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kobe4thewinbang
06-29-2017, 08:49 AM
Rumor has it he will first meet with the Miami Heat, then the Utah Jazz, and lastly the Boston Celtics, reportedly only interested in signing with the three organizations. I've seen rumors of a Paul George deal being in place if the Celtics were to acquire Hayward, but Pat Riley also seems to be in the mix.

http://www.nba.com/article/2017/06/29/morning-shootaround-june-29-2017#jazz

Interesting that he is seeing the Heat first. Lamarcus Aldridge for example met with the Spurs after he met with the Lakers. Not sure if it means much, but it could be telling that the Celtics are last for Hayward. The flight pattern is a bit odd, if that factors into things. He's going to Miami, then back to Utah, then way over to Boston. Clearly, the Heat lack the talent of the Celtics and Jazz but I can see why players enjoy this opportunity to hear pitches and whatnot.

Where do you think he goes, or does he stick with the Jazz? Are you surprised he isn't visiting more teams?

ruckus16969
06-29-2017, 08:56 AM
Unfortunately I don't think he goes to Boston

MILLERHIGHLIFE
06-29-2017, 09:03 AM
Its been reported PG13 will pretty much accept 3 year extension with Celtics if they sign Hayward first. But does that also apply if Heat do the same thing?

Vinylman
06-29-2017, 09:07 AM
Its been reported PG13 will pretty much accept 3 year extension with Celtics if they sign Hayward first. But does that also apply if Heat do the same thing?

Not buying that report at all... not saying he won't but there is just way to much uncertainty to believe that decision has been made contingent upon a just Hayward signing...

Jetsguy
06-29-2017, 09:13 AM
For how many times fans of NY and LA teams think people will come there just because of the market/location and all that comes with it I think Miami may be the only place where that actually happens.

hugepatsfan
06-29-2017, 09:16 AM
For how many times fans of NY and LA teams think people will come there just because of the market/location and all that comes with it I think Miami may be the only place where that actually happens.

It happened in 2010 but what other notable FA have they ever signed other than that?

I think Miami has a ton to offer but their FA reputation is so overstated because of one year.

Vinylman
06-29-2017, 10:08 AM
It happened in 2010 but what other notable FA have they ever signed other than that?

I think Miami has a ton to offer but their FA reputation is so overstated because of one year.

exactly... I wasn't even going to waste my time pointing that out...

TrueFan420
06-29-2017, 10:19 AM
Not buying that report at all... not saying he won't but there is just way to much uncertainty to believe that decision has been made contingent upon a just Hayward signing...

I don't think it's just about Hayward tho. The Celtics have some top picks too and IT and Horford. Very good role players too. That would be a very very good team. One that's built to challenge now and in the future.

Plus after the speculation that he called up Klay to go to LA with him Klay was quoted as saying he has a taste for winning and that's far more important that chasing money or the lime light.

hugepatsfan
06-29-2017, 10:28 AM
I don't know what will happen but I feel VERY confident that Boston is the best place for him basketball wise.

I actually think Utah was better than Boston last year BUT that's comparing the Jazz with Hayward to BOS without him. The only significant player BOS needs to let go for Hayward is Olynyk and he's nothing special. So it's not like we need to subtract for him. Guys like Terry Rozier, Gerald Green, Amir Johnson, Jonas Jerebko are ancillary parts. Between Ante Zizic coming over from Europe, Tatum being drafted and then Hayward himself signing I feel like we easily replace Olynyk and that band of misfits. Green is probably back on a vet min deal anyway.

MIA is really the same thing. BOS w/out Hayward was better than MIA w/out Hayward last year and they have to subtract more from their roster to make the cap space than we do. They need to let one of James Johnson/Dion Waiters go along with Willie Reed, Luke Babbitt, Wayne Ellington who all played roles for them.

So I think just signing Hayward is easily the best basketball situation for BOS out of all those teams. That's not even mentioning the possibility of a PG trade after that for Bradley, Crowder and future picks as has been rumored. And that deal is still going to leave them with Brown, Tatum, 2018 BRK pick, Ante Zizic/Guerschon Yabusele as Euro prospects. I'd say in addition to being better right now, there's more room for growth on Boston's roster than MIA's or Utah's - either by developing young players picks or packaging them in trades for more stars.

So again, if you're looking strictly basketball wise I feel VERY confident in saying BOS is the best situation now and in the future.

Vinylman
06-29-2017, 10:28 AM
I don't think it's just about Hayward tho. The Celtics have some top picks too and IT and Horford. Very good role players too. That would be a very very good team. One that's built to challenge now and in the future.

Plus after the speculation that he called up Klay to go to LA with him Klay was quoted as saying he has a taste for winning and that's far more important that chasing money or the lime light.

there is no way RIGHT NOW that PG13 has AGREED to that... if he had then Indy loses all leverage in negotiations with Boston...

Like I said in my original post that you quoted... it might happen ... but there is just to many moving parts around the league and every indication is that PG13 is still trying to recruit guys to LA which there would be no point to do if he has already agreed to go to Boston

And yes ... that squad you outlined in Boston would be very solid except they should look immediately to move Horford and IT

Dade County
06-29-2017, 10:39 AM
Things to point out.

Why isn't the home team last? Utah should be positioning themselves to be the last voice Gordan hears.

Miami is in position, to make something happen so he cancel the other two meetings; like if they already have a deal with another free agent All Star or a trade in place already, timming it out when Hayward lands in Miami.

Utah should be worried they are in the middle. It doesn't make sense they allowed to be put in that position.

Back to Miami, it's good they are going first, so they can put everything on the table, if Hayward doesn't accepts then we can go after other free agents to pair them together in Miami.

Pat is aiming for 2 to 3 players. Either combination of players is fine, and elevates Miami to the ECF, i believe.

hugepatsfan
06-29-2017, 10:46 AM
Last year Miami goes last with Durant... THIS IS PERFECT LET RILEY HAVE THE LAST SAY!

This year they go first with Hayward... THIS IS PERFECT NOW RILEY IS IN POSITION TO MAKE HIM CANCEL ON OTHERS!

I think MIA's a great spot and I wouldn't be shocked if he goes there but I just love to bust MIA fans on how they twist everything to Riley is a God and gets everything he wants lol

Dade County
06-29-2017, 10:48 AM
Its been reported PG13 will pretty much accept 3 year extension with Celtics if they sign Hayward first. But does that also apply if Heat do the same thing?

Just like Vinylman, there is NO reason to believe this report. This is wishful thinking for the Boston media agenda that I've been noticing for the past two years.

PG agent already told us, he wants LA. He has told teams, that as a free agent he is targetting LA.

The only news i heard that differs from that is... He liked a post on IG or twitter, of him be traded to Miami, & until i see that, I really don't believe.

hugepatsfan
06-29-2017, 10:51 AM
Just like Vinylman, there is NO reason to believe this report. This is wishful thinking for the Boston media agenda that I've been noticing for the past two years.

PG agent already told us, he wants LA. He has told teams, that as a free agent he is targetting LA.

The only news i heard that differs from that is... He liked a post on IG or twitter, of him be traded to Miami, & until i see that, I really don't believe.

He retweeted an article of Pierce saying BOS should trade their pick for a star.

There have been reports now that he would re-sign with BOS, SA or CLE as well because he considers them title contenders. That's not from a Boston media guy.

Last week a Boston guy reported this Hayward/PG with extension scenario and even we in Boston wrote it off but then Woj picked it up (minus the extension part) and others have started to talk about more willingness to re-sign in places other than LA. Not sure if that means extend right away or more that he's open to it if the year goes well. I think it's more the latter so I agree no extension in place.

Dade County
06-29-2017, 10:51 AM
Last year Miami goes last with Durant... THIS IS PERFECT LET RILEY HAVE THE LAST SAY!

This year they go first with Hayward... THIS IS PERFECT NOW RILEY IS IN POSITION TO MAKE HIM CANCEL ON OTHERS!

I think MIA's a great spot and I wouldn't be shocked if he goes there but I just love to bust MIA fans on how they twist everything to Riley is a God and gets everything he wants lol

We do like Riley lol

But it's also good for Pat, so if Pat puts everything on the table & Hayward doesn't commit we move on to other free agents quickly.

Just like Boston, Miami is after 2 all stars. So as long as Miami gets 2 key free agents, thats all we can ask for as fans.

Dade County
06-29-2017, 10:54 AM
He retweeted an article of Pierce saying BOS should trade their pick for a star.

There have been reports now that he would re-sign with BOS, SA or CLE as well because he considers them title contenders. That's not from a Boston media guy.

Last week a Boston guy reported this Hayward/PG with extension scenario and even we in Boston wrote it off but then Woj picked it up (minus the extension part) and others have started to talk about more willingness to re-sign in places other than LA. Not sure if that means extend right away or more that he's open to it if the year goes well. I think it's more the latter so I agree no extension in place.

I can believe no extension in place. & PG sees how the year plays out.

hugepatsfan
06-29-2017, 10:55 AM
We do like Riley lol

But it's also good for Pat, so if Pat puts everything on the table & Hayward doesn't commit we move on to other free agents quickly.

Just like Boston, Miami is after 2 all stars. So as long as Miami gets 2 key free agents, thats all we can ask for as fans.

2 all stars could happen but I think that's an unfair expectation. You guys have about $36M in cap space I think now. To get two all stars you guys will need to clear another $24M. Basically it's impossible without moving Dragic. And the trade assets aren't great.

Never say never but I think you guys are being unfair to Riley expecting that. Really good position for one but two is probably unrealistic.

Vee-Rex
06-29-2017, 10:58 AM
Boston is definitely the best situation for Hayward to go to and I believe that's where he'll go. The following is speculation: the thing I'm not certain about is the PG13 extension (despite the reports). I think if George decides on a team other than the Lakers then he wants to win NOW, and I'm not sure IT/Hayward/PG13 will get it done vs. Cleveland, and especially not GS. Joining the Spurs or Cavs would likely give him a better chance to win a championship. Boston having tons of youth and future assets might not be as appealing to him.

Of course they could try to acquire even more talent, and that's probably something George would want before agreeing to an extension with Boston.

I think he'll be traded within a week and it's probably gonna be to one of those 3 teams (not sure if HOU has what it takes but we'll see).

Jetsguy
06-29-2017, 11:09 AM
It happened in 2010 but what other notable FA have they ever signed other than that?

I think Miami has a ton to offer but their FA reputation is so overstated because of one year.

Not necessarily signed there but they get visits as reported her and with KD last year etc when in all reality they dont have nearly enough to offer basketball wise compared to some of these other places.

Vinylman
06-29-2017, 11:13 AM
He retweeted an article of Pierce saying BOS should trade their pick for a star.

There have been reports now that he would re-sign with BOS, SA or CLE as well because he considers them title contenders. That's not from a Boston media guy.

Last week a Boston guy reported this Hayward/PG with extension scenario and even we in Boston wrote it off but then Woj picked it up (minus the extension part) and others have started to talk about more willingness to re-sign in places other than LA. Not sure if that means extend right away or more that he's open to it if the year goes well. I think it's more the latter so I agree no extension in place.

The bolded was my point

I am positive that Boston wants to do what has been reported... what I say is BS is the extension part

AT THIS POINT

hugepatsfan
06-29-2017, 11:13 AM
Obviously I hope BOS pulls off Hayward/PG but curiosity wise I'm almost more interested in seeing what Ainge would do if it doesn't work out. TBH I have no ****ing idea what they'd do.

They could try the Hayward/PG scenario with Blake instead of PG.

They could go after a lower tier FA like Gallinari and still try for PG. Or go for Gallinari and not try for PG.

They could just load up on a couple more good role players like Dedmon and James Johnson to get better and hope the picks become their stars.

They could trade for Paul George and try to go with just him and role players instead of Hayward.

They could go after one year guys stash the cap space for next year (that would take some salary dumps though).

They could sell off pieces and try to start not necessarily from scratch but definitely step out of any semblance of "win-now" mode.

hugepatsfan
06-29-2017, 11:14 AM
Not necessarily signed there but they get visits as reported her and with KD last year etc when in all reality they dont have nearly enough to offer basketball wise compared to some of these other places.

Yeah but I feel the Lakers and Knicks get plenty of meetings with those guys. LMA went to LAL for a meeting. Melo did. Lebron and them all visited NY in 2010. I could go on and on.

AntiG
06-29-2017, 11:50 AM
It happened in 2010 but what other notable FA have they ever signed other than that?

I think Miami has a ton to offer but their FA reputation is so overstated because of one year.

The big advantage Miami can offer amongst the targets for Hayward is money. They can offer the max + no state tax. That's a huge difference. Boston can offer the least money of his prospective employers but the most upside to win by far given their existing roster and future high draft picks. Additionally, they can offer the best package in a trade for another star.

hugepatsfan
06-29-2017, 12:23 PM
https://twitter.com/AdamMKaufman/status/880453513570123776


One thing working against #Jazz in Gordon Hayward sweepstakes: per source, he's upset with Utah's reluctance to pay Hill/Ingles big money.

Finances can play a big part in this. Not just what he makes but with the other pieces. Utah will need to go into the luxury tax to keep their team together. MIA will have to next year and so will Boston if they keep the teams around him in place. BOS will have to go deeeeeeeeeeeeeep if they do the PG scenario and keep IT.

I'd expect future willingness to pay to be a huge discussion point.

WestCoastSportz
06-29-2017, 12:39 PM
I"m not sure why Indiana isn't getting any love with Hayward. It just makes sense for both parties. Indiana is on the verge of losing their best player who happens to be a small forward like Hayward. The Pacers are well under the cap and offer Hayward the same amount as any other team, except for the extra year with the Jazz. Hayward is also an Indiana native. Just a perfect fit. I would be in talks with the Blake Griffin and see if he would come to Indiana. If he does, then he should opt in of his contract so that the Pacers can trade George to the Clippers for him. Hayward, Griffin and Turner would make for a very nice front court in the East. I think thats a team that can compete with the Cavs and the Celtics.

dhopisthename
06-29-2017, 12:42 PM
btw the schedule order seems to be a mystery right now. it was first reported that it was going to be Miami Saturday, Boston Sunday, and Utah Monday, but now they are reports that the celtics want to meet last or something. no one knows for sure

dhopisthename
06-29-2017, 12:43 PM
I"m not sure why Indiana isn't getting any love with Hayward. It just makes sense for both parties. Indiana is on the verge of losing their best player who happens to be a small forward like Hayward. The Pacers are well under the cap and offer Hayward the same amount as any other team, except for the extra year with the Jazz. Hayward is also an Indiana native. Just a perfect fit. I would be in talks with the Blake Griffin and see if he would come to Indiana. If he does, then he should opt in of his contract so that the Pacers can trade George to the Clippers for him. Hayward, Griffin and Turner would make for a very nice front court in the East. I think thats a team that can compete with the Cavs and the Celtics.

cause hayward wants to win and if they lose george they aren't winning anytime soon.

Firefistus
06-29-2017, 01:37 PM
https://twitter.com/AdamMKaufman/status/880453513570123776



Finances can play a big part in this. Not just what he makes but with the other pieces. Utah will need to go into the luxury tax to keep their team together. MIA will have to next year and so will Boston if they keep the teams around him in place. BOS will have to go deeeeeeeeeeeeeep if they do the PG scenario and keep IT.

I'd expect future willingness to pay to be a huge discussion point.

Actually they won't. AND they already have Joe Ingles tied to a Restricted Free Agent contract. The only other person we have to sign is George Hill, who we probably aren't going to keep unless he signs for around 15 million.

Unless the luxury tax comes in at 115 the Jazz won't hit it.

FYI, the owner has stated she's willing to go into luxury cap a few years if they need it. (Dennis Lindsay has stated it on the radio several times).

So that won't be much of an issue for Utah anyways. If they decide to keep George Hill and pick up another piece using the MLE.

They are also looking to change up the roster a bit, people are suspecting Burks is going to be gone this summer, and probably Favors. But that's just speculation for now.

smith&wesson
06-29-2017, 01:41 PM
Probably will end up in Houston

hugepatsfan
06-29-2017, 01:51 PM
Actually they won't. AND they already have Joe Ingles tied to a Restricted Free Agent contract. The only other person we have to sign is George Hill, who we probably aren't going to keep unless he signs for around 15 million.

Unless the luxury tax comes in at 115 the Jazz won't hit it.

FYI, the owner has stated she's willing to go into luxury cap a few years if they need it. (Dennis Lindsay has stated it on the radio several times).

So that won't be much of an issue for Utah anyways. If they decide to keep George Hill and pick up another piece using the MLE.

They are also looking to change up the roster a bit, people are suspecting Burks is going to be gone this summer, and probably Favors. But that's just speculation for now.

Well my point is that unless they let players go they'll hit the tax. I know that they won't hit it if they let Hill go but that's my point. Unless they want to subtract from the team they will need to pay that tax to some degree.

We already know the Jazz aren't even close to good enough of as-is. So if you just keep Hayward and subtract other pieces then how can you sell him he has a chance to win there?

Dade County
06-29-2017, 02:04 PM
I would be in talks with the Blake Griffin and see if he would come to Indiana. If he does, then he should opt in of his contract so that the Pacers can trade George to the Clippers for him. Hayward, Griffin and Turner would make for a very nice front court in the East. I think thats a team that can compete with the Cavs and the Celtics.

HEAT are going to try to pair two of these All-Stars together.

Blake & Hayward.

HEAT can trade contracts away to make room & creat their big 4.

Also if Blake or Hayward says they only want to come to Miami; one of them can approach their former team and say would you like to get something and Miami can trade some of the contracts to that team.

Anyway you look at it Miami is in position to strike. Is Just up to the players if they want to play in Miami, alongside Whiteside and dragic.



btw the schedule order seems to be a mystery right now. it was first reported that it was going to be Miami Saturday, Boston Sunday, and Utah Monday, but now they are reports that the celtics want to meet last or something. no one knows for sure

Jazz should aim to go last, anything other than that doesn't make sense.

hugepatsfan
06-29-2017, 05:34 PM
https://twitter.com/ESPNSteinLine/status/880532659943874561


Reported here during the NBA Finals that the threat posed by Miami concerns Utah as much as Boston ... but the Celts have ramped it up since

*Eyes Emoji* lol

MILLERHIGHLIFE
06-29-2017, 05:59 PM
Obviously I hope BOS pulls off Hayward/PG but curiosity wise I'm almost more interested in seeing what Ainge would do if it doesn't work out. TBH I have no ****ing idea what they'd do.

They could try the Hayward/PG scenario with Blake instead of PG.

They could go after a lower tier FA like Gallinari and still try for PG. Or go for Gallinari and not try for PG.

They could just load up on a couple more good role players like Dedmon and James Johnson to get better and hope the picks become their stars.

They could trade for Paul George and try to go with just him and role players instead of Hayward.

They could go after one year guys stash the cap space for next year (that would take some salary dumps though).

They could sell off pieces and try to start not necessarily from scratch but definitely step out of any semblance of "win-now" mode.

Signing Blake would be costly besides still have to sign Hayward if you can. You guys got like what $29M projection for cap? I think that's what basketballinsiders.com said.

FOXHOUND
06-29-2017, 07:36 PM
HEAT are going to try to pair two of these All-Stars together.

Blake & Hayward.

HEAT can trade contracts away to make room & creat their big 4.

Also if Blake or Hayward says they only want to come to Miami; one of them can approach their former team and say would you like to get something and Miami can trade some of the contracts to that team.

Anyway you look at it Miami is in position to strike. Is Just up to the players if they want to play in Miami, alongside Whiteside and dragic.

What am I missing here?

Take out Bosh's money and waive Wayne Ellington's non-guaranteed $6.2M and Miami still only has about $33.9M of cap space. I suppose they can pull the ole Michael Beasley in 2010 and use Winslow to dump McRoberts contract, but that still leaves them with just $41M or so. That would still leave them $18M or so short from offering Hayward and Blake a max and they sure as hell are not taking a pay cut that large.

They would have to move Whiteside to realistically get both. Maybe that's why they drafted Adebayo...

Dade County
06-29-2017, 08:50 PM
What am I missing here?

Take out Bosh's money and waive Wayne Ellington's non-guaranteed $6.2M and Miami still only has about $33.9M of cap space. I suppose they can pull the ole Michael Beasley in 2010 and use Winslow to dump McRoberts contract, but that still leaves them with just $41M or so. That would still leave them $18M or so short from offering Hayward and Blake a max and they sure as hell are not taking a pay cut that large.

They would have to move Whiteside to realistically get both. Maybe that's why they drafted Adebayo...

I believe Miami is around 36.2...

Whiteside - $23.77
Dragic - $17
McBob - $6
TJ - $5.88
Ellington - $6.27
Winslow - $2.71
JRich - $1.47
Mcgruder - $1.32
White - $1.32
Bam - $2.49

Trade: Tj, McRob, Winslow... Waive who we have to waive...etc

Dragic. 17mil
PG 19mil
Hayward 28mil (Miami no State Tax)
?
Whiteside 24mil

Or... It depends how Pat & Spo want to shape this team.

Dragon 17mil
?
Hayward 27mil
Blake 27mil (BG max is 29mil)
Whiteside 24mil

& Pat just targets ring chases an minimum contract players lol

Pat will figure out the Cap holds...etc

LA_Raiders
06-29-2017, 08:55 PM
Looks like Boston is the best destination, unless Miami can pull another star.

jneises21
06-29-2017, 10:50 PM
Brad Stevens recruited him when he was a nobody. He got biggers schools to offer after senior year, but stayed loyal to Stevens. I think that connection brings him to Boston

JAZZNC
06-30-2017, 01:48 AM
The Jazz gutted the team for him and gave him a max, made the team "his" when he hadn't earned it. I know he's earned the right to do whatever he wants but it'll be a dick move if he bolts now. If he plays for the Celtics, he's just another guy. If he stays with the Jazz long term he probably gets his jersey in the rafters. But honestly we in all likelihood won't win jack with him as our best player so I dunno. I just don't wanna go back to being completely irrelevant.

Dade County
06-30-2017, 02:27 AM
The Jazz gutted the team for him and gave him a max, made the team "his" when he hadn't earned it. I know he's earned the right to do whatever he wants but it'll be a dick move if he bolts now. If he plays for the Celtics, he's just another guy. If he stays with the Jazz long term he probably gets his jersey in the rafters. But honestly we in all likelihood won't win jack with him as our best player so I dunno. I just don't wanna go back to being completely irrelevant.

Good points..

But we are in the super team era. & whats not right, is talented players never really having a shot at winning it all.

Then getting criticized a decade later, for not having won anything. Only thing i can think of is if the League has the power to balance out teams at any point in time. But no one would trust them, meaning the fans & players...etc

JAZZNC
06-30-2017, 02:44 AM
What sucks is that without GS I feel like we would only be a move here or there away from competing for a championship but as it stands there really isn't any feasible way to compete with those guys which makes me wonder if keeping Hayward is really all that big of a deal? I really want to keep him by the way, I just wonder if it makes any difference in the long run???

Dade County
06-30-2017, 03:03 AM
What sucks is that without GS I feel like we would only be a move here or there away from competing for a championship but as it stands there really isn't any feasible way to compete with those guys which makes me wonder if keeping Hayward is really all that big of a deal? I really want to keep him by the way, I just wonder if it makes any difference in the long run???

On the money...

Kd with GS is just too much for most of the teams to handle. Cavs big 3 is also too much for the East.

This is why i have been pointing out, that Pat is going after 2 All Star players; to go alongside Whiteside & maybe Dragic.

Thats the only way to even have a chance against Cavs or GS.

hugepatsfan
06-30-2017, 09:39 AM
What sucks is that without GS I feel like we would only be a move here or there away from competing for a championship but as it stands there really isn't any feasible way to compete with those guys which makes me wonder if keeping Hayward is really all that big of a deal? I really want to keep him by the way, I just wonder if it makes any difference in the long run???

It doesn't make a difference and he doesn't really make a difference for BOS or MIA either.

Let's say Riley pulls off a Hayward/Blake haul. Won't even be close to challenging CLE never mind GS after gutting their entire roster for it.

BOS can pull off the Hayward/PG combo and they're still behind CLE (though a realistic shot because they're keeping pieces).

There really is no "win-now" situation for Hayward of the 3 teams he's talking to. Utah's selling point should almost be you won't win there either so might as well stay where you're comfortable at least" lol

hugepatsfan
06-30-2017, 09:49 AM
Signing Blake would be costly besides still have to sign Hayward if you can. You guys got like what $29M projection for cap? I think that's what basketballinsiders.com said.

By my calculations we're at $26,993,245 of cap space right now accounting for the following pieces:

Horford
IT
Bradley
Crowder
Smart
Brown
Rozier
Tatum (cap hold)
Ante Zizic (cap hold #23 pick last year who played Euro ball)
Guerschon Yabusele (cap hold for #16 pick last year who played Euro ball)
Demetrius Jackson ($650K guaranteed)

That's 11 players so a max FA would be our 12th, thus no need for roster holds to account for. This leaves us $2,706,756 short of a max slot at $29.7M. However there are two easy moves to make.

We can stash Yabusele overseas to remove his cap hold of $2,247,480. It does create a roster spot cap hold though so the net savings are $1,431,865.

To clear the rest we need to salary dump Terry Rozier while also attaching that $650K Jackson guarantee to him. (The $650K guaranttee makes it so that we'd actually lose space by cutting him but gain it by trading him away.)

They make those two quick moves and they'll have cap space for a max.

Wade n Fade
06-30-2017, 09:52 AM
I would rather go to Miami or stay in Utah. Utah for the 5 year max deal while having another piece in Rudy Robert. Miami is also better than Boston for the $ because of no state income tax. I believe Riley will get this wrapped up and Boston will have to go elsewhere for a scoring wing.

TheDish87
06-30-2017, 10:32 AM
The Jazz gutted the team for him and gave him a max, made the team "his" when he hadn't earned it. I know he's earned the right to do whatever he wants but it'll be a dick move if he bolts now. If he plays for the Celtics, he's just another guy. If he stays with the Jazz long term he probably gets his jersey in the rafters. But honestly we in all likelihood won't win jack with him as our best player so I dunno. I just don't wanna go back to being completely irrelevant.

in no way is leaving as an UFA a dick move. hes been there 7 years, he owes utah nothing.

WaDe03
06-30-2017, 10:44 AM
I hope he goes to Miami. Him and Griffin there would be nice but I don't see how they pull it off.

Dragic
JRich
Hayward
Griffin
Whiteside

Wade gets bought out and the rumors are true

Dragic
Wade
Hayward
Griffin
Whiteside

TheDish87
06-30-2017, 11:31 AM
i havent seen any link of Griffin to Miami. I saw yesterday that he is very interested in PHX.

Firefistus
06-30-2017, 12:45 PM
Clippers are going to offer him a super max, so I'm suspecting Blake re-signs in L.A. I wouldn't understand why he would leave to go to a rebuild from ground up, when he can stay where he is for a lot more money.

Gibby23
06-30-2017, 12:53 PM
I hope he goes to Miami. Him and Griffin there would be nice but I don't see how they pull it off.

Dragic
JRich
Hayward
Griffin
Whiteside

Wade gets bought out and the rumors are true

Dragic
Wade
Hayward
Griffin
Whiteside

Miami can't keep Whiteside and Dragic and afford both Hayward and Griffin. They would have to trade everyone else, including any draft picks they drafted and Griffin and Hayward would still have to take less than max because of the minimum cap holds for roster spots.

Not going to happen just to play with Whiteside and Dragic. Also, they don't have an MLE, and Wade isn't playing for the minimum.

Vee-Rex
06-30-2017, 01:22 PM
Hearing that we shouldn't count the Spurs out from making a run at Hayward. They whiffed on the CP3 sweepstakes but can still clear space to sign Hayward.

FOXHOUND
06-30-2017, 01:28 PM
Hearing that we shouldn't count the Spurs out from making a run at Hayward. They whiffed on the CP3 sweepstakes but can still clear space to sign Hayward.

Whaaaaa? That would be shocking. Where would he play?

hugepatsfan
06-30-2017, 01:38 PM
Whaaaaa? That would be shocking. Where would he play?

They'd probably have to salary dump Green to open up a spot. So Hayward would slide in at SG. They'd have to let Dedmon, Simmons, Mills, Gasol all walk though unless one of them would take the room exception for $4M.

Parker/Murray
Hayward/Forbes
Leonard/Betans
LMA/Anderson
???

Room exception and vet min deals to fill the rest of the team out.

Dade County
06-30-2017, 05:04 PM
Jazz getting desperate, trying to trade for Rubio. Lol

That mean George is out, can't afford him.

WaDe03
06-30-2017, 05:38 PM
Hayward is gone imo, especially if the Love to Utah rumor doesn't happen. They downgraded at PG and may lose Joe Ingles.

hugepatsfan
06-30-2017, 05:49 PM
Option #1

IT / Smart
Bradley
Brown / Tatum
Crowder
Horford / Zizic

(have to salary dump Rozier and stash Yabusele for max cap space)

Option 2

Dragic / Richardson
Waiters / Johnson
McGruder
Winslow / White
Whiteside / Bam

or

Dragic / Richardson
Johnson
Winslow / McGruder
Johnson / White
Whiteside / Bam

After they sign Hayward they'll have space to re-sign one of Waiters or James Johnson if they stretch McBob.

Option 3

Rubio / Exum
Ingles / Mitchell
Ingles / Hood
Diaw / Johnson
Gobert / Favors

This is what Utah has with the Rubio deal.



Hayward is going to sign with one of those supporting casts. MIA is last year's team that almost made the playoffs minus a starter (one of Johnson/Waiters) and also swapping out Willie Reed for their 1st round pick. Utah is last year's 2nd round, 50 win team minus their best player but adding Donovan Mitchell from the draft. BOS is last year's ECF runner-up minus their 7th man (Olynyk), 9th man (Rozier) and rotating 10th man (Green/Amir/Jerebko - but all could be vet min candidates) and adding a top 3 pick and a Euro big.

To me, I feel BOS is clearly the best situation there basketball wise.

Heediot
06-30-2017, 06:04 PM
Hearing that we shouldn't count the Spurs out from making a run at Hayward. They whiffed on the CP3 sweepstakes but can still clear space to sign Hayward.

These stars wives seem to have a big influence on where these guys are playing. The Spurs would have been a better option to go for a ship, but I guess the wifey prefers a bigger and or more lively city. Melo staying in NY trying to win back Lala, lmao. All these guys want to win, but how much are you willing to pay the price. Guys like Duncan, Dirk and Gasol talk the talk.

eDush
06-30-2017, 06:28 PM
Jazz getting desperate, trying to trade for Rubio. Lol

That mean George is out, can't afford him.Its not as much as it might seem compare to Rubio...did he learn how to play defense from Love? :facepalm:

eDush
06-30-2017, 06:30 PM
Hearing that we shouldn't count the Spurs out from making a run at Hayward. They whiffed on the CP3 sweepstakes but can still clear space to sign Hayward.

Whaaaaa? That would be shocking. Where would he play?They still need a PG with Parker likely to retire sooner or later....
:dance2:

FlashBolt
06-30-2017, 06:34 PM
Hayward is not good enough to have his own thread...

Gibby23
06-30-2017, 06:35 PM
Hayward is not good enough to have his own thread...

Probably the top FA this year, so yes, he is for this off-season.

eDush
06-30-2017, 06:36 PM
Hayward is not good enough to have his own thread...Oh yes he does...trust me on this :nod:

Barnes doesn't last offseason but he got tons :(

FlashBolt
06-30-2017, 06:36 PM
Oh yes he does...trust me on this :nod:

Barnes doesn't last offseason but he got tons :(

I wouldn't trust anything you say about basketball.

eDush
06-30-2017, 06:40 PM
Oh yes he does...trust me on this :nod:

Barnes doesn't last offseason but he got tons :(

I wouldn't trust anything you say about basketball.So you're a Barnes lover too like that WCS poster who said he would sign a poison pill to prevent the Dubs from matching?
:laugh:

FlashBolt
06-30-2017, 06:41 PM
So you're a Barnes lover too like that WCS poster who said he would sign a poison pill to prevent the Dubs from matching?
:laugh:

When did I say I was a Barnes lover? I just believe you lack any basketball insight because you're such a drugged up Warriors fan.

WaDe03
06-30-2017, 07:36 PM
Hayward is not good enough to have his own thread...

Top 6 guy in the move between CP3 Butler George Millsap Griffin and Hayward. I don't see a problem with it for this summer.

Heediot
07-01-2017, 04:52 AM
Hayward probably staying in Utah.

Aust
07-01-2017, 07:30 AM
I'm guessing Utah or Miami are more likely over Boston now that both Butler/George are no longer an option to pair him with.

PAOboston
07-01-2017, 07:31 AM
I'm guessing Utah or Miami are more likely over Boston now that both Butler/George are no longer an option to pair him with.
Boston still has IT and Horford which is better than whatever Miami and Utah currently have. But I think it is likely Hayward just stays at Utah.


Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

metswon69
07-01-2017, 08:12 AM
Utah: Most money
Miami: Funnest City
Boston: Best team

Its a hard choice.

Scoots
07-01-2017, 08:12 AM
When did I say I was a Barnes lover? I just believe you lack any basketball insight because you're such a drugged up Warriors fan.

Don't feel special, he does stuff like that to other Warriors fans too.

metswon69
07-01-2017, 08:12 AM
Boston still has IT and Horford which is better than whatever Miami and Utah currently have. But I think it is likely Hayward just stays at Utah.


Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

Little chance they overtake the Cavs without adding another star though.

Scoots
07-01-2017, 08:16 AM
Boston still has IT and Horford which is better than whatever Miami and Utah currently have. But I think it is likely Hayward just stays at Utah.


Rubio, Exum, Hood, Mitchell, *Favors, *Ingles, Gobert ... I'd rather play there than in Boston. The question to me is where they go next. The Celtics do have the huge advantage of playing in a 1 team strong conference.

PAOboston
07-01-2017, 08:18 AM
Rubio, Exum, Hood, Mitchell, *Favors, *Ingles, Gobert ... I'd rather play there than in Boston. The question to me is where they go next. The Celtics do have the huge advantage of playing in a 1 team strong conference.
The thing with Utah is that they are likely losing Hill and Ingles. The rest of the roster minus Gobert is meh. The C's roster has higher upside. But the familiarity with Utah, etc might be pretty appealing to him.

Who knows? This NBA off-season is straight up whack.

Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

warfelg
07-01-2017, 08:24 AM
I think some team that no one has talked about is going to end up with Gordon Hayward now.

warfelg
07-01-2017, 08:27 AM
The thing with Utah is that they are likely losing Hill and Ingles. The rest of the roster minus Gobert is meh. The C's roster has higher upside. But the familiarity with Utah, etc might be pretty appealing to him.

Who knows? This NBA off-season is straight up whack.

Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

Huh? Hood has been pretty good. Rubio is a good PG to put in that team too, being that he's defense and passing. Yea he's not a great shooter, but he can knock down open shots. Burks and Diaw are solid on that team too.

PAOboston
07-01-2017, 08:28 AM
Huh? Hood has been pretty good. Rubio is a good PG to put in that team too, being that he's defense and passing. Yea he's not a great shooter, but he can knock down open shots. Burks and Diaw are solid on that team too.
What I'm getting at is that roster in the West ain't doing squat. And not sure how they can improve it to a point where they will have a chance to compete.

Not the case with Miami or Boston for example. Easier conference and room for both teams to make significant improvement even after adding Hayward to the roster.

Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

warfelg
07-01-2017, 08:36 AM
What I'm getting at is that roster in the West ain't doing squat. And not sure how they can improve it to a point where they will have a chance to compete.

Not the case with Miami or Boston for example. Easier conference and room for both teams to make significant improvement even after adding Hayward to the roster.

Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

A lot of rosters ain't doing squat. This is also a team that just got to the second round, and while 2 west teams got stronger, 1 was in front, 1 behind. And another team that was ahead of them got worse.

thomass
07-01-2017, 09:11 AM
Utah: Most money
Miami: Funnest City
Boston: Best team

Its a hard choice.

lol not for most people. Most money please. Not like any of these teams are competing with the warriors

eDush
07-01-2017, 09:22 AM
When did I say I was a Barnes lover? I just believe you lack any basketball insight because you're such a drugged up Warriors fan.

Don't feel special, he does stuff like that to other Warriors fans too.Like what? I hold true Dubs fans in the highest regards and you can identity them by them wearing Warriors jersey and would either shake their hand or high five them as I pass by, especially if they wore number 30, then they are my new friends.

You think buying team merchandise is a waste of money and would not buy one so I already know what kind of fan you are Scoots :(

kjthunderman
07-01-2017, 09:26 AM
Hayward would not put Boston over Cleveland. In my opinion, Hayward would make a bigger impact on a team like the Heat, would put them top 4 in east and definitely compete more with Cleveland. Still lose, but compete more.

eDush
07-01-2017, 09:30 AM
Utah: Most money
Miami: Funnest City
Boston: Best team

Its a hard choice.I was in a Utah airport once while changing flight and it was the weirdest feeling ever like I was in some communist country. I would not live there no matter what or how much and Hill probably feels the same way and hope another team offers more and he is a very good player worthy of a 9 figure contract imo and would be ideal going back to the Spurs where it all started :nod:

FOXHOUND
07-01-2017, 09:31 AM
Hayward would not put Boston over Cleveland. In my opinion, Hayward would make a bigger impact on a team like the Heat, would put them top 4 in east and definitely compete more with Cleveland. Still lose, but compete more.

If they could build on their 30-11 second half plus add Hayward, they can definitely bump up from 41 to 50 wins and get a top 5 spot.

They probably wouldn't even have to lose Waiters or James Johnson, depending on their Bird's rights/offers.

warfelg
07-01-2017, 09:32 AM
If I were Washington I would be sprinting to Hayward with a deal while someone else gets on the phone with the Jazz FO to fine out what it would take to sign and trade.

Honestly....they should do it. Fast.

eDush
07-01-2017, 09:34 AM
Hayward would not put Boston over Cleveland. In my opinion, Hayward would make a bigger impact on a team like the Heat, would put them top 4 in east and definitely compete more with Cleveland. Still lose, but compete more.Well it's culture shock to go from Utah to South Beach on living. It's why people wants to retire there and he might not want to wait :nod:

eDush
07-01-2017, 09:39 AM
If I were Washington I would be sprinting to Hayward with a deal while someone else gets on the phone with the Jazz FO to fine out what it would take to sign and trade.

Honestly....they should do it. Fast.Hayward not a good fit with the Wiz as scoring is something they don't lack. It's a solid 3 and D which he is lacking in the D part but they plan to resign Otto for less so why pay the max?
:shrug:

FOXHOUND
07-01-2017, 09:42 AM
If I were Washington I would be sprinting to Hayward with a deal while someone else gets on the phone with the Jazz FO to fine out what it would take to sign and trade.

Honestly....they should do it. Fast.

I would try offering Otto Porter for him in a sign and trade. Could be like a preemptive Oladipo dump + gain because there's no way that guy is worth $20M+.

warfelg
07-01-2017, 09:44 AM
I would try offering Otto Porter for him in a sign and trade. Could be like a preemptive Oladipo dump + gain because there's no way that guy is worth $20M+.

I would add a 1st too.

Wall
Beal
Hayward
Morris
Gordot

....That's a ECF team. If they keep Bogdonovic, Ourbe, Burke, and get one or two vet min? They could be a very interesting team.

warfelg
07-01-2017, 09:45 AM
Hayward not a good fit with the Wiz as scoring is something they don't lack. It's a solid 3 and D which he is lacking in the D part but they plan to resign Otto for less so why pay the max?
:shrug:

That's cute. You've never seen the Wizards play.

FOXHOUND
07-01-2017, 09:55 AM
I would add a 1st too.

Wall
Beal
Hayward
Morris
Gordot

....That's a ECF team. If they keep Bogdonovic, Ourbe, Burke, and get one or two vet min? They could be a very interesting team.

They'd have to work out some stuff cap wise, because they decided to pay Ian Mahinmi $16M last year so they don't have space. lol.

warfelg
07-01-2017, 10:01 AM
They'd have to work out some stuff cap wise, because they decided to pay Ian Mahinmi $16M last year so they don't have space. lol.

S&T Porter at the max, the salaries would match. They have the bird rights to Bogdonovic IIRC too. They would just be in the tax.

eDush
07-01-2017, 10:41 AM
Hayward not a good fit with the Wiz as scoring is something they don't lack. It's a solid 3 and D which he is lacking in the D part but they plan to resign Otto for less so why pay the max?
:shrug:

That's cute. You've never seen the Wizards play.I have and Otto is a better fit than I can't play D Hayward. Some game I can't even tell who plays better defense between him or mister stirring the pot but they are both great offensively and it seems like I know team fit better than you as ur only looking at more scoring which they don't need.
:no:

warfelg
07-01-2017, 10:50 AM
I have and Otto is a better fit than I can't play D Hayward. Some game I can't even tell who plays better defense between him or mister stirring the pot but they are both great offensively and it seems like I know team fit better than you as ur only looking at more scoring which they don't need.
:no:

Literally the only way the Wizards won is if Wall or Beal went off. No one else on that team contributed offensively. They need a 3rd playmaker more than defense.

corky831
07-01-2017, 11:09 AM
Honestly at this point, I wouldn't be upset if the Celtics did nothing. I really like Brown and Tatum and think they will become very good players in this league. We need to give the kids minutes. If it costs us in seeding, so be it. Celtics will be a top 8 team regardless.

Vee-Rex
07-01-2017, 11:14 AM
Boston is looking less like a wonderful destination after the PG13 trade. I'm sure Hayward's gotta see that IT and Bradley and Smart's contracts are coming to an end so there's some uncertainty there. I'd bet he doesn't give a **** about the infants in diapers (Brown/Tatum) or what Boston's future infants may look like.

Whereas you have the opportunity to play for Riley along with Dragic and Whiteside in South Beach? If he leaves Utah then I see him going to Miami over Boston at this point.

hugepatsfan
07-01-2017, 11:18 AM
I would add a 1st too.

Wall
Beal
Hayward
Morris
Gordot

....That's a ECF team. If they keep Bogdonovic, Ourbe, Burke, and get one or two vet min? They could be a very interesting team.

Objectively though, putting aside your disline for Boston, I don't understand how you think this is better for Hayward than Boston.

BOS was a higher seed and beat WAS so the starting point is that they're a better team.

in order to accommodate Hayward WAS is giving up Porter. BOS is giving up Olynyk/Rozier having also added Tatum in the draft and bringing Ante Zizic over. So I'd say the roster sacrifices to make Hayward work are greater on WAS's side.

The young player in WAS's rotation (Oubre) doesn't have as much room to grow as BOS's (Brown) by I think any objective account.

WAS has only their own late picks going forward. BOS has what should be high lottery picks. So more room for future growth on BOS as well.

I just don't see how objectively you think that's a better situation than Boston.

hugepatsfan
07-01-2017, 11:28 AM
Boston is looking less like a wonderful destination after the PG13 trade. I'm sure Hayward's gotta see that IT and Bradley and Smart's contracts are coming to an end so there's some uncertainty there. I'd bet he doesn't give a **** about the infants in diapers (Brown/Tatum) or what Boston's future infants may look like.

Whereas you have the opportunity to play for Riley along with Dragic and Whiteside in South Beach? If he leaves Utah then I see him going to Miami over Boston at this point.

This is the risk of having your name in rumors like the PG stuff. Before any mention of the PG stuff people felt BOS was fir sure the best. But now that the potential of PG was introduced, what BOS has left, even though it's the same as before, seems like a disappointment.

corky831
07-01-2017, 12:03 PM
Boston is looking less like a wonderful destination after the PG13 trade. I'm sure Hayward's gotta see that IT and Bradley and Smart's contracts are coming to an end so there's some uncertainty there. I'd bet he doesn't give a **** about the infants in diapers (Brown/Tatum) or what Boston's future infants may look like.

Whereas you have the opportunity to play for Riley along with Dragic and Whiteside in South Beach? If he leaves Utah then I see him going to Miami over Boston at this point.

Dragic, Hayward, and Whiteside is probably a 5 or 6 seed in the East. I don't think he will go to Miami. Most likely return to Utah, or he will go to Boston. IT, Bradley, Smart, Rozier, Brown, Crowder, Tatum, Horford, Zizic, etc. is a better roster than Miami has to offer

AllBall
07-01-2017, 12:10 PM
601 Biscayne *****es!

881176878656180225

LA_Raiders
07-01-2017, 01:13 PM
it has come down to 2 impact players left. Hayward and Milsap if they don't go to the east, west will be packed. Boston, wash or Tor has to get them if they want to compete with the Cavs.

hugepatsfan
07-01-2017, 01:19 PM
Reports now say MIA is the favorite but IDK, feel like that is always the case when anyone is actually meeting with the guy unless he walks out of it lol

If BOS loses out I wonder if the best option isn't just to use the cap space to get AB/IT on favorable extensions. They could use the cap to give them extra money now and entice more favorable numbers to the team since they're getting security early.

I'd try to lock them in for 3 years each. That lines them up to expire with Horford/Crowder. The East is so trash that you still compete w/ WAS and MIA (assuming Hayward is there) for the ECF those 3 years. Then after that you have ultimate flexibility around a team that will have a ton of high draft picks you hope have developed well over those three years.

other alternatives are to go after a lesser big name (Milsap? Gallo?) or splurge on some more role players (Dedmon, James Johnson, etc.). IDK, it will be interesting to see.

corky831
07-01-2017, 01:28 PM
Celtics don't really need to go after anyone. They would be better with Hayward, but I still don't think they will be better than the Cavs. Celtics are going to be a better team next yr already, adding Zizic and Tatum.

TylerSL
07-01-2017, 01:38 PM
I believe he also will take his talents to South Beach! Hayward would fit in well with us and if we can keep James Johnson then we will pretty well off going into next year.

Dragic/T Johnson
McGruder/Richardson
Hayward/Winslow
J Johnson/White/Haslem/McRoberts
Whiteside/Adebayo

That would definitely be a top team in the east next season and at the buyout deadline next year, March 1, Miami could maybe look to bring Wade back if he agrees to a buyout then. Wishful thinking yes, but crazier things have certainly happened before.

eDush
07-01-2017, 01:42 PM
Boston is looking less like a wonderful destination after the PG13 trade. I'm sure Hayward's gotta see that IT and Bradley and Smart's contracts are coming to an end so there's some uncertainty there. I'd bet he doesn't give a **** about the infants in diapers (Brown/Tatum) or what Boston's future infants may look like.

Whereas you have the opportunity to play for Riley along with Dragic and Whiteside in South Beach? If he leaves Utah then I see him going to Miami over Boston at this point.

Dragic, Hayward, and Whiteside is probably a 5 or 6 seed in the East. I don't think he will go to Miami. Most likely return to Utah, or he will go to Boston. IT, Bradley, Smart, Rozier, Brown, Crowder, Tatum, Horford, Zizic, etc. is a better roster than Miami has to offerIf Miami play the first half like the second half last season, they would be the top seed in the East if they remain healthy. Dragic knows how to win and with Hayward by his side, they will be a team to worry to about. Heat is a better team then the Jazz now that they have Rubio instead of Hill regardless of Hayward decision match up wise, trust me on this :nod:

And not sure why you think he rather live in Utah over South Beach.
:shrug:

Scoots
07-01-2017, 01:43 PM
Like what? I hold true Dubs fans in the highest regards and you can identity them by them wearing Warriors jersey and would either shake their hand or high five them as I pass by, especially if they wore number 30, then they are my new friends.

You think buying team merchandise is a waste of money and would not buy one so I already know what kind of fan you are Scoots :(

More lies.

hugepatsfan
07-01-2017, 01:46 PM
Celtics don't really need to go after anyone. They would be better with Hayward, but I still don't think they will be better than the Cavs. Celtics are going to be a better team next yr already, adding Zizic and Tatum.

It would be pretty crushing to not get him. It's a chance to add a top 15ish player for nothing but cash. Grand scheme of things, sure probably not a huge deal. But getting him would be awesome.

warfelg
07-01-2017, 01:48 PM
That moment when you realize the Bookie Cousins deal:
Heild, Evans, Galloway, 10th pick, 2nd rounder

Is about the same as Prichard was asking from Ainge for PG.

hugepatsfan
07-01-2017, 01:52 PM
That moment when you realize the Bookie Cousins deal:
Heild, Evans, Galloway, 10th pick, 2nd rounder

Is about the same as Prichard was asking from Ainge for PG.

Still glad he didn't do that for either player. Both great pieces but I don't think they get us where we need to be.

eDush
07-01-2017, 02:02 PM
Like what? I hold true Dubs fans in the highest regards and you can identity them by them wearing Warriors jersey and would either shake their hand or high five them as I pass by, especially if they wore number 30, then they are my new friends.

You think buying team merchandise is a waste of money and would not buy one so I already know what kind of fan you are Scoots :(

More lies.Just because you can't remember what you post, even if it's a few days ago, doesn't mean its a lie okay. Lol do you remember stating that Barnes is improving every year on the Dubs when the opposite was true?!?

Only a Barnes lover would make such a claim or an opinion when it is so false it's not even funny or are u going to ask for more link as proof?
:laugh:

I just can't tell if you are trolling or absent minded when making such dumb statements.
:shrug:

eDush
07-01-2017, 02:05 PM
^ And Mudiay is a good shooter during the draft comment was classic or was that a lie too?
:laugh:

futureman
07-02-2017, 02:36 PM
I bet that report came from a source out of miami. Gobert is so much better and younger than Whiteside.

futureman
07-02-2017, 02:39 PM
[QUOTE=eDush;31721002]I was in a Utah airport once while changing flight and it was the weirdest feeling ever like I was in some communist country. I would not live there no matter what or how much and Hill probably feels the same way and hope another team offers more and he is a very good player worthy of a 9 figure contract imo and would be ideal going back to the Spurs where it all started :nod:[/QUOTE

That's a dumb comparison to make for a city that's the most Right Wing in the whole country. What the Hell is California when they have pictures of Mao under their freakin street signs?

daleja424
07-02-2017, 07:12 PM
I really don't like the whole taking meetings for 3 days thing man. No matter which team he picks... two others are going to be screwed...b/c by the time he signs... there will not be any high impact FAs left.

WaDe03
07-02-2017, 08:48 PM
I bet that report came from a source out of miami. Gobert is so much better and younger than Whiteside.

He's younger but he's not much better if at all.

hugepatsfan
07-02-2017, 08:59 PM
I really don't like the whole taking meetings for 3 days thing man. No matter which team he picks... two others are going to be screwed...b/c by the time he signs... there will not be any high impact FAs left.

It is bad for the teams but it's a life altering decision so you can't get mad at a guy for taking a few days to consider the presentations he just saw.

daleja424
07-02-2017, 09:04 PM
Understand it is a HUGE decision. But honestly... the 3-5 city tour that takes a week is just over the top. A guy like Hayward has been thinking about this decision for 6 weeks... if not even longer.

I just don't recall this system working this way prior to the Lebron decision summer....maybe I just want paying attention.

hotdalton18
07-02-2017, 09:07 PM
I bet that report came from a source out of miami. Gobert is so much better and younger than Whiteside.

Get off the crack(Stephen A voice)

What says Gobert is better then Whiteside ?

Points and rebounds are Whiteside...Jumper is Whiteside

Defense is about the same

Couple years younger ohhhh lol

But Gobert being so much better is dumb for you to say

warfelg
07-02-2017, 09:09 PM
It is bad for the teams but it's a life altering decision so you can't get mad at a guy for taking a few days to consider the presentations he just saw.

**** I don't even have that much money on the line and I take like 2-3 days to decide to take a new job offer.

dhopisthename
07-02-2017, 09:20 PM
**** I don't even have that much money on the line and I take like 2-3 days to decide to take a new job offer.

not only that, but I am sure Hayward wants to see the celtics and Heats plans. The Celtics were rumored to want to sign Hayward and then trade for PG, but now that can't happen. Also, Hayward probably wanted to see what the Jazz would do at the point guard spot and if they resign Ingles.

KobeOwnSU
07-02-2017, 09:22 PM
Get off the crack(Stephen A voice)

What says Gobert is better then Whiteside ?

Points and rebounds are Whiteside...Jumper is Whiteside

Defense is about the same

Couple years younger ohhhh lol

But Gobert being so much better is dumb for you to say
I'd rather have Gobert then Whiteside 10 out of 10 times.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

hotdalton18
07-02-2017, 09:25 PM
Get off the crack(Stephen A voice)

What says Gobert is better then Whiteside ?

Points and rebounds are Whiteside...Jumper is Whiteside

Defense is about the same

Couple years younger ohhhh lol

But Gobert being so much better is dumb for you to say
I'd rather have Gobert then Whiteside 10 out of 10 times.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

That's fine

There's just no stats or any proof to point to why

But that's fine lol

warfelg
07-02-2017, 09:26 PM
I'd rather have Gobert then Whiteside 10 out of 10 times.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

Ditto

dhopisthename
07-02-2017, 09:33 PM
That's fine

There's just no stats or any proof to point to why

But that's fine lol

lets see Whiteside scores 17 points on 12.6 shots good for a .579 ts%, Gobert scores 14 on 7.7 shots good for a .681 ts%. So Whiteside only scores more because he shoots more. Whiteside got 1.3 more rebounds, but Gobert lead the Jazz to the 3rd best rebounding rate while miami was 15th so it's likely that he only gets more rebounds because there are more rebounds to get. if you think defense is close then you are alone on that island because Rudy got 99 votes in the defensive player of the year award and Whiteside got 3 with similar results for all defensive team. Finally Rudy slaughters Whiteside in any kind of advanced numbers. 14.3 win shares to 9.5, 5.8 BPM to -.5, and 6.37 RPM to 2.03. Rudy is better and younger so it's more likely he improves.

eDush
07-02-2017, 09:33 PM
I was in a Utah airport once while changing flight and it was the weirdest feeling ever like I was in some communist country. I would not live there no matter what or how much and Hill probably feels the same way and hope another team offers more and he is a very good player worthy of a 9 figure contract imo and would be ideal going back to the Spurs where it all started :nod:

That's a dumb comparison to make for a city that's the most Right Wing in the whole country. What the Hell is California when they have pictures of Mao under their freakin street signs?What does that has to do with anything?!? Being at a Utah airport is unusually quiet and people there stares at you with their eyes but not turning theirs heads if you look different then them unlike in LAX or JFK where their lots of noise and commotion where you can look a bum and no one would notice nor care. I assume a communist airport would be like the former instead of the later Moe, dumb*** :nod:

Firefistus
07-02-2017, 09:36 PM
Get off the crack(Stephen A voice)

What says Gobert is better then Whiteside ?

Points and rebounds are Whiteside...Jumper is Whiteside

Defense is about the same

Couple years younger ohhhh lol

But Gobert being so much better is dumb for you to say

Defensive rating? Offensive Rating? (Points per possesion, field goal %). Points Created off Pick and Roll. Opposing Field Goal %., Opposing Field goal attempts per 100 possesions. Rudy Dominates Whiteside in all of these. How does Whiteside dominate in points when rudy averages such less field goals per game than Whiteside? And second to only Deandre Jordan in Field goal %, he shoots 11% better than Whiteside. He gets twice as many assists with less turnovers than Whiteside. He has a higher free throw percentage. Oh ya, he blocks more shots too, and that's why he was runner up for DPoY. Whiteside was none of these things. But you're right, we're idiots for thinking Gobert is better than Whiteside, when obviously since Miami is obviously far superior than Salt Lake City Heat fans think Whiteside is better and Utah is only Utah there's no reason to think otherwise.

eDush
07-02-2017, 09:43 PM
I bet that report came from a source out of miami. Gobert is so much better and younger than Whiteside.

Get off the crack(Stephen A voice)

What says Gobert is better then Whiteside ?

Points and rebounds are Whiteside...Jumper is Whiteside

Defense is about the same

Couple years younger ohhhh lol

But Gobert being so much better is dumb for you to sayBe careful cause when I pointed out the slight age difference on another post, I was made fun of by other posters. Maybe they just hate Warriors fans making such comments perhaps cause they are jealous we rule :nod:

Dade County
07-02-2017, 09:57 PM
lets see Whiteside scores 17 points on 12.6 shots good for a .579 ts%, Gobert scores 14 on 7.7 shots good for a .681 ts%. So Whiteside only scores more because he shoots more. Whiteside got 1.3 more rebounds, but Gobert lead the Jazz to the 3rd best rebounding rate while miami was 15th so it's likely that he only gets more rebounds because there are more rebounds to get. if you think defense is close then you are alone on that island because Rudy got 99 votes in the defensive player of the year award and Whiteside got 3 with similar results for all defensive team. Finally Rudy slaughters Whiteside in any kind of advanced numbers. 14.3 win shares to 9.5, 5.8 BPM to -.5, and 6.37 RPM to 2.03. Rudy is better and younger so it's more likely he improves.



Defensive rating? Offensive Rating? (Points per possesion, field goal %). Points Created off Pick and Roll. Opposing Field Goal %., Opposing Field goal attempts per 100 possesions. Rudy Dominates Whiteside in all of these. How does Whiteside dominate in points when rudy averages such less field goals per game than Whiteside? And second to only Deandre Jordan in Field goal %, he shoots 11% better than Whiteside. He gets twice as many assists with less turnovers than Whiteside. He has a higher free throw percentage. Oh ya, he blocks more shots too, and that's why he was runner up for DPoY. Whiteside was none of these things. But you're right, we're idiots for thinking Gobert is better than Whiteside, when obviously since Miami is obviously far superior than Salt Lake City Heat fans think Whiteside is better and Utah is only Utah there's no reason to think otherwise.

I don't no what happend, but lets just say Utah is happy with their big man, & HEAT are happy as well with Whiteside.

We both like are bigs. Lets see who Hayward decides to play with for the next 3 to 4yrs.

Hope he takes a team off his list by tomorrow, so that team can move on and try to gather assets.

Chewbacca
07-02-2017, 10:06 PM
lets see Whiteside scores 17 points on 12.6 shots good for a .579 ts%, Gobert scores 14 on 7.7 shots good for a .681 ts%. So Whiteside only scores more because he shoots more. Whiteside got 1.3 more rebounds, but Gobert lead the Jazz to the 3rd best rebounding rate while miami was 15th so it's likely that he only gets more rebounds because there are more rebounds to get. if you think defense is close then you are alone on that island because Rudy got 99 votes in the defensive player of the year award and Whiteside got 3 with similar results for all defensive team. Finally Rudy slaughters Whiteside in any kind of advanced numbers. 14.3 win shares to 9.5, 5.8 BPM to -.5, and 6.37 RPM to 2.03. Rudy is better and younger so it's more likely he improves.

LOL DAMN idk how someone could argue against this. Props to you man. I'm not being sarcastic either aha good stuff!

warfelg
07-02-2017, 10:08 PM
lets see Whiteside scores 17 points on 12.6 shots good for a .579 ts%, Gobert scores 14 on 7.7 shots good for a .681 ts%. So Whiteside only scores more because he shoots more. Whiteside got 1.3 more rebounds, but Gobert lead the Jazz to the 3rd best rebounding rate while miami was 15th so it's likely that he only gets more rebounds because there are more rebounds to get. if you think defense is close then you are alone on that island because Rudy got 99 votes in the defensive player of the year award and Whiteside got 3 with similar results for all defensive team. Finally Rudy slaughters Whiteside in any kind of advanced numbers. 14.3 win shares to 9.5, 5.8 BPM to -.5, and 6.37 RPM to 2.03. Rudy is better and younger so it's more likely he improves.

We need the ability to like or give thanks to posts.

Kyben36
07-02-2017, 10:38 PM
I'm betting he stays in Utah. but I think there is no way he goes to Boston. and hear me out.

as a player. you look at Boston and wonder if they are focused more on now. or the future. and basses on their recent actions it seems they value picks and young players more than stars and winning now.

I mean. they have not been able to land another star to pair with him and IT. and they seem more focused on young talent. not to mention the last 2 drafts. they picked players who play at his same position.

if I'm a player. I question Boston's comitment to win now. they seem to have missed out on 3 or 4 players now that could have made major impacts on winning and a players view of teams direction.

I think he stays in Utah myself

I known i would take Gobert over IT as an overall player.

favors way over whatever horford is at this point. and I think the familiarity. culture. money keep him there.

people under rate how hard it is to play with a guy like IT you have to hide in a corner

Green_Monster
07-02-2017, 11:07 PM
I'm betting he stays in Utah. but I think there is no way he goes to Boston. and hear me out.

as a player. you look at Boston and wonder if they are focused more on now. or the future. and basses on their recent actions it seems they value picks and young players more than stars and winning now.

I mean. they have not been able to land another star to pair with him and IT. and they seem more focused on young talent. not to mention the last 2 drafts. they picked players who play at his same position.

if I'm a player. I question Boston's comitment to win now. they seem to have missed out on 3 or 4 players now that could have made major impacts on winning and a players view of teams direction.

I think he stays in Utah myself

I known i would take Gobert over IT as an overall player.

favors way over whatever horford is at this point. and I think the familiarity. culture. money keep him there.

people under rate how hard it is to play with a guy like IT you have to hide in a corner

This was all fine until you said you'd take Favors "way over" Horford... what.

Bostonjorge
07-02-2017, 11:26 PM
I'm betting he stays in Utah. but I think there is no way he goes to Boston. and hear me out.

as a player. you look at Boston and wonder if they are focused more on now. or the future. and basses on their recent actions it seems they value picks and young players more than stars and winning now.

I mean. they have not been able to land another star to pair with him and IT. and they seem more focused on young talent. not to mention the last 2 drafts. they picked players who play at his same position.

if I'm a player. I question Boston's comitment to win now. they seem to have missed out on 3 or 4 players now that could have made major impacts on winning and a players view of teams direction.

I think he stays in Utah myself

I known i would take Gobert over IT as an overall player.

favors way over whatever horford is at this point. and I think the familiarity. culture. money keep him there.

people under rate how hard it is to play with a guy like IT you have to hide in a corner

In Boston he's a top 5 player in the east and can end up being a all star starter. Boston will have a deep playoff run and Hayward can put them over the top. With a first seed out east Hayward is on the all NBA team as well. To many positives.

In the west there is no guarantee he even makes the all star team. If Okc is up on the standing then George will get the vote and same with Minny with Butler and Wiggins. I don't think Hayward is scared to compete with those guys but it's a lot of work to even make the playoffs out west. If he leads Boston past the Cavs then we talking instant legend.

Firefistus
07-02-2017, 11:37 PM
I don't know where he'll land, but without getting the 2 players that Boston thought they were going to land, then having Blake sign a super max with Clippers I don't see Boston as contending anytime soon. They have all these assets and are poised to stike it big the next couple years in the draft. Just seems to me they want to focus more on rebuilding rather than winningthe next 4-5 years.

I'm a Jazz homer, I'll admit, but I personally think Horford is better than Favors. Favors has had a hard time staying healthy his whole career, and he's not getting any younger. But when Favors is healthy he's a super beast. That's just very rare.

I personally don't see him moving to Miami either, Hayward isn't a party type guy. He's very quiet and extremely family oriented. I think he would choose Boston over Miami because of that, but ultimately I think he stays in Salt Lake City, they don't have to do anything to sign him, and they are already the best team without need to trade pieces to obtain him. They have a solid coach and a solid team that's familiar with each other that's still young and will continue to improve.

Depending on who you are it's either going to be a really good 4th or a not so good 4th. Good luck to everyone!!

hugepatsfan
07-02-2017, 11:45 PM
Boston saving their assets is still better than either MIA or Utah. I thought Utah with Hayward was better than us but they had him and we didn't. It's not like we need to subtract much from our roster - only Olynyk matters. Boston without Hayward is arguably as good as Utah with him. Throw in the East cs west thing and it's not even close which is a better spot to win IMO. Boston is better than Miami with their current rosters so he'd just be joining a better team.

Ainge can hoard all his picks and draft nothing but busts and Boston is still the best spot for him to win.

LA_Raiders
07-02-2017, 11:50 PM
I hope he stays in Utah so the west can finish up the offseason with a sweep...

Dade County
07-02-2017, 11:54 PM
I hope he stays in Utah so the west can finish up the offseason with a sweep...

Lol

But this has me thinking that one team in the East has to pull a big move.

Kyben36
07-03-2017, 12:55 AM
This was all fine until you said you'd take Favors "way over" Horford... what.

watching horford. he is 1/5th of the player he used to be.

he only averaged 7 boards and all he does not is shoot jumpers. I get your a homer but horford is not special and is declining. favors is 25 and hitting his prime. he averaged 18 + points and 9+ boards per 36 2 and 3 years ago. this year he was hurt but his stock is still on the rise. horford hit his prime 3 years ago and has been declining since. and while horford is a much better passer. in sorry. if take favors in almost every other category

JAZZNC
07-03-2017, 01:02 AM
lets see Whiteside scores 17 points on 12.6 shots good for a .579 ts%, Gobert scores 14 on 7.7 shots good for a .681 ts%. So Whiteside only scores more because he shoots more. Whiteside got 1.3 more rebounds, but Gobert lead the Jazz to the 3rd best rebounding rate while miami was 15th so it's likely that he only gets more rebounds because there are more rebounds to get. if you think defense is close then you are alone on that island because Rudy got 99 votes in the defensive player of the year award and Whiteside got 3 with similar results for all defensive team. Finally Rudy slaughters Whiteside in any kind of advanced numbers. 14.3 win shares to 9.5, 5.8 BPM to -.5, and 6.37 RPM to 2.03. Rudy is better and younger so it's more likely he improves.
hotdalton18....this is you getting owned.

rhino17
07-03-2017, 01:05 AM
I don't see why he would leave Utah. Most money and best team at this point. I thought Boston would be the place to win, but they haven't been doing anything with all their assets. Idk why he would even consider Miami

hotdalton18
07-03-2017, 05:03 AM
I don't see why he would leave Utah. Most money and best team at this point. I thought Boston would be the place to win, but they haven't been doing anything with all their assets. Idk why he would even consider Miami

This is false

Let's start with the money

You get paid more for being on all teams

He didn't make an all team without PG and Jimmy Butler in the west but he's gonna do it now?

Super max is pretty much a lock for him in the east

So Miami and Boston make the money sense not to mention no state tax in Mia


Best team...Well jazz are gonna be around a 50 win team..5th or worse seed

Boston would be a 1st or 2nd seed and make the eastern conference finals n lose to Bron

Miami bounced back from terrible injury luck and finished 30-11 which ended up being 41-41...add Hayward and there a 50 or more win team prolly around 2nd or 3rd seed and would have a shot at losing to Bron in the ECF

So let's recap

Money - 1.Mia 2.Bos 3.Utah

Winning - All the teams would win around the same amount of games in regular season...Boston and Mia give him a much better chance to make a conference finals and go deeper in the playoffs just because of conference weakness

So Boston and Mia make all the sense actually

The only reason to go back to the Jazz is to stay home , stay with the team that drafted you and loyalty and all that which I totally get if he does that

rhino17
07-03-2017, 05:22 AM
This is false

Let's start with the money

You get paid more for being on all teams

He didn't make an all team without PG and Jimmy Butler in the west but he's gonna do it now?

Super max is pretty much a lock for him in the east

So Miami and Boston make the money sense not to mention no state tax in Mia


Best team...Well jazz are gonna be around a 50 win team..5th or worse seed

Boston would be a 1st or 2nd seed and make the eastern conference finals n lose to Bron

Miami bounced back from terrible injury luck and finished 30-11 which ended up being 41-41...add Hayward and there a 50 or more win team prolly around 2nd or 3rd seed and would have a shot at losing to Bron in the ECF

So let's recap

Money - 1.Mia 2.Bos 3.Utah

Winning - All the teams would win around the same amount of games in regular season...Boston and Mia give him a much better chance to make a conference finals and go deeper in the playoffs just because of conference weakness

So Boston and Mia make all the sense actually

The only reason to go back to the Jazz is to stay home , stay with the team that drafted you and loyalty and all that which I totally get if he does that

1. Conference has NOTHING to do with all-nab teams, so idk what you are talking about in regards to that

2. You ignored my Boston explanation. They will finish high on in the playoff order, but they don't appear to by willing to spend any of their assets. If that doesn't happen, then they aren't gonna get any bette

3. Miami was also a horrible team for a large portion of the season and not even a playoff team in the East. They could very well go back to sucking next season, just like they did for a HUGE portion of last year.

4. The money is with Utah, they can offer more than the other teams, although Miami doesn't have state income tax (but like I said, its the worst situation for winning as well).

More-Than-Most
07-03-2017, 06:33 AM
lets see Whiteside scores 17 points on 12.6 shots good for a .579 ts%, Gobert scores 14 on 7.7 shots good for a .681 ts%. So Whiteside only scores more because he shoots more. Whiteside got 1.3 more rebounds, but Gobert lead the Jazz to the 3rd best rebounding rate while miami was 15th so it's likely that he only gets more rebounds because there are more rebounds to get. if you think defense is close then you are alone on that island because Rudy got 99 votes in the defensive player of the year award and Whiteside got 3 with similar results for all defensive team. Finally Rudy slaughters Whiteside in any kind of advanced numbers. 14.3 win shares to 9.5, 5.8 BPM to -.5, and 6.37 RPM to 2.03. Rudy is better and younger so it's more likely he improves.

get that man a body bag... its over.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypot3CYECwE

hotdalton18
07-03-2017, 06:49 AM
This is false

Let's start with the money

You get paid more for being on all teams

He didn't make an all team without PG and Jimmy Butler in the west but he's gonna do it now?

Super max is pretty much a lock for him in the east

So Miami and Boston make the money sense not to mention no state tax in Mia


Best team...Well jazz are gonna be around a 50 win team..5th or worse seed

Boston would be a 1st or 2nd seed and make the eastern conference finals n lose to Bron

Miami bounced back from terrible injury luck and finished 30-11 which ended up being 41-41...add Hayward and there a 50 or more win team prolly around 2nd or 3rd seed and would have a shot at losing to Bron in the ECF

So let's recap

Money - 1.Mia 2.Bos 3.Utah

Winning - All the teams would win around the same amount of games in regular season...Boston and Mia give him a much better chance to make a conference finals and go deeper in the playoffs just because of conference weakness

So Boston and Mia make all the sense actually

The only reason to go back to the Jazz is to stay home , stay with the team that drafted you and loyalty and all that which I totally get if he does that

1. Conference has NOTHING to do with all-nab teams, so idk what you are talking about in regards to that

2. You ignored my Boston explanation. They will finish high on in the playoff order, but they don't appear to by willing to spend any of their assets. If that doesn't happen, then they aren't gonna get any bette

3. Miami was also a horrible team for a large portion of the season and not even a playoff team in the East. They could very well go back to sucking next season, just like they did for a HUGE portion of last year.

4. The money is with Utah, they can offer more than the other teams, although Miami doesn't have state income tax (but like I said, its the worst situation for winning as well).


I meant all star but all NBA would be easier to because his stats should be better...Less talent that he's playing every night

And yeah Mia can go back to being horrible if everyone gets injured again lol but when healthy went 30-11

I guess we'll see what he does

hotdalton18
07-03-2017, 06:59 AM
That's fine

There's just no stats or any proof to point to why

But that's fine lol

lets see Whiteside scores 17 points on 12.6 shots good for a .579 ts%, Gobert scores 14 on 7.7 shots good for a .681 ts%. So Whiteside only scores more because he shoots more. Whiteside got 1.3 more rebounds, but Gobert lead the Jazz to the 3rd best rebounding rate while miami was 15th so it's likely that he only gets more rebounds because there are more rebounds to get. if you think defense is close then you are alone on that island because Rudy got 99 votes in the defensive player of the year award and Whiteside got 3 with similar results for all defensive team. Finally Rudy slaughters Whiteside in any kind of advanced numbers. 14.3 win shares to 9.5, 5.8 BPM to -.5, and 6.37 RPM to 2.03. Rudy is better and younger so it's more likely he improves.

Everyone saying this is a bodybag because they agree with the point lol

Back when Whiteside wasn't a vocal part of the offense he use to shoot over 60% to...that's what happens when you expand your game...He actually has a jumper and more offensive moves...Deandre Jordan shoots a higher % then Whiteside to...does that make him better then Whiteside on offense? Hell no

Your rebounding point was garbage...Jazz had 3rd rebounding rate and Heat had 15th so "it's likely there's just more rebounds for Whiteside to get"

Wtf lol so now your random opinion is taken as facts? All that means is the Jazz were a better rebounding team


And your really gonna use the votes to decide how good guys are on defense ?

IT got a vote, multiple platforms and players have already said how terrible some of the choices were

As far as the age yeah Gobert has that...But this is a different situation as far as growth...Hassan grows big every year to because of his lack of NBA coaching and experience at this point in his career

I just thought you saying Gobert was so much better was dumb

Guess we'll see what Hayward thinks

hotdalton18
07-03-2017, 07:00 AM
lets see Whiteside scores 17 points on 12.6 shots good for a .579 ts%, Gobert scores 14 on 7.7 shots good for a .681 ts%. So Whiteside only scores more because he shoots more. Whiteside got 1.3 more rebounds, but Gobert lead the Jazz to the 3rd best rebounding rate while miami was 15th so it's likely that he only gets more rebounds because there are more rebounds to get. if you think defense is close then you are alone on that island because Rudy got 99 votes in the defensive player of the year award and Whiteside got 3 with similar results for all defensive team. Finally Rudy slaughters Whiteside in any kind of advanced numbers. 14.3 win shares to 9.5, 5.8 BPM to -.5, and 6.37 RPM to 2.03. Rudy is better and younger so it's more likely he improves.
hotdalton18....this is you getting owned.

Your a Jazz fan , your gonna ride with whatever supports a Jazz argument over a heat one lmao

hotdalton18
07-03-2017, 07:08 AM
It's crazy Gobert is so much better on offense and defense but every time he plays him he has a worse game then Hassan...crazy

JAZZNC
07-03-2017, 07:37 AM
Your a Jazz fan , your gonna ride with whatever supports a Jazz argument over a heat one lmao

If by "whatever supports a Jazz argument" you mean all the facts...then yeah, that's what I'm gonna ride with.

Green_Monster
07-03-2017, 09:25 AM
watching horford. he is 1/5th of the player he used to be.

he only averaged 7 boards and all he does not is shoot jumpers. I get your a homer but horford is not special and is declining. favors is 25 and hitting his prime. he averaged 18 + points and 9+ boards per 36 2 and 3 years ago. this year he was hurt but his stock is still on the rise. horford hit his prime 3 years ago and has been declining since. and while horford is a much better passer. in sorry. if take favors in almost every other category

I'm a homer for this? :laugh2: Open basketball reference buddy, it will tell you Horford > Favors. You just have terrible eyes.

corky831
07-03-2017, 09:32 AM
These statements on here are ridiculous. If Boston doesn't get Hayward, people think they no longer can compete in the east? Lol Boston will have the same team as last yr except, they added Tatum and Zizic....2 highly regarded prospects. The east has gotten significantly worse, with Butler, Millsap, George all heading out West. And for the Horford bashing, he had a concussion that affected him for most of the early part of the season. I believe he was suffering from headaches/vertigo after the concussion which affected his play. He emerged as his true self late in the year, and in the playoffs....not many big men in the league average 5 dimes a game as well......Celtics are still a top 4 team in the east even if they make no moves

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 09:36 AM
Horford is a historic player. Once in a lifetime type guy.

Green_Monster
07-03-2017, 10:19 AM
Horford is a historic player. Once in a lifetime type guy.

*No one ever called Horford a historic player. He had historic shooting percentages in the first two playoff series.

On another note, looks like you'll be a Bulls fan to start the year! Maybe Wade will get a buyout though later in the year and join a good team. Exciting times to be a bandwagon fan!!!

eDush
07-03-2017, 10:22 AM
Horford is a historic player. Once in a lifetime type guy.He's a solid player or maybe a solid solid player but let's not go overboard lol

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 10:30 AM
*No one ever called Horford a historic player. He had historic shooting percentages in the first two playoff series.

On another note, looks like you'll be a Bulls fan to start the year! Maybe Wade will get a buyout though later in the year and join a good team. Exciting times to be a bandwagon fan!!!

Let's count rings the last 11 years.......

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 10:31 AM
He's a solid player or maybe a solid solid player but let's not go overboard lol

What?! It is a sin to say he's only solid. He's arguably the best player ever.

AllBall
07-03-2017, 10:32 AM
3. Miami was also a horrible team for a large portion of the season and not even a playoff team in the East. They could very well go back to sucking next season, just like they did for a HUGE portion of last year.

4. The money is with Utah, they can offer more than the other teams, although Miami doesn't have state income tax (but like I said, its the worst situation for winning as well).

Miami lost because they had 7 new players, 3 of them starters with 1 of them hurt half the season (not Bosh). It was going to take time for them to gel. They also had the most difficult part of their schedule in the first quarter of the season.

Miami is the team that can offer the most money, the no state income tax negates the additional year Utah can offer. Utah is the worst situation for winning, not Miami, because the West is even more loaded with talent. I'd be more surprised if he stayed in Utah than if he chose Boston.

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 10:45 AM
I don't see why he would leave Utah. Most money and best team at this point. I thought Boston would be the place to win, but they haven't been doing anything with all their assets. Idk why he would even consider Miami

This is the dangerous part of missing on acquiring players like Boston has... perception shifts. Take a step back... forget they didn't trade for Butler or PG....

The Utah Jazz last year, with Hayward, were 51-31. The Boston Celtics last year, without Hayward, was 53-39. Now, I think the West being stronger affected that and actually think Utah was a little better. But I think we can agree that it's close one way or another.

If Hayward comes to Boston, he takes Amir Johnson's starting spot (Crowder goes to PF). We'll be losing Gerald Green, or maybe he comes back, but either way Jayson Tatum is replacing him. Kelly Olynyk will be let go for cap space and replaced by Ante Zizic. I feel confident Tatum will be better than Green and while Olynyk is a proven role player, Zizic's skill set does address weaknesses if he can be a solid rookie. Hayward is a top 15ish player and Amir isn't very good anymore. So if he joins Boston he's joining last year's 53 win team with huuuuuuuuuuge improvement.

If he re-signs in Utah, they're just that same 51 team replacing Hill with Rubio. It's just the status quo.Throw in that the East is so much weaker and I think BOS is clearly the best spot to win.

The East being so weak has made it where I even think MIA is the best spot to win. Utah with Hayward is probably still a littler better than MIA with him. But MIA with him in the East is a legit contender for the ECF. In the West, Utah with Hayward is probably a 1st round exit.

warfelg
07-03-2017, 10:49 AM
How often has a player actually admitted to the lack of tax being the reason to pick a team?

eDush
07-03-2017, 11:09 AM
He's a solid player or maybe a solid solid player but let's not go overboard lol

What?! It is a sin to say he's only solid. He's arguably the best player ever.Hyping up a player is probably a sin too and so is trolling so you beat me there so I think I will stick with my own adjectives when describing a player thank you very much.

:smoking::ohno:

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 11:11 AM
Hyping up a player is probably a sin too and so is trolling so you beat me there so I think I will stick with my own adjectives when describing a player thank you very much.

:smoking::ohno:

That 2nd emoji or whatever describes your posts perfectly lol.

corky831
07-03-2017, 11:39 AM
Celtics beat the Jazz by 8 and 11 last yr when they had Hayward. East is way weaker this year....celtics already improved this yr by adding Tatum and Zizic. Brown has a yr under his belt and really impressed in the playoffs.....hes going to improve. They will be top 4 seed next yr regardless of Haywards decision. I like what Ainge and Stevens have done, they have created a tough, high character team that has a great mix of vets and young, promising players. We will have a top pick next yr, maybe 2, and the future is looking bright for the Cs. Probably the brightest in the East with Philly.

Firefistus
07-03-2017, 12:21 PM
Miami lost because they had 7 new players, 3 of them starters with 1 of them hurt half the season (not Bosh). It was going to take time for them to gel. They also had the most difficult part of their schedule in the first quarter of the season.

Miami is the team that can offer the most money, the no state income tax negates the additional year Utah can offer. Utah is the worst situation for winning, not Miami, because the West is even more loaded with talent. I'd be more surprised if he stayed in Utah than if he chose Boston.

This is STILL a false statement. Hayward only needs to make an All-NBA team once to earn far more money with Utah than any other team because of the "Kevin Durant Rule"

The provision in the 2017 CBA that allows teams to create Designated Player contracts for their own veteran players, officially known as the "Designated Veteran Player Extension" (DVPE),[9] came to be called the "Kevin Durant Rule" because it was seen as a reaction to a wave of veteran superstars leaving their teams in free agency, capped off by Durant's departure from the Thunder to the Golden State Warriors in the 2016 offseason. The 2011 CBA allowed all of the teams that were trying to lure Durant to offer him the same initial salary of $26.5 million.[8]

For a veteran player to qualify for such an extension, he must be entering his eighth or ninth season in the NBA, and have either:

made the All-NBA team (at any level) in either the season immediately before signing the extension, or two of the three previous seasons;
been named NBA Defensive Player of the Year in either the season immediately before signing the extension, or two of the three previous seasons; or
been named NBA MVP at least once in the previous three seasons.

Additionally, the team offering the extension must have originally drafted the player, or obtained him in a trade while he was on his rookie contract.[8]

Hayward will qualify for this rule age wise next year. And as people have stated, all-nba teams have nothing to do with conferences. It's all about season play for these players. If Hayward continues to improve like he has every season than yes, he'll be voted in one of those in a couple years. If he doesn't improve than he will probably stay where he's at regardless which team he plays on.

As for the Rubio vs Hill talk, Rubio will (hopefully) be better than Hill ever was for Utah last season because Rubio will actually play games, Hill had an injury in November and missed games because of it all the way untill the last game they played in the playoffs.

Jazz also only had 20 games with all the starters playing together all season, so it was a tough one for injuries. I don't think anyone would debate that Utah would have won more games if we had Hill and Favors for 60 of our regular season games, but we didn't, and we only got 50 wins because of it. (btw Utah only lost 3 games all season with all of our starters playing, playoffs including)

AllBall
07-03-2017, 01:11 PM
This is STILL a false statement. Hayward only needs to make an All-NBA team once to earn far more money with Utah than any other team because of the "Kevin Durant Rule"

Irrelevant, he will still make more in Miami. Doing a 3+1 contract will allow him to get a 5 year $230M super max deal in 2020, tax free.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 01:19 PM
People are taking pictures with Pat Riley in San Diego right now. Haywards in San Diego, interesting.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 01:40 PM
Spo also in San Diego.

Bostonjorge
07-03-2017, 02:17 PM
If Hayward goes to Boston and they can get 1st place again then Hayward is almost guaranteed a all nba spot.

Scoots
07-03-2017, 02:20 PM
Yahoo had a picture of Hayward next to the headling "Jazz re-sign small forward for 4 years" ... I had to click 2 links to find out it was Ingles.

Fake news :)

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 02:25 PM
881937484459921410

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 02:27 PM
Yahoo had a picture of Hayward next to the headling "Jazz re-sign small forward for 4 years" ... I had to click 2 links to find out it was Ingles.

Fake news :)

881503147168071680

Are you sure it wasn't CNN?

Heediot
07-03-2017, 02:29 PM
Ingles at 12.5 per, not too sure if Hayward is staying with utah. But 12.5 is the going rate for a high end bench player.

Forever35
07-03-2017, 02:36 PM
This is the dangerous part of missing on acquiring players like Boston has... perception shifts. Take a step back... forget they didn't trade for Butler or PG....

The Utah Jazz last year, with Hayward, were 51-31. The Boston Celtics last year, without Hayward, was 53-39. Now, I think the West being stronger affected that and actually think Utah was a little better. But I think we can agree that it's close one way or another.

If Hayward comes to Boston, he takes Amir Johnson's starting spot (Crowder goes to PF). We'll be losing Gerald Green, or maybe he comes back, but either way Jayson Tatum is replacing him. Kelly Olynyk will be let go for cap space and replaced by Ante Zizic. I feel confident Tatum will be better than Green and while Olynyk is a proven role player, Zizic's skill set does address weaknesses if he can be a solid rookie. Hayward is a top 15ish player and Amir isn't very good anymore. So if he joins Boston he's joining last year's 53 win team with huuuuuuuuuuge improvement.

If he re-signs in Utah, they're just that same 51 team replacing Hill with Rubio. It's just the status quo.Throw in that the East is so much weaker and I think BOS is clearly the best spot to win.

The East being so weak has made it where I even think MIA is the best spot to win. Utah with Hayward is probably still a littler better than MIA with him. But MIA with him in the East is a legit contender for the ECF. In the West, Utah with Hayward is probably a 1st round exit.

I think Rubio will get more out of the Jazz than Hill was able to... Rubio has been on a bad team his whole career...

eDush
07-03-2017, 02:39 PM
This is the dangerous part of missing on acquiring players like Boston has... perception shifts. Take a step back... forget they didn't trade for Butler or PG....

The Utah Jazz last year, with Hayward, were 51-31. The Boston Celtics last year, without Hayward, was 53-39. Now, I think the West being stronger affected that and actually think Utah was a little better. But I think we can agree that it's close one way or another.

If Hayward comes to Boston, he takes Amir Johnson's starting spot (Crowder goes to PF). We'll be losing Gerald Green, or maybe he comes back, but either way Jayson Tatum is replacing him. Kelly Olynyk will be let go for cap space and replaced by Ante Zizic. I feel confident Tatum will be better than Green and while Olynyk is a proven role player, Zizic's skill set does address weaknesses if he can be a solid rookie. Hayward is a top 15ish player and Amir isn't very good anymore. So if he joins Boston he's joining last year's 53 win team with huuuuuuuuuuge improvement.

If he re-signs in Utah, they're just that same 51 team replacing Hill with Rubio. It's just the status quo.Throw in that the East is so much weaker and I think BOS is clearly the best spot to win.

The East being so weak has made it where I even think MIA is the best spot to win. Utah with Hayward is probably still a littler better than MIA with him. But MIA with him in the East is a legit contender for the ECF. In the West, Utah with Hayward is probably a 1st round exit.

I think Rubio will get more out of the Jazz than Hill was able to... Rubio has been on a bad team his whole career...Then you haven't watch the Jazz play with Hill. I have and he got them into the playoffs along with Hayward. I doubt someone who can't score can do that since he couldn't help Minny enough that they dump him for their low first pick. I doubt they make they even playoffs with Rubio and anyone can get the ball to Gobert.
:nod:

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 02:41 PM
881937484459921410

Not trying to be a homer but I truly and genuinely believe that in a pure basketball sense BOS is the best spot for him. In this upcoming season BOS is better with him than Utah or Miami is. Long-term, BOS has more room to grow than either MIA or Utah - our current young players have higher upside than MIA's or Utah's, our future picks project to be the highest, and our ownership has shown the most willingness to pay.

Obviously there's a lot more to it. He has familiarity in Utah. BOS is third in money when you factor in bird rights and taxes. Ainge not trading for a star could leave a bad taste in his mouth. Even if he's a better player IT has been here 3 years now and is such an infectious personality that Hayward probably never will be the most beloved player like he would be in Utah or Miami. In MIA it's for sure a more attractive lifestyle to most and while most people would say BOS > Utah in that regards, is it really a material difference worth moving a family for?

The one lifestyle thing will say about BOS is that the athletes really are the rockstars here. The Patriots and all their supermodel girlfriends all living in the Boston suburbs and Rhode Island (where the beaches are actually great) has kind of livened up the celebrity scene for the area.

eDush
07-03-2017, 02:43 PM
I hope Hayward does leave for Boston cause they didn't resign his buddy Hill.

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 02:52 PM
https://twitter.com/mattjshannon4/status/881510543231766532

I do want to talk about one thing I see a lot that Hayward won't want to play with IT because he'll never get the ball. Look at that link... Dragic and Rubio both average more time with the ball per possession than IT does.

There's this perception that IT just dribbles and everyone watches. It's not true at all. Everyone on Boston touches the ball. It's just that IT is a great scorer and no one else on the team is even a "good" one except maybe Horford whose true skill is actually passing/facilitating. So after all the ball movement and different players touching it usually the best shot is usually getting the ball back in IT's hands. With Hayward, that ball movement would continue but the best shot wouldn't be IT as much of the time.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 02:54 PM
881946548891860992

There's also this.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 02:55 PM
I agree with you I think the cieling is higher in Boston but with Miami you never know. They seem to always get it done and get back to the top or close to it.

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 02:59 PM
881946548891860992

There's also this.

I don't think he's serious. I read his feed... first he mocked the integrity of that tweet you quoted earlier. Then posted that. Then his next tweet quoted that one and said "That was way too easy. Guys, I've never broken a story in my life. I never even get quotes anymore." I think he's just mocking the whole thing of pretending you know which way he was leaning so you can say you were right if it comes true.

dhopisthename
07-03-2017, 03:03 PM
I don't think anyone but hayward, his wife, and maybe his agent knows what he is doing at this point

Green_Monster
07-03-2017, 03:04 PM
881946548891860992

There's also this.

His tweet right after that:

"That was way too easy. Guys, I've never broken a story in my life. I never even get quotes anymore."

Do some research before posting fake/false sources, kids.

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 03:11 PM
https://twitter.com/ramonashelburne/status/881952293809119237


For those reading tea leaves on Gordon Hayward, word is he told Jazz he wanted Rubio & would love to play w/ him

dhopisthename
07-03-2017, 03:26 PM
https://twitter.com/ramonashelburne/status/881952293809119237

if you follow Jazz guys aka Jody Genessy and Tony Jones this really isn't news. The question is really if Hayward wanted Hill more or not.

Wes Mantooth
07-03-2017, 03:45 PM
According to sources Hayward is leaning toward signing in China to dethrone Jimmer. Yes, anyone can make this garbage up. Now I get 20k clicks on my twitter for making crap up. Just stop. Hayward is still deciding.

George Hill turned down 80 million over 4 years to stay with the Jazz. His agent said he could get more money. Nope, he was wrong and now Hill replaced this joker 2 days before free agency with another joker who has never represented an NBA player. Nice work George. You had a career year in Utah and now you blew it by hiring the wrong people. You forced our hand and we replaced you with a younger cheaper yet just as good option because we had to have a decent PG before the Hayward meeting.

Ingles and Hayward are BFF's. Not just teammates, but come on over for Thanksgiving dinner type friends. Plus Ingles and Hayward share the same agent. Signing Ingles was a big deal.

http://www.nba.com/jazz/video/teams/jazz/2016/12/09/1481315092914-hayward-ingles-1019844/

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 04:13 PM
His tweet right after that:

"That was way too easy. Guys, I've never broken a story in my life. I never even get quotes anymore."

Do some research before posting fake/false sources, kids.

Good for you to take someone else's research it and claim it as your own. Good job, kid!

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 04:14 PM
881952293809119237

Seems like a random request to me but never know, I know Green Monster never does.

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 04:23 PM
A lot of people seem to love Rubio for Utah... am I missing something? I don't like the fit.

Hayward is a guy I'd think you want at least sharing ball handling duties. Not saying he's going to essentially be your PG at the SF spot the way Lebron is but I'd think that the ideal PG for him is someone who can handle but also score off-ball. Not a pure facilitator who brings no floor spacing like Rubio. I think IT or Dragic would be much better pairings.

I like Rubio as a player but not as a fit on a winning team. Same problem I had with Rondo - his skill for passing combined with a total lack of shooting make it so that his only value on offense is to have the ball in his hands the majority of the time. But neither is/were ever good enough to be a ball dominant player for a team that wins it all.

Green_Monster
07-03-2017, 04:39 PM
Good for you to take someone else's research it and claim it as your own. Good job, kid!

We all make mistakes, just learn from yours. Don't post ****** rumors. Pretty simple. I know you like the attention but at least make sure it's a somewhat reliable source.

eDush
07-03-2017, 04:43 PM
A lot of people seem to love Rubio for Utah... am I missing something? I don't like the fit.

Hayward is a guy I'd think you want at least sharing ball handling duties. Not saying he's going to essentially be your PG at the SF spot the way Lebron is but I'd think that the ideal PG for him is someone who can handle but also score off-ball. Not a pure facilitator who brings no floor spacing like Rubio. I think IT or Dragic would be much better pairings.

I like Rubio as a player but not as a fit on a winning team. Same problem I had with Rondo - his skill for passing combined with a total lack of shooting make it so that his only value on offense is to have the ball in his hands the majority of the time. But neither is/were ever good enough to be a ball dominant player for a team that wins it all.They are called Rubio lovers which mean they cannot be reason with. Every fan whose not bias saw what Hill have accomplished in Utah by carrying them to a 5th seed compared to Rubio in Minny with arguably more talent but still drop to the 13th in the standing with a worst record than Sactown. That's cause he can't score and that allow the player guarding to play zone to prevent him from passing to Towns. If you replace him with my Steph, they would be favorite to win the West cause everyone would be scared of the greatest shooter the league has ever witness that Towns would have a field day in the paint, something Rubio can only dream of and that is a fact as well as an opinion :nod:

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 04:52 PM
We all make mistakes, just learn from yours. Don't post ****** rumors. Pretty simple. I know you like the attention but at least make sure it's a somewhat reliable source.

I heard from a reliable source you have 1 ring in the last 30 years. Is this true?

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 04:53 PM
A lot of people seem to love Rubio for Utah... am I missing something? I don't like the fit.

Hayward is a guy I'd think you want at least sharing ball handling duties. Not saying he's going to essentially be your PG at the SF spot the way Lebron is but I'd think that the ideal PG for him is someone who can handle but also score off-ball. Not a pure facilitator who brings no floor spacing like Rubio. I think IT or Dragic would be much better pairings.

I like Rubio as a player but not as a fit on a winning team. Same problem I had with Rondo - his skill for passing combined with a total lack of shooting make it so that his only value on offense is to have the ball in his hands the majority of the time. But neither is/were ever good enough to be a ball dominant player for a team that wins it all.

I don't understand it either

Firefistus
07-03-2017, 06:17 PM
Everything thinks Hill is better, I'll give you that, but Hill played 1500 minutes last season, Rubio played 2500. Sure it's all fine and good to play Hill, but he really didn't effect our team much last year. Honestly George Hill is asking too much for someone who is aging and doesn't play half the season. I'm glad we got someone else, and that was my first wishlist item was to get a good durable PG this off-season, and we got one.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 06:42 PM
Hopefully he leaves, would be a boring storyline if he stayed lol

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 06:50 PM
Everything thinks Hill is better, I'll give you that, but Hill played 1500 minutes last season, Rubio played 2500. Sure it's all fine and good to play Hill, but he really didn't effect our team much last year. Honestly George Hill is asking too much for someone who is aging and doesn't play half the season. I'm glad we got someone else, and that was my first wishlist item was to get a good durable PG this off-season, and we got one.

This is a good point about durability. Availability is the best ability, as they say.

I still question the on-court fit though. Gobert is a complete non factor spacing the floor. Diaw isn't a sniper at all. Ingles shoots a great percentage but IDK if defenses really gravitate towards him out there. Hood is a good not great shooter. JJ is good off the bench too. IDK, it just seems to me that the team has no spacing. I don't see Rubio fitting in well there.

More-Than-Most
07-03-2017, 07:00 PM
If the celtics miss out on GH someone will have to put bodyguards around Ainge because he is getting roasted across the media and the fans in boston are going to be pissed... Undisputed today chris broussard and the rest of the crew basically called him the most inept gm in basketball who squandered what could have been the golden ticket off season that put them ahead of the cavs.

B'sCeltsPatsSox
07-03-2017, 07:09 PM
If the celtics miss out on GH someone will have to put bodyguards around Ainge because he is getting roasted across the media and the fans in boston are going to be pissed... Undisputed today chris broussard and the rest of the crew basically called him the most inept gm in basketball who squandered what could have been the golden ticket off season that put them ahead of the cavs.

Ya Danny's so inept he started it all over and go the team back to the ECF in 4 years.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 07:21 PM
Ya Danny's so inept he started it all over and go the team back to the ECF in 4 years.

Then he'll have the assets to turn them into a legit championship contender but will sit on his hands again lol

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 07:29 PM
If the celtics miss out on GH someone will have to put bodyguards around Ainge because he is getting roasted across the media and the fans in boston are going to be pissed... Undisputed today chris broussard and the rest of the crew basically called him the most inept gm in basketball who squandered what could have been the golden ticket off season that put them ahead of the cavs.

If Ainge thought they'd get ahead of the Cavs he would have made those moves.

A lot of people talk about Ainge "overvaluing" his assets but I think his reluctance to deal comes more from "undervaluing" the players on his roster relative to what others think.

As we were competing w/ CLE for the #1 seed Ainge came out and said something to the effect of "I don't want to put a ceiling on the team but realistically I know we aren't close."

A lot of people look at BOS and see a "#1 seed that's knocking on the door of being elite." Ainge I think looks at it and sees "deep team of role players that can win reg. season games with effort but against elite competition is thoroughly outmatched."

I guess I just don't think Ainge feels BOS is as close as a lot of others so he's more interested in the long game.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 07:32 PM
I would definitely be upset if I were a Celtics fan. I think there has been opportunities to get your team to championship level this summer. All the assets talk would be getting old to me right now.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 07:35 PM
And honestly Hayward should have been plan C at best

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 07:40 PM
And honestly Hayward should have been plan C at best

He's a FA so he costs nothing but money which is why he ranks so highly in their priorities.

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 07:44 PM
https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/882021517504262146


Source: Jazz meeting w/ Gordon Hayward in San Diego, 3.5 hours, with @rickyrubio9 flying from Spain to pitch partnership. Decision looms.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 07:52 PM
He's a FA so he costs nothing but money which is why he ranks so highly in their priorities.

True but seeing what Butler and PG cost I think you all should have jumped all over it. Even if that meant the Nets pick for Butler followed by the 2018 Nets for PG.

You guys have money to offer the max to Hayward so could you not have traded Horford and maybe another player and picks for someone like Whiteside and made up the different and kept Jae and Avery?

IT
Bradley
Butler/Jae
George
Whiteside

Or if PG was still being soft and didn't want to take advantage of his ability to kill at the 4:

IT
Butler/Bradley
George
Jae
Whiteside

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 07:52 PM
https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/882021517504262146

I hope he leaves, I'm looking forward to a new look NBA next year.

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 08:00 PM
True but seeing what Butler and PG cost I think you all should have jumped all over it. Even if that meant the Nets pick for Butler followed by the 2018 Nets for PG.

You guys have money to offer the max to Hayward so could you not have traded Horford and maybe another player and picks for someone like Whiteside and made up the different and kept Jae and Avery?

IT
Bradley
Butler/Jae
George
Whiteside

Or if PG was still being soft and didn't want to take advantage of his ability to kill at the 4:

IT
Butler/Bradley
George
Jae
Whiteside

I'd pick CLE over that team but it'd be close. I'd pick GS in 5.

For me to go all-in with the assets like you have there I need a team I feel good about winning it all. I don't feel that way about that team. As good as it looks, the bar has been set even higher by CLE and GS.

Scoots
07-03-2017, 08:12 PM
I hope he leaves, I'm looking forward to a new look NBA next year.

It's going to be "new look" regardless.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 08:13 PM
I'd pick CLE over that team but it'd be close. I'd pick GS in 5.

For me to go all-in with the assets like you have there I need a team I feel good about winning it all. I don't feel that way about that team. As good as it looks, the bar has been set even higher by CLE and GS.

I think they push both to 6 or 7 at worst. That team matches up very well with both. Whiteside would definitely effect Kyrie and LeBron attacking the rim, I feel both Butler and PG play LeBron well on both sides of the court. You have Bradley locking up and spotting up and IT scoring/playmaking. An underrated aspect here is Butler is an elite off ball player and also shoots 40% on catch and shoot 3s and I would assume Pg shoots a good percentage on catch and shoot.

I think you're selling that team short and perhaps trying to be unbiased but I think that team has a good shot. Whiteside would also give Golden State a lot of problems on both sides. I remember watching them play at Miami and he was eating them alive.

Bradley and Jae are better than anything Cleveland has off the bench and Bradley is better than anything the Warriors have off the bench. Also have to factor in potential vets coming for cheap to try and win, especially with how many guys are currently unsigned with money drying up.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 08:14 PM
It's going to be "new look" regardless.

Yea I know, the more the better in my eyes.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 08:15 PM
Also factor in Browns development as I think he's going to develop pretty fast. Already good on both sides with the jumper steadily improving.

Dade County
07-03-2017, 08:30 PM
True but seeing what Butler and PG cost I think you all should have jumped all over it. Even if that meant the Nets pick for Butler followed by the 2018 Nets for PG.

You guys have money to offer the max to Hayward so could you not have traded Horford and maybe another player and picks for someone like Whiteside and made up the different and kept Jae and Avery?

IT
Bradley
Butler/Jae
George
Whiteside

Or if PG was still being soft and didn't want to take advantage of his ability to kill at the 4:

IT
Butler/Bradley
George
Jae
Whiteside

Are you on crack man? Whiteside not going anywhere, except in a AD trade lol

bagwell368
07-03-2017, 08:32 PM
If the celtics miss out on GH someone will have to put bodyguards around Ainge because he is getting roasted across the media and the fans in boston are going to be pissed... Undisputed today chris broussard and the rest of the crew basically called him the most inept gm in basketball who squandered what could have been the golden ticket off season that put them ahead of the cavs.

Rubbish, was he supposed to outbid himself for a guy that was headed to LA after one year?

I heard those that said the Indy GM made the worst trade in NBA history with that OKC deal.

So let's stop with that. Ainge is a proven GM that has pulled a number of fine trades and picks along the way. He even broke the franchise curse by getting Horford last year.

The Cavs are going to be all done after next year, topping them after that? Even the 76'ers can manage that trick.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 08:37 PM
Are you on crack man? Whiteside not going anywhere, except in a AD trade lol

Lmao yea right he could be had for the right price. That price isn't AD. Horford Rozier or another player and picks would get it done.

Dade County
07-03-2017, 08:45 PM
Lmao yea right he could be had for the right price. That price isn't AD. Horford Rozier or another player and picks would get it done.

No it wouldn't... Horford maybe 5yrs ago but not now. Whiteside is are center piece.

Green_Monster
07-03-2017, 08:50 PM
If the celtics miss out on GH someone will have to put bodyguards around Ainge because he is getting roasted across the media and the fans in boston are going to be pissed... Undisputed today chris broussard and the rest of the crew basically called him the most inept gm in basketball who squandered what could have been the golden ticket off season that put them ahead of the cavs.

Chris Broussard? :laugh2:

http://www.prosportsdaily.com/RedZone/Article/chris-broussard-again-proves-hes-on-the-mount-rushmore-of-morons-in-sports-media-473202

Green_Monster
07-03-2017, 08:51 PM
I would definitely be upset if I were a Celtics fan. I think there has been opportunities to get your team to championship level this summer. All the assets talk would be getting old to me right now.

You can be a Celtics fan. You're good at switching which team you're a fan of. Come and join us, trust me Ainge knows what he's doing.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 08:53 PM
No it wouldn't... Horford maybe 5yrs ago but not now. Whiteside is are center piece.

They liked Horford the year they signed Whiteside too. They would definitely think hard about it if it was offered. The AD stuff is nonsense lol, Whiteside is very good but his value isn't near that high.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 08:54 PM
You can be a Celtics fan. You're good at switching which team you're a fan of. Come and join us, trust me Ainge knows what he's doing.

I will as long as Ainge promise to not use any of these "assets" to get better and compete. I only want the cieling to be a 5 game ECF.

Dade County
07-03-2017, 08:56 PM
They liked Horford the year they signed Whiteside too. They would definitely think hard about it if it was offered. The AD stuff is nonsense lol, Whiteside is very good but his value isn't near that high.

Of course not Whiteside for AD straight up lol

But that should go without saying. & they wouldn't do the Horford trade now. Thats what i am saying. Nothing to think about, Whiteside has proved his worth.

That Horford contract is awful & Boston will regret it if they can't move his contract.

WaDe03
07-03-2017, 09:04 PM
Of course not Whiteside for AD straight up lol

But that should go without saying. & they wouldn't do the Horford trade now. Thats what i am saying. Nothing to think about, Whiteside has proved his worth.

That Horford contract is awful & Boston will regret it if they can't move his contract.

We can agree to disagree. I think Miami takes Horford Rozier and 2 firsts and you don't, that's fine.

corky831
07-03-2017, 09:57 PM
I like what Ainge has done with these "assets" producing Brown and Tatum, with 2 more potential high picks with high upside. This is the true future of the celtics....everyone crapping on Ainge, but when he low-key traded for IT, no one believed that move would make them a contender. Boston was expected to be bad for a few yrs....them being good was a shock.

B'sCeltsPatsSox
07-03-2017, 10:30 PM
Sam Amick‏Verified account @sam_amick 59s59 seconds ago
More
Gordon Hayward will sleep on his decision to go to Utah, Boston, or Miami, I'm told. Another July 4 declaration it is...

thomass
07-03-2017, 10:32 PM
Building for the future in the NBA means absolutely nothing unless you assemble a team with multiple stars. Boston could have easily had both butler and PG.

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 10:38 PM
Building for the future in the NBA means absolutely nothing unless you assemble a team with multiple stars. Boston could have easily had both butler and PG.

Either one of them would have been the worst #1 player on a championship team besides the 03-04 Pistons going back to the 80s. You don't just need multiple stars, you need transcendent star(s). Top 10-15 in the league at a given time isn't good enough. You need guys that will go down in history as some of the absolute greatest to play the game. So i can't fault Ainge for not wanting to push all his chips in on a Butler/PG combo that doesn't give him that type of player. He needs to save pieces in case a player like Anthony Davis becomes available over the next couple of years IMO. Guys like Cousins, PG, Butler ain't gonna get us to the promise land.

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 10:41 PM
https://twitter.com/sam_amick/status/882065456646955009


At the risk of tugging at Jazz fans' heart strings, I'm told Utah made a very strong impression on Gordon Hayward & he's genuinely torn.

corky831
07-03-2017, 10:47 PM
I'm legit worried Hayward is gonna ***** and moan about coming off the bench behind Jaylen/Jayson :D

Lol on a serious note, I think they both have a higher ceiling than Hayward, but I'd love to have all 3 :)

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 10:47 PM
I like what Ainge has done with these "assets" producing Brown and Tatum, with 2 more potential high picks with high upside. This is the true future of the celtics....everyone crapping on Ainge, but when he low-key traded for IT, no one believed that move would make them a contender. Boston was expected to be bad for a few yrs....them being good was a shock.

I'm legit worried Hayward is gonna ***** and moan about coming off the bench behind Jaylen/Jayson :D

AllBall
07-03-2017, 10:48 PM
Sam Amick‏Verified account @sam_amick 59s59 seconds ago
More
Gordon Hayward will sleep on his decision to go to Utah, Boston, or Miami, I'm told. Another July 4 declaration it is...

In other words:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Udj-o2m39NA

thomass
07-03-2017, 10:58 PM
Building for the future in the NBA means absolutely nothing unless you assemble a team with multiple stars. Boston could have easily had both butler and PG.

Either one of them would have been the worst #1 player on a championship team besides the 03-04 Pistons going back to the 80s. You don't just need multiple stars, you need transcendent star(s). Top 10-15 in the league at a given time isn't good enough. You need guys that will go down in history as some of the absolute greatest to play the game. So i can't fault Ainge for not wanting to push all his chips in on a Butler/PG combo that doesn't give him that type of player. He needs to save pieces in case a player like Anthony Davis becomes available over the next couple of years IMO. Guys like Cousins, PG, Butler ain't gonna get us to the promise land.

You're basically competing against 1 team to get to the finals.

hugepatsfan
07-03-2017, 11:04 PM
You're basically competing against 1 team to get to the finals.

Yeah... that 1 team has, IMO, the 1st or 2nd best player of all time. Another top 15ish player. And then a top 20-25 player.

Also, I don't set my goal as "getting" to the Finals. I want to win them once I'm there. And that GS team is a MONSTER.

For me to push chips in I need to either be reasonably close enough to that level I think I can win or have enough left over to make future moves. Pushing all my lottery picks in for a Butler, PG (assuming he stays), IT, Horford core doesn't get me there and without my premium assets I don't feel great about getting another star to get there.

kobe4thewinbang
07-03-2017, 11:06 PM
Jazz meeting should be over soon with Hayward, in San Diego. Rubio flew out from freaking Spain to talk with him, per Woj. Last chance for Hayward to feel nostalgic and secure with the Jazz, despite likely losing Hill.

corky831
07-03-2017, 11:41 PM
That meeting ended hours ago

mightybosstone
07-03-2017, 11:54 PM
I really hope Hayward is headed to Boston. Not only will it eliminate one more really tough team in the West next season and balance out the power of the conferences slightly, but he's a huge upgrade for Boston and immediately gives them a fighting shot to knock off Cleveland and bring some competition to that conference.

I also just think it's the best spot for Hayward's career. Utah is going to struggle to build a contender as I think it's a challenge to attract star players to come there. Even if Ainge's "plan" has been mind boggling, you can't deny the sheer amount of assets or the Celtics' ability to attract star talent over the years. Plus, with George and Butler gone, Hayward would probably be the fourth best player in the East behind Lebron, Giannis and Wall, and the Celtics would easily be the 2nd best team in the conference. In the West, he's going to be in the shadow of like 8-10 other guys for the rest of that contract, and Utah is (at best) maybe the 5th best team in the conference.

If it were me, it would be a no-brainer. But a lot goes into the decision of where to sign, and only he can make that call.

SportsFanatic10
07-04-2017, 12:13 AM
Come on Gordon...You know you want to live in Miami! :hope:

futureman
07-04-2017, 12:58 AM
A lot of people seem to love Rubio for Utah... am I missing something? I don't like the fit.

Hayward is a guy I'd think you want at least sharing ball handling duties. Not saying he's going to essentially be your PG at the SF spot the way Lebron is but I'd think that the ideal PG for him is someone who can handle but also score off-ball. Not a pure facilitator who brings no floor spacing like Rubio. I think IT or Dragic would be much better pairings.

I like Rubio as a player but not as a fit on a winning team. Same problem I had with Rondo - his skill for passing combined with a total lack of shooting make it so that his only value on offense is to have the ball in his hands the majority of the time. But neither is/were ever good enough to be a ball dominant player for a team that wins it all.
The Jazz believe in pass first. Isaiah Thomas is a ball hog. So was George Hill.

futureman
07-04-2017, 01:00 AM
Yeah... Boston and Miami leech of the Jazz because they can't draft for S H I T. Even when Boston has a top 3 pick. They're player development must really suck if they have to leech off other teams.

Scoots
07-04-2017, 01:01 AM
Yeah... that 1 team has, IMO, the 1st or 2nd best player of all time. Another top 15ish player. And then a top 20-25 player.

Also, I don't set my goal as "getting" to the Finals. I want to win them once I'm there. And that GS team is a MONSTER.

For me to push chips in I need to either be reasonably close enough to that level I think I can win or have enough left over to make future moves. Pushing all my lottery picks in for a Butler, PG (assuming he stays), IT, Horford core doesn't get me there and without my premium assets I don't feel great about getting another star to get there.

You also want to be almost there so you can take advantage of an untimely injury to that team.

PAOboston
07-04-2017, 01:26 AM
Yeah... Boston and Miami leech of the Jazz because they can't draft for S H I T. Even when Boston has a top 3 pick. They're player development must really suck if they have to leech off other teams.
Leech of the Jazz? Care to clarify that one? Makes no sense.

Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

eDush
07-04-2017, 01:57 AM
Yeah... Boston and Miami leech of the Jazz because they can't draft for S H I T. Even when Boston has a top 3 pick. They're player development must really suck if they have to leech off other teams.The irony of ur ludicrous accusation to the contrary, Boston hasn't leech off any teams as of late cause Danny Boy cherished his picks so much he just couldn't part with them, okay mister bow-cut?

It's up to Hayward to make his decision, not us :no:

TylerSL
07-04-2017, 03:40 AM
Yeah... Boston and Miami leech of the Jazz because they can't draft for S H I T. Even when Boston has a top 3 pick. They're player development must really suck if they have to leech off other teams.

Hassan Whiteside, Patrick Beverley, Tyler Johnson, Willie Reed, Rodney McGruder, Briante Weber and Okaro White are all current NBA players who developed in our D-League over the last several years. Miami is one of the very best at developing players. Also, learn how to spell their.

SportsFanatic10
07-04-2017, 04:03 AM
Hassan Whiteside, Patrick Beverley, Tyler Johnson, Willie Reed, Rodney McGruder, Briante Weber and Okaro White are all current NBA players who developed in our D-League over the last several years. Miami is one of the very best at developing players. Also, learn how to spell their.

Yep...the Heat are actually very good in that regard despite what many people think.

TylerSL
07-04-2017, 04:20 AM
Hayward would make the most money if he signed a 3 year max instead of 4 or 5 because he would re-enter the market at 10 years service time. For those that do not know, once you have played 10 seasons you can sign an even higher max contract so expect Hayward to look for 3 year deal wherever he signs (possibly 4 years with an opt out after 3). Here is the interesting part about that, Miami and Boston can offer Hayward over $93 million over 3 years while Utah can offer him just over $96 million over the same span.

So assuming Hayward is looking for 3 years as we surmise it is in his best interest, Utah doesn't have have much of a financial advantage. Now considering that Florida doesn't have a state tax for home games, Miami may actually have a financial advantage over both Boston and Utah over a 3 year period. This was certainly brought up when he met with the Heat. The Heat are a team on the rise with Whiteside still just 28 and T Johnson, Richardson, McGruder, Winslow, White, and Adebayo all 25 or younger. We were tied with the Spurs as the 2nd best team in the league in the 2nd half of the season last year.

Boston on the other hand is afraid to trade their assets to get better. They made a terrible mistake in wanting to wait to sign Hayward before giving up the assets to get Paul George. Imagine how much more appealing the Celtics could have been if they had ponied up and acquired PG13 prior to meeting Hayward.

A return to the Jazz would be a good choice for Hayward considering he has developed there and is an icon in the city of Utah. He went from promising young player to legitimate all star and he is still getting better. The only thing is with the West so loaded now with OKC and Minnesota passing the Jazz since the season ended, even with Hayward they may be no better than 7 or 8 in the West.

No decision he makes could be considered a bad decision but he does have a best decision, and his best decision is the Miami Heat.

SportsFanatic10
07-04-2017, 04:58 AM
Hayward would make the most money if he signed a 3 year max instead of 4 or 5 because he would re-enter the market at 10 years service time. For those that do not know, once you have played 10 seasons you can sign an even higher max contract so expect Hayward to look for 3 year deal wherever he signs (possibly 4 years with an opt out after 3). Here is the interesting part about that, Miami and Boston can offer Hayward over $93 million over 3 years while Utah can offer him just over $96 million over the same span.

So assuming Hayward is looking for 3 years as we surmise it is in his best interest, Utah doesn't have have much of a financial advantage. Now considering that Florida doesn't have a state tax for home games, Miami may actually have a financial advantage over both Boston and Utah over a 3 year period. This was certainly brought up when he met with the Heat. The Heat are a team on the rise with Whiteside still just 28 and T Johnson, Richardson, McGruder, Winslow, White, and Adebayo all 25 or younger. We were tied with the Spurs as the 2nd best team in the league in the 2nd half of the season last year.

Boston on the other hand is afraid to trade their assets to get better. They made a terrible mistake in wanting to wait to sign Hayward before giving up the assets to get Paul George. Imagine how much more appealing the Celtics could have been if they had ponied up and acquired PG13 prior to meeting Hayward.

A return to the Jazz would be a good choice for Hayward considering he has developed there and is an icon in the city of Utah. He went from promising young player to legitimate all star and he is still getting better. The only thing is with the West so loaded now with OKC and Minnesota passing the Jazz since the season ended, even with Hayward they may be no better than 7 or 8 in the West.

No decision he makes could be considered a bad decision but he does have a best decision, and his best decision is the Miami Heat.

No doubt. I still don't know how Boston has let all these chances to get Butler or George go. They could win any bidding war for them, and they went for not that much. Ainge should have acted and utilized their assets to become a contender.

CELTICS4LYFE
07-04-2017, 05:43 AM
Boston on the other hand is afraid to trade their assets to get better. They made a terrible mistake in wanting to wait to sign Hayward before giving up the assets to get Paul George. Imagine how much more appealing the Celtics could have been if they had ponied up and acquired PG13 prior to meeting Hayward.

Celtics wouldn't of been able to sign him if we got PG first. They wanted to sign Hayward with cap space then trade for PG. INDY didn't want to wait a week for a better package

MILLERHIGHLIFE
07-04-2017, 08:46 AM
Two tweets... one mentioned he will sleep on it. The other he will tell the Utah news paper he's staying. So fake news or whatever. Guess he must of hung one on last night. If Celtics and Heat miss out on Hayward. What's their back up plans?

corky831
07-04-2017, 08:57 AM
Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown

bagwell368
07-04-2017, 09:23 AM
Building for the future in the NBA means absolutely nothing unless you assemble a team with multiple stars. Boston could have easily had both butler and PG.

Celts offer for PG (a potential one year and screw player) was markedly better than what Indy took - you want to blame DA for that?

Butler did go cheap, DA could have easily outbid that, given how UN-manlike Butler was in the last 4 games vs the Celts I'm glad he didn't.

DA could have had Cousins too, so could your team - some guys you just don't want - Stevens and Ainge of one mind on that one too.

bagwell368
07-04-2017, 09:36 AM
Hayward would make the most money if he signed a 3 year max instead of 4 or 5 because he would re-enter the market at 10 years service time. For those that do not know, once you have played 10 seasons you can sign an even higher max contract so expect Hayward to look for 3 year deal wherever he signs (possibly 4 years with an opt out after 3). Here is the interesting part about that, Miami and Boston can offer Hayward over $93 million over 3 years while Utah can offer him just over $96 million over the same span.

So assuming Hayward is looking for 3 years as we surmise it is in his best interest, Utah doesn't have have much of a financial advantage. Now considering that Florida doesn't have a state tax for home games, Miami may actually have a financial advantage over both Boston and Utah over a 3 year period. This was certainly brought up when he met with the Heat. The Heat are a team on the rise with Whiteside still just 28 and T Johnson, Richardson, McGruder, Winslow, White, and Adebayo all 25 or younger. We were tied with the Spurs as the 2nd best team in the league in the 2nd half of the season last year.

Boston on the other hand is afraid to trade their assets to get better. They made a terrible mistake in wanting to wait to sign Hayward before giving up the assets to get Paul George. Imagine how much more appealing the Celtics could have been if they had ponied up and acquired PG13 prior to meeting Hayward.

You are misinformed, IT HAD TO BE Hayward 1st, PG trade 2nd for salary cap working.


A return to the Jazz would be a good choice for Hayward considering he has developed there and is an icon in the city of Utah. He went from promising young player to legitimate all star and he is still getting better. The only thing is with the West so loaded now with OKC and Minnesota passing the Jazz since the season ended, even with Hayward they may be no better than 7 or 8 in the West.

No decision he makes could be considered a bad decision but he does have a best decision, and his best decision is the Miami Heat.

Hayward stays with the Jazz, he'll never win a title.

Boston still has two big picks left, an open max if Hayward comes, two young players worth watching, IT will be gone after next year (or a 6th man on a non max deal). Gallinari could also be part of the plan. The future of the East goes thru Boston and Philly, with Washington and Toronto trying to hang in, Cavs are dead. Miami is at this point "vaporware".

warfelg
07-04-2017, 09:37 AM
Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown

It's summer league against 2 guys that will be on an NBA team and a bunch that won't.....and a rapist.

Green_Monster
07-04-2017, 09:44 AM
The Jazz believe in pass first. Isaiah Thomas is a ball hog. So was George Hill.

Ricky Rubio had a higher time of possession than IT last year. :laugh2:

Green_Monster
07-04-2017, 09:50 AM
It's summer league against 2 guys that will be on an NBA team and a bunch that won't.....and a rapist.

Lol his comment isn't based off of one summer league game. Anyone who knows anything about basketball knows that Brown and Tatum have massive potential. Playing very well in the summer league just shows some of that potential.

corky831
07-04-2017, 10:45 AM
Lol his comment isn't based off of one summer league game. Anyone who knows anything about basketball knows that Brown and Tatum have massive potential. Playing very well in the summer league just shows some of that potential.

Thank you. Some posters are oblivious

warfelg
07-04-2017, 10:52 AM
Lol his comment isn't based off of one summer league game. Anyone who knows anything about basketball knows that Brown and Tatum have massive potential. Playing very well in the summer league just shows some of that potential.

And it's summer league.

corky831
07-04-2017, 11:03 AM
And it's summer league.

Jaylen against the Cavs in the playoffs wasn't summer league as far as I'm concerned. How'd the young guys in Philly perform in the playoffs?