PDA

View Full Version : What IF David Lee never got injured?



Chronz
06-26-2017, 01:18 PM
So I woke up from another one of my dream NBA scenarios, this being chief among the recurring ones I decided to make a thread of it. What if David Lee never got injured during the 2013 playoffs and more importantly in the final game of 14-15 preseason.

A quick rewind for those who are too young or too smoked out to remember. 2013 was the year the team finally removed the tumor that was Monta Ellis and we got our first view of the Curry to come. It was also the year David Lee had finally made the playoffs and in his first game he collides with the immortal Javale McGee and injures his hip or something. Dude is basically done for the playoffs outside of inspiring spurts of play in limited minutes. This gives the Warriors their first look at potential death lineups with versatile athletes and spacing galore. Barnes thrives as a small ball 4, Bogut has more room to operate, even Draymond Green gets more run in pivotal games and shows enough promise to make Kerr wonder of his potential.

2014 happens and Lee returns to form, the Dubs win 51 games then they lose Bogut right before the playoffs and push the Clips to 7 games. This series gives Kerr yet another glimpse into what Draymond can do filling in as the primary defensive bigman.

(Funny sidenote, during this series I remember people telling me they have to play a historically bad defender and his frontcourt partner is 6"7, I was like, are you guys watching this beef cake, I initially thought Blake couldn't be defended by players of similar size but DG changed all that).



So we come into the 2015 season and Kerr is thinking about playing Draymond more but he didn't know how to approach Lee about coming off the bench or taking a backseat in terms of MPG. Luckily for him, Lee aggravates his preseason injury and Draymond becomes the starter by default and the rest is history, Lee gets traded and makes a comeback with the Spurs only to get injured and unable to finish a series vs his former team. A tragic story.




So what happens to the Warriors if Lee never gets hurt? Do they lose vs the Nuggets? Do they ever discover Draymond or is he discovered by another team similar to the Ben Wallace story?

Monta is beast
06-26-2017, 03:14 PM
This god awful thread never gets created

Scoots
06-26-2017, 03:28 PM
Green had already been discovered. It would have slowed his development some, but he'd have been starting by mid-season regardless.

Lee was injured in his youth and couldn't use his dominant arm for a couple months, but he refused to stop playing so he developed his weaker arm to the point where he's fully ambidextrous ... if THAT injury never happens he may not even make the NBA.

Raps18-19 Champ
06-26-2017, 03:40 PM
David Lee is cool man.

B'sCeltsPatsSox
06-26-2017, 03:40 PM
I think the bigger what if is "what if the Knicks offered Kerr a few more million dollars to become their coach in 2014?"

Vee-Rex
06-26-2017, 03:41 PM
I'd love to give a more in-depth, predicative answer that takes into account the Warriors contract situation, draft scouting, and free agent prospects - but I'm gonna be super lazy here and give a super lazy answer.

I say Golden State barely makes it to the 2015 finals while heavily utilizing David Lee. They eventually lose to the Cavs in 7 games, mainly because Kerr takes longer to emphasize small-ball due to not having a lot of trust in Green. As a result, the Warriors don't sign Green to an extension in July and lose him to some other team.

Then in 2016, the Warriors lose to the Thunder in the 2016 WCF in 5 games, that's only assuming the standings play out the same way (they wouldn't win 73 games without Green). Regardless of where they finish, I don't think they're beating the Thunder or Spurs in the playoffs without Green and we likely see a Thunder/Cavs finals matchup.

I think the Cavs win the 2016 finals (call me biased but nova Kyrie + LeBron is tough to win against).

Green is no longer in GS so he doesn't call KD to join him, and so KD either remains with OKC or signs with Boston. If KD stays with the Thunder, GS never reaches the finals again because they'll lose to either the Thunder or the Spurs without Green and KD. If KD signs with Boston, GS likely loses to the Spurs, but if they do reach the finals then they're losing to the Cavs or KD-led Celtics.

Long story short - if David Lee doesn't get injured, GS never wins a championship (IMO).

hughest4
06-26-2017, 04:20 PM
It's interesting to think about.
David Lee is one of my favorite players of all-time, and as much as I hate to admit it, I think he would have lost his starting spot at some point during the 2015 season regardless of injury. The guy is very talented offensively but lacks the toughness and grit that the Warriors team desperately needed in that lineup.

I'm sure through practice and whatever limited minutes Draymond was getting, he would have impressed Kerr. The guy is absolutely awesome. Lee and Draymond are my one and two favorites, just wish they could have co-existed on the same team a little bit better.

Saddletramp
06-26-2017, 06:18 PM
I think the bigger what if is "what if the Knicks offered Kerr a few more million dollars to become their coach in 2014?"

Or if he was a man of his word? Didn't he agree to join them and then backed out like a little *****? That's a common thing over in the Bay Area lately.

Maybe he screwed up his back this bad by moonwalking out of New York?

eDush
07-03-2017, 05:06 PM
Then he would not have injured Kawhi or did that happened afterward which would likely be due to. karma. Now if Steph never got injured last season, we would be a 3 peat championship winner now!
:win::win::win:

tredigs
07-03-2017, 05:58 PM
Put down the spliff and re-enter our dimension Chronz. What-ifs are a waste of your life.

COOLbeans
07-03-2017, 06:04 PM
So I woke up from another one of my dream NBA scenarios, this being chief among the recurring ones I decided to make a thread of it. What if David Lee never got injured during the 2013 playoffs and more importantly in the final game of 14-15 preseason.

A quick rewind for those who are too young or too smoked out to remember. 2013 was the year the team finally removed the tumor that was Monta Ellis and we got our first view of the Curry to come. It was also the year David Lee had finally made the playoffs and in his first game he collides with the immortal Javale McGee and injures his hip or something. Dude is basically done for the playoffs outside of inspiring spurts of play in limited minutes. This gives the Warriors their first look at potential death lineups with versatile athletes and spacing galore. Barnes thrives as a small ball 4, Bogut has more room to operate, even Draymond Green gets more run in pivotal games and shows enough promise to make Kerr wonder of his potential.

2014 happens and Lee returns to form, the Dubs win 51 games then they lose Bogut right before the playoffs and push the Clips to 7 games. This series gives Kerr yet another glimpse into what Draymond can do filling in as the primary defensive bigman.

(Funny sidenote, during this series I remember people telling me they have to play a historically bad defender and his frontcourt partner is 6"7, I was like, are you guys watching this beef cake, I initially thought Blake couldn't be defended by players of similar size but DG changed all that).



So we come into the 2015 season and Kerr is thinking about playing Draymond more but he didn't know how to approach Lee about coming off the bench or taking a backseat in terms of MPG. Luckily for him, Lee aggravates his preseason injury and Draymond becomes the starter by default and the rest is history, Lee gets traded and makes a comeback with the Spurs only to get injured and unable to finish a series vs his former team. A tragic story.




So what happens to the Warriors if Lee never gets hurt? Do they lose vs the Nuggets? Do they ever discover Draymond or is he discovered by another team similar to the Ben Wallace story?

Mark Jackson was the coach during those first 2 playoff runs and he's the one who developed Green and gave him run as a 35th pick

eDush
07-03-2017, 07:10 PM
So I woke up from another one of my dream NBA scenarios, this being chief among the recurring ones I decided to make a thread of it. What if David Lee never got injured during the 2013 playoffs and more importantly in the final game of 14-15 preseason.

A quick rewind for those who are too young or too smoked out to remember. 2013 was the year the team finally removed the tumor that was Monta Ellis and we got our first view of the Curry to come. It was also the year David Lee had finally made the playoffs and in his first game he collides with the immortal Javale McGee and injures his hip or something. Dude is basically done for the playoffs outside of inspiring spurts of play in limited minutes. This gives the Warriors their first look at potential death lineups with versatile athletes and spacing galore. Barnes thrives as a small ball 4, Bogut has more room to operate, even Draymond Green gets more run in pivotal games and shows enough promise to make Kerr wonder of his potential.

2014 happens and Lee returns to form, the Dubs win 51 games then they lose Bogut right before the playoffs and push the Clips to 7 games. This series gives Kerr yet another glimpse into what Draymond can do filling in as the primary defensive bigman.

(Funny sidenote, during this series I remember people telling me they have to play a historically bad defender and his frontcourt partner is 6"7, I was like, are you guys watching this beef cake, I initially thought Blake couldn't be defended by players of similar size but DG changed all that).



So we come into the 2015 season and Kerr is thinking about playing Draymond more but he didn't know how to approach Lee about coming off the bench or taking a backseat in terms of MPG. Luckily for him, Lee aggravates his preseason injury and Draymond becomes the starter by default and the rest is history, Lee gets traded and makes a comeback with the Spurs only to get injured and unable to finish a series vs his former team. A tragic story.




So what happens to the Warriors if Lee never gets hurt? Do they lose vs the Nuggets? Do they ever discover Draymond or is he discovered by another team similar to the Ben Wallace story?

Mark Jackson was the coach during those first 2 playoff runs and he's the one who developed Green and gave him run as a 35th pickJackson was also the reason why Iggy wanted to come here plus a slew of other players but we were limited to roster size and change our culture to a winning and fun one like he has promised https://youtu.be/8olol-7MnaM

Thanks Mark for the memories :clap:

Chronz
07-04-2017, 08:28 PM
I'd love to give a more in-depth, predicative answer that takes into account the Warriors contract situation, draft scouting, and free agent prospects - but I'm gonna be super lazy here and give a super lazy answer.

I say Golden State barely makes it to the 2015 finals while heavily utilizing David Lee. They eventually lose to the Cavs in 7 games, mainly because Kerr takes longer to emphasize small-ball due to not having a lot of trust in Green. As a result, the Warriors don't sign Green to an extension in July and lose him to some other team.

Then in 2016, the Warriors lose to the Thunder in the 2016 WCF in 5 games, that's only assuming the standings play out the same way (they wouldn't win 73 games without Green). Regardless of where they finish, I don't think they're beating the Thunder or Spurs in the playoffs without Green and we likely see a Thunder/Cavs finals matchup.

I think the Cavs win the 2016 finals (call me biased but nova Kyrie + LeBron is tough to win against).

Green is no longer in GS so he doesn't call KD to join him, and so KD either remains with OKC or signs with Boston. If KD stays with the Thunder, GS never reaches the finals again because they'll lose to either the Thunder or the Spurs without Green and KD. If KD signs with Boston, GS likely loses to the Spurs, but if they do reach the finals then they're losing to the Cavs or KD-led Celtics.

Long story short - if David Lee doesn't get injured, GS never wins a championship (IMO).

How I know posters actually give a F.

They say they dont want to go in depth, then proceed to have the most in depth answer. hah!

JasonJohnHorn
07-04-2017, 08:35 PM
That season, I wondered this as well. It reminded me of Young replacing Montana (not that I watch football). But I don't think the injury is what put him on the bench long-term: I think that was Kerr's choice.

The criticisms of Jackson's offense were specifically directed at Lee without naming him. He wasn't 'utilizing' his shooters and passers.... Kerr's job was to do that.

Had he not been injured, I feel like he would have gotten more minutes that year, but his role would have still be significantly reduced, and if anything, he would have been on the trading block.

Chronz
07-04-2017, 08:38 PM
Mark Jackson was the coach during those first 2 playoff runs and he's the one who developed Green and gave him run as a 35th pick
Right, I brainfarted there but I meant to say the Warriors brass, the incumbent staff + Kerr had an idea at least of what DG was capable of. Like I remember Kerr wondering about the potential of DG while Lee was around.

Chronz
07-04-2017, 08:41 PM
I wondered this as well. But I don't think the injury is what put him on the bench long-term: I think that was Kerr's choice.

The criticisms of Jackson's offense were specifically directed at Lee without naming him. He wasn't 'utilizing' his shooters and passers.... Kerr's job was to do that.

Had he not been injured, I feel like he would have gotten more minutes that year, but his role would have still be significantly reduced, and if anything, he would have been on the trading block.

I thought it had more to do with wasting possessions by isolating Klay on the blocks and forcing Curry to work more off the ball (with Iggy handling). Kerr basically eliminated all Klay post ups and kept the ball in Curry's hands more than Iggy. He installed the post centered kick outs but that could've been possible with Lee IMO, hes not a bad passer himself. Its just impossible to find someone like DG who can play 4 on 3 at his level whilst defending much bigger players. Hes the key that turned the cog around IMO and I dont foresee that happening if Lee stays healthy. Dude made too much money, was decently skilled and was something of a face of the franchise.

Chronz
07-04-2017, 08:46 PM
Put down the spliff and re-enter our dimension Chronz. What-ifs are a waste of your life.
Just about all nba talk is a waste of my life now that Im aware of the KD pussification era. I'd rather reminisce for entertainment purposes but since you've brought it up, I've actually had a seemingly inconsequential pontification change my life recently so I disagree with you on the value of entertaining ones beliefs.

JasonJohnHorn
07-05-2017, 03:05 AM
I thought it had more to do with wasting possessions by isolating Klay on the blocks and forcing Curry to work more off the ball (with Iggy handling). Kerr basically eliminated all Klay post ups and kept the ball in Curry's hands more than Iggy. He installed the post centered kick outs but that could've been possible with Lee IMO, hes not a bad passer himself. Its just impossible to find someone like DG who can play 4 on 3 at his level whilst defending much bigger players. Hes the key that turned the cog around IMO and I dont foresee that happening if Lee stays healthy. Dude made too much money, was decently skilled and was something of a face of the franchise.

I think the concern with Lee was as much the lack of defense as the post scoring (and lack of 3-pt shooting). I love Lee. Think he's a great player. Were he playing the 80's/90's, he'd likely be a perennial all-star. But defensively and with respect to the 3-ball... he didn't seem to fit where Kerr wanted to take the team, and where the ownership seemed to want the team to go.

But yeah.. he is a strong passer. Not where Green is, but very adept at that.


Were he healthy, I feel like he would have had a bigger role, but that Green would seen minutes grow over the season while Lee's went down.

The money is a good point. Some teams and GMs are insistent on using guys who they are paying a lot to... but when new coaches come in... they often don't want to be tied to the previous regimes 'mistakes' (which is an unfair word to Lee).

He could have done well in the Warriors system. But I think Green effectiveness would have won out. And it could have given the Warriors a trade piece in Lee. I think even by then they were looking ahead to clearing cap space out for Klay and Curry.

I was kinda on the outside cause I'm on the East coast and I don't get as much of the news out there, so I may not be as well informed as some.

Great threat though.

rhd420
07-05-2017, 06:45 PM
David Lee would dominate ---- from Greg Oden

4North
07-05-2017, 07:00 PM
What if Colin Kaepernick completes that pass to Michael Crabtree to win The Super Bowl in 2012? That team was stacked at seemingly every unit offensively and defensively. Kaepernick was a great talent but had the confidence and maturity of a tween emo girl. Had he completed that pass, and was the guy who lead The 49ers to their 6th Super Bowl in what would've been the greatest comeback in Super Bowl history, while throwing for over 300 yards, etc. etc. etc. EVERYTHING would've been way different for a potential dynasty that never was. Harbaugh never leaves, Kaepernick doesn't break down mentally and emotionally like he did, all pro players don't start retiring on a team in a free fall, oh what could've been.