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mrblisterdundee
10-31-2017, 12:22 PM
Kobe Bryant took the 11th spot last round. This round, I expanded the voting options to 20 to appease people who thought the right options weren't available for voting. They're still based on ESPN's #NBArank (http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/page/nbarank160202/all-nbarank-26-30). Voting lasts two days.

1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Lebron James
4. Wilt Chamberlain
5. Tim Duncan
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Magic Johnson
8. Larry Bird
9. Hakeem Olajuwon
10. Bill Russell
11. Kobe Bryant

mrblisterdundee
10-31-2017, 12:36 PM
It was neck-and-neck for me between Julius and Moses. Oscar was great, but he was another victim of the inflated stats and lesser competition in the 1960s.

Hawkeye15
10-31-2017, 01:30 PM
Moses here.

FlashBolt
10-31-2017, 01:34 PM
I like David Robinson here. as much as I dislike KD, it might be time to put him top 15. I'm not sure how Julius was better than KD at all and if winning was the criteria, then there isn't really an advantage for Julius. I guess legacy and longevity for now? But I'll take KD over him any day.

YAALREADYKNO
10-31-2017, 01:44 PM
Moses

Chronz
10-31-2017, 04:30 PM
Man y'all hate Kobe

valade16
10-31-2017, 04:57 PM
Man y'all hate Kobe

This forum has always been more stats based and his peak stats can't hold a candle to 1-9 and if we start to include career and accomplishments, he can't hold a candle to Russell. I could easily see an argument for him over Hakeem to be Top 10, Hakeem (despite being one of my favorite players ever) should probably be 11th.

FlashBolt
10-31-2017, 05:27 PM
This forum has always been more stats based and his peak stats can't hold a candle to 1-9 and if we start to include career and accomplishments, he can't hold a candle to Russell. I could easily see an argument for him over Hakeem to be Top 10, Hakeem (despite being one of my favorite players ever) should probably be 11th.

I find that the hardcore BBall fans generally frown upon high USG% scorers and ball-hog type guys whereas casual fans love them. There's a huge disconnect in rankings if you asked people from both sides,

hugepatsfan
10-31-2017, 05:37 PM
I think the "hardcore" guys often forget how the stats translate to the game. Unless you simply have overwhelming talent like GS you can't afford for your team to have everyone pass up contested shots and only take wide open looks that they can knock down at super high rates. Few teams are talented enough to actually find that type of shot eventually. They need guys who can make contested and difficult shots. And those may not be at an "efficient" clip but they'll be at a better rate than if others on the team took them and that's what counts.

dhopisthename
10-31-2017, 05:43 PM
espn had Kobe 12th so liked him more then they did.

valade16
10-31-2017, 06:05 PM
I think the "hardcore" guys often forget how the stats translate to the game. Unless you simply have overwhelming talent like GS you can't afford for your team to have everyone pass up contested shots and only take wide open looks that they can knock down at super high rates. Few teams are talented enough to actually find that type of shot eventually. They need guys who can make contested and difficult shots. And those may not be at an "efficient" clip but they'll be at a better rate than if others on the team took them and that's what counts.

I am very sympathetic to the nuance of high usage scorers based on my own experience. While on a rec team someone kept track of our stats and I always shot a ridiculous amount of shots per game and I joked I was a ball-hog but the actual problem was, everyone else was so afraid of taking a shot of concerned with whether they were getting a good look they never wanted to shoot. And it always fell upon me to shoot.

In my defense I did shoot 35% from 3 (while taking 11 a game lol), so I wasn't super inefficient. But I completely understand why players have to shoot a lot depending on the situation.

GREATNESS ONE
10-31-2017, 09:49 PM
This forum has always been more stats based and his peak stats can't hold a candle to 1-9 and if we start to include career and accomplishments, he can't hold a candle to Russell. I could easily see an argument for him over Hakeem to be Top 10, Hakeem (despite being one of my favorite players ever) should probably be 11th.

Lol

GREATNESS ONE
10-31-2017, 09:52 PM
https://youtu.be/NLOMEmRQ40U

This is why Vlade hates Kobe :p

YAALREADYKNO
11-01-2017, 08:29 AM
Man y'all hate Kobe

You ain't lying

KnicksorBust
11-01-2017, 11:16 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nuance of high usage scorers based on my own experience. While on a rec team someone kept track of our stats and I always shot a ridiculous amount of shots per game and I joked I was a ball-hog but the actual problem was, everyone else was so afraid of taking a shot of concerned with whether they were getting a good look they never wanted to shoot. And it always fell upon me to shoot.

In my defense I did shoot 35% from 3 (while taking 11 a game lol), so I wasn't super inefficient. But I completely understand why players have to shoot a lot depending on the situation.

Only Valade would know his TS% in a rec league. ;)

KnicksorBust
11-01-2017, 11:20 AM
I'm going Moses Malone. Pretty easy vote for me tbh. I hate to oversimplify things here but his league MVPs and epic Finals run outweigh anything any of these other guys did. 3x league MVP 1x FMVP. Love the longevity. Almost a decade of all-nba teams. Over a decade of all-star teams. Made all-nba defensive 1st and 2nd team. To me he is clearly above the other names here. #13 even I'm not sure yet. :laugh: This is where it gets tricky again and people's individual criteria really come in to play.

KnicksorBust
11-01-2017, 11:23 AM
I think the "hardcore" guys often forget how the stats translate to the game. Unless you simply have overwhelming talent like GS you can't afford for your team to have everyone pass up contested shots and only take wide open looks that they can knock down at super high rates. Few teams are talented enough to actually find that type of shot eventually. They need guys who can make contested and difficult shots. And those may not be at an "efficient" clip but they'll be at a better rate than if others on the team took them and that's what counts.

I'm curious if we had a vote just Kobe vs. Hakeem if Hakeem would have still won. The Hakeem people clearly had a problem with voting Russell.

Hawkeye15
11-01-2017, 11:24 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nuance of high usage scorers based on my own experience. While on a rec team someone kept track of our stats and I always shot a ridiculous amount of shots per game and I joked I was a ball-hog but the actual problem was, everyone else was so afraid of taking a shot of concerned with whether they were getting a good look they never wanted to shoot. And it always fell upon me to shoot.

In my defense I did shoot 35% from 3 (while taking 11 a game lol), so I wasn't super inefficient. But I completely understand why players have to shoot a lot depending on the situation.

well, we have ourselves a Costanza....chucker!

valade16
11-01-2017, 11:26 AM
Only Valade would know his TS% in a rec league. ;)

:laugh2: Damn Straight!

I'd actually be afraid of calculating my TS%, I bet it is atrocious lol.

KnicksorBust
11-02-2017, 11:27 AM
Gotta be Oscar next right?

Chronz
11-02-2017, 09:51 PM
Gotta be Oscar next right?

Believe in his mystique as a leader? Not keen on him here but he's got that chip