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View Full Version : How much did teams screw up not Trading for Rubio this past summer or Deadline?



Hellcrooner
03-30-2017, 09:28 PM
Seriously.

He began the year playing " buy out and out of the league" ball, partially because family issues, Thibs misusing him ( rubio on the corner as a spot up shooter? wtf:rolleyes:) being partially injured, Ball too much time in Lavines hand.

But since january hes been beasting.

He is doing around 15 ppg, 10 ppg, 4 rpg 2 spg in that span shooting over .400

Playing good D as always and now actually even getting wins for their team.

He is being the second best player for the wolves since january over Wiggins.


Furhter more post deadline he is matching some of Kidds best seasons 17 ppg, 11 apg, 5 rpg, 2 spg on .450 shooting and even getting near to that famous 50, 40, 90 shooting mark.


Is said that the Bucks, Pistons, Knicks at least ( some others were mencioned) lowballed the wolves last few months.

How much did they screw up?

Particulary Knicks screw up is Massive.

Think about bulding on Rubio, Kp and Whg!!!!
And they didnt trade because they didnt want to do straight up expiring washed up Rose for Rubio, they wanted wolves to surrender a first :eyebrow:

Damm they should have actually sweetened the pot adding Koq to Rose.!!!!

Sly Guy
03-30-2017, 09:37 PM
the words of a wolves fan trying to sell high.

Rubio? Pass.

Hellcrooner
03-30-2017, 09:38 PM
the words of a wolves fan trying to sell high.

Rubio? Pass.

*lakers fan.

FlashBolt
03-30-2017, 09:46 PM
I'd take him over what we have right now but I don't think you can win with your PG not being able to shoot. Regardless of that shooting percentage of .400, it's seasonal. I don't think Rubio is a good shooter and he's certainly not shooting it at the rate to where I would say he can shoot. Guards just have to be able to shoot these days so they can play the pick-and-roll. Not to mention his increased production is basically due to Lavine being injured so it's not like he's just putting those numbers up because of some otherwordly newfound talent.

Sly Guy
03-30-2017, 09:48 PM
I don't begrudge them for trying, I mean we managed to pry assets away from NYC for the steaming pile of garbage Andrea Bargnani was. But still, we're talking a few good months, where his fg% still isn't something to brag about even if it's improved over that duration. Andrea had one of those stints for us too, but it doesn't mean he was all the sudden a great player.

He's also not new in the league, and his achilles' heel when he came into the league is still his achilles' heel. The lack of shooting. Shooting should be the easiest skill to learn, everyone likes shooting, and all it takes is repetition or at the worst a dedicated coach to spend time with him in an off season. The fact he's been around as long as he has and HASN'T shown any improvement in that area makes me doubt his commitment to better himself as a player. So, in essence, what you see is what you get, and what I see is a starter on a low-tier team. I was never high on Rondo for the same reason. I'm not expecting a PG to shoot the lights out, but I do expect some degree of proficiency in their jumpshot to offset the lack of size at the position.

Green_Monster
03-30-2017, 10:19 PM
the words of a wolves fan trying to sell high.

Rubio? Pass.

He's obsessed with anything that's Spanish.

GiantsSwaGG
03-30-2017, 11:00 PM
He's had a nice stretch, funny thing is, so has Derrick Rose so it pretty much doesn't mean ****. They'll come back down to earth!

Hellcrooner
03-30-2017, 11:03 PM
I don't begrudge them for trying, I mean we managed to pry assets away from NYC for the steaming pile of garbage Andrea Bargnani was. But still, we're talking a few good months, where his fg% still isn't something to brag about even if it's improved over that duration. Andrea had one of those stints for us too, but it doesn't mean he was all the sudden a great player.

He's also not new in the league, and his achilles' heel when he came into the league is still his achilles' heel. The lack of shooting. Shooting should be the easiest skill to learn, everyone likes shooting, and all it takes is repetition or at the worst a dedicated coach to spend time with him in an off season. The fact he's been around as long as he has and HASN'T shown any improvement in that area makes me doubt his commitment to better himself as a player. So, in essence, what you see is what you get, and what I see is a starter on a low-tier team. I was never high on Rondo for the same reason. I'm not expecting a PG to shoot the lights out, but I do expect some degree of proficiency in their jumpshot to offset the lack of size at the position.

you definetly have NOT been watching if you thingk so.

He is shooting WELL over .400 since january the ONLY reason his SEASON average is barely over .400 is taht he started really awful, shooting like .200 in 3p shots and .300 for 3 p shots early in teh season.

Hes is being shooting Steadily well for more tan 40 games now.

Oh and he is actually shooting well on a mUCH higher volumen of shots that he ever took before.

ewing
03-30-2017, 11:20 PM
wait, what?

IKnowHoops
03-30-2017, 11:23 PM
you definetly have NOT been watching if you thingk so.

He is shooting WELL over .400 since january the ONLY reason his SEASON average is barely over .400 is taht he started really awful, shooting like .200 in 3p shots and .300 for 3 p shots early in teh season.

Hes is being shooting Steadily well for more tan 40 games now.

Oh and he is actually shooting well on a mUCH higher volumen of shots that he ever took before.

All true, but to be fair. Now he has the balls to attempt wide open lay ups...lmao. Where as early in the season, guy would pass off two feet from the rim for some unknown reason. Rubio more than anything needed a change in offensive attitude. As long as he drives the lane when it's wide open, Rubio is a good floor general. When he is a non shooting passer, he's almost worthless...as anyone would be.

ewing
03-30-2017, 11:33 PM
he's a limbo PG IMO. Its such an important position at this point unless have a play maker like Bron you need an elite PG. Rubio is a average starting PG with out a jump shot which makes a backup or stop gag in the league right now

Scoots
03-30-2017, 11:51 PM
Rubio would be a fine backup PG on a good team. 25 minutes a night tops. And I like him a lot.

ewing
03-31-2017, 12:03 AM
Rubio would be a fine backup PG on a good team. 25 minutes a night tops. And I like him a lot.

I agree and i feel bad for limbo PGs now. Reggie Jackson is another one. He is good basketball player but PGs have such an advantage in today league if you are a PG that needs the ball a lot (not a George Hill/Billups type) you have to be elite.

dhopisthename
03-31-2017, 01:02 AM
we need more then one month before any team loses sleep at night at not trading for him.

IKnowHoops
03-31-2017, 02:13 AM
we need more then one month before any team loses sleep at night at not trading for him.

LOL right...

But he has been playing the best stretch of his entire career, and better than I think anyone thought was possible for him outside of Rubio guzzlers.

From what I have seen, he can be a top 8 PG if he ups his penetration aggression, about 35%, and if he shoots that little 10 footer every time he is open in the lane. His 10-12 foot jumper is actually money. He was like Dunn in a way. While Dunn plays afraid to make a mistake (Thibs effect I think), Rubio was afraid to miss a shot. He finally got disrespected enough that he started playing pissed. He didn't give an F. And he is way more effective. Like Dunn the skill is there, but the mind was totally gone. I still love Dunn and expect him to be a very good player. He's been improving...but the fact that his physicality is awesome, and its pretty much all in his head, I'm not worried at all that he will be a good player. GLOVE

KnicksorBust
03-31-2017, 07:32 AM
I would have taken Rubio on the Knicks just because I want someone who will just consistently feed Porzingis. At this point I want to see KP dropping 25-30ppg every night.

JLynn943
03-31-2017, 09:24 AM
I wanted the Kings to trade for for Rubio since at least last summer. Supposedly there were talks, but God knows what the Wolves asked for to make Vlade lose interest. That or Vivek must not like him. Idk. I'd still like to add him.

Bruno
03-31-2017, 05:11 PM
Under/over on Rubio having a Nash type career arch? Does he peak in the 29-32 age range? 29-32 is usually sustained prime not peak.

JasonJohnHorn
03-31-2017, 11:43 PM
shooting over .400



That is setting the bar pretty fawking low for a bold worthy stat ;-)

Short answer: No. Rubio is $#!T. There are elements of his game that are jaw dropping, but his utterly dismal shooting (over .400? Yes. But also under .420) makes him a huge liability and easy to defend.

Can you think of another point guard in the league who has that much talent around him (Towns, LaVine, Wiggins) but still has so few wins?

I can't.

JasonJohnHorn
04-01-2017, 12:16 AM
Under/over on Rubio having a Nash type career arch? Does he peak in the 29-32 age range? 29-32 is usually sustained prime not peak.

I realize you are comparing career arcs and not style of play... but still... any two players in the same position more opposite than those guys? Both greta passers, but one is an amazing shooter who was a joke on D, and the other is a stellar defender who is a joke with a wide-open shot in front of him.

I don't see Rubio peaking. I see him more having a career arc like Rondo. He simply is not improving his shooting game enough to be a PG on a legit contender unless they have some amazing pieces in place around him.

Hellcrooner
04-01-2017, 12:40 AM
That is setting the bar pretty fawking low for a bold worthy stat ;-)

Short answer: No. Rubio is $#!T. There are elements of his game that are jaw dropping, but his utterly dismal shooting (over .400? Yes. But also under .420) makes him a huge liability and easy to defend.

Can you think of another point guard in the league who has that much talent around him (Towns, LaVine, Wiggins) but still has so few wins?

I can't.



He is " under .420 because he started the year LIKE ****.


In the last month he is .470 with .400 on three pointers and over .900 at the Ft line.

Hellcrooner
04-01-2017, 12:53 AM
Under/over on Rubio having a Nash type career arch? Does he peak in the 29-32 age range? 29-32 is usually sustained prime not peak.

His mirror should not be nash but kidd.

Y expect him to get his peak form when he is 28 or 29 and given his game does not relay at all in athleticism or strenght he will probably keep his prime until he is 34 or 35.

I fully expect him to struggle early next season or seaosn and a halg because now he has picked up his shot when open teams are going to adjust and game plan for him and stop allowing him to shoot uncovered, so he is going to have to adjust to being able to shoot with defenders on him.

Of course if teams do that you can expect his apg numbers to go up.

I expect him to get a 13 ppg 12 apg season on .400 shooting next year.

and have a 16 ppg 12 apg on .450 shooting prime..............yep that jason kidds number more or less.

IndyRealist
04-01-2017, 08:18 AM
He is " under .420 because he started the year LIKE ****.


In the last month he is .470 with .400 on three pointers and over .900 at the Ft line.

Anyone can have one good month. It's a very small sample size. There is simply too much time that has to be devoted for a player to vastly improve his shooting in a sustained manner, for it to happen during the season.

tl;dr When he does it for an entire year, it's a change. Until then, it's a fluke.

Heediot
04-01-2017, 08:57 AM
Don't sleep on Rubio's shot. The dude has been working on it and has been gradually improving. I expect it to be even more consistent next year. It'll become respectable sooner then people think. If he can get it to the point where defenses have to defend it by the time the pups are ready for prime time action post April (in future years), they will be a team no one wants to face.

MILLERHIGHLIFE
04-01-2017, 11:59 AM
Bucks were linked to Rubio last couple years. Last season Wolves wanted Middleton for Rubio swap. So talks died. Then this trade deadline we were linked yet again. Wolves had interests in Snell. But not sure a Rubio/Snell swap. Not sure what else would of had to be tossed in. One rumor was Delly, Henson for Rubio. But that could of been fake news on twitter.

Sly Guy
04-01-2017, 01:25 PM
"b/c last month he shot well"
-Ref to my Andrea Bargnani point. Dude had maybe a 30 game stretch where he looked like a legit 20-25ppg scorer. We all know how that went.

"his 10-12' shot is money"
-unless you're 7' tall, you need more range than 10', especially out of your pg. I'm looking for closer to 40fg% from 3 out of my point guard, not 40% overall.

Rubio is an still remains the same guy he's always been, and based on the people in this thread who've said they're willing to trade for him, then I will hold firm on my claim that he's a lower-tier starting PG (no offense to those teams). Autopick drafted him for me in my fantasy pool this year and he single handedly ****ed my team up. Can't say I was surprised though. There was a time I was high on Rubio, basically when drafted based on his performance in the Olympics. But that was a long time ago, and the fact he's never learned how to shoot, I've lost confidence that he ever will.


So again, until he shows me an extended period of competent shooting (~1 season or more) I say, pass.

valade16
04-01-2017, 02:37 PM
Shouldn't the real question be "Did Minnesota screw up by not trading Rubio at the deadline"?

mrblisterdundee
04-01-2017, 04:28 PM
Minnesota didn't screw up. Rubio didn't have much value on the trade market, but seems to be hitting his stride with the new core. Any improvement in his value is tied to an improvement in shooting over multiple seasons.

tredigs
04-02-2017, 01:18 PM
Rubio coming back with vengeance to reinvigorate the Kyrie V Ricky debate!

IKnowHoops
04-02-2017, 02:31 PM
Under/over on Rubio having a Nash type career arch? Does he peak in the 29-32 age range? 29-32 is usually sustained prime not peak.

NONE!!!!!!

Well Arch hopefully 50/50.

Impact will never be anything remotely close to Nash. So much so that I didn't understand the question at first and jumped to conclusions with NONE!!!!!! LOL.

IKnowHoops
04-02-2017, 02:48 PM
That is setting the bar pretty fawking low for a bold worthy stat ;-)

Short answer: No. Rubio is $#!T. There are elements of his game that are jaw dropping, but his utterly dismal shooting (over .400? Yes. But also under .420) makes him a huge liability and easy to defend.

Can you think of another point guard in the league who has that much talent around him (Towns, LaVine, Wiggins) but still has so few wins?

I can't.

10000000000000% this.

And I like the OP. This is no slight to him at all.

But Rubio fans have a bad habit of cross referencing his best play with his worst play instead of cross referencing his best play with what the best players in the league are doing.

This leads them to believe Rubio is much more valuable than he actually is. I have given Rubio props for his recent play. He has in fact been playing the best basketball of his LIFE, so its been a pleasant surprise.

But have I moved him into my top 10? Heck no. Top 15? Nope. Goran Dragic has been much better than Rubio, but in this latest stretch Rubio I think has been playing at that impact level. If he can play like this for the rest of his life, then he would be around the 10-12 mark. If he improves, then I think he can get into the 8th spot. That is his ceiling to me in the best of best case scenarios.

IKnowHoops
04-02-2017, 02:56 PM
"b/c last month he shot well"
-Ref to my Andrea Bargnani point. Dude had maybe a 30 game stretch where he looked like a legit 20-25ppg scorer. We all know how that went.

"his 10-12' shot is money"
-unless you're 7' tall, you need more range than 10', especially out of your pg. I'm looking for closer to 40fg% from 3 out of my point guard, not 40% overall.

Rubio is an still remains the same guy he's always been, and based on the people in this thread who've said they're willing to trade for him, then I will hold firm on my claim that he's a lower-tier starting PG (no offense to those teams). Autopick drafted him for me in my fantasy pool this year and he single handedly ****ed my team up. Can't say I was surprised though. There was a time I was high on Rubio, basically when drafted based on his performance in the Olympics. But that was a long time ago, and the fact he's never learned how to shoot, I've lost confidence that he ever will.


So again, until he shows me an extended period of competent shooting (~1 season or more) I say, pass.

I'm trying to be positive...at really the only positives I have seen from Rubio since drafted.

But I want to let you know, I appreciate what you said, and I think you are 100% correct. I have basically felt the exact same way on every point you hit on.

IKnowHoops
04-02-2017, 02:57 PM
Rubio coming back with vengeance to reinvigorate the Kyrie V Ricky debate!

That must of been a thread I stayed out of due to the sheer ridiculousness of the notion.

I don't remember that debate.

tredigs
04-02-2017, 03:04 PM
That must of been a thread I stayed out of due to the sheer ridiculousness of the notion.

I don't remember that debate.

Stems from the fact that he's essentially better than Irving at every facet of basketball other than scoring. Rubio once again dominating him in RPM fwiw. Which granted is large and more than negates Rubio's huge playmaking advantage. But when you factor in defense it becomes a much more intriguing debate.

@the comment about "so much talent" with Lavine, Wiggins and Towns. One of those players is a winning piece, and even he has huge holes still. Wiggins and Lavine have essentially no positive impact on the floor due to their black-hole mentality and lack of D. That team has performed much better since Lavine has been sidelined and Rubio has been allowed to flourish in the 2nd half.

Raps18-19 Champ
04-02-2017, 03:15 PM
Don't the Wolves play much better when Rubio is on the court than off of it?

IKnowHoops
04-02-2017, 05:24 PM
Stems from the fact that he's essentially better than Irving at every facet of basketball other than scoring. Rubio once again dominating him in RPM fwiw. Which granted is large and more than negates Rubio's huge playmaking advantage. But when you factor in defense it becomes a much more intriguing debate.

@the comment about "so much talent" with Lavine, Wiggins and Towns. One of those players is a winning piece, and even he has huge holes still. Wiggins and Lavine have essentially no positive impact on the floor due to their black-hole mentality and lack of D. That team has performed much better since Lavine has been sidelined and Rubio has been allowed to flourish in the 2nd half.

For some reason this all reminds me of Dave Chappelle's, "when keeping it real goes wrong"

Either away, if Ricky is better than Kyrie, I guess it just makes Lebron winning with his sorry --- that much more impressive.

Regardless, at there worst Ricky is 10x worse. Kyrie wins games. He drops 50. Man is Ricky also better than Steph at every portion of the game accept scoring too?

Is there an argument for who is better?

Don't know if Rubio has ever cracked 15or 16 at PER.

Rubio aint better than either for the same reasons lets be real here.

MILLERHIGHLIFE
04-02-2017, 06:52 PM
I'd still take that rumored Delly/Henson for Rubio deal. Hopefully happens this summer. Not saying the rumored deal was legit with twitter and all. I believe Wolves didn't want Henson so that was the hold up. Also they had interests in Snell but a Snell/Delly for Rubio seems a overpay.