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JordansBulls
09-02-2016, 07:05 PM
Two Superstars or One Superstar in these cases - Who do you want to build around?

Knowing what you know about the player's history including injuries, etc


Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone

6man
09-02-2016, 07:16 PM
2 superstars every time lol.

europagnpilgrim
09-02-2016, 09:52 PM
One player I would take for sure solo over any combo are Wilt N. Chamberlain and possibly but a long shot is Shaq Diesel

I would take the combo of Chamberlain/The Answer over all and any if I had to build a team from scratch and go from there

hugepatsfan
09-02-2016, 09:56 PM
Give me the 2 in a vacuum but in reality you'd go the with better player you listed in each scenario and then get a second superstar to put with him.

IKnowHoops
09-02-2016, 11:00 PM
Two Superstars or One Superstar in these cases - Who do you want to build around?

Knowing what you know about the player's history including injuries, etc


Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett.....Tracy and Webber Easily

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird........Penny and Dirk Easily

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James.........Lebron easily

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson........Magic

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving.........close call, but I'm going with Glove and Nique

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon............Dream

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem..........Admiral and Walt easily

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal...........Shaq Easily

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan.............Barkley and Melo

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone..........Rose and Garnett easily


Nice little thread

mrblisterdundee
09-03-2016, 12:08 AM
This all depends on when you get the players, what era they're in and other factors. For my choices, I'll assume that the player pairings are drafted the same year, and that either choice plays in today's NBA.

Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett
We're talking about 18 good seasons from Garnett, at least 13 of them elite, and better defense than McGrady or Webber could ever offer.
Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird
As well as being more prolific in almost every regard, Bird's a better leader than either of the other guys. Hardaway only had four good seasons.
Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James
James can run your offense and defend every position. Surround him with shooters and a rim protector.
Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson
This was a harder choice than Bird or James. Johnson's like Draymond Green with much better offense. But Kidd and Drexler are such a good back court. Both had incredible longevity. Drexler would be the perfect do-it-all wing for today's game.
Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving
I'll take the best defensive point guard ever and an awesome small forward over a somewhat better small forward.
Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon
Olajuwon was obviously better than Ewing because of his defense. But it's not like he was on another plane of existence. Pair Ewing with Bosh, and you have one of the best front courts ever.
David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem
Abdul-Jabbar was that good for that long.
Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal
This decision is heavily influenced by the state of today's NBA. Malone could play both front court positions in today's NBA. Nash can run an offense better than anyone. Both had incredible longevity. Young O'Neal could still bully anyone in today's NBA, but that's not as important as it once was. He's also kind of undisciplined, which allowed him to let his body go and not reach his total potential.
Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan
Duncan, too, could play either front court position today. He'd also provide better leadership and defense.
Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone
This is probably the hardest choice of them all. Rose obviously hasn't had more than 3.5 good seasons, but he could still be serviceable. Durant tips the scale with his dominant scoring, shooting, versatility and passable defense. Malone's a beast, but like Blake Griffin, probably can't effectively play at center, which would skyrocket his value in today's NBA.

Miltstar
09-03-2016, 01:55 AM
well you gotta play 5 guys regardless so it all comes down to who those other guys are... if it's 1 or 2 superstars + a bunch of garbage players you take the 2 superstars

FlashBolt
09-03-2016, 10:12 AM
It's not as simple as saying 1+1=2 superstars = NBA championship.

Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone

Some of these guys play way too similar. It's detrimental to have two guys doing the same thing.

Jeffy25
09-03-2016, 11:21 AM
This is a great series of questions....and they should be itemized because of a variety of choices.

But the pure question has merit. Taking the solo, better player, may be easier to build around, but the two superstars with more issues gives you a better head start.

I would think finding great compliments would be every thing. And the two players is probably easier to build around.

Any way, my answers are bolded

Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone


My answers have more to do with some deficiencies in the dual player combos. Like Rose has a lot of issues and doesn't help Durant enough...though I arguably like Durant more than Malone...but with Rose I see a roster hog and salary hog...that I don't have with Malone starting fresh.

LeBron and Magic are too versatile.

Shaq, Kareem, and Hakeem are too dominant in any era.

Penny and Dirk would be awesome together, though you wouldn't have them forever....but Durant has better durability over Bird any way, making that an easier answer.

Garnett vs Webber and McGrady is another hard one.


Love this question.

Jeffy25
09-03-2016, 11:24 AM
This all depends on when you get the players, what era they're in and other factors. For my choices, I'll assume that the player pairings are drafted the same year, and that either choice plays in today's NBA.

Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett
We're talking about 18 good seasons from Garnett, at least 13 of them elite, and better defense than McGrady or Webber could ever offer.
Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird
As well as being more prolific in almost every regard, Bird's a better leader than either of the other guys. Hardaway only had four good seasons.
Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James
James can run your offense and defend every position. Surround him with shooters and a rim protector.
Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson
This was a harder choice than Bird or James. Johnson's like Draymond Green with much better offense. But Kidd and Drexler are such a good back court. Both had incredible longevity. Drexler would be the perfect do-it-all wing for today's game.
Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving
I'll take the best defensive point guard ever and an awesome small forward over a somewhat better small forward.
Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon
Olajuwon was obviously better than Ewing because of his defense. But it's not like he was on another plane of existence. Pair Ewing with Bosh, and you have one of the best front courts ever.
David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem
Abdul-Jabbar was that good for that long.
Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal
This decision is heavily influenced by the state of today's NBA. Malone could play both front court positions in today's NBA. Nash can run an offense better than anyone. Both had incredible longevity. Young O'Neal could still bully anyone in today's NBA, but that's not as important as it once was. He's also kind of undisciplined, which allowed him to let his body go and not reach his total potential.
Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan
Duncan, too, could play either front court position today. He'd also provide better leadership and defense.
Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone
This is probably the hardest choice of them all. Rose obviously hasn't had more than 3.5 good seasons, but he could still be serviceable. Durant tips the scale with his dominant scoring, shooting, versatility and passable defense. Malone's a beast, but like Blake Griffin, probably can't effectively play at center, which would skyrocket his value in today's NBA.

great points

FlashBolt
09-03-2016, 11:58 AM
Well the solo player in these scenarios are nearly all top ten players. It's all about positions at this point. I'm not sure how effective a J.Kidd+Drexler would be. A J.Kidd + D.Rob pairing against Magic would make it a more interesting argument. Same with D Wade + Stockton. Would be better if you had something like Stockton + Melo pairing against LeBron.

PowerHouse
09-03-2016, 12:19 PM
You always gotta go with two stars over one.

What happens when your one superstar has an off-night? Who on the team picks up the slack?

Jeffy25
09-04-2016, 01:27 AM
You always gotta go with two stars over one.

What happens when your one superstar has an off-night? Who on the team picks up the slack?

But that one superstar is better than the two all-stars

Heediot
09-04-2016, 10:40 AM
Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone

PowerHouse
09-04-2016, 12:07 PM
But that one superstar is better than the two all-stars

Depends.

If your talking about Brad Miller/BJ Armstrong(both were all-stars) or Wilt Chamberlain then yea I agree.

With the provided options...not so much.

YAALREADYKNO
09-04-2016, 12:17 PM
Two Superstars or One Superstar in these cases - Who do you want to build around?

Knowing what you know about the player's history including injuries, etc


Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone

Tmac/Webber
Penny/Dirk
Lebron
Magic
Payton/Wilkins
Hakeem
Robinson/Frazier
Shaq
Barkley/Melo
Rose/Durant

mrblisterdundee
09-06-2016, 06:47 PM
You always gotta go with two stars over one.

What happens when your one superstar has an off-night? Who on the team picks up the slack?

What happens when one of those two stars physically breaks down after several seasons and is no longer a star? Health is a pretty big part of this thread.

JasonJohnHorn
09-06-2016, 07:31 PM
Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett McGrady wouldn't mix well with Webber, and both of their careers were cut short with injury. Garnett gives you a 15-year window. Webber gives you 8, McGrady gives you 5.

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird Penny only gives you a 3 year window and had ego issues. So this is pretty much Bird vs. Dirk. Easy answer.

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James Stockton gives you a long window, and Wade has had 10 stellar years with a couple slowed by injury. Having such an amazing back court and guys who facilitate and are coachable.... I think that would make for a great base to build around. LBJ is harder to build around because his skill set is so unique and because he has to be in command on a lot more levels, which may make it hard to build around.

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson Love Magic, but having two franchise players in the back court who each give you over 10 years of All-Star performances.... that is hard to pass up. Kidd give you 15+ years and Drexler about 12.

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving. Not sure this is much of a choice. Dr. J and Nique were amazing to watch, but neither could win on their own, so I take Payton+Nique, though I'd take Dr. J overNique.

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon Given where the league is with spreading the game around, I'd say Hakeem not only gives you a longer window, but has a style of play that really helps shooters by drawing in defenders. Ewing and Bosh would just make for a crowded key.

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem This one was tough. If I knew Frazier could shoot 3's, I might go with him. But his career was relatively short, and D-Rob had a steep decline and a late start. Kareem gives you a 20-year-window to build. I'll take him.

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal. I was close to going with Shaq here, but Moses and Nash had long careers. I think the 15-year window they give, plus the fact they cover two positions, would make it easier to build around, but I'm not 100% on this one.

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan Duncan. Easily. Barkley proved TWICE that even with a team loaded with All-Stars, he could win (Phoenix: KJ, Chambers, Ainge, Cebolas, Marlje; Houston: Hakeem, Pippen, Drexler). So why would we assume you could build around him with another high-volume scorer? Granted, they'd both give you a 12-year window, but Duncan gives you just about 20 years, and he is a stellar defender PLUS and amazing offensive player. It would be easier to build around him than Melo and Barkley.

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone. I would take KD alone over Malone, so this is a no-brainer. Malone's game wouldn't translate well today. He'd be great on the pick-and-roll, and a solid rebounder, but he wouldn't be as effective a scorer as Durant. Rose is a non-factor here.

PowerHouse
09-06-2016, 08:45 PM
What happens when one of those two stars physically breaks down after several seasons and is no longer a star? Health is a pretty big part of this thread.

:shrug:

I probably already won a couple of rings by then. (assuming we are building quality role players around these guys.)

roshan3ai
09-06-2016, 08:59 PM
Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone

IKnowHoops
09-07-2016, 06:04 PM
Tmac/Webber
Penny/Dirk
Lebron
Magic
Payton/Wilkins
Hakeem
Robinson/Frazier
Shaq
Barkley/Melo
Rose/Durant

We don't usually agree do we? Cause that was exactly what I had.

JasonJohnHorn
09-08-2016, 03:27 PM
Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett.....Tracy and Webber Easily

If you know what you know about injury history, why would you choose T-Mac and Webber? T-Mac had 5 or 6 seasons to work with while Webber was done by the age of 29. That's a small window compared to Garnett who had 15 stellar seasons.


Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird........Penny and Dirk Easily


Again.. Penny crapped out early due to injury. He didn't even hit his prime. Dirk has a loner window than Bird, but Bird proved he could win against the very best, whereas Dirk ony had two finals appearances and often lost in big series.


Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James.........Lebron easily I can see how you'd pick LBJ, but I wouldn't say this is an easy choice. Stockton gives you a 20-year window and is the greatest playmaker of all time. Wade is one of the great SGs ever. The two in the same back court would be unbelievable.



Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan.............Barkley and Melo. If Barkley couldn't win with KJ, Chambers and Ainge, and then later with Dream, Drexler and Pippen, why would he be able to win with Melo? Duncan is a five time champion with an array of different role players and All-Stars. If any choice in this list was 'easy', I'd say it's this one: Duncan.

mrblisterdundee
09-10-2016, 06:14 PM
:shrug:

I probably already won a couple of rings by then. (assuming we are building quality role players around these guys.)

Like Orlando did with Hardaway and Shaq?

SportsFanatic10
09-10-2016, 09:25 PM
2 over 1 every time with a few exceptions:


if one of the 2 superstars was plagued by injury with the benefit of hindsight and had a short peak (like Rose)

if the 1 superstar is Jordan, Shaq, or Lebron

if the 2 superstars are just a terrible fit together with their play styles


There's a reason players want to team up on super teams now, it takes multiple stars to win championships in general imo.

PowerHouse
09-11-2016, 11:09 AM
Like Orlando did with Hardaway and Shaq?

Damn bro you got me.

I completely forgot that teaming Shaq up with another star never worked out.

Federal Reserve
09-11-2016, 05:31 PM
The correct answer is to take two players instead of one. No player has ever decidedly won a title by himself (Hakeem won when Jordan wasn't playing and Dirk won because Lebron choked).

SportsFanatic10
09-11-2016, 06:44 PM
The correct answer is to take two players instead of one. No player has ever decidedly won a title by himself (Hakeem won when Jordan wasn't playing and Dirk won because Lebron choked).

My thoughts exactly, however there are a few instances where it would make sense to take the 1 superstar instead like I put in my earlier post.

FlashBolt
09-11-2016, 11:14 PM
The players on the right side of the equation are top ten players so it's essentially: Would you have two top 20-30 players or a top ten player. Hard to say but some of these guys just changed the game or dominated at levels that I don't think can be replaced. Shaq+LeBron are just on another level.

flea
09-11-2016, 11:23 PM
2 over 1 every time with a few exceptions:


if one of the 2 superstars was plagued by injury with the benefit of hindsight and had a short peak (like Rose)

if the 1 superstar is Jordan, Shaq, or Lebron

if the 2 superstars are just a terrible fit together with their play styles


There's a reason players want to team up on super teams now, it takes multiple stars to win championships in general imo.

Funny how there are 2-4 players you didn't mention who actually did win a title without another superstar on the roster. It's arguable whether Jordan's 1991 or Shaq's 2000 qualifies, but Lebron certainly hasn't done it yet.

SportsFanatic10
09-11-2016, 11:49 PM
Funny how there are 2-4 players you didn't mention who actually did win a title without another superstar on the roster. It's arguable whether Jordan's 1991 or Shaq's 2000 qualifies, but Lebron certainly hasn't done it yet.

I'm not talking about the odd time it's happened, I'm talking about in general. And I'm saying Jordan/Lebron/Shaq and maybe another couple players but those 3 to me stand out as the elite once in a lifetime type talents that you just don't pass up. Just because say Dirk managed to win a ring without a true superstar doesn't mean I'd take him alone over 2 other top 20-30ish type superstars.

kdspurman
09-12-2016, 12:16 PM
I'm not talking about the odd time it's happened, I'm talking about in general. And I'm saying Jordan/Lebron/Shaq and maybe another couple players but those 3 to me stand out as the elite once in a lifetime type talents that you just don't pass up. Just because say Dirk managed to win a ring without a true superstar doesn't mean I'd take him alone over 2 other top 20-30ish type superstars.

How about Duncan in 03? He's certainly a once in a lifetime player IMO.

SportsFanatic10
09-12-2016, 02:12 PM
How about Duncan in 03? He's certainly a once in a lifetime player IMO.

He's close, but personally I wouldn't include him in that exception list. Depending on who the other 2 superstars were I would take him over some duos though. Duncan's an elite once in a lifetime player too who was truly great on both ends. But Jordan's the best of all time, and Shaq and Lebron are just physical specimens that dominate with talent and physicality. That's why those 3 made my cut as exceptions that I'd make to the taking 2 over 1 strategy.

Sanjay
01-20-2017, 01:23 AM
Two Superstars or One Superstar in these cases - Who do you want to build around?

Knowing what you know about the player's history including injuries, etc


Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone

1. McGrady/Webber
2. James
3. Magic
4. Payton/Wilkins
5. Olajuwon
6. Robinson/Frazier
7. O'Neal
8. Barkley/Anthony
9. Rose/Durant

nastynice
01-20-2017, 03:11 AM
Two Superstars or One Superstar in these cases - Who do you want to build around?

Knowing what you know about the player's history including injuries, etc


Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone

Damn, these are pretty good. The easy picks to me would be

penny/dirk over bird
lebron over Wade/Stockton
shaq over Nash/Moses
Rose/Durant over Malone

The rest are pretty tough

ewing
01-20-2017, 09:30 AM
Two Superstars or One Superstar in these cases - Who do you want to build around?

Knowing what you know about the player's history including injuries, etc


Tracy Mcgrady/Chris Webber - Kevin Garnett- I take healthy T-Mac first so thats easy

Penny Hardaway/Dirk Nowitzki - Larry Bird can't go wrong here. 2 heads....

Dwyane Wade/John Stockton - Lebron James Bron

Jason Kidd/Clyde Drexler - Magic Johnson Magic

Gary Payton/Dominique Wilkins - Julius Erving Dr is too old for me

Patrick Ewing/Chris Bosh - Hakeem Olajuwon That one hell of a big jump shooting front line

David Robinson/Walt Frazier - Kareem Old guys but Kareen won 6 MVPs so i'll take him

Moses Malone/Steve Nash - Shaquille O'neal Diseal was special

Charles Barkley/Carmelo Anthony - Tim Duncan Timmy is special

Derrick Rose/Kevin Durant - Karl Malone IDK, I don't like Rose.

ewing
01-20-2017, 09:31 AM
Funny how there are 2-4 players you didn't mention who actually did win a title without another superstar on the roster. It's arguable whether Jordan's 1991 or Shaq's 2000 qualifies, but Lebron certainly hasn't done it yet.



The Pippen superstar thing is a myth. He was a star. He was never a superstar. hindsight has drastically overrated Scottie Pippen