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View Full Version : Dražen Petrović and Reggie Miller



Redrum187
06-27-2017, 04:23 PM
I just got done watching 30 for 30: Once Brothers. If you haven't seen it, please watch. As most of the 30 for 30 videos, it's a must watch if you love the game, the history, and it's international players.

I was too busy obsessing over Micheal Jordan when Dražen Petrović started to break out in New Jersey, so I have no memory of any of this (I was also only 9 years old). Looking at his numbers, video of him playing, and his trajectory from his playing time in Portland to New Jersey, I am curious of "what could have been". Perhaps the greatest "what if" question that gets asked frequently is the what if Sabonis came to play earlier... Where would he rank all time?

I know premature death makes people glorify and build up the person more than they really were. This just doesn't happen in sports, but music, acting, etc... Nevertheless, how good do you think Dražen Petrović would have been if he didn't die so young? Better than Reggie? As good? Poor-man's version? Who would you compare him to?

http://i.imgur.com/r5IWq9Z.jpg

KnicksorBust
06-27-2017, 04:50 PM
Reggie is a decent comp. Drazen was pretty bad defensively...

Hawkeye15
06-27-2017, 05:32 PM
he wasn't quite as efficient as Reggie, who got to the line more. Kind of a cross between Miller and Allan Houston, idk

Mr.B
06-28-2017, 10:42 AM
To me he seemed more like a mix of Manu Ginobili and JJ Redick.

NYKalltheway
06-28-2017, 04:55 PM
Drazen was going to Greece to sign for Panathinaikos, so his NBA were over a bit before his death anyways. He didn't like the NBA and the fact that he was not treated like a star, plus he was getting homesick so he wanted to be close his family in Croatia (and Serbia; his family had roots from Herzegovina, very complicated situation to explain).

Hawkeye15
06-28-2017, 05:09 PM
Drazen was going to Greece to sign for Panathinaikos, so his NBA were over a bit before his death anyways. He didn't like the NBA and the fact that he was not treated like a star, plus he was getting homesick so he wanted to be close his family in Croatia (and Serbia; his family had roots from Herzegovina, very complicated situation to explain).

did you watch the 30 for 30, "Once Brothers"?

NYKalltheway
06-29-2017, 04:22 AM
did you watch the 30 for 30, "Once Brothers"?

Yes I have.

The only "source" that rejects the fact that Drazen was coming to Greece (he had 2 exclusive interviews in Greece and one local confirming this) and leaving the NBA was from a guy called Todd Spehr who was 9 years old at the time Drazen died... And his only comment on it was "I can't believe such a player wanted to leave the NBA". So it wasn't even a rejection, just disbelief because Drazen would not speak with American journalists about his NBA future during the time.

Four days before Drazen's accident, he said this, word by word: "I'm coming to Panathinaikos and with Nick (Galis) and Stojan (Vrankovic) we'll devour every trophy out there".

Also: https://www.netsdaily.com/2015/5/30/8691221/new-book-drazen-petrovic-planned-on-european-return-then-free-agency

This piece says that Drazen wanted to go back to Europe for a couple of years (it's true that the terms with Panathinaikos were for a 2 year deal initially) and then join the Celtics on a free agent.


Drazen had decided to return to Europe and his first choice was Panathinaikos, even if he had many more offers. He wanted to stay for one or two seasons in Greece and then return to the NBA in order to sign with the Celtics. It’s been said that he had a soft spot for teams which had the shamrock as their emblem, like Panathinaikos, Notre Dame and the Celtics. Fate had other plans for him…

It's true for most Europeans that since we have a much different team loyalty system (we never change teams and there are sayings in at least 10 languages that you can change your wife, political party or car but never your sports team, and on the other hand you're quite okay with relocations and you adapt to whatever is near you).
I know people who are Bulls' fans for decades, Knicks and Pistons fans for decades, Lakers and Celtics fans for decades. I don't know anyone who likes the Cavs or the Heat or the Mavs or the Warriors other than kids who are just picking their teams in the last decade. But these kids will stick to their teams most likely. I even know a guy who's a Pacers fan btw, from the Reggie Miller days.

Hawkeye15
06-29-2017, 09:32 AM
Yes I have.

The only "source" that rejects the fact that Drazen was coming to Greece (he had 2 exclusive interviews in Greece and one local confirming this) and leaving the NBA was from a guy called Todd Spehr who was 9 years old at the time Drazen died... And his only comment on it was "I can't believe such a player wanted to leave the NBA". So it wasn't even a rejection, just disbelief because Drazen would not speak with American journalists about his NBA future during the time.

Four days before Drazen's accident, he said this, word by word: "I'm coming to Panathinaikos and with Nick (Galis) and Stojan (Vrankovic) we'll devour every trophy out there".

Also: https://www.netsdaily.com/2015/5/30/8691221/new-book-drazen-petrovic-planned-on-european-return-then-free-agency

This piece says that Drazen wanted to go back to Europe for a couple of years (it's true that the terms with Panathinaikos were for a 2 year deal initially) and then join the Celtics on a free agent.



It's true for most Europeans that since we have a much different team loyalty system (we never change teams and there are sayings in at least 10 languages that you can change your wife, political party or car but never your sports team, and on the other hand you're quite okay with relocations and you adapt to whatever is near you).
I know people who are Bulls' fans for decades, Knicks and Pistons fans for decades, Lakers and Celtics fans for decades. I don't know anyone who likes the Cavs or the Heat or the Mavs or the Warriors other than kids who are just picking their teams in the last decade. But these kids will stick to their teams most likely. I even know a guy who's a Pacers fan btw, from the Reggie Miller days.

we have a fan from Greece in the Wolves forum who is a die hard haha

Mr.B
06-29-2017, 09:59 AM
Yes I have.

The only "source" that rejects the fact that Drazen was coming to Greece (he had 2 exclusive interviews in Greece and one local confirming this) and leaving the NBA was from a guy called Todd Spehr who was 9 years old at the time Drazen died... And his only comment on it was "I can't believe such a player wanted to leave the NBA". So it wasn't even a rejection, just disbelief because Drazen would not speak with American journalists about his NBA future during the time.

Four days before Drazen's accident, he said this, word by word: "I'm coming to Panathinaikos and with Nick (Galis) and Stojan (Vrankovic) we'll devour every trophy out there".

Also: https://www.netsdaily.com/2015/5/30/8691221/new-book-drazen-petrovic-planned-on-european-return-then-free-agency

This piece says that Drazen wanted to go back to Europe for a couple of years (it's true that the terms with Panathinaikos were for a 2 year deal initially) and then join the Celtics on a free agent.



It's true for most Europeans that since we have a much different team loyalty system (we never change teams and there are sayings in at least 10 languages that you can change your wife, political party or car but never your sports team, and on the other hand you're quite okay with relocations and you adapt to whatever is near you).
I know people who are Bulls' fans for decades, Knicks and Pistons fans for decades, Lakers and Celtics fans for decades. I don't know anyone who likes the Cavs or the Heat or the Mavs or the Warriors other than kids who are just picking their teams in the last decade. But these kids will stick to their teams most likely. I even know a guy who's a Pacers fan btw, from the Reggie Miller days.

I've been a pretty hard core Mavs fan since 1992.

NYKalltheway
06-29-2017, 10:55 AM
I'm not saying someone cannot support a less known or smaller market team. Even if they do, they'll stick to that team forever. Most problematic fans were the Sonics' fans and the Hornets' fans as well for a long while.

But the trend was to support a popular team and then stick with it. Which is why we will have a surge of Warrior fans as we have a lot of people in their 20s supporting the Heat. A player might be enough to attract you to a team some times, but even after he leaves, you won't find many Europeans/internationals who'll abandon that team and go on to support that player. Lebron for example created many Heat fans, but I doubt even 5% became Cavs fans after he returned to Cleveland.

As for Drazen, I'm pretty sure he had a soft spot for the Celtics. Might be the shamrock, but it also may be the history (Russell etc) or the recent success (Larry Bird and the rest in the 80s). And as I said, there's too much shame in switching teams over here. There's an unofficial age limit for that, which is in the low single digits, unless the team you supported was shameful itself, then you have managed to dignify yourself :D

Hawkeye15
06-29-2017, 11:34 AM
I'm not saying someone cannot support a less known or smaller market team. Even if they do, they'll stick to that team forever. Most problematic fans were the Sonics' fans and the Hornets' fans as well for a long while.

But the trend was to support a popular team and then stick with it. Which is why we will have a surge of Warrior fans as we have a lot of people in their 20s supporting the Heat. A player might be enough to attract you to a team some times, but even after he leaves, you won't find many Europeans/internationals who'll abandon that team and go on to support that player. Lebron for example created many Heat fans, but I doubt even 5% became Cavs fans after he returned to Cleveland.

As for Drazen, I'm pretty sure he had a soft spot for the Celtics. Might be the shamrock, but it also may be the history (Russell etc) or the recent success (Larry Bird and the rest in the 80s). And as I said, there's too much shame in switching teams over here. There's an unofficial age limit for that, which is in the low single digits, unless the team you supported was shameful itself, then you have managed to dignify yourself :D

that was the trend in the U.S. (still is for most fans), but there are for sure plenty of fans that follow a certain player(s) more than teams the last 10 years or so. Kind of plays hand in hand to more star movement. There has been tons of player movement since the early 90's, but stars moving to the degree they have the past 5-10 years was not common back in the day. I would imagine Europe has fans of teams that at some point, were formidable. Celtics/Lakers, duh, they have always been. But the smaller markets, you probably don't see fans of those teams unless they were really good at some point, drawing in fans from across the world. My guess anyways?

NYKalltheway
06-30-2017, 06:46 AM
I would imagine Europe has fans of teams that at some point, were formidable. Celtics/Lakers, duh, they have always been. But the smaller markets, you probably don't see fans of those teams unless they were really good at some point, drawing in fans from across the world. My guess anyways?

Well, as I said, most fans pick their teams very early on. With NBA it depends on exposure. Now there's too much of it, back then (80s-early 90s) it was huge because of the stars and the Dream Team and whatnot. The newest generation of that group grew up with Tim Duncan and Kevin Garnett as the up-and-coming stars and they loved Kobe, Shaq and some loved Dirk as well, so it would explain some Spurs, Timberwolves and Mavericks fans emerging that have been around for almost 2 decades. But in the 80s, you can imagine that almost everyone would be exposed to the Lakers, the Celtics, the Pistons, the Bulls and maybe the Sixers. Not many knew of Karl Malone and John Stockton, or Hakeem. That grew in the 90s.

For non-domestic teams, it usually takes some great players (in every sport there is), maybe the location or culture of the team (politics is a strong point for some, others like cosmopolitan cities or traditional clubs and so on) and since it's an age-related thing, colors, crest and uniform is a thing as well :D

Back in my day, I loved the Knicks (didn't really know it was a NY team) because I liked some of the players and most importantly, the colors... I just fell in love with the colors. Then you get to know more abou that team and you grow more attached to it.
I know people who supported the Suns because of Barkley and their uniforms. Others who loved the Rockets because of Hakeem but most importantly, that Rocket on the uniform. Others loved the Sonics because of their crest and uniform, and colors maybe too. Obviously, if you don't win, you don't get exposure. We had like 2 live games a week back then at 3am or something and around 4-5 games during the weekend in the morning or early in the afternoon. By the end of the decade it was expanding of course. But some teams we didn't even know they existed unless we owned a video game or something. I remember never hearing about teams like the Kings, or the Clippers because they weren't significant enough to earn exposure to my place. I guess they could have had exposure in other countries if there was relevance with some players who played there. I learned about these teams through video games. And I sort of liked the Kings in the mid and late 90s due to that.
Which brings me to the Warriors. I know kids who loved the Warriors before their dominance. Reason? NBA 2k games and the catchy colors. They drained three's all day long and they have been the team to pick for many kids to beat the Miami Heat in the 2012-2014 era. Them becoming an elite team with a record breaking season and later on a championship escalated their fandom around the world of course. But people nowadays barely watch the games (live) but follow the league through video games mostly. Playoffs are of course a different story.