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Scoots
07-25-2017, 09:23 AM
I'm not a LeBron "hater" ... I can see that he's one of the greatest players ever to play the game.

But pretty much everything going wrong in Cleveland can be dropped right at his feet.

Gilbert gets the blame for Griffin I think.

It looks like LeBron wants out, everyone seems to know it, but he's maneuvering his way to having the fans blame Gilbert, blame Kyrie, blame KD, etc.

Does anybody believe LeBron was "shocked" and "blindsided" by the things happening this off-season when fans were not? We knew Gilbert had never extended a GM and Griffin hadn't worked out a new deal despite trying a year ago to get an extension. We knew Kyrie was unhappy and talking about trades months ago. Billups said "no" because LeBron didn't offer any support. LeBron, who can be a great recruiter when he wants to be did nothing this offseason to improve the team.

It sure looks like it's the worlds worst kept secret that LeBron wants to build his 3rd super team with Magic in LA. He was even courtside cheering Lonzo in summer league ... I didn't watch them all, but I didn't see him courtside for the 2 Cavs summer league games I watched.

LeBron is the most powerful man in the NBA ... and I can't help but think things are going the way he wants them to go.

Jamiecballer
07-25-2017, 09:39 AM
i don't agree with any of it. i do believe he was blindsided, why wouldn't he be? Kyrie Irving is a player with obvious limitations who has thrived next to James. he had a ticket to the finals as long as james was healthy. and while you may blame james for not trying to drag others to cleveland, if he truly doesn't see himself there after this season that is a strong character move, not something to be blamed for.

hugepatsfan
07-25-2017, 09:52 AM
CLE was all-in to win now with absolutely zero regard for the long-term... then GS happened and now that all-in to win now team has basically no chance to win now. It's sent the team spinning.

CLE to GS is now essentially like BOS/TOR/WAS/IND/CHI have been to Lebron's Heat/Cavs teams in the East. Good enough to be #2 but no real path to being #1. And now there's a combination of guys who want more, the team scrambling to make moves with star players for even better stars and then a guy in Kyrie saying "**** it, I have my ring I'd rather be the man elsewhere compared to #2 on a team that won't win it all". It's thrown everything into disarray.

RowBTrice
07-25-2017, 09:59 AM
Agree with OP. Lebron was allowed to be too involved, got everything he wanted, and ran this franchise right back into the ground.

cheetos185
07-25-2017, 10:12 AM
Agree with OP. Lebron was allowed to be too involved, got everything he wanted, and ran this franchise right back into the ground.
Without lebron Cavs were at dumpster level.

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Vee-Rex
07-25-2017, 10:24 AM
Nah, Scoots. You're wrong on some of that.

Gilbert gets full blame regarding Griffin. He should've locked him up asap. That was the first huge miscue and it sort of snowballed from there. The Cavs then rushed and signed Jose Calderon and Jeff Green which were BAD moves, especially considering that there were better available pieces still on the market. Again, I'm fine with the Kyle Korver re-signing because he has an offensive gravity that is 2nd to only LeBron on this team, even though fans fail to see that.

The failure of acquiring Paul George (despite being sooooo close) might be put on Gilbert as well, because if Griffin was there then he might've been able to come through with that trade.

No one knew months ago that Kyrie wanted out. Not you, me, or anyone else. I've always felt that he wasn't as happy being second fiddle but not to the extent that he would demand a trade. I've also always knew that he and LeBron were never buddy-buddy/bestfriends off the court either. Still, there was nothing to indicate Kyrie was at his breaking point and he often played mediator during the on-court spats between LeBron and TT/Love.

Billups primarily said no because he got low-balled. Even if LeBron was hyping him up and trying to recruit, he still would have said no because Gilbert only offered 1.5 million and wouldn't budge. Chauncey came out and said he was low-balled and he actually makes more money as an ESPN analyst.

The LeBron to LA crap is so overblown that it's ridiculous. No one knows where he's going or if he's leaving Cleveland at all. The media is mind-****ing everyone right now and getting them to believe LeBron is definitely gonna be in LA. Sounds familiar? Because IIRC LeBron was supposed to be playing for the Knicks a long time ago, and there was FAAAAR more support/signs for that than this Lakers stuff.

If you guys want to entertain LeBron to LA as a possibility or even likelihood, by all means - I won't argue against you. But acting like it's guaranteed is behaving like all the mindless idiots that burst their load every single time an unsubstantiated report about LeBron surfaces. You're better than that.

Now, where I DO agree with you is the fact that LeBron's non-committment, yet again, seems to warp the offseason and progression of the team he's on. However, I'm starting to blame LeBron less and less for this. Everyone has these huge expectations for him to commit and he does the same thing plenty of other stars do - say absolutely nothing. Yet, unlike other stars, his silence drives the media and fans crazy and they begin nit-picking him excruciatingly (zomg he didn't post on twitter at 1:43pm it means he's angry and joining the Warriorz!!!!).

I honestly believe he's not throwing out support because he did that his first time around in Cleveland and was heavily blamed for the front office making certain moves right before he left (like the much criticized acquisition of Antawn Jamison). I'm guessing right now he doesn't know if he's leaving or not and simply doesn't want to get involved.

And while I agree he would've helped the Cavs improve if he would just commit and am tired of his non-commitment, I can't really fault him for being quiet about it. It's his life, his future, and he's within his right to wait until the contract ends before making a decision.

eDush
07-25-2017, 10:31 AM
I'm not a LeBron "hater" ... I can see that he's one of the greatest players ever to play the game.

But pretty much everything going wrong in Cleveland can be dropped right at his feet.

Gilbert gets the blame for Griffin I think.

It looks like LeBron wants out, everyone seems to know it, but he's maneuvering his way to having the fans blame Gilbert, blame Kyrie, blame KD, etc.

Does anybody believe LeBron was "shocked" and "blindsided" by the things happening this off-season when fans were not? We knew Gilbert had never extended a GM and Griffin hadn't worked out a new deal despite trying a year ago to get an extension. We knew Kyrie was unhappy and talking about trades months ago. Billups said "no" because LeBron didn't offer any support. LeBron, who can be a great recruiter when he wants to be did nothing this offseason to improve the team.

It sure looks like it's the worlds worst kept secret that LeBron wants to build his 3rd super team with Magic in LA. He was even courtside cheering Lonzo in summer league ... I didn't watch them all, but I didn't see him courtside for the 2 Cavs summer league games I watched.

LeBron is the most powerful man in the NBA ... and I can't help but think things are going the way he wants them to go.Excuse me but you are a hater just from your responses and to say you are not a hater makes you a liar :(. Lebron never indicated that he is leaving so you are making assumptions like most every other hater that he is leaving to make him look bad! He has little intention of leaving the state he was born and raise along with the huge support he garnered from going back home which is why Kyrie wants out cause he really wants to be "THE MAN" like your Barnes. If Lebron was planning on leaving, why would Kyrie when he will be THE MAN after next season and another final appearance to beat our Dubs! The owner or his cronies most likely leaked out that info cause he doesn't want to look like the bad guy by trying to trade him more discretely that will make him look like the bad guy but to make Kyrie look selfish which he is :nod:.

We already know you're a Jackson hater so adding the Lebron hater to your credits seem justifiable. Just not sure why you tend to deny them which is a bad habit but you're not the only one. Just the only mod that does it...:(

:flag:

cmellofan15
07-25-2017, 10:51 AM
What specific incidents are you blaming on Lebron? Kyrie wanting to leave?

BKLYNpigeon
07-25-2017, 10:52 AM
I think there's blame to go all around. Gilbert, lebron, Grif, Kyrie. Etc.

Why does everyone think Griffin is a good gm? He made a few minor moves that helped a bit. Building a team to win now hurts the team no and foreseeable future. It was always going to end like this. The cavs did win a championship so maybe it was all worth it.

Griffins track record as cavs gm off the top of my head:

Resigned verajao to that awful 3y for 30m
Traded 2 first round picks for Moszgov
Traded a first for frye
Traded a first for Korver
Resigned shump 4y for 40m
Resigned JR 4y for 57m

Scoots
07-25-2017, 11:21 AM
i don't agree with any of it. i do believe he was blindsided, why wouldn't he be? Kyrie Irving is a player with obvious limitations who has thrived next to James. he had a ticket to the finals as long as james was healthy. and while you may blame james for not trying to drag others to cleveland, if he truly doesn't see himself there after this season that is a strong character move, not something to be blamed for.

LeBron and Kyrie both hinted at their working relationship being work a year ago. Kyrie talked about leaving the Cavs before the finals. I think Griffin may have been the only one holding it together.

mngopher35
07-25-2017, 11:25 AM
Ya I think there are many people who can take some blame. Cavs fo and the griffin situation, lebron being so non committal, kyrie wanting to be the main star and opportunity to shine individually etc.

Like someone else has said I don't think this is as big of an issue pre this new gs team. Maybe kyrie still wants to be the man but then they just trade him in a decent package and can still compete possibly keeping lebron. Now the gap is just huge so why shouldn't kyrie look for his own personal best situation and no matter who they get back it seems odds of truly having a shot for a title are pretty low etc.

Scoots
07-25-2017, 11:41 AM
To be clear ... I think LeBron's (apparently warranted) distrust of Gilbert is a big part of the problem too.

I like the theory that this was all a big LeBron ploy to screw Gilbert for the open letter from when he left :)

I don't think anyone is certain of anything, about what happened when and who said what exactly when and where exactly everyone wants to go and when and how.

What we know is that things in Cleveland are a mess and if LeBron really didn't know that shows a pretty severe level of isolation since Brian Windhorst and Zach Lowe were talking about Kyrie leaving at the beginning of July. So maybe LeBron is innocent of everything other than lack of commitment and his usual passive aggressive comments ... but he's smart enough to know what the results of those things are going to be by now.

I don't know that anyone is saying Griffin is a great GM ... I think a lot of his moves were "demanded" by LeBron and I don't think anyone can argue that Griffin didn't pull some magic to assemble the 3 time finalist Cavs.

RowBTrice
07-25-2017, 12:01 PM
Agree with OP. Lebron was allowed to be too involved, got everything he wanted, and ran this franchise right back into the ground.


Without lebron Cavs were at dumpster level.

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Yes, I'm aware. But Lebron should of been able to sustain long term success at least at some level for this organization. That's not going to happen. It was s dumpster fire before him, he came back and used the franchise, owner, GM, and frankly his city like a pawn, and will very shortly leave, running it right back into the ground as I said initially.

AllBall
07-25-2017, 12:16 PM
I think yes, ultimately it's all Lebron's fault. He knew that Gilbert was a turd of an owner, but decided to go back anyways. You can't go back with your Ex, knock her up (Championship), and expect that all of a sudden things are going to be different. She's the same psycho as she was when you left her the first time. Now you're reminiscing of the good days you had with the one that got away (Miami) on instagram. :rolleyes:

ewing
07-25-2017, 12:21 PM
CLE was all-in to win now with absolutely zero regard for the long-term... then GS happened and now that all-in to win now team has basically no chance to win now. It's sent the team spinning.

CLE to GS is now essentially like BOS/TOR/WAS/IND/CHI have been to Lebron's Heat/Cavs teams in the East. Good enough to be #2 but no real path to being #1. And now there's a combination of guys who want more, the team scrambling to make moves with star players for even better stars and then a guy in Kyrie saying "**** it, I have my ring I'd rather be the man elsewhere compared to #2 on a team that won't win it all". It's thrown everything into disarray.



I disagree with this. Of course GS is the favorite but cant an injury or move put Clev right back at the top. They were dropping 50 point quarters in the finals. seems like another LeBron generation narrative

Vee-Rex
07-25-2017, 12:31 PM
I think there's blame to go all around. Gilbert, lebron, Grif, Kyrie. Etc.

Why does everyone think Griffin is a good gm? He made a few minor moves that helped a bit. Building a team to win now hurts the team no and foreseeable future. It was always going to end like this. The cavs did win a championship so maybe it was all worth it.

Griffins track record as cavs gm off the top of my head:

Resigned verajao to that awful 3y for 30m
Traded 2 first round picks for Moszgov
Traded a first for frye
Traded a first for Korver
Resigned shump 4y for 40m
Resigned JR 4y for 57m

He's a good GM. Not the best, but certainly one that is intelligent and creative.

Re-signing Varejao might be the only 'blight' on his record, but he more than made up for it.

-fired Mike Brown (and I loved it)

-drafted Wiggins and flipped him + a 1st (to Philly) and Bennett for Love.

This was a no-brainer to build the big 3, so it's nothing special.

-Traded Waiters for OKC's 1st round pick (top 18 protected in 2015), while also shipping out Alex Kirk, Lou Amundson, and a 2019 2nd round pick to acquire JR Smith and Iman Shumpert. It was part of a 3-team deal that also saw OKC send the Knicks Lance Thomas.

^^ Great trade, as the Cavs were struggling with a ball-dominant Waiters on the team with the Cavs big 3. Bringing in Smith (shooter) and Shumpert (defender) improved the team, while also acquiring a 1st round draft pick.

-Traded the newly acquired OKC 1st rounder along with a Memphis 1st rounder to bring in Mozgov and a 2015 2nd round pick.

^^ Another great trade. At this point the Cavs were sorely lacking rim protection and needed help on the interior. The two picks they traded were late 1st round picks and one that they actually just acquired in a trade. It's not Griffin's fault that Mozgov sustained an injury and required surgery and was never the same again. Pre-injury Mozgov was a really solid player.

-acquired Frye by giving up a 2018 1st round pick and shedding themselves of Varejao's ugly contract.

Not the best move, but Frye has been a killer vs. EC teams. Ask Toronto and Atlanta fans.

-fired David Blatt and hired Lue (without an extension)

^^Great move that was needed to help manage the diva personalities of the alphas on the team. Ultimately led to a championship.

-Traded Dunleavy (bum), Mo Williams (bum), and a 2019 top 10 protected 1st to Atlanta for Korver.

Those were the major moves. He essentially turned a Cavs team with horrible roleplayers that fit badly (Waiters, Varejao, Lou Amunson, etc...) into guys that could support the big 3 much better and actually be a championship team. He burned through 1st round picks when they wouldn't have held much value anyway to solidify and improve the team. Just because the Cavs were destined to face off against a historical Warriors team in 2016 and 2017 doesn't mean his moves weren't good.

Consider also that his hands were tied trying to please LeBron by signing his boys to extensions (TT, Shump) because LeBron only had a 1+1 deal in 2014. After the 2014-15 finals lost he HAD to keep LeBron happy and he did, and following the championship LeBron signed a 2+1 deal.

Also consider that his hands were tied with the Cavs being far over the luxury tax, and you'll see the ingenuity of some of his moves.

Griffin made 3x as many trades/deals as I lifted above just to bend and contort around salary cap restrictions. The full list is provided here:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/executives/griffin01x.html

Dude found a way to get the pieces he needed to get while being beloved by his players. It's impressive.

Scoots
07-25-2017, 12:39 PM
I disagree with this. Of course GS is the favorite but cant an injury or move put Clev right back at the top. They were dropping 50 point quarters in the finals. seems like another LeBron generation narrative

I agree. The "the team around LeBron is garbage" narrative is tired now.

LeBron isn't to blame for all of the mess ... but he needs to not get a clean pass either.

ewing
07-25-2017, 12:40 PM
I agree. The "the team around LeBron is garbage" narrative is tired now.

LeBron isn't to blame for all of the mess ... but he needs to not get a clean pass either.

It not even like people think they stink its like its OK to say **** it I have no chance if I don't see the clear road to making me the favorite. Clev is damn good, fight it out, maybe something breaks your way.

mrblisterdundee
07-25-2017, 01:15 PM
LeBron doesn't get enough blame, considering he seems to be doing a less overt version of The Decision again. He doesn't dispel any of the rumors that he wants out, and then he shows up at a Lakers summer league game to watch Lonzo.
But everybody seems to be getting tired of Gilbert. LeBron's never had a great relationship with him. I'm sure that's rubbed off on Kyrie too. Billups didn't want to be GM of the league's second-best team in his first front office gig, so that should tell you something about working under Gilbert. He's never kept a GM after his first contract.
The Cavaliers need a new owner. They might need a new city, considering Cleveland's lost over half its population since the 1970s.

FlashBolt
07-25-2017, 01:21 PM
LeBron got Cleveland a damn ring - something that he said he would do. Cleveland won a ring. Something their city hasn't seen in any major sport for over five decades. They have done well. Cleveland was always going to turn to crap when LeBron leaves. They'll still make the Finals without Kyrie. They probably lose the Finals with or without Kyrie. LeBron leaves to another team in 2018 = end of Cleveland with or without Kyrie. There's no story to this.

mightybosstone
07-25-2017, 01:23 PM
Nah, Scoots. You're wrong on some of that.

Gilbert gets full blame regarding Griffin. He should've locked him up asap. That was the first huge miscue and it sort of snowballed from there. The Cavs then rushed and signed Jose Calderon and Jeff Green which were BAD moves, especially considering that there were better available pieces still on the market. Again, I'm fine with the Kyle Korver re-signing because he has an offensive gravity that is 2nd to only LeBron on this team, even though fans fail to see that.

The failure of acquiring Paul George (despite being sooooo close) might be put on Gilbert as well, because if Griffin was there then he might've been able to come through with that trade.

No one knew months ago that Kyrie wanted out. Not you, me, or anyone else. I've always felt that he wasn't as happy being second fiddle but not to the extent that he would demand a trade. I've also always knew that he and LeBron were never buddy-buddy/bestfriends off the court either. Still, there was nothing to indicate Kyrie was at his breaking point and he often played mediator during the on-court spats between LeBron and TT/Love.

Billups primarily said no because he got low-balled. Even if LeBron was hyping him up and trying to recruit, he still would have said no because Gilbert only offered 1.5 million and wouldn't budge. Chauncey came out and said he was low-balled and he actually makes more money as an ESPN analyst.

The LeBron to LA crap is so overblown that it's ridiculous. No one knows where he's going or if he's leaving Cleveland at all. The media is mind-****ing everyone right now and getting them to believe LeBron is definitely gonna be in LA. Sounds familiar? Because IIRC LeBron was supposed to be playing for the Knicks a long time ago, and there was FAAAAR more support/signs for that than this Lakers stuff.

If you guys want to entertain LeBron to LA as a possibility or even likelihood, by all means - I won't argue against you. But acting like it's guaranteed is behaving like all the mindless idiots that burst their load every single time an unsubstantiated report about LeBron surfaces. You're better than that.

Now, where I DO agree with you is the fact that LeBron's non-committment, yet again, seems to warp the offseason and progression of the team he's on. However, I'm starting to blame LeBron less and less for this. Everyone has these huge expectations for him to commit and he does the same thing plenty of other stars do - say absolutely nothing. Yet, unlike other stars, his silence drives the media and fans crazy and they begin nit-picking him excruciatingly (zomg he didn't post on twitter at 1:43pm it means he's angry and joining the Warriorz!!!!).

I honestly believe he's not throwing out support because he did that his first time around in Cleveland and was heavily blamed for the front office making certain moves right before he left (like the much criticized acquisition of Antawn Jamison). I'm guessing right now he doesn't know if he's leaving or not and simply doesn't want to get involved.

And while I agree he would've helped the Cavs improve if he would just commit and am tired of his non-commitment, I can't really fault him for being quiet about it. It's his life, his future, and he's within his right to wait until the contract ends before making a decision.

Pretty much all of this. Lebron's inability to commit hasn't helped, but to act as if the majority of this mess falls squarely on his shoulders is pretty bogus. He didn't fire Griffin or botch the George trade or add Jeff freaking Green or sign Shumpert and Smith to bad contracts or ask Kyrie to leave or low-ball Billups or create this huge media circus around him going to LA. For people who want to knock the guy for not committing long-term, fine. But that just makes him like the vast majority of superstars in professional sports. Why does he warrant more criticism for that than the next guy?

eDush
07-25-2017, 02:09 PM
I think yes, ultimately it's all Lebron's fault. He knew that Gilbert was a turd of an owner, but decided to go back anyways. You can't go back with your Ex, knock her up (Championship), and expect that all of a sudden things are going to be different. She's the same psycho as she was when you left her the first time. Now you're reminiscing of the good days you had with the one that got away (Miami) on instagram. :rolleyes:What a bad analogy imo cause based on past players who return back to where they started regardless of the circumstances involved, it end up better than not like Roger Clemons and his buddy Andy Pettite, Chris Osgood, my favorite Willie McCovey and some guy with the initial MJ seem to do okay... :nod:

So to imply it will always end up bad is not always true :(

PayDaPiper
07-25-2017, 02:29 PM
Everything is Lebron's fault. He delivered on bringing a title back to CLE, but he is going to leave the city worse then before.

JR and Tristans ridiculous contracts are Lebron's fault. Kyrie wanting to leave is Lebron's fault.

Actually...

The Cavs self destructing is the Warriors fault, lol The Cavs are maxed out with bad contracts and no way of improving to beat GS. Lebron is a goner next season, Kyrie is a goner this season. At least Kevin Love will put up some monster numbers like his T Wolves days

Sorry for what the Warriors have done to you Cleveland :hide:

FlashBolt
07-25-2017, 02:36 PM
Everything is Lebron's fault. He delivered on bringing a title back to CLE, but he is going to leave the city worse then before.

JR and Tristans ridiculous contracts are Lebron's fault. Kyrie wanting to leave is Lebron's fault.

Actually...

The Cavs self destructing is the Warriors fault, lol The Cavs are maxed out with bad contracts and no way of improving to beat GS. Lebron is a goner next season, Kyrie is a goner this season. At least Kevin Love will put up some monster numbers like his T Wolves days

Sorry for what the Warriors have done to you Cleveland :hide:

Which is what really matters. Cleveland wouldn't have sniffed a ring without LeBron. Look at all the other franchises that are trying to win one but won't. As a fan, that's all you can ask for.. an opportunity to win every season and that's what LeBron did for that franchise.

SteBO
07-25-2017, 02:51 PM
I disagree with this. Of course GS is the favorite but cant an injury or move put Clev right back at the top. They were dropping 50 point quarters in the finals. seems like another LeBron generation narrative
If you're relying on an injury to get back on top, then the gulf is vast. Its absurd to dismiss the greatness of the Warriors as a "LeBron generation narrative".

FlashBolt
07-25-2017, 02:54 PM
If you're relying on an injury to get back on top, then the gulf is vast. Its absurd to dismiss the greatness of the Warriors as a "LeBron generation narrative".

Even if KD was injured, look at what happened to the Warriors.. still the best team in the NBA. And if anyone relies on an injury as an opportunity to seize victory, then they are doing things wrong. The odds of a player getting severely injured is fairly low. And by his logic, what if LeBron, Irving, or Love gets injured? If LeBron gets injured, forget about it - no chance in hell.

SteBO
07-25-2017, 02:54 PM
I agree. The "the team around LeBron is garbage" narrative is tired now.

LeBron isn't to blame for all of the mess ... but he needs to not get a clean pass either.
Strawman argument. KD stacked the deck, and as a result LeBrons cast isn't nearly as good by comparison.

LBJ shouldn't go blameless though, we agree there. His noncommittal always causes problems for the teams he plays for, but it's his career and his reasons for not making his intentions public are understandable. Don't necessarily agree...but I ain't him.

Scoots
07-25-2017, 03:07 PM
Pretty much all of this. Lebron's inability to commit hasn't helped, but to act as if the majority of this mess falls squarely on his shoulders is pretty bogus. He didn't fire Griffin or botch the George trade or add Jeff freaking Green or sign Shumpert and Smith to bad contracts or ask Kyrie to leave or low-ball Billups or create this huge media circus around him going to LA. For people who want to knock the guy for not committing long-term, fine. But that just makes him like the vast majority of superstars in professional sports. Why does he warrant more criticism for that than the next guy?

I don't think it's all on LeBron, but certainly he's not blameless. And the George trade was "botched" by Kyrie not being available for the trade. Gilbert is certainly to blame for a lot of it.

The majority of superstars in sports sign deals longer than 2 years ... and I understand that one possible reason for this was to keep Gilbert on his toes.

LeBron may or may not have lit the fire, but he hasn't done anything to put it out either.

Scoots
07-25-2017, 03:09 PM
Strawman argument. KD stacked the deck, and as a result LeBrons cast isn't nearly as good by comparison.

LBJ shouldn't go blameless though, we agree there. His noncommittal always causes problems for the teams he plays for, but it's his career and his reasons for not making his intentions public are understandable. Don't necessarily agree...but I ain't him.

It's not a strawman, it was an aside in a reply to ewing.

Jamiecballer
07-25-2017, 03:43 PM
LeBron and Kyrie both hinted at their working relationship being work a year ago. Kyrie talked about leaving the Cavs before the finals. I think Griffin may have been the only one holding it together.

sure, but so what. i'm sure at some point between then and now the question was asked "are you with us or not" and i'm pretty sure we can all guess the answer.

Bostonjorge
07-25-2017, 03:49 PM
Everything is just speculation. No report has come out and said Irving wants to be the man and is tired of being robin. Irving wanting to play in San Antonio goes against all that speculation about wanting to be the man.

The only FACT we have so far is Irving does not want to play with James. That's it.

ewing
07-25-2017, 05:29 PM
If you're relying on an injury to get back on top, then the gulf is vast. Its absurd to dismiss the greatness of the Warriors as a "LeBron generation narrative".

You're soft


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SteBO
07-25-2017, 06:08 PM
You're soft


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I win.

eDush
07-25-2017, 06:30 PM
Everything is Lebron's fault. He delivered on bringing a title back to CLE, but he is going to leave the city worse then before.

JR and Tristans ridiculous contracts are Lebron's fault. Kyrie wanting to leave is Lebron's fault.

Actually...

The Cavs self destructing is the Warriors fault, lol The Cavs are maxed out with bad contracts and no way of improving to beat GS. Lebron is a goner next season, Kyrie is a goner this season. At least Kevin Love will put up some monster numbers like his T Wolves days

Sorry for what the Warriors have done to you Cleveland :hide:Even if he does leave which he won't, how is the city of Cleveland will end up worse than before?!? The city if not the entire state was starved for a championship for the longest time regardless of which sport and Lebron made it happened! So that's already false and the team drafted Bennett with the top pick and was struggling to get out of the cellar when Lebron came back to saved the team and the city if you will. And he did it his way and if you don't like it...go jump off somewhere, you senseless hater by blaming him for everything... :facepalm:

He's a hero is my book! :clap:

COOLbeans
07-25-2017, 07:32 PM
Strawman argument. KD stacked the deck, and as a result LeBrons cast isn't nearly as good by comparison.

LBJ shouldn't go blameless though, we agree there. His noncommittal always causes problems for the teams he plays for, but it's his career and his reasons for not making his intentions public are understandable. Don't necessarily agree...but I ain't him.

People in here live season to season changing their opinions quarterly. A lot of that have to do with others opinions in here being strong willed and them being convinced of said opinions.

People in here prior to last season where saying Kyrie was better than Steph. And 3 years ago many people were entertaining the Wolves trade offer of KLove for Klay and Draymond. Because those guys improved since that time now they're a super team lol. No those guys compete hard and worked even harder to get better and did it organically. That should not stop them nor should it garner any criticism if they want to add an existing star to their roster.

This is a much better situation than creating a super team like Lebron and Bosh on those boys did down in Miami

eDush
07-25-2017, 07:54 PM
Strawman argument. KD stacked the deck, and as a result LeBrons cast isn't nearly as good by comparison.

LBJ shouldn't go blameless though, we agree there. His noncommittal always causes problems for the teams he plays for, but it's his career and his reasons for not making his intentions public are understandable. Don't necessarily agree...but I ain't him.

People in here live season to season changing their opinions quarterly. A lot of that have to do with others opinions in here being strong willed and them being convinced of said opinions.

People in here prior to last season where saying Kyrie was better than Steph. And 3 years ago many people were entertaining the Wolves trade offer of KLove for Klay and Draymond. Because those guys improved since that time now they're a super team lol. No those guys compete hard and worked even harder to get better and did it organically. That should not stop them nor should it garner any criticism if they want to add an existing star to their roster.

This is a much better situation than creating a super team like Lebron and Bosh on those boys did down in MiamiYou know I wasn't one of those guys who wanted Love cause he didn't fit what we were doing. Jerry West was very wise to see this before it was too late and Myer agreed with West instead of management who loves his stats. I supported West/Myers of keeping the key roster intact. I forgot what side you were CB at the time but many were for the Love trade... :facepalm:

COOLbeans
07-25-2017, 07:56 PM
You know I wasn't one of those guys who wanted Love cause he didn't fit what we were doing. Jerry West was very wise to see this before it was too late and Myer agreed with West instead of management who loves his stats. I supported West/Myers of keeping the key roster intact. I forgot what side you were CB at the time but many were for the Love trade... :facepalm:

I was always a huge Thonpson and Green supporter. And really I'm committed to guys once they show serious promise and have room to grow which those guys did at the time. I was strongly against that trade but there were a lot of guys even in the Warrior forum who saw the flash Shu klove name and jumped at that offer if they had any FO power

AllBall
07-25-2017, 08:05 PM
What a bad analogy imo cause based on past players who return back to where they started regardless of the circumstances involved, it end up better than not like Roger Clemons and his buddy Andy Pettite, Chris Osgood, my favorite Willie McCovey and some guy with the initial MJ seem to do okay... :nod:

So to imply it will always end up bad is not always true :(

I don't know about the ownership situations there. I just know of what I'm seeing with the Cavs.

eDush
07-25-2017, 08:13 PM
You know I wasn't one of those guys who wanted Love cause he didn't fit what we were doing. Jerry West was very wise to see this before it was too late and Myer agreed with West instead of management who loves his stats. I supported West/Myers of keeping the key roster intact. I forgot what side you were CB at the time but many were for the Love trade... :facepalm:

I was always a huge Thonpson and Green supporter. And really I'm committed to guys once they show serious promise and have room to grow which those guys did at the time. I was strongly against that trade but there were a lot of guys even in the Warrior forum who saw the flash Shu klove name and jumped at that offer if they had any FO powerThey were lead by Big Ern as he was flushing post after post like a man possessed on how important Love is for us to get over the hump to compete with the best at the time. When I tried to reason with him, he got scary on me like I was a Munson...
:crying:

SteBO
07-25-2017, 09:00 PM
People in here live season to season changing their opinions quarterly. A lot of that have to do with others opinions in here being strong willed and them being convinced of said opinions.

People in here prior to last season where saying Kyrie was better than Steph. And 3 years ago many people were entertaining the Wolves trade offer of KLove for Klay and Draymond. Because those guys improved since that time now they're a super team lol. No those guys compete hard and worked even harder to get better and did it organically. That should not stop them nor should it garner any criticism if they want to add an existing star to their roster.

This is a much better situation than creating a super team like Lebron and Bosh on those boys did down in Miami
Whoa, whoa. Don't misunderstand me. It's not the franchise that should be getting any criticism. Warriors deserve nothing but credit and praise with how they've handled their business. KD is the disappointment here.

They're the complete opposite of the Cavs FO, which deserves at least 90% of the blame for what's happened. It's not even about the Irving craziness with me, because they can't control how a man feels.....but letting Griffin go was a dumb move on all levels.

FlashBolt
07-25-2017, 09:28 PM
Look at what Cavs management did to Griffin.. Prevented him from meeting other teams (which now seems limited because most of those teams have gotten an assigned GM - thus, lowering the value of Griffin). Then reports come out Cavs owner was lowballing potential GM's - which explains why they promoted the assistant GM (why would an unproven assistant GM complain about a promotion)?

BKLYNpigeon
07-25-2017, 09:53 PM
I can't wait till after next year so we can all finally stop talking about the Cavs .

COOLbeans
07-25-2017, 10:49 PM
.

COOLbeans
07-25-2017, 10:49 PM
They were lead by Big Ern as he was flushing post after post like a man possessed on how important Love is for us to get over the hump to compete with the best at the time. When I tried to reason with him, he got scary on me like I was a Munson...
:crying:

Who the **** is big ern? Lol

Balltime
07-25-2017, 10:56 PM
This falls squarely on Lebron James. He want's to control everything from player personnel, style of play, control the media, he want's complete control of everything. Not every player is going to be appeased with his role on the team. Love, Bosh, how most of the star player's he had played with took a hit in the numbers (stats), never reached their peak.

Scoots
07-25-2017, 10:56 PM
I can't wait till after next year so we can all finally stop talking about the Cavs .

Sorry ... there's more than a year left on that conversation.

JordansBulls
07-25-2017, 10:57 PM
They should trade Lebron why they can. This is Kyrie's team, he was there first.

Gibby23
07-25-2017, 11:02 PM
They should trade Lebron why they can. This is Kyrie's team, he was there first.

Kyrie never led the Cavaliers to Home Court Advantage.

mightybosstone
07-26-2017, 12:08 AM
I don't think it's all on LeBron, but certainly he's not blameless. And the George trade was "botched" by Kyrie not being available for the trade. Gilbert is certainly to blame for a lot of it.

The majority of superstars in sports sign deals longer than 2 years ... and I understand that one possible reason for this was to keep Gilbert on his toes.

LeBron may or may not have lit the fire, but he hasn't done anything to put it out either.
Honestly, I would put the vast majority of this on Gilbert. Because he's likely the sole reason for Lebron's hesitation in the first place. If he wasn't such an egotistical douche and he had any clue how to run an NBA franchise, Lebron probably stays long-term.

LA_Raiders
07-26-2017, 12:25 AM
LA needs to stay away from LeDrama.

AllBall
07-26-2017, 01:13 AM
LA needs to stay away from LeDrama.

I'm pretty sure that Lebron and Magic are good friends, so brace yourselves.

Bostonjorge
07-26-2017, 01:38 AM
Cavs need to trade Irving or we are going to hear story's like James wanted to kick Irving's ***** true or not all offseason.

The players are going to have to pick a side if they keep Irving. Jefferson already came out and backed Irving. Pointed out how no one wants to wait around a year to see if James is leaving or not.

This Cavs team is finished. Irving and James have zero loyalty to Cleveland. Dan has zero loyalty to his GM's. Soon Cavs will have zero loyalty form its fans.

eDush
07-26-2017, 01:46 AM
LA needs to stay away from LeDrama.LeDrama has three syllables so it fails :down:

eDush
07-26-2017, 01:47 AM
Cavs need to trade Irving or we are going to hear story's like James wanted to kick Irving's ***** true or not all offseason.

The players are going to have to pick a side if they keep Irving. Jefferson already came out and backed Irving. Pointed out how no one wants to wait around a year to see if James is leaving or not.

This Cavs team is finished. Irving and James have zero loyalty to Cleveland. Dan has zero loyalty to his GM's. Soon Cavs will have zero loyalty form its fans.Dion already did that :nod:

mightybosstone
07-26-2017, 06:50 AM
They should trade Lebron why they can. This is Kyrie's team, he was there first.

Exept he literally wasn't and not a single person on the planet outside of maybe Kyrie thinks that it's Kyrie's team. :shrug:

europagnpilgrim
07-26-2017, 07:11 AM
They should trade Lebron why they can. This is Kyrie's team, he was there first.

2003 1st overall pick by his home state of Ohio says hello

Kyben36
07-26-2017, 09:01 AM
to be fair. let's not put the blame solely on LeBron and bring it back to the FO. does anyone here imagine kyrie gets any say in what happens to this team. I can imagine LeBron being consulted on any type of move. but kyrie. a super star player in his own. likely feels mistreated. especially when you begin to hear your name brought up in trade talk. despite the fact you could claim kyrie. was a major reason they won that tittle two years ago. I'm sure he feels same about the fan base too. I'm sure everyone but LeBron takes the blame for losses. but surely none of the equal credit when they win.

the fact is. LeBron takes soo much of the spotlight. and so much team concern. I don't blame kyrie for feeling like he should be the guy. or at least acnowledged as one. the team should have treated him as a key guy instead of dangling his name out their to make LeBron happy.

Kyben36
07-26-2017, 09:09 AM
Exept he literally wasn't and not a single person on the planet outside of maybe Kyrie thingks that it's Kyrie's team. :shrug:

does nobody see why with this attitude he would want to leave. I get it. LeBron is God. but your valuing a 32 year old with 14 seasons on his back over kyrie who is in his prime. you dangle kyrie to make a guy with maybe 2 or 3 more season left happy. and to be fair. I'm not sure if I'm the only one who noticed. but LeBron has really slowed down. he is no longer taking defensive asignments like he used to. essentially plays as a help man most of the time. he is getting old but Cleveland fans would rather live out his last days making sure he is as comphy as possible instead of looking to the . look. LeBron is going to leave fine. but to allianate other players. dangle them in trade. and expect the. to not be upset. maybe kyrie does not even want t to be the guy. but at least recognized as a key part of the core. hell draymond green gets more respect from his teammates LeBron gives kyrie

Kyben36
07-26-2017, 09:16 AM
Kyrie never led the Cavaliers to Home Court Advantage.

and LeBron would not have either without kyries help. it goes both ways. but everyone throw kyrie under he buss. FWIW. lebron did not till he was 6 seasons into the league. has kyrie reasonably gotten a chance to. I mean. prior to LeBron. sure they had loads of picks. but most would be considered bust.

funny. how people give LeBron a pass on loosing in 2009 due to having a ****** team. but can you name a player kyrie played with prior to LeBron returning that is even starting. closes one is Thompson who is far from any type of reliable option.

Kyben36
07-26-2017, 09:22 AM
Everything is Lebron's fault. He delivered on bringing a title back to CLE, but he is going to leave the city worse then before.

JR and Tristans ridiculous contracts are Lebron's fault. Kyrie wanting to leave is Lebron's fault.

Actually...

The Cavs self destructing is the Warriors fault, lol The Cavs are maxed out with bad contracts and no way of improving to beat GS. Lebron is a goner next season, Kyrie is a goner this season. At least Kevin Love will put up some monster numbers like his T Wolves days

Sorry for what the Warriors have done to you Cleveland :hide:

nobody talks about those contracts. but those can solely be placed on LeBron. I'm pretty sure he talked up guys like Thompson prior to contract talks and really said I want these guys back meaning all leverage was on thopsons camp. same with guys like shump and Jr. but now. they have two guys locked up under bad contracts cause LeBron needed help. the big is though. he could have had better help. but because of soo many bad contracts and aquirong guys like Frye. they can't sign quality FA are left with fillling out bench spots with guys like Williams and bogut. guys who really should not be on the floor

mightybosstone
07-26-2017, 09:27 AM
does nobody see why with this attitude he would want to leave. I get it. LeBron is God. but your valuing a 32 year old with 14 seasons on his back over kyrie who is in his prime. you dangle kyrie to make a guy with maybe 2 or 3 more season left happy. and to be fair. I'm not sure if I'm the only one who noticed. but LeBron has really slowed down. he is no longer taking defensive asignments like he used to. essentially plays as a help man most of the time. he is getting old but Cleveland fans would rather live out his last days making sure he is as comphy as possible instead of looking to the . look. LeBron is going to leave fine. but to allianate other players. dangle them in trade. and expect the. to not be upset. maybe kyrie does not even want t to be the guy. but at least recognized as a key part of the core. hell draymond green gets more respect from his teammates LeBron gives kyrie

The dude put up 33/9/8 in the playoffs last year. I don't care that he's 32. Until he shows some serious signs of decline, he's the guy you build around, not Kyrie. Kryie has proven on numerous occasions that he can't be the No. 1 on a team that wins the majority of its basketball games. And as incompetent as Cleveland's front office has been at times, I think they recognize that.

I get the whole "don't alienate your players by shopping them in potential trades" argument. But that's the league today. Players should know that, unless you're a top 10 player in the league (and even if you are), that's pretty much always going to be par for the course, and they ought to be tougher than that. As far as the respect that Lebron gives Kyrie, if this is how Kyrie acts, then maybe Lebron was right to not give the kid more respect in the first place. :shrug:

Kyben36
07-26-2017, 10:54 AM
The dude put up 33/9/8 in the playoffs last year. I don't care that he's 32. Until he shows some serious signs of decline, he's the guy you build around, not Kyrie. Kryie has proven on numerous occasions that he can't be the No. 1 on a team that wins the majority of its basketball games. And as incompetent as Cleveland's front office has been at times, I think they recognize that.

I get the whole "don't alienate your players by shopping them in potential trades" argument. But that's the league today. Players should know that, unless you're a top 10 player in the league (and even if you are), that's pretty much always going to be par for the course, and they ought to be tougher than that. As far as the respect that Lebron gives Kyrie, if this is how Kyrie acts, then maybe Lebron was right to not give the kid more respect in the first place. :shrug:

I'm sorry but to disrespect young stars for a guy who has proven already he will leave you. seems like a dumb idea. especially when LeBron is one year away from potentially bolting (which seems more likely if you loose a stud like kyrie ) you loose kyrie and you are. not close to a contender. I think people will realize that once he is gone. he deserves credit. and alienating him and offering him in trades is not the answer. it should be build around LeBron AND Kyrie. not LeBron at all cost. do what you can to improve. but you can do so while still grooming kyrie to take over.

the funny thing. this reminds me a ton of shaq vs kobe. and guese what. I would argue that while the Lakers traded a HOF catalyst like shaq (LeBron like player ) they realized that while they might get one or two more chances with shaq. they got anotber 6 years with kobe. and retooling around him. got 2 more championships out it.

short term yes shaq got a ring in Miami. but I would take those 6 to 8 years of kobe excitment and winning basketball over the obvious retool that is going to be coming for the Cavs in 2 years.

Vee-Rex
07-26-2017, 10:55 AM
he is getting old but Cleveland fans would rather live out his last days making sure he is as comphy as possible instead of looking to the .

Lol Cleveland fans just want to have a shot at winning for as long as possible, and LeBron gives us that - not Irving. We don't give a **** about how horrible/bleak the future may look - we've been through that fire plenty of times. It doesn't scare us.

I'm not mad at Irving. Even if he doesn't have the ability/leadership to be the #1 guy, he's an alpha who is struggling to be a beta.

Chronz
07-26-2017, 11:52 AM
Wait. Why does bron and bron alone have to commit beyond his contractual obligations?

BDawk4Prez
07-26-2017, 01:43 PM
Bron gonna Bron.

ewing
07-26-2017, 01:44 PM
Wait. Why does bron and bron alone have to commit beyond his contractual obligations?

b/c he is the only ******* that signs one deals or has an opt out every year that he uses to strong arm mgt, he is also the only guy who runs on teams that say **** the future we are going all in now and giving Bron whatever he wants

IKnowHoops
07-26-2017, 02:29 PM
Without lebron Cavs were at dumpster level.

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

Lol exactly. If you want to blame Bron for something, blame him for the championship. Without Bron Cleveland doesn't make playoffs, zero free agents come there, and most of all Vee-Rex wouldn't be a die hard Cleveland fan or would he have a single post regarding Cleveland basketball. So yes Brons presence not only gave Vee Rex a platform, but it gave Cleveland life.

IKnowHoops
07-26-2017, 02:34 PM
Who cares about disrespecting young stars who can't get you into the playoffs? Of course you side with the guy who guarantees you get to the finals.

LaVar Ball
07-26-2017, 02:34 PM
Wait. Why does bron and bron alone have to commit beyond his contractual obligations?

Why not?

It can be said that amongst the greatest players in NBA history, LeBron is the one among all the others who looked out for his own brand way above and beyond the brand of the organization. To me, it has become clear that LeBron is all about the name on the back and never about the name on the front of the jersey. Keeping not just a franchise but also his teammates and a city of fans in limbo from year to year and keeping them on the edge of their seats to me is selfish, self-serving and downright disrespectful. Year after year it becomes more about the man's status of which team he's going to rather than the play on the court.

ewing
07-26-2017, 02:38 PM
Why not?

It can be said that amongst the greatest players in NBA history, LeBron is the one among all the others who looked out for his own brand way above and beyond the brand of the organization. To me, it has become clear that LeBron is all about the name on the back and never about the name on the front of the jersey. Keeping not just a franchise but also his teammates and a city of fans in limbo from year to year and keeping them on the edge of their seats to me is selfish, self-serving and downright disrespectful. Year after year it becomes more about the man's status of which team he's going to rather than the play on the court.

this guy knows what's up

AllBall
07-26-2017, 02:41 PM
Why not?

It can be said that amongst the greatest players in NBA history, LeBron is the one among all the others who looked out for his own brand way above and beyond the brand of the organization. To me, it has become clear that LeBron is all about the name on the back and never about the name on the front of the jersey. Keeping not just a franchise but also his teammates and a city of fans in limbo from year to year and keeping them on the edge of their seats to me is selfish, self-serving and downright disrespectful. Year after year it becomes more about the man's status of which team he's going to rather than the play on the court.

He just tying to get that Neymar plan.

Hawkeye15
07-26-2017, 02:45 PM
I disagree with this. Of course GS is the favorite but cant an injury or move put Clev right back at the top. They were dropping 50 point quarters in the finals. seems like another LeBron generation narrative

I think you constantly underrate how good GS is. Remove Durant, and it's still the most talented team in the NBA. So a single injury would just knock them back to one of the 2-3 real contenders. No injuries, and they are basically unbeatable, or as close as it gets in sports.

I know you want to make sure and believe LeBron has a fair chance, and he did. But those days are over, as our everyone else's, until bad things happen to GS. Now, history has shown us nothing last forever, but until greed, injury, or chemistry issues start flying, GS isn't losing.

Vee-Rex
07-26-2017, 02:47 PM
b/c he is the only ******* that signs one deals or has an opt out every year that he uses to strong arm mgt, he is also the only guy who runs on teams that say **** the future we are going all in now and giving Bron whatever he wants

I'm pretty sure he only did that once. He had a 3-year deal and a 4-year deal for his 1st stint in Cleveland, and a 4-year deal in Miami.

In 2014 he signed a 1+1 deal - the only time he ever did that, and the world knew it was because of the new tv contract. I mean sure you had rabid/idiotic people guaranteeing LeBron was gonna leave Cleveland after just one year despite a finals appearance in which we came just 2 games short while missing our 2nd and 3rd best players, but the logical ones knew he was coming back and that the terms of his contract was just to enable him to cash in on more money.

In 2016 he signed a 2+1 deal.

Jordan gets absolutely no heat for his 1-year contracts after his return from his 1st retirement. Chicago was having its own front office issues with a power struggle between Phil Jackson and his superiors. But of course, it was no big deal. Now we have LeBron who will end his career as a legend, a historic/generational talent that can be compared to Jordan, and he gets an unprecedented amount of hate for having his hand (whether we like it or not) in impacting decisions.

Again, I wish LeBron would stop the little catty/pathetic tweets. I wish LeBron would commit long-term. Even though Gilbert should take the majority of the blame for this trainwreck of an offseason, LeBron's not completely blameless at all. But at the end of the day I'm not gonna crucify him and sacrifice the hearts of my children in hatred to the man.

eDush
07-26-2017, 02:49 PM
Who cares about disrespecting young stars who can't get you into the playoffs? Of course you side with the guy who guarantees you get to the finals.And it looks more like Kyrie disrespected his mentor who took him under his wing and made him a better teammates and a winner by deflecting his weaknesses and this is how he thank him? His mentor also got rid of his former teammate who punch him in the face for trying to be the man before. http://thebiglead.com/2013/11/19/dion-waiters-said-he-didnt-give-kyrie-irving-a-black-eye-and-break-his-nose-in-a-fight/

I don't blame Lebron for wanting to beat his *** if true since he hasn't learn and wants to be the man again :nod:

Vee-Rex
07-26-2017, 02:50 PM
Lol exactly. If you want to blame Bron for something, blame him for the championship. Without Bron Cleveland doesn't make playoffs, zero free agents come there, and most of all Vee-Rex wouldn't be a die hard Cleveland fan or would he have a single post regarding Cleveland basketball. So yes Brons presence not only gave Vee Rex a platform, but it gave Cleveland life.

I love your obsession with me, but I ended your life in the other thread. Are you really back for more? :laugh2:

eDush
07-26-2017, 02:58 PM
b/c he is the only ******* that signs one deals or has an opt out every year that he uses to strong arm mgt, he is also the only guy who runs on teams that say **** the future we are going all in now and giving Bron whatever he wants

I'm pretty sure he only did that once. He had a 3-year deal and a 4-year deal for his 1st stint in Cleveland, and a 4-year deal in Miami.

In 2014 he signed a 1+1 deal - the only time he ever did that, and the world knew it was because of the new tv contract. I mean sure you had rabid/idiotic people guaranteeing LeBron was gonna leave Cleveland after just one year despite a finals appearance in which we came just 2 games short while missing our 2nd and 3rd best players, but the logical ones knew he was coming back and that the terms of his contract was just to enable him to cash in on more money.

In 2016 he signed a 2+1 deal.

Jordan gets absolutely no heat for his 1-year contracts after his return from his 1st retirement. Chicago was having its own front office issues with a power struggle between Phil Jackson and his superiors. But of course, it was no big deal. Now we have LeBron who will end his career as a legend, a historic/generational talent that can be compared to Jordan, and he gets an unprecedented amount of hate for having his hand (whether we like it or not) in impacting decisions.

Again, I wish LeBron would stop the little catty/pathetic tweets. I wish LeBron would commit long-term. Even though Gilbert should take the majority of the blame for this trainwreck of an offseason, LeBron's not completely blameless at all. But at the end of the day I'm not gonna crucify him and sacrifice the hearts of my children in hatred to the man.I wouldn't if I was Lebron otherwise that owner will continue to make goof ball moves he wants without worrying that his prized money making player will leave. This gives Lebron the leverage he needs as the greatest player the Cavs ever had and for the entire state of Ohio. I don't trust your owner one bit but I trust Lebron and always will... :nod:

ewing
07-26-2017, 03:23 PM
I think you constantly underrate how good GS is. Remove Durant, and it's still the most talented team in the NBA. So a single injury would just knock them back to one of the 2-3 real contenders. No injuries, and they are basically unbeatable, or as close as it gets in sports.

I know you want to make sure and believe LeBron has a fair chance, and he did. But those days are over, as our everyone else's, until bad things happen to GS. Now, history has shown us nothing last forever, but until greed, injury, or chemistry issues start flying, GS isn't losing.

To be the man you have to beat the man

Jamiecballer
07-26-2017, 03:27 PM
Wait. Why does bron and bron alone have to commit beyond his contractual obligations?It's the same reason guys like KD have to sign only with teams that are good, I think.

Sent from my SM-T530NU using Tapatalk

eDush
07-26-2017, 03:40 PM
I think you constantly underrate how good GS is. Remove Durant, and it's still the most talented team in the NBA. So a single injury would just knock them back to one of the 2-3 real contenders. No injuries, and they are basically unbeatable, or as close as it gets in sports.

I know you want to make sure and believe LeBron has a fair chance, and he did. But those days are over, as our everyone else's, until bad things happen to GS. Now, history has shown us nothing last forever, but until greed, injury, or chemistry issues start flying, GS isn't losing.

To be the man you have to beat the manThat is true but no singer player on Warriors is the man nor do they want to be but the team and players are in consensus that Steph should be the man and wants him to get the supermax to signify to outsiders he is it but in reality and internally, no one is really the man as they play and sacrifice as a team to reach their goals as champions :clap:

It's the Dubs way!!!! :cheer:

:dance:

eDush
07-26-2017, 03:44 PM
Wait. Why does bron and bron alone have to commit beyond his contractual obligations?It's the same reason guys like KD have to sign only with teams that are good, I think.

Sent from my SM-T530NU using TapatalkIts not the same reason and if you can't see the difference, then you never will :(

Hawkeye15
07-26-2017, 03:56 PM
To be the man you have to beat the man

basketball isn't tennis. Teams win. No team is beating GS. No matter who they have, past or present, in place of LeBron James.

ewing
07-26-2017, 04:27 PM
basketball isn't tennis. Teams win. No team is beating GS. No matter who they have, past or present, in place of LeBron James.

i'm positive said the same thing in 04 before the Piston/Lakers series just with LA instead of GS

Hawkeye15
07-26-2017, 04:35 PM
i'm positive said the same thing in 04 before the Piston/Lakers series just with LA instead of GS

as I said, it will take major injury/chemistry/greed to disrupt what they have (anything can happen). And GS is easily more talented than the Lakers dynasty as well. Not since Russell's Celtics, has a team been this talented, when talking about number of all NBA and all star players all in their peaks. Then toss in the finals MVP from 2 years ago off the bench. It's just stupid dude. Makes it not even that interesting to watch the standings.

Vee-Rex
07-26-2017, 04:59 PM
as I said, it will take major injury/chemistry/greed to disrupt what they have (anything can happen). And GS is easily more talented than the Lakers dynasty as well. Not since Russell's Celtics, has a team been this talented, when talking about number of all NBA and all star players all in their peaks. Then toss in the finals MVP from 2 years ago off the bench. It's just stupid dude. Makes it not even that interesting to watch the standings.

It looks grim, but all it takes is for another contender to play/shoot out of their minds and for the Warriors to shoot badly for a series to go 6 or 7 games.

Obviously I can't say this with absolute certainty, but I think anyone can reasonably conclude that the Spurs would've been up 1-0 on the Warriors had they remained healthy, and who knows, that series could've went 6 or 7 games as a result. And the Spurs weren't shooting out of their minds either, they were simply putting a beatdown on the Warriors.

Have faith. Don't be miserable, but join me in happily rooting for their downfall. I'll throw out some memes to make you feel better if you want. :D

ewing
07-26-2017, 05:00 PM
as I said, it will take major injury/chemistry/greed to disrupt what they have (anything can happen). And GS is easily more talented than the Lakers dynasty as well. Not since Russell's Celtics, has a team been this talented, when talking about number of all NBA and all star players all in their peaks. Then toss in the finals MVP from 2 years ago off the bench. It's just stupid dude. Makes it not even that interesting to watch the standings.

If you want the ultimate, you've got to be willing to pay the ultimate price. It's not tragic to die doing what you love.


know what i'm saying?

ewing
07-26-2017, 05:01 PM
It looks grim, but all it takes is for another contender to play/shoot out of their minds and for the Warriors to shoot badly for a series to go 6 or 7 games.

Obviously I can't say this with absolute certainty, but I think anyone can reasonably conclude that the Spurs would've been up 1-0 on the Warriors had they remained healthy, and who knows, that series could've went 6 or 7 games as a result. And the Spurs weren't shooting out of their minds either, they were simply putting a beatdown on the Warriors.

Have faith. Don't be miserable, but join me in happily rooting for their downfall. I'll throw out some memes to make you feel better if you want. :D

do it

Hawkeye15
07-26-2017, 05:02 PM
If you want the ultimate, you've got to be willing to pay the ultimate price. It's not tragic to die doing what you love.


know what i'm saying?

I mean, I live my entire life by what Bodhi says, so yea

Hawkeye15
07-26-2017, 05:04 PM
It looks grim, but all it takes is for another contender to play/shoot out of their minds and for the Warriors to shoot badly for a series to go 6 or 7 games.

Obviously I can't say this with absolute certainty, but I think anyone can reasonably conclude that the Spurs would've been up 1-0 on the Warriors had they remained healthy, and who knows, that series could've went 6 or 7 games as a result. And the Spurs weren't shooting out of their minds either, they were simply putting a beatdown on the Warriors.

Have faith. Don't be miserable, but join me in happily rooting for their downfall. I'll throw out some memes to make you feel better if you want. :D

it looks very grim. But, nothing lasts forever. I am hoping a team finds a matchup issue heavily in their favor, and can have the interchangeable defense to make life harder for GS. And I still think being physical with the Warriors is an absolute must.

But, it looks grim..

LaVar Ball
07-26-2017, 05:12 PM
I just watched the press conference of Gilbert and Koby Altman. Straight out BS and lying through their teeths. Both hesitated in being asked if Kyrie would be there in training camp. Also Gilbert was speechless for the first 5 seconds when asked if LeBron will want to come back next summer. The Cavs are a sinking ship and I can't wait to see both guys gone from that God forsaken franchise and ownership.

LaVar Ball
07-26-2017, 05:14 PM
I also saw the contrast between Cavs Management and Lakers Management. Cavs management is arguing the fact that Kolby Altman is well respected within their organization, while Magic and Pelinka in every one of their press conferences go out of their ways to create rapport and good relationship building not just within their own organization, but also with players, agents, and executives and figureheads around the entire league. Magic and Rob's goals are to be well respected league-wide.

When asked about the Pacers situation with Paul George, Gilbert just had to get it in there that 'they could have gotten a better deal". A shot at Pritchard and the Pacers organization. So much for good rapport and relationship building Gilbert. You just don't come out and say that and bury another organization like that. It will affect future deals and negotiations. Dumb will always remain dumb.

Vee-Rex
07-26-2017, 05:20 PM
I just watched the press conference of Gilbert and Koby Altman. Straight out BS and lying through their teeths. Both hesitated in being asked if Kyrie would be there in training camp. Also Gilbert was speechless for the first 5 seconds when asked if LeBron will want to come back next summer. The Cavs are a sinking ship and I can't wait to see both guys gone from that God forsaken franchise and ownership.

Damn I meant to listen to that live. Came on at 4pm and I completely forgot about it.

Scoots
07-27-2017, 03:01 PM
Kinda funny that the Cavs can't get Irving to answer when they call ... supposedly they haven't been in contact at all since he told them to trade him.

And we found out that Rose didn't choose the Cavs, he got rejected everywhere else. That is a harsh wake up call for Rose.

Vee-Rex
07-27-2017, 03:10 PM
Kinda funny that the Cavs can't get Irving to answer when they call ... supposedly they haven't been in contact at all since he told them to trade him.

And we found out that Rose didn't choose the Cavs, he got rejected everywhere else. That is a harsh wake up call for Rose.

Also, apparently LeBron is actively recruiting and has been all along for the Cavs and helped get Rose here.

These reports are just wild - don't know what to believe at this point.

Scoots
07-27-2017, 03:49 PM
Also, apparently LeBron is actively recruiting and has been all along for the Cavs and helped get Rose here.

These reports are just wild - don't know what to believe at this point.

Yeah, I heard that he just wanted to be left alone by the team and that he was recruiting Rose hard. Then to hear that Rose had essentially no other options with a winning team? Who knows anymore.

SAS was a LeBron "insider" and that's where the "beat his ***" comment came from so it could be true. Of course once LeBron gets criticized by people who don't understand he doesn't mean it literally he has to walk it back and say #notfacts ... this is surreal.

LeBron should get off social media and just stay off. He's not good at it.

AllBall
07-27-2017, 04:34 PM
All this confusion is a result of Lebron's camp running the circus. They want a say in all the FO decisions. They leak information to the media left and right. They don't know how to stay on message and many times leak things against Lebron's wishes. This is the reason that the HEAT didn't allow Lebron and his homeboys to do anything. They were irresponsible brats that don't know what to do with power. They huffed and they puffed and had to take their *** back to Cleveland where pushover Gilbert would bend to their every whim.

LaVar Ball
07-27-2017, 05:49 PM
All this confusion is a result of Lebron's camp running the circus. They want a say in all the FO decisions. They leak information to the media left and right. They don't know how to stay on message and many times leak things against Lebron's wishes. This is the reason that the HEAT didn't allow Lebron and his homeboys to do anything. They were irresponsible brats that don't know what to do with power. They huffed and they puffed and had to take their *** back to Cleveland where pushover Gilbert would bend to their every whim.

All the more reasons why he won't be a Laker next summer. Magic (a Riley guy) will not allow LeBron and his brand to dominate the Laker brand.

COOLbeans
07-27-2017, 07:01 PM
All this confusion is a result of Lebron's camp running the circus. They want a say in all the FO decisions. They leak information to the media left and right. They don't know how to stay on message and many times leak things against Lebron's wishes. This is the reason that the HEAT didn't allow Lebron and his homeboys to do anything. They were irresponsible brats that don't know what to do with power. They huffed and they puffed and had to take their *** back to Cleveland where pushover Gilbert would bend to their every whim.

Lebron is the Trump of the NBA

LeTrump :cool:

Bostonjorge
07-27-2017, 07:19 PM
All we now for sure is

KYRIE HATES LEBRON

Chronz
07-28-2017, 07:56 PM
b/c he is the only ******* that signs one deals or has an opt out every year that he uses to strong arm mgt, he is also the only guy who runs on teams that say **** the future we are going all in now and giving Bron whatever he wants

Even if you had a point about the ******* part your argument remains dog doodoo. Those teamsLOVE doing things to appease him and you're wrong about his contracts. He's actually been more loyal than he should have imo. Mj n Kobe wouldn't have stuck it out that's for sure.

Chronz
07-28-2017, 07:57 PM
Lebron is the Trump of the NBA

LeTrump :cool:
The media hasn't done **** for Trump tho. Media misinforms in general too

Chronz
07-28-2017, 08:03 PM
To be the man you have to beat the man
But it's a TEAM not a MAN.

To use your expression. LeBron beat the man (73win defending champs), then the man you beat exchanged his Human parts for robo gear n tossed out the genitals for good measure.. Point being, its no longer man

Chronz
07-28-2017, 08:08 PM
Why not?

It can be said that amongst the greatest players in NBA history, LeBron is the one among all the others who looked out for his own brand way above and beyond the brand of the organization. To me, it has become clear that LeBron is all about the name on the back and never about the name on the front of the jersey. Keeping not just a franchise but also his teammates and a city of fans in limbo from year to year and keeping them on the edge of their seats to me is selfish, self-serving and downright disrespectful. Year after year it becomes more about the man's status of which team he's going to rather than the play on the court.
Based on what tho?

eDush
07-29-2017, 01:20 AM
To be the man you have to beat the man
But it's a TEAM not a MAN.

To use your expression. LeBron beat the man (73win defending champs), then the man you beat exchanged his Human parts for robo gear n tossed out the genitals for good measure.. Point being, its no longer manIt's a figure of speech, not that physical nature of the gender, you dumb*** :pity:

ewing
07-29-2017, 11:32 AM
But it's a TEAM not a MAN.

To use your expression. LeBron beat the man (73win defending champs), then the man you beat exchanged his Human parts for robo gear n tossed out the genitals for good measure.. Point being, its no longer man

cant even learn from Ric Flair :pity:

eDush
07-29-2017, 11:58 AM
Lebron is a man of a mans :nod:

ewing
07-29-2017, 02:02 PM
Lebron is a man of a mans :nod:

What


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eDush
07-29-2017, 02:06 PM
Lebron is a man of a mans :nod:

What


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He is a man of mans. Like the king of kings. If a figure of speech :nod:

Scoots
07-29-2017, 02:10 PM
"man of mans" is NOT a figure of speech

https://media.giphy.com/media/i1JSXl0MfeRd6/giphy.gif

LaVar Ball
07-29-2017, 02:16 PM
Based on what tho?

Huh?

eDush
07-29-2017, 02:24 PM
Yes it is....a Man's man is not. There is a difference :nod:

LaVar Ball
07-29-2017, 06:19 PM
Ayesha Curry is a real man's man. 😉

ewing
07-29-2017, 06:35 PM
Yes it is....a Man's man is not. There is a difference :nod:

sorry didn't get the joke at first


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IKnowHoops
07-29-2017, 08:46 PM
I love your obsession with me, but I ended your life in the other thread. Are you really back for more? :laugh2:

End my life? You exposed yourself as a hypocrite.

Call me out for posting in Wolves forum after KAT

Yet you only post in Cavs forum after Bron returns

You committed suicide

ewing
07-29-2017, 10:34 PM
End my life? You exposed yourself as a hypocrite.

Call me out for posting in Wolves forum after KAT

Yet you only post in Cavs forum after Bron returns

You committed suicide


VX actually know hoops though

IKnowHoops
07-30-2017, 01:25 PM
VX actually know hoops though

Why hang on another man's loins though? Can't trust the word of that guy.

ewing
07-30-2017, 01:44 PM
Why hang on another man's loins though? Can't trust the word of that guy.

Are talking about VX or yourself?


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Vee-Rex
07-30-2017, 03:17 PM
End my life? You exposed yourself as a hypocrite.

Call me out for posting in Wolves forum after KAT

Yet you only post in Cavs forum after Bron returns

You committed suicide

I already showed a link showing a post from before LeBron returned.

Since then I've found more of my pre-Lebron posts the Cavs forum. If you agree to never post again on this site (or in the very least, stfu about this off topic nonsense and obsession you keep reviving with me) then I'll backhand you with those links.

eDush
08-02-2017, 06:20 AM
End my life? You exposed yourself as a hypocrite.

Call me out for posting in Wolves forum after KAT

Yet you only post in Cavs forum after Bron returns

You committed suicide

I already showed a link showing a post from before LeBron returned.

Since then I've found more of my pre-Lebron posts the Cavs forum. If you agree to never post again on this site (or in the very least, stfu about this off topic nonsense and obsession you keep reviving with me) then I'll backhand you with those links.I think I seen some but I can't vouch if true so I only have your word as a Cavs fan :nod:

IKnowHoops
08-02-2017, 03:22 PM
Are talking about VX or yourself?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You...hanging on V-Rex's

IKnowHoops
08-02-2017, 03:25 PM
I already showed a link showing a post from before LeBron returned.

Since then I've found more of my pre-Lebron posts the Cavs forum. If you agree to never post again on this site (or in the very least, stfu about this off topic nonsense and obsession you keep reviving with me) then I'll backhand you with those links.

Wow "A" post. I can find more than "A" post from me before KAT. Before you go patting yourself on the back for "A" post, you may want to take a step back and punch yourself in the face...but your already doing that.

Vee-Rex
08-02-2017, 03:37 PM
Wow "A" post. I can find more than "A" post from me before KAT. Before you go patting yourself on the back for "A" post, you may want to take a step back and punch yourself in the face...but your already doing that.

Again, I will show multiple posts if you agree to STFU. Agree?

FlashBolt
08-02-2017, 04:34 PM
This thread turned from a Cavs dysfunction discussion thread to a IKH and Vee-Rex dysfunction thread.

Vee-Rex
08-02-2017, 05:03 PM
This thread turned from a Cavs dysfunction discussion thread to a IKH and Vee-Rex dysfunction thread.

No kidding.

I'm about to put it to rest and put 'em out, though. Any further posts from IKH towards me on that topic will be trolling, and I will report them.

Vee-Rex
08-02-2017, 05:10 PM
And yeah ur upset cause u don't have a Cavs post while Bron was in Miami. Your a hypocritical bum. A pure joke of a human being. Show us a Cavs post sucker.

Where the hell were you when a Bron was in Miami? Would love to see a Cleveland post from you then lmfao!

Wow "A" post. I can find more than "A" post from me before KAT. Before you go patting yourself on the back for "A" post, you may want to take a step back and punch yourself in the face...but your already doing that.

As I said before, I did a ton of lurking/reading earlier on. But here's several posts related to the Cavs during LeBron's time in Miami. They're dated:

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?786468-2013-NBA-Draft/page53 (May 2013)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?786468-2013-NBA-Draft/page60 (June 2013)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?828594-Where-will-Cleveland-stand/page6 (July 2013)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?852571-2014-NBA-Draft/page30 (May 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?852571-2014-NBA-Draft/page92 (June 2014)

And if you question my Cleveland sports fandom, here's posts related to the BROWNS (I'm a huge football fan):

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?716052-Cleveland-Browns-General-Discussion-Thread/page26 (October 2012)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?716052-Cleveland-Browns-General-Discussion-Thread/page27 (October 2012) 2 posts

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?861472-Quotes-Regarding-FO-amp-FO-Changes (Apr 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?878845-Week-9-Buccaneers-Brownies (Nov 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?875419-New-Orleans-Saints-Cleveland-Browns-Week-2-(HOME-OPENER) (Sept 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?898107-2015-Regular-Season (Sept 2015)

It should go without saying that if I'm an enormous fan of a franchise (Browns) that hasn't been relevant in 20 years, I would have no problem rooting for the Cavs w/o LeBron.

My posts DID spike when LeBron returned to Cleveland, primarily because:

1. Excitement
2. Waaaay more Cavs-related topics in the main forum.

From there on, I definitely became a regular poster.

On the other hand, you've been a huge Heat fan, then switched to the Cavs when LeBron returned (I saw your posts saturating our forums in July 2014), and now you're a Spurs fan and you're trying to sneak onto the T-Wolves bandwagon since they got KAT.

Just stop it. I consider this topic over and done with and, as I said before, if you continue to obsess with me across multiple threads regarding it, then feel free to get reported. I presume this should make you stfu about it for good.

LaVar Ball
08-02-2017, 06:25 PM
This is all Anderson Varejao's fault.

**** that guy!

Romeo Naes
08-03-2017, 08:08 PM
This is all Anderson Varejao's fault.

**** that guy!

Lol.

Romeo Naes
08-03-2017, 08:09 PM
The Cavs are a crazy organization. Dan Gilbert is definitely a real big tool bag.

Romeo Naes
08-03-2017, 08:15 PM
I'm not a LeBron "hater" ... I can see that he's one of the greatest players ever to play the game.

But pretty much everything going wrong in Cleveland can be dropped right at his feet.

Gilbert gets the blame for Griffin I think.

It looks like LeBron wants out, everyone seems to know it, but he's maneuvering his way to having the fans blame Gilbert, blame Kyrie, blame KD, etc.

Does anybody believe LeBron was "shocked" and "blindsided" by the things happening this off-season when fans were not? We knew Gilbert had never extended a GM and Griffin hadn't worked out a new deal despite trying a year ago to get an extension. We knew Kyrie was unhappy and talking about trades months ago. Billups said "no" because LeBron didn't offer any support. LeBron, who can be a great recruiter when he wants to be did nothing this offseason to improve the team.

It sure looks like it's the worlds worst kept secret that LeBron wants to build his 3rd super team with Magic in LA. He was even courtside cheering Lonzo in summer league ... I didn't watch them all, but I didn't see him courtside for the 2 Cavs summer league games I watched.

LeBron is the most powerful man in the NBA ... and I can't help but think things are going the way he wants them to go.

You can still be a great player and a tool bag at the same time lol. I can give plenty of example if need be.

eDush
08-05-2017, 11:47 AM
I'm not a LeBron "hater" ... I can see that he's one of the greatest players ever to play the game.

But pretty much everything going wrong in Cleveland can be dropped right at his feet.

Gilbert gets the blame for Griffin I think.

It looks like LeBron wants out, everyone seems to know it, but he's maneuvering his way to having the fans blame Gilbert, blame Kyrie, blame KD, etc.

Does anybody believe LeBron was "shocked" and "blindsided" by the things happening this off-season when fans were not? We knew Gilbert had never extended a GM and Griffin hadn't worked out a new deal despite trying a year ago to get an extension. We knew Kyrie was unhappy and talking about trades months ago. Billups said "no" because LeBron didn't offer any support. LeBron, who can be a great recruiter when he wants to be did nothing this offseason to improve the team.

It sure looks like it's the worlds worst kept secret that LeBron wants to build his 3rd super team with Magic in LA. He was even courtside cheering Lonzo in summer league ... I didn't watch them all, but I didn't see him courtside for the 2 Cavs summer league games I watched.

LeBron is the most powerful man in the NBA ... and I can't help but think things are going the way he wants them to go.

You can still be a great player and a tool bag at the same time lol. I can give plenty of example if need be.He's just a Bron hater...simple as that :(

prodigy
08-05-2017, 12:40 PM
As I said before, I did a ton of lurking/reading earlier on. But here's several posts related to the Cavs during LeBron's time in Miami. They're dated:

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?786468-2013-NBA-Draft/page53 (May 2013)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?786468-2013-NBA-Draft/page60 (June 2013)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?828594-Where-will-Cleveland-stand/page6 (July 2013)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?852571-2014-NBA-Draft/page30 (May 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?852571-2014-NBA-Draft/page92 (June 2014)

And if you question my Cleveland sports fandom, here's posts related to the BROWNS (I'm a huge football fan):

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?716052-Cleveland-Browns-General-Discussion-Thread/page26 (October 2012)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?716052-Cleveland-Browns-General-Discussion-Thread/page27 (October 2012) 2 posts

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?861472-Quotes-Regarding-FO-amp-FO-Changes (Apr 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?878845-Week-9-Buccaneers-Brownies (Nov 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?875419-New-Orleans-Saints-Cleveland-Browns-Week-2-(HOME-OPENER) (Sept 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?898107-2015-Regular-Season (Sept 2015)

It should go without saying that if I'm an enormous fan of a franchise (Browns) that hasn't been relevant in 20 years, I would have no problem rooting for the Cavs w/o LeBron.

My posts DID spike when LeBron returned to Cleveland, primarily because:

1. Excitement
2. Waaaay more Cavs-related topics in the main forum.

From there on, I definitely became a regular poster.

On the other hand, you've been a huge Heat fan, then switched to the Cavs when LeBron returned (I saw your posts saturating our forums in July 2014), and now you're a Spurs fan and you're trying to sneak onto the T-Wolves bandwagon since they got KAT.

Just stop it. I consider this topic over and done with and, as I said before, if you continue to obsess with me across multiple threads regarding it, then feel free to get reported. I presume this should make you stfu about it for good.

Someones questioning ur fanhood? I've seen Vee-rex in Cleveland sports forums for years now lol. Don't let the new warrior fans get to ya man. not even worth it.

prodigy
08-05-2017, 12:45 PM
The Cavs are a crazy organization. Dan Gilbert is definitely a real big tool bag.

Yet any fan would/should demand an owner like him. He has one goal and thats to win. Not many owners in sports u can say that about. Always been very respectful to the fans and talks to them often. sits with the broadcasters handful of times throughout the year and is down to earth and has me dieing with the stuff he says.

Most people from the outside only knows what ESPN tells them which is .0003% truth. Gilbert is a guy whos very passionate and speaks his mind.

IKnowHoops
08-05-2017, 01:29 PM
As I said before, I did a ton of lurking/reading earlier on. But here's several posts related to the Cavs during LeBron's time in Miami. They're dated:

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?786468-2013-NBA-Draft/page53 (May 2013)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?786468-2013-NBA-Draft/page60 (June 2013)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?828594-Where-will-Cleveland-stand/page6 (July 2013)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?852571-2014-NBA-Draft/page30 (May 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?852571-2014-NBA-Draft/page92 (June 2014)

And if you question my Cleveland sports fandom, here's posts related to the BROWNS (I'm a huge football fan):

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?716052-Cleveland-Browns-General-Discussion-Thread/page26 (October 2012)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?716052-Cleveland-Browns-General-Discussion-Thread/page27 (October 2012) 2 posts

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?861472-Quotes-Regarding-FO-amp-FO-Changes (Apr 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?878845-Week-9-Buccaneers-Brownies (Nov 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?875419-New-Orleans-Saints-Cleveland-Browns-Week-2-(HOME-OPENER) (Sept 2014)

http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/showthread.php?898107-2015-Regular-Season (Sept 2015)

It should go without saying that if I'm an enormous fan of a franchise (Browns) that hasn't been relevant in 20 years, I would have no problem rooting for the Cavs w/o LeBron.

My posts DID spike when LeBron returned to Cleveland, primarily because:

1. Excitement
2. Waaaay more Cavs-related topics in the main forum.

From there on, I definitely became a regular poster.

On the other hand, you've been a huge Heat fan, then switched to the Cavs when LeBron returned (I saw your posts saturating our forums in July 2014), and now you're a Spurs fan and you're trying to sneak onto the T-Wolves bandwagon since they got KAT.

Just stop it. I consider this topic over and done with and, as I said before, if you continue to obsess with me across multiple threads regarding it, then feel free to get reported. I presume this should make you stfu about it for good.

This guy.

You came out of nowhere calling me out for doing the exact same thing as you. Yeah I got plenty of posts.

Then you run away threatening to report me when I expose you as such.

This is def a first, haven't run into a poster like you yet. Pathetic.

valade16
08-05-2017, 01:48 PM
b/c he is the only ******* that signs one deals or has an opt out every year that he uses to strong arm mgt, he is also the only guy who runs on teams that say **** the future we are going all in now and giving Bron whatever he wants

Is he?

http://articles.latimes.com/1996-07-13/sports/sp-23758_1_jordan

When MJ returned he signed 3 consecutive 1 year contracts to force the Bulls to keep the guys MJ wanted like Scottie and Phil and Rodman. This prevented the Bulls from planning or making any moves with the future in mind, which is why when MJ retired in 98 the Bulls fell off a cliff and had no assets or players to build for the future and no plan.

FlashBolt
08-05-2017, 02:19 PM
Is he?

http://articles.latimes.com/1996-07-13/sports/sp-23758_1_jordan

When MJ returned he signed 3 consecutive 1 year contracts to force the Bulls to keep the guys MJ wanted like Scottie and Phil and Rodman. This prevented the Bulls from planning or making any moves with the future in mind, which is why when MJ retired in 98 the Bulls fell off a cliff and had no assets or players to build for the future and no plan.

Don't forget Jordan was the one who axed the deal for T-Mac in exchange for Pippen.

Vee-Rex
08-05-2017, 11:07 PM
This guy.

You came out of nowhere calling me out for doing the exact same thing as you. Yeah I got plenty of posts.

Then you run away threatening to report me when I expose you as such.

This is def a first, haven't run into a poster like you yet. Pathetic.

"Would love to see a Cleveland post from you then lmfao!"

"Show us a Cavs post sucker."

How does that backhand feel? :laugh2:

ewing
08-06-2017, 08:40 AM
Is he?

http://articles.latimes.com/1996-07-13/sports/sp-23758_1_jordan

When MJ returned he signed 3 consecutive 1 year contracts to force the Bulls to keep the guys MJ wanted like Scottie and Phil and Rodman. This prevented the Bulls from planning or making any moves with the future in mind, which is why when MJ retired in 98 the Bulls fell off a cliff and had no assets or players to build for the future and no plan.

He never lost in the finals after getting everything he asked for then bolted though


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cmellofan15
08-06-2017, 09:31 AM
This guy.

You came out of nowhere calling me out for doing the exact same thing as you. Yeah I got plenty of posts.

Then you run away threatening to report me when I expose you as such.

This is def a first, haven't run into a poster like you yet. Pathetic.

Dude give it up. He already shut you down in two other instances now you're just nitpicking anything he says to try not to look like a loser.

valade16
08-06-2017, 12:05 PM
He never lost in the finals after getting everything he asked for then bolted though

Depends on what you mean by bolted, he left the Bulls in the midst of their championship windown in 1993/1994 then left them again in 1998. In both instances he wasn't truly done with Basketball (as we saw by him returning twice). In fact, he was gone from Chicago by retiring for more time than LeBron was gone from Cleveland by going to Miami.

But to clarify, is it Bron/MJ's behavior you have the problem with, or is it the behavior and not winning in Bron's case?

Scoots
08-06-2017, 01:01 PM
Depends on what you mean by bolted, he left the Bulls in the midst of their championship windown in 1993/1994 then left them again in 1998. In both instances he wasn't truly done with Basketball (as we saw by him returning twice). In fact, he was gone from Chicago by retiring for more time than LeBron was gone from Cleveland by going to Miami.

But to clarify, is it Bron/MJ's behavior you have the problem with, or is it the behavior and not winning in Bron's case?

I like the idea that the first time he "retired" was a secret NBA suspension.

valade16
08-06-2017, 01:48 PM
I like the idea that the first time he "retired" was a secret NBA suspension.

That's one of my favorite conspiracies. I can easily believe that.

ewing
08-07-2017, 08:20 AM
Depends on what you mean by bolted, he left the Bulls in the midst of their championship windown in 1993/1994 then left them again in 1998. In both instances he wasn't truly done with Basketball (as we saw by him returning twice). In fact, he was gone from Chicago by retiring for more time than LeBron was gone from Cleveland by going to Miami.

But to clarify, is it Bron/MJ's behavior you have the problem with, or is it the behavior and not winning in Bron's case?

Its leaving one, two, going on 3 top tier teams when mgt has treated you like a King. If the Bulls lost one year Micheal wouldn't have joined Pat Ewing in NY

ewing
08-07-2017, 08:22 AM
That's one of my favorite conspiracies. I can easily believe that.

really the guy was biggest cash cow ever why would the NBA suspend him b/c he gambles? I have a hard time believing that they cared at all

Scoots
08-07-2017, 09:55 AM
really the guy was biggest cash cow ever why would the NBA suspend him b/c he gambles? I have a hard time believing that they cared at all

It was strictly against the rules and if it got to the point that his Dad was killed for his gambling it was dangerous.

Of course it could also be that his Dad was killed randomly and it caused MJ to not want to play anymore.

eDush
08-07-2017, 11:40 AM
really the guy was biggest cash cow ever why would the NBA suspend him b/c he gambles? I have a hard time believing that they cared at all

It was strictly against the rules and if it got to the point that his Dad was killed for his gambling it was dangerous.

Of course it could also be that his Dad was killed randomly and it caused MJ to not want to play anymore.You really have your conspiracy theories running wild again just like your theory on Jackson :crazy:

Scoots
08-07-2017, 01:14 PM
You really have your conspiracy theories running wild again just like your theory on Jackson :crazy:

What's my theory on Jackson?

valade16
08-07-2017, 01:38 PM
really the guy was biggest cash cow ever why would the NBA suspend him b/c he gambles? I have a hard time believing that they cared at all

Because they had strict no gambling rules. I mean Pete Rose still isn't welcomed in baseball over gambling. If MJ, their cash cow had been found to have gambled it would have been disastrous for the league.

IKnowHoops
08-07-2017, 01:43 PM
"Would love to see a Cleveland post from you then lmfao!"

"Show us a Cavs post sucker."

How does that backhand feel? :laugh2:

I'm not a Cavs fan, I am a Bron fan and a Twolves fan. So use that lil peanut and figure out what kind of post you should be asking for. You whiffed hard with your backhand young one.

IKnowHoops
08-07-2017, 01:44 PM
Dude give it up. He already shut you down in two other instances now you're just nitpicking anything he says to try not to look like a loser.

Explain yourself cause you sound like you have absolutely no clue as to what you are talking about.

Scoots
08-07-2017, 02:35 PM
I'm not a Cavs fan, I am a Bron fan and a Twolves fan. So use that lil peanut and figure out what kind of post you should be asking for. You whiffed hard with your backhand young one.

Is there ANY point in this back and forth anymore?

FlashBolt
08-07-2017, 04:05 PM
Its leaving one, two, going on 3 top tier teams when mgt has treated you like a King. If the Bulls lost one year Micheal wouldn't have joined Pat Ewing in NY

Players choosing their own teams were very rare back then. It only happened if the absolute perfect situation arised. Does Lebron leave if Cleveland drafted a player like Scottie Pippen before he initially left? Stop being willfully ignorant. Jordan doesn't play in this era.. which he would be crucified for in social media. No one mentions the shots MJ misses in the clutch because no one remembers them. They only remember the one he makes - which I can bet you he missed more than made. Not sure why people see a mythical figure when Jordan lost for seven seasons.


Is there ANY point in this back and forth anymore?

It's disgusting. People here just hate to admit being wrong that they will just drag on a stupid "debate" for no reason. All it takes is, "Okay, you're right. Sorry about that." Instead, they just pick each other's sentences, letter by letter.

ewing
08-07-2017, 06:21 PM
[QUOTE=FlashBolt;31794028]Players choosing their own teams were very rare back then. It only happened if the absolute perfect situation arised. Does Lebron leave if Cleveland drafted a player like Scottie Pippen before he initially left? Stop being willfully ignorant. Jordan doesn't play in this era.. which he would be crucified for in social media. No one mentions the shots MJ misses in the clutch because no one remembers them. They only remember the one he makes - which I can bet you he missed more than made. Not sure why people see a mythical figure when Jordan lost for seven seasons.



Its the era's fault LeBron is soft?

FlashBolt
08-07-2017, 10:17 PM
[QUOTE=FlashBolt;31794028]Players choosing their own teams were very rare back then. It only happened if the absolute perfect situation arised. Does Lebron leave if Cleveland drafted a player like Scottie Pippen before he initially left? Stop being willfully ignorant. Jordan doesn't play in this era.. which he would be crucified for in social media. No one mentions the shots MJ misses in the clutch because no one remembers them. They only remember the one he makes - which I can bet you he missed more than made. Not sure why people see a mythical figure when Jordan lost for seven seasons.



Its the era's fault LeBron is soft?

Not soft. A different attitude and style of game. Remember how we used to kill each other with spears for barbaric reasons? I guess we're "soft" now, huh? These players are growing up in a different environment. They may have played tougher back then because they had to but I'm a basketball fan. I can care less how hard Barkley could punch someone. If you can't translate your skills into playing basketball, who the hell cares? Oh, yeah.. you do because you're anti-LeBron on all your stances.

ewing
08-08-2017, 08:23 AM
[QUOTE=ewing;31794202]

Not soft. A different attitude and style of game. Remember how we used to kill each other with spears for barbaric reasons? I guess we're "soft" now, huh? These players are growing up in a different environment. They may have played tougher back then because they had to but I'm a basketball fan. I can care less how hard Barkley could punch someone. If you can't translate your skills into playing basketball, who the hell cares? Oh, yeah.. you do because you're anti-LeBron on all your stances.

yes