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View Full Version : Is Lonzo ball worth the headcase that is his father?



More-Than-Most
05-19-2017, 01:30 AM
http://nypost.com/2017/05/17/lavar-ball-attacks-fox-sports-reporter-in-sexist-rant/

He is getting destroyed right now and rightfully so... That being said no doubt his son is talented but as soon as another player takes the spotlight from his son whether its Isiah Thomas/Ben Simmons/Embiid/Saric/Ingram/Russ his father will say something and cause some kind of annoying rift in said team... Now there is no doubt his son is worth the risk if you are picks 4-10 but if you are a top 3 pick and have the chance at JJ and Fultz is he really the route worth taking for a franchise?

More-Than-Most
05-19-2017, 01:33 AM
I never had him as a top 2 pick... He is insanely talented but I am with Aust when I would take Ingram/Simmons from last years draft over him but to each their own... I think the dude is talented no doubt but in this draft JJ/Fultz are easily top 2 and have always been to me with guys like Isaac/Monk/Ball the next tier down

FlashBolt
05-19-2017, 01:44 AM
He has too much potential to not draft. His dad is a total joke but his son has the skills. 6'6, can shoot, mature, has a great sense of how the game is and should be played. But I can't imagine how difficult it would be having to deal with his dad. The greatest fear is uncertainty. One day he comes out saying he loves the Lakers, the next he'll be saying he can beat Magic one-on-one or that he's a better coach than Luke Walton. I'll still take him, though. Fultz is a bit overrated. You can find ten of him before you find a player like Ball. I don't really like Fox, either. Inability to shoot is always a concern for guards.

More-Than-Most
05-19-2017, 01:52 AM
He has too much potential to not draft. His dad is a total joke but his son has the skills. 6'6, can shoot, mature, has a great sense of how the game is and should be played. But I can't imagine how difficult it would be having to deal with his dad. The greatest fear is uncertainty. One day he comes out saying he loves the Lakers, the next he'll be saying he can beat Magic one-on-one or that he's a better coach than Luke Walton. I'll still take him, though. Fultz is a bit overrated. You can find ten of him before you find a player like Ball. I don't really like Fox, either. Inability to shoot is always a concern for guards.

how long though before what I mentioned happens? Lets say Ingram/Russ/Simmons/Embiid are taking to many shots and his son is struggling or not getting the lime light... his dad will go out there saying exactly what he said when ucla lost and that **** will cause a team rift.

Now its not his fault of course but do you think ingram/simmons/embiid/russ etc give a **** when all they hear is they are taking away from this kids potential? Its going to end badly for any team that drafts him unless this kid explodes/becomes the focal point of the team and the team has amazing success.

GoferKing_
05-19-2017, 03:11 AM
Depends, he is perfect for the Lakers, NYK maybe Miami. Rest of the teams should stay away.

HandsOnTheWheel
05-19-2017, 03:26 AM
He's a reach at 2. This draft is way overrated as has been the past 3 or 4 drafts seemingly. I have serious questions regarding whether Fultz can translate his game to the next level or not.

Back on topic though, Ball may end up being better than a lot of people think if he can get past the pressure of playing in a big market/his dad hyping him up immensely. He can probably come in and make an instant impact as he is among the more nba ready prospects in this draft IMO. Definitely has a more polished game than Ingram did going into the draft.

Saddletramp
05-19-2017, 03:32 AM
Your daddy can talk all he wants to college coaches and other 19 year olds but what do you think some of these grown men are going to do when your daddy starts screwing with their livelihood? If he gets drafted by the Lakers I hope Kobe puts that old twatbag in his place. Whoever gets him, I hope they explain (very slowly it would seem) that this is professional sports now.

"We drafted your son, not you. Get the **** out of here. Now."

FlashBolt
05-19-2017, 03:41 AM
how long though before what I mentioned happens? Lets say Ingram/Russ/Simmons/Embiid are taking to many shots and his son is struggling or not getting the lime light... his dad will go out there saying exactly what he said when ucla lost and that **** will cause a team rift.

Now its not his fault of course but do you think ingram/simmons/embiid/russ etc give a **** when all they hear is they are taking away from this kids potential? Its going to end badly for any team that drafts him unless this kid explodes/becomes the focal point of the team and the team has amazing success.

The potential is always there and I'll assume his dad isn't stupid enough to confront Magic as he knows full well the Lakers can simply trade his son. He wants his son in the Lakers because he likes to control HIS son. But at the end of the day, he's the best player in this draft IMO. If I wanted to be a player, I would choose his skillset. The other guys are just high USG% ME LIKE TO SCORE players. Good for the show but bad for winning. Anyone can score these days. Takes a true player to dictate the pace and flow of the game and that is something Lonzo probably can do. And with Magic there, I don't see how he won't develop.

More-Than-Most
05-19-2017, 04:05 AM
The potential is always there and I'll assume his dad isn't stupid enough to confront Magic as he knows full well the Lakers can simply trade his son. He wants his son in the Lakers because he likes to control HIS son. But at the end of the day, he's the best player in this draft IMO. If I wanted to be a player, I would choose his skillset. The other guys are just high USG% ME LIKE TO SCORE players. Good for the show but bad for winning. Anyone can score these days. Takes a true player to dictate the pace and flow of the game and that is something Lonzo probably can do. And with Magic there, I don't see how he won't develop.

I think JJ is the best player in this draft...

Like I said I would have it

JJ/Fultz
Lonzo/Monk/Fox/Isaac



Tatum


I dont think there is a big difference in 1-6 or so... after Id say Isaac/fOX/mONK/Ball/Lonzo
JJ/Fultz I think it drops off drastically.

jaydubb
05-19-2017, 04:14 AM
I think JJ is the best player in this draft...

Like I said I would have it

JJ/Fultz
Lonzo/Monk/Fox/Isaac



Tatum


I dont think there is a big difference in 1-6 or so... after Id say Isaac/fOX/mONK/Ball/Lonzo
JJ/Fultz I think it drops off drastically.
Well you're in luck because the way the draft is currently slotted, I have Boston taking fultz, lakers taking ball, and 76ers taking JJ. I really think that's the way the top 3 picks will play out. I keep going back and forth between fultz and JJ, but I love JJ as a prospect for sure and I really think he's going to Philadelphia

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More-Than-Most
05-19-2017, 04:33 AM
Well you're in luck because the way the draft is currently slotted, I have Boston taking fultz, lakers taking ball, and 76ers taking JJ. I really think that's the way the top 3 picks will play out. I keep going back and forth between fultz and JJ, but I love JJ as a prospect for sure and I really think he's going to Philadelphia

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I dont think the sixers take JJ and rightfully so... I want him but I doubt they take someone who really doesnt fit with their team in todays NBA... They will likely trade down and take monk/Isaac/fox which is the much smarter play....

I actually think the lakers/celtics shock the world and one takes JJ... If that happens I think the sixers luck into fultz and dont trade back... I thought Fultz/JJ were the 2 best for months now with monk/fox/isaac/Ball being next in line... I just dont think the sixers take another player who has shooting issues and instead draft a player of need which is smart... Its also why i preferred the lakers pick next year... to much young talent is a bad thing because it takes away minutes... having 2 top picks is bad for the sixers because we need to see saric/simmons/embiid/tlc this year with whomever we draft as well.. there is no room for 2 top picks this year thus drafting for need next year after seeing how every fits is much much better,


If it does go fults/ball... I think suns or whomever trades up get a steal in JJ whom i think is best in this draft with fultz

Scoots
05-19-2017, 11:15 AM
The funniest thing I heard was the Celtics take Ball, call the Lakers and ask for #2 and other assets.

Ball might be very good, he could struggle ... either way I would shy away from his father, but I'm betting Magic figures he can get LaVar under control.

Fox supposedly in play for a top 3 pick ... maybe Sixers?

GREATNESS ONE
05-19-2017, 11:19 AM
^ dumb we'll just take Fultz.


We're going to come back to this thread in 1year. I'll enjoy re-reading the absolute hate for Lonzo. Not because of his game but because his dad..

mrblisterdundee
05-19-2017, 12:20 PM
The Ringer had some back-and-forth about this. People in the know say executives aren't that concerned with LaVar having any real influence on a professional basketball team, although his antics could affect a team if he's criticizing teammates.
Would you rather have Ball with a head case father, or Cousins, who's a head case himself?

jaydubb
05-19-2017, 12:38 PM
^ dumb we'll just take Fultz.


We're going to come back to this thread in 1year. I'll enjoy re-reading the absolute hate for Lonzo. Not because of his game but because his dad..

Yep. Lakers will likely select ball, but I really don't think the lakers are absolutely in love with ball as much as some think that they are.. If Celtics threaten to take ball, then the lakers will just take fultz and not think twice.. Both have talent. It's not like ball is that "can't miss prospect". Besides KAT and maybe Simmons there really hasn't been a "can't miss prospect" in years and there really isn't one this year..

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jaydubb
05-19-2017, 12:41 PM
Also I think the lavar Ball thing is way overblown.. I think he's annoying AF but I don't have concerns that he will be a distraction for any team that drafts him.. If he gets in Lonzo balls head and lavar continues to call the shots, then maybe Lonzo isn't man enough to be in the NBA in the first place.. There needs to come a time where a boy becomes a man and makes his own decisions, I expect that to happen with Lonzo.

Lavar will always talk but ultimately it's Lonzo that's stepping on the court

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Yanks All Day
05-19-2017, 01:50 PM
Lonzo Ball is polished enough to be a very good NBA player for a long time. I don't necessarily think he'll be a big time scorer in the league, but he'll be a guy that can average 18 points and 11 assists for a long time. You don't teach passing and court vision. He's just got it. It's the opposite situation of most big time college players where they know they can score, but have to adjust to playing team ball with much better competition.

That said, I'm much, much higher on Josh Jackson and Jayson Tatum than I am Lonzo Ball of Markelle Fultz. I just hate the optics that Fultz couldn't lead a Washington team to a better record than 9-21 in a decent conference. I do, however, love that he doesn't turn the ball over much. Jackson and Tatum just seem like "do it all" guys who play the premiere position in basketball: Small Forward. Give me a SF that can dribble, defend, and shoot over a PG any day of the week in today's NBA.

To the topic: is he worth his father's headache? Yes. Then again, I don't think his father will be that impactful once he starts playing NBA ball. Lonzo stood out on a team full of college kids. Yes, the Lakers will be young, but experienced ownership and management won't deal with some rookie's dad talking big. He'll get stuck on the bench because they don't HAVE to play him. It's not ideal for the Lakers, but they hold all the cards here. It'll be on LaVar to shape up or he'll hurt his kid in the long run.

Mave1002
05-20-2017, 02:41 AM
Still can't believe we're in a position to choose between Ball and JJ. Best time to be a Laker fan.

If we didn't have Ingram, maybe I'll take Ball. But JJ.... You guys have to wonder about the defensive potential of a BI/JJ duo even if you had a D'Angelo Russell running the break. JJ is like the only missing piece for this Lakers team. Looking waaaay ahead.. I'd love to think that KP leaves NYK eventually only to become a Laker. That's a serious possibility. Insert him into a line-up of:

Zubac / Randle
------- / Nance Jr.
Ingram
Jackson / Clarkson
Russell

Then see what happens.

PurpleLynch
05-20-2017, 07:11 AM
I don't know actually. He's intriguing for sure as a potential, but if you take him you have to explain to his father that he has to shut his mouth and stop doing dumb ****, because that will damage his son's future in more than a way.

I'd still prefere Jackson for the Lakers, we need some defense, we are horrible, saving Ingram and Zubac.

KnicksorBust
05-20-2017, 08:20 AM
Lavar's antics seemed to have little impact on UCLA having an incredible season.

GREATNESS ONE
05-20-2017, 11:06 AM
This is the NBA we're grown men, professionals play. You really think Lavar is going to have any influence? Lol c'mon now.

Aust
05-21-2017, 05:04 PM
Yes, he is worth it. Sorry MTM, I've flipped my position.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TeqpRWbU9qs&feature=youtu.be&t=18m43s

He mentioned this on 3/30. I think the annoying thing will be that he'll still likely get media spotlight as he tries to promote the BBB thing.

BDawk4Prez
05-23-2017, 01:05 PM
Wouldn't touch him.

D Blue987
05-23-2017, 02:09 PM
He is perfect for the Lakers. They need an elite distributor and there is no one better at that in this draft than Ball. Number 1 in total assists among freshman in the last several decades. Also the best total efficiency player among freshman over the likes of guys like Gilbert Arenas, James Harden, Dwayne Wade, and Allen Iverson. Not hard to see with a .551 fg %. lol. Say what you will about his dad but he certainly has superstar potential in him.

Kyben36
05-23-2017, 03:11 PM
NO NOT AT ALL. Lavar is totally insane, and will fist fight people over dumb ****. im surprised lonzo can even handle it.

KB24PG16
05-23-2017, 03:42 PM
lavar ball may be a head case, but lonzo is quite different than him. I see a lot of people high on Josh Jackson who be a head case himself

Kyben36
05-23-2017, 04:47 PM
lavar ball may be a head case, but lonzo is quite different than him. I see a lot of people high on josh jackson who be a head case himself

nobody has complained that much about lonzo. Can you imagine him (LAVAR) though on la radio if the lakers are loosing (which honestly i quite likely to happen early if we are being honest), calling for coaches heads, saying he can coach better ,saying they are getting lonzo the ball enough, the guy is a media nightmare if i have ever seen one. And coming from a guy who hated the derrick rose camp, its bad.

Raps18-19 Champ
05-24-2017, 05:00 AM
As the Lakers, Lavar won't be as big of a headcase. And really, Lavar is fit for Lakers land anyway so Lakeres should draft Lonzo at the 2nd.

If I had the 1st, 3rd or 4th pick, I would look at other alternatives. But I would pick Lonzo if he's available at the 5th spot.

LA_Raiders
05-25-2017, 01:04 AM
No, I would trade the pick for a proven player not named PG; he can be obtained during FA. Butter for the #2 pick.

effen5
05-25-2017, 11:01 AM
I've seen family members (Derrick Rose's brother Reggie) interfere by taking shots at management which caused a conflict within the organization. Hard pass.

mightybosstone
05-25-2017, 11:16 AM
The answer to this question is pretty simple to me. It's "It depends on where my team is drafting, what my needs are and who is on the board." Boston definitely isn't taking him at No. 1. But LA seriously needs to consider all the factors when picking at No. 2, including the guy's idiot father.

If it were me, there are probably 3-4 other guys I'd take ahead of him based on talent and intangibles. But that's just me, and I'm not an NBA scout. He's certainly going top 10, and I'd be a little shocked if he fell out of the top 5. But I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't go to LA at No. 2 and if some teams go with other players, in part due to the baggage he brings with him. This is supposedly a very talented draft class at the top, and baggage matters when you're nitpicking between similarly talented guys.

More-Than-Most
05-25-2017, 03:27 PM
The answer to this question is pretty simple to me. It's "It depends on where my team is drafting, what my needs are and who is on the board." Boston definitely isn't taking him at No. 1. But LA seriously needs to consider all the factors when picking at No. 2, including the guy's idiot father.

If it were me, there are probably 3-4 other guys I'd take ahead of him based on talent and intangibles. But that's just me, and I'm not an NBA scout. He's certainly going top 10, and I'd be a little shocked if he fell out of the top 5. But I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't go to LA at No. 2 and if some teams go with other players, in part due to the baggage he brings with him. This is supposedly a very talented draft class at the top, and baggage matters when you're nitpicking between similarly talented guys.

this has been my take forever as well.. i think the cream of the crop is Fultz/Jackson... after that would be monk/fox/ball/issac.

TheDish87
05-25-2017, 03:50 PM
your order couldnt be more wrong

lakerfan85
05-25-2017, 03:52 PM
Jackson brings some baggage as well..

Bostonjorge
05-25-2017, 05:40 PM
Ball seems to have crossed over to a media Superstar(not a superstar player yet) and instantly is putting Lakers all over the headlines attached to Ball. Lakers draft Ball and Lakers will dominate the summer league news all the way up to training camp of course minus the free agent period. Ball guarantees more national TV time and Christmas primetime game.

Lavar and ESPN are making him the most much watch rookie going into next season. Simmons is a rookie to but anything less then what Embiid did will not be enough.

More-Than-Most
05-25-2017, 05:45 PM
your order couldnt be more wrong

wasnt in order... was tier based.

TheDish87
05-25-2017, 07:06 PM
its still wrong. Jackson isnt near Fultz and Tatum is the 2nd best player in this draft.

More-Than-Most
05-25-2017, 07:52 PM
its still wrong. Jackson isnt near Fultz and Tatum is the 2nd best player in this draft.

:laugh:

More-Than-Most
05-25-2017, 08:56 PM
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19464452/lonzo-ball-workout-philadelphia-76ers-possible

but yo... nobody wants to play for sixers per lakers fans.

GREATNESS ONE
05-25-2017, 09:11 PM
Check Lavar and Lonzo's recent interview with Chris Boussard. Lavar knows, NBA is a man's league, it's a profession. He's not going to be involved.

LOb0
05-25-2017, 10:14 PM
Check Lavar and Lonzo's recent interview with Chris Boussard. Lavar knows, NBA is a man's league, it's a profession. He's not going to be involved.


His shoe deal, which he already f*cked up was part of his profession.

D Blue987
05-25-2017, 11:19 PM
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19464452/lonzo-ball-workout-philadelphia-76ers-possible

but yo... nobody wants to play for sixers per lakers fans.

He doesn't lol. He just doesn't want to fall past number 3 if the Lakers pass on him. lol. The further down you go, the more money he will lose on his rookie deal. Sixers need a pg badly so it makes sense to work out for them if your primary concern is not losing hundreds of thousands of dollars.

GREATNESS ONE
05-26-2017, 12:22 AM
His shoe deal, which he already f*cked up was part of his profession.

You're smarter than that.

Tg11
05-27-2017, 12:52 PM
Lonzo Ball if anything I see him being a draft bust

GREATNESS ONE
05-27-2017, 01:04 PM
Lonzo Ball if anything I see him being a draft bust

Bet. I see him being an all star within 3-5 years.

Tg11
05-27-2017, 01:13 PM
Lonzo Ball may have potential but I don't see him translating his game into the NBA where he would have to constantly be great each and every night night after night playing against the league's best like LeBron, Curry, Wall, IT, Cousins, Davis, Melo, Paul, Kawhi, etc. I just don't see him doing it much less winning Rookie of the Year

GREATNESS ONE
05-27-2017, 01:38 PM
Lonzo Ball may have potential but I don't see him translating his game into the NBA where he would have to constantly be great each and every night night after night playing against the league's best like LeBron, Curry, Wall, IT, Cousins, Davis, Melo, Paul, Kawhi, etc. I just don't see him doing it much less winning Rookie of the Year

Lonzo, is a pass first point guard with high basketball IQ, great court vision, fantastic A/TO ratio, who shoots 50% from the field and over 40% from NBA 3pt.

Not only will he transition well in a running, fast paced league but the fact that's he's never played with star caliber players will help elevate his game as much as he will elevate his teammates.


Whichever team drafts Lonzo will see an immediate difference in their locker room, on the floor and the addiction of passing. Lonzo is the real deal, don't sleep on him.

Tg11
05-27-2017, 02:02 PM
Either way Lonzo Ball I don't see him doing much in his rookie year considering he is just coming into the league but depending on which team drafts him will he even be in the starting 5? If the Lakers draft him would they start Ball really start him over D'Angelo? I think not and not to mention if the Celtics if we draft him we would more than likely trade him to get a star but Lonzo Ball if he drops to like #3, #4 or #5 then either the 76ers, Suns or Kings then I could realistically see him starting

GREATNESS ONE
05-27-2017, 04:02 PM
D'Angelo Russell isn't a PG. he's more of a 2 than 1 and honestly I think he gets traded this off-season.

Federal Reserve
05-27-2017, 04:48 PM
Nothing like a driving point guard who can't shoot free throws be the franchise of your team. The last time a noteworthy free agent left his team to sign with the Lakers? 1996.

The Lakers are young with minimal young talent.

Sly Guy
05-27-2017, 09:33 PM
my take on lonzo is this:

-great frame for the nba, for a guy playing point, he's long, and that automatically makes him more desirable and less likely to be a bust. AKA you can't teach size.
-unselfish, and a good passer, again always nice
-reliable shot, but a weird, awkward form. Release point is too low. NBA is full of guys bigger than he's seen so far, a low release point on a guy who's still a small means he might have trouble getting his shot up.
-doesn't attack the rim well out of half court sets. For a guy playing point, you NEED this skill. It's incredibly important that your point guard can break a guy down off the bounce and set up teammates for easy looks

So all in all, I'm unsure of whether or not he'll be a bust. It very much depends on whether or not his jumper will translate over the the NBA level because he relies on it so heavily to generate his offense. He's going to need it while the rest of his more raw skills develop at this level. But the NBA is full of players who were drafted for their physical frame alone, and he's definitely got that. I can see why he's a highly touted prospect and I think he's got a better shot than most to be a solid player, but he isn't a 'can't miss' draft pick either.