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FOXHOUND
05-31-2017, 11:25 PM
http://sportsnaut.com/2017/05/adam-silver-nba-rethinking-one-done-rule/

So, Adam Silver talked about how the NBA is actually now thinking about getting rid of the one and done rule. At first I was like nah, the one and done rule has done a great job of trimming the fat of draft picks like Eddy Curry and getting young kids some college coaching. As I thought about it more though, and Silver talks about it here, is that one and done has become so common and basically a sham that I don't think that same effect is being felt like when it was first introduced.

The real key here is the D-League. Once the D-League becomes a legit, NBA team for D-League team minor league system, I think this actually could be a better outcome. The two-way contract is now already here and it's only a matter of time before each team has a designated D-League franchise they run.

It would become like Europe where the top talented young players go on to play professionally in a league of grown men as opposed to continuing to dominate their peers at the NCAA level. You still need to draft players to get to that point but I don't know how many players would jump at that opportunity when college stills offers the exposure to greatly raise your draft stock/rookie contract size and the education to fall back on if you aren't one of the lucky 450 to crack an NBA roster.

One drawback I could potentially see happening is prospects like Hamidou Diallo, who went back to school after failing to receive a high enough draft guarantee. Teams who pick in the 20's are your playoff teams, so you run the risk of them being able to secure better long term talent with less worry of the risk of them busting like top 10 picks have to deal with. It could actually lead to the talent equality gap widening, since these teams are already clearly better run to get to where they are to begin with. That could also start the trend to shift back to Eddy Curry like draft selections again.

What do you guys think? Would this be good or bad for the NBA? Also, **** the NCAA and the way they profit off of college athletes lol. Them losing out on whoring out the top young talent is a nice bonus.

HandsOnTheWheel
06-01-2017, 03:36 AM
This is great IMO. Always been a proponent of doing away with one and dones.

More-Than-Most
06-01-2017, 04:20 AM
i dont like it at all.... The NBA is mostly black and a ton of the athletes are from **** areas.... Fresh out of highschool they will be in the lime light making a ton and that just promises monumental **** ups both financially and publicly... I am pro more years of school.. Most of these athletes dont work out and make the big bucks... why not have a degree to fall back on... a ton of athletes go broke when their career is done and if these kids come fresh out of highschool it will only get worse... Seems like the NBA is looking out for themselves more than these kids.

hugepatsfan
06-01-2017, 04:30 AM
i dont like it at all.... The NBA is mostly black and a ton of the athletes are from **** areas.... Fresh out of highschool they will be in the lime light making a ton and that just promises monumental **** ups both financially and publicly... I am pro more years of school.. Most of these athletes dont work out and make the big bucks... why not have a degree to fall back on... a ton of athletes go broke when their career is done and if these kids come fresh out of highschool it will only get worse... Seems like the NBA is looking out for themselves more than these kids.

The flip side of this though is that if they come from **** areas they're family needs the money. Sure there are some that the school will do good for but there are others who will get hurt or just prove to not be very good despite athleticism and they'll never get an NBA payday they would have. Which do you prioritize? Personally, I say give the opportunity to do good to all of them and if they **** up that's on then. Don't hurt others to save people from themselves.

For the game it's better to have more school for athletic and even personal development. But for these kids lives I don't believe in limiting their earning potential. I think all sports should allow 18 year olds to be drafted. Now if a team prefers seasoned college players that's their prerogative but don't limit the earning potential of these kids.

metswon69
06-01-2017, 04:55 AM
If an 18 year old can put his life on the line and go to war, he certainly should be able to pick his profession out of high school.

That said, yeah the quality of the game will suffer some. Guys like Calipari, Coach K, Pitino, Izzo, etc are very good at preparing guys for the NBA and there will be kids who miss out on that coaching.

Not to mention you'll probably have a higher bust rate because aside from the Lebron James and Kevin Garnetts of the world (where they were already NBA ready) as it will more difficult to see how certain skills translate from high school to the professional game.

Heediot
06-01-2017, 06:12 AM
A two way d-league would be nice.

There is a lot of money internationally for guys who bust in the NBA, but on the flip-side these international teams want guys that are ready to contribute and won't have as much patience as NBA teams in developing talent since players are signed in a free market and not drafted (at least US imported players).

warfelg
06-01-2017, 07:36 AM
I've long been a proponent of this being the rule:

- If a player skips college they have to play 2 years in the, now, g-league. This makes it so that if a player wants to leave early he knows that he won't be in the NBA for a few years. He also wont get a rookie salary or start the rookie payscale until he makes it to the NBA. And it makes NBA teams prioritize what they want out the the draft.

- If the player goes to school it's at least 2 years before he can go pro. So for that player going to school, he knows it will be a while before he goes to the NBA, but he will be able to go to the NBA right away with no g-league. NBA teams picking this kind of player gets help right away.

Once caveat that I've wanted to add over time was that the player that goes to school must get his associates before going to the NBA. If you go to the G-league, there should be a NBA required classes that the player must finish the classes before being pulled up.

hugepatsfan
06-01-2017, 07:42 AM
At the end of the day, as much as the sports fan in me wants what's best for the league, this is a decision about the lives of young men. My priority there is giving them the opportunities they deserve. They should be free to get paid for their talents.

IndyRealist
06-01-2017, 08:56 AM
The NCAA should be paying players. A lot of these one and done guys don't even go to classes, so to think they're getting a useful degree to fall back on only really applies to the ones not going to the NBA anyway.

The NBA used the NCAA as their farm system. Now that the D league is more structured, they need to use it officially as a minor league. That'll save them from overpaying busts, and from having to carve time for player development instead of putting the best team on the floor, all the time.

Scoots
06-01-2017, 09:10 AM
I've long been a proponent of this being the rule:

- If a player skips college they have to play 2 years in the, now, g-league. This makes it so that if a player wants to leave early he knows that he won't be in the NBA for a few years. He also wont get a rookie salary or start the rookie payscale until he makes it to the NBA. And it makes NBA teams prioritize what they want out the the draft.

- If the player goes to school it's at least 2 years before he can go pro. So for that player going to school, he knows it will be a while before he goes to the NBA, but he will be able to go to the NBA right away with no g-league. NBA teams picking this kind of player gets help right away.

Once caveat that I've wanted to add over time was that the player that goes to school must get his associates before going to the NBA. If you go to the G-league, there should be a NBA required classes that the player must finish the classes before being pulled up.

Or just do away with the school requirement but set the rookie scale higher depending how much education you have?

warfelg
06-01-2017, 09:20 AM
Or just do away with the school requirement but set the rookie scale higher depending how much education you have?

You realize for the most fact what I put forth is the MLB structure.

And I don't think that the NBA PA would go for what your suggesting.

FOXHOUND
06-01-2017, 09:29 AM
i dont like it at all.... The NBA is mostly black and a ton of the athletes are from **** areas.... Fresh out of highschool they will be in the lime light making a ton and that just promises monumental **** ups both financially and publicly... I am pro more years of school.. Most of these athletes dont work out and make the big bucks... why not have a degree to fall back on... a ton of athletes go broke when their career is done and if these kids come fresh out of highschool it will only get worse... Seems like the NBA is looking out for themselves more than these kids.

Damn, you went to harsh reality quick haha.

I don't have an issue with a persons right to choose, and I don't think it would happen as frequently as it used to when it was much more wild west. Even then, the money they make on just a rookie scale contract in the 20-30 pick range is more than enough to pay for a college education if their NBA career falls short.

Now, that young kid might be irresponsible with that money and blow it but I think that's their responsibility. The NBA may be looking out for their best interest but really that's their prerogative. Like Charles Barkley, it's not their job to raise other peoples kids.

The new two-way contract and the D-League is probably enough of an obstacle to still push most kids to college. I think this would mainly apply to the top talent that gets mocked top 5-10 a year before the draft, like a Markelle Fultz. This would also allow for the recruitment process to get pushed down, so lesser talents get the chance to go to schools like Kentucky and Duke and so on as it trickles down.

FOXHOUND
06-01-2017, 09:44 AM
If an 18 year old can put his life on the line and go to war, he certainly should be able to pick his profession out of high school.

That said, yeah the quality of the game will suffer some. Guys like Calipari, Coach K, Pitino, Izzo, etc are very good at preparing guys for the NBA and there will be kids who miss out on that coaching.

Not to mention you'll probably have a higher bust rate because aside from the Lebron James and Kevin Garnetts of the world (where they were already NBA ready) as it will more difficult to see how certain skills translate from high school to the professional game.

I agree with this drawback, that would be my biggest fear. I think it would strengthen the D-League to where it's a legit minor league system but I think that's fairly far away. This could help expedite that growth though. The D-League isn't just for players either, it's also for coaches, front office positions, referees, etc.

The hope would be that guys like Calipari, Coach K, Pitino, Izzo, etc who don't want to coach in the NBA star drama but want to develop young kids with full coaching control are in the D-League instead of college. Where those coaches are being paid millions to coach student athletes, they could instead be paid millions to develop NBA talent more directly if interested and have a more direct path line to an NBA gig. The NBA could also work the D-League into their future TV deals and games with the top young talent can be televised. That's talking way down the line though.

FOXHOUND
06-01-2017, 09:48 AM
I've long been a proponent of this being the rule:

- If a player skips college they have to play 2 years in the, now, g-league. This makes it so that if a player wants to leave early he knows that he won't be in the NBA for a few years. He also wont get a rookie salary or start the rookie payscale until he makes it to the NBA. And it makes NBA teams prioritize what they want out the the draft.

- If the player goes to school it's at least 2 years before he can go pro. So for that player going to school, he knows it will be a while before he goes to the NBA, but he will be able to go to the NBA right away with no g-league. NBA teams picking this kind of player gets help right away.

Once caveat that I've wanted to add over time was that the player that goes to school must get his associates before going to the NBA. If you go to the G-league, there should be a NBA required classes that the player must finish the classes before being pulled up.

Interesting proposal, not sure if the NBAPA would dig it though.

warfelg
06-01-2017, 09:54 AM
Interesting proposal, not sure if the NBAPA would dig it though.

Why not?

I think it makes both sides very happy. Teams get protected against busts a bit, older players are protected against younger cheaper options.

Hawkeye15
06-01-2017, 09:58 AM
this part I want to touch on:


While that could impact the quality of college basketball, it really does look like this is something the NBA has to do. Whether that becomes a reality here soon remains to be seen.

No, the quality sucks already. You either make it so a kid can come straight from high school, or they need to stay 2-3 years imo. Or just get rid of it all together. The quality of college basketball is horrible compared to before the one and done era, and there is fault for that all the way around, including the NBA.

My whole thing has always been, if a dude can go die in war at 18, he should be able to go make money in the NBA. I get that it will ruin a kids eligibility if they make that move, and it doesn't work out, but that is up to the kids family to be intelligent enough to help him make those decisions correctly. Not everyone is meant to be an NBA player, CEO, and make a lot of money, sorry. Guess what, your kid probably isn't going to make the NBA, if you are lucky enough for them to get an education paid for that you can't, embrace it. If you both **** it up, too bad.

FOXHOUND
06-01-2017, 10:05 AM
Why not?

I think it makes both sides very happy. Teams get protected against busts a bit, older players are protected against younger cheaper options.

They were trying to get rid of the one and done rule this last go around and fought against the NBA's idea of making it two and done. This can be seen as a happy compromise, but you're also keeping them stuck in the D-League.

FOXHOUND
06-01-2017, 10:10 AM
No, the quality sucks already. You either make it so a kid can come straight from high school, or they need to stay 2-3 years imo. Or just get rid of it all together. The quality of college basketball is horrible compared to before the one and done era, and there is fault for that all the way around, including the NBA.

My whole thing has always been, if a dude can go die in war at 18, he should be able to go make money in the NBA. I get that it will ruin a kids eligibility if they make that move, and it doesn't work out, but that is up to the kids family to be intelligent enough to help him make those decisions correctly. Not everyone is meant to be an NBA player, CEO, and make a lot of money, sorry. Guess what, your kid probably isn't going to make the NBA, if you are lucky enough for them to get an education paid for that you can't, embrace it. If you both **** it up, too bad.

Good points, especially the bold. The volume of one and done players has definitely been both a blessing and a curse for college basketball. On one hand it gives it much better talent to showcase, and make billions on, but on the other there is an insane turnover rate of that talent that destroys team continuity. This years draft is slated to have around 20 one and done players. It's raising every year, why delay the inevitable and waste scholarships on kids who don't want or need to be there?

da ThRONe
06-01-2017, 10:17 AM
Has anyone ever looked at the rate in which a high schooler bust? I did and it was at a slightly lower rate than 4 year college players. That was never the concern with the one and done rule. The league wanted kids in school so the NCAA could create exposure and develop a market for the athletes. The idea that going to college to be a professional athlete is better than actually going to a professional team is illogical and has no factual merit.

da ThRONe
06-01-2017, 10:21 AM
If the league is so concerned with young men getting an education set aside full rides for kids that come in out of high school that get drafted and bust. It's rare to find a athlete that's on the NBA radar in high school that goes to college and takes it serious.

FOXHOUND
06-01-2017, 10:56 AM
Has anyone ever looked at the rate in which a high schooler bust? I did and it was at a slightly lower rate than 4 year college players. That was never the concern with the one and done rule. The league wanted kids in school so the NCAA could create exposure and develop a market for the athletes. The idea that going to college to be a professional athlete is better than actually going to a professional team is illogical and has no factual merit.

Nice. Teams would definitely prefer to have that extra year to directly develop their prospect. Especially in an environment where they can do it full time, with the NBA weight training program and while getting actual NBA experience.

Scoots
06-01-2017, 11:01 AM
The g-league is only 3 teams from all of the NBA teams having an affiliate and it's the NBA's goal to get there. The GL will be transformed when teams are allowed to protect more than 15 players protected on contracts. Keep the active list down at 13 but allow NBA teams to have 20 players under contract. Maybe allow the bottom 5 contracts to not count against the cap to encourage teams to use the GL to develop players.

Shawn2timer
06-01-2017, 11:07 AM
What will this do to college basketball though? Where are the NCAA fans, what do you guys think. I'd rather not see that form suffer either though.

I will say this. It might force the NCAA to actually compete for talent. Right not the pay athletes debate is just that, a debate. Oh you want to us to pay these dumb kids? That's cute. No thank you. They have this privilege because no real alternative exists, and you're only competing against other non paying schools. Even when kids go international we discount them by saying maybe he couldn't get into a top program. And the one year rule all but cements this monopoly. All of a sudden if a legit alternative exists, the NCAA might no longer have the privilege of a debate

Scoots
06-01-2017, 11:17 AM
Has anyone ever looked at the rate in which a high schooler bust? I did and it was at a slightly lower rate than 4 year college players. That was never the concern with the one and done rule. The league wanted kids in school so the NCAA could create exposure and develop a market for the athletes. The idea that going to college to be a professional athlete is better than actually going to a professional team is illogical and has no factual merit.

It's incredibly hard to gather that data meaningfully though. Were the 4 year players compared taken at approximately the same pick as the high school player they are compared with? Did medical busts get removed from the stat gathering?

Oakmont_4
06-01-2017, 11:24 AM
At the end of the day, as much as the sports fan in me wants what's best for the league, this is a decision about the lives of young men. My priority there is giving them the opportunities they deserve. They should be free to get paid for their talents.

I'm 100% pro more school. Yes ultimately it's the individuals choice but at the same time, the league is perpetuating bad decisions by allowing them to come straight into the league. Some athletes end up being great in the NBA but more often than not these kids need an education to fall back on. One injury and their entire career can go away, then what do you do the rest of your life when you put all your chips into the NBA basket. I'd much rather the league get these kids a better education and more development before bringing them into the NBA.

In the end, just as many players are going to get paid and improve their lives. It's not like not allowing players to go right from HS to the NBA reduces the number of rookies. In the end it's the same number. I believe there is a lot to be said for someone who puts effort into their basketball skills as well as their education. Instead of just getting paid for natural gifts...I'd rather see that money go to players who put in just as much effort physically but more effort mentally.

Hawkeye15
06-01-2017, 11:26 AM
Good points, especially the bold. The volume of one and done players has definitely been both a blessing and a curse for college basketball. On one hand it gives it much better talent to showcase, and make billions on, but on the other there is an insane turnover rate of that talent that destroys team continuity. This years draft is slated to have around 20 one and done players. It's raising every year, why delay the inevitable and waste scholarships on kids who don't want or need to be there?

exactly man. Let Karl Anthony Towns go right to the NBA, and allow some kid who will never make the NBA, but can't afford to go to college, access to that scholarship. I get that college bball wants the best players it can get, but the quality is already terrible.

Hawkeye15
06-01-2017, 11:27 AM
If the league is so concerned with young men getting an education set aside full rides for kids that come in out of high school that get drafted and bust. It's rare to find a athlete that's on the NBA radar in high school that goes to college and takes it serious.

The NBA isn't concerned with anyones education, I can guarantee you that.

effen5
06-01-2017, 11:28 AM
No more one and done.

This should improve the fundamentals in the NBA tremendously.

da ThRONe
06-01-2017, 11:37 AM
It's incredibly hard to gather that data meaningfully though. Were the 4 year players compared taken at approximately the same pick as the high school player they are compared with? Did medical busts get removed from the stat gathering?

Agreed which farthers my point that the rule isn't based on anything substantial. There's no proof that going to college is a better step to professional success in sports. Logic says that if I can have all my time and a great amount of resource I'll be a better pro. College divides athletes time and limits their resources why would I believe it makes them better pros?

Scoots
06-01-2017, 11:40 AM
What will this do to college basketball though? Where are the NCAA fans, what do you guys think. I'd rather not see that form suffer either though.

I will say this. It might force the NCAA to actually compete for talent. Right not the pay athletes debate is just that, a debate. Oh you want to us to pay these dumb kids? That's cute. No thank you. They have this privilege because no real alternative exists, and you're only competing against other non paying schools. Even when kids go international we discount them by saying maybe he couldn't get into a top program. And the one year rule all but cements this monopoly. All of a sudden if a legit alternative exists, the NCAA might no longer have the privilege of a debate

High shoolers could go direct for years, then they were not allowed, then they were allowed, then not allowed again ... it never really seemed to make much of a difference to the NCAA game.

AllBall
06-01-2017, 11:47 AM
I have absolutely zero issue with this.

Player's with less than 4 years of college goes straight to the NBGL.

They will then get paid a NBGL salary (players in NBGL currently get paid).

They require you to stay there an X amount of years, before being called up to NBA.

Easy peezy lemon squeezy.

Scoots
06-01-2017, 12:15 PM
I have absolutely zero issue with this.

Player's with less than 4 years of college goes straight to the NBGL.

They will then get paid a NBGL salary (players in NBGL currently get paid).

They require you to stay there an X amount of years, before being called up to NBA.

Easy peezy lemon squeezy.

Except the NBA and NBA PA will hate it. The NBA wants the talent they want, they don't want to wait, and the PA well, that ones obvious. "LeBron, we tanked all year to get you, now you have to play for the Canton Charge for 3 years for less money than you were making in high school" Yeah right.

ccugrad1
06-01-2017, 12:32 PM
http://sportsnaut.com/2017/05/adam-silver-nba-rethinking-one-done-rule/

So, Adam Silver talked about how the NBA is actually now thinking about getting rid of the one and done rule. At first I was like nah, the one and done rule has done a great job of trimming the fat of draft picks like Eddy Curry and getting young kids some college coaching. As I thought about it more though, and Silver talks about it here, is that one and done has become so common and basically a sham that I don't think that same effect is being felt like when it was first introduced.

The real key here is the D-League. Once the D-League becomes a legit, NBA team for D-League team minor league system, I think this actually could be a better outcome. The two-way contract is now already here and it's only a matter of time before each team has a designated D-League franchise they run.

It would become like Europe where the top talented young players go on to play professionally in a league of grown men as opposed to continuing to dominate their peers at the NCAA level. You still need to draft players to get to that point but I don't know how many players would jump at that opportunity when college stills offers the exposure to greatly raise your draft stock/rookie contract size and the education to fall back on if you aren't one of the lucky 450 to crack an NBA roster.

One drawback I could potentially see happening is prospects like Hamidou Diallo, who went back to school after failing to receive a high enough draft guarantee. Teams who pick in the 20's are your playoff teams, so you run the risk of them being able to secure better long term talent with less worry of the risk of them busting like top 10 picks have to deal with. It could actually lead to the talent equality gap widening, since these teams are already clearly better run to get to where they are to begin with. That could also start the trend to shift back to Eddy Curry like draft selections again.

What do you guys think? Would this be good or bad for the NBA? Also, **** the NCAA and the way they profit off of college athletes lol. Them losing out on whoring out the top young talent is a nice bonus.

The one and done is a monumental shame and has been for years. About the only sports related thing that is an even bigger one than this is the Rooney Rule in the NFL which truthfully does more a dis-service to minority candidates than it does help!

Let's be real, look at any NBA Mock Draft, especially the lottery, and count how many guys projected to be drafted in the lottery are "freshman." If they can all leave after one year, do the world a favor and do college basketball a favor and let these guys declare out of high school and be done with it! I doubt Lonzo Ball really cared about UCLA education in the few months he was on campus!

mrblisterdundee
06-01-2017, 12:38 PM
While I do think the one-and-done sham should go away, I think NBA players should be required to take continuing education in money management, public speaking and other courses to help turn these oversized babies into adults.

LongIslandIcedZ
06-01-2017, 12:39 PM
I like the baseball rule. If you want to come out after High School, go for it. They're adults and can make their own choices.

But if you go to college, you need to stay for 2 or 3 years. Haven't decided which I'd prefer.

AllBall
06-01-2017, 12:58 PM
Except the NBA and NBA PA will hate it. The NBA wants the talent they want, they don't want to wait, and the PA well, that ones obvious.

There will still be plenty of players who did complete college or already met the NBGL requirement. There will be less to pick from in the first few years when the system gets put into place until the "pipeline" gets full, then you'll have a non stop stream of developed talent every year.

MarkieMark48
06-01-2017, 12:59 PM
I'm most of the time in favor of athlete.... I'm for doing away with 1 and done rule. sounds good to me

AllBall
06-01-2017, 01:56 PM
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Creation of “two-way” contracts that will pay players who shuttle between their parent teams and Development League teams depending on where they’re playing. There will be additional roster spots on NBA teams as well to accommodate the two-way players. Players on those contracts will receive more money if they go to the D League, with the hope of keeping them from taking deals overseas.

http://www.nba.com/article/2016/12/14/nba-and-nbpa-reach-tentative-labor-deal


🤔
It's all starting to make sense. Something is definitely happening for a true farm system, the Heat seem to know something.

IndyRealist
06-01-2017, 04:16 PM
I'm 100% pro more school. Yes ultimately it's the individuals choice but at the same time, the league is perpetuating bad decisions by allowing them to come straight into the league. Some athletes end up being great in the NBA but more often than not these kids need an education to fall back on. One injury and their entire career can go away, then what do you do the rest of your life when you put all your chips into the NBA basket. I'd much rather the league get these kids a better education and more development before bringing them into the NBA.

In the end, just as many players are going to get paid and improve their lives. It's not like not allowing players to go right from HS to the NBA reduces the number of rookies. In the end it's the same number. I believe there is a lot to be said for someone who puts effort into their basketball skills as well as their education. Instead of just getting paid for natural gifts...I'd rather see that money go to players who put in just as much effort physically but more effort mentally.

This is about one and done scholarship kids. They don't go to classes, they're not there for an education. They are there to play basketball.

IndyRealist
06-01-2017, 04:20 PM
Is there evidence the NBAPA cares at all? If they cared what happened to rookies there wouldn't be rookie scale contracts and restricted free agency. The vast majority of voting members are past their rookie contracts. I doubt they're in a hurry to add more competition for their jobs. I suspect they're all for a farm system.

Jeffy25
06-01-2017, 04:34 PM
I just wish the D-league was better, similar to the way it works in the MLB. Where players are actually developed in that league, and don't just come off the bench in the NBA out of school.

It should be a rarity if a player jumps right to the NBA. That's LeBron, Garnett, Malone, etc.

Most players (i.e. kids out of high school who aren't a top 3-5 pick) should expect to start in the D-League, where they develop your skills over a period of time.

If you are a top kid, right out of high school, and a team is going to be playing you 20+ minutes off the bat, then good deal, no D-League.

But the D-League is supposed to be there to develop kids. Develop guys that go all the way through college, or even guys that jump straight to the pros, but need some time to develop and clean up.

Also, while in the D-league, they should be getting coaching on finance, responsibility, physical training and nutrition, etc.

While in the d-League, you should have a food plan, supplement plan, work out plan. You should have a players coach who isn't the team coach who works on the professional side of things (how to interview, how to handle yourself, how to handle your finances, what you do with posse's, etc).


Additionally, some guys should be developed into a specific role that can help the parent club. Maybe you are a good rim protector, and they can work on you in the pick and roll so you can be more helpful in two directions and not just a one sided player. Maybe you are a 3 and only player, they can help with your perimeter defense. Then, when there are injuries or players leave, you actually have players to call up.


I like the MLB system on this stuff.

You can be drafted right out of high school.

And if you are in the D-League, then the team has control over you for 3-4 years (MLB it's 4), and you collect service time while in the NBA. And then your team has control over you for up to 6 years.

You first 3 years you are under league minimum standards. Then the next 3 years you are under an arbitration scale. Then you are an unrestricted free agent, and there would be no salary cap.

This would allow small market teams a chance to actually develop players and keep a core for several years.

Imagine if Minnesota had paid Wiggins league minimum so far (1.5M combined for three years) plus his signing bonus for being 1.1, and then he would make 20% of his free agency value in his 4th year, 40% in his 5th year, and 60% in his 6th year. And they had control over him another 3 years. They'd have Towns another 4 years, etc.

If Wiggins would be worth $25M in free agency, then he would collect the following salaries

2014 signing bonus - $7M (or whatever)
2014/15 - $.5M
2015/16 - $.5M
2016/17 - $.5M
2017/18 - $5M
2018/19 - $10M
2019/20 - $15M

Total - $38.5M
And now he is free to go anywhere he likes (you could still allow a max in dollars so that his home team could extend him the most).


Meanwhile, Minneosta could stuff Dunn, Jones, and Muhammad down in the minors for a year or two playing 30 minutes per night developing their game and getting challenged by other young rookies similar to them. In a year or two, call them up when Wiggins/LaVine etc would potentially leave.

Jeffy25
06-01-2017, 04:36 PM
^ Basically, a strong D-League is going to discourage a high school kid or a kid with a year or two in college from jumping to the NBA, because they will just be sitting in the minors for a few years. They should be working to improve their game and getting a degree if they aren't a lottery pick. Meanwhile, the lottery picks, the special talents can still go right into the NBA.

Scoots
06-01-2017, 06:46 PM
There will still be plenty of players who did complete college or already met the NBGL requirement. There will be less to pick from in the first few years when the system gets put into place until the "pipeline" gets full, then you'll have a non stop stream of developed talent every year.

I understand that, but I'm saying NBA teams will reject "owning" talent that they can't use.

Scoots
06-01-2017, 06:47 PM
🤔
It's all starting to make sense. Something is definitely happening for a true farm system, the Heat seem to know something.

Yes, they know that 26 other teams already have controlling interest in their G-league teams.

Scoots
06-01-2017, 06:52 PM
Is there evidence the NBAPA cares at all? If they cared what happened to rookies there wouldn't be rookie scale contracts and restricted free agency. The vast majority of voting members are past their rookie contracts. I doubt they're in a hurry to add more competition for their jobs. I suspect they're all for a farm system.

"vast majority"? Do you really think 80%+ of NBA players are on their 2nd+ contracts? That would mean the average NBA team only has 3 players on a rookie contract. The Warriors, as top heavy as they are, hit that number exactly. The Cavs have 2.

As to your actual point? No, the PA doesn't actually care about their future members getting educations.

b-ballistic
06-01-2017, 07:04 PM
I think they should stay two years in college. They have too much impact on our youth and they spend too much time in the public eye to be dipshits.

IndyRealist
06-01-2017, 07:50 PM
"vast majority"? Do you really think 80%+ of NBA players are on their 2nd+ contracts? That would mean the average NBA team only has 3 players on a rookie contract. The Warriors, as top heavy as they are, hit that number exactly. The Cavs have 2.

As to your actual point? No, the PA doesn't actually care about their future members getting educations.

There are never more than 120 first round picks on their rookie contracts at any one time, out of 450 jobs. 73% is a vast majority. Even if you count 2nd rounders, most wash out in a year or two so you're not raising that number substantially. And that doesn't include draft picks that never come over from international leagues.

AllBall
06-01-2017, 07:57 PM
What will this do to college basketball though? Where are the NCAA fans, what do you guys think. I'd rather not see that form suffer either though.

I will say this. It might force the NCAA to actually compete for talent. Right not the pay athletes debate is just that, a debate. Oh you want to us to pay these dumb kids? That's cute. No thank you. They have this privilege because no real alternative exists, and you're only competing against other non paying schools. Even when kids go international we discount them by saying maybe he couldn't get into a top program. And the one year rule all but cements this monopoly. All of a sudden if a legit alternative exists, the NCAA might no longer have the privilege of a debate

This is the key I think people don't see. If the NBA puts in a true farm system where not only pay these kids but offer them a tuition reimbursement the NCAA will be forced to pay their players so that they don't all start jumping ship.

SiteWolf
06-01-2017, 08:10 PM
At the end of the season, the Suns' starting lineup was younger than many March Madness teams....and we're talking about getting younger?

Football players have to be 3 yrs removed from HS to be draft eligible. What really is the argument for the NBA not to do the same?

flea
06-01-2017, 08:41 PM
The NBA obviously benefits greatly from the current rule but I don't think it matters that much for the majority of college basketball teams. College basketball is way better in terms of competition than the NBA to me most of the time - only for brief periods has NBA lifted itself out of the tabloid and legacy-obsessed joke of a league into a truly competitive sports league. I don't think the one-and-done rule has anything to do with that because the "one-and-done" teams don't typically win even if they do sometimes make noise in the tournament

The only two one-and-done "teams" that have won were Duke with Okafor/Winslow/Jones and Kentucky with Teague/Kidd-Gilchrist/Davis. Both teams had upper-classmen they relied pretty heavily on for various things, but I suppose that is like 2 championship teams of primarily one-and-dones in some 11 or 12 years they've had the rule. Nothing to sneeze at but it's not like those kids are dominating the college game. More often than not, they're getting beaten by better teams and better basketball players even if the kids that beat them don't have a bright future in the star-craving NBA.

Now the one thing I do think that is about for college ball about the rule is that the prospects dominate all the headlines, rather than the actual good teams. That kind of sucks for the NCAA in terms of getting eyes but for people like me who watch for the game rather than for the stars it doesn't matter.

I do think the college football rule should apply - make them play in the program 3 years if they go to college. Otherwise, let them get drafted. I think it would be good for competition in the NBA since there would be less incentive to tank (it's hard to predict what a HS player is until you see him against good competition, see: Skal Labissierre) and therefore you could get a precocious wing at #10 or #15 in the draft, develop him, and he ends up being the best in his class. The only thing it hurts is NBA teams who want to draft sure-things and eschew development in the neverending tank-a-thon to find a top 5 player.

KB24PG16
06-01-2017, 08:44 PM
rather see the ncaa excel than the d league. need to pay college athletes

Raps18-19 Champ
06-01-2017, 08:50 PM
Get rid of it.

If those young kids from the ghetto screw with their future and reduce their chance of success in the NBA, I say let them.

LA_Raiders
06-01-2017, 11:46 PM
Lol, NBA is turning into a joke, first by not allowing to play D anymore, second by allowing 3 super starts team up to win, and now this? The bets that a person can have is education, instead of the one and done rule they should consider the graduate first rule.

metswon69
06-02-2017, 03:14 AM
Lol, NBA is turning into a joke, first by not allowing to play D anymore, second by allowing 3 super starts team up to win, and now this? The bets that a person can have is education, instead of the one and done rule they should consider the graduate first rule.

Not if they are in line to make millions of dollars they shouldn't. College is a vehicle to find a career. Well many of these uber talented high school kids have a chance at a career if the NBA reverses this rule and should be afforded the opportunity to do so.

These one and dones are just taking scholarships away from kids that may actually need the sport to afford them the opportunity at a university.

College isn't going anywhere. If these high school kids who dont make it want to go back they can but there are only so many bites at the apple in terms of pursuing a professional basketball career.

rhino17
06-02-2017, 06:26 AM
there is absolutely no evidence that the high school bust rate is any higher than the college bust rate. They absolutely should do this

bklynny67
06-02-2017, 08:30 AM
i dont like it at all.... The NBA is mostly black and a ton of the athletes are from **** areas.... Fresh out of highschool they will be in the lime light making a ton and that just promises monumental **** ups both financially and publicly... I am pro more years of school.. Most of these athletes dont work out and make the big bucks... why not have a degree to fall back on... a ton of athletes go broke when their career is done and if these kids come fresh out of highschool it will only get worse... Seems like the NBA is looking out for themselves more than these kids.
If these kids choose not to get an education and fail in the NBA and have nothing to fall back on, that's tough **** for them. They should have gotten an education, or just go back to school and get one. That's not the leagues problem. They might be called kids but they are now considered adults and can make their own decisions.

Scoots
06-02-2017, 08:43 AM
Not if they are in line to make millions of dollars they shouldn't. College is a vehicle to find a career. Well many of these uber talented high school kids have a chance at a career if the NBA reverses this rule and should be afforded the opportunity to do so.

These one and dones are just taking scholarships away from kids that may actually need the sport to afford them the opportunity at a university.

College isn't going anywhere. If these high school kids who dont make it want to go back they can but there are only so many bites at the apple in terms of pursuing a professional basketball career.

You realize that a player leaving college after 1 year is actually freeing up 3 years of scholarships, so there are more opportunities for more people BECAUSE of one and done players leaving after 1 year rather than staying for 4.

AllBall
06-02-2017, 09:56 AM
If these kids choose not to get an education and fail in the NBA and have nothing to fall back on, that's tough **** for them. They should have gotten an education, or just go back to school and get one. That's not the leagues problem. They might be called kids but they are now considered adults and can make their own decisions.

Right because if it doesn't work out in the NBA, and you're in your early twenties it's too late to go to college???????????????????:confused::confused:

Rivera
06-02-2017, 09:59 AM
I wish the NBA would adopt the MLB rule and tweak it a bit

either fresh outta HS or go to college for a minimum of 2 years.

The D League isnt a full minor league system yet I dont believe, that will help the draft big time if the NBA teams can send the rooks to the d league without fear of getting poached and call them up when its time again similar to baseball

IndyRealist
06-02-2017, 12:43 PM
You realize that a player leaving college after 1 year is actually freeing up 3 years of scholarships, so there are more opportunities for more people BECAUSE of one and done players leaving after 1 year rather than staying for 4.

You're assuming though that the one and dones would stay for 4 years. Without the 1yr requirement many of those kids would go straight to the NBA, freeing up 4 years of scholarships instead of 3. How many of those scholarships now just go to another one and done player, instead of someone who needs the scholarship to get a 4yr degree?

warfelg
06-02-2017, 12:47 PM
You're assuming though that the one and dones would stay for 4 years. Without the 1yr requirement many of those kids would go straight to the NBA, freeing up 4 years of scholarships instead of 3. How many of those scholarships now just go to another one and done player, instead of someone who needs the scholarship to get a 4yr degree?

That's also assuming very few one and done's would go to school.

Remember before the rule it wasn't all that common to happen, and when it did the player was really special.

ugottabjoshinme
06-02-2017, 12:50 PM
I'd let HS kids declare, but if you got to college you have to stay for 2 years.

Forcing kids to play in the D/G League isn't going to work. I'm sure many would rather go play international ball for a year or two instead.

FOXHOUND
06-02-2017, 01:18 PM
That's also assuming very few one and done's would go to school.

Remember before the rule it wasn't all that common to happen, and when it did the player was really special.

I mean, people like JR Smith made the jump from HS lol. If you look at that 2004 recruiting class, http://www.basketball-reference.com/awards/recruit_rankings_2004.html

You have your JR Smith's, who made the jump and was drafted 18th overall despite being the 23rd ranked prospect. You also have your Al Horford's, who was tied for 47th but became the 3rd overall pick after 3 years of college. I mean just looking at this one year as a sample, the top 4 made the jump and 6 of the top 8. 5 of those 6 had a 10-year NBA career and the other played 4 years as the 12th overall pick, which is still a **** ton of money with plenty of time to go to college and get an education with it.

But really, if you look at the years around that time, 2004 was the biggest HS to NBA jumping year. If you look at the HS kids over any of those years, they mostly all carved out an NBA career. Maybe plenty of them didn't become stars or anything but anyone who can play 4-10 years in the league is pretty successful overall.

I think this would only affect like 4-8 players a year with the occasional big year on strong recruiting classes.

da ThRONe
06-02-2017, 04:19 PM
I think they should stay two years in college. They have too much impact on our youth and they spend too much time in the public eye to be dipshits.

Who really thinks 2 years of college turns dip****s into non-dip****s? These kids are still treated like rock stars on the campus. That's not going to deflate their egos.

MiamiBoy77
06-02-2017, 05:09 PM
Have not read through 5 pages, but I wanted to throw in my 2 cents. Sorry if this has already been said but I personally love the idea of taking away 1 and dones but instead giving players these options:

A. Go to NBA straight from High School

B. Go to College for at least 2 years (or until AA is acheived)

Furthermore, any player that goes straight to the NBA from HS should be required to get their AA at a local college (even if online) within their first 3 seasons out of HS.

BKLYNpigeon
06-02-2017, 05:45 PM
Lets the kids play. it only applies to 10-15 players every year.

Jeffy25
06-02-2017, 10:46 PM
I'm still the fan of the better D League, no college requirement, no salary cap, and longer team control over drafted players as the trade off


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Jeffy25
06-02-2017, 10:48 PM
^along with improved revenue sharing and luxury tax


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Scoots
06-04-2017, 10:48 AM
I'm still the fan of the better D League, no college requirement, no salary cap, and longer team control over drafted players as the trade off

The issue here is what is in it for the players union?

Need to increase NBA roster sizes and dramatically increase g-league pay to facilitate the G-league growth.

How about ... players who play at least half of the g-league season don't apply to the cap?

AllBall
06-04-2017, 06:27 PM
I'd let HS kids declare, but if you got to college you have to stay for 2 years.

Forcing kids to play in the D/G League isn't going to work. I'm sure many would rather go play international ball for a year or two instead.

So you want to force someone in college to stay an additional year UNPAID while the NCAA and the College taking advantage of them?

Please. Just let them go and get paid in the G-League.