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Jets012
03-02-2017, 01:12 AM
Holy cow is this guy good. Talk about a compete game. If he played in NY, the hype on this guy would be unreal. Good finisher around the rim. Good shooter for his position/size. Good defender. One of the best passing bigs in the league. Advanced stats are crazy good. This guys game is suiting up to be elite. Is it too crazy to start calling this guy one of the 3 to 5 best bigs in the league? I know plays that play in small markets and aren't as flashy typically get hated on by this site, but this guy is ridiculous at the moment.

Call me crazy which people will but I'd take this guy's current trajectory over AD. I just think there's less flaws in his game at the moment.

LOb0
03-02-2017, 01:56 AM
Love his passing, he's gonna be really good. I was with you till "over Anthony Davis". That's going too far.

CodeRed
03-02-2017, 02:44 AM
I wouldn't say he's a good defender yet, but he will get there. He's an average defender at the moment who gets exposed when facing someone with quick feet and athleticism. He's a really smart player though and already has great positioning on the defensive end i have no doubt he will be a good defender soon. Offensively he seriously has no ceiling. I have no problem saying he's the best passing big man in the league. He can shoot, drive, and do work in the post. He's also a very good rebounder despite his lack of athleticism. As far as the young bigs around the league i'd put him right behind AD and KAT. He should be in better shape and a little stronger by the time next season comes. He should easily average 20/10/5 next year while shooting a high percentage.

zn23
03-02-2017, 03:01 AM
I've been riding the hype train since December and I don't plan on getting off of it any time soon.

Scoots
03-02-2017, 10:32 AM
I wouldn't say he's a good defender yet, but he will get there. He's an average defender at the moment who gets exposed when facing someone with quick feet and athleticism. He's a really smart player though and already has great positioning on the defensive end i have no doubt he will be a good defender soon. Offensively he seriously has no ceiling. I have no problem saying he's the best passing big man in the league. He can shoot, drive, and do work in the post. He's also a very good rebounder despite his lack of athleticism. As far as the young bigs around the league i'd put him right behind AD and KAT. He should be in better shape and a little stronger by the time next season comes. He should easily average 20/10/5 next year while shooting a high percentage.

Well it's a good thing he won't face anybody with quick feet in the NBA then!

Seriously I love his offensive game and his BBIQ is excellent ... but his D has a LONG way to go to be good.

Hawkeye15
03-02-2017, 10:49 AM
He is a poor defender right now, and will never be great on that end, but his IQ should at least get him to "good" as a team defender. His offensive ability is off the charts. I see him get frustrated and commit a stupid foul at least once a game, but the dude can ball.

I wouldn't be convinced any possible way to trade KAT for him, but he is going to be a stud big for years to come. Great passer, smart, finishes well, good rebounder, and has an edge to him.

Vee-Rex
03-02-2017, 11:02 AM
I really love the resurgence of big men in the league. Jokic has so much skill and I'm hoping Denver can continue developing into a real force.

Blitzbolt
03-02-2017, 02:34 PM
Denver gives a lot of points in the paint and while you can't blame it all on Jokic he is a big part of the problem.

I rather have a guy like gorbert then Jokic but that's just me ...

mgjohnson7851
03-02-2017, 02:49 PM
Jokic is a stud. He's looking like he's already on the verge of being an elite player.

CodeRed
03-02-2017, 02:54 PM
Denver gives a lot of points in the paint and while you can't blame it all on Jokic he is a big part of the problem.

I rather have a guy like gorbert then Jokic but that's just me ... Yeah that is just you lol. If you prefer Gobert to Jokic you haven't seen Jokic enough hahaahahahaha

Hawkeye15
03-02-2017, 04:32 PM
Yeah that is just you lol. If you prefer Gobert to Jokic you haven't seen Jokic enough hahaahahahaha

eh, Gobert is a stud man. He is defensively a BEAST, and has some room to grow offensively.

Depending on need, either would be ideal.

Avenged
03-02-2017, 05:34 PM
Over AD? Naw.. Dude is good but that's a little over board. AD has been great since day 1, top 10 player already.

CodeRed
03-02-2017, 05:37 PM
Yeah that is just you lol. If you prefer Gobert to Jokic you haven't seen Jokic enough hahaahahahaha

eh, Gobert is a stud man. He is defensively a BEAST, and has some room to grow offensively.

Depending on need, either would be ideal. Yeah, I'm probably underrating him a bit. I just think Jokic has more potential. I'm admittedly biased.

Hawkeye15
03-02-2017, 06:09 PM
Yeah, I'm probably underrating him a bit. I just think Jokic has more potential. I'm admittedly biased.

well, and it's hard to quantify defense. Gobert is amazing defensively, and while rim protection is HUGE, offense many times outweighs defense. By age alone, I think I would move forward with Jokic though. But Gobert is a beast no doubt.

Scoots
03-02-2017, 06:43 PM
Yeah that is just you lol. If you prefer Gobert to Jokic you haven't seen Jokic enough hahaahahahaha

If you asked the Warriors GM which he'd rather have I bet he'd say Gobert 10 times out of 10.

WestCoastSportz
03-02-2017, 07:20 PM
He's better than anyone else who was drafted in that year's lottery and that means Wiggins as well. Well, that can be debated. But he's definitely better than Jabari Parker, Aaron Gordon, Dante Exum, Marcus Smart, Julius Randle, Nik Stauskas, Noah Vonleh, Elfrid Payton and Doug McDermott. He and Embiid would be close if Embiid wasn't always injured. Redrafting that year, Jokic would be a top 5 pick.

1. Cleveland - Andrew Wiggins
2. Milwaukee - Joel Embiid
3. Philadelphia - Nikola Jokic
4. Orlando - Dario Saric
5. Utah - Gary Harris
6. Boston - Julius Randle
7. Los Angeles - Jabari Parker
8. Sacramento - Elfrid Payton
9. Charlotte - Zach Lavine
10. Philadelphia - Marcus Smart
11. Denver - TJ Warren
12. Orlando - Jordan Clarkson
13. Minnesota - Jusuf Nurkic
14. Phoenix - Rodney Hood

Guys like Stauskas, McDermott, Exum and Vonleh would probably fall out of the first round entirely. The other guy I really like and is coming on at the midway point is Dario Saric. In the last 8 games he's averaging 20.3 points, 8.7 rebounds and 3.3 assists.

CodeRed
03-02-2017, 07:22 PM
Yeah that is just you lol. If you prefer Gobert to Jokic you haven't seen Jokic enough hahaahahahaha

If you asked the Warriors GM which he'd rather have I bet he'd say Gobert 10 times out of 10. Well no ****

kingsdelez24
03-02-2017, 08:25 PM
Nikola Jokic is everything David Kahn said about Darko Milicic and then some

The true Manna from Heaven

eDush
03-03-2017, 09:19 AM
He is a poor defender right now, and will never be great on that end, but his IQ should at least get him to "good" as a team defender. His offensive ability is off the charts. I see him get frustrated and commit a stupid foul at least once a game, but the dude can ball.

I wouldn't be convinced any possible way to trade KAT for him, but he is going to be a stud big for years to come. Great passer, smart, finishes well, good rebounder, and has an edge to him.Not KAT but I will would trade DMC for him all day long and would add sweeteners to make it happen too :nod:

eDush
03-03-2017, 09:28 AM
Nikola Jokic is everything David Kahn said about Darko Milicic and then some

The true Manna from HeavenKahn was also the idiot who passed on drafting Curry to take Jonny Flynn cause he reminded him of Earl Monroe or Walt Frazier :laugh:

Hawkeye15
03-03-2017, 10:26 AM
If you asked the Warriors GM which he'd rather have I bet he'd say Gobert 10 times out of 10.

well yeah, you have plenty of offense, and despite the numbers regarding rim protection, it's clearly the Warriors real weakness come playoff time.

PurpleLynch
03-03-2017, 11:31 AM
If you asked the Warriors GM which he'd rather have I bet he'd say Gobert 10 times out of 10.

Because you have already an offense that can obliterate any team. Jokic would be just a plus,Gobert instead has an amazing defensive game that compliment well with GS weakness.

nycericanguy
03-03-2017, 12:31 PM
Seems like he could be a better version of Marc Gasol

Blitzbolt
03-03-2017, 01:38 PM
Seems like he could be a better version of Marc GasolNo way Marc Gasol is a top defensive Center since he got in the NBA while Jokic has potential to be a beast on offense he will never reach that defensive lvl Marc Gasol former DPOY has.

Marc is an all around C and in my opinion the only one in the NBA.Just because they are both European does not mean their the same.

nycericanguy
03-03-2017, 02:10 PM
No way Marc Gasol is a top defensive Center since he got in the NBA while Jokic has potential to be a beast on offense he will never reach that defensive lvl Marc Gasol former DPOY has.

Marc is an all around C and in my opinion the only one in the NBA.Just because they are both European does not mean their the same.

its not about just because they are EURO... euro bigs just tend to pass more and have similar games.

Gasol & Jokic are both great passers with similar offensive games, but Jokic seems to have a better handle and better range.

Gasol wasn't known as a good defender early on either, too early to say if Jokic will be good on that end.

Blitzbolt
03-03-2017, 02:42 PM
its not about just because they are EURO... euro bigs just tend to pass more and have similar games.

Gasol & Jokic are both great passers with similar offensive games, but Jokic seems to have a better handle and better range.

Gasol wasn't known as a good defender early on either, too early to say if Jokic will be good on that end.
Gasol was a good defender since day one he just got better after he drop the weight.People just didn't notice since that grizzlies team was one of the worst teams to watch since the roster was awful.

R. Johnson#3
03-03-2017, 04:03 PM
He's an offensive weapon in many ways but like others have said, the defence is nothing to write home about. He's still going to be a great player.

FlashBolt
03-03-2017, 05:56 PM
the defense will come but let's not blame Jokic for that. The nuggets are just terrible defensively from every position. Their best defender makes Harden look like pippen. You guys keep talking about Jokic's defense but it's only because his teammates can't defend for **** either. Put him on the Spurs and you'll see a much improved defense from Jokic not only due to him being motivated but also because it'll be easier for him.

tp13baby
03-03-2017, 09:50 PM
the defense will come but let's not blame Jokic for that. The nuggets are just terrible defensively from every position. Their best defender makes Harden look like pippen. You guys keep talking about Jokic's defense but it's only because his teammates can't defend for **** either. Put him on the Spurs and you'll see a much improved defense from Jokic not only due to him being motivated but also because it'll be easier for him.

I have tried driving this home. Jokic isn't a bad defender, right now not good, but underrated a bit. Mudiay, Nelson, Gallo, Chandler, Barton, And to a point Murray can't stay in front of a soul in the NBA. It's obvious Malone protects Jokic from fouls as much as possible. He isn't a rim protector so he doesn't challenge drivers at the rim on terrible defense by the guards. He has great hands, so he gets a decent amount of steals for playing relaxed defense (extremely evident from last year). One of the better defensive rebounders, not like your athletic bigs like Gobert or them, but he blocks out so consistently. Elite outlet passer. Willing to play physical.

His faults are he will never become a rim protector. He can't stay in from of laterally quick bigs like Towns. Malone protects him from fouls so there is times where it looks like he doesn't play defense.

He is actually an average defender right now.

CodeRed
03-03-2017, 10:21 PM
the defense will come but let's not blame Jokic for that. The nuggets are just terrible defensively from every position. Their best defender makes Harden look like pippen. You guys keep talking about Jokic's defense but it's only because his teammates can't defend for **** either. Put him on the Spurs and you'll see a much improved defense from Jokic not only due to him being motivated but also because it'll be easier for him. This... Gary Harris, Wilson Chandler, and Darrell Arthur are the only above average defenders on the roster.

Blitzbolt
03-03-2017, 11:42 PM
I don't buy that excuse at all yes his teammates are awful but as a Center you can't let guys get whatever they want in the paint.

His 1 one 1 defense is well below average too are you guys gonna blame that on his team too??The nuggets suck on defense and Jokic deserves part of the blame.

mgjohnson7851
03-04-2017, 02:11 AM
I don't buy that excuse at all yes his teammates are awful but as a Center you can't let guys get whatever they want in the paint.

His 1 one 1 defense is well below average too are you guys gonna blame that on his team too??The nuggets suck on defense and Jokic deserves part of the blame.
Well below average is a bit harsh. I'd say it's closer to average.

CodeRed
03-04-2017, 03:51 AM
I don't buy that excuse at all yes his teammates are awful but as a Center you can't let guys get whatever they want in the paint.

His 1 one 1 defense is well below average too are you guys gonna blame that on his team too??The nuggets suck on defense and Jokic deserves part of the blame. I wouldn't say well below average lol I'm not sure why you hate Jokic so much it's actually quite funny. Just curious how many games have you watched?

Blitzbolt
03-04-2017, 11:20 AM
I wouldn't say well below average lol I'm not sure why you hate Jokic so much it's actually quite funny. Just curious how many games have you watched?
I didn't say I hate him I just think he is getting overrated by fans a little bit to fast (some have him ahead of Davis/Gasol already )he has clear holes in his game (defense specially)and it's putting up empty stats on a average team (like K.love in minny ).

With that said I'll take him over almost any other young C he slightly better then porzingis,Embid or tows who are right there with him when it comes to potential and talent.

I prefer defense at the C position Gobert ,
DJordan and Gasol are elite in that department right now and what they do impacts the game way more then flashy offense.

ewing
03-04-2017, 11:29 AM
I didn't say I hate him I just think he is getting overrated by fans a little bit to fast (some have him ahead of Davis/Gasol already )he has clear holes in his game (defense specially)and it's putting up empty stats on a average team (like K.love in minny ).

With that said I'll take him over almost any other young C he is better then porzingis,Embid or tows who are right there with him when it comes to potential and talent.

thats the nature of the beast. When i guy first shows he can play in the league everyone acts like he is MJ. Jokic has some great skill and looks like he can be the real deal. Is he better then Marc Gasol now? No. Will he be? IDK but he is a good and looks like he could be damn good.

Blitzbolt
03-04-2017, 11:45 AM
Again I don't like to sound like a major hater but I got this from NBA.com

""Defense is an issue, though. The Nuggets have been better defensively with Jokic on the floor, but have still allowed 109.0 points per 100 possessions in those minutes. Among the 50 players who have defended at least five shots at the rim per game, Jokic ranks as the worst rim protector, having allowed opponents to shoot 58.4 percent while he was there.""


Calling him a average defender is giving him to much credit right now in my opinion so that's why I say he is well below average which is true.

D-Leethal
03-04-2017, 12:48 PM
Porzingis needs to step his game up.

Giannis94
03-04-2017, 02:13 PM
Porzingis needs to step his game up.


Same shenanigans as last year. Play well for the first few months and then fall off around January

tp13baby
03-04-2017, 04:43 PM
Again I don't like to sound like a major hater but I got this from NBA.com

""Defense is an issue, though. The Nuggets have been better defensively with Jokic on the floor, but have still allowed 109.0 points per 100 possessions in those minutes. Among the 50 players who have defended at least five shots at the rim per game, Jokic ranks as the worst rim protector, having allowed opponents to shoot 58.4 percent while he was there.""


Calling him a average defender is giving him to much credit right now in my opinion so that's why I say he is well below average which is true.

He isn't a rim protector we all know that. He struggles against quick bigs. Switching is a problem.

He is a decent 1 on 1 defender down low. Before the all star game he ranked in the 74th percentile for post up defense giving up .78 points per possession.

KingPosey
03-04-2017, 05:32 PM
No way Marc Gasol is a top defensive Center since he got in the NBA while Jokic has potential to be a beast on offense he will never reach that defensive lvl Marc Gasol former DPOY has.

Marc is an all around C and in my opinion the only one in the NBA.Just because they are both European does not mean their the same.
Cousins is pretty well rounded man

Giannis94
03-04-2017, 07:55 PM
Cousins is pretty well rounded man
But his personality and attitude has lost his team's a countless number of games

FlashBolt
03-04-2017, 11:37 PM
Jokic isn't a rim protector but he's a very solid team defender. Just his team makes him work much more than other centers in different situations. I would bet he becomes a much better defender if his coach actually tries to get them to play defense... doesn't seem like they care at all.