PDA

View Full Version : Is Mudiay a Bust?



shep33
11-05-2016, 10:07 PM
He's been pretty inconsistent and can't really shoot. What y'all think?

MILLERHIGHLIFE
11-05-2016, 10:33 PM
Haven't seen him play. But the season is young.

nycericanguy
11-05-2016, 10:57 PM
his shooting is incredibly bad. it's gotta be approaching historic bad levels. and so far almost 5 to's per game this year with only 3.5apg.

So glad the Knicks took KP over him...

europagnpilgrim
11-06-2016, 12:12 AM
He just fell victim to the current big percent crop of new talent coming into the league as being that next star or even superstar who are not going to be that

that along with the rising amount of 3pt shooting plus pedestrian overseas(all they can do is pretty much shoot the 3 or overpass) players has really put the league behind the 8ball, the nba is riding on its last leg with that 03' draft class as it had previously with the 84' and 96' class, I wouldn't call him a flat out bust but he wasn't all that to begin with in my bball book

Sadds The Gr8
11-06-2016, 01:37 AM
after 1 year and 2 weeks? wtf?

5ass
11-06-2016, 01:42 AM
Too young to be a bust. I haven't watched him play this season, but this is why young PGs either need to come off the bench or have a very good backup. You see how much better he played when they had Augustin on the team? His numbers increased across the board. He needs at least a very good back up instead they have another rookie? Or jameer? Like I said I haven't seen them play yet, but I dont see a good back up on the roster... You see how the Hawks gave Schroder 3 years to develop before giving him the starting position? If you want to make the play offs, that's what you have to do. There are no PGs his age able to handle being a consistent starter last time I checked.

shep33
11-06-2016, 01:55 AM
after 1 year and 2 weeks? wtf?

I mean, look at his numbers. He is like historically bad when it comes to starting PGs. He can't shoot, and isn't a great playmaker. Those are two pretty important factors to being a pg.

I guess bust is a bad term. I like the dude. But maybe he should've played a year or two as a backup

More-Than-Most
11-06-2016, 03:32 AM
said all along coming in I didnt like him at all... People had him top 3-5... What a Joke.

ROY 2 MVP Braun
11-06-2016, 03:45 AM
idk how people can write him off after 1 season and a few weeks. Wasn't it known he was pretty raw entering the draft and at that didn't play college ball but went overseas. I agree with Sass that it would be better if he was a back up or had a solid vet backing him up. It's not his fault that he got put into the starting role that's on the gm/coach. It probably takes at least 2/3 years for a pg coming out of college/overseas to be ready to start let alone really excel.

I'm sure by year 4/5 he will be at the least a solid starter/ good back up pg if not more. It depends on the team around him, coaching, and work he puts in. However writing anyone off after just a little over 1 season is ridiculous. I think rookies should get at least 2 to 4 years before making a judgement on if he's a bust.

ewing
11-06-2016, 06:50 AM
not yet but any time you draft a perimeter player that sucks on the perimiter you have that potential

ewing
11-06-2016, 06:51 AM
idk how people can write him off after 1 season and a few weeks. Wasn't it known he was pretty raw entering the draft and at that didn't play college ball but went overseas. I agree with Sass that it would be better if he was a back up or had a solid vet backing him up. It's not his fault that he got put into the starting role that's on the gm/coach. It probably takes at least 2/3 years for a pg coming out of college/overseas to be ready to start let alone really excel.

I'm sure by year 4/5 he will be at the least a solid starter/ good back up pg if not more. It depends on the team around him, coaching, and work he puts in. However writing anyone off after just a little over 1 season is ridiculous. I think rookies should get at least 2 to 4 years before making a judgement on if he's a bust.

Nelson is a solid vet.

Miltstar
11-06-2016, 07:59 AM
Too Early... some players take longer to come around then others. With his size and ball skills he's gonna get every chance. It's gonna come down to work ethic with him.

qwerty123
11-06-2016, 08:44 AM
Too soon, yet I'm trying extremely hard not to sour on him. he looks as if he has taken a step back this year and regressed to where he was at the beginning of last year I almost cringe when he takes a shot. Although he is playing with a new starting lineup with two c's and he does have flashes where you think wow! why cant you keep doing that.

ewing
11-06-2016, 09:11 AM
Too soon, yet I'm trying extremely hard not to sour on him. he looks as if he has taken a step back this year and regressed to where he was at the beginning of last year I almost cringe when he takes a shot. Although he is playing with a new starting lineup with two c's and he does have flashes where you think wow! why cant you keep doing that.


the one thing i liked about him the little i watched is just how big he looks on the court. A slashing guard needs the ability to absorb contact and finish he looks like he has it.

hughest4
11-06-2016, 09:12 AM
Before he was drafted it was pretty well known that the guy was a raw talent, but would need time to develop.
He would have been better off coming off the bench in a limited role, but Denver decided to throw him right into the action which was probably a mistake.

He is only 20 years old and its way too soon to call him a bust, although that will happen if he doesnt work on the weak parts of his game.

nycericanguy
11-06-2016, 09:33 AM
Too soon, yet I'm trying extremely hard not to sour on him. he looks as if he has taken a step back this year and regressed to where he was at the beginning of last year I almost cringe when he takes a shot. Although he is playing with a new starting lineup with two c's and he does have flashes where you think wow! why cant you keep doing that.

i expected him to play much better this year, he has legit starters around him now to take the pressure off.

Gallo, Nurkic, Jokic, are all good players. Wilson Chandler & Barton off the bench. the talent is there around him for him to shoot less and be more efficient. it's not like MCW in PHI who HAD to shoot all the time because he had no help.

but man 27% from the field? Same thing in preseason too, and not much better last year. Those are just BRUTAL numbers, especially for a guy that has help on a team.

and IDK but i feel like his explosiveness and speed was overhyped, he's not that explosive when i watch him. In fact watching Rose every game now, I'd say Rose even after all the injuries is far more explosive and faster.

Yanks All Day
11-06-2016, 10:41 AM
As many have said, he's too young to be a bust.

That being said, he was never a good shooter and never played college ball in the U.S. for people to see that. He racked up big numbers overseas playing against lesser competition. There's nothing wrong with getting paid, but the result was probably most people overrating him. He was never as good as people thought, but he's not as bad as people currently think. Just needs time to progress. Regardless, he's gotta develop a jump shot or his NBA tenure won't be smooth.

shep33
11-06-2016, 11:14 AM
I do think it's a bit early. But the nuggets should maybe do something to help with his development. Send him to the D-league or put him on the bench right now.

NYKnickFanatic
11-06-2016, 01:08 PM
And I wanted the Knicks to draft him. :laugh:

Thank goodness I'm not in their front office.

zn23
11-06-2016, 01:40 PM
It's still early to tell but I don't see any signs of progress.

I said last year he'll likely be the next Austin Rivers.

tp13baby
11-06-2016, 03:27 PM
Yeah I am eating crow so far on him this year. He has been pathetic and we are a better team with him on the bench. But here is some slack.

1. He is 20 years old. Hardest for PG's to excel at such a young age and the crop is unreal.
2. To me the biggest reason is who he plays with. He plays mostly with Nurkic and Jokic together. God knows Mudiay can't shoot so teams are sagging on him. With a 2 center lineup the lane is clogged. He still is finishing at a below average rate near the rim but he can get there.
3. He needs to get stronger. Alone finishing layups instead of finesse layups alone would increase his percentage.

That being said he needs to be more careful with the ball and facilitate it more. We don't need double figures in points from him. We need a point guard that is smart because Denver has 6 players that can score 15 ppg at an efficient rate

TheNumber37
11-06-2016, 03:43 PM
You can't bust in a year.

shep33
11-06-2016, 05:32 PM
Yeah I am eating crow so far on him this year. He has been pathetic and we are a better team with him on the bench. But here is some slack.

1. He is 20 years old. Hardest for PG's to excel at such a young age and the crop is unreal.
2. To me the biggest reason is who he plays with. He plays mostly with Nurkic and Jokic together. God knows Mudiay can't shoot so teams are sagging on him. With a 2 center lineup the lane is clogged. He still is finishing at a below average rate near the rim but he can get there.
3. He needs to get stronger. Alone finishing layups instead of finesse layups alone would increase his percentage.

That being said he needs to be more careful with the ball and facilitate it more. We don't need double figures in points from him. We need a point guard that is smart because Denver has 6 players that can score 15 ppg at an efficient rate

Well said. He is very young, but he has to play better. He has a lot of decent talent on that team, and the poor shooting is one thing (see Rubio), but the turnovers make him extra bad.

Maybe he needs to be in a role like Marcus Smart. That's just my opinion, but he'd excel more with fewer minutes and maybe coming off the bench.

MJL80
11-06-2016, 05:38 PM
Gotta give a guy at least 3 full seasons before you can start to stamp the bust label. He was never a great shooter, just needs to develop his game more. It's only been one season.

warfelg
11-06-2016, 09:11 PM
PSDKarma at work?

Mudiay has 22 already. 8/9 from the field.

shep33
11-06-2016, 09:15 PM
Haha right on cue! 24 first quarter points for the dude!

God he's so weird as a player. Signs of explosiveness and all-star ability, and then he looks like a guy who shouldn't be in the NBA.

Career PER: 9.6
TS%: 43.4%
WS/48: -.052 (yes negative)
VORP: -1.3

Hopefully he picks it up, cause physically he is an absolute beast.

shep33
11-06-2016, 09:19 PM
Glad Mudiay reads PSD. Still has been awful for his career.

If you take away his bizzare 1st quarter dominance, he had 7 assists, and I believe 7 turnovers, with only 4 points.

ewing
11-07-2016, 12:03 AM
it comes down to intestinal fortitude

NYKnickFanatic
11-07-2016, 01:43 AM
He must check the forum lol.

TheDish87
11-07-2016, 12:06 PM
eh dude had 7 turnovers to 2 assists.

KnicksorBust
11-07-2016, 12:16 PM
Definitely a bust. People acting like "oh maybe in 4 years he will be solid or a good backup..." please look where the dude was drafted? Excuses for a bum who creates more plays for the other team than his own.

Clint Olbrock
11-07-2016, 07:31 PM
30 points on 61% FG isn't bad.

shep33
11-07-2016, 08:14 PM
30 points on 61% FG isn't bad.

bumped his season fg% up to 34%.

tp13baby
11-07-2016, 08:32 PM
Definitely a bust. People acting like "oh maybe in 4 years he will be solid or a good backup..." please look where the dude was drafted? Excuses for a bum who creates more plays for the other team than his own.


He had very similar stats to westbrooks first year while being a year younger.

He has been terrible this year but until Malone stops giving him a chance is when I give up on him.

Mudiay has not been given the rotation to succeed. Which is still not an excuse for how bad he has played, you can't run a PG that can't shoot with 2 centers that are best at playing back to the basket. Teams defend pick and roles with ease. No spacing clogs the lane and he forces.

I'm not posting to say he is going To be great, just saying it is still early to be labeled a bust. He barely turned 20.

shep33
11-07-2016, 08:55 PM
He had very similar stats to westbrooks first year while being a year younger.

He has been terrible this year but until Malone stops giving him a chance is when I give up on him.

Mudiay has not been given the rotation to succeed. Which is still not an excuse for how bad he has played, you can't run a PG that can't shoot with 2 centers that are best at playing back to the basket. Teams defend pick and roles with ease. No spacing clogs the lane and he forces.

I'm not posting to say he is going To be great, just saying it is still early to be labeled a bust. He barely turned 20.

Man I really think he's not a pg, and that would help him out tremendously if he came off the bench, or played off the ball. I'm routing for him.

Aust
11-07-2016, 09:01 PM
I'd give him more time. I would need to ask Denver fans if they've noticed growth from him. If he hasn't improved at all I would worry.

tp13baby
11-07-2016, 09:24 PM
I'd give him more time. I would need to ask Denver fans if they've noticed growth from him. If he hasn't improved at all I would worry.

Its hard to say. He has went back to his first half play from last year but he most certainly got more consistent in the second half. Overall the assists aren't concerning to me, its the turnovers. They are mostly unforced this year but it is early playing with a new group.

Clint Olbrock
11-07-2016, 11:39 PM
bumped his season fg% up to 34%.

A whopping 6 games.. Let's revisit this after 66 games or at least some point more than 2 weeks into the season..

Scoots
11-08-2016, 08:05 AM
Klay Thompson is 11 for 53 from 3 7 games in and most people feel his 3pt shooting is the only thing he brings to the game. He must be a bust!

7 games is not enough of a sample size for anything.

Mudiay is not yet a bust, 6 games into his season he's scoring more, getting more rebounds, steals, free throw attempts, hitting his free throws at a far better % ... he's also turning the ball over more and getting fewer assists while shooting worse.

Not enough data and way to early to call him a bust.

I think people are just upset that his shot hasn't taken a huge leap forward ... it takes time. He may not get better, but it's not the way to bet.

nycericanguy
11-08-2016, 10:17 AM
Klay Thompson is 11 for 53 from 3 7 games in and most people feel his 3pt shooting is the only thing he brings to the game. He must be a bust!

7 games is not enough of a sample size for anything.

Mudiay is not yet a bust, 6 games into his season he's scoring more, getting more rebounds, steals, free throw attempts, hitting his free throws at a far better % ... he's also turning the ball over more and getting fewer assists while shooting worse.

Not enough data and way to early to call him a bust.

I think people are just upset that his shot hasn't taken a huge leap forward ... it takes time. He may not get better, but it's not the way to bet.

i dont think a single person here is basing it on 7 games dude...lol.

R. Johnson#3
11-08-2016, 11:08 AM
Way too early to call a 2nd year PG on a team trying to find its identity a bust. The Nuggets are still building their foundation with Jokic, Nurkic and Mudiay. Outside of Gallo he doesn't really have anyone who's consistent to work with on offense.

Scoots
11-08-2016, 12:19 PM
i dont think a single person here is basing it on 7 games dude...lol.

Since I was talking about the Warriors and Klay Thompson who have played 7 games, not the 6 games Mudiay has played, and that there are Warriors fans all over the place trashing Thompson ... my point was that it's too early to draw conclusions about the future of a player. Admittedly that may not have been crystal clear.

Mudiay is playing on a VERY young team. I don't think there's any reason to think he won't both improve as a shooter in the future, but also improve as a shot selector too.

shep33
11-08-2016, 01:05 PM
A whopping 6 games.. Let's revisit this after 66 games or at least some point more than 2 weeks into the season..

Lol, my rebuttal was to show that a one game sample is ridiculous.

Hawkeye15
11-08-2016, 03:07 PM
oh god, I just looked at his numbers.....very bad.

I have seen him once. He looks like a SG trying to play PG, only, he can't shoot. Not sure what his future holds honestly.

qwerty123
11-08-2016, 04:53 PM
oh god, I just looked at his numbers.....very bad.

I have seen him once. He looks like a SG trying to play PG, only, he can't shoot. Not sure what his future holds honestly.

I do think he looks more like a PG and his size at that position is why I'm trying to stay positive, and what I'm most excited about!!

He is really raw and his numbers and the eye test is somewhat worrisome... but then he has games like he did against Boston which come out of nowhere and you get your hopes up then he'll back it up with a herrendous fg% and like a trillion turnovers

Hawkeye15
11-08-2016, 05:10 PM
I do think he looks more like a PG and his size at that position is why I'm trying to stay positive, and what I'm most excited about!!

He is really raw and his numbers and the eye test is somewhat worrisome... but then he has games like he did against Boston which come out of nowhere and you get your hopes up then he'll back it up with a herrendous fg% and like a trillion turnovers

well, Boston's guards are annoying defenders, so that doesn't help.

He physically has the talent. Reminds me of Tyreke, only not as stupid

Clint Olbrock
11-08-2016, 06:28 PM
Lol, my rebuttal was to show that a one game sample is ridiculous.

Of course it is, similarly as ridiculous as a 6 game sample size.

shep33
11-08-2016, 06:55 PM
Of course it is, similarly as ridiculous as a 6 game sample size.

Lol, again, everyone here is really looking, or at least hope so, is the 74 game sample that we've seen. Which is historically bad for a starting pg.

tp13baby
11-08-2016, 07:53 PM
Lol, again, everyone here is really looking, or at least hope so, is the 74 game sample that we've seen. Which is historically bad for a starting pg.

And again, He played better in the second half last year. He was an average/barely below average guy in the second half. He made progress, he has came out of the gates this year bad.

shep33
11-08-2016, 08:57 PM
And again, He played better in the second half last year. He was an average/barely below average guy in the second half. He made progress, he has came out of the gates this year bad.

That I agree with. He was better the 2nd half.

blahblahyoutoo
11-08-2016, 10:03 PM
idk how people can write him off after 1 season and a few weeks. Wasn't it known he was pretty raw entering the draft and at that didn't play college ball but went overseas. I agree with Sass that it would be better if he was a back up or had a solid vet backing him up. It's not his fault that he got put into the starting role that's on the gm/coach. It probably takes at least 2/3 years for a pg coming out of college/overseas to be ready to start let alone really excel.

I'm sure by year 4/5 he will be at the least a solid starter/ good back up pg if not more. It depends on the team around him, coaching, and work he puts in. However writing anyone off after just a little over 1 season is ridiculous. I think rookies should get at least 2 to 4 years before making a judgement on if he's a bust.

raw? he had a year of pro ball overseas.

tp13baby
11-08-2016, 11:02 PM
raw? he had a year of pro ball overseas.

It's a joke of a league he was in:l. Wilson Chandler when he came back from China said he thought he was the next Michael Jordan in that league

Clint Olbrock
11-09-2016, 10:32 PM
It's a joke of a league he was in:l. Wilson Chandler when he came back from China said he thought he was the next Michael Jordan in that league

Not to mention he only played 12 games in said league.

Raps18-19 Champ
11-10-2016, 12:59 AM
Not yet but he will be. It's really just a formality at this point. You gotta give someone time to call them a bust but really, he's so garbage it isn't even funny.