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View Full Version : Is there a move any team can make to give them a remote chance against GS this yr?



Nikeman
07-04-2017, 04:38 PM
I am looking at three teams who I think can even make a small effort to make GS even work.

1) Cleveland
2) San Antonion
3) Houston

I was praying PG13 went to a contender like Houston/Cleveland but then Pritchard sent him to OKC... Paul George in Cleveland would have been an extremely interesting match-up with GS.

At this point, Cleveland landing Melo without giving up Love may make a more intriguing series. People keep saying Melo doesn't play D, but the finals had no defense anyway. Aside from Game 1, Cleveland averaged like 120 a game themselves. Melo would give Cleveland another elite scorer to go with Irving and makes GS not be able to rotate 3 guys onto LeBron.

Signings like a 36 year old Calderon just aren't going to cut it, esp if GS is adding people like Jamal Crawford potentially. Vets like Tony Allen for his D, Afflalo as cheap signings?

Maybe a S&T for a player like Rudy Gay..

Not really sure what Houston/SA could do anymore either. Sad as it sounds, you almost have to see a KD/Steph injury happen to see a competitive NBA this year. Even if Klay/Draymond get injured, I still think GS wipes the floor.

At least every star left the East for the Cavs to basically walk into the finals lol.

Heediot
07-04-2017, 04:55 PM
yeah cavs if they get melo via buyout.

trade love for another key piece and i think they have a chance to win it all. melo and kyrie in the end of games is hard to defend when the iso fests hits late in games.

DanG
07-04-2017, 04:57 PM
There's no move.

JWorthy42
07-04-2017, 05:03 PM
Call me crazy but I think if T-Wolves got Millsap, they could give GSW a run for their money.

Dade County
07-04-2017, 05:03 PM
Not this season but next off season for sure.

If AD & Cousins don't workout. AD can ask to be moved. Cousins might join other All Star players.

Also Westbrook.

So whatever team have enough money to outright sign, West and Cousins could be a start.

But seriously Westbrook and AD have to find a way to team up with each other next offseason. I would say Giannis too but he isn't getting trafed & NO is signing with the bucks.

So we have to wait for a team that can assemble firepower and freakish athleticism.

Key Players.. West, AD, Giannis, Lbj.

dhopisthename
07-04-2017, 05:18 PM
Golden state has 2/5 best players in the NBA, the defensive player of the year and klay thompson who is an all star. not only do they have those pieces, but they mesh perfectly into the best shooting team of all time who can be the best offensive and defensive team. no team can come close to that. The cavs if they can do something that gives them another piece could maybe make it interesting, but I don't see the move yet.

nastynice
07-04-2017, 05:21 PM
It'll be tough. I was talking to my friend, I think it's kind of tough to find any starting 5 players from the entire league to compete with us. I kinda figure lebron almost has to be part of any equation to beating us.

Heediot
07-04-2017, 05:36 PM
if you have a team that can keep it close with gs until late in the game i think they are vulnerable. as long as you have guys that can close out games, you have a shot at beating them. the thing about gs is most of the time the cushion is too comfy for them to be stressed. but if the pressure is on, i think they are vulnerable. if the cavs can add melo and another two way big/wing, i think they have the horses to **** with gs's head.

nastynice
07-04-2017, 05:43 PM
if you have a team that can keep it close with gs until late in the game i think they are vulnerable. as long as you have guys that can close out games, you have a shot at beating them. the thing about gs is most of the time the cushion is too comfy for them to be stressed. but if the pressure is on, i think they are vulnerable. if the cavs can add melo and another two way big/wing, i think they have the horses to **** with gs's head.

Heading into these playoffs I woulda agreed with you. Watching the 4th quarters these past playoffs, they clearly stepped it up down the stretch

Heediot
07-04-2017, 05:47 PM
Heading into these playoffs I woulda agreed with you. Watching the 4th quarters these past playoffs, they clearly stepped it up down the stretch

That KD hot was huge, I give him and them credit for stealing that game. But if you Got Kyrie, Melo, LeBron, and another threat out there, with Korver as a decoy on offense, anything can happen. I won't discount GS's growing wealth of finals experience though, but I can't discount the hypothetical Cavs' either.

valade16
07-04-2017, 05:48 PM
No.

If Cleveland had managed to get PG without giving up Love, maybe.

mngopher35
07-04-2017, 06:02 PM
Nope, I suggest putting some money down so at least you have that to look forward to

IKnowHoops
07-04-2017, 07:51 PM
It'll be tough. I was talking to my friend, I think it's kind of tough to find any starting 5 players from the entire league to compete with us. I kinda figure lebron almost has to be part of any equation to beating us.

Lol.

Kyrie
PG13
Kawaii
Lebron
AD

Beat the dog ish outta GS

IKnowHoops
07-04-2017, 08:00 PM
Cavs just need to stand pat, and just add Wade, Bosh, Melo when they get released/bought out, and go for it.

Kyrie/Calderon/Deron
Wade/JR
Melo/Shump/Korver
Bron/Bosh/Frye
Love/TT

Gives them a legit shot make it an interesting series.

Chronz
07-04-2017, 08:01 PM
if you have a team that can keep it close with gs until late in the game i think they are vulnerable. as long as you have guys that can close out games, you have a shot at beating them. the thing about gs is most of the time the cushion is too comfy for them to be stressed. but if the pressure is on, i think they are vulnerable. if the cavs can add melo and another two way big/wing, i think they have the horses to **** with gs's head.
Well if you're saying the best/most likely chance at beating them is scrapping away and barely winning then yeah but if its a close game, chances are the other team has been playing at such a high level of intensity that in the closing moments the FACT that GS essentially has a distinct advantage without either MVP on the floor means they will have more conserved energy for the final stretch. In the past when the level of talent was FAR more in contention, then yeah, forcing the dubs into a non-free flowing grind it out for the final possession type game was plausible, but now, you're an idiot if you didn't have the Dubs repeating IMO. I made money for this year but I should've doubled down on my dystopian view of the league.

Chronz
07-04-2017, 08:05 PM
Cavs just need to stand pat, and just add Wade, Bosh, Melo when they get released/bought out, and go for it.

Bosh, you gotta risk the ultimate for the ...... cue Hawkeye

Wade is no longer a championship piece unless hes off the bench IMO. **** that might hold true for Melo too at this point. CP3 is the best member of the non-Bron banana boat crew. I would want him to join that mess of a team but it would still be a bunch of old farts trying their damnest ala the Rox in 97 to compete with prime teams. Rather see CP3 ride off into the sunset with Houston for the next 2-3 years and then sink their cap for the final 2-3 years ala Shaq in Miami.

nastynice
07-04-2017, 08:14 PM
Lol.

Kyrie
PG13
Kawaii
Lebron
AD

Beat the dog ish outta GS

Doubt it. So AD parked at 3? And where does Kyrie park at? And Kawhai?

IKnowHoops
07-04-2017, 09:47 PM
Doubt it. So AD parked at 3? And where does Kyrie park at? And Kawhai?

We don't need to park anywhere. Lebron won't treat them like scrubs. They can all create for themselves and play off each other. Bron can finally play free basketball and not worry about anyone else. Meanwhile Kawaii will guard Curry, PG will guard Klay, AD will guard Durant and Bron will guard Draymond.

They will roll GS ---

eDush
07-04-2017, 09:58 PM
Doubt it. So AD parked at 3? And where does Kyrie park at? And Kawhai?

We don't need to park anywhere. Lebron won't treat them like scrubs. They can all create for themselves and play off each other. Bron can finally play free basketball and not worry about anyone else. Meanwhile Kawaii will guard Curry, PG will guard Klay, AD will guard Durant and Bron will guard Draymond.

They will roll GS ---
:eyebrow:

aman_13
07-04-2017, 10:04 PM
Call me crazy but I think if T-Wolves got Millsap, they could give GSW a run for their money.

Yeah I really wanted them to go for it. Not saying they would win but it would of been an intriguing series. At this time, I don't see any team beating them.

mightybosstone
07-04-2017, 10:05 PM
I don't think people in this thread are giving Cleveland very much credit. They were one bad minute of basketball away from it being a 2-2 series going back to Oakland. They were competitive in that series, and if their bench had stepped up and their role players played better, they would have had a shot to win. Adding Melo could feasibly be a big enough addition to make them competitive with the Warriors again next year, but even if they don't, they could feasibly give the Warriors a run by improving those 6-9 spots in their rotation.

As for Houston, only time will really tell with the Rockets. We still haven't seen Harden and Paul play together in MDA's offense. But feasibly adding Melo would make them even more dangerous offensively. Right now, I do think they're a much better team than last season, but I don't think it's enough to realistically give Golden State much of a fight over seven games.

And I have no clue what the Spurs can do. They got swept, and they haven't done much of anything to improve at this point in the offseason. If anything, they might be worse if they lose any of their key rotational guys, which could very well happen. They'll obviously be an excellent regular season team again next year, but without a pretty significant personnel change, I can't see them having a shot against the Warriors.

LOb0
07-04-2017, 10:07 PM
LeBron demanding a trade to SA is the only move.

Chronz
07-04-2017, 10:14 PM
I don't think people in this thread are giving Cleveland very much credit. They were one bad minute of basketball away from it being a 2-2 series going back to Oakland.

That doesn't mean as much as you want it to. Let me put it this way, do you think its possible to see a non-competitive 7 game series vs a very competitive 4-6 game series? I dont view the game 1 game at a piece but a culmination of probabilities that are effected by numerous variables (hot shooting streaks/law of averages, talent, hca etc..).

For me its like when the sub.500 Hawks pushed the eventual champion Celtics to 7 games but knowing that both LA and Detroit put up a bigger fight despite not pushing them to 7. If you disagree with that then we are just different fans but by my barometer, the Cavs were not at all competitive and it took FAR more to keep it close than I witnessed from them all year. Just my opinion but reality shaped out exactly as I had envisioned so I make no excuses. The end result was still a horrible playoffs.

Chronz
07-04-2017, 10:17 PM
LeBron demanding a trade to SA is the only move.

You underrate the Dubs. LeBron demanding a buyout so he can sign for the min is the only hope, whatever team he joins is the real question. Not so sure its SAS under those laws. Put it this way, Bron and KD/Curry are all pretty much on even terms now IMO, so unless you got a 73 win team handy, I dont think simply adding LeBron to a regular contender is enough.

Peak Bron yes but I dont buy the notion that hes still around. The game has just changed to help his strengths, he would've been even better in this system 3-4 years ago but thats the way the game works sometimes.

da ThRONe
07-04-2017, 10:24 PM
Cleveland is the only team this year. But they'd have to trade both Irving and Love to do it and they're nof likely to trade one at this point let alone both.

da ThRONe
07-04-2017, 10:32 PM
As great as the Warriors are SA looked like the superior team until Leonard was "taken out". They can be beat with a talented, physical and slow paced team. Can't get into a shootout with these guys.

JasonJohnHorn
07-04-2017, 10:46 PM
CP3 to either the Spurs or the Cavs (for Kyrie) were the best possibilities.

Nothing realistic is now in play.

The only thing that could open it up is is the Warriors made a bad move. Klay for DMC say... DMC ruins the chemistry.


But I don't see that happening.

I do hope Bogut returns to the Warriors though... I miss that defensive line-up.

Vee-Rex
07-04-2017, 11:13 PM
Remote chance? Sure. I think adding Melo via buyout would give Cleveland a remote chance. I think right now the Cavs have a remote chance. Hell, I think the Spurs as-is (assuming their 2017-18 team is as good at the 16-17) have a REMOTE chance.

WaDe03
07-04-2017, 11:20 PM
Doubt it. So AD parked at 3? And where does Kyrie park at? And Kawhai?

Hold on.....so you don't think that team beats Golden State? Stop it man lol.

Quinnsanity
07-04-2017, 11:26 PM
Hot take: I freaking LOVED the Patrick Patterson signing for OKC and think they're one legit 3 and D dude (likely an SG) away from making the Warriors sweat. If they could like flip like Kanter and a pick for Courtney Lee (shorter contract for Kanter, but more money, so helps the Knicks if they're patient), I think they're within the margin of error. If they got really hot, and the Warriors didn't...

mightybosstone
07-04-2017, 11:31 PM
That doesn't mean as much as you want it to. Let me put it this way, do you think its possible to see a non-competitive 7 game series vs a very competitive 4-6 game series? I dont view the game 1 game at a piece but a culmination of probabilities that are effected by numerous variables (hot shooting streaks/law of averages, talent, hca etc..).

For me its like when the sub.500 Hawks pushed the eventual champion Celtics to 7 games but knowing that both LA and Detroit put up a bigger fight despite not pushing them to 7. If you disagree with that then we are just different fans but by my barometer, the Cavs were not at all competitive and it took FAR more to keep it close than I witnessed from them all year. Just my opinion but reality shaped out exactly as I had envisioned so I make no excuses. The end result was still a horrible playoffs.

I both agree and disagree with you. Yes, there were certain variables that contributed to that Cleveland / Golden State series appearing to be closer than it probably seemed on paper. However, the one key variable that I brought up prior to the series which I thought gave Cleveland a fighting chance (and ultimately kind of did) is that extra indefinable gear that team has in the postseason. They're simply a much, much better team in the playoffs than they are in the regular season.

Golden State was obviously still obscenely good and statistically was probably better in the posteason. However, a lot of their individual performers tend to not perform that well in the playoffs compared to their regular season production, mainly Thompson and Curry (to a lesser extent).

So I still that one factor gives Cleveland a fighting chance. And if they get fix some of the holes they had in their rotation and improve on the defensive side of the ball, their odds are low, but still not insurmountable. If they played 100 games, Golden State probably wins 80 or more of them. But they don't have to beat Golden State 51 times, they just have to do it four times in seven tries.

Saddletramp
07-05-2017, 01:40 AM
Cle looked pretty good against GS in the first half of those first two games. Depth killed them. They could rest their guys while we all saw what happened to Cle when Lebron sat. Love and Kyrie just didn't know what they were doing and those guys lead Cle to a trash record when Lebron sits. And Deron, Korver, Frye and RJ just aren't going to cut it from the bench. Doubt Calderon will, either. If they got Melo and Wade off the bench, though (via buyout without losing any top guys)....,.,.look out.

Chronz
07-05-2017, 02:02 AM
Hot take: I freaking LOVED the Patrick Patterson signing for OKC and think they're one legit 3 and D dude (likely an SG) away from making the Warriors sweat. If they could like flip like Kanter and a pick for Courtney Lee (shorter contract for Kanter, but more money, so helps the Knicks if they're patient), I think they're within the margin of error. If they got really hot, and the Warriors didn't...

They got PatPat? Good for them, I like them as the 2-3 seed just on that role player signing.

mrblisterdundee
07-05-2017, 02:30 AM
I still think the Cavaliers could help themselves a lot by trading Love for Anthony and O'Quinn from New York or Vucevic, Ross and Hezonja from Orlando. They need some more depth.
If Houston could add Anthony, that would sure help their chances. San Antonio beat the Warriors twice last season, and were looking good with Kawhi in the playoffs.

LOb0
07-05-2017, 02:30 AM
You underrate the Dubs. LeBron demanding a buyout so he can sign for the min is the only hope, whatever team he joins is the real question. Not so sure its SAS under those laws. Put it this way, Bron and KD/Curry are all pretty much on even terms now IMO, so unless you got a 73 win team handy, I dont think simply adding LeBron to a regular contender is enough.

Peak Bron yes but I dont buy the notion that hes still around. The game has just changed to help his strengths, he would've been even better in this system 3-4 years ago but thats the way the game works sometimes.

LeBron and Kawhi is so absurdly nasty I think they could beat GS. Pop's brilliance, and perhaps Bron could rehab LA and get that mid range going again.

That's the only scenario I see for beating the Warriors.

Sssmush
07-05-2017, 02:44 AM
LeBron and Kawhi is so absurdly nasty I think they could beat GS. Pop's brilliance, and perhaps Bron could rehab LA and get that mid range going again.

That's the only scenario I see for beating the Warriors.

Westbrook to Cleveland for Kevin Love and a pick or something.

If Cleveland added Westbrook and then say Jamaal Crawford, and Larry Nance Jr and Deng from the Lakers for D.
That would be nasty.

In the past I wouldve said swap Kyrie for CP3 but Kyrie has become outrageously good so no.

But yeah Westbrook to Cleveland is the clearest path I see. Lebron on San Antonio yes but that would be a huge transition culture clash and Lebron doesnt need the Spurs theyve been mostly just a good western playoff team for a while now, and stacking the WCFs is a low percentage play for Lebron

JasonJohnHorn
07-05-2017, 02:46 AM
Remote chance? Sure. I think adding Melo via buyout would give Cleveland a remote chance. I think right now the Cavs have a remote chance. Hell, I think the Spurs as-is (assuming their 2017-18 team is as good at the 16-17) have a REMOTE chance.

I feel like Melo wouldn't really help the Cavs... I mean.. he's not a strong defender, and his 3pt shooting is merely decent in the current NBA climate. He's never been a particularly great passer. I don't see him adding anything to the Cavs roster that they don't already have a better version of.


And he wants the ball a lot. So... take shots away from Love and Kyrie? For less efficient shots?

Raps18-19 Champ
07-05-2017, 02:55 AM
The Wolves have the best chance if Wiggins takes the next step (and he will no doubt).

valade16
07-05-2017, 03:05 AM
I don't think people in this thread are giving Cleveland very much credit. They were one bad minute of basketball away from it being a 2-2 series going back to Oakland. They were competitive in that series, and if their bench had stepped up and their role players played better, they would have had a shot to win. Adding Melo could feasibly be a big enough addition to make them competitive with the Warriors again next year, but even if they don't, they could feasibly give the Warriors a run by improving those 6-9 spots in their rotation.

As for Houston, only time will really tell with the Rockets. We still haven't seen Harden and Paul play together in MDA's offense. But feasibly adding Melo would make them even more dangerous offensively. Right now, I do think they're a much better team than last season, but I don't think it's enough to realistically give Golden State much of a fight over seven games.

And I have no clue what the Spurs can do. They got swept, and they haven't done much of anything to improve at this point in the offseason. If anything, they might be worse if they lose any of their key rotational guys, which could very well happen. They'll obviously be an excellent regular season team again next year, but without a pretty significant personnel change, I can't see them having a shot against the Warriors.

No offense, but you sound like another sucker trying to convince the world there's a chance; there's not. Sure 1 minute was the difference between 1-3 or 2-2, but the Cavs still would have lost 2-2. The Warriors were easily the best team and although I love the CP3 signing, nobody is close to the Warriors.

The most talented team in the league added a prime MVP caliber player. Anyone who thinks any team is close is fooling themselves.

europagnpilgrim
07-05-2017, 03:25 AM
I am looking at three teams who I think can even make a small effort to make GS even work.

1) Cleveland
2) San Antonion
3) Houston

I was praying PG13 went to a contender like Houston/Cleveland but then Pritchard sent him to OKC... Paul George in Cleveland would have been an extremely interesting match-up with GS.

At this point, Cleveland landing Melo without giving up Love may make a more intriguing series. People keep saying Melo doesn't play D, but the finals had no defense anyway. Aside from Game 1, Cleveland averaged like 120 a game themselves. Melo would give Cleveland another elite scorer to go with Irving and makes GS not be able to rotate 3 guys onto LeBron.

Signings like a 36 year old Calderon just aren't going to cut it, esp if GS is adding people like Jamal Crawford potentially. Vets like Tony Allen for his D, Afflalo as cheap signings?

Maybe a S&T for a player like Rudy Gay..

Not really sure what Houston/SA could do anymore either. Sad as it sounds, you almost have to see a KD/Steph injury happen to see a competitive NBA this year. Even if Klay/Draymond get injured, I still think GS wipes the floor.

At least every star left the East for the Cavs to basically walk into the finals lol.

Houston could possibly get Melo via buy out and possibly add another wing d guy in Allen depending on what he is looking for money wise, possibly add another big man on cheap like Bogut or maybe pursue a cheap alternative like Bosh, if they could get three of those 4 on the cheap then it makes it very interesting

Spurs are going to be pretty much the same and will make it interesting if Leonard can stay healthy, Cavs can compete as well but its going to be tough barring any major injuries to the Dubs who are only going to be more confident this upcoming season with the group that just won it all

but at least West playoffs will be more fun to watch especially if Wolves/Nuggets show up with the talent they have and PG in OKC and it would have been better out East had Boston put its chips on the table and landed one of PG/Butler or acquired a Cousins/AD type player to challenge the Cavs but we have to hope Wizards/Raptors can be on its A game come playoff time to at least make it interesting like the Raptors did a couple yrs back

Vinylman
07-05-2017, 09:16 AM
Remote chance? Sure. I think adding Melo via buyout would give Cleveland a remote chance. I think right now the Cavs have a remote chance. Hell, I think the Spurs as-is (assuming their 2017-18 team is as good at the 16-17) have a REMOTE chance.

yep... melo via a buyout would be HUGE...

I would be sort of concerned that you guys paid what you did for Korver in terms of years and also added a worthless piece like Calderon but I would never count LBJ out...

Having no GM is hurting you guys right now.

Vee-Rex
07-05-2017, 11:45 AM
yep... melo via a buyout would be HUGE...

I would be sort of concerned that you guys paid what you did for Korver in terms of years and also added a worthless piece like Calderon but I would never count LBJ out...

Having no GM is hurting you guys right now.

I'm cool with Korver and wanted him back. He has a ton of gravity on offense and draws multiple defenders his way off screens, and it's something we've been getting better at exploiting.

The problem is, with Korver/Love/Irving, we really can't afford to have anyone else who can be defensive liabilities. I completely agree with what you said about adding Calderon... like, that dude sucks badly. With Love/Irving/Korver we really should not be adding pieces who suck defensively and Calderon just sucks at everything. Head-scratching move right there... even if Deron Williams leaves I'd rather wait for a better target.

And it all falls down on Dan Gilbert. The only thing I like about Gilbert is that he has spent a lot of money (although with hesitation and unwillingly). But he's killing this team with his decisions.

Sssmush
07-05-2017, 12:09 PM
the idea that Melo is the key, necessary piece to winning a title, much less beating GSW, is laughable on its face

prodigy
07-05-2017, 12:53 PM
If the cavs get Melo without giving up Love yes they have a real shot. Wade wants a buyout with the Bulls and we can all image hes going to join buddies lebron and melo. Now will the Bulls do that? who knows. but...

Irving
Wade
Melo
Lebron
Love

that can def compete with the warriors. I mean if the cavs didn't blow a 4th Q double digit lead in game 3 the series woulda been tired 2-2 going back to GS. So its not like they were smacked 4 straight games by 30. Even without Wade i believe Cavs can contend with the warriors.

hugepatsfan
07-05-2017, 12:59 PM
If the cavs get Melo without giving up Love yes they have a real shot. Wade wants a buyout with the Bulls and we can all image hes going to join buddies lebron and melo. Now will the Bulls do that? who knows. but...

Irving
Wade
Melo
Lebron
Love

that can def compete with the warriors. I mean if the cavs didn't blow a 4th Q double digit lead in game 3 the series woulda been tired 2-2 going back to GS. So its not like they were smacked 4 straight games by 30. Even without Wade i believe Cavs can contend with the warriors.

You sound like some of my Celtics fans friends trying to argue we're not that far off of CLE lol

IndyRealist
07-05-2017, 01:13 PM
the idea that Melo is the key, necessary piece to winning a title, much less beating GSW, is laughable on its face

+1. Despite all evidence to the contrary, people still think Melo is a good player.

WaDe03
07-05-2017, 01:22 PM
You sound like some of my Celtics fans friends trying to argue we're not that far off of CLE lol

I think we can all agree the Cavs are closer to the Warriors than you all were to the Cavs though lol. I mean they just straight ran through you guys in Boston 3 times.

I think those additions he mentioned would be huge, especially when closing games like the scenario he mentioned.

Vee-Rex
07-05-2017, 01:22 PM
You sound like some of my Celtics fans friends trying to argue we're not that far off of CLE lol

Yeah I feel that, though I think the 5-game finals series was a lot closer than the 5-game ECF series. I mean the blowouts/dominance in the ECF was pretty staggering. Cavs had an average margin of victory of 25.75ppg in their 4 wins over the Celtics. Not to mention the Celtics won their 1 game on a buzzer beater. And even in game 1 where the Cavs only won by 13, they had built a 28 point lead.

The Cavs/Pacers series was closer than that even though it only went 4 games.

Whereas in the finals, the Warriors average margin of victory in their 4 wins was only 14.25ppg, with the Cavs pretty much fighting and keeping it close in each game until the 4th quarter. Two of those games were single digit victories with 1 being a game that the Cavs probably should've won. The Cavs victory by 21 points as well.

Both the finals and ECF were a 5-game series but the dominance and gap in the ECF was much bigger.

WaDe03
07-05-2017, 01:25 PM
+1. Despite all evidence to the contrary, people still think Melo is a good player.

You have to look at his situation though. He's not that good in his role anymore but making him 3rd 4th or even 5th option depending on who's hot that night with the team he's listed he could be pretty good. The opposing teams 3rd or 4th best perimeter player will be guarding him, he would abuse them.

WaDe03
07-05-2017, 01:26 PM
Yeah I feel that, though I think the 5-game finals series was a lot closer than the 5-game ECF series. I mean the blowouts/dominance in the ECF was pretty staggering. Cavs had an average margin of victory of 25.75ppg in their 4 wins over the Celtics. Not to mention the Celtics won their 1 game on a buzzer beater. And even in game 1 where the Cavs only won by 13, they had built a 28 point lead.

The Cavs/Pacers series was closer than that even though it only went 4 games.

Whereas in the finals, the Warriors average margin of victory in their 4 wins was only 14.25ppg, with the Cavs pretty much fighting and keeping it close in each game until the 4th quarter. Two of those games were single digit victories with 1 being a game that the Cavs probably should've won. The Cavs victory by 21 points as well.

Both the finals and ECF were a 5-game series but the dominance and gap in the ECF was much bigger.

Swap Wade and Melo with Deron and Jefferson and I feel pretty confident you close that margin of victory.

hugepatsfan
07-05-2017, 01:31 PM
If the Cavs actually won Game 3, do you think GS plays the same in Game 4? You don't think they sat on a 3-0 lead at all?

Look, CLE just isn't remotely close to GS. Go back to the prior year. CLE barely squeaked out a 7 game series after having been down 3-1 to a team that had been 73-9. GS was better but CLE was close enough that GS slipped up and they got them.

Then GS added the 2nd best player in the game today and a top 20 player all time to that roster. So realistically that's what CLE needs to add to catch back up to GS and get on the almost level playing field they were with GS before.

Forget all these mental gymnastics about well if we won this game then the series changes or if we squeaked out game 5 we can win game 6 in CLE so it's pretty much a guaranteed 7 game series at that point. Just look at it the bare bones argument. They were close, GS made an ALL-WORLD addition, CLE needs to match to get back even.

We're talking guys like Melo, Wade? LMFAO at those guys making up that gap. Even just adding PG doesn't close that gap because he's not near Durant. If you're also shipping out Love too? Forget about it.

CLE obviously is a great team. Probably one of the best ever if we're being honest. But GS was even better to begin with and added a top 20 all-time player. CLE just isn't close to them right now.

KingPosey
07-05-2017, 01:37 PM
There WAS moves but idk about now. If SAS landed Paul that would have really changed things. And if someone else could have moved Iggy then things REALLY could start to look different. I think Cleveland is stuck though. They can trade a star for a star possibly, but they can't really add another star with their situation. Unless NY buys out Melo, even then I just don't know what that would do for them.

Vee-Rex
07-05-2017, 01:39 PM
If the Cavs actually won Game 3, do you think GS plays the same in Game 4? You don't think they sat on a 3-0 lead at all?

Look, CLE just isn't remotely close to GS. Go back to the prior year. CLE barely squeaked out a 7 game series after having been down 3-1 to a team that had been 73-9. GS was better but CLE was close enough that GS slipped up and they got them.

Then GS added the 2nd best player in the game today and a top 20 player all time to that roster. So realistically that's what CLE needs to add to catch back up to GS and get on the almost level playing field they were with GS before.

Forget all these mental gymnastics about well if we won this game then the series changes or if we squeaked out game 5 we can win game 6 in CLE so it's pretty much a guaranteed 7 game series at that point. Just look at it the bare bones argument. They were close, GS made an ALL-WORLD addition, CLE needs to match to get back even.

We're talking guys like Melo, Wade? LMFAO at those guys making up that gap. Even just adding PG doesn't close that gap because he's not near Durant. If you're also shipping out Love too? Forget about it.

CLE obviously is a great team. Probably one of the best ever if we're being honest. But GS was even better to begin with and added a top 20 all-time player. CLE just isn't close to them right now.

In terms of playoff numbers, GS isn't THAT much better than Cleveland. Decisively better? Absolutely. It's a sizable gap, but it's not the same size as it was with Cleveland and Boston. Anyone watching both could easily see that.

One of the major issues Cleveland has with GS is that they match up sooooo well. Swapping Love with George doesn't put us on their level but it allows us to match up better with them. That does make a pretty big difference.

Cleveland had the best offensive rating in history going into the finals... like, that's not just a coincidence. They put up 137 in game 4 on crazy shooting. Even if the Cavs won game 3, it's entirely possible they could still win game 4 if they put up the crazy shooting that they did. Would it have been sustainable? Absolutely not - that's why it's a 7 game series. But Cleveland's offense was/is historical.

GS is on their own tier, but I disagree with any notion that they are impossible to beat or are so enormously better than the next best team that there isn't even a REMOTE (0-10%) chance they could lose. That finals was a hella entertaining finals for it to only be a 5 game series and it was clear that we were watching two incredibly talented teams.

KingPosey
07-05-2017, 01:45 PM
Doubt it. So AD parked at 3? And where does Kyrie park at? And Kawhai?


:eyebrow:

Wait are you two serious?

mightybosstone
07-05-2017, 01:58 PM
No offense, but you sound like another sucker trying to convince the world there's a chance; there's not. Sure 1 minute was the difference between 1-3 or 2-2, but the Cavs still would have lost 2-2. The Warriors were easily the best team and although I love the CP3 signing, nobody is close to the Warriors.

The most talented team in the league added a prime MVP caliber player. Anyone who thinks any team is close is fooling themselves.

Look, if you asked me right now to put all my money on Golden State to win the next two championships or the field to take either of them, I'd put my money on Golden State without thinking about it. The odds are heavily, heavily in their favor. But I've seen talented teams lose to inferior opponents and egos or injuries completely derail dynasties. Kobe and Shaq should have won 5-6 titles as should the Miami Heat trio. The Dwight/Harden duo shouldn't have gone from a WCF team to a .500 basketball team. The Showtime Lakers and 80s Celtics should have been dominant into the 90s.

Sometimes things just happen in professional sports that go beyond the talent on paper. So I'm not going to sit here and say that the Warriors are locks to win the next 4-5 titles. Because even with the odds heavily in their favor, I cannot predict the future. Nobody can.

WaDe03
07-05-2017, 02:00 PM
No team is head and shoulders above a LeBron led team. Swapping Deron Williams who was an absolute 0 for the Cavs and Richard Jefferson with Wade and Melo is a HUGE improvement. That series is going 7 games if the Warriors win.

Lmfao at people who are acting like Wade and Melo are just complete scrubs now because they aren't as good as they used to be. People are so quick with the "out with the old, in with the new" stuff. That's one of the main reasons people were trying to say Curry was the best when it was still easily LeBron. They liked his style of play and were tired of LeBron being the best.

WaDe03
07-05-2017, 02:11 PM
Wait are you two serious?

Unfortunately, I think they are.

kdspurman
07-05-2017, 02:21 PM
Remote chance? Sure. I think adding Melo via buyout would give Cleveland a remote chance. I think right now the Cavs have a remote chance. Hell, I think the Spurs as-is (assuming their 2017-18 team is as good at the 16-17) have a REMOTE chance.

I believe the same about the Spurs. And I hope they get them again next post-season.

Sssmush
07-05-2017, 02:24 PM
If the cavs get Melo without giving up Love yes they have a real shot. Wade wants a buyout with the Bulls and we can all image hes going to join buddies lebron and melo. Now will the Bulls do that? who knows. but...

Irving
Wade
Melo
Lebron
Love

that can def compete with the warriors. I mean if the cavs didn't blow a 4th Q double digit lead in game 3 the series woulda been tired 2-2 going back to GS. So its not like they were smacked 4 straight games by 30. Even without Wade i believe Cavs can contend with the warriors.

Let's also not forget the refs were being STUPID trying to save the series from being a sweep.

On a level playing field, with totally objective refereeing, GSW wins 80+ out of a 100 on any sample size. It's not 100% because Kyrie gets crazy hot and GSW's shots cool off sometimes.

Expect GSW to be better next year.

Actually it's annoying to always talk about Cleveland, who would be like a 4 seed in the West, as the big challenger.

Reseed the playoffs or put the Texas teams in the East and it's a completely different conversation. This idea that Lebron gets a bye into the Finals every year makes the whole "challenge" thing kind of meaningless

Dee_Edge
07-05-2017, 02:41 PM
PG- Isaiah Thomas
SG- Avery Bradley
SF- Gordon Hayward
PF- Al Horford
C- Marc Gasol

...I'd say that this team maybe would have a "remote" chance.

Irving<...is this even possible?
Wade
Melo
Lebron
Love

Bostonjorge
07-05-2017, 02:53 PM
Leonard had this GS team by the throat. If he don't get injured then "HE" wins game 1. Then we here how GS lost home court and they are in trouble. "Experts" would question if this GS is really the best team in the league let alone ever. Leonard didn't even have a Kevin Love level player as help. He had Aldridge who couldn't give you what Ginobli gave you.

Leonard don't need Lebron or Anthony Davis to compete. Give him Kevin Love or Melo. Leonard will make it work and compete. You give him Westbrook and Westbrook will carry Leonard past anyone.

hugepatsfan
07-05-2017, 03:32 PM
In terms of playoff numbers, GS isn't THAT much better than Cleveland. Decisively better? Absolutely. It's a sizable gap, but it's not the same size as it was with Cleveland and Boston. Anyone watching both could easily see that.

One of the major issues Cleveland has with GS is that they match up sooooo well. Swapping Love with George doesn't put us on their level but it allows us to match up better with them. That does make a pretty big difference.

Cleveland had the best offensive rating in history going into the finals... like, that's not just a coincidence. They put up 137 in game 4 on crazy shooting. Even if the Cavs won game 3, it's entirely possible they could still win game 4 if they put up the crazy shooting that they did. Would it have been sustainable? Absolutely not - that's why it's a 7 game series. But Cleveland's offense was/is historical.

GS is on their own tier, but I disagree with any notion that they are impossible to beat or are so enormously better than the next best team that there isn't even a REMOTE (0-10%) chance they could lose. That finals was a hella entertaining finals for it to only be a 5 game series and it was clear that we were watching two incredibly talented teams.

Any team with Lebron I think has a chance for sure. I'm not saying it's impossible. I'm just saying that there's no moves they can make to where I think anyone should even consider actually picking them to win. Upsets happen and that's why we play the game but I don't see anyway to make an argument that someone is actually better.

Like I said, I think CLE as constructed is one of the best teams we've ever seen in this league. But so is GS and they were even before KD got there. And I think they were better than CLE before he even got there. 2 years ago the Warriors won 73 games in the regular season. They took a 3-1 series lead. Curry was playing on a hurt ankle. Draymond got suspended. Kyrie balled out of his ****ing mind and Lebron, the arguable GOAT, went BANANAS. You guys pulled it out for a down to the wire game 7 win. They earned the hell out of their title no doubt but you can't discredit how good GS was and what a perfect storm of events it took to beat them even without KD. That team before him was a ****ing monster. With him added at no real cost (just a swap of Barnes) I just don't see how CLE can get back on their level.

Sssmush
07-05-2017, 03:58 PM
Leonard had this GS team by the throat. If he don't get injured then "HE" wins game 1. Then we here how GS lost home court and they are in trouble. "Experts" would question if this GS is really the best team in the league let alone ever. Leonard didn't even have a Kevin Love level player as help. He had Aldridge who couldn't give you what Ginobli gave you.

Leonard don't need Lebron or Anthony Davis to compete. Give him Kevin Love or Melo. Leonard will make it work and compete. You give him Westbrook and Westbrook will carry Leonard past anyone.

Kawahi is kind of overrated I think. He's well suited to Popovich's system and is an excellent player but a Lebron or Westbrook in that system would be better and allow popovich to do more things.

Steph beat Lebron in the Finals, then 2016 realistically beat Lebron 5 games in the finals but the refs were ********. Then last year with Durant the only competition was how sneaky the refs could be to try and keep it close.

Kawahi is nice but he is << Curry OR Durant. No one sane considers a Curry or Durant for Kawahi trade

kdspurman
07-05-2017, 04:05 PM
Kawahi is kind of overrated I think. He's well suited to Popovich's system and is an excellent player but a Lebron or Westbrook in that system would be better and allow popovich to do more things.

Steph beat Lebron in the Finals, then 2016 realistically beat Lebron 5 games in the finals but the refs were ********. Then last year with Durant the only competition was how sneaky the refs could be to try and keep it close.

Kawahi is nice but he is << Curry OR Durant. No one sane considers a Curry or Durant for Kawahi trade

Westbrook, seriously?

I thought Kawhi proved the "he's overrated" or "he's a systemv player" 1000% wrong already.

archdevil84
07-05-2017, 04:08 PM
bron should just join the spurs. i think pop is a master and could rise his game to even higher levels unseen before tbh

R. Johnson#3
07-05-2017, 04:36 PM
In a hypothetical situation Lebron to the Raps could work.

JV
Ibaka
Lebron
DeMar
Lowry

The Raps always play GS tough but never come out on top. You replace Carroll with Lebron and that's one hell of a balanced starting 5.

R. Johnson#3
07-05-2017, 04:37 PM
Kawahi is kind of overrated I think. He's well suited to Popovich's system and is an excellent player but a Lebron or Westbrook in that system would be better and allow popovich to do more things.

Steph beat Lebron in the Finals, then 2016 realistically beat Lebron 5 games in the finals but the refs were ********. Then last year with Durant the only competition was how sneaky the refs could be to try and keep it close.

Kawahi is nice but he is << Curry OR Durant. No one sane considers a Curry or Durant for Kawahi trade

He's been the best 2 way player in the league for a few years now and it really only came to light this past season.

FOXHOUND
07-05-2017, 05:00 PM
Westbrook, seriously?

I thought Kawhi proved the "he's overrated" or "he's a systemv player" 1000% wrong already.

Nah, he's a Spur so he must be overlooked.

mngopher35
07-05-2017, 05:17 PM
Ya I think Kawhi has a good argument up there with Durant/Curry personally. He was incredible last year in the MVP race and insane playoff #'s (Hold up in comparison to Curry/Durant) and has been continually improving as well.

If SA manages their money right and gets people to accept/decline options they want it looks like they could have Kawhi/Green (get him to opt in)/Mills/Murray and like 55 mil in space (or add Aldridge and like 35 left if you can't get him to opt out). Not sure they will go that route but they could be players in next years FA...

Sssmush
07-05-2017, 05:36 PM
He's been the best 2 way player in the league for a few years now and it really only came to light this past season.


I mean that's the narrative but the results don't really bear that out.

Obviously can't be as good at somethings as big dudes like AD and KAT.

And obviously he's not as offensively spectacular as Curry, Harden etc.

He's also not as athletic as Westbrook, Lebron and now Wiggins is coming up.

It's questionable whether he's a better defender than Draymond, Goebert... especially Lebron.

So I mean mashing the numbers and claiming "Kawahi is the best two way player in the game the past two years".... what does that mean really? Like he is so balanced that he is like the perfect player and actually better/more valuable than Curry or Lebron? Or several other guys at least?

he's a nice player but I don't see him as the best no way

Sssmush
07-05-2017, 05:43 PM
bron should just join the spurs. i think pop is a master and could rise his game to even higher levels unseen before tbh


Lebron would've smoked San Antonio in the Finals last season, with or without Kawahi. And with or without a "coach" drawing up pick and roll diagrams.

You could tell San Antonio was mailing it in in the playoffs, and all season it was pretty obvious they could Peyton Manning their way to a nice record but weren't getting past the other top two or three teams in the West.

Popovich built a reputation around Duncan but Duncan was the real engine of that machine, both character and leadership-wise and also being a legit MVP caliber hall of famer and the best power forward ever.

Without Duncan so far they're a well disciplined clever offensive team that plays team defense and has results about like the Clippers.

Sssmush
07-05-2017, 05:45 PM
So, uh, unless the Spurs get the #1 pick in the draft a couple of times in the next few years... I can tell you how many titles the Spurs are probably gonna win.

0

That's how many

4North
07-05-2017, 06:21 PM
I was praying PG13 went to a contender like Houston/Cleveland but then Pritchard sent him to OKC... Paul George in Cleveland would have been an extremely interesting match-up with GS.


Why do you want Golden State to lose so badly? Is it a competition thing or do you just despise them so much that you are rooting for anybody they play to beat them?

I've been a Warriors fan since the latter end of the Chris Mullin days. I don't understand the hate for them at all. They have done things THE RIGHT WAY. Kevin Durant is THE ONLY big acquisition that this team has made to become a "super team" They drafted 3 of their 4 stars, and won a ring and 73 games before Durant was even there. They made intelligent trades and free agent acquisitions over the years and because they have worked so hard and made so many good decisions they have been rewarded. Kevin Durant wanted to go to The Warriors because they were already a GREAT team with a GREAT system, a GREAT fan base and a GREAT team morale.

They have taken their lumps and have earned everything that has come to them recently. This is not some Lakers type franchise, that just takes advantage of being in Los Angeles or New York. They aren't The Boston Celtics with more rings than they can count who have always gotten lucky and have always had the best players. The guys on the team? Curry is an angel. Durant might have rubbed people the wrong way with his decision but he is also an angel. Great guys on and off the court. Klay Thompson is a quiet guy, never said a negative thing about anyone. Draymond Green is a bit of a douche sometimes (I'm a 49ers fan and I consider him the Richard Sherman of The NBA so I understand people not liking him) but off the court he's shown to be a good guy as well. These guys all work EXTREMELY hard, they were all underdogs (besides Durant) So why do people hate them? The Warriors hadn't won in 40 years, can they not have a turn? Are people really so insecure and jealous that when a franchise puts in the work and gets what they deserve that everyone just "prays" for anything that could possibly that will lead to them losing? Don't like it

4North
07-05-2017, 06:29 PM
Leonard had this GS team by the throat. If he don't get injured then "HE" wins game 1. Then we here how GS lost home court and they are in trouble. "Experts" would question if this GS is really the best team in the league let alone ever. Leonard didn't even have a Kevin Love level player as help. He had Aldridge who couldn't give you what Ginobli gave you.

Leonard don't need Lebron or Anthony Davis to compete. Give him Kevin Love or Melo. Leonard will make it work and compete. You give him Westbrook and Westbrook will carry Leonard past anyone.

As a Warriors fan I can admit that San Antonio definitely had a chance, but in the long run they probably still lose that series in 5 or 6 games. The Warriors have been known to get way behind in some games and come back. They actually did the exact same thing against The Spurs towards the end of the regular season, WITH KAWHI playing, and WITHOUT DURANT. So it's really hard to say that we should've "expected" the series to play out how the first 2.5 quarters of game 1 had gone. The Spurs just couldn't miss and The Warriors just couldn't make a thing. They were obviously very rusty, couldn't make open shots, let alone contested. I give Spurs mad respect and think they are the 2nd best team in the league, and are 1 of 2 teams that always make me nervous (Cleveland) no matter how good I know my favorite team currently is. If Westbrook couldn't win with Durant and Ibaka and Harden I don't see him "carrying" Leonard past anyone. Durant left for a reason, I don't think any superstar is going to stay with stat padding Westbrook longer than they have to TBH.

kdspurman
07-05-2017, 07:41 PM
Lebron would've smoked San Antonio in the Finals last season, with or without Kawahi. And with or without a "coach" drawing up pick and roll diagrams.

You could tell San Antonio was mailing it in in the playoffs, and all season it was pretty obvious they could Peyton Manning their way to a nice record but weren't getting past the other top two or three teams in the West.

Popovich built a reputation around Duncan but Duncan was the real engine of that machine, both character and leadership-wise and also being a legit MVP caliber hall of famer and the best power forward ever.

Without Duncan so far they're a well disciplined clever offensive team that plays team defense and has results about like the Clippers.

So much wrong with this :confused:

s3antana5757
07-05-2017, 08:36 PM
Probably not this off-season, but if LA can get 3 max contracts for next year, they've got a shot. LeBron, PG13, Westbrook.

jphysics
07-05-2017, 08:42 PM
When I read the title of this thread, my first thought was "Lebron to the Spurs". I think that could get it done.

No realistic moves though at this point. If CP3 had gone to the Spurs, or Paul George had gone to the Cavs, then we might have something to talk about.

Basically if either the Cavs or the Spurs add another super star without giving up anything valuable, then they could compete. But it looks like that's not going to happen this year. Nobody else has a shot.

I think we should just merge the Spurs and the Cavs into the Spavs, and have them play the Warriors.

IKnowHoops
07-05-2017, 08:44 PM
I'd take the tandem of Lebron and Kawaii over Durant and Curry all day. The only thing is, Durant and Curry are a reality and Lebron and Kawaii are a dream.

Nikeman
07-05-2017, 08:45 PM
Why do you want Golden State to lose so badly? Is it a competition thing or do you just despise them so much that you are rooting for anybody they play to beat them?

I've been a Warriors fan since the latter end of the Chris Mullin days. I don't understand the hate for them at all. They have done things THE RIGHT WAY. Kevin Durant is THE ONLY big acquisition that this team has made to become a "super team" They drafted 3 of their 4 stars, and won a ring and 73 games before Durant was even there. They made intelligent trades and free agent acquisitions over the years and because they have worked so hard and made so many good decisions they have been rewarded. Kevin Durant wanted to go to The Warriors because they were already a GREAT team with a GREAT system, a GREAT fan base and a GREAT team morale.

They have taken their lumps and have earned everything that has come to them recently. This is not some Lakers type franchise, that just takes advantage of being in Los Angeles or New York. They aren't The Boston Celtics with more rings than they can count who have always gotten lucky and have always had the best players. The guys on the team? Curry is an angel. Durant might have rubbed people the wrong way with his decision but he is also an angel. Great guys on and off the court. Klay Thompson is a quiet guy, never said a negative thing about anyone. Draymond Green is a bit of a douche sometimes (I'm a 49ers fan and I consider him the Richard Sherman of The NBA so I understand people not liking him) but off the court he's shown to be a good guy as well. These guys all work EXTREMELY hard, they were all underdogs (besides Durant) So why do people hate them? The Warriors hadn't won in 40 years, can they not have a turn? Are people really so insecure and jealous that when a franchise puts in the work and gets what they deserve that everyone just "prays" for anything that could possibly that will lead to them losing? Don't like it

Good post. I definitely respect GS management, they would have done what any GM/Owner would do, add a top 2 player and a top 20 all time talent in his god damn prime. Stephen Curry was dead in the water with his injuries and he rebounded to a back to back unanimous MVP. I love Klay. He's quiet, does his job, and when his shooting is off, he will still damn well make an impact. I like Draymond, especially his D, but I think his offense and play making ability is definitely overhyped. When you play with arguably the greatest shooters in NBA history, literally #1 and #2, you will rack up assists, and get wide open looks.

The hate for me, and many others I feel is for KD. GS was a 73 win team and probably the favorites at the beginning of the year without KD. The #2 best player in the league joined the team. No **** you are gonna win titles and look amazing, teams can barely afford to double you. Your OKC Thunder were up 3-1 and YOU choked. Rather than avenge your own 3-1 loss, you go and help GS avenge their 3-1 loss. KD is a spineless guy.

What this has also done is almost ruin basketball. No team as of today stands a chance to win except GS. If KD stayed in OKC, you could have had 3-4 legit contenders. OKC themselves, the Spurs, Cavs, and this years Rockets, and maybe even a healthy Clippers team. Now GS is so far above the rest of the league its not even fun watching.

IKnowHoops
07-05-2017, 08:49 PM
Next off season is going to be the biggest off season in history. If GS wins again this year, I can see Bron, PG13, Westbrook, and more teaming up on the lakers to give GS a proper beating.

IKnowHoops
07-05-2017, 08:50 PM
Next offseason, the GOAT team will be assembled. Guys will be taking pay cuts...Bron def will.

Mark my words, a team will form to beat GS. Gonna be funny.

Bostonjorge
07-05-2017, 10:07 PM
Westbrook, James and George is more then enough to take down GS once and for all.

Nikeman
07-05-2017, 11:16 PM
Best part is we get to see how WB and PG13 coexist this year. Then you can picture adding LeBron to that next year.

IKnowHoops
07-06-2017, 05:24 AM
Best part is we get to see how WB and PG13 coexist this year. Then you can picture adding LeBron to that next year.

They should go join Leonard in San Antonio and let Pop coach them.

PG Westbrook
SG PG13
SF Kahwai
PF Chosen One
C. Aldridge

IKnowHoops
07-06-2017, 05:32 AM
Or maybe start a new dynasty and go win as a Twolf.

PG. Westbrook
SG. PG13/Wiggins
SF. Butler
PF. Chosen One
C. Towns

This is the kind of team that would absolutely wreck GS. I think I see Westbrook and Bron teaming up. Would be the ultimate get-back for both Westbrook and Bron to beat KD together when KD couldn't get it right with Westy.

There is no way this team could loose to GS

Saddletramp
07-06-2017, 05:52 AM
Couldn't lose, either.

basch152
07-06-2017, 06:23 AM
I mean that's the narrative but the results don't really bear that out.

Obviously can't be as good at somethings as big dudes like AD and KAT.

And obviously he's not as offensively spectacular as Curry, Harden etc.

He's also not as athletic as Westbrook, Lebron and now Wiggins is coming up.

It's questionable whether he's a better defender than Draymond, Goebert... especially Lebron.

So I mean mashing the numbers and claiming "Kawahi is the best two way player in the game the past two years".... what does that mean really? Like he is so balanced that he is like the perfect player and actually better/more valuable than Curry or Lebron? Or several other guys at least?

he's a nice player but I don't see him as the best no way

Lol, LeBron is a very solid defender, but he's been incredibly overrated on that end his entire career.

He's definitely not been close to as good as kawhi.

IKnowHoops
07-06-2017, 12:08 PM
Lol, LeBron is a very solid defender, but he's been incredibly overrated on that end his entire career.

He's definitely not been close to as good as kawhi.

He's underrated. The tole of carrying a team has always been on him. If all he had to do is just play free, he'd be an absolute savage 24/7 on defense. Def right there with Leonard and able to guard bigger stronger people.

BoSox47
07-06-2017, 01:25 PM
I am looking at three teams who I think can even make a small effort to make GS even work.

1) Cleveland
2) San Antonion
3) Houston

I was praying PG13 went to a contender like Houston/Cleveland but then Pritchard sent him to OKC... Paul George in Cleveland would have been an extremely interesting match-up with GS.

At this point, Cleveland landing Melo without giving up Love may make a more intriguing series. People keep saying Melo doesn't play D, but the finals had no defense anyway. Aside from Game 1, Cleveland averaged like 120 a game themselves. Melo would give Cleveland another elite scorer to go with Irving and makes GS not be able to rotate 3 guys onto LeBron.

Signings like a 36 year old Calderon just aren't going to cut it, esp if GS is adding people like Jamal Crawford potentially. Vets like Tony Allen for his D, Afflalo as cheap signings?

Maybe a S&T for a player like Rudy Gay..

Not really sure what Houston/SA could do anymore either. Sad as it sounds, you almost have to see a KD/Steph injury happen to see a competitive NBA this year. Even if Klay/Draymond get injured, I still think GS wipes the floor.

At least every star left the East for the Cavs to basically walk into the finals lol.

FWIW, Vegas has the Celtics at better odds to win the championship than Houston.

nastynice
07-06-2017, 11:17 PM
Next offseason, the GOAT team will be assembled. Guys will be taking pay cuts...Bron def will.

Mark my words, a team will form to beat GS. Gonna be funny.

You got the last line right, at least :)

Sssmush
07-07-2017, 01:33 AM
Or maybe start a new dynasty and go win as a Twolf.

PG. Westbrook
SG. PG13/Wiggins
SF. Butler
PF. Chosen One
C. Towns

This is the kind of team that would absolutely wreck GS. I think I see Westbrook and Bron teaming up. Would be the ultimate get-back for both Westbrook and Bron to beat KD together when KD couldn't get it right with Westy.

There is no way this team could loose to GS


The only problem is it comes down to who can make some shots from 3 and so actually this super team probably loses to GSW in a real series.

basch152
07-07-2017, 01:41 AM
He's underrated. The tole of carrying a team has always been on him. If all he had to do is just play free, he'd be an absolute savage 24/7 on defense. Def right there with Leonard and able to guard bigger stronger people.

He's been a below average man defender most of his career, he stepped up his game and was elite in Miami, but took another step back largely due to loss of athleticism after Miami. He's definitely never been there with kawhi. That is completely ridiculous.

I can tell when people are just being homers or nuthuggers. Whenever I hear that "he can guard 1-5". He isn't quick enough to guard most higher end PGs, and he isn't big enough to guard most centers, granted there isn't many great centers to take advantage of that if he were to guard them.

And of the day, he's been average at best most of his career.

JordansBulls
07-07-2017, 11:03 PM
Yes if the Bulls kept Rondo and Jimmy and everyone was healthy we would have beaten the Warriors.

IKnowHoops
07-07-2017, 11:40 PM
He's been a below average man defender most of his career, he stepped up his game and was elite in Miami, but took another step back largely due to loss of athleticism after Miami. He's definitely never been there with kawhi. That is completely ridiculous.

I can tell when people are just being homers or nuthuggers. Whenever I hear that "he can guard 1-5". He isn't quick enough to guard most higher end PGs, and he isn't big enough to guard most centers, granted there isn't many great centers to take advantage of that if he were to guard them.

And of the day, he's been average at best most of his career.

Last year in the playoffs he was the number 1 defender when measuring average points of players vs the points players put up when Bron guarded them.

Better than KL by a lot.

You have not a clue to what you are talking about.

Watch more. Hate less. You sound idiotic as hell to anyone who watches Bron play regularly.

nastynice
07-08-2017, 12:36 AM
Last year in the playoffs he was the number 1 defender when measuring average points of players vs the points players put up when Bron guarded them.

Better than KL by a lot.

You have not a clue to what you are talking about.

Watch more. Hate less. You sound idiotic as hell to anyone who watches Bron play regularly.

I don't know, didn't watch too much east playoffs, but while following my dubs I certainly noticed how hard KD **** on lebron

Left that boy on the floor at one point, lol

nastynice
07-08-2017, 01:33 AM
Sry, I be tryina talk **** to you, but the only way is to trash lebron. The guy's a ****in legend already, I ain't hating. I enjoy a nice healthy rivalry

*plus it was his game 4 temper tantrum last year that lead to this whole thing. Then a whole lotta other stuff that went down, including the guy going beast, but I ain't gonna lie, the revenge is sweet

It's still going tho, this thing ain't over just yet. We'll get some years, especially if lebron realign with something semi built. Even if in the west, **** it, remember how many years the lakers Spurs in the west was basically the finals. Then finally Detroit came up

prodigy
07-09-2017, 12:07 PM
You sound like some of my Celtics fans friends trying to argue we're not that far off of CLE lol

Well my team has Lebron lol. the best player in the world. we also beat the warriors in the finals before. So i def don't think we are far off. Need help though for sure.

prodigy
07-09-2017, 12:13 PM
Lmfao at people who are acting like Wade and Melo are just complete scrubs now because they aren't as good as they used to be. People are so quick with the "out with the old, in with the new" stuff. That's one of the main reasons people were trying to say Curry was the best when it was still easily LeBron. They liked his style of play and were tired of LeBron being the best.

This... Shocking the lack of respect and knowledge of basketball some show.

Scoots
07-09-2017, 12:20 PM
This... Shocking the lack of respect and knowledge of basketball some show.

Not that surprising considering how it seems every team has starters someone describes as "garbage". It seems a player in the NBA is either a star or garbage.

WaDe03
07-09-2017, 12:26 PM
Not that surprising considering how it seems every team has starters someone describes as "garbage". It seems a player in the NBA is either a star or garbage.

Yea it's pretty annoying. Take Carroll for example, he has a nice skill set that would fit well with some teams. Look at him on that Hawks team that moved the ball, he was a very solid 3 and D guy and that's why he got hat contract. The Raptors didn't use him right and now he's garbage to people lol. They didn't use him right offensively but they're going to miss his defense for sure. Who's their defensive guy now? They lost PJ and Carroll, they've definitely regressed by losing their "garbage".

Vee-Rex
07-09-2017, 12:40 PM
Posted in the wrong thread lol.

Scoots
07-09-2017, 12:45 PM
I don't understand how teams still undervalue draft picks.