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View Full Version : All-Time Auction Playoffs 2nd Round (Seaside Seagulls vs. Minnesota Lakers)



valade16
06-28-2017, 05:24 PM
Every year Posters from PSD come together and do a secret auction of all players throughout NBA history attempting to make the best team and win the PSD All-Time Auction Championship! The teams have been seeded and are now in the playoffs. Please look over the teams and vote based on which team you think would win in a 7 game playoff series.

Seaside Seagulls has the higher seed and will have home court advantage in the series.

Seaside Seagulls:

PG: Steph Curry | Derek Harper
SG: Joe Dumars | Michael Redd
SF: Alex English | Kyle Korver
PF: Bob McAdoo | Gus Johnson
C: Dwight Howard | Kevin Willis

vs.

Minnesota Lakers:

PG: Steve Nash
SG: Eddie Jones
SF: Michael Finley
PF: Chris Bosh
C:Wilt Chaimberlain

B: Danny Ainge
B: Joe Johnson
B: Derrick McKey
B: Lamar Odom
B: George Mikan

GREATNESS ONE
06-28-2017, 05:49 PM
Lakers.

Lakers + Giants
06-28-2017, 06:49 PM
Lakers.

Agreed, the teams look like replica of each other, then you get to the C position and the answer becomes clear. Minny Lakers, no doubt. On top of that, Minny also has the better bench.

valade16
06-28-2017, 07:02 PM
Agreed, the teams look like replica of each other, then you get to the C position and the answer becomes clear. Minny Lakers, no doubt. On top of that, Minny also has the better bench.

A replica in that every single position is better for me than him?

valade16
06-28-2017, 07:09 PM
My argument is simple: my team is better than his at every single position except C and his one discrepancy is not enough to overcome the rest of the team.

His only + perimeter defender is Eddie Jones, so he either guards Curry or English and lets the other wreak havoc. Alternatively, I have Joe Dumars to guard Steve Nash and force the ball out of his hands an into Eddie Jones or Michael Finley, where neither will be able to inflict more damage on me than English would on him.

Our PF both perform the same function with the exception that mine is just better both as a scorer and a rebounder. Yes he has Wilt, but Dwight is one of the very few guys big and strong enough to hold his own physically against Wilt. Additionally, Dwight won't have to chase Wilt all over the court because of his lack of range, meaning they are battling down low. His strategy is Wilt heavy and kicking out to 3pt shooters except Wilt is going against a 3x DPOY and his only other premium player/playmaker is facing one of the best perimeter defenders of all-time.

With Wilt and Nash both working for their production, who else is going to beat us? Eddie Jones, Finley and Bosh are just not good enough playmakers especially considering how many points his team will have to put up to keep up with mine.

I have 3 premium scorers, Curry, English and McAdoo. Does he have anyone that is going to drastically decrease their production? I don't think so.

Bad matchup for him as his best 2 players are guarded by my best 2 defenders whereas none of my best scorers are going up against a premium defender.

mngopher35
06-28-2017, 07:23 PM
Briefly on my phone, will try and do more later.

Jones will be on curry. If I can get your offense running through English with wilt/bosh capable of helping in the lane at times that's very good for me IMO.

Offensively while dumars on Nash is a good matchup Nash is not the gravity/key on my team like curry is yours. He runs the offense and takes what is there but wilt is that guy and Dwight while good defensively is not going to win that matchup. I will space out a lot of your good defenders and if it is wilt vs Dwight with space or English vs Finley with a more crowded paint I think that's a huge advantage for me.

So yes you can attack me with English or Mcadoo but I don't think that's better than what wilt can do with that space (while still having Nash distribute within the offense just likely less of a scorer now).

Dunkapolooza
06-28-2017, 07:31 PM
Wilt can average 50-30 in this game and they'd still get wrecked. Eddie Jones is the only defender lol. This is the worst wing d in the league. Curry English and dumars will average 70-75 pts. I'm not even buying jones slowing down curry or english significantly. He's not THAT much of a shut down guy. Love the guy but naw. And Finley? Barely a starter in this. Decent all around... which all time might as well be bad at everything. I don't buy him and Eddie Jones as being able to put the ball on the floor making a lot of plays if something breaks down. Forthis offense to do anything it'll have to start with Nash or wilt on his own. Which is just the number of all time great defenders as valade has.

Rely on bosh vs mcadoo. Mcadoo gonna do better on the other end. Or does the mvp get so little love? His top 3 scorers are all A type scorers all time. Curry is probably the only person on earth who can out shoot Nash. And he's a better defender. And then English on Finley. Naw. That's a slaughter.

Are centers so overrated that wilt can being a cast of this little talent through a series? Nash and wilt going to carry the day? Nash couldn't in the real nba. And wilt won rings that way how often?

valade16
06-28-2017, 07:32 PM
Briefly on my phone, will try and do more later.

Jones will be on curry. If I can get your offense running through English with wilt/bosh capable of helping in the lane at times that's very good for me IMO.

Offensively while dumars on Nash is a good matchup Nash is not the gravity/key on my team like curry is yours. He runs the offense and takes what is there but wilt is that guy and Dwight while good defensively is not going to win that matchup. I will space out a lot of your good defenders and if it is wilt vs Dwight with space or English vs Finley with a more crowded paint I think that's a huge advantage for me.

So yes you can attack me with English or Mcadoo but I don't think that's better than what wilt can do with that space (while still having Nash distribute within the offense just likely less of a scorer now).

I don't think Jones by himself is enough to stop Curry, you can put him on Curry but we're still looking at high 20's for points on good to great efficiency. Not to mention I think Nash is far more valuable to your team is claimed. If Nash becomes essentially another spacer for Wilt you're asking Wilt by himself to outscore (and out pass) my team. As great as Wilt is as a scorer (and passer), he alone is not going to be enough to outscore Curry/English/McAdoo.

mngopher35
06-28-2017, 07:34 PM
That's why I said Nash will still run the offense, some pick and roll, set plays etc. I just think like you there are matchups to exploit and mine happens to be better with my top player.

In the same way curry will still be fine to get his numbers. I am pointing out that if the game comes down to the ISO matchups (and I will take advantage of wilt here plenty), I clearly have that edge. Dwight is a good defender, especially help defense but 1v1 not as much especially when he doesn't have a big physical advantage (rare but true in this case).

jon32
06-28-2017, 07:47 PM
On my phone so cant vote yet.....tough as hell but im leaning Valade .... so much O, and i like dumars on nash and valade is right.....dwight is strong enough to cause some trouble for wilt

mngopher35
06-28-2017, 08:08 PM
Alright so to get a little more into it...

I was trying to think of big physical star centers Dwight faced and it was somewhat tough but Marc Gasol came to mind.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id1_hint=Dwight+Howard&player_id1_select=Dwight+Howard&player_id1=howardw01&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Marc+Gasol&player_id2_select=Marc+Gasol&player_id2=gasolma01&idx=players

Here is an example of what I mean about when he doesn't have the physical advantage his game is really diminished. He didn't really slow down Gasol from his average numbers despite it being early in his career because he matched up physically and Dwight wasn't killing him either. Wilt would be a way bigger beast but Dwight will not be the type to stop him 1v1 without that physical advantage.

I will have Eddie/Wilt on Curry/Dwight in the main pick and roll and you will have Dumars/Dwight on Nash/Wilt which favors me just a bit imo (sure you disagree) but my team will space you out more to give me the even bigger edge. There is no Green in the pick and roll to space or Klay on this team which is part of what helped make Curry so special too and open lanes for him. My point is that this matchup/situation is not necessarily ideal for your best/gravity player but for mine it is with spacing and a solid 1v1 matchup without needing to fully run the offense (can finish off playmaking of nash and others all can hit open man on rotations). You have those better iso players outside of them as mentioned but me having the inside advantage along with being able to help in the paint defensively is bigger than your 1v1 secondary edges.

valade16
06-28-2017, 08:26 PM
Alright so to get a little more into it...

I was trying to think of big physical star centers Dwight faced and it was somewhat tough but Marc Gasol came to mind.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id1_hint=Dwight+Howard&player_id1_select=Dwight+Howard&player_id1=howardw01&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Marc+Gasol&player_id2_select=Marc+Gasol&player_id2=gasolma01&idx=players

Here is an example of what I mean about when he doesn't have the physical advantage his game is really diminished. He didn't really slow down Gasol from his average numbers despite it being early in his career because he matched up physically and Dwight wasn't killing him either. Wilt would be a way bigger beast but Dwight will not be the type to stop him 1v1 without that physical advantage.

I will have Eddie/Wilt on Curry/Dwight in the main pick and roll and you will have Dumars/Dwight on Nash/Wilt which favors me just a bit imo (sure you disagree) but my team will space you out more to give me the even bigger edge. There is no Green in the pick and roll to space or Klay on this team which is part of what helped make Curry so special too and open lanes for him. My point is that this matchup/situation is not necessarily ideal for your best/gravity player but for mine it is with spacing and a solid 1v1 matchup without needing to fully run the offense (can finish off playmaking of nash and others all can hit open man on rotations). You have those better iso players outside of them as mentioned but me having the inside advantage along with being able to help in the paint defensively is bigger than your 1v1 secondary edges.

Those numbers are skewed heavily by post Magic Dwight. In the 5 games he played while on Orlando the numbers were a lot different:

19.6 PPG and 14 RPG

Vs

14.6 PPG and 7.4 RPG for Marc. So Prime Dwight didn't really have much of a problem with Marc at all.

mngopher35
06-28-2017, 08:31 PM
^sure prime Dwight against a new to the nba Marc. It wasn't much of a problem but he also didn't slow him down (still efficient too).

Now think of a peak wilt not being slowed down much compared to his average. Now with tons of spacing and Nash feeding him. I am just pointing out this is the type of matchup Dwight already struggles with somewhat (aka isn't slowing them down) because he won't have that big physical edge.

Edit:

To add to your numbers Gasol did that shooting 66% basically while Dwight was at 56% (assuming you used the 09-11 seasons his first 3 and dwights peak). I think given this was early Gasol (his first all star game came 2012 season after this sample, first all nba team 13 season) and Dwight couldn't throw him off his averages (arguably better all around) while his were a little below average is a good sign of how Wilt with space could be a rough matchup (if Dwight isn't limiting him and he is a bit to Dwight, far moreso than early Gasol).

valade16
06-28-2017, 08:34 PM
^sure prime Dwight against a new to the nba Marc. It wasn't much of a problem but he also didn't slow him down (still efficient too).

Now think of a peak wilt not being slowed down much compared to his average. Now with tons of spacing and Nash feeding him. I am just pointing out this is the type of matchup Dwight already struggles with somewhat (aka isn't slowing them down) because he won't have that big physical edge.

We all know Dwight isn't winning husband matchup with Wilt. It's the other 4 matchups that are the problem. I win every other one and as good as Wilt is, he's not outscoring my team single handidly.

mngopher35
06-28-2017, 08:58 PM
We all know Dwight isn't winning husband matchup with Wilt. It's the other 4 matchups that are the problem. I win every other one and as good as Wilt is, he's not outscoring my team single handidly.

The issue is he might not be able to slow him down, that's why I'm pointing out his issues with bigger guys. I have the only player who 1v1 likely calls for doubles in this matchup and I am also the team with spacing to punish help from 3 etc. To me that is going to be the key difference in this game. We both have two good defenders to put in the pick and roll against our stud PG/C combo etc as I pointed out just with mine having more room to operate so a potential staple for each is neutralized somewhat (again we probably disagree who has that edge lol).

My offense doesn't need to revolve around Wilt as I have Jones/Finley/Bosh who all are good/capable scorers and Nash to run things as one of the best PG's in history. For me to have such a balanced offense that can space like this and have such a big 1v1 edge I just don't get why you think I am relying on any one thing to beat you. Wilt is my clear advantage but that doesn't mean he has to outscore your team single handedly. Curry will be on one of those guys and english will as well so there should be plenty of other offense.

Lakers + Giants
06-28-2017, 09:11 PM
A replica in that every single position is better for me than him?

His PF is better imo, and C it's not even close. You are better at 1-3 but nash will bring the same elite shooting and playmaking curry does, Eddie jones brings legit defense and spacing like dumars. As good as curry is, I think Nash can bring the same that curry will, while being relied upon less making it better for Dwight. Dwight isn't too fond of having others outshine him, not sure how motivated he'll be here lmao. Especially when Wilt is going to be abusing him.

Your biggest h2h advantage is english, not sure how good that is. I personally don't like the fit of 4 alphas on 1 team. Curry I can accept because I do think he'd be able to adjust like how he did IRL with KD. McAdoo, English, and Dwight all want to be the alpha too tho. While Nash, Eddie Jones, Finley and Bosh have all accepted less roles before, allowing Wilt to remain the alpha. Fit wise, his team fits like a glove. I do agree you have more overall positional advantages, but im not sure the fit is even close to as good as his. His talent is comparable, while having a much better fit.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-28-2017, 10:29 PM
Agreed, the teams look like replica of each other, then you get to the C position and the answer becomes clear. Minny Lakers, no doubt. On top of that, Minny also has the better bench.

Seagull kills Lakers at PG to PF.

Lucky.
06-29-2017, 09:02 AM
Seagull kills Lakers at PG to PF.

I think SF is a bigger advantage than those two :shrug:


But anyway, I think there are some flaws on Seaside that could be taken advantage of later on, but that's not this match-up. Seaside can exploit Minnesota's flaws just as much, probably more here. I also don't think prime Dwight gets nearly enough credit in these games.

Seaside.

Dunkapolooza
06-29-2017, 12:57 PM
Bosh better then mcadoo?! No way. I think one day in 7th grade bosh dreamed of being mcadoo good. Then he met LeBron and realized he'd never have an mvp lol.

Eddie Jones is not on dumars level defensively. He never made it to an all d 1st team. In my last series there were 8 starters who made the all d team. They are practically a dime a dozen. If you made a second or third team you are decent. If you are all d 1st you're a good defender. Doy is an excellent defender. Eddie Jones is an OK defender by all time standards. He's not shutting down english. Let alone curry.

valade16
06-29-2017, 02:05 PM
I think SF is a bigger advantage than those two :shrug:


But anyway, I think there are some flaws on Seaside that could be taken advantage of later on, but that's not this match-up. Seaside can exploit Minnesota's flaws just as much, probably more here. I also don't think prime Dwight gets nearly enough credit in these games.

Seaside.

I think he meant I am better at every position from PG to PF (so PG, SG, SF and PF), and its true.

valade16
07-01-2017, 12:32 PM
People keep coming in and voting for the Lakers and I'm trying to figure out why. Is a Top 3 C vs a Top 10 C so overwhelming it supersedes being worse at every other position on the court?

As for McAdoo vs Bosh, it's clearly McAdoo. Here are their 3 year peak stats:

McAdoo 24.6 PER, .217 WS/48, 4.9 BPM
Bosh 23.6 PER, .179 WS/48, 2.8 BPM

That's at their peaks. McAdoo also had a higher PPG, RPG, APG, SPG and BPG.

KnicksorBust
07-01-2017, 04:55 PM
Score? I want to vote for Seaside but cant get to a computer.

valade16
07-01-2017, 05:06 PM
Score? I want to vote for Seaside but cant get to a computer.

12-9 Seaside with your vote.

KnicksorBust
07-01-2017, 05:14 PM
Score? I want to vote for Seaside but cant get to a computer.

12-9 Seaside with your vote.

Boring, it would be more excited if I voted for the Lakers. Can I change my vote?

valade16
07-01-2017, 05:14 PM
Boring, it would be more excited if I voted for the Lakers. Can I change my vote?

Of course you can. But do you really want to? :)

valade16
07-01-2017, 05:43 PM
Seaside Seagulls win.

KnicksorBust
07-01-2017, 05:43 PM
Boring, it would be more excited if I voted for the Lakers. Can I change my vote?

Of course you can. But do you really want to? :)

Lol nah. Congrats