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View Full Version : Green or Klay if things go sour?



MILLERHIGHLIFE
10-20-2016, 12:36 PM
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/17790252/golden-state-draymond-green-problem

Probably nothing but if one of them had to be traded who you move? Article mentions Green and Klay don't get along. Also Kerr hates Green. All in all if they win rings doesn't matter who hates who. Just speculation.

tp13baby
10-20-2016, 01:20 PM
Move Klay. Green is a premier defender that is so versatile. Acquiring KD made Klay expendable IF things go bad.

hugepatsfan
10-20-2016, 01:20 PM
THREE YEARS AGO, the Warriors had a mystery on their hands. Team trainers were noticing that the stationary bikes in their practice facility had become rather unstationary. More to the point, they were disappearing. Eventually, the mystery was solved. Green was dragging the stationary cycles to the sauna and leaving them there to soak.

It turned out that Green, who's struggled with his weight since his days at Michigan State, had developed a theory: By riding the bikes in the sauna, he could more efficiently shed pounds. In the short term, biking in a sauna will do that, but much of what is lost is water weight and is soon gained back. Golden State trainers were aware that Green's regimen was, at best, scientifically dubious. Also, the bikes were getting ruined. Says a former Golden State trainer: "He would come in and say, 'The screen's not working on the bike.' And I'd be like, 'Yeah, I wonder why.'"

Still, the team chose to ultimately allow it. It did involve cardio. And Green was loath to give it up. At the end of the day, success trusts its routine, no matter how absurd, grueling or dangerous to electronic equipment it might be.

And so it goes with the Warriors and their enigmatic star. The team indulges his more questionable behavior -- the late-night mischief, the berating of teammates, the feuding with coaches, the waterboarding of bikes -- because in doing so it has enabled him to become perhaps the best two-way player in the league. On the other hand, it might also have cost them a championship.

The Warriors have a problem to solve. The success of Draymond Green is inextricably wrapped up in the enigma of Draymond Green. There is, after all, more than one way to enable a man.

:laugh:

mrblisterdundee
10-20-2016, 01:29 PM
Klay Thompson is extremely talented but somewhat redundant with Stephen Curry and Kevin Durant. Draymond Green, whatever his quirks, is perenially in competition for Defensive Player of the Year, can defend every position, runs the offense at times and makes threes at a decent rate. If he slows down, then the story changes.

R!kSm!tz
10-20-2016, 02:01 PM
Klay for Jimmy straight up.

IKnowHoops
10-20-2016, 02:19 PM
Id trade Draymond. I'd try and get AD, but I'd be happy to get Paul George. I don't like Drayomnd's attitude and lack of sense.

FlashBolt
10-20-2016, 02:38 PM
You don't even need Klay. Durant does everything Klay can do but better. His defense isn't elite so I'm not sure why some of you pretend as if Klay is a lockdown defender. He's a good defender with scoring capabilities -- both of which are directly improved with his stacked team. Green is the most important player on the Warriors. As great as Curry and Durant are, he's their defensive presence and leader.

R!kSm!tz
10-20-2016, 03:56 PM
Durant isn't a better shooter than Klay but I agree everything else he does better or at least about even.

sens#11fan
10-20-2016, 04:22 PM
I think Klay is slightly a better player, but Draymond is a more complete player and fits more with the team's needs. As others mentioned, Klay is expendable with KD.

SportsFanatic10
10-20-2016, 06:00 PM
Well it seems to me that based on the article if things go sour it's likely because of Green. So if that hypothetically is the case then he'd have to be the one to go imo. Although his versatility and fit are more important then Klay to the team, if he's the one causing problems he goes. Some sort of trade for say Aldridge would be crazy just as a quick thought. Imagine Green and Leonard on the same team locking it down.

Dade County
10-20-2016, 06:52 PM
You can not separate the Splash Brothers. Green would be the odd man out.

Klay & Curry need to stay together for their entire career.

IndyRealist
10-20-2016, 06:57 PM
Well it seems to me that based on the article if things go sour it's likely because of Green. So if that hypothetically is the case then he'd have to be the one to go imo. Although his versatility and fit are more important then Klay to the team, if he's the one causing problems he goes. Some sort of trade for say Aldridge would be crazy just as a quick thought. Imagine Green and Leonard on the same team locking it down.

Pop would strangle him.

IndyRealist
10-20-2016, 06:59 PM
Id trade Draymond. I'd try and get AD, but I'd be happy to get Paul George. I don't like Drayomnd's attitude and lack of sense.

Doesn't make sense for Indiana. Not for New Orleans either unless AD gets injured again.

tredigs
10-20-2016, 07:39 PM
Things would have to get a lot worse for them to contemplate this, but ultimately you'd trade Draymond if there was a problem, simply because he would be the problem (and could cause further issues if you didn't). He IS more important thank Klay, but they'd get a haul for him, and if they made a halfway intelligent trade focused on a dynamic 4 (they would), they'd still be title favorites. Hopefully it does not come to that. No team is all butterflies, including GS.

D-Leethal
10-20-2016, 08:25 PM
I think Draymond's skillset is more critical to pair with Steph and KD long term. The addition of a lights out shooter like KD makes Klay more expendable. Dray is the critical glue guy that brings the swiss army knife you need around a Steph-KD 1-2 punch. Klay is more of a luxury item for this new roster.

Scoots
10-20-2016, 09:46 PM
1. Klay and Dray get along fine. Klay is just very quiet and reserved and quietly hyper critical of himself. He gets annoyed at Dray sure but it's not close to being a problem.

2. Kerr and Dray get along fine. They have clashed from day 1 but Kerr and the team understand it is part of what drives Dray.

I think Draymond's career may well be shorter than Klay's because his athletic capabilities start out below the NBA average so he physically won't have the ability to play at this level for too long and once he gets just a little slower his D will fall off a cliff.

Dray goes ... but it's not happening before this contract runs out is my guess.

tredigs
10-20-2016, 09:49 PM
1. Klay and Dray get along fine. Klay is just very quiet and reserved and quietly hyper critical of himself. He gets annoyed at Dray sure but it's not close to being a problem.

2. Kerr and Dray get along fine. They have clashed from day 1 but Kerr and the team understand it is part of what drives Dray.

I think Draymond's career may well be shorter than Klay's because his athletic capabilities start out below the NBA average so he physically won't have the ability to play at this level for too long and once he gets just a little slower his D will fall off a cliff.

Dray goes ... but it's not happening before this contract runs out is my guess.

1. I presume you know literally nothing about their relationship.

2. I presume you know literally nothing about their relationship.

Ancillary points... agreed.

Raps18-19 Champ
10-20-2016, 10:06 PM
You can replace Klay for Courtney Lee or something and the Warriors still probably end up winning it all. Not saying Klay is bad but he's so much more expandable.

tredigs
10-20-2016, 10:44 PM
You can replace Klay for Courtney Lee or something and the Warriors still probably end up winning it all. Not saying Klay is bad but he's so much more expandable.
You can replace Draymond with Tristan Thompson and they still probably end up winning it all. Beyond that, you'd be blind to just look at on court impact if Dray were in fact the catalyst of this team split (again talking hypotheticals). Klay is a top-10 perimeter shooter in NBA history. Their team goes NOVA when he is on. He matters. A lot. His NOVA factor is why they won game 6 in OKC and were the favorites in the Finals. Draymond's idiocy is why he was suspended in G5 and they lost the Finals (rudimentary but all-things-being-equal breakdown).

FlashBolt
10-20-2016, 11:49 PM
Klay is a scorer with good defense. Remember when some of you thought he was better than Harden? Klay has choked up two Finals in a row.. this dude gets way too much credit. What's the difference between Reddick and Klay? Not really much, tbh.

tredigs
10-21-2016, 12:05 AM
Klay is a scorer with good defense. Remember when some of you thought he was better than Harden? Klay has choked up two Finals in a row.. this dude gets way too much credit. What's the difference between Reddick and Klay? Not really much, tbh.

The ability to guard multiple positions effectively, consistent 20+ PPG scoring, and takeover ability. Other than that, absolutely nothing.

tredigs
10-21-2016, 12:21 AM
Bare in mind, in the current GM survey, 40% of current General Managers of NBA teams consider Klay Thompson the best Shooting Guard in the NBA. And while I disagree with them on an even plane (though I'd never trade him for Klay straight up in GS), not exactly what I'd call a "remember when" scenario big guy.

europagnpilgrim
10-21-2016, 01:39 AM
This is a tough call and it would basically come down to a team meeting minus those two

Dray brings more drama/baggage but winning cures all, it is sort of Rodman esque when you think about it and how Jordan/Bulls tolerated his camera kicking and other antics because he did what he did at a even higher scale than Dray but in todays nba Dray is doing his thing quite well no doubt

Klay is sort of locked to the hip with Curry as with the name splash bros. so I would think how the game is played Klay would be just as valuable since its hard to get a player to drop 30 in a game let alone in a qtr., but with KD on board it would seem Klay would be the odd man out but then again if Curry insist on him being there and threatens to jump ship I would give the minor edge to Klay but barely

Dray may be the quasi leader but I would always give the heart/soul/engine title to a back to back nba mvp as being that, and Curry to me is the co leader, a backcourt capable of dropping 60-80 pts combined is more valuable than a 10-10-10 triple double guy in my book all day every day

JAZZNC
10-21-2016, 09:52 AM
You get rid of the psychopath. And we all know who that is. It's IMO it's a myth that Green is their "leader" in any for of the word. There is a big difference in being loud and being a leader and Green is the former. Eventually his "act" will get old and wear on guys. I would keep the guy capable of taking over games.

FlashBolt
10-21-2016, 10:52 AM
Every team needs a psychopath.. that's a fact.

Scoots
10-21-2016, 11:30 AM
Klay is a scorer with good defense. Remember when some of you thought he was better than Harden? Klay has choked up two Finals in a row.. this dude gets way too much credit. What's the difference between Reddick and Klay? Not really much, tbh.

I didn't say Klay was better than Harden, but I did say I'd rather have Klay than Harden. And Harden has choked plenty in the playoffs too, so on that count the two are similar.

Scoots
10-21-2016, 11:33 AM
1. I presume you know literally nothing about their relationship.

2. I presume you know literally nothing about their relationship.

Ancillary points... agreed.

Other than what they and others around them have said? Yes, I don't personally know them. But Kerr straight up said that Dray is a pain in the *** but that his relationship with him is a "challenge" but also a good relationship. Kerr compared Dray's passion and anger with Michael Jordan's and that while it's not easy to deal with it's all about winning which is what Kerr is all about too. I can't remember who said it, but there was an incident on a plane last year where Dray was bugging Klay and Klay got pissed but just because he wanted to be left alone ... so yeah they are not buddies, but that doesn't mean they have a real problem either.

FlashBolt
10-21-2016, 11:45 AM
I didn't say Klay was better than Harden, but I did say I'd rather have Klay than Harden. And Harden has choked plenty in the playoffs too, so on that count the two are similar.

View Poll Results: Is Klay the #1 SG in the league RIGHT NOW?Voters 69.
Without question. 1623.19%
alkalinesolo, Allphakenny1, asandhu23, bigmac8675, bluegold39, COOLbeans, HoodedSB, lamzoka, lol, please, MygirlhatesCod, Rain City, rhymeratic, Scoots, Sssmush, Supreme LA, theducksmuggler

Some of you did say that and it was VERY recently. Cough cough. And Harden choked but with all the attention focused on him during the playoffs, it's not fair to compare Klay and Harden's role for a team. When you're expected to do less, you're not going to get blamed for losing. Hell, Klay had a terrible Finals and all we talked about was Curry sucking and Green missing game 5.

MILLERHIGHLIFE
10-21-2016, 12:15 PM
Klay for Cousins trade?

Tg11
10-21-2016, 12:18 PM
If things do go sour then I say Klay Thompson leaves but Durant, Green and Curry all stay

Saddletramp
10-21-2016, 04:32 PM
Other than what they and others around them have said? Yes, I don't personally know them. But Kerr straight up said that Dray is a pain in the *** but that his relationship with him is a "challenge" but also a good relationship. Kerr compared Dray's passion and anger with Michael Jordan's and that while it's not easy to deal with it's all about winning which is what Kerr is all about too. I can't remember who said it, but there was an incident on a plane last year where Dray was bugging Klay and Klay got pissed but just because he wanted to be left alone ... so yeah they are not buddies, but that doesn't mean they have a real problem either.

To me, that all screams "I really hate this guy and as soon as he slips, he's out of here pronto."

Draymond is such a douche and I bet they feel a little dirty having to keep him to win. Plus, all things considered, I'm not sure he could be the centerpiece in getting a guy like AD. His garbage temperament and tantrums plus not being a huge prospect but excelling in Kerr's system (not as special before Kerr showed up) might give GMs a quick pause. Maybe he goes on to another team and doesn't miss a beat but I'd think that there's cause for concern.


I didn't think I could dislike that guy more but after reading that article the other day, he proved me wrong.

IKnowHoops
10-21-2016, 07:11 PM
As much as Dre is an all purpose player, Klay allows the team to have the greatest spacing of all time which is as equally valuable. I would trade Dray and get back equal value and be happy. Dre for Blake...Dre for Cousins, if I have to add a bench piece I do it.

LoveCaliFan
10-21-2016, 09:04 PM
Klay goes because Curry, Durant, Green. They need Green's defense and versitility. He can get triple doubles. Triple doubles!! Also, without Thompson, Green is probably a 20ppg/ 10rpg/ 7apg player. Add the defense with his almost 2spg & almost 2bpg, they'd forget who Klay was quickly. He another Barkley, though not as athletic, but more versitile as a playmaker..But i'm not saying he's as good as Barkley, but he is darn close, especially if he was third scring option.

Vee-Rex
10-21-2016, 09:16 PM
In terms of who they need most - I say that's debatable. Probably Green but it could shift to Klay if Durant can become a little bit of a glue guy for GS.

Regardless, if there are irreconcilable problems because of Green then you ship his *** out of there. You trade the guy that is hurting morale, not the other way around especially if the other guy is close to being as important.

Keep Green and what happens if he starts to have problems with Steph or Durant?

Honestly, GS has enough talent to still win a championship if either Green or Klay retired right now, not even counting the assets acquired if one was traded.

LoveCaliFan
10-21-2016, 09:29 PM
In terms of who they need most - I say that's debatable. Probably Green but it could shift to Klay if Durant can become a little bit of a glue guy for GS.

Regardless, if there are irreconcilable problems because of Green then you ship his *** out of there. You trade the guy that is hurting morale, not the other way around especially if the other guy is close to being as important.

Keep Green and what happens if he starts to have problems with Steph or Durant?

Honestly, GS has enough talent to still win a championship if either Green or Klay retired right now, not even counting the assets acquired if one was traded.

Green and Durant are Best friends. If Green goes, i'd think K.D. would leave next. Green probably got him to even go to GSW. Or, just Maybe Curry leaves instead. Curry is a FA summer 2017.

tredigs
10-21-2016, 09:46 PM
Other than what they and others around them have said? Yes, I don't personally know them. But Kerr straight up said that Dray is a pain in the *** but that his relationship with him is a "challenge" but also a good relationship. Kerr compared Dray's passion and anger with Michael Jordan's and that while it's not easy to deal with it's all about winning which is what Kerr is all about too. I can't remember who said it, but there was an incident on a plane last year where Dray was bugging Klay and Klay got pissed but just because he wanted to be left alone ... so yeah they are not buddies, but that doesn't mean they have a real problem either.

You and I have no connection to the team and basing their relationship on media reports is dubious at best. You have no idea what the true dynamic is.

That said, ultimately I see this as a non issue. These are not the Warriors of the past, it is an organization run by legitimate operators and Draymond - for all his faults - does seem more than capable of being reasonable. Things like donating 7 figures to the Spartans and Izzo holding him in ultra high regard do speak volumes about his true character.

JAZZNC
10-21-2016, 10:49 PM
Every team needs a psychopath.. that's a fact.

That's gotta be one of the dumbest things I've ever read on here.

Who was that "guy" for the Spurs? Heat? Cavs? Lakers? Mavs? None of those teams had a complete crazy person like Green on their team. More often than not those types of players are far more detrimental then helpful. Occasionally there is a coach that can reign them in for a bit and make it work (Rodman/Jackson) but that's far from the norm.

tredigs
10-21-2016, 11:32 PM
That's gotta be one of the dumbest things I've ever read on here.

Who was that "guy" for the Spurs? Heat? Cavs? Lakers? Mavs? None of those teams had a complete crazy person like Green on their team. More often than not those types of players are far more detrimental then helpful. Occasionally there is a coach that can reign them in for a bit and make it work (Rodman/Jackson) but that's far from the norm.

"Complete crazy person". Lol. Home-boy you read too much TMZ and you're in for a world of hurt if you think Draymond's antics outweigh his gains.

BKLYNpigeon
10-21-2016, 11:34 PM
Plays contract come up first for an extension in 3 years. then Draymond the year after.

Klay will get his extension.

I think Draymond will be moved, theres no way the Warriors can pay 4 max players.

FlashBolt
10-22-2016, 12:34 AM
That's gotta be one of the dumbest things I've ever read on here.

Who was that "guy" for the Spurs? Heat? Cavs? Lakers? Mavs? None of those teams had a complete crazy person like Green on their team. More often than not those types of players are far more detrimental then helpful. Occasionally there is a coach that can reign them in for a bit and make it work (Rodman/Jackson) but that's far from the norm.

I said every team needs a psychopath.. where do you find the inclination to pick championship teams only?

likemystylez
10-22-2016, 01:18 AM
Plays contract come up first for an extension in 3 years. then Draymond the year after.

Klay will get his extension.

I think Draymond will be moved, theres no way the Warriors can pay 4 max players.

you do know what bird rights are right?

Vee-Rex
10-22-2016, 01:11 PM
you do know what bird rights are right?

The luxury tax would be insane. And I don't think Joe Lacob would be able to dish out that kind of money.

I mean, look at Dan Gilbert who is worth nearly 5 billion (much more than Lacob) and even he is starting to pinch pennies with contracts because of the potential monetary loss.

Vee-Rex
10-22-2016, 01:14 PM
Also, intentional or not, Green has GOTTA stop doing this:

http://clutchpoints.com/video-draymond-green-appears-kick-blazers-allen-crabbe/

I don't think the NBA is gonna allow that to keep happening and it could very well lead to some actual issues in the locker room if he keeps doing it.

5ass
10-22-2016, 02:35 PM
Also, intentional or not, Green has GOTTA stop doing this:

http://clutchpoints.com/video-draymond-green-appears-kick-blazers-allen-crabbe/

I don't think the NBA is gonna allow that to keep happening and it could very well lead to some actual issues in the locker room if he keeps doing it.
I hope they suspend him for that. Its the only way he'll learn. Suspend him every time he does that.

jason
10-22-2016, 03:01 PM
Obviously it would be Green if he's the one causing the problems. Green is important but not as important as Curry.

Allphakenny1
10-22-2016, 04:00 PM
I hope they suspend him for that. Its the only way he'll learn. Suspend him every time he does that.

Did he even make contact? I cannot tell 100%, but it looks like absolutely no contact was made. It would be pretty ridiculous to suspend a player for that.

Saddletramp
10-22-2016, 04:18 PM
Also, intentional or not, Green has GOTTA stop doing this:

http://clutchpoints.com/video-draymond-green-appears-kick-blazers-allen-crabbe/

I don't think the NBA is gonna allow that to keep happening and it could very well lead to some actual issues in the locker room if he keeps doing it.

Suspend him a game. Or, if you kick, it's an automatic technical. And if they really want to make techs hurt, fine them the equivalent to that quarter''s pay. 1/4 of a game's salary for a player per tech will lessen stuff like this, not a straight $2,000. I know it's in the CBA but real consequences and all.......

But yeah, what a jerk.

Saddletramp
10-22-2016, 04:21 PM
Did he even make contact? I cannot tell 100%, but it looks like absolutely no contact was made. It would be pretty ridiculous to suspend a player for that.

So? If you throw a punch that doesn't connect, you're still in trouble via intent. C'mon.

JAZZNC
10-22-2016, 06:53 PM
I said every team needs a psychopath.. where do you find the inclination to pick championship teams only?

Because championship teams would be included in "every team" therefore every team does not need a psychopath. Pretty simple concept dude.

JAZZNC
10-22-2016, 07:03 PM
"Complete crazy person". Lol. Home-boy you read too much TMZ and you're in for a world of hurt if you think Draymond's antics outweigh his gains.

He is a complete crazy person. I don't read TMZ "homeboy", it's just very apparent via his actions both on and off the court. He is just in a perfect spot and they are winning a lot. As they say winning cures all. Don't exactly understand how I'm in for a world of hurt lol??? I just think he's a psychopath, simple as that and his antics will hurt the team at some point. You said yourself he had a big part in your team losing last year's finals because he is crazy and can't control himself. But whatever, you're always right so no point in arguing with you.

FlashBolt
10-22-2016, 07:14 PM
Because championship teams would be included in "every team" therefore every team does not need a psychopath. Pretty simple concept dude.

So if I said every team needs a PG, I guess that means only championship teams need them. Simple indeed.

Allphakenny1
10-22-2016, 08:11 PM
So? If you throw a punch that doesn't connect, you're still in trouble via intent. C'mon.

Haha! When I responded, I predicted someone would reply with this stupid response. There have been numerous players throughout the years who have had a follow through kick after shooting. I 100% believe the Green kick on Adams was intentional, but suspending players for a flailing leg with no contact is not the same as suspending a player who throws an intentional punch that does not connect. They are no where near the same thing. C'mon.

tredigs
10-22-2016, 08:33 PM
He is a complete crazy person. I don't read TMZ "homeboy", it's just very apparent via his actions both on and off the court. He is just in a perfect spot and they are winning a lot. As they say winning cures all. Don't exactly understand how I'm in for a world of hurt lol??? I just think he's a psychopath, simple as that and his antics will hurt the team at some point. You said yourself he had a big part in your team losing last year's finals because he is crazy and can't control himself. But whatever, you're always right so no point in arguing with you.
Lmao he's not "psychotic" you ****ing weirdo. He's a loud mouth in his mid 20's with a temper. He's also a significant reason for the Warriors success and a legitimate top 10 all around player in the world. As I already said, he'd have to get far worse for it to be something where they were taking trade calls.

Vee-Rex
10-22-2016, 08:35 PM
Haha! When I responded, I predicted someone would reply with this stupid response. There have been numerous players throughout the years who have had a follow through kick after shooting. I 100% believe the Green kick on Adams was intentional, but suspending players for a flailing leg with no contact is not the same as suspending a player who throws an intentional punch that does not connect. They are no where near the same thing. C'mon.

Do you believe there should be some sort of disciplinary measure taken at all? I mean, if not, then Green (or anyone else) is allowed to flail/kick as much as they want, right? What stops the entire league from doing this?

Crabbe looked visibly upset and for good reason. I've played basketball all my life and if someone was known to kick and continued to kick we'd have some serious problems.

The argument for intent is irrelevant. The fact of the matter is - it's a non-basketball move that causes issues with players defending and can cause injury (Steven Adams suffered a groin injury because of that kick).

As I posted in my link - the NBA has made it known that they will crack down on that from any/every player. Green has to stop or it'll be very problematic.

tredigs
10-22-2016, 08:35 PM
Haha! When I responded, I predicted someone would reply with this stupid response. There have been numerous players throughout the years who have had a follow through kick after shooting. I 100% believe the Green kick on Adams was intentional, but suspending players for a flailing leg with no contact is not the same as suspending a player who throws an intentional punch that does not connect. They are no where near the same thing. C'mon.
Not to mention that Vine of Draymond that was going around showing him do that leg kick in 2 dozen different scenarios, with or without a player near him.

Saddletramp
10-22-2016, 09:06 PM
Haha! When I responded, I predicted someone would reply with this stupid response. There have been numerous players throughout the years who have had a follow through kick after shooting. I 100% believe the Green kick on Adams was intentional, but suspending players for a flailing leg with no contact is not the same as suspending a player who throws an intentional punch that does not connect. They are no where near the same thing. C'mon.

I was going to respond to this garbage but Vee Rex beat me to it. What a stupid question followed by a stupid response to the answer given.
C'mon. Actually wait, go away.

Saddletramp
10-22-2016, 09:10 PM
Not to mention that Vine of Draymond that was going around showing him do that leg kick in 2 dozen different scenarios, with or without a player near him.

Oh, in that case, let him kick whenever he wants. Hope they teach that in the basketball camps. "As long as you do it a lot, you can just say it's your thing. They'll have to allow it!"

Jokers be jokin' or homers be homin'.

Allphakenny1
10-22-2016, 09:40 PM
Do you believe there should be some sort of disciplinary measure taken at all? I mean, if not, then Green (or anyone else) is allowed to flail/kick as much as they want, right? What stops the entire league from doing this?

Crabbe looked visibly upset and for good reason. I've played basketball all my life and if someone was known to kick and continued to kick we'd have some serious problems.

The argument for intent is irrelevant. The fact of the matter is - it's a non-basketball move that causes issues with players defending and can cause injury (Steven Adams suffered a groin injury because of that kick).

As I posted in my link - the NBA has made it known that they will crack down on that from any/every player. Green has to stop or it'll be very problematic.

So whenever a players are or leg flails out, regardless of contact, suspend that player? I think that is a bit extreme.

Allphakenny1
10-22-2016, 09:42 PM
I was going to respond to this garbage but Vee Rex beat me to it. What a stupid question followed by a stupid response to the answer given.
C'mon. Actually wait, go away.

You are a known Warriors hater on this site who ends to lose all logic when it comes to this team so why should anyone take you serious? You said you were going to respond, but you did not because you knew your response would have zero logic. My guess is you will now go away, well if you have any common sense you will.

Saddletramp
10-22-2016, 10:59 PM
You are a known Warriors hater on this site who ends to lose all logic when it comes to this team so why should anyone take you serious? You said you were going to respond, but you did not because you knew your response would have zero logic. My guess is you will now go away, well if you have any common sense you will.

I was going to basically say what Vee Rex said. Why should I waste time on typing (and further....on you) when what I wanted to say was already said?

Why stop at kicks? Some guys used to throw their elbows wide when they'd come down with rebounds but that got heavily punished. So guess what? Guys stopped doing it all the time. It's funny how people start learning to control themselves when they start getting reprimanded for their dubious behavior.


And a known homer is calling out a known hater. Cool. Take off Nut Shot Dray and Weak Heart Durant and they're a pretty likable team. Actually, Klay's kind of a douche and a choker, Curry showboats too much, Iguodala gave up team secrets then signed with the team he told them to and Kerr has implemented the moving screens into the system that gets everyone so open. So yeah, on second thought, they're a bunch of twats.


Also, people with common sense would've figured out what "I was going to respond to this garbage but Vee Rex beat me to it" means. Ask someone, apparently.


Meh.

Allphakenny1
10-22-2016, 11:19 PM
I was going to basically say what Vee Rex said. Why should I waste time on typing (and further....on you) when what I wanted to say was already said?

Why stop at kicks? Some guys used to throw their elbows wide when they'd come down with rebounds but that got heavily punished. So guess what? Guys stopped doing it all the time. It's funny how people start learning to control themselves when they start getting reprimanded for their dubious behavior.


And a known homer is calling out a known hater. Cool. Take off Nut Shot Dray and Weak Heart Durant and they're a pretty likable team. Actually, Klay's kind of a douche and a choker, Curry showboats too much, Iguodala gave up team secrets then signed with the team he told them to and Kerr has implemented the moving screens into the system that gets everyone so open. So yeah, on second thought, they're a bunch of twats.


Also, people with common sense would've figured out what "I was going to respond to this garbage but Vee Rex beat me to it" means. Ask someone, apparently.


Meh.

I am not one to make thing personal here, but you clearly are, so here goes.

If you think a leg flail is the worst thing a person could do and should be cracked down on, so be it. I think flopping is much worse for the game and your best player is the poster child for that. Flopping hurts the game much more than a leg flail with no contact, so as long as you agree that Harden should be suspended for his BS every time he does it, then we can actually agree. You act like you are standing for something, but it is just because it is against your most hated team. Your team was much more hated as a potential contender than the Warriors because they are much less likable. Now no one cares because they have no chance at winning a championship.

BTW, I responded to Vee Rex. At least he had the courage to speak up, you just *****ed out.

Meh.

Saddletramp
10-22-2016, 11:42 PM
I am not one to make thing personal here, but you clearly are, so here goes.

I'm not the one that said:
"Haha when I responded I predicted someone would reply with this stupid response."
For someone that talks about common sense.......


If you think a leg flail is the worst thing a person could do and should be cracked down on, so be it. I think flopping is much worse for the game

The leg flail IS a flop, smart guy.


and your best player is the poster child for that. Flopping hurts the game much more than a leg flail with no contact, so as long as you agree that Harden should be suspended for his BS every time he does it, then we can actually agree.

Oh yeah, Harden gets away with some calls, no question. But running in for a layup with your hands and ball out and getting slapped on the arm/wrist isn't a flop. It's a foul. I'm surprised more people don't do it. They'd cradle the ball like it's a football until the last second whereas Harden knows he'll be swiped at more often than not. Kerr figured it out and told his guys to stop swiping at the ball. Sometimes Harden got the layup, sometimes he didn't. But he didn't get to the line as much on those plays and it didn't slow the game down as much. Kudos to Kerr and I hope no one else figures it out, as simple as it is.


You act like you are standing for something, but it is just because it is against your most hated team. Your team was much more hated as a potential contender than the Warriors because they are much less unlikable. Now no one cares because they have no chance at winning a championship.

Ahh, yes. They're not liked because Harden said "these guys aren't even that good" to pump up his guys and that "most of our team is filled with role players" because they are. Ahh yes, pep rally talk and serious quotes. Nothing worse than that stuff. Tanking, Green's thuggery, Weak Heart KD, Loose Lips Iggy, Just Offense Line Block the Defense Kerr, Turn With Your Hands Up Before The Make Curry, yeah, those are totally par for the course for liked teams.


BTW, I responded to Vee Rex. At least he had the courage to speak up, you just *****ed out.

Meh.

I don't think you understand something so simplistic as "I co-sign on what Vee Rex just said" so I'm going to just let it be. Sometimes conversations on this website are downright embarrassing to be a part of.

Allphakenny1
10-23-2016, 12:33 AM
I'm not the one that said:
"Haha when I responded I predicted someone would reply with this stupid response."
For someone that talks about common sense.......



The leg flail IS a flop, smart guy.



Oh yeah, Harden gets away with some calls, no question. But running in for a layup with your hands and ball out and getting slapped on the arm/wrist isn't a flop. It's a foul. I'm surprised more people don't do it. They'd cradle the ball like it's a football until the last second whereas Harden knows he'll be swiped at more often than not. Kerr figured it out and told his guys to stop swiping at the ball. Sometimes Harden got the layup, sometimes he didn't. But he didn't get to the line as much on those plays and it didn't slow the game down as much. Kudos to Kerr and I hope no one else figures it out, as simple as it is.



Ahh, yes. They're not liked because Harden said "these guys aren't even that good" to pump up his guys and that "most of our team is filled with role players" because they are. Ahh yes, pep rally talk and serious quotes. Nothing worse than that stuff. Tanking, Green's thuggery, Weak Heart KD, Loose Lips Iggy, Just Offense Line Block the Defense Kerr, Turn With Your Hands Up Before The Make Curry, yeah, those are totally par for the course for liked teams.



I don't think you understand something so simplistic as "I co-sign on what Vee Rex just said" so I'm going to just let it be. Sometimes conversations on this website are downright embarrassing to be a part of.

1. So you admit you responded to my quote with ill intentions. I did not start this, you did.

2 I do not agree with the leg flail, but Harden gets a ton of undeserved free throws from flopping. Green gets no free throws from the leg flail, all he gets is hate. Maybe Malone and Miller got free throws from the same thing, but Green gets flagrant foul points so why are you so mad at him.

3. What is the point in bringing up the fact that you are such a Warriors hater. I already made that statement. In fact, thanks for proving that fact for me. It helps to point out why no one should take your opinion serious. The worst part is pointing out that The Nuggets wanted to injure Curry because that is the only way they could beat the Warriors when they were the favorites and Iggy wanted to try to beat them straight up. You call him out for not being the bad guy and cheat his way to victory. This shows what kind of person you are.

4. If anyone should be embarrassed, it is you. You have tried to spew your "Donald Trump" hate with zero logic and have been absolutely owned tonight. Get some rest and wake up with a clearer head in the morning. I do not need an apology, just educating you is enough.

Aust
10-23-2016, 12:59 AM
I have no idea what a player like Green could fetch in a trade. I would assume they would want a C? Or a PF..?

Saddletramp
10-23-2016, 01:23 AM
1. So you admit you responded to my quote with ill intentions. I did not start this, you did.

No, You asked a question, I responded. You threw out that you "predicted" a "stupid response". Classy.


2 I do not agree with the leg flail, but Harden gets a ton of undeserved free throws from flopping. Green gets no free throws from the leg flail, all he gets is hate. Maybe Malone and Miller got free throws from the same thing, but Green gets flagrant foul points so why are you so mad at him.

I know you think most/all of the calls against Harden are because if his flopping. This is simply not true. . And Green gets hate because he's performing a little *****/thug move. And Green's leg kicks are worse than those guy's. Miller was trying to draw contact to go to the line. Green is kicking hard knowing there's a crotch right where his foot is kicking up to. It's a dirty move and he's a ***** for doing it.


3. What is the point in bringing up the fact that you are such a Warriors hater. I already made that statement. In fact, thanks for proving that fact for me. It helps to point out why no one should take your opinion serious.

You're the one that brought it up, smart guy. I was actually explaining how besides Green and Durant's heart, I don't hate them. Then I started remembering other ****** things about that team. Jogged my memory. Also, saying that someone shouldn't be taken seriously is pretty personal coming from someone who doesn't "make things personal". Then again, you didn't understand it earlier when I referenced it so why should you understand it now.


The worst part is pointing out that The Nuggets wanted to injure Curry because that is the only way they could beat the Warriors when they were the favorites and Iggy wanted to try to beat them straight up. You call him out for not being the bad guy and cheat his way to victory. This shows what kind of person you are.

So now he's ok with Green rupturing testicles? What a ****ing hypocrite. Wonder what changed? A middle of the pack team vrs a legit contender. And you're defending it now but not when te Nuggets were playing rougher? Showing some more hypocrisy, I see.


4. If anyone should be embarrassed, it is you. You have tried to spew your "Donald Trump" hate with zero logic and have been absolutely owned tonight. Get some rest and wake up with a clearer head in the morning. I do not need an apology, just educating you is enough.

What the hell are you talking about? "Donald Trump" hate? Lol, kid. If you only knew. "Owned?" Double lol. Apology for what? Educating?

Like I said before, embarrassing.
.

tredigs
10-23-2016, 01:24 AM
Lmao Inlove where this thread has gone. Judging by you fellas, Reggie Miller should have just been outright ejected from every game, yes?

Saddletramp
10-23-2016, 01:32 AM
Lmao Inlove where this thread has gone. Judging by you fellas, Reggie Miller should have just been outright ejected from every game, yes?

I edited up there to add that Miller used to kick to draw contact so he'd fall and it would appear as he'd been fouled. It was pretty shady. But Miller's kickout was more of a lifting of the leg, Green's is more of a toe punch up. There's a big difference. One should be an offensive foul, the other is a flagrant.



Edit: Oh, you were making fun of Kenny up there. Believe me, he's doing a pretty good job at that on his own without your help.

JAZZNC
10-23-2016, 10:45 AM
Lmao he's not "psychotic" you ****ing weirdo. He's a loud mouth in his mid 20's with a temper. He's also a significant reason for the Warriors success and a legitimate top 10 all around player in the world. As I already said, he'd have to get far worse for it to be something where they were taking trade calls.
Resorting to name calling now, sure hope you handle differences in opinion better in real life than you do on the internet. Stay classy tredigs, lmao.

JAZZNC
10-23-2016, 10:47 AM
So if I said every team needs a PG, I guess that means only championship teams need them. Simple indeed.

If you can't understand the difference in those 2 statements I don't know what to tell you man. You should just stop.

Vee-Rex
10-23-2016, 11:01 AM
So whenever a players are or leg flails out, regardless of contact, suspend that player? I think that is a bit extreme.

Where in my post did I say suspension?

I'm asking you if you believe that a player using a kicking motion should have the possibility of being disciplined or if the NBA should just completely ignore it.

Vee-Rex
10-23-2016, 11:15 AM
Also, the deflecting has gotten out of hand.

"Green should be disciplined for that kick."

"Westbrook and others do it too!!!!"

"Kicking out a foot is unsportsmanlike and can cause injury so maybe the NBA should examine these situations and assess a tech or flagrant or fine or suspension (for repeat offenses)."

"Flopping is bad too!!!"

Come on, guys.

tredigs
10-23-2016, 11:40 AM
Resorting to name calling now, sure hope you handle differences in opinion better in real life than you do on the internet. Stay classy tredigs, lmao.

"Name calling" lol. Oh 2016. You're calling a player "psychotic" (like legitimately feel he needs to be institutionalized it appears) who shows exactly zero signs of anything remotely close to that. You're either a troll or delusional. I settled in the middle at a more tame "weirdo".

Allphakenny1
10-23-2016, 11:49 AM
No, You asked a question, I responded. You threw out that you "predicted" a "stupid response". Classy.



I know you think most/all of the calls against Harden are because if his flopping. This is simply not true. . And Green gets hate because he's performing a little *****/thug move. And Green's leg kicks are worse than those guy's. Miller was trying to draw contact to go to the line. Green is kicking hard knowing there's a crotch right where his foot is kicking up to. It's a dirty move and he's a ***** for doing it.



You're the one that brought it up, smart guy. I was actually explaining how besides Green and Durant's heart, I don't hate them. Then I started remembering other ****** things about that team. Jogged my memory. Also, saying that someone shouldn't be taken seriously is pretty personal coming from someone who doesn't "make things personal". Then again, you didn't understand it earlier when I referenced it so why should you understand it now.



So now he's ok with Green rupturing testicles? What a ****ing hypocrite. Wonder what changed? A middle of the pack team vrs a legit contender. And you're defending it now but not when te Nuggets were playing rougher? Showing some more hypocrisy, I see.



What the hell are you talking about? "Donald Trump" hate? Lol, kid. If you only knew. "Owned?" Double lol. Apology for what? Educating?

Like I said before, embarrassing.
.

This will be my last response because this **** is too tiring. You keep arguing against me by saying things that I never said. I did not defend Green's actions last year. In fact, I stated he deserved to be suspended. So you calling me a hypocrite there just shows your basic lack of understanding. All I said about Green is that this one leg flail/kick against the Blazers that drew zero contact should not result in a suspension. This is what got you so angry and somehow you twisted it into something it was not. The only embarrassing part for me is that I took the bait for so long.

Allphakenny1
10-23-2016, 11:53 AM
Where in my post did I say suspension?

I'm asking you if you believe that a player using a kicking motion should have the possibility of being disciplined or if the NBA should just completely ignore it.

Suspension was brought up by a few people on here, that is what I responded to. I said over and over again the Green deserved what he got for the kick on Adams last year so obviously I believe disciplinary action could happen. I just do not believe this incident with no contact deserves a suspension like others have said.

valade16
10-23-2016, 12:20 PM
Leg kicking that didn't hit anyone? In this case sure, but the only reason we're talking about this is because he has a history of leg kicking that did hit people.

5ass
10-23-2016, 01:00 PM
Lmao Inlove where this thread has gone. Judging by you fellas, Reggie Miller should have just been outright ejected from every game, yes?

No. The rules change, and players adjust. Reggie would've learned to stop kicking. You punish Green and he'll learn too.

FlashBolt
10-23-2016, 02:42 PM
This will be my last response because this **** is too tiring. You keep arguing against me by saying things that I never said. I did not defend Green's actions last year. In fact, I stated he deserved to be suspended. So you calling me a hypocrite there just shows your basic lack of understanding. All I said about Green is that this one leg flail/kick against the Blazers that drew zero contact should not result in a suspension. This is what got you so angry and somehow you twisted it into something it was not. The only embarrassing part for me is that I took the bait for so long.

Yes it should considering he's been warned multiple times about it. The severity of it should only get worse after every offence. When you get stopped for DUI, it gets worse the 2nd time you're caught. This is the same thing in that Draymond really needs to stop flailing/kicking his leg out. Intentional or not, he knows it's not okay to do it so why doesn't he stop? Does he not care? I'm guessing that's the issue.

Saddletramp
10-23-2016, 07:42 PM
This will be my last response because this **** is too tiring. You keep arguing against me by saying things that I never said. I did not defend Green's actions last year. In fact, I stated he deserved to be suspended. So you calling me a hypocrite there just shows your basic lack of understanding. All I said about Green is that this one leg flail/kick against the Blazers that drew zero contact should not result in a suspension. This is what got you so angry and somehow you twisted it into something it was not. The only embarrassing part for me is that I took the bait for so long.

1. What did I say that you said that you never said?

2. We're not talking about last year and I don't know what you were saying then so what are you talking about? Oh, right, now you're done responding. Cool.

3. So he can kick and nothing's wrong as long as he doesn't connect? That's just awful logic. If you're defending him and you know he can flail to draw contact and kick at will, you're just supposed to be ok with that? And the end result will either be that he kicks you (potentially injuring you) and gets a foul called on him or he misses and clears space, so it'll still be in the back of your mind that he's willing to do it. It's a dirty mind game. Mind games are great but not like that.

Also, it's only a matter of time before guys just either cheap shot him for it or it leads to a fight, which is what almost happened against the Blazers.

4. How am I "angry"? Lol, bro. How did I twist it? You want him to be able to get away with kicking as long as he doesn't draw contact. That's silly. And that's what I told you.

This whole subject is dumb. Green has to stop doing these kicks, whether they connect or not. It's a dirty play. End of story.

warfelg
10-23-2016, 08:12 PM
I would keep Green, because he's the X-factor that makes the engine go.

Klay, although a great shooter, can have his production replicated by 2-3 guys.

Scoots
10-24-2016, 09:21 AM
You know how a lot of players make a fist and swing their arm in a roundhouse like motion to celebrate? It's ignored, but if a players face (or nuts) were there they would get in trouble :)

Green is a tool no doubt, but saying that ANY action by any player that is a solo action with no contact is "a dirty play" is a step too far.

MTar786
10-24-2016, 09:31 AM
Klay is a scorer with good defense. Remember when some of you thought he was better than Harden? Klay has choked up two Finals in a row.. this dude gets way too much credit. What's the difference between Reddick and Klay? Not really much, tbh.

well, he is better than harden

valade16
10-24-2016, 12:27 PM
You know how a lot of players make a fist and swing their arm in a roundhouse like motion to celebrate? It's ignored, but if a players face (or nuts) were there they would get in trouble :)

Green is a tool no doubt, but saying that ANY action by any player that is a solo action with no contact is "a dirty play" is a step too far.

So he's celebratory kicking people in the nuts?

FlashBolt
10-24-2016, 01:54 PM
Yes, you are a dirty player if you continue hitting people where no man should be hit even after numerous suspensions/technical/fines. It's pretty clear Draymond hasn't made any adjustments to how he lands after a jump. I'm hoping for the day he gets severely injured as a result of his stupid kicking. Either that or the dude should get suspended in the NBA Finals again.

tredigs
10-24-2016, 02:02 PM
Here's to hoping Green goes Ron Artest and just smashes Kawhi flush in the nuts prior to tip-off on opening night. Bring some extra intrigue to the team and feed the trolls. Win win. Also, it will create a scenario that actually matches the ferocity of what is being talked about concerning him and kick-gate over here.

kdspurman
10-24-2016, 02:02 PM
So he's celebratory kicking people in the nuts?

Yea that's not a good comparison lol. He is essentially flopping (?) it seems he does it most when he gets stripped or fouled. Floppers are supposed to be penalized, (though the league has done a poor job of that). He should be too...

Maybe slap with a T or a fine if he misses contact, and suspend if he does make contact

tredigs
10-24-2016, 02:06 PM
Looking forward to the endless vines of Draymond Green this season at any point that his foot reaches 36" above the hardwood during their 40 point victories and the susbsequent cries for suspension and potential jail time.

Saddletramp
10-24-2016, 02:06 PM
You know how a lot of players make a fist and swing their arm in a roundhouse like motion to celebrate? It's ignored, but if a players face (or nuts) were there they would get in trouble :)

Green is a tool no doubt, but saying that ANY action by any player that is a solo action with no contact is "a dirty play" is a step too far.

You cannot be serious.

valade16
10-24-2016, 04:26 PM
Looking forward to the endless vines of Draymond Green this season at any point that his foot reaches 36" above the hardwood during their 40 point victories and the susbsequent cries for suspension and potential jail time.

Well when you manage to kick people in the nuts more in one season than every NBA player combined over the last 5 seasons, that will happen.

Hawkeye15
10-24-2016, 04:50 PM
You know how a lot of players make a fist and swing their arm in a roundhouse like motion to celebrate? It's ignored, but if a players face (or nuts) were there they would get in trouble :)

Green is a tool no doubt, but saying that ANY action by any player that is a solo action with no contact is "a dirty play" is a step too far.

for today's NBA, Green is dirty

Scoots
10-24-2016, 06:14 PM
So he's celebratory kicking people in the nuts?

No, the point is that swinging a fist and not hitting anybody is not dirty, swinging a fist and hitting someone is. Kicking your leg out and hitting nothing is not dirty.

Scoots
10-24-2016, 06:25 PM
You cannot be serious.

Yes. A lot of players legs scissor kick. It should only be a penalty if there is inappropriate contact.

People complain all the time about how soft the game is getting but people here also want to regulate body motions as flagrant fouls with automatic suspensions.

What Green did was at most, and it's a long way from reasonable to there, a technical.

Green has to realize he's under the microscope and protect himself, but people calling for his suspension is just nuts :)

Vee-Rex
10-24-2016, 06:48 PM
I say throw a T @ anyone that does any extreme flailing of a limb. Review it on a case by case basis. I bold the extreme, because sometimes a limb goes out based on momentum (like how Green kicked Kyrie in the final seconds of game 7 in the finals after falling on the ground from fouling LeBron). That sort of thing happens. Kyrie helped him up.

But if a guy is gets stripped and his leg flies up to the ceiling of the arena... THAT's extreme. If it connects, review it and determine if it's a flagrant/flagrant2. If it doesn't connect, then T him up if appropriate.

People are screaming suspension just because of Green's history. While suspending him over that kick @ Crabbe would be absurd, you guys can't sit here and act like Green has been all sunshine and rainbows and doesn't deserve the ire and intolerance from those watching him.

Saddletramp
10-24-2016, 08:26 PM
No, the point is that swinging a fist and not hitting anybody is not dirty, swinging a fist and hitting someone is. Kicking your leg out and hitting nothing is not dirty.

Again, you can't be serious. Throwing a celebratory punch into the air not directed at anyone because you are happy/mad is ****ING MILES away from kicking up when you're driving/shooting/flopping for a call and inches/a foot or two away from your defender. ****ing miles.


It's not the kick or the punch that's in question, it's the kick/punch with the proximity/engagement with another player.

What the hell is going on around here? I realize we all have a little homer in us but this is the craziest discussion I've ever been a part of here. It's ridiculous.

valade16
10-24-2016, 08:53 PM
No, the point is that swinging a fist and not hitting anybody is not dirty, swinging a fist and hitting someone is. Kicking your leg out and hitting nothing is not dirty.

Swinging a fist with the intention of hitting someone is dirty regardless of if it connects or not. No?

jason
10-24-2016, 10:06 PM
Green really needs to control himself.. He knows hes under a microscope since the incident.

sixer04fan
10-24-2016, 10:09 PM
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/17790252/golden-state-draymond-green-problem

Probably nothing but if one of them had to be traded who you move? Article mentions Green and Klay don't get along. Also Kerr hates Green. All in all if they win rings doesn't matter who hates who. Just speculation.

Hopefully Klay. And hopefully they trade him to the Sixers lol

FlashBolt
10-24-2016, 11:08 PM
The problem lies when you have to differentiate between intentional or unintentional. You're just allowing Green to get away with this nonsense every time they stay lenient. Be honest here, how many times has he done this the past year? Twenty? Thirty? Can Metta World Peace continue swinging his elbow and claim it was unintentional because he's been swinging his elbow for years? That's not how it works. It's not a basketball play so it should be prevented before it becomes an issue. Green knows better at this point.

Scoots
10-25-2016, 07:48 AM
The problem lies when you have to differentiate between intentional or unintentional. You're just allowing Green to get away with this nonsense every time they stay lenient. Be honest here, how many times has he done this the past year? Twenty? Thirty? Can Metta World Peace continue swinging his elbow and claim it was unintentional because he's been swinging his elbow for years? That's not how it works. It's not a basketball play so it should be prevented before it becomes an issue. Green knows better at this point.

This.

I've consistently said Green is out of control and needs to get control of himself, but people calling for his suspension for a wild flail are going a step too far. I don't love or hate any professional athletes, I realize I'm watching expensive entertainers ... some people are too invested.

Hawkeye15
10-25-2016, 12:59 PM
I say throw a T @ anyone that does any extreme flailing of a limb. Review it on a case by case basis. I bold the extreme, because sometimes a limb goes out based on momentum (like how Green kicked Kyrie in the final seconds of game 7 in the finals after falling on the ground from fouling LeBron). That sort of thing happens. Kyrie helped him up.

But if a guy is gets stripped and his leg flies up to the ceiling of the arena... THAT's extreme. If it connects, review it and determine if it's a flagrant/flagrant2. If it doesn't connect, then T him up if appropriate.

People are screaming suspension just because of Green's history. While suspending him over that kick @ Crabbe would be absurd, you guys can't sit here and act like Green has been all sunshine and rainbows and doesn't deserve the ire and intolerance from those watching him.

agree with every word

IKnowHoops
10-25-2016, 01:24 PM
I edited up there to add that Miller used to kick to draw contact so he'd fall and it would appear as he'd been fouled. It was pretty shady. But Miller's kickout was more of a lifting of the leg, Green's is more of a toe punch up. There's a big difference. One should be an offensive foul, the other is a flagrant.



Edit: Oh, you were making fun of Kenny up there. Believe me, he's doing a pretty good job at that on his own without your help.

I agree. Reggie left the leg out there, Dray is trying to put the ball threw the uprights from 50 yards out. Dray gets no benefit of doubt. I am convinced his leg kick is a split second tantrum where he looses his cool when a play doesn't go his way. Reggie was cool and level headed plotting with that leg trying to nonchalantly keep it in play to get hit by another player. Nobody every go hurt by his foot. Even Jordan kind of left the leg out there a little. I know that was his shot but it was out there, but again, it wasn't to hurt, it was kind of like his balance. When Dray's leg rises, he is in a fowl mood.

kdspurman
10-25-2016, 01:42 PM
I agree. Reggie left the leg out there, Dray is trying to put the ball threw the uprights from 50 yards out. Dray gets no benefit of doubt. I am convinced his leg kick is a split second tantrum where he looses his cool when a play doesn't go his way. Reggie was cool and level headed plotting with that leg trying to nonchalantly keep it in play to get hit by another player. Nobody every go hurt by his foot. Even Jordan kind of left the leg out there a little. I know that was his shot but it was out there, but again, it wasn't to hurt, it was kind of like his balance. When Dray's leg rises, he is in a fowl mood.

Yup. Sums up how I feel when people bring up Reggie

FlashBolt
10-25-2016, 01:48 PM
Suspension for multiple abuse and refusal to stop doing so. When does it stop? When someone gets their nuts clipped and they have to sit their player? C'mon. It's way overdue for him to STOP. END OF.

R!kSm!tz
10-25-2016, 01:58 PM
I don't know why people are debating this. Green kicking his leg up is dirty and now he does it every chance he gets to try and back up his claim that he always does it. I've played ball for years and I'm sure many in here have, I've never once kicked my leg up as high as I could in the air because of a foul. That's just a BS excuse from a dirty player.

Saddletramp
10-25-2016, 02:29 PM
I agree. Reggie left the leg out there, Dray is trying to put the ball threw the uprights from 50 yards out. Dray gets no benefit of doubt. I am convinced his leg kick is a split second tantrum where he looses his cool when a play doesn't go his way. Reggie was cool and level headed plotting with that leg trying to nonchalantly keep it in play to get hit by another player. Nobody every go hurt by his foot. Even Jordan kind of left the leg out there a little. I know that was his shot but it was out there, but again, it wasn't to hurt, it was kind of like his balance. When Dray's leg rises, he is in a fowl mood.

Exactly, two different things.

IKnowHoops
10-25-2016, 02:56 PM
Where in my post did I say suspension?

I'm asking you if you believe that a player using a kicking motion should have the possibility of being disciplined or if the NBA should just completely ignore it.

I definitely think he needs to be suspended for it. Just like Kobe needed to get suspended for his back hands. I don't know how many time ignoble got slapped in the face. That ish hurts. If you have kicked 4-5 people in the balls and you are are a known light weight goon/dirty player then the next one should be a suspension. I'm all for 1st, 2nd, and even 3rd chances, but he is now a proven ball smasher...and so what because it might be on accident (its not) its OK? Even if it was 100% on accident, he would have to change his ways if it means guys keep getting there balls smashed. Next time it happens, fine and 1-2 game suspension if I get to make the decision.

IKnowHoops
10-25-2016, 03:14 PM
So he's celebratory kicking people in the nuts?

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL...my thoughts exactly!

IKnowHoops
10-25-2016, 03:16 PM
No, the point is that swinging a fist and not hitting anybody is not dirty, swinging a fist and hitting someone is. Kicking your leg out and hitting nothing is not dirty.

People have been suspended for for swinging and missing with there punch. You don't have to make contact to get thrown out of the game. But like you said, if it was in a celebratory manor, it would be all good. So that is the point actually.

IKnowHoops
10-25-2016, 03:19 PM
Here's to hoping Green goes Ron Artest and just smashes Kawhi flush in the nuts prior to tip-off on opening night. Bring some extra intrigue to the team and feed the trolls. Win win. Also, it will create a scenario that actually matches the ferocity of what is being talked about concerning him and kick-gate over here.


Looking forward to the endless vines of Draymond Green this season at any point that his foot reaches 36" above the hardwood during their 40 point victories and the susbsequent cries for suspension and potential jail time.

Tre be like, "My team is a beast...I ain't worried bout nothin...I got jokes..."

IKnowHoops
10-25-2016, 03:28 PM
Yes. A lot of players legs scissor kick. It should only be a penalty if there is inappropriate contact.

People complain all the time about how soft the game is getting but people here also want to regulate body motions as flagrant fouls with automatic suspensions.

What Green did was at most, and it's a long way from reasonable to there, a technical.

Green has to realize he's under the microscope and protect himself, but people calling for his suspension is just nuts :)

I really couldn't disagree more. First, his scissor kick is the only one that is putting guys down. How come nobody else ruptures sacks. Why is green the only one? Also Green is a proven -----. We know this now. There is no doubt. He needs to stop bringing his leg up so high, hard and fast or get suspended...simple as that. Its not natural...its a reaction to a play not going his way. Its like his body is screaming f--k!, when he gets ripped or blocked. He is having a split second tantrum and that is why his leg fires up like that. It doesn't help his shot, its not for balance, its an explosion of displeasure.

kdspurman
10-27-2016, 02:06 PM
No i'm not calling for a suspension or death penalty, but seriously why does he do this?

https://streamable.com/um2f

He got himself tangled up with a PG in Tony Parker lol He's really gotta get that under control

cmellofan15
10-27-2016, 04:20 PM
No i'm not calling for a suspension or death penalty, but seriously why does he do this?

https://streamable.com/um2f

He got himself tangled up with a PG in Tony Parker lol He's really gotta get that under control

How dare you point that out. You must just be a hater, Draymond isn't some kind of habitual nut kicker..only a classless hater would imply such. /s

tredigs
10-27-2016, 04:32 PM
No i'm not calling for a suspension or death penalty, but seriously why does he do this?

https://streamable.com/um2f

He got himself tangled up with a PG in Tony Parker lol He's really gotta get that under control

Lmao so he lifted his leg up approximately 2 feet away from Tony Parker going the other direction in an attempt to sell a call. In case you guys have not realized this by now, it is an instinctive way that he moves his body when he's trying to sell a foul. It's not going to change. But again, please feel free to post each instance, it's must-see TV.

Also, in case you guys have also not realized, it's not a phenomena exclusive to Draymond Green. The newest darling of the NBA Russell Westbrook also has a penchant for the leg-kick when trying to sell contact (and more often than not more egregious and blatant than Draymond. Just a few examples that you might (not... apparently) remember KDSpurman:

https://gfycat.com/UnacceptableSelfishElephant
https://gfycat.com/FairImpoliteIberianmole
https://gfycat.com/CanineActiveFattaileddunnart

kdspurman
10-27-2016, 04:39 PM
Lmao so he lifted his leg up approximately 2 feet away from Tony Parker going the other direction in an attempt to sell a call. In case you guys have not realized this by now, it is an instinctive way that he moves his body when he's trying to sell a foul. It's not going to change. But again, please feel free to post each instance, it's must-see TV.

Also, in case you guys have also not realized, it's not a phenomena exclusive to Draymond Green. The newest darling of the NBA Russell Westbrook also has a penchant for the leg-kick when trying to sell contact (and more often than not more egregious and blatant than Draymond. Just a few examples that you might (not... apparently) remember KDSpurman:

https://gfycat.com/UnacceptableSelfishElephant
https://gfycat.com/FairImpoliteIberianmole
https://gfycat.com/CanineActiveFattaileddunnart

I understand why you get defensive, but pointing out another guy who does it doens't some how make Draymond's actions OK. Westy should be penalized for that too. Again, I made sure to say I'm not calling for a suspension or death penalty....

And Draymond did it on the biggest stages, on the team that has been in the spotlight the last 2 years. Thinking it won't be scrutinized or expecting people to just ignore it seems like the wrong approach. The fact is, he will likely make contact with someone again, or someone will pretend they got kicked by him and he'll be penalized...

He's a guy that gets hot-headed easily. Who's to say he doesn't have this "instinctive" kick in a way to later justify when he does it out of frustration? All I said was he's gotta get that under control. As a Warriors fan, I'd think you'd agree with that

kdspurman
10-27-2016, 04:39 PM
How dare you point that out. You must just be a hater, Draymond isn't some kind of habitual nut kicker..only a classless hater would imply such. /s

Silly me :rolleyes:

tredigs
10-27-2016, 04:48 PM
I understand why you get defensive, but pointing out another guy who does it doens't some how make Draymond's actions OK. Westy should be penalized for that too. Again, I made sure to say I'm not calling for a suspension or death penalty....

And Draymond did it on the biggest stages, on the team that has been in the spotlight the last 2 years. Thinking it won't be scrutinized or expecting people to just ignore it seems like the wrong approach. The fact is, he will likely make contact with someone again, or someone will pretend they got kicked by him and he'll be penalized...

He's a guy that gets hot-headed easily. Who's to say he doesn't have this "instinctive" kick in a way to later justify when he does it out of frustration? All I said was he's gotta get that under control. As a Warriors fan, I'd think you'd agree with that
It's not something that concerns me in the least, what-so-ever, other than the fact that it is such a pathetically big deal. His personality in general? Yes, that is a much deeper and more relevant topic that I am more than willing to discuss and delve into. Hint: Him flexing/screaming after the play and receiving a T for it and after the game stating "that's who I am, I'm going to do the same thing after the next dunk" is much more of a real issue that actually matters than you showing me a stupid Vine (RIP) of him lifting his leg innocuously within 3 feet of another player (again, him flexing after a dunk is NOTHING obviously, but for him to willingly state he will do something that hurts his team IS in fact an issue). Hope that clears up my take on the Draymond issue. It's not about being "defensive", it's about me thinking you guys are being pathetically overbearing in your concern over something so petty.

Btw, speaking of "doing it on the biggest of stages", those of Westbrook were all playoff games in ultra-heated high-leverage situations against another top contender (your team mind you). You just showed me a vine of G1 of the regular season. I can show you similar gifs of a dozen different players (granted harder to find, as is evidenced nobody cares about anybody else doing this other than Green).

kdspurman
10-27-2016, 04:57 PM
It's not something that concerns me in the least, what-so-ever, other than the fact that it is such a pathetically big deal. His personality in general? Yes, that is a much deeper and more relevant topic that I am more than willing to discuss and delve into. Hint: Him flexing/screaming after the play and receiving a T for it and after the game stating "that's who I am, I'm going to do the same thing after the next dunk" is much more of a real issue that actually matters than you showing me a stupid Vine (RIP) of him lifting his leg innocuously within 3 feet of another player (again, him flexing after a dunk is NOTHING obviously, but for him to willingly state he will do something that hurts his team IS in fact an issue). Hope that clears up my take on the Draymond issue. It's not about being "defensive", it's about me thinking you guys are being pathetically overbearing in your concern over something so petty.

Btw, speaking of "doing it on the biggest of stages", those of Westbrook were all playoff games in ultra-heated high-leverage situations against another top contender (your team mind you). You just showed me a vine of G1 of the regular season. I can show you similar gifs of a dozen different players (granted harder to find, as is evidenced nobody cares about anybody else doing this other than Green).

Sure, it could be he's selling it at times. But other times he does it out of frustration.. If nothing else, he should be penalized for flopping.
The NBA said flopping will be defined as "any physical act that appears to have been intended to cause the referees to call a foul on another player." But the NBA does a ****** job of fining relevant players consistently, so shame on them for that.

BTW, It seems his personality issues you speak of possibly tie into his frustration kicking (yes he kicks out of frustration), but maybe that's just me and many others being pathetically overbearing.

And yea, I realize that's against my team and I was pissed off about it. I am pretty sure if I find posts from myself either here or other forums I would have made comments on how he should be hit with a flopping fine or technical. So there's that

tredigs
10-27-2016, 05:05 PM
Sure, it could be he's selling it at times. But other times he does it out of frustration.. If nothing else, he should be penalized for flopping. But the NBA does a ****** job of fining relevant players consistently, so shame on them for that.

BTW, It seems his personality issues you speak of possibly tie into his frustration kicking (yes he kicks out of frustration), but maybe that's just me and many others being pathetically overbearing.

And yea, I realize that's against my team and I was pissed off about it. I am pretty sure if I find posts from myself either here or other forums I would have made comments on how he should be hit with a flopping fine or technical. So there's that

I mean it's a fine line. I'm presuming that with you making a video/post bringing this up that you believe this play on TP was deserving of a foul/flopping fine. IF you truly believe that is the case for a completely meaningless off-ball play where literally nothing happened (if anything it should have been a foul on Draymond for kind of tugging TP's arm actually), then this league would be impossible to watch and the CBA hearings would go on for an extra year as the players revolted. There would have been no less than 800 grand in "flopping" fines passed out yesterday under your proposed managing of the NBA. Love you Spurman, but you're falling victim to a very silly and absurdly over-blown media/fan-hate cause here. I get it, the Warriors are all that 90% of fans see of the NBA other than their own team and this is an issue on account of that, but what's the REAL issue is his attitude, not the gif of him and Tony Parker you just linked. If you want to say the two are not mutually exclusive - fair enough - but we'd agree to disagree there. I think the kick-thing is more instinctual than anything else.

kdspurman
10-27-2016, 05:17 PM
I mean it's a fine line. I'm presuming that with you making a video/post bringing this up that you believe this play on TP was deserving of a foul/flopping fine. IF you truly believe that is the case for a completely meaningless off-ball play where literally nothing happened (if anything it should have been a foul on Draymond for kind of tugging TP's arm actually), then this league would be impossible to watch and the CBA hearings would go on for an extra year as the players revolted. There would have been no less than 800 grand in "flopping" fines passed out yesterday under your proposed managing of the NBA.

No, what I said was "he needs to get that under control". Kicking his leg up is not a basketball play no matter how you try to justify it. Just as the crap WB does is not, and I've always been ticked at some of the benefit of the doubt he got from the officials just for being a bit out of control and hitting the deck.

For his sake and the Warriors sake, he needs to stop kicking his leg up,especially with people watching what he does closely. (not just us here btw, I'm sure you saw the Trailblazers tweet about it during the pre-season) People will watch him very closely, and he's gonna get himself in trouble.

BTW how would cracking down on flopping make the league impossible to watch? Those fines are handed out after the game , and result in fines, not suspensions or replays anything. (?)

But just to emphasize on the kicking/flailing:


Joe Borgia, the NBA senior vice president of replay and referee operations, said players are no longer just swinging their arms in attempt to draw a foul when taking a shot.
"Now all of a sudden legs are coming out in different directions at weird times, they're coming higher," he said. "Well, for the protection of the players, we're going to stop it."

If you think the NBA trying to stop that would make it impossible to watch, then idk what to say.

tredigs
10-27-2016, 05:25 PM
No, what I said was "he needs to get that under control". Kicking his leg up is not a basketball play no matter how you try to justify it. Just as the crap WB does is not, and I've always been ticked at some of the benefit of the doubt he got from the officials just for being a bit out of control and hitting the deck.

For his sake and the Warriors sake, he needs to stop kicking his leg up,especially with people watching what he does closely. (not just us here btw, I'm sure you saw the Trailblazers tweet about it during the pre-season) People will watch him very closely, and he's gonna get himself in trouble.

BTW how would cracking down on flopping make the league impossible to watch? Those fines are handed out after the game , and result in fines, not suspensions or replays anything. (?)

But just to emphasize on the kicking/flailing:



If you think the NBA trying to stop that would make it impossible to watch, then idk what to say.

Fair enough Spurman, as far as I'm concerned as a fan of the team, it falls somewhere between the 59th-75th thing I am most interested in and/or worried about concerning the 2016 Warriors. I'll leave it at that and leave you guys to it.

kdspurman
10-27-2016, 05:49 PM
Fair enough Spurman, as far as I'm concerned as a fan of the team, it falls somewhere between the 59th-75th thing I am most interested in and/or worried about concerning the 2016 Warriors. I'll leave it at that and leave you guys to it.

lol... that makes sense :hi5:

FlashBolt
10-28-2016, 02:04 AM
Some users are just unbearable. I don't even care about him kicking people but the dude runs around like he won the lottery every time he gets a rebound, assist, or a shot. Worst part was when he kicked Adams in the nuts and started taunting him.

"and 1"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWVbRexPkcA

Is this guy forreal or a donkey trying to troll?

t_money25
10-28-2016, 08:44 AM
I'd trade Green. Personally I think Klay is the best and most complete player on that team.

IKnowHoops
10-28-2016, 11:59 AM
No i'm not calling for a suspension or death penalty, but seriously why does he do this?

https://streamable.com/um2f

He got himself tangled up with a PG in Tony Parker lol He's really gotta get that under control

So there he flopped, and part of his flopping motion is to throw the leg up. So he's either tantruming or acting flailing to get a call. Either way, its easy to stop, and its not something that he is doing accidentally.

FlashBolt
10-28-2016, 12:06 PM
No i'm not calling for a suspension or death penalty, but seriously why does he do this?

https://streamable.com/um2f

He got himself tangled up with a PG in Tony Parker lol He's really gotta get that under control

I'm about to compile a Draymond Green: Special Christmas Nutcracker compilation soon and will send it to the NBA. Thanks for adding to that collection.

IKnowHoops
10-28-2016, 12:09 PM
Lmao so he lifted his leg up approximately 2 feet away from Tony Parker going the other direction in an attempt to sell a call. In case you guys have not realized this by now, it is an instinctive way that he moves his body when he's trying to sell a foul. It's not going to change. But again, please feel free to post each instance, it's must-see TV.

Also, in case you guys have also not realized, it's not a phenomena exclusive to Draymond Green. The newest darling of the NBA Russell Westbrook also has a penchant for the leg-kick when trying to sell contact (and more often than not more egregious and blatant than Draymond. Just a few examples that you might (not... apparently) remember KDSpurman:

https://gfycat.com/UnacceptableSelfishElephant
https://gfycat.com/FairImpoliteIberianmole
https://gfycat.com/CanineActiveFattaileddunnart

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:: laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

Oh snap, that was funny. And those were all dirty just like Dray. The the only thing that saves Russ is that he is not nearly as good as it and he ends up landing flat on his back 2/3 times. The one against Tim he tried to air walk off Tim's nuts, the other two he was trying to draw contact like Reggie, but he was reaching with those and didn't have his spacing right or his timing and winded up on his back...lolololol. I can look at those all day. Dray has much better form and skill when it comes to the leg raise. He could easily change and its dirty when you hit someone in the nuts repeatedly.

IKnowHoops
10-28-2016, 12:21 PM
It's not something that concerns me in the least, what-so-ever, other than the fact that it is such a pathetically big deal. His personality in general? Yes, that is a much deeper and more relevant topic that I am more than willing to discuss and delve into. Hint: Him flexing/screaming after the play and receiving a T for it and after the game stating "that's who I am, I'm going to do the same thing after the next dunk" is much more of a real issue that actually matters than you showing me a stupid Vine (RIP) of him lifting his leg innocuously within 3 feet of another player (again, him flexing after a dunk is NOTHING obviously, but for him to willingly state he will do something that hurts his team IS in fact an issue). Hope that clears up my take on the Draymond issue. It's not about being "defensive", it's about me thinking you guys are being pathetically overbearing in your concern over something so petty.

Btw, speaking of "doing it on the biggest of stages", those of Westbrook were all playoff games in ultra-heated high-leverage situations against another top contender (your team mind you). You just showed me a vine of G1 of the regular season. I can show you similar gifs of a dozen different players (granted harder to find, as is evidenced nobody cares about anybody else doing this other than Green).

I get it, but I also have no doubt that if you were playing a pickup game and some guy was throwing his leg up like that and it missed you 4 times but hit you in the balls 3 times and put you on the ground all three times, I'm sure you would be ready to "go"...and I doubt you would say "I'm not concerned with how you flail your leg Dray". I think you'd be like " you need to stop that silly s--- or I'm f------ you up next time." And I'm guessing it wouldn't take 3 of them, I'm guessing after the second one you would rush him. And I'm also guessing that if his leg flailed and didn't hit you but you had already be sacked twice, you become very annoyed if not let him know again, "stop with the bs mf'er".

FlashBolt
10-28-2016, 12:37 PM
Russell does it to draw a foul. Draymond does it for no particular reason. Is this grandpa that much of a homer?

lol, please
10-29-2016, 03:29 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if there was truth to players/staff not really liking Green but considering him sort of a "necessary evil" per se. I would be surprised if he was an actual lockerroom cancer though.

If one had to leave, I would choose Green if it were up to me. It's no secret I've never been his biggest fan, and I think we still win with Lee starting if he doesn't get injured.

Unlike most Warriors fans I don't think our defensive schemes fall apart without Green, and he is the one starter I really wouldn't miss if we got rid of him.

Like someone said earlier, please don't break up the Splash Bros whatever you do. :laugh2:

likemystylez
10-29-2016, 10:40 PM
I'd trade Green. Personally I think Klay is the best and most complete player on that team.

what always confuses me is that people dont take into account what is being got in return when thinking of trading a player. There is something incoming on trades too.... but that doesnt seem to be being considered at all.

youd trade green for anthony tolliver instead of trading klay for jimmy butler?

Jeffy25
11-01-2016, 12:31 AM
Trade Klay for a defensive center like Cousins or Whiteside or someone who fits financially but is a post defender.

Klay is too redundant.

Though, Durant may not stick around long term either, then you'd miss him.

Jeffy25
11-01-2016, 01:25 AM
^ and by post defensive player, I meant one that can be given 30+ minutes a night and score some allowing the floor to be spread

Chronz
11-01-2016, 02:25 AM
Trade Klay for a defensive center like Cousins or Whiteside or someone who fits financially but is a post defender.

Klay is too redundant.

Though, Durant may not stick around long term either, then you'd miss him.

If Klay is the guy holding his team back NOW, I don't want to hear him mentioned in Reggie Millers class. Reggie would have thrived in such a role, redundancy be damned. Most things being equal, this is why I lean towards more efficient players among stars, they seem more reliable role to role IMO.

R. Johnson#3
11-01-2016, 08:21 AM
If things go sour you keep Klay and Dray while trading KD for a big man.

I've only seen bits and pieces of the Warriors with KD. What I've seen is the offense just taking turns running ISO plays for Steph or KD a lot of the time. Ball movement completely stops for periods of time in this offense. It's not as fast paced as it was before.

MILLERHIGHLIFE
11-01-2016, 09:55 AM
Trade Klay for a defensive center like Cousins or Whiteside or someone who fits financially but is a post defender.

Klay is too redundant.

Though, Durant may not stick around long term either, then you'd miss him.


I suggested that a while back of Klay for Cousins. Probably the best Kings fetch for instant all star. Other wise yeah they might get a bunch of young guys and picks if trading with Celtics. But longer process to see what they got.

FlashBolt
11-01-2016, 01:48 PM
Why would Kings trade Cousins for Klay? It's better they do so to get someone who is in a long-term contract and is being underappreciated because of their role on a current team. Cavs would be perfect for Cousins and Love would also be a good fit for the Kings (Easily a 24/12 player if given his own team). Hell, if Kings could make a Lamarcus for Cousins trade, why not?