PDA

View Full Version : PSD NBA All-Time Player Power Rankings: #19



mrblisterdundee
11-17-2017, 12:27 PM
Julius Erving took the 18th spot last round. This round, I added Walt Frazier, ranked 38th by ESPN's #NBArank (http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/page/nbarank160129/all-nbarank-36-40). Voting lasts two days.

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Lebron James
4. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Tim Duncan
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Magic Johnson
8. Larry Bird
9. Hakeem Olajuwon
10. Bill Russell
11. Kobe Bryant
12. Moses Malone
13. Jerry West
14. Oscar Robertson
15. David Robinson
16. Kevin Garnett
17. Charles Barkley
18. Julius Erving

valade16
11-17-2017, 02:21 PM
For me itís Dirk here with Wade, Curry, KD and Malone in some order with the next picks.

mightybosstone
11-17-2017, 02:41 PM
I went with Dirk as well. He was elite for longer in his career than Wade was, he crushes Curry and KD in terms of longevity and overall accolades, and his postseason resume is head and shoulders ahead of Malone. I think Curry and KD will ultimately pass Dirk, but I'd still give him the edge in 2017.

KnicksorBust
11-17-2017, 03:14 PM
Accolades = out of 10 (MVPs, All-NBA teams, etc.)
Offensive Ability = out of 10
Defensive Ability = out of 8
Team Success = out of 8 (Postseason production included here)
Peak Production = out of 5
Longevity = out of 5
Era = out of 4

It adds up to 50 to keep it clean.

Karl Malone = 9+7+5+4+5+4 = 34
Dwyane Wade = 9+7+8+4+4+4 = 36
Dirk Nowitzki = 9+3+8+4+5+4 = 33

I'm going Wade here.

mightybosstone
11-17-2017, 04:06 PM
Karl Malone = 9+7+5+4+5+4 = 34
Dwyane Wade = 9+7+8+4+4+4 = 36
Dirk Nowitzki = 9+3+8+4+5+4 = 33

I'm going Wade here.

OK, those numbers have to be out of order. How is it that Malone, Wade and Dirk would all get a "4" for team success? And how is it that Dirk would get a "3" in offensive ability? I would love to argue with you on this, but since I have no clue which number goes with which category, it's pretty tough...

If I were going in order based on your metrics here, I would go with something like this:
Dirk: 9+9+4+7+5+5+5 = 44
Wade: 8+8+7+8+5+3+4 = 43
Malone: 9+9+6+3+5+5+5 = 42

WaDe03
11-17-2017, 04:37 PM
Easily Wade for me. He's better than quite a few guys already selected. He destroyed Dirk on the biggest stage in 1 finals and then outplayed him the 2nd time as well. Far better defender and all around better player than Dirk. 3 rings to 1, just so many things in Wades favor. Dirk has longevity, Wade has everything else.

mightybosstone
11-17-2017, 04:50 PM
Easily Wade for me. He's better than quite a few guys already selected. He destroyed Dirk on the biggest stage in 1 finals and then outplayed him the 2nd time as well. Far better defender and all around better player than Dirk. 3 rings to 1, just so many things in Wades favor. Dirk has longevity, Wade has everything else.
Saying that Dirk just "has longevity" is a pretty big understatement. His prime (which is roughly as good as Wade's) was much longer, and he was consistently much healthier at his peak than Wade. He was aslo the alpha dog on a team that won 50+ games for 11 straight seasons. I also don't give Wade a massive edge in terms of postseason success since he really just won the one title as an alpha dog and won the other two as Lebron's No. 2.

KnicksorBust
11-17-2017, 07:11 PM
Karl Malone = 9+7+5+4+5+4 = 34
Dwyane Wade = 9+7+8+4+4+4 = 36
Dirk Nowitzki = 9+3+8+4+5+4 = 33

I'm going Wade here.

OK, those numbers have to be out of order. How is it that Malone, Wade and Dirk would all get a "4" for team success? And how is it that Dirk would get a "3" in offensive ability? I would love to argue with you on this, but since I have no clue which number goes with which category, it's pretty tough...

If I were going in order based on your metrics here, I would go with something like this:
Dirk: 9+9+4+7+5+5+5 = 44
Wade: 8+8+7+8+5+3+4 = 43
Malone: 9+9+6+3+5+5+5 = 42

Hah. I left out the first category by accident. Shouldnt have rushed on my lunch hour. :)

KnicksorBust
11-17-2017, 07:18 PM
[QUOTE=KnicksorBust;31984371]Accolades = out of 10 (MVPs, All-NBA teams, etc.)
Offensive Ability = out of 10
Defensive Ability = out of 8
Team Success = out of 8 (Postseason production included here)
Peak Production = out of 5
Longevity = out of 5
Era = out of 4

It adds up to 50 to keep it clean.

Karl Malone = 9+9+7+5+4+5+4 = 43
Dwyane Wade = 8+9+7+8+4+4+4 = 44
Dirk Nowitzki = 9+9+3+8+4+5+4 = 42

KnicksorBust
11-17-2017, 07:20 PM
Karl Malone = 9+7+5+4+5+4 = 34
Dwyane Wade = 9+7+8+4+4+4 = 36
Dirk Nowitzki = 9+3+8+4+5+4 = 33

I'm going Wade here.

OK, those numbers have to be out of order. How is it that Malone, Wade and Dirk would all get a "4" for team success? And how is it that Dirk would get a "3" in offensive ability? I would love to argue with you on this, but since I have no clue which number goes with which category, it's pretty tough...

If I were going in order based on your metrics here, I would go with something like this:
Dirk: 9+9+4+7+5+5+5 = 44
Wade: 8+8+7+8+5+3+4 = 43
Malone: 9+9+6+3+5+5+5 = 42

Sidenote mbts point totals make me think my metrics are not half bad because it shows how close these 3 really are for this spot. It is a great debate for all 3.

mrblisterdundee
11-17-2017, 07:29 PM
I'll catch a lot of flak on this take, but 'dis here Karl Malone. He was an absolute beast in a two-man show almost his entire career. People knock him for his playoff performances, but Malone made two runs to the finals against one of the best teams in history and won a couple games both times. You can't really knock someone for not beating Jordan's Bulls.
Malone might not have championships, but he beat Jordan out for an MVP award. He's the only player to be named to 11 consecutive all-NBA first teams. He's got more all-NBA defensive team selections than Wade, and two more MVPs. That sort of longevity should be rewarded.
I'd take Wade next over Nowitzki. He has had some amazing seasons on extremely high usage rates, including an epic finals run in 2006. But that run was through some softer competition and with the help of Shaq, who while 33 years old was still 1st team all-NBA and probably the best center in the league. Then Wade got to ride on LeBron's banana boat with Bosh.

Chronz
11-17-2017, 07:34 PM
Julius? Lmfao, y'all took this too far. Dude couldn't polish wades knob if he asked politely two times

WaDe03
11-17-2017, 09:38 PM
I'll catch a lot of flak on this take, but 'dis here Karl Malone. He was an absolute beast in a two-man show almost his entire career. People knock him for his playoff performances, but Malone made two runs to the finals against one of the best teams in history and won a couple games both times. You can't really knock someone for not beating Jordan's Bulls.
Malone might not have championships, but he beat Jordan out for an MVP award. He's the only player to be named to 11 consecutive all-NBA first teams. He's got more all-NBA defensive team selections than Wade, and two more MVPs. That sort of longevity should be rewarded.
I'd take Wade next over Nowitzki. He has had some amazing seasons on extremely high usage rates, including an epic finals run in 2006. But that run was through some softer competition and with the help of Shaq, who while 33 years old was still 1st team all-NBA and probably the best center in the league. Then Wade got to ride on LeBron's banana boat with Bosh.

I only saw the last sentence. Don't sit here and act like Wade wasn't huge in their wins. The 2nd ring in 1 leg. That game 4 is legendary.

WaDe03
11-17-2017, 09:39 PM
Julius? Lmfao, y'all took this too far. Dude couldn't polish wades knob if he asked politely two times

This! I **** with you now Chronz!

Bostonjorge
11-17-2017, 11:05 PM
What about Isiah Thomas? A back to back champ while playing in the Magic, bird and Jordan era.

mrblisterdundee
11-18-2017, 01:02 AM
I only saw the last sentence. Don't sit here and act like Wade wasn't huge in their wins. The 2nd ring in 1 leg. That game 4 is legendary.

Wade has had some great moments. But he's ever gone against a team in the playoffs on the level of Jordan's Bulls. Malone has had monster games and beaten Jordan's Bulls four times. He beat the Bulls in Chicago, shooting 63 percent and scoring almost half his team's points.
When has Wade ever beaten a team that good while being the team's leader? The Mavericks were a joke compared to the Bulls. He was clearly a second fiddle in his playoffs with LeBron.

AntiG
11-18-2017, 03:00 AM
Having been able to watch NBA from the early 80s to now, comes down to Drexler and Malone here for me. Much like Barkley, both of them fought through a brutal western conference to run into a juggernaut eastern champ, and always were the 2nd-4th best player in the league after Jordan, Bird, Olajuwon or Magic. During the late 80s/early 90s, people were talking Jordan or Drexler, who is the best 2-man in the NBA, which Jordan settled in 1992. But in all-time rankings, both Clyde and Karl should have gone right after Kobe.

KnicksorBust
11-18-2017, 10:55 AM
What about Isiah Thomas? A back to back champ while playing in the Magic, bird and Jordan era.

I call BS here. The 89 season Bird was out basically the whole year, Byron Scott and Magic Johnson both got injured in the Finals and Kareem was 42 and retiring. The 90 title is more impessive but they basically got their rings in the window where Bird's career had peaked, Kareem had retired, and Jordan/Pippen were maturing.

WaDe03
11-18-2017, 11:38 AM
Wade has had some great moments. But he's ever gone against a team in the playoffs on the level of Jordan's Bulls. Malone has had monster games and beaten Jordan's Bulls four times. He beat the Bulls in Chicago, shooting 63 percent and scoring almost half his team's points.
When has Wade ever beaten a team that good while being the team's leader? The Mavericks were a joke compared to the Bulls. He was clearly a second fiddle in his playoffs with LeBron.

Yes LeBron was better their last 3 years together but how can you try and discredit Wade for those rings when he was a huge part of them?

Wade didn't play anyone better than those Bulls but why does it matter? Karl didn't beat them to win a championship either. Wades 06 finals performance is better than any finals performance Malone had, hell its better than any Jordan had. Only 2nd to LeBron in 2016. 3 to 0 in rings is a huge gap for what I believe is probably most important when you're talking all time elite players.

Wade played some pretty damn good teams though go back and look around, he was busting those Pistons teams *** in just his 2nd year up 3-2 in the ECF until injury, beat them in his 3rd year then we know what happened after that, beat those Kidd/Carter/Jefferson Nets teams, beat the big 3 Celtics, those very strong Pacers teams, the Durant/Westbrook/Harden/Ibaka Thunder, Spurs, etc.

Imagine if a 3rd year player right now did what Wade did in 06. The basketball world would go ****ing nuts.

WaDe03
11-18-2017, 11:40 AM
Do the right thing guys, its past due at this point anyways.

Malone couldn't get the big one, Dirk was destroyed by Wade in 1 finals and was still outplayed by Wade in 2011. That epic choke job by LeBron had a huge impact on Wades legacy.

KnicksorBust
11-18-2017, 12:58 PM
Accolades = out of 10 (MVPs, All-NBA teams, etc.)
Offensive Ability = out of 10
Defensive Ability = out of 8
Team Success = out of 8 (Postseason production included here)
Peak Production = out of 5
Longevity = out of 5
Era = out of 4

It adds up to 50 to keep it clean.

Put Isiah Thomas in that system and he comes far short of #19.