustaining your peak is a major part in all-time rankings.


I'm a pretty big Kobe basher, but I'd never rank Wade ahead of him. Even if I think Wade was a better individual player in specific seasons

Wade had the better individual seasons, but didn't have nearly enough of them to out pace what Kobe could accomplish in almost a decade and a half.

Jeffy25
06-20-2018, 10:34 AM
you got the mod to delete my post... suffice it to say kobe had a better record in his age 25-27 seasons than wade and the above post is simply a lie... not misinformation... it is flat out inaccurate.

I guess PSD can't deal in facts

I posted in the other thread, but to clear up.

1. I didn't report your post, or ask it to be deleted, or talk to anyone about you

2. I didn't post misinformation. I simply stated the Lakers record during Kobe's prime years in response to what Flash had said.

3. I also said that prime Wade missed the playoffs, which Wade03 countered

4. I wasn't siding with one player vs the other and don't know why you shot off out of anger so quickly and without cause. I wasn't riding Wade's dick or bashing Kobe. I was illustrating how each player needed help, and has had it for most of their careers. And when they didn't have it, their teams suffered greatly.

Scoots
06-20-2018, 10:43 AM
Sorry, while moving things here and deleting posts in the other thread (that were off-topic, but not about Kobe/Wade) I apparently somehow deleted a bunch of posts here too. I think it's all good now.

WaDe03
06-20-2018, 10:43 AM
Just out of personal interest last night, I totaled Wade's career team record in his starts vs Kobe's

Wade - 538-369 - .593 winning percentage
Playoffs - 106-71 - .599 winning percentage

Kobe - 730-468 - .609 winning percentage
Playoffs - 135-85 - .614 winning percentage



For me, Kobe is ahead of Wade all-time because of the sheer volume of peak. It's why LeBron can catch Jordan.

Kobe has at least a 14 year peak. And even if Wade was better for maybe a 7 year stretch, it's marginal and the sheer volume ranks Kobe ahead of Wade.

It's the same thing that brings LeBron into the Jordan stratosphere. While Jordan was better on a per minute basis during their primes, LeBron having a 15 year prime vs Jordan's broken up 10 seasons is just too much value produced for it to be ignored.

It's the same thing here, Wade's peak is basically half as long as Kobe's. And sustaining your peak is a major part in all-time rankings.


I'm a pretty big Kobe basher, but I'd never rank Wade ahead of him. Even if I think Wade was a better individual player in specific seasons

Wade had the better individual seasons, but didn't have nearly enough of them to out pace what Kobe could accomplish in almost a decade and a half.

I think youíre confused, no one is arguing Wade over Kobe all time.

LaVar Ball
06-20-2018, 11:10 AM
Why was this made into a thread in the nba forum ?m


Thereís a damn comparisons forum for this ****

Jeffy25
06-20-2018, 11:11 AM
I think youíre confused, no one is arguing Wade over Kobe all time.

Then what are we even discussing?

WaDe03
06-20-2018, 11:23 AM
Why was this made into a thread in the nba forum ?m


Thereís a damn comparisons forum for this ****

The comparisons forum is dead, itís never used. People debate players on here all the time.

WaDe03
06-20-2018, 11:24 AM
Then what are we even discussing?

My original claim that started all this discussion, Wade at his best was better than Kobe at his best. So basically peak vs peak.

LaVar Ball
06-20-2018, 11:25 AM
The comparisons forum is dead, itís never used. People debate players on here all the time.

Nobody gives a **** about Kobe and Wade right now. Itís the NBA draft and free agency coming up. That stuff is more interesting than this ****

Scoots
06-20-2018, 11:27 AM
My original claim that started all this discussion, Wade at his best was better than Kobe at his best. So basically peak vs peak.

FWIW, I don't really care for this comparison stuff, particularly over generations ... but I agree with you. Peak Wade for me.

WaDe03
06-20-2018, 11:32 AM
Nobody gives a **** about Kobe and Wade right now. Itís the NBA draft and free agency coming up. That stuff is more interesting than this ****

Then dry your tears and see your way out, itís that simple.

WaDe03
06-20-2018, 11:36 AM
FWIW, I don't really care for this comparison stuff, particularly over generations ... but I agree with you. Peak Wade for me.

Theyre very close in a lot of areas but Wade was the more efficient player, better closer, shot blocker, and passer/playmaker. Kobe could shoot better from 3, both were awesome attacking the basket, at the mid range game, and in the lost.

LaVar Ball
06-20-2018, 11:44 AM
Then dry your tears and see your way out, itís that simple.

Youíre insecure about your boy and I bet youíre the one who requested a mod to make this into a thread.


Wade sucks donkey balls. Who cares!

WaDe03
06-20-2018, 11:56 AM
Youíre insecure about your boy and I bet youíre the one who requested a mod to make this into a thread.


Wade sucks donkey balls. Who cares!

I didnít request it but good guess. I donít understand a bunch of grown men crying to other grown men about something another grown man did or said on an Internet forum. Why guys on here cry to the mods about something all the time is beyond me. Get the **** over it!

Hawkeye15
06-20-2018, 02:28 PM
Yep, prime Wade was better than Kobe.

eh, Wade's absolute peak may have an argument over Kobe's peak, but Kobe had a stronger career pretty easily. I mean, he was a top 5 player for like 12-13 years. That is ridiculous.

WaDe03
06-20-2018, 02:43 PM
eh, Wade's absolute peak may have an argument over Kobe's peak, but Kobe had a stronger career pretty easily. I mean, he was a top 5 player for like 12-13 years. That is ridiculous.

Yea Kobe has the longevity, no debate there.

Jeffy25
06-20-2018, 06:23 PM
My original claim that started all this discussion, Wade at his best was better than Kobe at his best. So basically peak vs peak.

Does length of peak matter?

Jeffy25
06-20-2018, 06:24 PM
Nobody gives a **** about Kobe and Wade right now. Itís the NBA draft and free agency coming up. That stuff is more interesting than this ****

Then why are you posting in this thread?

WaDe03
06-20-2018, 07:01 PM
Does length of peak matter?

No lol just best for best. 1 season, their absolute best.

Jeffy25
06-20-2018, 07:10 PM
No lol just best for best. 1 season, their absolute best.

It's a coin toss for me most likely. Maybe baby edge for Wade.

But if that's the case, then probably McGrady in 02-03

Bruno
06-20-2018, 09:13 PM
Reminds me of the old days when everything became a kobe debate


So true my old friend, I've been away from forums for years now because life happens, but I see some things never change
aman.

PSD is such a relic its funny to even log in these days. a reminder of the 'old' internet. i'd be shocked if anyone under 30 even comes here.

Switch
06-20-2018, 11:08 PM
Lmao

Only on psd do you hear something so stupid as Wade is better than Kobe. Lol thanks for the chuckles

IKnowHoops
06-20-2018, 11:08 PM
I would take Peak Wade over Peak Kobe. The big difference is Wade always played winning basketball. I think Wade/Kobe/Tmac were all pretty even at there Peak on any given day.

thenaj17
06-21-2018, 07:21 AM
Pau was a legit all star who many argued shouldíve won finals MVP in one of their championship wins. Odom is one of the best 6 mans ever and Bynum was the 2nd best center in the league then.

Wade got swept in 06 because he was injured. Thatís the year he shattered his restoration cut and ****ed yo his knee. They didnít want him to come back but he did anyways to try and defend the ring. He had to get more surgery right after that series because he was still hurt and it even lingered into the next season where he tried to play through and they forced him to shut it down and get even more surgery. Prior to shattering his rotator cuff he was running away with MVP averaging 29-7-8-2-1 on 50% and having a much better season than Kobe ever had.

Nonsense. Bynum was only viewed as one of the best centres for a few months and well after 2010 championship. He barely played between 2008-2010 in the playoffs.

WaDe03
06-21-2018, 09:41 AM
Nonsense. Bynum was only viewed as one of the best centres for a few months and well after 2010 championship. He barely played between 2008-2010 in the playoffs.

Not nonsense at all. Bynum was a monster. Kobeís team was stacked but people just like to **** on them to try and hype Kobe up in LeBron debates which is dumb.

Fisher
Gasol
Bynum
Odom
Artest
Vujacic
Ariza

His team was very solid and well rounded.

YAALREADYKNO
06-21-2018, 12:32 PM
Kobe and I donít think twice tbh

FlashBolt
06-21-2018, 05:25 PM
Can you name the greatest Kobe playoffs games? Because he doesn't have many of them. There are way too many instances of poor Kobe games and his teams end up winning the game still. People acting like Kobe didn't have an insane amount of help. Forget Fisher and Horry for a second (two solid veterans who made the right plays every time). Odom, Artest/Ariza, Pau Gasol and Bynum on the same team? All you needed was a great wing and you were going to win. Kobe gets way too much credit for "leading" his team when it hasn't been true at all.

nastynice
06-21-2018, 07:58 PM
Can you name the greatest Kobe playoffs games? Because he doesn't have many of them. There are way too many instances of poor Kobe games and his teams end up winning the game still. People acting like Kobe didn't have an insane amount of help. Forget Fisher and Horry for a second (two solid veterans who made the right plays every time). Odom, Artest/Ariza, Pau Gasol and Bynum on the same team? All you needed was a great wing and you were going to win. Kobe gets way too much credit for "leading" his team when it hasn't been true at all.

The Lakers bigs were def underrated, between Odom, gasol, Bynum, def had one of the best paint offenses in the league

At the same time, 5 rings don't lie. 5 rings as the best or second best player on the team, he deserves plenty of credit. He's not overrated, he has 5 rings, is it even possible to over rate someone with that type of resume?

YAALREADYKNO
06-22-2018, 10:50 AM
The Lakers bigs were def underrated, between Odom, gasol, Bynum, def had one of the best paint offenses in the league

At the same time, 5 rings don't lie. 5 rings as the best or second best player on the team, he deserves plenty of credit. He's not overrated, he has 5 rings, is it even possible to over rate someone with that type of resume?

Nobody with that resume gets overrated except for Kobe on PSD. You should already know this lol

Jeffy25
06-22-2018, 11:19 AM
The Lakers bigs were def underrated, between Odom, gasol, Bynum, def had one of the best paint offenses in the league

At the same time, 5 rings don't lie. 5 rings as the best or second best player on the team, he deserves plenty of credit. He's not overrated, he has 5 rings, is it even possible to over rate someone with that type of resume?

Pippen has 6 as the second best player on his team, and I don't think he is over-rated.

effen5
06-22-2018, 12:41 PM
Advanced stats favor peak Wade over Kobe, both in the regular season and the playoffs.

Wade was more efficient, better defense, and passer, at least according to general stats. Kobe put up more points due to shot volume.

At their peaks I prefer Wade. Longevity is another topic altogether.

Honestly, I wonder what we've missed out on because of Wade's injuries. If only he had a healthy career...

I think I agree with this.

If it was only one year, if I had to choose a prime Kobe v prime Wade, I'd take Wade. If it was over an entire career, I'd take Kobe.

Quinnsanity
06-22-2018, 12:44 PM
I don't know what's funnier here, the fact that you started a thread just to argue with Flashbolt, or the fact that you did it, and you're still wrong. KD is better than Kobe ever was. Kobe has a lengthier resume, but KD is the better player. I might take Wade too, but I'd have to think about it.

FlashBolt
06-22-2018, 03:02 PM
I don't know what's funnier here, the fact that you started a thread just to argue with Flashbolt, or the fact that you did it, and you're still wrong. KD is better than Kobe ever was. Kobe has a lengthier resume, but KD is the better player. I might take Wade too, but I'd have to think about it.

Post didn't start with me. I think a mod took this portion out and created a new thread as it was off-topic.

Baldyy
06-22-2018, 03:33 PM
Wade was better at his peak, but that didn't last nearly as long as Kobe was at his peak.